RERUN: Heated Rivalry by Rachel Reid

Summary

Fated Mates Podcast RERUN: Heated Rivalry by Rachel Reid

Release Date: November 28, 2025
Hosts: Sarah MacLean (bestselling romance author), Jen Prokop (romance critic/reader/editor)

---

Episode Overview

This Fated Mates episode is a rerun of Sarah and Jen’s beloved exploration of Heated Rivalry, the second book in Rachel Reid’s Game Changers series. The conversation dives deep into why this queer hockey romance is so iconic—tracing its depiction of forbidden love, masculinity, and the real-life challenges faced by queer athletes—while also reflecting on its enduring emotional power. The hosts discuss the book's nuanced characters, the evolution of sports romance, and what makes Heated Rivalry such a foundational read in contemporary romance.

---

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Collections and Microtropes: Discovering More Romances

• [00:09] The episode opens with Jen’s excitement about the new collections project on the Fated Mates website:
  • Collections are curated book lists based on microtropes or themes (“Virgin Heroes,” “Food in Historicals,” “Basketball Romances”).
  • Aim: Improve romance book discoverability, which has become harder online.
  • Community involvement: Listeners and favorite romance voices contribute collections, e.g., “Getting Sprung” (prison breaks), “First Come First Curve” (plus-size heroines in historicals), and “From Starchy to Feral” (heroes who lose their decorum).
  • Notable quote:
    “If you find a collection that has, okay, two books on it you really loved, you can kind of like, hey, I'm probably gonna like the rest of these, right?” — Jen, [04:17]
• [06:11] Collections include all Fated Mates deep dives and 'best of' lists for easier access.

2. Bookish Community & Bookstore Love

• [06:56] Sarah introduces Pagebound, a growing online community for book lovers, highlighting its romance-friendly vibe.
  • Rich discussion threads; listeners pose questions like what book Sarah and Jen haven’t talked about that the community loves.
• [08:54] Reflections on Independent Bookstore Day:
  • Sarah did a “bookstore crawl” in Brooklyn; Jen visited new and Black-owned bookstores in Chicago.
  • The impact of big-box retailer sales seemingly timed to undercut indie celebrations is discussed, but they notice a groundswell of community support for small bookstores.
  • Memorable moment: Sarah visits The Ripped Bodice on a bustling Saturday night.
• [15:47] Book shopping confessions: Both hosts share recent purchases for themselves and children, reinforcing their roles as dedicated readers and bookish parents.

3. Pop Culture Moments

• [15:59] Sarah recounts taking her 11-year-old daughter to the remastered Pride and Prejudice (2005), reflecting on the film’s emotional resonance and its role in awakening her daughter’s appreciation for romance.

  • Notable quote:
    “She was leaning forward on the couch and she went, kiss, kiss, kiss.” — Sarah, [17:16]

• [19:41] Imagined Fated Mates movie nights are proposed (“we should just do that more”)—a humorous interlude on the joys and absurdities of fangirl gatherings.

---

Main Deep Dive: Heated Rivalry by Rachel Reid

Context & Canon Status

• [24:55] Jen expresses nerves about discussing a modern classic:
  • “What are the books that you think of as being so beloved by so many people that they become… there’s a small number of books that have become just like beloved.”
  • Sarah and Jen both missed this “zeitgeist” book on release, weighing the outsized expectations felt when tackling a universally praised romance.
• [25:39] Reflections on how the romance “canon” shifts—ten years ago, “Lord of Scoundrels” or “Bet Me” were entrypoints; today’s list is more complex.

Summary & Structure of the Book

• [31:36] Heated Rivalry (2019) is the second book in the Game Changers series.
  • Set in a “real world” NHL where queerness is largely closeted.
  • Focuses on Shane Hollander (Montreal’s captain, Canadian, sweet, single-minded) and Ilya Rozanov (Russian, Boston’s captain, brash, overtly masculine).
  • Their rivalry hides a long-term, secret sexual relationship, begun as teenagers in hockey camp.
• [33:18] Book is divided into four distinct parts; each represents an evolution of their dynamic:
  • Part 1: Introduction; years of erotic, emotionally walled-off hookups defined by rivalry and secrecy.
  • Part 2: Hint of more; Shane tries to create safety (buys them a secret apartment to meet).
  • Part 3: The romance peaks—emotional and physical vulnerability, tenderness emerges.
  • Part 4: Post-catalyst denouement—they seize their chance at real intimacy.

Depiction of Masculinity, Secrecy, and Emotional Growth

• [34:45] Character study:
  • Shane: Naïve, closeted, uncomfortable with identity, “It has never occurred to Shane to be gay” ([34:45]). Hockey is his whole life.
  • Ilya: “His job is fucking people” ([35:14]), hypermasculine, jaded, Russian (so greater threat), emotionally complex beneath bravado.
  • Their rivalry is integral to their chemistry—Jen: “We have no idea how they could have been with each other if it had not been for the fact they were set up to be rivals” ([53:54]).
• [44:37] They are "kings"—the best of the best, but unable to claim true happiness until overcoming threats, fears, and societal expectations.

Stakes and Social Context

• [40:35] Real-world stakes:
  • Still, in 2025, there are no openly gay NHL players. The book’s anxiety about outing and career repercussions remains very real.
• [46:46]-[47:09] The existential threat of being outed is ever-present; both must “overcome their own insecurity about everything” (Sarah).

Emotional Highs: Key Scenes and Microtropes

• [58:47] The Russian confession: Ilya, wracked with grief after his father’s death, calls Shane from Moscow and, unable to express his feelings in English, confesses his love in Russian while Shane listens and supports.
  • Notable quote:
    “Say it to me in Russian. I won’t understand, but I’m gonna listen.” — Shane, [58:47]
  • Both hosts identify this as a “god tier romance moment.”
• [61:47] The first use of first names:
  • “When he said Shane, I was like, that’s over… This is a God. Tier. Microtrope.” — Sarah, [61:47]
  • Transformation from public personas (last names) to private intimacy.
• [73:57] Shane's injury (concussion): Drives further closeness and showcases the physical dangers these athletes face—a favorite romance device for the hosts (“if I’m reading hockey romance and nobody’s getting a concussion, why am I even here?” — Sarah, [74:00]).

Resolution and HEA (or HFN)

• [78:10] Catalyst: An out, celebrated gay player (Scott Hunter from book 1) wins the Stanley Cup and kisses his partner on TV, sparking new hope in Shane and Ilya.
• [79:45] The final part is idyllic: The two retreat to the cottage, are “out” to Shane’s family, and map out a way to be together off the ice and in life.
• [82:24] Parental acceptance (especially from Shane’s hockey-obsessed mom) is heartfelt and hilarious:
  • “You never let him win, did you?” — Shane’s Mom, [82:24]
  • “I don’t need anybody to let me win.” — Ilya, [82:49]
• [85:29] The book’s epilogue shows increasing acceptance; the couple are cautiously out to more people, but a fully public, queer-affirming HEA is deferred to the sequel The Long Game, which gives them open community and validation.

---

Broader Reflections and Cultural Relevance

• The book is praised for:
  • Authentic depiction of the pressures on closeted queer athletes.
  • Realistic emotional growth: “These two are kids and… are very aware of the pressure… I didn't ever find that I was like disappointed or thought that they should have [come out]…” — Jen, [42:48]
  • Wrenching emotional journey (especially Ilya's vulnerability).
  • Detailed, insider-y hockey elements.
  • Skillfully structured pacing, paralleling erotic tension and emotional intimacy.
• The hosts discuss missing elements (queer community, public acceptance), and how The Long Game sequel addresses these needs, shifting from a personal HFN to a communal HEA.

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments with Timestamps

• “If you find a collection that has… two books on it you really loved, you can… like, hey, I'm probably gonna like the rest of these…” — Jen, [04:17]
• “She was leaning forward on the couch and she went, kiss, kiss, kiss.” — Sarah describing her daughter and Pride and Prejudice, [17:16]
• “What are the books that you think of as being so beloved by so many people that they become… beloved?” — Jen, [24:55]
• “It has never occurred to Shane to be gay.” — Sarah, [34:45]
• “Say it to me in Russian. I won’t understand, but I’m gonna listen.” — Shane to Ilya, [58:47]
• “When he said Shane, I was like, that’s over… This is a God. Tier. Microtrope.” — Sarah, [61:47]
• “If I’m reading hockey romance and nobody’s getting a concussion, why am I even here?” — Sarah, [74:00]
• “You never let him win, did you?” — Shane’s Mom, [82:24]
• “I don’t need anybody to let me win.” — Ilya, [82:49]

---

Timestamps for Major Segments

• [00:09] – Collections and microtropes
• [06:56] – Book community shout-outs, Pagebound
• [08:54] – Independent Bookstore Day stories
• [24:55] – Canonicity and pressure of beloved books
• [31:36] – Book context, characters, setup
• [33:18] – Structure and timeline of the novel
• [44:37] – "Heroes have to be kings” discussion
• [58:47] – Ilya’s Russian phone call moment
• [61:47] – First names microtrope
• [73:57] – Injury/fake out as plot device
• [78:10] – Outness, catalyst, resolution
• [82:24] – Family coming-out scene
• [85:29] – Epilogue, sequel discussion

---

Final Thoughts & Recommendations

• Both hosts enthusiastically endorse Heated Rivalry as a transformative, deeply felt sports romance that stands the test of time—even if they personally best connect with the novel’s second half (the emotional pay-off).
• Listeners are encouraged to check out both Heated Rivalry and its sequel The Long Game for a full, open-hearted HEA.
• Additional recommendations and collections can be found on the Fated Mates website for those who love sports romance, hockey stories, or Rachel Reid’s writing.

---

For more, visit fatedmates.net and explore Collections, Show Notes, and community discussions.

Transcript

[A]

Right before I walked into my office, Jen, Eric said to me, don't forget to talk about the collections. Bring up virgin heroes. That'll set Jen off.

[B]

Oh, my God. Okay, so first of all, I am obsessed with collections.

[A]

Okay? Tell everybody what they've won with collections.

[B]

So Eric had this great idea, which is that we should essentially, like, you know, like, our. We have pages that are, like, okay, it's enemies to lovers. You can look at these books. But we really. There's so many people who have great ideas about love. Like microtropes. Right? Like, smaller. Like. Right. A smaller way to organize or collect a series of books. And one of the reasons that this becomes, I think, especially important now, and this was, I think, Eric's idea, too, is that it is harder and harder to find good lists of romances on the Internet. Right when you and I started, you could easily be like, all right, give me, you know, blah, blah, blah, romance. And you could easily find people's lists. But now, oh, the Internet is just so hard.

[A]

It's too big. There's impossible to discover things. Right?

[B]

It's agreed. Right? And so he was like, like, let's get, you know, people essentially, like, our listeners, authors, the two of us, to, like, make groups of books that are basically, like, your favorite microtrope or just, like, something you've noticed about, you know, a bunch of books, a way to read a bunch of books together. And we are calling this the collections department, which is funny, only we promise, like, never to call your mom and tell her that you didn't pay your bills. And, like, some of them are just like our, like, right. Like every deep dive we've ever done, all of our best of. Right? So you can kind of look at those as an easy way to see all those at once. But then we have, like, people who have, like, microtropes. Like, so we asked be in her books, and she made one about mustaches.

[A]

Or my friend Shane did one about food in historicals. And then the. And Jen did, too.

[B]

I did only ones up so far.

[A]

Only ones up.

[B]

He.

[A]

He's. He's.

[B]

Why isn't the other one so funny?

[A]

He's not every. He's like, jen can wait. Everybody else is going up. So Jen did one. It was called.

[B]

Originally.

[A]

Was called Hoops. There it is.

[B]

No Hoop. There it is. Like, it was.

[A]

There it is. And then. And then. So it's a basketball one. And then Eric put it to the text thread. I changed the structure of this title to match the title of the song with parentheses and exclamation point.

[B]

And I was like, okay, that's fair enough. But the funny part is. So he was kind of like, you two need to actually make some, you dummies. And I was like, okay, so I made these two. And the thing that's fun is like, it can be like. Like, okay, the MNBA is in playoffs, the WNBA season. Oh, my God, you guys. When the time you hear this? It started last night, right? So I'm like, in my. In a great time for me. So I was like, oh, it'd be really fun to have, like a basketball romance one, right? So they can be topical, whatever. There's. So there's so many really great ones. So Shreya apparently submitted Virgin Heroes. And I, like, check out the collections page. And I sent Eric this text and I was like, excuse me, are you literally trolling me right now? Virgin Heroes went up before hoop. There it is.

[A]

What I love about this, though, is the Virgin Heroes list. I mean, everybody knows Virgin Heroes are not for Jen. And so it's interesting to me because we may never do a Virgin Hero episode. The closest we'll ever have gotten is when we did. We, like, did an episode related to Fate of Mains Live.

[B]

No.

[A]

So I know. So we did an episode related to Fated Mates Live. And we talked a little bit. I talked a little bit about Virgin Heroes, but now there's a list. And a lot of these books I didn't. I have not read.

[B]

See, there you go.

[A]

What is very. The coolest thing about the collections for me is like, I am into a lot of these microtropes and I think of myself as being somebody who knows the score. But there are so many books in these collections that I've never read. I'm so excited.

[B]

I really like about it is. So then Eric does a nice job of being like, you know, we've talked about this book or this author. But yeah, it's like if. And I think the other thing is, as you all know, just when you're looking for a discoverability buddy, right. If you find a collection that has, okay, two books on it you really loved, you can kind of like, hey, I'm probably gonna like the rest of these, right? Also, it's fun. Cause people come up with their own titles. And my. The one that I think of as being really funny is by some Heather Varlow, who wrote one called Getting Sprung, which is oh, so clever, right? About essentially when people get broken out of jail. And I was like, so clever. God, why do I love this?

[A]

And then Alice Murray did one called First Come First Curve. About plus size Heroines and historicals.

[B]

Oh, Secret Tattoos from art. The person, my favorite, right, who made the Discoverability Buddy name.

[A]

And then Andy has done a couple Nisha. By the time these are up, Nisha's got a couple in here. I sort of. You can go to faded mates.net collections or just go to faded mates.net and it's right, there's a link on the main page that's to collections and so you can head over and take a look and explore. And what we love about this is it's giving an opportunity for people who we love and who we respect and who we think are great, you know, our great Discoverability buddies, a chance to have space on the website. And I love this structure too. Like you could think to yourself, like, I don't know what I want to read. And you don't have to listen to a whole episode though you should, right?

[B]

And just be like, I wonder what From Starchy to Feral could be about. Well, it's about a starchy hero who comes completely undone. Thanks, Hilary Bowen. That's another great one.

[A]

And you can also find a full list of all of the deep dives like Jen said you can and a full list of all of our best lists on here too. So welcome everyone to Fated mates. I'm Sarah MacLaine. I read romances and I write them.

[B]

And I'm Jennifer Prokup, a romance reader and editor.

[A]

And if you are a member of our Patreon, an announcement has been made. So check your email is what I'll say just quickly to anybody there and then everybody else will get that announcement next week, I think. So there's that, that's a little bit of housekeeping that I wanted to do. And then can we talk about Pagebound?

[B]

Oh yeah.

[A]

And we have like Romance Domination page.

[B]

Give the people what they want, Sarah.

[A]

Pagebound. We've talked about it on a couple of podcasts, but it's a ferocious and growing community of book lovers. And you go there and it's basically like a place where you can collect the books that you've read and talk about the books that you're reading and meet other like minded readers. And so once we partnered with Pagebound and we said, all right, we've got a quest. We're going to be here, we're going to send our listeners to you. This week I went over to Page Bound and there's just romance everywhere as far as the eye can see.

[B]

And I think the other part that is really cool is it's like very conversation based. Right. Somebody wrote like there's like a topic that's like iad for the win. Basically there's a cheat code for a gold medal and hence having read all of the IED books the show covers. And I was like, look at this. Here's a fun question. Two scenarios. What's your take? And so it says scenario one. Someone who has never read romance before asks you where they should start. You must recommend one book from this quest. Which do you choose? Or scenario two. An experienced romance reader is in a slump and desperate to find something to get them back in the game again. You must pick one book from this quest. What do you recommend?

[A]

Being really thoughtful.

[B]

Yeah. And then it's like really super fun to read. Like read people's answers too.

[A]

So yeah, I love, like today Eric sent me a post that somebody had posted and they were like, what's a book Sarah and Jen have never talked about that you wish they would read. And there were a couple books in the list and I was like, I've never even heard of that book. Like, so you guys, I'm paying attention. I'm.

[B]

We're listening.

[A]

I'm doing the job.

[B]

And listen, we all need those fun places to go, especially places where it's just like all books, Bookish community. It feels great. So yay. Speaking of fun and bookish community, did you go to any independent bookstores yesterday, Sarah?

[A]

Let's talk about that. Yesterday was independent bookstore day. So when you all are listening, last weekend was independent Bookstore day. I did. So I did this thing originally. I've, I actually was in multiple independent bookstores all week long. And in Brooklyn there was like a bookstore crawl and you were supposed to like get stamps through like 15 independent bookstores in Brooklyn. And of course I was in like six over the course of the week. And did I have my card for stamping? I did not. So I failed in my, in the like, most obvious way. I failed. But the. But what's interesting is it felt squeaky this week. There was the Barnes and Noble pre order sale, which is now it seems like maybe quarterly, which is, you know, great. Everybody great. That's 25, 15% off or 25% off your preorders if you do it through Barnes and Noble in all formats, which is, you know, a big, a big discount. So that happened and then like suddenly Amazon announced that they were going to do some sort of like Amazon sale yesterday Saturday. And that felt shit, like, shitty.

[B]

Well, and it was funny because, like there was a guy on Blue sky who was like an author, like a historian. He's like, hey, I just looked and my book is only like $10 on Amazon.

[A]

I don't know why.

[B]

And someone was like, it's because Amazon is trying to undercut Independent Bookstore Day. And the guy was horrified because of course he was just like, hey, I want people out there buying it. But like, if you are not hooked into that, it's real easy to see how you could not know.

[A]

And here's the thing. Independent Bookstore Day is always the last Saturday in April. So it does feel like Barnes Noble was a little bit eating. Eating Indy's lunches too. I think so anyway. So I think. But interestingly, I think the, the fact that Barnes and Noble and Amazon both were like doing these kind of shenanigany things made the indie like elevated Indie Bookstore Day, at least online. Like, I saw so many people talking about it. So then I posted, I, I'm gonna post about all the bookstores that I love. And then I got to 20 and I was like, it's too many bookstores and that. And then it's one of those things where it's like you're giving a speech at like the Academy Awards and then you're like, I'm just going to forget. Like, I can't, I can't remember everybody. So then I slowly like deleted all the bookstores that I had been talking about. And I just said like, thank you to every independent bookstore. Because indies really are like a huge part of how we succeed as people, as writers in the world. And then last night Eric and I went out for dinner and we went out to a restaurant like a block from the Ripped Bodice. So I popped into the Ripped Bodice and Catherine from the Ripped Bodice was like working and it was packed in there. It was like seven and there were so many people, which was great. And I was like, it feels like 7 o' clock on a Saturday night for a bookstore. Does not feel like you would normally.

[B]

Expect it to be.

[A]

Yeah. And she was like, oh no. And this is. She's like, it has been like even busier all day. So it sounded like that was. And then I was in my local bookstore too. Bookmarks in Bay Ridge, which is nice.

[B]

I only went to two. There are like kind of five independent books, like within a mile of me. But I went to. Last week I went to a new black owned bookstore at like the northern end of Hyde park called Call and Response Books. And I bought like five or six books. So I Was like, okay. And so yesterday I was like, I'm going to drive by and if I can like find an easy parking space, I'll pop in. But I couldn't. So I just kind of kept going. But I, I went to 57th Street Books. I wasn't able to make it into Seminary Co op, but they're like essentially the same owner. So I was like, again, it was just like too busy down by one. But I was able to find parking at another one. And then I went to a really cool new bookstore like in my neighborhood called the Book Joint, which is another black owned bookstore. And it is a beautiful space and it really, it has like a very lovingly curated selection of essentially like call and response does essentially all kinds of people of color. But like, this bookstore is really like black owned books. But I found a really cool book for my husband. He doesn't listen to the podcast so I can talk about it about like black TV shows. And so like they had really cool books. And then just like a really nice, like seating area. It was like a really bright, sunny space. So that was. I had a good time there. And then I did not go, there's a Powell in my neighborhood. But like, the Hyde Park Powells is just like, it's like boring books from university. No, it's not. I'm just like, nobody wants to read your old textbooks, you weirdos.

[A]

A. I'm sure all these books were.

[B]

Owned by Nobel prize winners, but whatever.

[A]

Not useful to me unless you put your name in them.

[B]

Correct. So it's actually, it's in great shape and it's like, everything's really well organized. But like, sometimes I'm just not in the mood. I think a good used bookstore, you have to be in the mood to just discover what comes your way. It's a different vibe.

[A]

So my thing is, I think I've talked about this recently because I did this when I went to Montgomery and Taggart too. But I went to. When I go to a romance bookstore now, like the only. I. I tend not to browse. I tend to just like immediately go to the manager and be like, what should I read? Yeah, because. And then if they recommend me a book that I have never read before, I buy it because, like, I've read so much that it's hard to find, you know, whatever. So I was at the Robotus yesterday, like I said, and I bought Katherine recommended Sarah Grunder Ruiz's Luck and Last Resorts, which we. I think I feel like I mentioned her next her second book on I Think she has a new book coming out. So I bought that. It's a ship romance, which I'm into.

[B]

Sure. I mean, summer is on our way, right? I like it.

[A]

And then I bought my daughter. I didn't realize that Ashley Herring Blake had written, like, middle grade, like, lower ya. So I bought my daughter the Mighty heart of sunny St. James. And then when I was in. When I was in bookmarks, I bought. My daughter actually reads this, like, graphic novel series called the Love Report. And there's a brand new one that was out this week. So I got to be a good. A good mom. And I bought a collection of Audre Lorde essays. I just. And then I just. They just pile up. All my books just pile up.

[B]

I'm afraid that is.

[A]

And then instead I came home and I read he did Rivalry. Wait, before we get there, though. And Jen, I'm sorry, you're gonna have to turn off your ears because I gotta say this out loud to the crew.

[B]

Okay. What are you about to say?

[A]

I did take my 11 year old to see Pride and Prejudice remastered. The rerelease on the big screen.

[B]

And how was it?

[A]

Listen, it was a fucking delight.

[B]

I'm so glad.

[A]

I had a great time. She had a great time. We ate popcorn and drank diet Coke and watched Mr. Darcy be Mr. Darcy all over on.

[B]

Is this the one where he clenches his hand? Yes.

[A]

That part's nice. That hand. That hand.

[B]

Did you intuitively understand the power of that moment? Oh, yeah. Okay.

[A]

Oh, yeah. This is the. I think I've told this. I know I've told you this story. I'm not sure I've told this story online, but this is the movie that sort of, like, awakened her to, I think, like, romance in general. She was maybe 8, and I was having a day, and so I was watching it, and she sort of like, toddled into the living room and was like, what is this?

[B]

What's this boring thing? And then you're like, oh. And then she was like, no, it's great.

[A]

There's a scene and it's raining and they're in a gazebo, and he proposes and she turns him down. But then they get, like, real close. You know, they do one of those, like, real close almost kiss things. And she was leaning forward on the couch and she went, kiss, kiss, kiss.

[B]

And you were like, look at. It works.

[A]

Look at this. You've done so well. So anyway, we had a great time. I'm very grateful to, you know, film in general for deciding that we all needed us that this week. And I'll be honest. Like, I saw Sanj. Sanj went too, at some point, and she was post. She posted on Instagram about it, and. And she was like, it was so emotional for me. And I was like, you know, it was really emotional for me, too, in like, a very, like, cathartic way. Like, in a sort of. I just. It's such a romantic movie, and so I had a great time, and I got all teary at, like, totally irrelevant. Like, all teary at moments that I shouldn't have gotten all teary at, but just, like, felt emotional and nice. So, anyway, well done, Keira Knightley. Well done, Matthew.

[B]

Well done, Keira Knightley.

[A]

Everything, if you were wondering, everything holds up there.

[B]

Well, I mean, it is kind of a I do not believe classic story that's held up for a long time.

[A]

You know what? I don't believe we need constant remakes of Jane Austen.

[B]

And, yeah, I think.

[A]

I think this one is good.

[B]

But this one seems okay.

[A]

This one is. Well, it's 20. What is it, 25 years old? I think it was 20 years old. 20, okay, 2005.

[B]

Oh, yeah. Then 20.

[A]

Okay, listen, 20 years old. But here's the thing. If it's beautiful, it's set in the Regency, so no one knows. It'll just last how old it is.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

Costumes are the same, and yet somehow they are not. All right, so that is that. Everybody reporting in. I saw Linda took her statue to the movies. That's some.

[B]

Of course she did. Linda, real vibe.

[A]

Linda, we love you.

[B]

Meanwhile, have I. Had. I been with Linda, I'd been like, I have to get up and sit in another row now. What is happening? Oh, my goodness. It'd be like me going to Mad Max Fury Road and bringing out, like, a skull. I don't know. What are you guys doing?

[A]

Bringing your Tom Hardy poster.

[B]

Sure. Furiosa.

[A]

That's also. That is a movie I would really love to go see in the movie theater again.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Anyway, I'm putting that. So maybe I'm manifesting that for next year.

[B]

Maybe we just need to rent one of these movie theaters out.

[A]

You know, I did the mat. I. I did some research on this because I thought, oh, it might be fun to rent out a movie theater to, like, do a screening of. Of Pride and Prejudice. And I just didn't get around to it. But I did send the email, and I got an email back, and the one, the guy was like. And this is for a movie theater in New York City. So, like, it was $750 and.

[B]

That.

[A]

Which for like a 40 seat theater. And then plus like the expectation was like people would spend like $15, I think per person, like for food. And I was like, that's actually not a terrible amount of money for a private screening of something. So I don't know, maybe everybody. We should just do that more.

[B]

I don't. Yeah, we could just watch whatever we wanted.

[A]

Just. I mean, my whole theory is you should just like there should be like a Wednesday afternoon curated fated mates movie. If we all lived in the same place, everyone imagine it would be so fun. It would be the Saint Moonstruck.

[B]

Be a real weird group.

[A]

Something with Jason Statham in it.

[B]

Just a super cut of like Explosions on my day.

[A]

The first episode of Reacher.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Oh my God, that Reacher man sings.

[B]

A lot on the Internet.

[A]

And I find it questionable.

[B]

I don't know anything about that.

[A]

Really?

[B]

No. Well, you know, I took all that off my phones.

[A]

He's a musician. I think he was originally musician. I'm talking about this like big giant.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, sure. Alan.

[A]

If you ask AI to build you Jack Reacher, this is the person it would build you. Except AI is not good because it wouldn't build you a person who can carry a tune probably. And this guy was like a musician at some point and so now does a lot of like singing to his camera, which, you know, I have no idea. Anyway, so you should go follow him. Alan. Is that his name?

[B]

Something? Alan something something.

[A]

You watch that show, don't you?

[B]

I do, but I apparently don't pay attention to the credits.

[A]

Alan something, I think.

[B]

Alan. Rick Richson, Richter. I don't know.

[A]

Sure. Oh, yeah. So now let's get to it.

[B]

This week's episode of Fated Mates is brought to you by Laquette, author of Royal Bride Demand.

[A]

Okay, so Reina, our heroine is just like a normal person vibing in the world. Sure, she once had this like great relationship or you know, she had a relationship with Jasiria to be and it fell apart. But she is like over it.

[B]

Totally over it.

[A]

And all she really cares about right now is that her childhood home is. She no longer has access to her childhood home. And she wants that more than anything. Well, lucky for her, Jasiri is back in business and he needs to get married. And he needs to get married real fast. Gen. Because he is a royal prince teed up secret. A secret royal prince. He never told Reina about this.

[B]

Of course he didn't.

[A]

He is teed up to become heir to the island kingdom of Na and In order to take over the throne, he needs to get married fast. So he has come back to claim Reina, the girl who got away and convince her to marry him and become princess slash future queen of this island country. Now initially Reina is like, I don't know that I want any part of this except he's promised that she can have her childhood home back. He'll buy it for her and make sure she has everything she wants in bed, out of bed, forever and ever and ever and ever if she'll just agree to be a queen.

[B]

You know, I brain, I believe in you.

[A]

I think she's going to make the right choice.

[B]

Okay, so if you would like to read this marriage of Convenience second chance romance that has an enemies to lovers, But They're Royals vibe, then you should check out Royal Bride Demand. It is available in print and an ebook and if your podcast app supports it, you can click on the chapter title right now to be taken to buy the book. Thanks to Laquente for sponsoring this week's episode. Well, here's what I'm going to say, everybody. We are about to talk about Heated Rivalry by Rachel Reed. And the reason I am nervous about this is because I, you know, this actually is an interesting question which is like, what are the books that you think of as being so like, beloved by so many people that they become. Right. Like there's, I think I don't think of. I was trying to think about how to frame this. Like, I don't think of romance as having like a canon. I don't think you have to read anything or not. Like I, I. There's just too much and I think it's like what you want to read. But I do think that there's a small number of books that have become just like beloved.

[A]

I think there are books that are in the zeitgeist like that like people. It feels like everybody has read them and everybody who has read them loved them.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And often those books are books that like I have missed.

[B]

If you One of the things I think is like before Faded Mates, a long time ago when people would ask me like, you know, like, should I read a romance? I would sort of has I had like a two question, right? And it was kind of like, do you want contemporary or historical? And then I would recommend either Lord of Scoundrels or Bet Me because I felt like these were two books where I'm like, if you for like a. You've never read a book before, you've never read a romance before, right? This is like 10 years ago. I don't know that I'd say these two books now.

[A]

I'd be like, no, that's interesting, because I definitely would have said Lord of Scoundrels. But I wouldn't now.

[B]

No. Right. Correct. So this is like, yeah, to be clear, everybody, 10 years ago. And I don't think I'd say bet me now, but I would say, like, what I would say to people is, if you don't like these books, then you don't like romance. Like, I think they're very good at doing what romance does. And they are really well liked and they're great books and they're really. You know what I mean? They're like the pinnacle of, like, romance or whatever at that time. And so I think that in some ways, I think this book, I think a lot of people would think of as being like, this is a. And I think to me, that often feels like a way. Like, this isn't a book that just is insider love of romance. I think a lot of people would say that this book is a romance they would, like, recommend to a lot of people. Right. Like, it's really good at doing what romance does.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And I think, like, in. When you then come to that book, like, the two of us have neither of us had read it before. Nope. It's like the pressure. I was like, oh, I better love this book. Or, I don't know.

[A]

I mean, it does feel that way. Often you're like, oh, what if I don't like it? And here's what I will say. I really did like it. I enjoyed it. I sometimes feel, though, like, a book like this because it's in the. Like, I didn't read it the year it came out. So, like. So I think there are a few things at play here. I didn't read it the year it came out. Like, when it came out, I didn't. I like. So now it feels like, well, there's lots of queer romance out there.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Like, it doesn't feel. As for me, it didn't have the kind of. It doesn't. It doesn't feel like. What's the word I'm looking for? Like, spectacular in that way. Like, oh, I've never read anything like this. I've never anything like it. And also, like, it feels like hockey is everywhere now.

[B]

I am also really interested, though, when you do read a book that everyone loves and you're coming to it late, it's really fun to think, well, what is it that people love about this Book. Right. Like, what is the. What is it about this book that really, like, makes people feel so strongly about it? Right. That's kind of a fun thing to sort of like, almost like you're like retconning it in advance. Right.

[A]

I. And we'll, I'm sure, get to it, but I think this book really rides an interesting, interesting line between what was before and what is now.

[B]

Yeah, I would agree with that too.

[A]

Yeah, I think it has the sort of tension and because of like, of the way that these two characters have to really shield themselves from the world and like, protect their identities from the world. So it has this kind of very old school feeling of like, you know, truth and, you know, identity and, and fear and like, threat. But it also is about, like, there is something very phone boothy about this book.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Like, it's very. Like there are moments of real quiet, like, emotional tension that feel very modern.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like it's two generations of romance smashed together.

[B]

I experienced several moments of what I will call like, cognitive dissonance between the hopefulness of this book for what it would mean about what it would be like to be openly, openly queer in America or Canada or North America or the world and how it feels reading that now and like, the questions it raised about masculinity.

[A]

Right. Yes, because these are so. Okay, let's talk about what this book is. Let's give a quick overview for those of you who haven't read it. So Heated Rivalry 2015 by Rachel Reed is the second book in her Game Changers series. This series is entirely about hockey players. They are all queer. The first book in the series is. I'm just gonna name check because I think it's like we're gonna, we're gonna reference it, I think, or when we do this, when we talk about the plot of this book. The book is called Game Changer. I have not read this, but it is a hockey captain, Scott Hunter, he's important to this book. And a, like, juice bar barista, like, fall for each other. Okay. So Rachel has done this really interesting thing where she's created a world in which queer hockey players exist, but they exist within the confines and the construct of what is existing in like, sports masculinity in America. Right. So like, there is the threat of discovery or like there is a constant sort of underlying current of if we are found out to be gay, we will, our careers will suffer because sports and masculinity. So it's this interesting use you said cognitive dissonance. Like, it's this interesting world that she's built for us. Right? We're like, all of these characters are hockey players within a real existing sports universe. Right? So that's an important thing for you to know. It's not like there are some newer series of. There are some newer queer sports series where like the whole team is gay and like it's just open and normal. Like, that is not what we're dealing with here.

[B]

So this is more like the real world of the NHL and professional sports hockey, where it's kind of. Where it's forbidden.

[A]

Right, exactly. So. And I think that that's part of what's so compelling about this book is like this forbidden. It's a modern day, like, forbidden romance. So Shane is our. Is captain of the Montreal hockey team and he is. And. And Ilya is a Russian hockey player and he is captain of the Boston Bears. And they are. And when we meet them at the very beginning of the book, basically, like, all we know is they've just been on the ice together. They've just been. They've just had a. And then there's like, they are rivals. They are presented to us as like straightforward, they fucking hate each other rivals. And then in a very. This is a prologue. And in a very interesting twist at the very end of the prologue, it becomes clear that like, Shane has gone to this like, secret meeting place afterward and there's a knock at the door and there's Ilya and then they are gonna fuck.

[B]

Oh, yeah, right.

[A]

And you're like, oh, shit. Like they're rival captains and rival people. And then it goes back in time to when they were teenagers in hockey camp together. And then the time is really interesting. Like there's a timeline, a timeline structure here where like she then brings a timeline forward every, you know, sometimes in months, sometimes in years to show us how they have like, developed this like, simultaneously public rivalry and a private, like, erotic experience.

[B]

The book is organized in four parts. Part one is like this like the beginning of their, like, sort of like really just sexual relationship that they develop. And I mean, I think the thing is, is it's like, I want to point like, so they are at like the world Junior World Championship for Hockey, which is basically like the, like, you guys always makes you laugh when I read these like, college hockey romances, the Final Frozen Four, that's. That means they weren't good enough to be where these guys were. Right? And then part two is like, what I thought was like, really interesting was kind of a way shorter, just a couple of chapters where there's sort of like an overture that maybe it's more. And it kind of gets shut down. Right. Like, it's like this little window that, like, maybe there could be more between us than I thought it, like, closed. Because of their own fears or feelings.

[A]

Right. Because Shane. So. Sorry. Let me just. Okay. Is it okay if I stop you here or do you want to finish your thoughts about parts?

[B]

Well, I. No, I just think, like, to me, the timeline was less interesting than the parts. That's what I was gonna say. Each part, I think, is doing something.

[A]

Really distinct, is doing something very different. I agree. So. But Shane's character is very kind of like, he's like a sweet baby. It has never occurred to Shane to be gay.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, it's almost like he's sort of written as, like, not only has it never occurred to Shane to be gay, it's also never occurred to Shane, really, to have sexual thoughts.

[B]

Right. Yeah, he, like. Because he knows.

[A]

He's hockey. That's his thing. Yeah, he's. His job is hockey. And so that's it. Now, Ilya is Russian, and you get the vibe very quickly that Ilya's job is fucking people.

[B]

Correct? Yeah, 100%.

[A]

He also is very good at hockey, but this man knows his way around a bedroom. And there's this sort of sense. So there's a really interesting tension between them, like, emotionally, because you get this very. And I want to talk. I know you want to talk about masculinity, too, but, like, there is something deeply masc. Like, Ilya feels like. Like he just, like, oozes testosterone. Right?

[B]

Well, because Shane describes him that way.

[A]

But they're described physically that way, too.

[B]

Right. But, like, we're seeing each other, like, Right. There's. It's through their eyes. Right. Like that. That Shane talks about over and over again about how Ilya feels like a man and he does not himself feel like a man.

[A]

Facial hair. He has body hair. He's like.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Bigger.

[B]

Right. More. Broader. All those things. Right, yeah, of course.

[A]

And then. Okay, so then. And so then there's this kind of sense of, like. Okay, Ilya's Russian. Shane is Canadian, and they have the. For the first two parts of this book, you're really reading an erotic romance. Like you're reading.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Them. There's very little that they know about each other other than hockey and being hot. Right.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then as we move into the third and fourth four parts.

[B]

Five parts. Four.

[A]

Four parts. Then we start to see them, like, actually become humans to each Other. Right. Like, then there we start to see them, like, grow up.

[B]

One. Yes.

[A]

Which is important. And then in the growing up, they start to have to navigate what are essentially feelings. Right. They start to feel feelings. And that makes everything more complicated because these are not. This is not a structure. This is not a. This is not a conflict that is easily overcome. Right. Like, this is. You have to overcome society. Right. Familial expectation, the masculinity that comes with sports, the expectations of a team, the expectations of, you know, your. Your own expectations for, like, who you are and the face you present to the world. And then on top of it, Ilya is Russian. Right. And so we all know that in Russia, he. There is no way for Ilia to be outwardly openly gay. Yeah. I don't think we have to talk too much more about plot except to say, like, it's basically just like, what, 10 years or not even. It's like six or seven years of them, like, dancing around each other on the ice. This week's episode of Faded Mates is sponsored by Jillian David, author of Paging doctor Breakup.

[B]

So this is the second book in Jillian's Yukon Valley, Alaska hospital series. And the best way to think about this, everyone, is Grey's Anatomy means Northern Exposure.

[A]

I don't know.

[B]

If that doesn't appeal to you, then.

[A]

I don't know what to say to you because that sounds pretty great to me.

[B]

Yeah, The Pit meets Northern Exposure. I will just like change it. Okay. So anyway, with no rats.

[A]

Fine.

[B]

Okay, I'll stop now.

[A]

Oh, my God.

[B]

Anyway, Deirdre Stein is the chief nurse. She's a widow. And she's basically like, I am not gonna let my heart ever get broken again. It was too much. Right. So she has been fending off the town's matchmakers for as long as she can. She just can't take it anymore. But this, it really hits a rough spot because her old high school friend Cal Garrett is back in town. Calvin is the head of an er, fast paced ER in Seattle, but he's. When. Since he's helping his parents, he's also like, putting in some shifts at this small Yukon Valley hospital to like, sort of pitch in and help out. And the town, of course, is like matchmaking potential. Just they, they can see it. So Cal and Deirdre enter into a fake dating situation just to like, kind of shut down the matchmakers. Like, eventually Cal will go back to Seattle and they won't have to listen to anybody talking about them. But real feelings start being had when they have These like kind of nice dates and all this hanging out, right? So the fake dates are turning into real feelings. Everything is going to come to a head at the breakup festival. And this everyone is not where Deirdre and Cal are going to break up in front of the whole town, but rather when the ice is going to break on the frozen Yukon River. And so that's when he is slated to go back to Seattle. But this is also like feels like they don't want to break up. Just because the ice is breaking up doesn't mean they're ready to break up. And so what is going to happen when these two have to figure it out? Like they. I can't take it anymore.

[A]

What is going to happen? Well, you can find out right now in print or ebook. You can get Paging doctor Breakup Today. It was out this week and if your podcasting app supports it, you can click on the chapter title right now to be taken to buy the book. Thanks to Jillian David for sponsoring this week's episode.

[B]

One of the things that it like is worth saying is right so we talked about this book was published in 2019. It is now 2025. And I, as far as I know, there is one professional hockey player named Luke Prokop, ironically, who is not even.

[A]

No relation.

[B]

Yeah, not no relation. Who is not in the NHL. He instead is. He plays for like a, you know, I don't know what it's called in hockey. Like one tier down, right? So he's a professional hockey player, but he's not an NHL player. And as far as I know, there, there are still no openly gay hockey players. Right. In the NHL. So the world that they live in, I mean, it's I think, very the, the world of professional hockey. I think that we see the homophobia, their fear of being outed, their idea that, like, they know gay players must exist. They don't know who they are. They think it would take a lot of bravery. They're Shane's like, I don't think that's me, Ilya. I think it could be. But he very. But he fears like, if I'm cut, I have to go back to Russia and I can't go back there. Right. So it's like his bravery for him would be an existential, physical danger as well. The other thing, though, that I thought was really effective about this book was like, how young they are. And I think, like, you know, you read a lot of these, a lot of romances now when you read about like, you know, they're in college or they're 22 or 20, 23. And they are really not. They're really like, you know, have the abilities and skills and decision making. Six year olds, right?

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

But I mean, these two are kids and I think one of the things that I found really truly effective about it is like, so, you know, they're, you're like kind of in their point of view is like these, you know, hookups are happening. Basically, they're hookups. And then you would sort of, kind of be like, okay, well why can't these two get us together? And then there'd be this like casual thing where Ilya would be like, you know, brother would call and like demand money. And Ilya's like, I'm 21 years old. And you're like, oh my God, they're so young.

[A]

That's why they can't be together.

[B]

Right. And so it's like this question of like, what is bravery when or like what? You know what I mean? Like, I didn't ever find that I was like disappointed or thought that they should have, you know what I mean? Like, but they are, they as people are very aware of, of like the pressure and the expectations of the league that they are playing in, of their. And for Ilya, of his family and his country and for Shane, it's, who is like, it's I guess like a coming out kind of journey. For him though, being with women as a, as a professional hockey player is very easy and he has been with women, but he's never satisfied and he doesn't really like it. And it's clear it takes him a long time to essentially be able to say like, I think I'm gay. And to say to Ilya, but you're really not.

[A]

Right?

[B]

You're bi. And I think like that is part of the journey of this book for them is like the hookups evolve in such a way where like, Shane in particular is on a journey of figuring out who he is, but Ilya is on a journey of figuring out what is possible in terms of his life. And I think they're different. And I think that's another reason it takes them so long to sort of like figure this out. Right.

[A]

Well, it's also really interesting because she teased them up in such a way. Yes. They are so young. Right. I mean, first of all, a perfect example of a prologue that's doing a lot of cognitive work for the reader, like establishing them as grown ups before we go back and read them as kids.

[B]

I think that's smart. I would have Had a hard time without that prologue, right?

[A]

So one, and then I think there's also this, like, I always joke. Like, I say it a million times a day, but, like, heroes should be kings, right? And here are two kings, literal kings, right? They are captains of their team at, like, 22 years old. Like, they are. They are brilliant. They are in the Olympics at their age. Like, Ilya is the captain of the Russian Olympic team at 22. Like, it is. It's unreal how skilled they are in that world.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And she does. You know, there's this moment, this very. So Ilya smokes.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And it's interesting because I'm always fascinated when a hero smokes in a romance, because in, like, there was a time when all the heroes smoked, and then. And now you never. You almost never see it. Right? But Ilya smokes, at least when he's young, he smokes. He quits ultimately, over the course of the book. Although, you know, and there's this great moment where they're, like, being fucking men. They're. They're just being dumb men in a gym and they're, like, running on treadmills side by side. And you're in Shane's pov, and he's like, I can beat him. I mean, like, he smokes. Like, I should be able to beat him and he can't. Right? Like, and the joke of the sort of magnificence of this book is they are both kings and they are equal in every way. Right? Like, so when Ilya wins a game one year, one week, Shane wins the next week. Like, there's no, you know, Ilya doesn't.

[B]

The.

[A]

The Russians don't make it to the podium at the Olympics, but the American, the Canadians do.

[B]

You.

[A]

So, like, you know, it's an interesting push, pull. And I think what's really fascinating and what elevates this book in a way that, you know, shows Rachel Reed's real skill is that in the hands of a lesser author, this book would have a lack of conflict.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Because these are just two very skilled people, like, being skilled on the ice and, like. But because they are both kings, Right. What she has established for them is this situation where they cannot rule until they have overcome their own insecurity about everything.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Who they are, who they would be if they were revealed to the world.

[B]

Like, what.

[A]

That. What would come next if they were outed. Right. Or if they were found, discovered. And so I think the stress of that is so well articulated by. And. And it feels existential for them. And It's. And it is existential. This is the. The threat of. Of being outed, right. Is a. Is existential. And so I feel, really, what was magnificent, what I think she does so well, is give you these two characters who are so powerful, it seems like they cannot fail and then deliver you exactly how they might.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

And. And she doesn't. For what it's worth. And, like, this is spoiling it. They are not outed. Right. Like, there is no. There is. This is not done.

[B]

Right.

[A]

She doesn't. She doesn't deliver that threat to them because. Or she doesn't. She doesn't make good on that threat because the threat itself is so powerful.

[B]

Doesn't actually need to happen. They just have to live with it.

[A]

Right, Exactly.

[B]

And now here's where I will admit something. I read this book for the first time all the way through I'd started this book for. And DNF'd it because I think the beginning of the book, like, the part one section in particular, is like, pure erotic erotica, even not even really, like, an erotic romance, right? Like, they have no way of.

[A]

Well, the walls are so high, right.

[B]

They have no way of actually getting to each other. And at whatever point in time I tried reading it, I was like, I'm just not into it, right? I was like, I don't really just want to read about these guys all the time. Sorry. And it wasn't in. And I kind of had forgotten why, you know, like, yeah, I don't think I got that far. I just. Whatever. And then this time around, I was like, oh, I remember now. And it was so. I was really fascinated. I was really fascinated by that switch to part two, because I think I was like, okay, what is gonna happen here that's making this part two? It's not really that time has moved along, right? Like, they see each other a couple of times a year. We get, like, it was, I think, really smart, like, kind of subtle. Like, at some point much later in the book, Shane sort of says, like, after March, like, right as. As it's approaching, like, the Stanley cup finals or the. Or the playoffs, they. No matter if they saw each other or not, they didn't contact each other. Like, hockey became supreme. It just whatever they were to each other was not as important. And so I was really interested in, like, those sections between, like, part one and part two. And in part two is where we see Shane by the building, which I thought was really smart for showing just how deeply he wanted to be with Ilya and how Desperately. He knew that, like, I mean, the word safe, they had to be safe. They had to be safe.

[A]

Right.

[B]

That he was like, what is gonna make me feel safe to do this?

[A]

Right.

[B]

And I was. I was really interested in that.

[A]

And then.

[B]

Right. Like, it's sort of like this part where he. He thinks, like, realistically about, you know, Russia's laws against homosexuality and, like, what it would mean for Ilya if he was discovered. For Shane, it's more sort of like his emotional vulnerability. But, like, I was really fascinated. I found myself flagging how many times the word safe is used in that section that, like, that's what Shane wants. Like, I want to figure out who I am, but I want to do it in a way that's safe. And because I am one of the biggest hockey stars in the literal world. Right. Where is that place for us in Canada? At one point, he's like, we couldn't be in the same room in Canada without people knowing who we were. Right. And then in part three is the part where it transitions from, like, that, like, erotica. It's like erotica, erotic romance, and then romance.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Like, almost like each part is a different sub genre. And that's when I really found myself thinking, like, oh, I'm really enjoying this. You came online getting the things that I really love out of a romance. Right. Which is, like, all those little moments of, like, tenderness and connection and, you know, like, joy and humor and them, like, being together and. You know what I mean? And so I think it's, like, a really interesting read in the sense that the. The. We talk all the time about an erotic romance. Like.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Like, sex has to do work. It's showing us the emotional intimacy of the relationship. I think that's incredibly true of this book, but I also think it's telling us something about the emotional journey of the reader. Right. Like, I didn't. It wasn't super emotional at the beginning because it really wasn't for them. They couldn't let it be.

[A]

Well, because she's right.

[B]

She.

[A]

It's interesting, though, right, Because I feel like she wouldn't have been able to maintain the tension for the whole book if she'd introduced the sort of heightened stakes at the very beginning. Like, yeah, for the first two parts. I mean, part one is really the past. Like, it's.

[B]

Yeah, they're.

[A]

I mean, they're. One is, like, how they. It's basically the rivalry. Like, how the rivalry came to be, plus how they started to be attracted to each other. Right.

[B]

Like, yeah, but I Also want to point out part one was eight chapters and part two was three. The. The parts were not equal. No. Right. Yeah. And I think the other thing that. So I. This is. I did find myself thinking, if I can interrupt and not talk about, like, two people I don't think are in love, but, like, the part that I found really poignant as, like, a WNBA fan is like, I. I have. I watched in real time last year the WNBA create a rivalry between Caitlin Clark and Angel Reese. Right. Like, in every way that is possible to sell the story that these two people hate each other. And no matter how many times you get these two people saying, like, yeah, no, we're fine together, right? The narrative of the league takes over. And I think that that's the part about part one that is so powerful is like, we have no idea how they could have been with each other if it had not been for the fact that they were set up to be rivals. Right. By the league. And I do think that's part. About an important part of that first section because they have to undo that too, right?

[A]

Yeah, I guess it's interesting, right? Because I think. I agree that that's the structure, but I do think that there's. I think Ilia especially likes it.

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

He gets off on the rivalry.

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

And, like, so I don't know that it's like, I think there's something more to the rivalry than, like, it's just how they are. It's how they were conditioned to think of each other. Like, I think Iliad, and I think this is why. Listen, this is really Ilia's story. You know, there's always a. I feel this way about all romances that, like, it's very, very rare that I come across a romance where it's not one character story more than the other. And so I am always sort of predisposed to think about a book as like, well, whose story is this? And I will say, if you're out there writing romance, often, you're fucked because it's almost never who you think you're. It's like, whose story you think it is. But in this case, right, like, Shane is really coming to terms with who he is, and he's having to, like, understand himself and he's going through real, like, for Shane, it, like, the first half of this book feels real coming of age in a lot of ways.

[B]

Right.

[A]

But Ilya, this is like, Ilia's story in that, like, we get to see him really evolve, which is why in, like, later in the book, when he starts speaking in Russian and listen. I mean, my favorite. Right? My favorite.

[B]

Yeah, but that's the thing. Like, those are great scenes where you're like, I get it now. Right.

[A]

He gets to rush. Like, Ilya's father, like, is very ill for the first half of the book. We sort of have a sense of what's up. Like, there's a conversation with his dad that doesn't feel quite right, but, like, he certainly isn't interested in revealing himself in any way to. To Hollander.

[B]

Part of the reason that it's fascinating is because Shane is the one who's obsessed with safety, but his position is far more safe than Alias is. Oh, yeah, right. I mean, at the end, his parents.

[A]

Are like, he's not going to get deported. He's not. He's not going to get deported to a place where he'd be thrown into a prison for being himself. Like, I mean, there are all sorts of things.

[B]

He has two living parents and they love him, and he's pretty sure that they will except him. You know what I mean? Like, so I think that's the part that's also really fascinating, and that's why I think it is Ilya's story, because he has.

[A]

I mean, he's got more.

[B]

More to lose. Yeah. Right.

[A]

Yeah. And so there's this great moment, like, late. I mean, this. It's great. He had. So his father dies and, like, it's one of those things. This. This is not uncommon in a sports romance for, like, something traumatic to happen at home. And then, like, just as, like, like, listen, Rachel Reed knows the job. Like, you know, we've. We've escalated everything. They've had this, like, very romantic time together. They're like, you know, moving toward the Stanley Cup. There's, like, all this kind of happening, but, like, you're starting to really feel like these two could actually make go of it. And then dad dies in Moscow.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And Ilya goes home to Russia. And he's alone there. Right. Like, he is. There's a moment there where he is, like, at. So at sea. Like, he's without country.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Because, like, at. In. Back in Canada, slash Boston. It's all the same. Like, he has, you know, this. Whatever the community of players looks like for him. Right. The team, the. The purpose, the work, the sport.

[B]

His cars.

[A]

His cars. And then he has. He has Shane.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But in Moscow, he has nobody. His father is dead. He didn't really like his father very much. He doesn't like his stepmother. He doesn't like his brother, right?

[B]

They all. They just want him for his money, right?

[A]

Everybody just wants money from him. And so he calls. He makes a phone call. He calls Shane. And there's something very vulnerable, obviously, not just about the moment, but also about the fact that Ilya, this, like, king among kings who, like. Like, first half of this book is him just being, like, like, the biggest in the league, right? And then all of a sudden, we see him, like, in deep romance, hero vulnerability. Yeah. Calling. And he can't find the words in English. Yeah, he can't find the words in English, but he can't find them.

[B]

Like.

[A]

Yeah, it's all such a, like, str. It's just obvious. Like, he can't. He can't feel the feeling. And then Shane says, say it to me in Russian.

[B]

It's a. And I'll just God tier romance moment.

[A]

I won't understand, but I'm gonna listen.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And you're in Shane's pov, which is very smart. And so, like, immediately, like, he speak. He starts speaking Russian. And Shane just, like, is thinking about the sound of his voice, right? And he goes on and on and on. And then he says, and now I'm done in English. And then it switches to Ilya. And Ilya's like, his first thought is, did. He should have recorded the conversation and then put it through a translator. And, like, which is a very sort of Russian. Like, it's sort of a reminder of, like, surveillance and threat and all the things that are looming over Ilya's head. And what I would say is, like, Rachel Reed really threads this needle very carefully because you don't really think about Russia very much for the first two, like, three quarters of this book, two thirds of this book, right? Like, it's sort of mentioned in passing, but, like, suddenly you see, like, Ilya is worried on a level, like, far beyond anything Shane could be worried about.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then Ilya. And then he's like. And the worst part was in the middle of all this, that he'd confess that he loves him. And of course, I mean, done.

[B]

I'm like, no, it's.

[A]

This is perfect.

[B]

But these were the moments, right? At the perfect. This is. This is where I was like, oh, now I get why people love this book so much. Right? Like, because these mo. The.

[A]

I mean, it's a great moment.

[B]

It is a great moment. And listen, great romances are made out of great moments, right? And I think that's the other part about this. I was taking notes because I was like, what Do I want to remember to say about this book? And you know, we say all the time, like. Like, heroes have to be kings. These two men are kings. But we are rooting for them. Like, they are underdogs, right? Because we know that, like, yeah, you can be a king in this world, but how are you going to, like, how are you going to find your way to each other? How are you going to, like, how are you going to find your way to this romance, to being in love with each other? Because there's so many things stacked against you and not just the things like, in your own heads. Right? And I think the other thing that I think this book does incredibly well, like, again, showing that transition from beginning to end, right. Is the beginning. All those scenes are. It is them in a phone booth, but it's also, like the isolation of them being closeted, right? Of how afraid they both are of being discovered, of being found, of being heard. What will happen and as time goes on. And so, like, you know, one of the things I was. And I'm sure you were on watch for this too, is I was like, what are gonna be the scene? As soon as I started reading, I was like, okay, so what are going to be the things I'm gonna watch for as, like, showing them, like, breaking down these walls and the big one. And I know you. I know you know this is the first time they call each other not by their last name.

[A]

Oh, of course. I highlighted it.

[B]

Shane.

[A]

You did?

[B]

When he said Shane, I was like, that's over.

[A]

Listen, this is a micro. This is a God. Tier. Microtrope.

[B]

Yes. And this. This book does it so well.

[A]

We've all used it. It happens a lot in historicals, right? Where, like, instead of referring to the Duke as the Duke, you refer to him by his first name. Or like, my favorite, when they're insects and he's like, call me first name. Right? Oh, yeah. I mean, perfect. And Shane clocks it and is like. And it's during sex.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

And it's interesting because I went back and I reread that sex scene because I was like, okay, well, then if this is the scene where it happens, what happened in this sex scene to make it this? Right. And I think. And the structure of the sex scene changes. She pacing of it slows down. She's thinking there are more feelings, like, more emotional feelings in that sex scene than there are physical, which is where the first. I mean, like, she is really doing the job here. And what's interesting about this is it happens and then immediately Everything. It sort of goes into chaos. Then he starts to have. Then Shane meets the actress.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Oh, I want to talk about her.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then. And then this is all. This all, like, sort of predates the way that all of the, like, barriers start to be, like, immediately. The first name is terrifying for both of them. As elate as they are elated, and then they are terrified, and then they both go back to building walls. And Shane goes so far as to, like, fucking date a movie star.

[B]

Yes. Right, well. And I was really fascinated by that because I. So her name's Rose. Right. And that whole part of the book was really interesting to me, I think, for what it says about Shane. Obviously. I. I think in a lot of ways, she. Rose did not feel like a real character to me. She was just like a paper doll of, you know, a perfectly. A perfect, beautiful, wonderful woman who, like, understood him. Great. But there are two things in particular. Like, I didn't actually really love that part of it, but there are two things in particular that I thought were really great, which is one, when Shane first meets her, he explicitly thinks that she is. She is a movie star in a different, bigger, better way than him. And I think he loves that. I think he loves being. Not being Shane Hollander because he is with Rose.

[A]

Right.

[B]

So he, I think, finds a kind of, like, again, like, safety or security or whatever with someone whose stardom is, like, bigger or more expansive. He's like, yeah, people know hockey, they know me, but everyone knows her. I found that part really interesting. And I think the other part is that he genuinely, at this part, he really did like her as a person, and he'd never allowed himself to feel that way about women before. He'd never had that connection with women before. Right. Like, because he was. I think he was like, do they only like me because I'm Shane Hollander?

[A]

Well, and also, I mean, he's very clear. And ultimately, at the very end, his parents are pretty clear that, like, he's always been gay.

[B]

Right. Like, his parents were like, we kind of maybe thought. Yeah. Like.

[A]

And then he basically says by the end, he's like, I've had sex with a few women. But, like, it's never been.

[B]

It's never been. Right, great. Yeah. Right.

[A]

And so I think you're absolutely right. But I think the running two rows is in direct response to Holy. Like, this is becoming very real. Because. Because Shane is the one. Until Ilia speaks Russian. Right. Short of. Obviously, romance readers know that the moment Ilia used the term Shane, he was in, yeah, of course we all knew that's happening. But if you're just like a normal reader.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Until Ilya speaks Russian, this romance is dominated by Shane's feelings. You know, like, at any point Shane could, Ilya could walk away and we'd be like, well, that guy was an asshole. Like, but Shane, like, this is Shane, like, reckoning with his fear. For me, this book starts to really sing at that point. Like when Ilya goes to Russia. This week's episode of Fated Mace is sponsored by Measured and Slow Studio.

[B]

Everyone. Measured and Slow is a studio that is hosted by one of Romancelandia's good citizens, Alyssa Long. If you are on social media at all, she is just like someone who I have followed for a really long time. And she is a expert craftsman with all kinds of fabric arts, right? Crocheting, quilting, sewing, hand dying, if you know, spinning, you name it, she knows how to do it. And she has a really cool site, Measured in Slow Studio, where she has all sorts of fun things that you can shop for for yourself, for a friend or maybe upcoming Mother's Day or Father's Day type of presents, right? So there are lots of really cool things, stickers that she designs and 3D printed things, and a lot of really fun bookish items. So in particular, I have my eye on a stack of little book earrings. There are these really adorable little chases like that have a. At the end, anything that you, if you love dragons, there are like really cute, like page holders that have a dragon shape, statues, bookmarks, you name it. So if you are just like looking for something really fun and cool that just is like the perfect romance Landia ethos, then check out Measured and Slow Studio.

[A]

So as Jen said, with the holidays coming up and gift giving sort of always being difficult for those older people in our lives, if you know somebody who might, might be charmed by one of these adorable things, Then head to MeasuredAndSlow Studio and check things out. Alyssa tells us that Anything ordered by May 5 will arrive before Mother's Day in the United States, and that is good news for everyone. Thanks so much to Measured and Slow for sponsoring this week's episode. And again, that's MeasuredAndSlow Studio. Listen, it's a fine romance novel that I, I really enjoyed up until then. But at that moment, when Ilya leaves the country, goes to Russia, and has to deal with the Russian of it all, that's when it really starts to, like, come online for me as like, oh, now I get why people talk about this book like it's yeah. You know. Right. Can. It can.

[B]

Right.

[A]

I want to talk about the fact that from in that moment while Ilya is in Russia, he says, I don't want to come back here.

[B]

I don't want to come back here. Here.

[A]

And he's like, I want to be American or Canadian, but I'm in America, so. And then he's like, well, there's this woman, Svetlana, and what if we got married?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And Shane is like, what? And he's like, no, I don't mean you and I get married. I mean, what if I marry slip Svetlana and you find a nice girl, you want to have kids. Like, there's another guy on the team who's having children. Like. And so he's like, you know, we could have. We could have this relationship. Like, we could get married. It could be business. He even says, like, svetlan is not stupid. Like, she knows the score. She knows it would just be business. And suddenly there's, like, deep threat of, like, what if? Like, is this. Is this the solution? And it starts to really feel like this can't. Can't go on this way.

[B]

Like, what? Right?

[A]

Whatever the game is that they are playing cannot continue because there is no logical out.

[B]

Right. Well. And I think this is why. And when the Scott Hunter of it all happens, well, it's right after that, right? Like, Right.

[A]

It feels. And it almost feels like Rachel Reed was like, oh, yeah, Like. Like she had gotten herself so far along the road that she had, like, built the wall too high. Right. So something massive needs to happen in order to pull back down again.

[B]

And before that happens, I will say it is important to note. And I had a lot of respect for Shane saying, don't marry her. Don't do it. And even though he doesn't have an answer at that moment, he does say, don't do it. Yeah.

[A]

He doesn't say, don't marry her until after.

[B]

Until later. But he does say, like, come to the cottage. And I think what he's saying is like. And this is like, the thing about this book that I think it's really perfect in the ways that they say things to each other without saying things to each other. Right. Which is, I think, how so many relationships are. But it's like the weight of all of the ways they had to keep who they were secret means that even when they're talking to each other, it feels secretive. And I think even, like, their texts, right? Like, they don't even have. I was really fascinated how they give each Other, like, names. Right. For texts. Right. Like, so Ilya is. It's like Jane instead of Shane. And then I can't remember what Ilya's name is. Lily. Lily, Right. But what the thing that was really interesting is when they're texting to each other, it would say Shane and Lily. And when Ilya's texting, it would say Ilya and Jane. So it's like even that part is still, like, sort of secretive. Like, they know who they are, but they're still like, this barrier.

[A]

There's a wall.

[B]

There's a wall. There's a wall. There's a wall. Right. They can't.

[A]

It's protection. It's not just protection from the outside world. Like, who cares about them at this point?

[B]

Like.

[A]

Like, it's protection from their selves. Like, it's like, if I bear myself to this person. Also don't, like, the biggest. The really most interesting thing here. Often in other romances, often in romances in general, someone falls first.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Right. And so there is a sort of sense of, you know, she's still nervous, but he, like, heroine is still nervous, but the hero is all in. In. And he's like, whatever comes, I'm gonna, like, we'll. We'll make it together. Or vice versa. Right.

[B]

Like.

[A]

Or, you know, in queer romance, it looks like that. Where one person is just so bedrock certain that, like, it will be okay. These two don't know. They can't promise that to each other. So Ilya says, let's get married. And then after that, it starts to get like. Obviously Shane feels panicked. They both sort of feel like that's. They don't even want to look that in the eye.

[B]

Right.

[A]

So then they have these, like, really sexy, like, face. That's right. After that, they FaceTime. They like, oh, that's beautiful. Really lovely. Yeah. The sex starts to get really emotional.

[B]

Oh, yeah, right. Because they do. It's like FaceTime or Skype as, like, show 2019. And at one point he's like, I wanna see your face, not your dick. It was great. And then they're just like. Like, at one point, I think it's. Shane thinks, like, this is how it would be if we were, like, laying on pillows next to each other. Right. If we were in the same bed. And, like, they're longing for this intimacy. I mean, that was a. Like. And that's it.

[A]

Like, it's really lovely.

[B]

It really was. Like, these were beautiful scenes. So then they start, like, being, like, kind of texting friends.

[A]

And then Shane gets Hurt, which, you know, I'm like, oh, you love that.

[B]

Of course. Such garbage for that.

[A]

I'm trash for it. Listen, this is why I don't like a lot of sports romance. Because if you don't hurt these, like, why am I even here?

[B]

Right?

[A]

Right. If I'm. If I'm reading hockey romance and nobody's getting a concussion, why, If I'm reading F1 and there's no car crash, what am I even here for?

[B]

Yeah, like, you have to see. This is like. These are, like, the best athletes in the world, but that means they also can get really injured. Show me.

[A]

Exactly. It's. Jane gets thrown into the boards by Ilya's team member. Ilya.

[B]

Together.

[A]

Great work, everyone. I was like, what's gonna happen now? And interestingly, I will say to everybody that there were a couple of moments where I was like, oh, this is where everybody's gonna find out. And then Jen reminded me that that was the straight white lady in me who was saying, like, I. This is how everybody's gonna discover that.

[B]

Oh, like, Ellie's gonna rush over and be like, that's my boyfriend, goofball.

[A]

No. So, like, I. The coming out trauma, I appreciate. But anyway, so he gets, like, thrown into the boards and. And he gets a concussion, and then he goes to the hospital, and Ilya is, like, trying to figure out, like, how he can, like, simultaneously, like, go check on this man who he loves in Russian. And he loves. He loves in all languages, but in Russian especially. And then. And then he. And also, like, not reveal, you know, because still, when they're doing media.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

They're like, Ilya's like, I'm gonna get more goals than this asshole. Like, it's perfect.

[B]

Listen, I love it. This is the brilliance of having them both be at the top of their game. Because if it was just Ilia being like, it is worth it for me to throw my career away to show that I love this man. But he cannot make that decision for Shane.

[A]

No, Right. That's what's so good about it.

[B]

It is so good. This is the conflict, right?

[A]

So this is. I mean, like, when I say this book really starts to sing in the second half.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

This is where we are. Right? And then they're like, so then Shane. So Shane's out of the playoffs because he's got a concussion and broken. Who even knows? Just. He's been roughed up, which is exactly what I want. And then. But Ilya is still in the running for the Stanley Cup.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Right. So then it turns Out. Interestingly, Ilya. So again, I was like, they're gonna, like, how are they gonna navigate this? Because you don't want one of them to win the cup without the other, like on the ice, right? And so what they. What she does is she takes them out.

[B]

He takes.

[A]

She takes them out of the running, right? Like, Boston doesn't get close to the Stanley Cuppy either. They get into the playoffs, they don't get to the finals. So they're watching the finals together by like texting.

[B]

They're each watching, like texting here, right?

[A]

And Scott, you remember I told you about Scott from Game Changer, the first book in the ser. Scott Hunter, Game Changer, the first book in the series, Right? Who that team? Now listen, I haven't read this book, but here's what I'm going to predict. I'm going to tell you what I think is in this book, which is. Is I'm guessing that this book ends with the Stanley Cup Final. It's got to listen, right? We've seen this scene before from the reverse 100%, right? So they're watching. So Shane and Ilia are watching it on tv, texting. And I love this because they never speak by phone.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It's only texting. So they're texting and Scott wins the Stanley Cup. And then all of a sudden, and they're like, this guy, why'd this guy win? I can't believe it. Scott is making out with a dude.

[B]

On the ice and they're like, neither of them can believe what they're seeing.

[A]

Right? Holy.

[B]

And I love this, right? Scott Hunter was kissing a man, not like one of his teammates, on the cheek in a night. Love you, bro, kind of way. Scott Hunter was kissing a man wearing street clothes. We have full on the fucking mouth. Same looked like tongues were involved. We have. Right.

[A]

The same highlights throughout this book, Jen.

[B]

We're the same person.

[A]

Same person. So. Okay. Unreal. Okay. And then it's like they have this moment and they're both experiencing like cognitive, like McCreeve brain, right? Just like full, like static brain. Because here in front of them is proof that it's possible that they can have it.

[B]

Yeah, it's amazing. It's a great moment.

[A]

Phone rings. And what's his name?

[B]

Ilya.

[A]

No, Shane. Oh, Shane picks up.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And Ilya says, I'm coming to the cabin.

[B]

Yeah. And then it's part four, Right. So it's like. And this is what I think. You know, I like talk about structure. I like thinking about structure. I think This, I think the structure, like, separating the book into parts, like, this is really smart because I do think it is telling the reader something really explicit about and because it's like a timeline. Them, like, looking back, right? Like, almost like these are the big moments, like, the things. When things. This is when things changed, right? This is when things changed. And the hopefulness that you bring from part three to part four, right? Like, I'm coming, I'm coming. This all of a sudden, all the things we thought we couldn't have, hey, maybe we can have them. And that both of them thought it at the exact same moment, right? Like, they are literally having the exact same experience at that moment.

[A]

I. I thought it was awesome.

[B]

I loved it.

[A]

Yeah, I loved it. So then they go to the cabin and it's really like a. It's fascinating, that cabin thing. It almost feels like that's all just, like, denouement, right? Like, yeah, when. When Ilya says, I'm coming, it really is just like, okay, now they're gonna go. They're gonna figure it out in, like, Idol, right? They're gonna be, like, in love off season and, like, sleep in the same bed and, like, eat food and, like, swim, and it's gonna be great.

[B]

And they do all those things, and.

[A]

It is great, and it's great, and there's no stress and there's no tension. It's just like these two men against the world, like, in their, like, beautiful place. And then Shane's dad walks in on them, and it's just this kind of, like, lovely moment where, like, the dad is like.

[B]

And he, like, gets in the car and his dad, his parents live, like, 10 minutes away. And Shane told them, I just needed. Need some privacy for a couple of weeks because I'm recovering from my thing. So, like, leave me alone. So he's pretty sure they'll be alone. But I think the thing that about that moment is, like, he gets to his car and, like, just, like, drives away.

[A]

Well, I mean, what would you. Of course that's what you would do too. Like, oh, no, I've walked into something that I'm not supposed to see.

[B]

Like, yes.

[A]

And also, like, a decent parent thing where, like, you're not supposed to see it. And, like, you're like, you just want your kid to be happy and you want your kid to come out to you when your kid's ready to come out to you, right?

[B]

Exactly. Not when you stumbled onto them. Now, here's the part that I thought was great. Another really great moment in our mom.

[A]

Was it the mom?

[B]

Oh, yeah. But no, wait. But, like, the conversation about, like, Shane had been ready to tell his parents anyway, so he's like, I have to go, I have to go. And Ilya's like, do you want me to come with you?

[A]

Shane's like, well, it would be weird, but, yes, I think I do.

[B]

But I loved it because, like, of course, right?

[A]

For the record, my husband would never. In this case, he'd be like, this is a you thing.

[B]

Yeah. Listen, your parents walked in on us. Forget it.

[A]

Good luck to you.

[B]

But I thought it was. So anyway, and the thing that's really great is I, like, really loved his dad for this. His dad has, like, beaten him home, and mom has no idea what's going on. It's not like dad came in, like, right. Like, Dad's just like. I'm trying to process. And Shane bursts in with, like, his heated rival, and his mom's like, what is happening? Why are you here? And then all. It just all, like, bursts out, right? And I did. I. I really. Listen, I. This is the. This is the landing I want every person to have with their family when.

[A]

They come out with their family. It's perfect. It is truly happily ever after in this moment. You're like, these parents are great. Can I tell you my favorite line, though, from this whole scene is when the mom who we've been told, like, takes hockey very, very seriously was like, shane, you never let him win, did you? And Ilya's response is, I don't need anybody to let me win.

[B]

Correct. Right. Well. And then, you know, he says, mom, you let dad win at Yahtzee. And she's like, of course not. He's like, see, it's. No, it's so cute. And then the other thing is that his mom. This is. And then it's great because they say, like, right, like, we have this idea and we're going to have, you know, like, they've come up with a plan, like, part of the time. It's not just like these idyllic, lovely days of being lovers together, right? They have this. We have a plan, right? We're going to form a foundation together. It's going to be for suicide prevention after what happened to Ilya's mom, which is really sweet, right? And this is what we're going to do. And this is going to be the way that we are going to essentially, like, overcome the stories. And it's going to mean, like, Ilya, who's a free agent, is going to, like, leave his team and Go to Ottawa. They'll only be an hour away. Like, blah, blah, blah. Right. Like, they have really thought through, like, kind of, how can we make this work? And so if they tell the parents the plan, and the mom is like, you would leave Boston for Shane? And Ilya's like, yes. And we. At this moment, she frowned as if she couldn't believe anything he was saying was real. And you're like, because this is, like, really kind of a big deal to leave your one professional sports team for, like, a worst team. Right. Like, who would do that? Shane's like, no, my mom actually is upset that you don't have loyalty to your team. And I honestly was like, it's real cute, right?

[A]

Perfect.

[B]

It's really perfect. And then my favorite part is, like, right at the end of this scene, it's kind of like, right. Like an. And they're like, since you're like, how long has this been going on? On, of course, is the other conversation now. Of course, again, at this point, it's been going on for six or seven years. They are still 26 years old. Right. Wild and like, right since their rookie season. Shane heard his mother say, I can't believe it. His father's, like, looking at them now, I kind of can, because they're already, like, doing the thing. Like, that thing when we see people who are just an old married couple. Oh, I loved it.

[A]

I. It really, really is great. And then. And then there's this. So two things. One, I just wanted. There's a throwaway moment where Shane thinks, are there Russian vampires? Because Ilya bites him. And then he's like, no, vampires aren't real. And I was like, point of order. Kressley Cole's vampires are all Russian. So there is that. So that's canon. And then. No, but. And then the epilogue is this kind of, like, moment later where it reveals that the. That Shane's teammates clocked it.

[B]

Yeah, His. His one best friend. Yeah.

[A]

And. And now he is out to the team. And so there is this sort of, like, community there where they are not, like, alone on an island. They now have Shane's family and they have Shane's team. And, you know, so hopefully that is that. And then.

[B]

And then Ilia has Shane's family in some kind of way. Right. Like, that he didn't have a family of his own and that they accept and love him and how powerful that is for him, I think is really beautiful. Yeah.

[A]

And then that is the end of this book. And it sort of has this. And I felt really, like, rewarded by this. I felt like, okay, this is good. This is. This ended correctly for me. But a lot of people, I don't think did feel. I think a lot of people felt like they wanted, like, an assured public. Happily ever after. Yeah. And Rachel Reed delivers that a few years later with the Long Game, which is the sequel to this book, which I have not. Again, I have not read. But it's the two of them, and they're coming.

[B]

Yeah. Right.

[A]

To the world.

[B]

I haven't read it either. You know, one of the things on our Discord, like, this book gets a lot of love. And my friend Laurel talks. Talks about, like, sort of as a. As a person, a queer woman herself. Right. One of the things, like, missing from this book is the sense that, like, there's. Yes, they have each other, but they still are sort of isolated from, like, having a queer community that ex. That they are a part of and that any. For any person who is, like, we're the only ones. Right. That, like, community is, like, of. Of being around people like you. That there's a sense of that being. That there. There's something missing. That it's, like, better for people to, like, feel love and acceptance from people like them. Right.

[A]

That.

[B]

That we're humans and that this is, like, one of the things in particular that happens in the Long Game that, like, Shane and Ilia can have acceptance from, like, a larger queer community. I guess there's, like, a scene where they go out to dinner with other, like, couples and that, like, how powerful it is to sort of say, like, you know, one of the reasons that this book, for some people might feel like an HFN is like, yes, they have a plan, but they are still having to hide who they really are. Are. And that ultimately, like, an hea. Right. That whole idea of, like, the world being righted. Yes, they are together and they have acceptance from Shane's family, but there are so, you know, and. And Shane's friend. But there's still a way in which they aren't, like, fully realized. And that that book, Long Game, delivers that to them in a way that I think many people then have. Right. Delivers, like, the full promise of the HEA to them. Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I found. You know what I think my thing about this book is, like, if I were going to reread it, I think I'd be. I'm really curious about, like, people who love it and reread it. If they reread the whole thing or if they reread just the second half.

[A]

Interesting.

[B]

Because I think I know how I am. I love rereading, but I'm like, a scene rereader. I don't typically reread whole books, and I think, like, the. But like, those scenes where like. Like, I don't know, like, they're teasing each other or they're like. I mean, like, listen, the phone call. The phone call where Russia. Where he's like, I'm just gonna speak in Russian.

[A]

Right?

[B]

Or right. Like the scene where they are at his home and, like, really feel, like, free to be each other. The department. They're like, playing PlayStation or they can, like, sleep in the same bed. Like, I could see myself rereading those scenes because I feel like those are the things I want real romance to deliver to me. Right. There's a great scene where they are. One of the things that's also really interesting about this book is it is like a real sports book. Not just like, yeah, we didn't even.

[A]

Talk about this sports name only. And because, well, Rachel Reed is Canadian, so there's that too. Right. Like, this is not a. This is a person who knows how hockey.

[B]

Who knows hockey, how hockey really works. There's a great scene where. So the only time they could ever play together on the same team would be during, like, the All Star Games. And. But like, the first year of the All Star, they do something. They traded. They, you know, they change it up. This is like the league changing it up, right? So it's like North Americans on one side and Europeans on another, even though they would normally be on the same team because it's like, you know, the east versus the west or whatever. And so there's this great scene, a scene I really loved, where the first time they play on the same ulcer team, how much they love playing together, that they, like, can, like, just feel like they can just read each other's minds and their signals because they both, like, have been studying each other as athletes, but also know each other so well as lovers. And so it's like this great moment where Ilya's like, I could just like, pass it to him and he will be there in the right place at the right time. And I loved that. Like, I love the sense that like, or. Or, like when they're at Shane's cottage, like, Shane has his own, like, gym and his own own, like, little hockey rink or whatever, and that they have that in common in a way that the league made them feel instead was not in common. Right.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Your rivals, you don't have this in common. You're two different. You're opposite sides. And they're like, no, we have this shared love of this thing together. It was great. Yeah. Lots of hockey.

[A]

Lots of hockey. If you grew up a hockey player, a hockey fan.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

In, say, New England, this is the hockey sport for you. The hockey book for you.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I all in all had a great time.

[B]

Me too.

[A]

So thanks to everybody for telling us that we had to read it for a million years. Thanks to Adriana Herrera for saying, I've read it a million trillion times.

[B]

Yeah, I think. I think people have. I think, think there's like a real comfort, I think, to people who figure.

[A]

It out despite all odds.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Agreed. Let us know what you think about this book and this series. Let us know if we're right about the content of the first book and the last book in this series.

[B]

Yeah. We make wild predictions.

[A]

It's like a new episode where we should just like predictions what happens in the book.

[B]

I'm writing that down. That's a great idea.

[A]

Anyway, let us know and let us know if you have other favorite Rachel Reed books that we can recommend to people or we can pop into. Into maybe a collection.

[B]

Ooh, there you go.

[A]

Hockey books to read. If you loved Heated Rivalry, everyone.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

I'm Sarah McLean. I'm here with my friend Jen Prokop. We are Fated mates. You can find us every [e-mail] or wherever you listen to your podcasts. If you want to learn more about collections from other listeners and authors and other people who we love, head over to fadeamates.net and click on Collections. While you're over there, click on Show Notes and you'll see everything that we referenced today on the podcast and on normal weeks. You'll also see all the books that we reference when we make recommendations. You can also find us online. We're on Blue sky and Threads and Instagram. And if you are just looking for a place to talk more about romance novels, head over to the Patreon and join us. That'[e-mail] faded mates. When you are a member of the Patreon, you also get access to our Discord, which is full of brilliant people saying brilliant things about romance. And you get an extra episode of the podcast every month where we sometimes sing things that we would never ever say on Maine. So that's your little giving away our secrets. I know. That's the temptation to join the Discord, I guess, or the Patreon, I guess. Other than that, it's gonna be May now Sarah's singing. All right, Alan Rickson.

[B]

Have a great week, everybody.

[A]

Rickson. Bye, everyone. Sa.