Fated Mates S08.07: Romance Demons: Problématique (Italics)

Podcast: Fated Mates - Romance Books for Novel People
Hosts: Sarah MacLean & Jen Prokop
Episode Date: October 29, 2025

Episode Overview

In honor of Halloween, Sarah and Jen embrace the spooky season by diving deep into “demons” in the romance genre. They explore why demon heroes hold a particular kind of appeal (and angst), how they compare to devils and other monsters in romance, and review the shifting trends over time—from early-2010s paranormal staples to contemporary, playful (and occasionally “problematic”) demon books. The discussion is candid, funny, and at times, deeply appreciative of “problematic in italics” romance favorites. Classic series, new discoveries, as well as the hosts’ personal reading kinks, all get equal time.

Key Topics & Insights

1. Halloween Traditions and the Evolution of “Occult” Episodes

• Past Halloween Episodes ([00:14]-[02:10]):
  • 2022: “Spooky stuff”—Halloween romances and whether it's possible for romance to be scary.
  • 2023: Serious tone, focusing on mortality and the role of grief in romance.
• 2025 returns to a lighter, giggly mood ([01:44]):

  "Too serious. I mean, we... I don't think I had a giggle one time. That is not the way today is gonna go." — Sarah ([01:44])

2. Defining Demons vs Devils in Romance

• Demons vs Devils—Historical vs Paranormal ([04:26]-[06:33]):

  • Devils: More common in historical romance, confident, unashamed.
  • Demons: Typically paranormal, always a little tortured, ashamed, and “self-abnegating.” Deeper feelings.

  "The devil doesn't hate himself... The devil's like, I am great. ... Whereas demons are like, oh, I'm like a little more tortured. I think they feel it a little. Like they're a little more emotional." — Jen ([06:13])

• Recurring ‘Shame’ Trope ([05:25]-[06:13]):

  • Demons often “made wrong,” feel ostracized, not easily lovable.
  • Hosts joke about loving "a hero with shame."

  "I love it when they hate themselves!" — Sarah ([06:08])

3. The Problematic Allure: Incubi, Succubi, and Patriarchal Roots

• Incubus & Succubus Lore ([09:14]-[13:04]):
  • Biblical and mythological origins, Lilith as a “succubus.”
  • Incubi/succubi tropes rooted in patriarchal anxieties about female sexuality.
  • The problematic but compelling undertone in these stories, especially the succubus as both powerful and demonized.

  "There’s all this kind of like this idea of women taking semen and using it as life force in like a negative way. ... It feels like patriarchal in some way." — Sarah ([11:11])
  "But incubi actually do seem like fucking problems." — Sarah ([11:52])

4. Paranormal’s Heyday: Kindle Memories & Romance Shifts

• 2010s Paranormal Romances ([17:53]-[21:40]):
  • The big surge of demon-centered series: Larissa Ione’s Demonica, Richelle Mead’s Succubus Blues.
  • Kindle-era nostalgia: binge reading and book borrowing.
  • Urban Fantasy’s “PG-13” flavor vs steamy paranormal romance.
  • Memorable note: "Which books were early on-ramps to the paranormal highway? Always books where the heroine was human." ([42:08])

5. New Demon Romances: From Banter to Monster Sex

• Contemporary “Romcom Demon” Books ([26:02]-[27:39], [32:26]-[34:13]):

  • Playful takes: A Witch's Guide to Fake Dating a Demon by Sarah Hawley, I Accidentally Summoned a Demon Boyfriend by Jessica Cage.
  • Kimberly Lemming’s I Got Drunk and Yeeted a Love Potion at a Demon is cited as a recent favorite.
  • Recent Sapphic standout: Alexandria Bellefleur’s The Devil She Knows — a bantery, Faustian-bargain love story ([66:58]).

  "I want a character like a demon to not be cute. ... I want there to be stakes that feel like the end of the world." — Sarah ([27:55])

• Monsterfucking & Genre Fluidity ([26:08]-[33:49]):

  • Demons as versatile: can be anything from dangerous and tragic to sweet and sexy.
  • Monster romance expansion means “more of everything”—horns included, sometimes used as “sexual organs... you have to be able to use them to steer them!” ([07:57])

6. Recurring and Classic Demon Romances

• The Kresley Cole Catalog ([06:49]-[07:57], [44:09]-[51:28]):

  • Detailed discussion of Immortals After Dark (IAD) standouts: Malcolm (Demon from the Dark), Ruhn, Cadeon and Rydstrom.
  • Sarah's and Jen's personal favorite demon archetypes: sad, tortured, deeply feeling.
  • Notable Enemy-to-Lovers: Kiss of a Demon King.
  • Succubus heroine in MacRieve.
  • “Check your content warnings” cautioned with some of these.

  "They hate each other so fucking much. ... and they are like cruel and unusual to each other. And still many, many people claim this to be their favorite Crustley book." — Sarah ([47:23])

7. The “Problematic in Cursive” Canon

• Problematic Faves and Their Appeal ([34:13]-[38:01]):

  • Pleasure Unbound by Larissa Ione: set in a demon hospital, incubus heroes, a heroine who’s never climaxed—and plenty of dubious consent.
  • Host confession: These books are wildly horny, fun, and foundational for many readers' paranormal tastes.

  "If he takes a partner and is in love... she has to be able to come. ... Our heroine does not come. Like, has never come from a partner." — Sarah ([38:01])

• Historical Demon: Stephanie Laurens' Sinster Family ([53:43]-[59:35]):

  • A Rogue’s Proposal: Hero nicknamed Demon (real name Harold!), classic age gap, racy for its time, features lengthy sex scenes and powerful heroine initiative.
  • Laurens credited with “pioneering the 25-page sex scene” ([56:17]-[56:37]).

8. Demons as Symbols: Community, Shame, and Redemption

• Devils Are Confident, Demons Are Lonely ([75:52]-[76:18]):

  • Demons’ sense of shame stands in for outcast/otherness, and their journey is about coming to believe they can be loved.
  • Demons = “teamwork and community,” while devils are stand-alone “big bads.”
  • The messy, “feelings-full” demons make for “prime therapist bait.”

  "Devils are just like, you know, I'm the big bad... Demons are like, oh, I have all these feelings of I'm not good enough." — Jen ([76:06]-[76:22])

Notable Book Recs & Segment Timestamps

Classic Paranormal/Urban Fantasy:

• Demonica series by Larissa Ione ([34:50])
• Immortals After Dark by Kresley Cole ([46:34])
• Night Huntress series by Jeaniene Frost ([25:23])
• Succubus Blues by Richelle Mead ([20:12])

Recent/Contemporary Demon Romances:

• A Witch’s Guide to Fake Dating a Demon by Sarah Hawley ([62:01], [65:09])
• I Accidentally Summoned a Demon Boyfriend by Jessica Cage ([40:08])
• I Got Drunk and Yeeted a Love Potion at a Demon by Kimberly Lemming ([32:37])
• The Devil She Knows by Alexandria Bellefleur ([66:58])
• Demon Lover by Heather Guerre ([73:55])

Historical:

• A Rogue’s Proposal (Demon Sinster) by Stephanie Laurens ([55:09])

Sapphic:

• The Devil She Knows by Alexandria Bellefleur ([66:58])

Additional:

• Dionysus in Wisconsin: Not a demon romance, but notable for demon antagonist ([75:08])
• Our Vicious Oaths by N.E. Davenport—promo, not a demon book ([59:45])

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Demons vs Devils:

  "Demons just, like, can live in hell. Like, the devil is like the devil... Whereas demons are, like, a little more tortured." — Jen ([06:16], [06:29])

• On Demons’ Core Appeal:

  "I love it when they hate themselves!" — Sarah ([06:08]) "I want a monster to feel dangerous... I want there to be stakes that feel like the end of the world." — Sarah ([27:55])

• On “Problematic in Italics”:

  "When I say problematic, imagine it like in, like, cursive problematic." — Sarah ([34:16])

• On Old-School Eroticism:

  “Why not a 25-page sex scene?” — Sarah, recounting Stephanie Laurens’ signature style ([56:34])

• On Demon Trope Diversity:

  "Now when I think about demons, I feel like there’s just more of them out there because, like, you make your demon whatever you want... There’s not—The blueprint is not so intense as it is like with vampires." — Jen ([27:25])

• On Devils vs Demons as Love Interests:

  "You can't love me because I'm unlovable. And also, I've never felt a feeling." — Sarah (as “devil”) ([76:11]) "Demons are, 'I have every feeling!'" — Jen ([76:22])

Episode Structure & Flow

• Intro & Halloween Recap ([00:00]-[03:58])
• Devil vs Demon Analysis ([04:15]-[06:49])
• Incubus/Succubus/Myth History ([09:03]-[13:12])
• Paranormal/Urban Fantasy Boom ([17:53]-[25:23])
• Monsterfucking and Current Trends ([26:02]-[34:13])
• Book Rec: Pleasure Unbound ([34:50])
• Book Rec: I Accidentally Summoned a Demon Boyfriend ([40:08])
• Deep Dive: Kresley Cole/IAD Demons ([44:09]-[51:28])
• Historical Demon: Sinster ([53:43])
• Recent/Cozy Demon Romance: Hawley, Bellefleur, Guerre ([62:01], [66:58], [73:55])
• Final Thoughts: Demon Stories as Community & Healing ([75:52]-end)

For First-Time Listeners

This episode is a wild, affectionate tour through romance’s demon territory. Expect lively debate, joyous nostalgia, “problematic in italics” confessions, and a ton of thoughtful recommendations spanning from the foundational to the newest in demon romance. Episodes like these capture Fated Mates at its best—smart, self-aware, and always joyfully pro-romance.

For full show notes, including book lists and further resources, visit fatedmates.net.