Feminist Survival Project: Elon Musk Does Not Have Asperger's and Neither Do We
Hosts: Emily Nagoski and Amelia Nagoski
Release Date: February 5, 2025

1. Introduction to the Topic

In this compelling episode, hosts Emily and Amelia Nagoski delve into the intricate history of autism, challenging prevalent misconceptions surrounding Asperger's Syndrome and its association with public figures like Elon Musk. Sparked by a recent incident involving Musk's controversial actions, the sisters aim to unravel the complexities of autism diagnoses and their historical underpinnings.

Notable Quote:
"Today we're talking about the history of autism, specifically because of the Elon Musk Nazi salute and people being like, oh, it's because of Asperger's."
— Emily Nagoski [00:00]

2. Deconstructing Preconceptions of Asperger's

Both Emily and Amelia candidly discuss their initial misunderstandings of Asperger's Syndrome. They highlight how societal narratives have often romanticized or stigmatized individuals on the spectrum, leading to skewed perceptions.

Notable Quotes:
"Before I started learning about this stuff, I thought Asperger's was a kind of a disease that meant someone was a mad genius."
— Amelia Nagoski [01:19]

"Asperger's was somebody who was pretty rigid and highly intellectual, so they would be successful in academia."
— Emily Nagoski [01:49]

3. Historical Origins of Asperger Syndrome

Drawing from Edith Scheffer's Asperger's: The Origins of Autism in Nazi Vienna, the hosts trace the origins of Asperger Syndrome back to its namesake, Hans Asperger. They elucidate how the term "autism" was initially used to describe children exhibiting inward-focused behaviors, distinct from the later, more rigid definitions imposed by societal and political forces.

Notable Quotes:
"Most of the history stuff I'm going to talk about comes from the book Asperger's: The Origins of Autism in Nazi Vienna."
— Emily Nagoski [03:28]

"Leo Kanner was using 'autism' not to describe a single diagnosis, but to highlight a certain inward-facingness in children."
— Emily Nagoski [05:03]

4. Hans Asperger's Role During the Nazi Era

A significant portion of the discussion centers on Hans Asperger's collaboration with the Nazi regime. The hosts reveal how Asperger's work was co-opted to fit the fascist ideology, categorizing children based on their perceived utility to the Reich. This historical context underscores the problematic foundations of early autism diagnoses.

Notable Quotes:
"He was sending the children who could not be of service to the Reich to their death on purpose."
— Amelia Nagoski [19:25]

"Asperger described these autistic kids as being like aliens... Disconnected. He also described them as 'life unworthy of life.'"
— Emily Nagoski [49:40]

5. Evolution of Autism Diagnosis

The conversation transitions to the evolution of autism diagnoses, highlighting the transition from Asperger Syndrome to Autism Spectrum Disorder (ASD) in the DSM-5 and ICD-11. The hosts emphasize the importance of language and classification in shaping societal understanding and support mechanisms for autistic individuals.

Notable Quotes:
"As of 2021, in the ICD-11, Asperger syndrome was erased as its own separate diagnosis and it was included under Autism Spectrum Disorder."
— Emily Nagoski [07:55]

"The primary feature of autism was other people's experience of an autistic person."
— Emily Nagoski [25:39]

6. Implications of Historical Context

Emily and Amelia discuss the lingering effects of Asperger's historical ties to Nazi ideology, arguing that the term itself carries supremacist connotations. They advocate for discontinuing the use of "Asperger's" due to its problematic origins, urging the community to embrace more accurate and respectful terminology.

Notable Quotes:
"The definition of autism came to be when literally Nazis were like, this is a disease."
— Emily Nagoski [34:26]

"If you're the richest man on earth currently alive, then you have access to all the resources that so many autistic people don't have access to."
— Amelia Nagoski [45:58]

7. Personal Reflections and Modern Context

The hosts share personal anecdotes illustrating how historical misconceptions about autism affect individuals today. They discuss the disparities in diagnosis rates between genders and the challenges faced by those who identify as non-binary or have higher support needs. The conversation underscores the necessity for nuanced understanding and individualized support within the autistic community.

Notable Quotes:
"AMAB people are diagnosed three times more often than AFAB people. Not least because AFAB people are more likely to mask."
— Amelia Nagoski [31:08]

"We all share similar experiences. I am not different from Renee. I am not different from that 10-year-old on the plane."
— Amelia Nagoski [44:31]

8. Conclusion and Takeaways

Emily and Amelia conclude the episode by reiterating the importance of historical awareness in shaping current perceptions of autism. They advocate for respectful language, informed diagnoses, and a collective effort to dismantle ableist narratives. The sisters also tease upcoming episodes that will explore lighter topics and delve deeper into their personal experiences with autism.

Notable Quotes:
"So let's think about the context of words and meanings and diagnoses and understand that it's not okay to call someone an Aspie if they don't identify that way."
— Emily Nagoski [47:31]

"Everyone on the spectrum has like the meltdown self inside them."
— Amelia Nagoski [44:31]

Key Insights and Reflections

• Historical Misuse of Diagnoses: The episode illuminates how Asperger Syndrome was intertwined with Nazi ideologies, serving as a tool for eugenics and societal conformity.

• Evolving Language: The shift from Asperger Syndrome to Autism Spectrum Disorder reflects broader changes in understanding and advocating for neurodiversity.

• Personal Impact: The hosts’ personal stories highlight the enduring impact of historical misconceptions on present-day autistic individuals, emphasizing the importance of self-identification and community.

• Call for Respectful Dialogue: By exploring the origins and evolution of autism diagnoses, the sisters advocate for a more informed and compassionate approach to discussing and supporting autistic individuals.

Recommendations for Further Listening

For listeners seeking a deeper understanding of autism's history and its implications on modern society, Emily and Amelia recommend Edith Scheffer's Asperger's: The Origins of Autism in Nazi Vienna. Additionally, they refer to cultural representations like Pixar's "Loop" and The Rosie Project as mediums that both reflect and shape public perceptions of autism.

Final Thoughts

This episode of Feminist Survival Project serves as a crucial reminder of the importance of historical context in contemporary discussions about neurodiversity. By unraveling the dark origins of Asperger Syndrome, Emily and Amelia Nagoski empower listeners to engage in more informed and empathetic conversations surrounding autism.