Financial Advisor Success – Episode 458

Guest: Lisa Brown (President, Greenwood Gearhart)
Host: Michael Kitces
Release Date: October 7, 2025
Main Theme: Overcoming perfectionism-driven burnout in a financial advisory firm while maintaining high service standards, through a framework of “calm excellence.”

Episode Overview

This episode explores how Lisa Brown, President of $1.8B RIA Greenwood Gearhart, led her fast-growing firm through a crisis of burnout stemming from perfectionist tendencies and hyper-customized client service. Lisa details the transition from “urgent perfectionism” to “calm excellence,” balancing high standards with sustainability, and shares practical steps—like revising meeting structures and focusing on what truly matters to clients. The discussion offers actionable insight into culture, leadership, team wellbeing, and scalable service models for financial advisors.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Context: Rapid Growth and Rising Pressures

• Firm Profile: $1.8B AUM, 1,070 families in 38 states, 25 client-facing staff ([07:42])
• Growth story: 22% AUM growth per year for seven years—all but one year was organic ([07:42], [19:42])
• Structure: Three business units: Family Office ($10M+), Wealth Management ($1–10M), Advisory (<$1M) ([09:07])
• Fee Schedule: Same as in 1982: AUM-based, 1% on the first $10M, then 0.75%/0.5%/0.25% for higher tiers ([11:51])

“It's a standard asset under management fee starting at 1% and then tiering down from there... literally the same fee schedule as when the firm in 1982.”
— Lisa Brown ([13:08])

2. From Investment Focused to Planning Centric—And the Perfectionism Trap

• The pivot to financial planning (2016) drove growth but brought more work and complexity ([17:17])
• Initially, “everyone needs a financial plan, and we need to see every client annually” ([17:17])
• Plans grew more comprehensive and customized as talented staff added personalized analyses
• Over time, firm culture began to equate excellence with ever-expanding deliverables ([26:41])

“We would take a MoneyGuide Pro plan, you get the output… and a team member would deliver that and it would blow our minds... So next time, two additional analyses or spreadsheets.”
— Lisa Brown ([26:40])

• “Perfectionism” began as a point of pride but mutated into unsustainable late nights, constant 'urgent' tasks, and process overload:
  • 2AM emails ([31:20])
  • Custom processes difficult to scale or delegate ([33:59], [35:26])

3. Burnout Comes to a Head—Recognizing the Cycle

• Symptoms: exhaustion, overwork, one-off customizations that couldn't scale, morale issues ([31:17], [38:11])
• Attempts to solve via process only sometimes made things worse (“trying to code for every possible error”) ([35:26])
• Hiring more didn’t solve it; core was a need to recalibrate expectations and culture ([39:12])

“We tried to create a process for all of that... if this client had this one specialized thing, we're creating a firm-wide process to address it… but we made them so complex and down to the detail, it was never going to be repeatable.”
— Lisa Brown ([35:26])

4. Hitting Reset: Culture, Meetings, and Calm Excellence

a. Meeting Overhaul ([39:50])

• Experiment: All internal meetings canceled except two “sacred” ones ([40:23])
  • Daily huddle (Mon–Thu, whole firm, 5–15min): market update, client meetings recap, money movement ([41:03])
  • Investment committee ([45:25])
  • Temporary removal of all other recurring internal meetings ([40:23], [45:08])
  • Result: More client time, less busywork—“everything continued to work great” ([47:24])
  • Other meetings reintroduced only if needed, less frequently ([48:09])

b. Positive Reinforcement: The Kudos Program

• Public peer recognition; $100 gift cards for team members “kudoed” ([43:43])
• “On average it’s weekly… it’s a really good tool and morale booster.” ([44:32])

c. The Calm Excellence Framework

• Inspired by Lisa’s own journey as a self-identified “Enneagram One” (“perfectionist/improver”) ([52:59])
  • Transition from “urgent perfectionism” to “calm excellence” ([52:55])
• Calm excellence: “Striving to be our best with measured and paced progress while allowing ourselves to learn and grow from challenges and mistakes.” ([60:46])
• Framework visualized as three tiers:
  • Top: Urgent perfectionism (reactive, exhausting)
  • Middle: Calm excellence (sustainable, professional)
  • Bottom: Market standard/competitors (minimal effort)
• Examples:
  • Instead of chasing down unavailable staff to answer client calls instantly, explain when they’ll get a response ([55:44])
  • Replace exhaustive 80-page plans with focused, actionable summaries ([58:01])
  • Clarify internal expectations: not every request from leadership = drop everything now ([58:01])

“I've never heard a client say, that PDF you created with 80 pages in it was amazing.”
— Lisa Brown ([28:16])

5. Tools and Tactics for Sustainable Excellence

• Culture shift cemented in team meetings, a framed “calm excellence” definition, and quarterly reviews ([60:02], [60:39])
• “Relationship Evaluation Tool” ([62:10]):
  • One-page sheet rates what truly matters to the client and what will “move the needle”
  • Use for onboarding & reviews to prioritize team focus; less overkill, more “proper dosage” ([64:25], [65:22])
  • Sets explicit timeline for tackling priorities with clients

“We can do all these things, so we should deliver them all—even if they don’t need or want them... This has been a great way for us to start to exercise that discernment muscle of cleanly identifying where they need our help and where we can best serve them.”
— Lisa Brown ([62:12])

• Checkpoints: Senior leaders debrief new client/planning cases to avoid “automatic” comprehensive overload ([73:00])

6. Impact and Takeaways

a. Results

• Burnout eased (no more 2am emails; “a lot of exhaling” among staff) ([67:54])
• Staff report more thoughtful work, mutual respect with clients, less paralysis-by-analysis ([67:54])
• New frameworks “compounding calmness,” improved morale ([67:54])
• Meetings and processes are now intentionally added and removed based on value and need ([48:09])

“We went from, in our minds, being their service provider, that had to hop to and be really urgent in our responses to—no, we have a partnership, and we’re professionals operating at the top of our game, and we have a mutual respect.”
— Lisa Brown ([67:54])

b. Ongoing Challenges

• Still requires leadership vigilance; old habits can return ([70:46], [71:52])
• New strategic focus (GG 3.0): business unit design, brand, new BD staff, “simplification” across the firm ([76:31])
• Avoid “urgently perfectionist” about calm excellence itself ([75:16])

c. Personal Leadership Journey

• Lisa’s own struggles: redefining fulfillment after her promotion; letting go of “scorekeeping” via titles ([79:31])
• Key resources:
  • Book: The Gifts of Imperfection (Brené Brown); Dare to Lead, Next Right Thing (Emily P. Freeman) ([83:31])
  • Executive coach: Renee Fleming, "Reset with Renee" ([83:03])

d. Advice for Other Advisors, Especially Women

• Don’t try to be someone else: “If you like helping people, you’re going to be successful and the business will come.” ([78:20], [84:32])
• Women: Don’t be pressured to fit in; focus on people, not perfection ([86:24])

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

“I think our job in leadership is to reconcile when you don’t see the way we’re living actually aligning with the values we say we have.”
— Lisa Brown ([05:12])

“No one [quits the perfectionism race]. Until you have no time left.”
— Lisa Brown ([32:48])

“You could urgently perfectionist calm excellence and defeat the purpose.”
— Michael Kitces ([75:16])

“Success to me is all about making sure that I maintain focus on my priorities, that I’m present for my children and my husband and my family, that I’m aligned with my values and living that every day... it’s not work–life balance, because that’s impossible.”
— Lisa Brown ([87:31])

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Firm background and growth: [07:11]–[11:45]
• Transition to planning-centric model: [17:17]–[19:42]
• Burnout symptoms emerge: [31:01]–[33:59]
• Meeting overhaul: [39:50]
• Kudos program explained: [43:40]
• Definition & rollout of calm excellence: [52:42]–[60:46]
• Relationship evaluation tool/prioritization: [62:10]
• Effects and staff feedback: [67:54]
• Lisa’s personal perfectionism journey: [52:59], [79:31]
• Book and coaching resources: [83:03]–[83:31]
• Advice for new advisors/women: [84:32], [86:24]
• Personal definition of success: [87:31]

Conclusion

Lisa Brown’s story presents a powerful case study for advisor firms facing “too much of a good thing” as perfectionism-driven client service collides with the limits of team stamina and scalability. Her “calm excellence” approach—shifting from relentless perfection to thoughtful, client- and staff-focused discernment—reminds leaders that “excellent service” is about proper focus and sustainability, not endless customization or speed. Both the tactical changes (meeting resets, new tools, Kudos) and cultural shifts (definition, deliberate conversation) offer a practical roadmap for any advisory firm navigating growth, service standards, and team wellbeing.

For more on this episode and additional insights for financial advisors, visit the Nerd’s Eye View blog at www.Kitces.com.