Fat Guy Refuses To Stop Eating Out

Summary

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Financial Audit Podcast: “Fat Guy Refuses To Stop Eating Out”

Host: Caleb Hammer
Guest: [Name not provided]
Date: October 4, 2023

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Overview

This episode features an in-depth financial audit of the host, Caleb Hammer, who discusses his rapid income growth, impulsive spending, real estate investments, and personal life with guest Graham Stephan (not directly named in the transcript but obviously him based on context). The conversation humorously and candidly addresses the benefits and challenges of financial success, key lessons around real estate, cash flow, business expansion, eating habits, and even online dating struggles.

The episode’s tone is informal, funny, and self-aware, with both speakers poking fun at financial habits and personal quirks, while offering honest advice to listeners interested in personal finance and entrepreneurship.

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Episode Breakdown & Timestamps

1. Background & Motivations (00:00–04:36)

• Caleb introduces himself and shares his content goals: entertaining, educating, and helping people get out of debt through YouTube.
• Discusses Dave Ramsey’s influence and decision to avoid politics to keep financial topics accessible for all.
• Caleb’s main motivation: “Helping the people here on the show… seeing the reward of people getting on debt is actually really cool.” (01:36)

Notable Quotes:

• “I think anyone and everyone should be welcome into finances, regardless of the—I don’t want anyone to, you know, feel turned off.” (01:08, Caleb)

2. Rapid Income Growth and Career Shift (04:36–08:00)

• Caleb started YouTube after frustration as a product manager (“They didn’t really listen to anyone who focused on different areas of the business...I just started applying to a bunch of things.” 02:47).
• Unexpectedly successful; now earns low six figures per month, compared to $100K/year just two years ago.
• Acknowledges difficulty adjusting to rapid income changes and the temptation to overspend.

Notable Quotes:

• “The amount of money that is coming in on a monthly basis isn’t something that I would have dreamed about making in a yearly basis.” (01:59, Caleb)

3. Financial Freedom Goals & Stress Management (04:13–06:56)

• Caleb outlines his desire for “peace of mind” via reliable cash flow (~$16k/month, later revised to $25k–$30k/month).
• Graham warns even that may be insufficient given lifestyle and unpredictable future market events.

Memorable Moment:

• Graham: “I don’t think $16,000 a month is going to be enough.” (05:07)

4. Real Estate Deep-Dive (08:00–29:28)

a. Primary Residence Purchase (08:00–12:59)

• Caleb bought a nearly $900k home in Austin ($8k/month mortgage), admitting it was an impulsive decision.
• Graham remains critical, suggesting renting would have been wiser given newness of income.

Notable Dialogue:

• Graham: “Spending this amount of money on a house, I would have told you just to rent.” (10:14)
• Caleb: “No, you’re right... that was a choice. Love the house though.” (12:44)

b. Furniture Financing & Frugality (13:12–16:41)

• Caleb used 0% financing for furniture, explaining preference for keeping cash invested—a habit Graham finds trivial at this income level.

c. Real Estate Portfolio Analysis (16:50–29:28)

• Owns five properties in total (Austin condo, three out-of-state rentals in Michigan/Illinois, plus primary home).
• Discussion on cash flow, vacancy, and the folly of betting on hypothetical appreciation or developer buyouts.
• Regrets some impulsive, poorly calculated purchases (notably first rental, Illinois).
• Considers selling Austin condo to reinvest in midwestern real estate.

Memorable Moment:

• Graham: “We have a theme with you in real estate. Seeming a little impulsive.” (25:18)

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5. Business Expansion, Franchises, and Diversification (29:28–44:41)

• Caleb considers investing in a burger franchise (“Burger Buddha”) because he likes the business and product.
• Graham strongly advises against it: too risky, better to focus on YouTube, wait until income is more stable for such “FU money” bets.
• Discussion of pitfalls: cost overruns, high employee turnover, food service unpredictability.

Key Quotes:

• Graham: “A franchise is something you do when you have FU money... This is a huge liability... You want all these income sources, but it pales in comparison to what you’re doing with this.” (31:54, 42:10)
• Caleb: “I don’t want to take away from this though.” (28:24)

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6. Video Business Strategy: Staying Relevant (39:31–43:51)

• Graham and Caleb acknowledge the “shelf life” of YouTube formats and urge constant innovation and diversification for longevity.
• Plans for new content types, broadening the team, and investing in studio infrastructure.
• “If you do the same thing, eventually people will start to move on… Keeping this show exciting, relevant, cutting edge and entertaining.” (39:31)

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7. Daily Expenses & Impulsive Spending (43:51–54:50)

• Caleb treats staff very well (high payroll), splurges on guest experiences (Lincoln Navigator airport rides), and is self-described “bougie” for special occasions.
• Minor ongoing subscriptions (Netflix, Disney+, YouTube TV) and meal delivery kits—admitted inconsistency in using them for better health.

Memorable Moment:

• Graham (on eating habits): “I think you would really benefit from Factor, CookUnity, one of those meal delivery services. Sign up for that, you’ll pay a little bit more... you’ll know exactly what the calories are. It’ll be really fresh food.” (52:49)

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8. Health & Self-Control (“Fat Guy” Joke) (52:49–54:59)

• Candid jokes about food addiction and yo-yo dieting.
• Discussion about health as a prerequisite to enjoying and sustaining financial success.

Quote:

• Caleb: “There’s no point in making a lot of money if I’m gonna die at a heart attack at 60.” (53:42)

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9. Investments & Debt (55:01–66:17)

• Main platform is Fidelity (300k–475k invested, mostly S&P 500, some Nasdaq).
• Experiments with Robinhood, Moomoo, Acorns; acknowledges lack of investment organization.
• Student debt ($37k at 4%, deferred), prefers investing instead of paying off due to arbitrage; Graham advises paying it off for simplicity given large monthly surplus.

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10. Organization, Financial Hygiene (66:17–68:16)

• Graham critiques disorganization in credit cards and recurring expenses, urges weekend audit of accounts to cut waste.
• “It seems like a jumbled mess.” (66:40)

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11. Personal Life: Dating & Mental Health (68:16–83:17)

Online Dating Segment (68:16–79:09)

• Graham roasts Caleb’s Hinge profile and messaging style, offering tips on self-esteem, conversational tactics, and not being “the seller.”
• Caleb is self-deprecating, open to learning: “I’m notoriously a bad texter.”
• Touches on the awkwardness of dating as a minor YouTube celebrity and the potential “position of power” dilemma.

Air Travel Anxiety (47:24–50:57)

• Caleb talks about aviophobia related to not feeling in control, not fear of crashes, and how phobia limits opportunities.

Mental Health & Balancing Success

• Discuss challenges with anxiety, stress, and not internalizing newfound stability.

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12. Business Decisions & Buying Back Equity (83:28–87:37)

• Caleb sold 10% of his YouTube business for $25k in early days due to anxiety; plans to buy back at same price thanks to a favorable clause.

Quote:

• Caleb: “Sold 10% to another YouTuber… if the business is successful, I can buy it back at $25,000. So I can buy this month at $25,000 instead of whatever that share is worth.” (84:21)
• Graham: “Noticed a theme here of impulsive decisions.” (84:21)

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13. Final Evaluations & Advice (90:21–91:42)

• Caleb receives Graham’s audit scores (out of 10):
  • Spending: 8
  • Debt: 1
  • Emergency Fund: 10
  • Retirement: 9
  • House: 7
  • Dating: 0
  • Total: 35/60 (dating score “really brings it down”)
• “Don’t be stupid with your money. Play it safe. Double down on what you’re doing, be creative here and get better with your texting game.” (90:21)

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Memorable Quotes & Highlights

• “The amount of money that is coming in on a monthly basis isn't something that I would have dreamed about making in a yearly basis.” (01:59, Caleb)
• “A franchise is something you do when you have FU money, when you’ve made it and you’re like, I could afford to light this money on fire and I wouldn’t even care or notice, then you could start making burger investments.” (31:54, Graham)
• “Your finances—they’re not bad… So this is my chance to shine here. Okay?” (75:57, Graham on the Hinge roast)
• “You want to say, I’m into this person. This is who I want to be with. Not, Hey guys, so this is what my financial audit has turned into.” (83:00, Graham)
• “Sold 10% to another YouTuber… if the business is successful, I can buy it back at $25,000.” (84:21, Caleb)
• “Play it conservative, play it very safe until it’s really sunk in. You get years of that income under your belt and then could readjust.” (65:47, Graham)

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Summary Table: Key Points by Timestamp

| Segment Title | Timestamps | Key Topics | |-------------------------------|------------------|-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | Background & Motivation | 00:00–04:36 | Podcast origin, helping people, Dave Ramsey influence | | Rapid Income Growth/Career | 04:36–08:00 | Transition to YouTube, six-figure months, adjustment struggles | | Financial Freedom/Stress | 04:13–06:56 | Cash flow goals, market crash fears, stress management | | Real Estate Deep-Dive | 08:00–29:28 | Austin house, impulsive buys, Midwest rentals, Airbnb, cash flow | | Franchise & Diversification | 29:28–44:41 | Burger Buddha pitch, entrepreneurial risks, business focus | | Business Strategy | 39:31–43:51 | Keeping content fresh, show longevity, innovation | | Daily Expenses/Spending | 43:51–54:50 | Payroll, splurges, subscriptions, “bougie” moments | | Health & Food | 52:49–54:59 | Eating habits, yo-yo dieting, prioritizing health | | Investment & Debt | 55:01–66:17 | Stock portfolios, Robinhood/Moomoo, paying off loans, arbitrage | | Organization | 66:17–68:16 | Expense cleanup, disorganized accounts, subscription waste | | Dating & Mental Health | 68:16–83:17 | Hinge profile roast, personal life, online dating, position of power | | Buying Back Equity | 83:28–87:37 | Selling 10% stake in business, buyback clause, early-stage anxiety | | Final Audit/Advice | 90:21–91:42 | Audit scores, need for texting improvement, future focus, conservative spending |

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Concluding Thoughts

This is one of the most self-aware and relatable deep dives into the realities of sudden financial growth, emotional decision-making, and personal discipline. Caleb, with Graham’s candid input, explores what it means to have “too much” income, how not to sabotage it, and why boring, steady, focused systems still win. The banter, practical wisdom, and honest failures make this not just a financial audit—but also a life audit.

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Score Recap (from Graham):

| Category | Score (out of 10) | |------------------|------------------| | Spending | 8 | | Debt | 1 | | Emergency Fund | 10 | | Retirement | 9 | | House | 7 | | Dating | 0 | | Total | 35/60 |

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Listen for:

• Raw discussion on income relativity—“rounding error” expenses at high income
• How impulsive real estate can “disguise” itself as investment
• An epic roast of bad Hinge profiles (“You are the picker, not the seller!” 76:57)
• Why successful YouTubers should avoid “side hustles” until their business is mature
• Honest talk on anxiety, impostor syndrome, and balancing philanthropy with business

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[Episode ends at 92:03]

For more, find Financial Audit with Caleb Hammer on YouTube or your favorite podcast platform.

Transcript

[A]

My name is Caleb. I'm 28 years old. I'm based out of Austin, Texas. And this is financial audit.

[B]

This is crazy for me to be sitting here.

[A]

It's crazy for me.

[B]

It's nuts because I've seen so many videos and it's hard for me to be in this seat doing this on you because I would be on the other side of this, dude.

[A]

I've been watching Graham Stephan for like three years. How do you think I feel right now?

[B]

Cool. So tell us what you do for work. What would you explain your job is to someone who's asking?

[A]

I do the YouTubes and yeah, who get paid for the videos that are put on there.

[B]

But you've carved out a really unique niche, I think on YouTube no one's really done that. Dave Ramsey has, but he hasn't taken it to the podcast.

[A]

He does the mini automatic.

[B]

So what prompted you to get into auditing full on financials like this?

[A]

So I think the way that I thought about it is like the other things that I do in my creative process, like I studied music composition in college, so when I would go to write music, I'd be like, okay, here's a piece of music that I want to hear. It doesn't exist, so let me write it. Here's a show that I want to watch. Here's a conversation that I wish happened to me 10 years ago. Doesn't exist. I guess we should make it.

[B]

Are you a fan of Dave Ramsey?

[A]

Oh, yeah, yeah. No, I mean, he paved the way, right?

[B]

Sure.

[A]

You know, he definitely goes a bit political and stuff, which can turn people off, which is fine. That's why I try to avoid that here because I think anyone and everyone should be welcome into finances, regardless of the. I don't want anyone to, you know, feel turned off. Yeah, yeah. But I like them overall. Obviously it's helped like, what, millions of people.

[B]

Obviously. Yeah. And you have a great schedule as well, filming Monday, Tuesday, what was it? Thursday, Monday, Tuesday, Thursday. That's great. You really seem to have this dialed in. Tell us a little bit about your goals, like what is your objective with doing all this?

[A]

So we definitely want to help as many people as possible. That's certainly the big thing. And that's why, you know, recently we've like sent out a survey to all past guests seeing, like how they're doing and capturing like how the whole experience was. So overall primary goal, helping the people here on the show. Because, you know, regardless of any income that comes through this, just seeing the reward of people Getting on debt is actually really cool. So many people are gonna think like, oh, you know, that's not true. I mean, it's about the money. But no, actually seeing people get out of debt and change it in their life is incredible. And we get like a million emails, social media, YouTube comments. All these people who've watched the YouTube videos and they're getting out of debt, dude, that is like the most, like, it just lights a fire under you and you just wanna record more episodes and like do more things. And then of course, the financial reward that has come with it, like the amount of money that is coming in on a monthly basis isn't something that I would have dreamed about making in a yearly basis. It still blows my mind. I can't even comprehend it.

[B]

So, yeah, what were you making, let's say two years ago?

[A]

Two years ago. Hundred thousand dollars after bonuses.

[B]

And what were you doing then?

[A]

I was a product manager. About. Yeah, two years ago I would have been a product manager.

[B]

Okay, and why did you decide to leave that to then do YouTube?

[A]

I was getting just frustrated with that business itself. They didn't really listen to anyone who like focused on different areas of the business. And I'm not going to name them. Sure.

[B]

Okay, let's put it on screen. Yeah, rhymes with but.

[A]

Yeah, I was just getting a little unhappy with them. So I started looking with, looking for other product management jobs. But I also like the idea of operation side of things. So I was looking for operation jobs as well. And I just started applying to a bunch of things. And then like I got a call back from a YouTuber who I accidentally applied to because I did, you know, like, applied to like a thousand a day or whatever. He ended up not hiring me and you know, for whatever and. But then I was like, but I love creating things, like the arts world and stuff. That's why I went into music. I like creating things. This is a show I've wanted to do. So I was just like, okay, let's just start the show. And. And it just ended up taking off. Thanks to all you lovely people. It's completely thanks to them. But it just took off and then I was able to pursue it full time.

[B]

You're very good at asking people to subscribe. By the way. Notice right around now you're telling people, subscribe. You gotta hit 750,000 subscribers.

[A]

750.

[B]

So that's coming up.

[A]

And thank you to everyone who has subscribed so far. And we just hit 700 today. And it's all thanks to you.

[B]

Congratulations.

[A]

It's really good. Yeah, that's good.

[B]

Seven hundred's a good number.

[A]

Yeah, it's an exciting number.

[B]

That's fun. What are your goals, though, financially? Like, what do you want to attain?

[A]

I think so. For me personally, hitting a certain number that I feel comfortable with in monthly cash flow that I can pull, like, you know, 3% from an overall stock market portfolio or cash flowing from real estate or business. That equals what I would need to live, maybe times two.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And then I would just never have to worry about anything again because this is a very stressful job. And stress and anxiety and stuff that I have isn't always the best.

[B]

Sure.

[A]

So hitting that number would give me the flexibility of just knowing that. Okay, I could just coast until I'm dead.

[B]

Okay, what is that number? What do you want? And then we could break it down from there because we're going to be starting at the end point and then working backwards, figuring out how you could get there.

[A]

16. 16 would be good. 16,000amonth.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

16,000Amonth in cash flow.

[B]

I'm going to say something unpopular. I don't. I don't think $16,000 a month is going to be enough.

[A]

Oh, okay. Maybe not.

[B]

I'm looking through a lot of these expenses, and your mortgage, I think substantially more. I think you have to be more in the third.

[A]

No, you're right. No, actually, you're right, because I just.

[B]

And then if you want to double that, I think you have to be probably around half a million dollars a year. That's where I think. That's where I think you have to end up.

[A]

Yeah. So quick math. In my head, all I did was double my mortgage. But then that means that. No, but that means.

[B]

No, you can't do that.

[A]

That's terrible, because that means mortgage is 50% of that would be aggressively terrible. So I don't know, $25,000 a month. But again, even 25,000 hours a month, I feel like that's just like I'd still have money that I wouldn't even know what to do with.

[B]

It's like peace of mind.

[A]

It's peace of mind.

[B]

That's what you really want, is even if the market crashes 50%, you want to be okay. I'm the exact same way. I assume all my investments are going down 50%. And then I assume other investments, they're worth nothing. I don't even count them. So all of these things in my mind, I'm like a black swan. Event is going to happen. Everything is going to go to zero. And I work based off that. So I'm like kind of the same way when it comes to that. So let's first talk about your income. What would you say it averages out to be every month?

[A]

Yeah, that's a good question. So it definitely varies month by month. But since, well, thanks to you all amazing people out there who are incredibly supportive, I think recently it's more like low six figures on a monthly basis comes into the business before payroll and before for all other expenses like giving a flat rate to people who are traveling and some other expenses that the business is required. And of course, both of my employees make over six figures on a yearly basis. But that's what comes in before all those expenses.

[B]

Congratulations.

[A]

Thank you.

[B]

It's ridiculous posting hour long videos three times a week. The consistency that I see on your channel is admirable, man.

[A]

I appreciate it.

[B]

I did that for six years. Three times a week. It is grueling, it's grinding to keep that sort of schedule and have a backlog just in case you miss something to have something else you could post. Congratulations. How new is that though?

[A]

It's very new. I mean, when we. When I did an audit on Jack, I was making maybe 15, 20,000. Was that like six months ago?

[B]

Yeah. So it scaled up incredibly quickly.

[A]

Yeah, no, I've been very blessed.

[B]

Congratulations. So that's why I think it's somewhat difficult to navigate making such a high income because all of the other expenses that you normally worry about don't make a difference. Like a lot of the money that I've seen you spend are just rounding errors. So it's hard for me to go through and be like, you spent too much money at Jimmy John's. Because in the big picture it really doesn't matter that much relative to how much you're making. But in doing so, there's a lot of stuff that tends to fall through the cracks that you just don't care about that could easily be cleaned up. Yeah, the one thing that really stood out to me. I guess we'll get into the juicy part. Now. I see a mortgage.

[A]

Yeah, I got one of those sick mortgages.

[B]

$8,000 a month is what I put towards it.

[A]

I think minimum is like 7200.

[B]

And what about property taxes though? Because that's another good chunk.

[A]

Oh yeah, well, that's all included. So that's mortgage, property taxes, insurance.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Yeah. But no, a massive portion of that is getting by property taxes. Then of the property taxes, like 30, 40% of it gets recaptured by the State and given to other portions of the state anyway, so it's not even supporting Austin.

[B]

So why did you decide to buy? Because it seemed like you went from, like. Because it seems as though, like 8 months ago you wouldn't have qualified for the loan, and now you're able to qualify. So within eight months, you decide, okay, I'm making a decent chunk of money. Let's go and put it towards a house at a six and a half percent interest rate.

[A]

Yeah. Which is brutal. This was, I think when it comes financially, I don't do a lot of impulsive choices. This is one of the more impulsive choices. But of course, it just also happens to be basically $900,000. That's a big thing to be impulsive about. Yeah. So like me, but I needed more space. So Austin neighborhoods, starting from downtown, kind of the radius is around it, the first inner loop of highways. Maybe throw a map on screen. I don't know. A lot of those neighborhoods, you know, the houses have been bought, torn down, built up new. Now they're starting to do the outer ring. I bought just slightly in the outer ring where one of the first places in this neighborhood that is doing that. So I really think if it follows the trend, there's more of a bet, which is not a great way to go off things. But if it follows the trend of the rest of Austin, I think this neighborhood in the coming years, you know, there's houses for sale, tear down, build nice new house, and then again, one zip code over. This is a $2.5 million house versus 900,000 here. So I think it has potential.

[B]

The issue that I see is that you're spending more money owning the home than you could just pay renting it, and you're tying up 20% of your down payment. I just don't see the upside. You having just recently come into a whole lot of money through this channel, not knowing the trajectory, it's probably going to go really well for you, most likely. But in that small chance YouTube algorithm changes, something changes. You have no control over those sort of things. Probably you're safe. But spending this amount of money on a house, I would have told you just to rent.

[A]

I know, you told me to rent. You would be talked about.

[B]

You can probably rent a home similar to this, I'm guessing for under $7,000 a month.

[A]

I couldn't find it. But I also wasn't being patient. I bet if I waited, I could have found something like it.

[B]

Probably I wasn't patient, but you weren't patient. At the expense of the next 30 years of having payments. Really high payments overall.

[A]

Mm. Yeah.

[B]

And the house, I also have to say, is, is. It's a newer, it's not a newer neighborhood, but this is like the only new house. As we were driving up, I'm like.

[A]

Oh, that's gotta be again, that's the inter. That's the loop thing I was talking about. So that was more of a play. I just. We'll see if it works out.

[B]

The ideal play, in my opinion, would have been to buy a fixer. Buy something that like needs a good chunk of work to it, please. And then you buy it for way less. Maybe like, what. What's the average price?

[A]

Three times. I'm so. I hate that process. I hate that process because it's so annoying. This is the first time I've been able to turnkey ever. Yeah. And it's been so nice. Instead of endless construction going on and.

[B]

Just bull, bull every day that's costing you $280 a day just for you to be able to say that. And the newness is going to wear off. Give it about six to eight months. You're going to be itching. You're going to think, I need some more space. The driveway is a little too steep. Can't fit my Ferrari up there. It's going to scrape.

[A]

I have a 2019 Jeep Cherokee and I have no plan of upgrading. To be very clear, when you get.

[B]

An exotic SP sports car convertible, you're not going to be able to pull it up the right scrape on the splitter. I'm just saying it's a very impulsive choice. I would have preferred to have seen you save some money, maybe with renting nearby house for less.

[A]

Yeah, my equity position in this house is like 20% of my net worth. That's way too, that's way too much tied into a primary residence for a net worth.

[B]

The thing is, your income is skewing. Your income is skewing everything. So it's, it's, it's haywire. You can't really look at that the same way because you're making so much. And you could hypothetically. Oh, you know, I could pay off the home if I wanted to in a few years. If things continue with this.

[A]

I could pay it off now.

[B]

Well, I mean, but that would rely on you selling other things.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

No, that and then paying tax on those things. So. I don't quite know about that.

[A]

No, you're right.

[B]

After taxes you'd still be a little screwy on that. But just with all the expenses on that, that's something that really stood out to me as something that just. You got to cool it on the impulsive bit.

[A]

That's like the only thing financially I've been impulsive on for what it's worth, other than like, okay, I'm gonna go get a little nom right now. Get those calories that fits in the budget. But you're right. No, that was a choice. Love the house, though.

[B]

It's a great house.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah, I like that.

[A]

I'm not unhappy with that.

[B]

I like the house. I don't like the price.

[A]

I know.

[B]

That's it. We also have to talk about.

[A]

Oh, actually, well, before you leave, from the house listed for 1.4, I got it down to 914, though.

[B]

Yeah. But it was never worth it to begin with.

[A]

It was not. It was not. But, yeah, I know people put their.

[B]

Homes listed all the time at ridiculous prices. Some of them, what they'll do is they'll start at high and then reduce it so that you think, wow, they just reduced the price. This must be such a good deal. Now they just dropped it 15%. It's never worth that to begin with.

[A]

I know.

[B]

And then sometimes they underprice it and get multiple offers, so it gets bid up. It just depends on their. How motivated they are to sell. So on the topic of the house, I actually noticed you have an Ashley Furniture loan. So you finance the furniture.

[A]

Zero percent, baby.

[B]

For what, one year? How long is this?

[A]

I think it's six months. Zero percent. So the logic behind this.

[B]

Please.

[A]

We'll see.

[B]

Humor me.

[A]

I. I personally like 0% financing or very low finances and financing and then investing the rest. And that's just what I wanted to do with this was like 15,000 bucks total.

[B]

Sure.

[A]

I just didn't. I wanted to invest at all.

[B]

I can't fault. I can't fault the logic, but it seems like at your income, it's. It would be the equivalent of you kind of going out of your way to like pick up pennies off the ground. It's like you going downtown be like, I'm going to pick up all the quarters that like. Because when you think of how much you're left over, I see you have like a Sofi savings account with four and a half percent interest.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

After tax, what is that going to look like? Maybe 1.8%. And then we got to think, what's 1.8% of $15,000? What is that? That's going to be basically rounded up to 2%. And then we got to think, well, only six months worth of that. So yeah, it's not bad. But I just think in the big picture, is stuff like this even worth your time? And that's really what it's going to come down to. I think it's good to keep those habits of like being frugal, making the smart choices. But something like this, I just, I wouldn't even think about it.

[A]

I just like I'm in, I'm finessing. But you're right. No, I mean, to be completely honest, I don't think I've mentally adjusted to the income.

[B]

I could tell because some of the spending seems way out of control and then some of the things like this, this seems like something you would do. If you have an emergency fund that's making some cash on the sidelines, that few hundred extra dollars over six months is gonna be a big deal. That's really gonna help out. That could be a week's worth of groceries. But for you, when you calculate how much that's, that's worth relative to everything else, it just doesn't seem like this is worth the mental headspace of having an Ashley Furniture loan to furnish your almost million dollar home. So you could get free interest for six months. And I'm the one who's really encouraging it. I know I'm the one who would say do it. But I think in your situation, if you could get better clarity on anything else by not having an extra loan under your name, I probably that's true. Go without it. Honestly.

[A]

It is set up just for sake of your conscience. It is set up that you know it's going to be the minimum payments that I put towards it. You know, it automatically pays off. I don't have to think about it. No interest will be charged.

[B]

But I was hoping they'd give you a discount. Like, hey, open up our credit card. We're going to give you 20% off the entire thing. Usually that's what I see that they, they do. Like when you shop at Macy's. Oh, would you like to open up a Macy's credit card? You'll get 20% off your first order.

[A]

Got 50% off. My friend's mom working there.

[B]

Wait, wait, what? Your friend's mom?

[A]

My friend's mom is the store manager there. So I got 50% off. I didn't like bang my friend's mom or anything. No.

[B]

So I got 50 on my friend's mom though.

[A]

Your poor friend, she's a very lovely person.

[B]

So while we're on the topic of real estate, though I do notice you own quite a lot of real estate. Congratulations.

[A]

Thank you.

[B]

One, two, three. Five properties in total.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

So walk us through this. Besides this place that you bought with 20% down, you have a condo that you bought at a good time, mid-2021. So values have gone up a bit since then. And you have what seems like a decent chunk of equity, about 100 something thousand dollars of equity in this. You're going to hate this, huh?

[A]

At that great rate, I still. I want to sell it right now.

[B]

3.13. I wouldn't be opposed to you selling.

[A]

Really?

[B]

Because here's what I think when I. When I see this value in your payment, your monthly payments, $2,400 a month.

[A]

Plus the condo association.

[B]

Okay. What. Could you rent this place out?

[A]

Only 2500, so. Yeah, exactly.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Thank you.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Everyone else has been saying, no, thank you.

[B]

Well, that's what I would do.

[A]

Everyone's like, the land's going to get bought by some because they changed the zoning. So it can go higher. It's an old building, and there's an empty lot next door. So they. Someone thinks someone's going to come in and build a new complex.

[B]

It's possible.

[A]

It is.

[B]

But negotiating. How many. How many units in this building?

[A]

30. It's really small.

[B]

Negotiating buyouts is going to take a long time. It's very complicated. And for a developer, even though you can build higher doesn't mean it's. It's.

[A]

And the people on the board anyway.

[B]

So to build higher. So I'm saying for a developer, when they see a building like that, usually they want a building empty. They want something easy that they just tear down, start building soon. Negotiating buyouts, like 28 people could be on board, and then you have the two that aren't, and then what do you do for those two people? You have to overpay if you want to get them out. And someone can still hold out. So I would say in this case, unless you're really betting on Austin continuing to go up in value, it doesn't make sense as a rental. If you did rent it out at 25, you're going to be gaining minimal equity, paying down the mortgage every month. It's going to be a hassle. This is one of the few places I would sell. The other benefit is that you've lived here for two of the last five years, so you'd be exempt from paying any capital gains taxes. So for me, this would be a no brainer. Sell it as soon as possible. And the market seems pretty strong right now, so I would take that cash. Do anything else with it. I don't think it makes sense as a rental.

[A]

I want to put it into another property, but up in Michigan because my Michigan properties cash flow very well.

[B]

I see this. You bought one at $120,000. How do you find 120,000? Where?

[A]

Midwest. Midwest. This is a college town, Kalamazoo.

[B]

Really?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And you just hire a property manager on it.

[A]

Yep. So I worked with someone that I rented from when I lived there. Yeah. Their group, they rented to me and they're fantastic. They're my broker and they're my property management company.

[B]

So this seems like a pretty good cash on cash return. So your monthly payment's about $900. Monthly rent is 1250. And that monthly payment is that including like property manager, everything all out.

[A]

Property manager will take $10,000. 10%. But that is before the income that comes in.

[B]

What do you mean? 10% before the income that comes in.

[A]

So the income that you see coming in there is what I receive personally. So that's after their 10.

[B]

Got it. So this is net. That's a pretty decent cash on cash return. My only criticism is whether or not this is worth your time at this point, because right now you got a cash cow and that would be your business.

[A]

Yeah. And so I don't think about this. I've never thought about it since I purchased it.

[B]

That's good.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But you will at some point. At some point. Have you had a vacancy through here.

[A]

One of those is going through an eviction.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Right now.

[B]

And you are thinking about that to some degree. You.

[A]

To some degree.

[B]

If you're financing furniture, you're thinking about an eviction because you're thinking about. Every day someone's in there, they're not paying rent. That eviction is costing you way more than your.

[A]

Maybe I should be thinking about it more than I do. I think I've thought about it once this month.

[B]

It's good. You're very fortunate. I had an eviction. This must have been about 10 years ago. And it was consuming my life.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Every day I was thinking about it and just like. And. And I was receiving threatening messages from the tenant at the time.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So that was bad.

[A]

I know that.

[B]

So try to avoid that. Your next rental is also fantastic. Well, you bought it a little high. See if values have gone down.

[A]

But yes, that one was weird because it was actually val. It was appraised much higher. But the value has. I mean, all I did was go off his estimates on this.

[B]

Estimates not accurate at all.

[A]

So I wanted to create rough numbers for you because I, I don't have access to the MLS and I'm not messing with numbers up there anyway. I just trust my broker when I go to purchase properties. So according to that, it went down. But that one, is that the one I bought in cash?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

So that's the one that's currently going through an eviction. I've given them months, Months. They have not paid once. And every time we've gone in to do a repair, they like, threaten the people. So, like, I'm very morally torn on the eviction thing because, like, you, this. This person lives here? Yes, I own the property, but the person lives here. Like, where are they going to go? They haven't paid once and that's okay. I'm willing to work with them as they're like, trying to find a new job or whatever their situation is, or if they have a medical thing going on, that's fine. But with the threats going on that they've done towards our maintenance people and stuff like that, it's just a situation where they've clearly not put any effort forward of trying to get jobs. They've hired lawyers instead of trying to pay rent before we even started the eviction process.

[B]

Are you, are these professional tenants? Do you know what that is? There's a thing called professional tenants where what they do is they know the basics of the law and they can move in with a security deposit and get sometimes upwards of one to three years of free rent, depending on what they do. And I've seen tenants also file for bankruptcy and you can't do anything when they're in bankruptcy. Drag out the bankruptcy. They could cancel the bankruptcy in the future, but they'll be able to get one to two years of free rent. And then by the time you're actually able to get them out, you've spent so much time and money that they then go and do it to somebody else. They have another place lined up and that's just what they do.

[A]

She came with the house.

[B]

Oh, she did.

[A]

She was the previous tenant.

[B]

Never take a tenancy.

[A]

Well, the thing is the, the listing price and the appraisal price at the. Of what it was appraised for doing a cash offer. I got it for $40,000 less than it was appraised, which was really good. And I don't know. I don't know what it appraised for today because we can't trust the Zillow, so I was getting a good deal on it. And still the projected rent, once we get someone in there from our. From my broker who every time she's rejected rent, she's got it, gotten it more. She undercuts it. Like it. Cash flows at like 1.2% a month of the value.

[B]

Who did the appraisal? Did you, did you do it?

[A]

No, no. An appraisal, you know, like a professional appraiser.

[B]

And that was part of your contingency, so you hired the. Okay.

[A]

Oh, yeah.

[B]

And why couldn't it be delivered vacant?

[A]

I don't know. I don't remember. I want to thank Today's episode sponsor, SoFi. They've got some incredible tools to help you take control of your personal finances. If you haven't heard of SoFi yet, they are an all in one finance app that simplifies your financial life. You can bank, borrow, and invest all from one place. Sofi makes managing your finances a breeze. Whether you're keeping tabs on your cash, investments, monthly savings, spending categories, or even upcoming expenses. It's all displayed on one mobile dashboard. You can even add your property. So you're checking the value of your home over time and tracking your net worth over time. And their credit score monitoring will not hurt your credit score. You'll earn cash reward points every time your credit score goes up and there's no added cost. New users get up to $10 in reward points just for signing up and activating credit score monitoring. And SoFi wants you to get your money right. So they're actually giving one of you in the audience right now $2,500. All you have to do to enter is to sign up for the free credit score monitoring with SoFi by scanning this QR code on screen or by checking it out in the link in the description below. Thanks again to SoFi for sponsoring this episode.

[B]

It's a. It's a lesson just always, you pick your own tenants. You're in control of that. And then in Illinois, rental first one. Yeah, this is the first one. Monthly rent, $950 on a. Looks like a six hundred and something dollar payment.

[A]

Yeah, it's not the best.

[B]

So it's a. It's okay.

[A]

It was my first one. I rushed into it.

[B]

But you're saying you want to buy another rental right now?

[A]

Yes, because, I mean, I've learned a lot throughout the process. I have the math down. I have the area down in the relationship, my relationship with them. That's a different broker. And Stuff, they're okay. The area is not as good that I just rushed into because I had money. I was like, I. I've been wanting to rental property forever. I'm just gonna buy a rental property.

[B]

That sounds impulsive, too.

[A]

Yes, it was. And I don't do that for rental property themes.

[B]

But we have a theme with you in real estate. Seeming a little impulsive.

[A]

Very excited to real estate buying hgtv, kid. Yeah.

[B]

Why do you think that is?

[A]

I don't know. I mean, maybe because I've always been interested in real estate. Just before I even knew anything about personal finances. Like, it was still a dream that I would have rental properties in the area that I grew up in. So it's hard to pinpoint at why, but I know that's something I've been interested in for a long time.

[B]

Okay, so is that what you plan to do with this Austin condo? I want to sell that and then put it in a rental property. Are you seeing good opportunities right now in today's.

[A]

With today's interest rates, there's three properties right now that's open internally for the brokerage that. There's one. They're putting it up for $280,000. I think it's worth about $230,000, but it's currently cash flowing. It's a. A triplex. That a word? Yeah, triplex. It's a Triplex. Bringing in $3,500 of rent a month. That's the one I'm interested in. You know, they're selling it for 2,800 or 280,000. I should be able to get that much lower with cash.

[B]

What's.

[A]

And it's.

[B]

What's the area worth? I mean, is that it's high cash flow for a reason. Because it's got to be higher risk. The area's probably not appreciating college students.

[A]

College students. So it's. I buy right off of Western Michigan University. But I mean, it's just like, across the country, zoning. It's people. We've ruined ourselves with terrible zoning laws. But because of that, they build no new housing in that area.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And there's just. There's always demand. Students need places to live. So it's just like, since forever that it's been, like, the easiest place to rent.

[B]

And what's maintenance like? What about repairs?

[A]

So far, I haven't had to do anything major, but I am setting 3% aside on a monthly basis for future repairs and 3% additional 3% for future vacancies. So. But I haven't had any major repairs yet.

[B]

I've seen some college rentals and they are trashed. Have you, have you walked through a virtual okay? I've seen like holes in the wall, things completely broken doors, like off their hinges. It's wild.

[A]

And I know I couldn't do that.

[B]

Never touch that.

[A]

I know I couldn't deal with that myself. That's why I have this brokerage and someone who's been doing it in the area for 20 years with a good track record.

[B]

So while we're on the topic of investments, you mentioned something about burger and you brought a whole bunch of food for us here.

[A]

Taste and running.

[B]

20 bags of food and you're telling me you want to invest, you want to buy a burger?

[A]

Oh yeah, I think as far as. So cash flow opportunities again to get to that goal. I'm looking for cash flow, which sometimes.

[B]

It'S so stupid because you have the cash flow right in front of you. You have a pot of gold that's right here and you're thinking, yes.

[A]

Oh well, yes.

[B]

But you're, but you're, you're, you're like you, you have all the money right here. You're like, oh, what's this over here? And maybe I could do this over here and buy, you know, arbitrage this interest rate over here for a few hundred dollars. It's like, it's, it's stupid for me because I see like all this opportunity right here. Well, and you're looking.

[A]

I don't want to take away from this though. Like I, I already have in place a full time operator who would run it for me completely. So like again, it wouldn't take much mental energy. I like outsourcing.

[B]

So explain what burger is for people not familiar.

[A]

You schooled me on best burger I've ever had. Okay, Personally, I know you disagree with that Jack in the audience who likes in and out for some unhumane reason. It's incredible. It's a local spot opened in a gas station a year and a half ago. It's fantastic. It's owned by a dude who's done actually really successful businesses in Toronto. And then he moved down here during the pandemic because everything was like closed up there and he just didn't want that, I guess. And he started this place. It's just like the most fresh food you can get. Everything the meat is ground on a daily basis at the store and it is so good, it's affordable for the area. That place is always popping. People are getting deliveries like Crazy. And I, you know, I, for legal reasons can't talk about their numbers, but they make money. So even like the 12% cash on cash return I get on some rental properties, like I can do better with some money I put into something I feel like.

[B]

So how much money would you invest in something like that?

[A]

Well, it's gonna depend on the location because there's gonna be build out. Right. Physical build out. So that would be the expensive place. He's not gonna. Since I'm gonna be the first franchise owner and then obviously I have the media presence, I'm not gonna have a franchise fee. And until it's well profitable, I'm not gonna be paying anything on a monthly basis back to him. So it's almost like an independent offshoot until it's successful. So the finances up front would be, you know, whatever inventory we need. And then obviously the build out of.

[B]

A location build out is expensive. So I looked into doing a franchise and I got to the point of having a franchise contract ready in my email, reviewed by attorneys and I was one signature away and I decided against it. The cost is through the roof. It's going to take way more money than you expect. Mine would be a small franchise, not even a big one. A small one similar to you, more of like a startup.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Hundreds of thousands of dollars is how much it takes for the build outs. Hundreds of thousands. And it's going to take longer than you expect. So I think you're probably looking at if it's anywhere similar to mine and the food's somewhat similar. It was like 5 to $700,000 depending on how high end you're going with this. That's how much it is. So when you're talking about basically betting your net worth on a free franchise, I know that's silly. It seems, I don't think you're at the point where you could make FU investments. A franchise is something you do when you have FU money, when you've made it and you're like, I could afford to light this money on fire and I wouldn't even care or notice, then you could start making burger investments. You're not at the point you, you have everything. You, you have a winning lottery ticket and you want to make a side bet, betting that lottery ticket that, well, maybe I could do better over here. The other issue that I see with franchises, you're stuck on that lease you're signing a long term lease on. Usually those leases are like five to seven years and then you're negotiating options beyond that. What are you going to do in the event that business is not doing well? You're 600 grand in the hole. You have a monthly payment of five, six grand a month. The business is losing money. You're dealing with employees who are quitting. High turnover rates on franchises, by the way. A lot of insurance costs go into that too. A lot of expense. You're also at the whims of whatever the food people want to charge you for the cost of the food. There's so many variables. You also have to consider the location that you want to get in one location to be really successful while the other is not.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So you're building out a brand new audience somewhere else who's not used to going into the Buddha Burger. It's not, this is not investment I would ever do.

[A]

Ever.

[B]

Unless. Unless you have so much money that you just don't care. Like this is a fun investment that you should value at zero because you don't have experience in the food industry. You're relying on other people without the experience.

[A]

Please, sir, I delivered Jimmy John's bro.

[B]

Excuse me. Excuse me. You've eaten quite a lot of. So you do have experience with the place, but managing a business like that, you don't have the experience relying on other people. And you're fronting all of them, but you're taking of all, all the risk on.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

If you were taking all the risk, don't do a franchise. You can come up with your own thing, own 100% of it. You could be.

[A]

I can't make a burger as good as them, though.

[B]

I would, I would beg to differ.

[A]

The reason I'm attached to them is because I think they have an amazing product and process.

[B]

I don't. Personally, I don't see it and I don't think you should be fronting that amount of money.

[A]

That's.

[B]

That's a lot of money. You're. You're taking on 100% of the risk. The owner of Burger is getting all the benefit because now your name is attached to Burger automatically gives it a lot of credibility. He could easily sell other franchises because he could say, well, if Caleb Hammer did it then, and he's the money guy, then it's a good investment because if the money guy is doing it, you should do it too.

[A]

So it's automatic for you. This is out of your, out of your.

[B]

It's not only too high risk, but you don't have the finances to support it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You're eight months in something and I think you're Getting ahead of yourself.

[A]

No, I think you're right.

[B]

It's like what I kind of did when I started making more money on YouTube. I thought of, and I heard someone else say this. They based their income, spending finances on like three years prior. And so I heard something like that. And I thought to myself, with three years ago me approve of this purchase. If three years ago me would say, no, it's too much money, that's stupid. I didn't do it. Not until the point where I thought, three years ago me okay, can afford it, it's reasonable. I'm not making a stupid decision. If I need, if things, you know, if I need to sell it, I could sell it, get my money back. This is, this is a huge liability. And three years ago you would never have done this investment based on, based on eight months of income, doing well on YouTube. You also have to consider what happens in that five to seven year lease if something happens to YouTube and that Burger's not doing well for whatever reason. Maybe just a bad location, Maybe just people aren't jiving with it. Realistically, it's probably just gonna be more money than you expect. It's gonna be a higher rent than you expect. Higher employee turnover. Training employees is the operator.

[A]

That's what the operator is for. Of course.

[B]

But even with a great operator, you're still gonna have a very high employee turnover. That was one of the things that I really disliked about the franchise thing. You know, I almost franchised. It was one of those frozen yogurt places. Almost did that. And that was 20, 2013 or 2014. I went between that and getting a rental property. And I like the frozen yogurt franchise because I thought, wow, I could make 25 to 30% on my money versus a rental property. That at best is going to be doing about 8 to 9%. So why wouldn't I take the 30%? I ended up taking the rental property. I'm so glad I did. Yeah, my friend did the frozen yogurt. Friend. Horrible. Now unfortunately, a lot of this was not due to him, but employee turnover. He was there every day. Because if your employees aren't there opening at 9am, they'll call you at 8. 35. Place has to open at 9 because it's a franchise. What do you do? Sorry, I can't make it. Just not feeling well today. Yeah, you could let that person go, but you still have to be there physically to open up the store. He was there like seven days a week from open to close. And sometimes he'd be There at open, have employees during the day and employees would leave early, hey, I gotta go. Something came up and he would have to go there to close the store. Holidays too. COVID ruined, ruined him and the franchise requested that he stay open during a lot of the days that Los Angeles was for the most part shut down. So he would remain open even though like only a few people would come in. And he said that it costs more to stay open than it would be just to close and pay all the rent and pay, pay all the overhead. Like it would cost him money. So like I hear all of these stories and I think for a franchise it's not worth the headache. And you're not at the point if you had, let's just say 20 million bucks, consistent income of 50,000, $70,000 a month and you say, I love this burger place. This is a hobby of mine. I could write this off to zero. I don't care. I just want to support the owner. Consider this then, like a gift to the owner. I like this guy. I like the food. Going to throw some money and see what happens. Write it off as zero. Because I see this as like a startup investment. Like if you were to invest in a startup with a 1 in 100 chance of ever making it, that's essentially what this is.

[A]

They have a proven model though. And if it's.

[B]

They have one, they have one store they don't have. There's no franchise, there's no proven model.

[A]

They have one store that's successful, has proven itself.

[B]

And if that's that, that's not a franchise though. You want a franchise, no one store has done well. That doesn't mean it's repeatable. I've also seen one off. Stores do well. They try to repeat it in another location. Doesn't do as well for whatever reason.

[A]

Metro area though.

[B]

Yeah, doesn't matter.

[A]

What would you think of one of a lower cost food truck which is very popular. Food truck courts are huge here and that would probably be half.

[B]

Why do you want to do all these things?

[A]

Okay, so the question you asked me is a big question. What if the YouTube income dries up, but it's not. Well, we don't know.

[B]

But you're focusing on all these other things. You're focusing on all these other maybes.

[A]

And what if income dries up? That's where I want.

[B]

But it's not drying up right now.

[A]

Not right now. But you would want something in place though. And that's where my idea behind a side.

[B]

Eventually. Eventually. But here's the thing if YouTube dries up, you definitely don't want to be tied to a franchise. That's a coin flip of being successful or not. You don't want to be tied down. You like, huh?

[A]

You lack the.

[B]

You. The franchise that I wanted to do was the best product that I've had in that category. The best by far. I love it and I still eat there. I still decided against it.

[A]

You've clearly been very successful in the YouTube game. You have a substantial making of piles of monies and things like that. So my philosophy always is, if people know more than you, lean on them. So I will take your advice on the franchise.

[B]

I appreciate that. I think. Here's the way I see it. You have something very good going on. I would take all of your resources, all of your mental energy, double down on the channel. Here's my fear with your channel. It's a really, really, really good concept. There will be a point and people are going to disagree with me. From what I've seen across everybody, there's going to be a point eventually where it gets a bit stale, where people are just familiar with it. They could predict it. Yes. Every story is going to be different. Yeah, but when you look at someone even. Even like a Dave Ramsey audience, every story is a bit different. But he's got his core audience there and the odd video does, you know, great views. You've built something really special. It's very unique. No one could be you. And I'm here in this chair, and I can't be anywhere close to what you're doing. I think you're gonna notice other people start to pop up with the same format, same sort of thing, and they're gonna be different personalities. They're gonna put their different spin on things.

[A]

They pay for ads under my videos.

[B]

Do they really?

[A]

Yeah, they promote their videos under my videos.

[B]

Well, good. Well, you're getting paid off that then. Oh, so there you go. So you're making a little bit off that. But I'm just saying, I think keeping this show exciting, relevant, cutting edge and entertaining for people to continue coming back with different, you know, objectives. And you were telling me about something you were doing with someone on the show outside of the office. I thought that was really cool.

[A]

I know about. It's a grocery shopping trip.

[B]

Okay. So, yeah, so I think stuff like that is fantastic. I'd also like to see you at some point, maybe going in, like, car shopping with someone who's, you know, want needs to get a new car and like, you motorcycles, you going Shopping with someone. Close shop. I don't know, you reeling back people spending. I think stuff like that could be.

[A]

Entertaining, but I want H and M with Graham.

[B]

Deal. Well, let's do it. I think stuff like that is how you keep your business going well and continuing to expand. Because if you do the same thing, and I'm guilty of it, you do the same thing, eventually people will start to move on because there's going to be more competition.

[A]

There's a lot of shows I want to do, actually. That's why I brought on the two people over there. Yeah. So that I'm able to spend more focus on the, you know, planning out some other things we want to do. So when we get the studio that we want to do, we want to have different sets for different shows we want to do because, yeah, no, the show's been successful and I think it's always going to help people. But will it always do as well as it is now? No, probably not. And I want to make sure that there's, you know, other avenues that people can consume, things that they would want to consume.

[B]

I think realistically, the show will continue to do well for a while because I think it's a great format. It's exactly what algorithms love, which is long form content that you could clip up. Stuff like that will do well on almost every platform because you could take the hour, post on YouTube and then release it everywhere else in their own algorithms and have it do well. So I think realistically, you've got years ahead of you on this. I think as long as you just be a little bit cutting edge on this, because I think the format works right now. But for how long? We don't know. Kind of like you hit a gold mine and you don't know how long that vein of gold is there for. Like, you could run out in a year, or that vein and gold could be there for 50 years. But it's like if you're mining for gold and you've got the gold, why would you say, well, yeah, the mine, right. Might run out at some point. So let me look over here. You got it right in front of you. And that's the thing that I'm seeing is that you're very like, here, here, here, here, this idea. And I think it's commendable that you want all these income sources.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But it pales.

[A]

You don't want to rely on one.

[B]

But it pales in comparison to what you're doing with this and one month of what you're doing here. Could be a year, two years of income on something else that will take your time away from. I think what's important, which is this.

[A]

I mean, obviously focusing too much on financially from YouTube though, a lot of money can be made. You know, we, we get so many sponsor requests and we turn down so many because they're just absolute. We. There's. There's so much. There's more money to be made than we can do. But I want the show to actually focus on people's situations that are more individual, unique, that help people out there. Balancing that with what we know could be a good cash grab. Like we put out that video with the model, I guess when this video is coming out a week before it, like, okay, we could replicate that every single week if we wanted to. And that would just, you know, make double the money almost. But it's like I also want to balance, you know, making it. Because there's no point of this content if it doesn't actually help people, because that is like the goal in the end. Right? So I agree. I'm a little nervous of being too money focused with the YouTube channel.

[B]

I don't think you have to be money focused. I would be more creatively focused. I'm just saying, money wise, you've got everything you need right here. This should be your focus. Everything here. Your time should be spent being in front of the camera, strategizing and being creative. You're going to get 10 times higher return doing that than you will doing a franchise, buying another rental property. There are fantastic investment opportunities out there as well, but I'm worried. I don't want to see that distracting you from what? I think this is so unique. You've got something here. And I wouldn't spread your time out anywhere else other than what's important, which is this.

[A]

All right, that makes sense. I won't do it.

[B]

Good. Do I have your word on that? I don't know. I don't. I don't think I do. I think you're going to say that. No, no, but because I, but because I was telling you rent originally, I'm like, dude, I'd rent right now. You know, values are a little sticky. Mortgages, and you didn't do it.

[A]

Well, here's my thing. Yeah, I'm 90% sure I'm not going to do it from this conversation. I just, I'm getting access to a deep dive on their numbers in a few days and I just like, what if all of a sudden there's this.

[B]

I hope you take that 90% into consideration.

[A]

Oh, I want a very strong 90%.

[B]

Yeah, I wouldn't do it based on this. If you were five years from now and you say I could light this on fire, wouldn't even notice. If it's gone and this is a hobby, then do it. Yeah, but I don't think you're at that point yet. Based on what I've seen so far.

[A]

I'll buy another property then.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Only doing them in cash right now because of the rates and I can get good deals on them. That one I was just telling you about, that's one that I'm considering. So maybe that's the move.

[B]

It's tough for me because I see, well, you're getting good returns. But where I'm looking like a lot of Las Vegas recently, the returns that I'm seeing, unfortunately are the same returns that I could get locked in with the treasury for zero work whatsoever.

[A]

That's because you don't like doing multi state, you know, you don't like doing far away, right?

[B]

Not really, no. I like investing where I could see because when you drive by certain areas you could just see it's like that's going to go up in value. Just you see all the development around, you could see like people are moving in one direction or another. Like personally, I'm just going to say the arts district of Las Vegas. It's an area right by downtown. It kind of looks a little weird when you go in like a lot of dilapidated buildings, but you get into these pockets of just like really cool hipster looking techy people and it's like a hub now. So like I see that and I would never have noticed unless you're just there and you're familiar with what's going on. So that's why I like to invest where, where I see, that's where I live.

[A]

It is my hometown and I lived in that area for a while. So I think that's the only reason why I feel comfortable with it because I guess it would be harder if I've never been there.

[B]

Yeah. Would you say though, when it comes to your spending, you have any issues or anything that would stand out in this?

[A]

Well, let's see. Obviously I invest a lot of money, so I mean, payroll is high, but I like payroll being high. I like them making money. Both of them make over six figures. But reward good work with good monies and obviously I'm making great money, so I'm not gonna pay less for that. But payroll's high and then paying, you know, travel compensations for people that come here. And we're always continuing to update it as well.

[B]

I have to say, by the way, you had us picked up at the airport with a Lincoln Navigator. It's excessive.

[A]

It is only for you.

[B]

I think for your guests. You could wow them if they're flying in to come on the show. But not for Jack and I. Like, we would have been happy with an Uber. I thought it was too much every.

[A]

Once while, have a little bougie moment. And that was my little bougie moment for you guys because I've been a big fan for forever and Jack's been here. I love Jack. I just thought, I want you guys to get the special treatment objectively.

[B]

I saw that. And I would have rather you would save the money.

[A]

Well, plus also, you guys haven't been able to get my plane.

[B]

Yeah, true.

[A]

So I'm like, all right, you know, treat them a little.

[B]

Yeah. Well, are we going to be able to get over. Have you talked about that? We should talk about it. Do you want to talk about it?

[A]

Oh, I'll talk about anything. If you want to say that yours are mine.

[B]

We could talk about it on both.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

On the iced coffee hour. By the way, if you want to see the full interview on this. But afraid of airplanes, you don't want to go.

[A]

It's not fear of airplanes. It's a panic disorder. Not being in control. So when you're on an airplane or in an area where I just can't get to my, like, escape place, this, like, it's an overwhelming phobia that I've allowed to build over the years. And since I've allowed it to build and just gets worse and worse and worse, I just get anxious when I'm in situations I can't control. I can't land the plane if I'm having a terrible place panic attack. So it's not even like, well, I have. I thought maybe I'd have one today because I was just nervous about this whole situation. So I was nervous about being nervous, but it didn't happen. Maybe it wouldn't happen on a plane. But the phobia of me being so afraid of getting stuck in a place and having a panic attack is so extreme that I'm missing out on so many aspects of life that I could experience right now.

[B]

So it seems like you're afraid of being afraid.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

In an area where you can't escape.

[A]

And it's developed a true phobia. It's not fear. Yeah. It's not like, just fear Itself. It's like a true mental barrier that is in. Like, I cannot get over the wall. And I don't know, is it.

[B]

Is it a fear of, like, the plane crash?

[A]

No, I don't give a. Or the flights. I've been on a plane. I've gone to Paris.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

A long time ago.

[B]

So what is it about being able to escape? Because I'm terrified of the plane crashing.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like, that's my biggest fear. Which, by the way, TikTok knows for some reason. I got, like, recommended one plane crash video and started recommending them. And then I've never had a phobia of flying ever. And now I get nervous on flights because TikTok started recommending these plane crash videos.

[A]

Well, we all know the statistics around us, so, I mean, like, again, I'm not afraid of that. It's just being stuck. Like, even I prefer driving versus having someone else driving, you know, that's just what I prefer. I. I don't know. It's hard to explain, but it's just the idea of not being in control and being stuck in a situation that you can't get out of. When you have.

[B]

You should start small. You should start by you not driving, having someone else driving.

[A]

I'm fine with that now. I've gotten better with that. Yeah.

[B]

And we could take short flights. Flight to Vegas might be kind of nice.

[A]

Sure. That's like three hours. You're stuck on a thing.

[B]

Two hours, 45 minutes.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Very easy.

[A]

I was thinking of doing, like, a flight to Dallas and then I could drive back. That's short.

[B]

What's that, like 30 minutes?

[A]

Like an hour? Because it takes a while to.

[B]

Do. You meditate?

[A]

It's difficult.

[B]

That might help, maybe. I mean, I think that would help in a situation like that. I've tried it before. It really calms you down. It makes me feel like I can't.

[A]

Concentrate because of my tinnitus.

[B]

I have tinnitus.

[A]

Tinnitus. You do?

[B]

Yeah, I do.

[A]

You know, it's actually pronounced tinnitus.

[B]

No.

[A]

Yeah. Fun fact.

[B]

Oh, wow.

[A]

Yeah. Thanks. NPR now.

[B]

I've had it my entire life. My entire life.

[A]

So silent.

[B]

It's always. It's always a ringing sound, no matter what.

[A]

Do you sleep with a box fan or noise machine? You're a madman. I couldn't.

[B]

No. Now, recently, we started to. With, like, the sounds of, like, crickets at night. But I've never done that before. H. I'm so used to it. It's. It becomes white noise after a while. It's Like a little thing I don't even.

[A]

Well, it just gets louder in silence. So anytime I've done something similar to meditation, when I'm in that silent mode and all of a sudden it goes. Then all of a sudden, that's all I can think.

[B]

Why meditation would help calm that down. It's just about letting go. When you get the intrusive. I can't say when you get the intrusive. When you get the intrusive thoughts, it teaches you how to let them go. And I think being in that state, if you get those same thoughts on an airplane, you'll know how to let them go.

[A]

No, I want to. I very much want to. So this is a step that I'm going to have to take somehow.

[B]

Another step you could take is actually getting a credit card that gives you rewards besides the carrot credit card.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

There's a lot of things on the carrot credit card that I see that are getting you nothing back, and they seem very disorganized. You had sent all your, like, credit card statements to me, and the one thing I couldn't understand is which credit cards are for which. Because it seems like besides the Amazon.

[A]

One, I keep this for business only.

[B]

But there are other business credit cards that will give you points back. Like, at least if you're going to use this card, spend it on things that get you points back. Because right now you've spent $6,000 on this card and gotten 271 points back, which is what, like $3?

[A]

Yeah. I did not set up the categories correctly. Remember when I said earlier I like to finesse? Well, apparently I like to finesse selectively. So I did not. I have not taken the time to finesse business purchases.

[B]

Now he says business. Why a lot of Jimmy John's?

[A]

Well, so on long days of work, that's just usually what, like. Like, I'll get that for dinner and then I'll get back to work and stuff like that. So it's just like, stuff like that. Get it right off the shoot, then eat it back to administrator healthy. Depends what you get. But what I get. No, and mostly no.

[B]

Why not transition to some healthier foods?

[A]

I. I've done that many times. I just. I. I'm a yo yoer. I'm a yo yo, and I've yoed all the way back up, so.

[B]

But we could yo back down.

[A]

We can.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Well, but unfortunately, with my yo experience, then I'd yo up. So. Actually, recently. Recently. That's last month's statement. Recently, I have been a little better.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Mr. But of course, we all know that doesn't count. That doesn't count for people on my show either. If you're just doing a little better recently, you, you know, you're getting in recent habits. It's like, all right, but historically I've demonstrated that, no, I eat poorly. Does it take up a big percentage of the budget? Not even close. But that doesn't matter. It's health wise.

[B]

Yeah, I think you would really benefit from factor Cookunity, one of those meal delivery services. Sign up for that, you'll pay a little bit more. Actually, you know what, you're probably gonna pay about the same price per meal as you're spending eating out, but you'll know exactly what the calories are. It'll be really fresh food. I would do that.

[A]

I've done facto and they've been a sponsor twice on this channel.

[B]

Fantastic.

[A]

No, they've been really good. And then all of a sudden I'll just, I forget to like, continue it or whatever. Like, I enjoy it. Then I forget to continue. Then I get my Jim Jones and.

[B]

It'S just like, all right, I think you're at a point right now where you got everything dialed in. Now you could start focusing your time on health and I think eating better, I think going to the gym, these things, you'll perform better and you're going to make more money. Like, you have to think what the ROI is of you being in shape at like the best physical condition that you could be in. How much more money do you think you'd be able to make from that?

[A]

Plus, there's no point in making a lot of money if I'm going to die at a heart attack at 60.

[B]

Exactly. And I will say objectively, I have more energy when I go to the gym. I sleep better, I feel better, I'm more productive, and I'm able to think sharper. If I take like a few weeks off, you feel like this fatigue that kind of comes over you a little bit lazier. And if you slack on that, you tend to slack in other areas. So if you can get yourself to the gym every day, eat healthy every day, you're gonna find that other things also tend to fall in place. I would try that because you're at a point where you could easily afford it. It's not gonna cost you anything. And I think the time commitment, given that you're thinking about doing franchises, all this other stuff, you could just as easily spend 30 minutes a day either getting walking in, get a treadmill Doing some weights. Just light stuff.

[A]

It's my addiction, for sure. Yeah, it's my. If I have an addiction, it's the fat, greasy sweets. You know, any. Anything in those categories. This is. Once I get in those modes and then I just continue down it and it's just like. I just like, go, like out, like, eat a little breakfast, then I'll eat nothing all day, and then I'll just gorge in it in a single meal. It's really bad. Yeah. So I'll probably title this episode Fat Cheeses.

[B]

To Stop Eating Out Gets financially destroyed. More. More fast food than anyone should ever have.

[A]

That's true.

[B]

I'm the same way. I like to have one big meal. Like, ideally, if I could not eat the entire day and then have one, like all you could eat.

[A]

Intermediate. Intermediate, fast.

[B]

Is that what I try to skip breakfast, have a small snack for lunch, and then not eat until dinner. And then I like a big dinner. Yeah, but if you overeat in that dinner, it kind of makes everything else, you know, worthless.

[A]

So like me shoving a bunch of burgers down your throat immediately when you show up.

[B]

See, I. But it makes me feel lethargic. Like, I was really nervous about eating before doing this because I'm not gonna have as much energy.

[A]

Like maybe a double shot. So.

[B]

Yeah. But even if it affects me 5%, how better could this episode been if I were 5% better just being a little bit more perky. And that's the way I think of it. And what's that 5% worth? $100. $200. And then all of a sudden, is that meal worth $200? Probably not for waiting a little bit. So I see things in terms of dollars like that. So we got fidelity. Almost 300 grand in fidelity. I look through that, by the way. $500,000.

[A]

Wow. 475.

[B]

Congratulations.

[A]

Thank you. So this was end of last month. This is the last time I did a network checkup.

[B]

Congratulations. And they're reasonable investments. I saw, like, it wasn't anything crazy. It's just like the S and P, a good globally diversified fund. I can't fault you on that. See, I think that's a good use of cash long term over the next 30 years. I could see you doing quite well on that. And just dollar cost averaging. Regardless, just don't pay attention. Just don't look at it for 30 years, I think is good.

[A]

I do 70s and P30. NASDAQ. That's my current go.

[B]

What about international? Have you thought about doing any international?

[A]

Every Time I look at any, any funds related to it says their historic returns are just bad. Yeah, but I. I know, I know.

[B]

So whatever. What I've seen with International so far, and I've just done the basic of research, is that it's very cyclical and that the international is good for balancing out your portfolio. So that when the US is not doing so well, the International is probably buffering that a bit. So you're not going to see the high highs, but you're not going to see quite the low lows.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Yes, it's underperformed, but it's been pretty stable even though it hasn't gone up a ton. So I know it's tough to look back last, you know, 10 years and see, oh, it's only made 4%, but the S&P is up 70%.

[A]

Right.

[B]

I know that's tough, but you also have to consider the dividends are a little bit higher in that and it's been pretty stable and you never know what might happen. So I think a small allocation that. Not investment advice, but it's just something to consider. It's interesting though. It's good. You're trying out a whole bunch of different platforms here. I like Acorns a lot.

[A]

Acorns is great.

[B]

I've been using them for years now.

[A]

Link in the description below. Get your free $5 and they're good.

[B]

Mumu $5,000 in Moomoo. What do you think of them?

[A]

So Moomoo's really good. So I do a little bit of single stock type stuff and in Robinhood and I'm considering switching over to Moomoo and we're talking partnership with them right now. But again, I don't do any partnerships until I can fully test it out. And what I'm getting from them versus Robin Hood is just a more developed platform for individual stocks and I'm really liking it. There's a lot more research I need to do before fully switching over to them, But I threw 5,000 hours in there. Give it a test. All I did was buy some qqq, so. But no. Pretty cool.

[B]

And what do you think between MOOMOO and Weeble?

[A]

I've never used Weeble.

[B]

Have you really? No, they're like the OGs.

[A]

No, no. For single stocks I've just been Robinhood.

[B]

Interesting. Try Weeble.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Give that a shot just to test it out. Weeble's pretty advanced with a lot of the things that they offer, but this might be worth it. I like to try every platform I can.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And Just, just to give it a shot, see what you think of it. And then that way if someone ever asks, hey, what do you think of this platform? You've tried it out, you've used it. So student loans37313, is that deferred?

[A]

Deferred until. Well, until right now. Yeah.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Yeah. And what started again.

[B]

What's the plan on that?

[A]

Well they're at 4% so minimum monthly payments till they're paid off. I. I feel like it's a. Not a waste but yeah kind of of $37. 37, 000 to just start at it if I'm going to get average 10 point whatever with dividends reinvested in the S&P 500 on average. So it's just like the check that comes in this month. I could wipe that but I also would rather just throw it to S&P 500.

[B]

Is that tax deductible?

[A]

The interest on that depends on your income levels.

[B]

So I'm guessing for you it's not.

[A]

Honestly, when I was making $100,000 it wasn't so part of.

[B]

Listen, I know on a rental property you're going to arbitrage the difference but wouldn't this be nice just to wipe out because you're making. Would be but four and a half percent on SoFi after tax. You're taking homeless. Let's just call it three something. But then you're paying for on student loans.

[A]

The stuff in so far I'm not. It's not necessarily in there to make 4.5.

[B]

I know you're looking for an opportunity.

[A]

It's in there for taxes. I gotta pay those taxes and it's not enough.

[B]

Are you doing quarterly tax payments?

[A]

No, annual. This is the last year I can do it without a penalty or because it's my first full year. Yeah. And then next year I'm trying to. Well, you actually had a really interesting. I don't remember where I heard it but I remember you at one point saying you did annual because whatever negative penalties you get, you're well making up for via the money that you're putting it in. Not grow.

[B]

Not anymore.

[A]

Not anymore.

[B]

Not anymore. So that was a thing in the past when the market was doing as well as it was.

[A]

This year's been great though.

[B]

Yes. But also the penalty back then was not as much as it is now. So the interest rates have gone up. Oh yeah. So the amounts that you owe, I think it used to be like 2 to 3% and now I think. Don't quote Me on this, I think it's like 5 or 6%.

[A]

I thought it was around 3. Okay, well, kill me.

[B]

Well, I believe, I believe two, three years ago, I did a whole thing with my accountant and we did the determination of where the money was going, where it was invested, and it was an amount that I said, I'll pay the penalty on it. It makes sense. I'm going to invest the difference. And that was at a time too where I was sinking almost all my money into rental properties. I was fixing them up, I was renting them out. I was really active with my money. And then interest rates started going up. Did the math on it and I determined it was a big waste of money not to do the payment. So now. So I've been doing the estimated quarterly tax payments for almost two years, or about a year, year and a half, give or take. Started doing that.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

It's good and bad. It's bad seeing such a big amount coming out of the account, but it is nice. At the end of the year you do your taxes and maybe you don't owe anything. And that was actually quite freeing because in my mind I was always saving a big chunk of cash just knowing this is coming up. I got to prepare for this. It was nice doing my taxes this last year and knowing it's already paid.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like really close to what the actual amount was. So it was nice that it was out of sight, out of mind.

[A]

Okay. No, that's great. Just I did find a great CPA through a really successful business person here. So I haven't used them yet, but that is a conversation that happened very quickly.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

So the student loans, you'd pay them off?

[B]

I probably would because I think financially. Yes. You could arbitrage your money and you could make the, you know, 8% while you're paying out 4.

[A]

So you're talking about. Yeah, so it would emotionally you. So that's interesting.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I think I always try to do a situation situation. If it emotionally weighs on someone and it's a low rate, then I'm like, do it that I feel nothing with it existing. Nothing, nothing.

[B]

I'm also a hypocrite because I still have my Tesla Model 3 loan that I took out at, but it was at like 3 something percent. But I could deduct that because I just, I use that car just for driving around, you know, for business.

[A]

If I ever do get a new car, I think I want a Tesla.

[B]

Tesla's a fantastic car to buy, mostly.

[A]

Because of self driving and the text.

[B]

It's barely even functional. They're self driving is. It's it. Their self driving is atrocious.

[A]

Full self driving. I heard it was good. I've watched reviews.

[B]

I've. I've done it. I had the full self driving beta I stopped using. It's a novelty. It's a novelty to do it once. Be like, hey, look at this. Look at this it turn. I am so nervous behind the wheel of this thing driving. If you're on the highway and you're. And you're just doing the basic lane thing where it could, you know, go around other cars and whatnot, even that's terrifying because you get phantom braking where you're going on the highway going 75. It just the brakes slam on it. You have to hope no one's behind. But thanks.

[A]

So glitchy on the self driving. Then I can be doing swipes on hinge and we'll talk about that while I'm driving.

[B]

Yeah, it's probably not the best. I don't trust Elon Musk and Tesla to drive me in a car.

[A]

That's fair enough. Well, if that's not the case, then, then I will stick with my 2019 Jeep turkey until it dies.

[B]

I think that's, I think the Jeep is a fantastic car. You wouldn't qualify for the tax subsidies of the Model 3. You would be able to write off the full cost of a Tesla Model X because of how much it weighs.

[A]

But those are ridiculous expensive.

[B]

Still, they lowered the price a ton. They did? Oh yeah. They lowered them like $20,000. Even the plaid, the Model X plaid, I think used to be like 130 and now it's like 100. I mean, they lowered the, the price of these cars by a lot.

[A]

So I never try to find things at the dip and that's when I buy. But this is like the one time if I'm gonna get a Tesla. Oh my goodness. Every single month they're getting cut in price. I feel like I'm gonna buy. The next month is gonna be $10,000.

[B]

I, I would personally keep the Jeep for as long as you can.

[A]

Oh yeah, that's my plan. So I, I'm not a car person. I don't give.

[B]

But yeah, I just like this student loans. I just think how much you're bringing in every month, how small this is relative to that. And I just think for the ease of just knocking it out and being done with it, it would not make that big of a financial difference. That's how I see it. You could Arbitrage it and financially you're probably better off arbitraging it. But when we're talking about what the real difference of that is, even if it's like $1,000, two grand of arbitrage over the lifetime, is that really worth it? Maybe it is. I think it's just easy to. But, but either way, it's like you're still coming out ahead. It doesn't matter. Like a lot of these things are trivial.

[A]

Highly considered that I, and before this conversation I wouldn't have even considered it. But you know, I want to come into this as open minded as possible. So I will definitely highly consider that.

[B]

Yeah, it's difficult for me because we could go through all of your expenses and none of it would matter. I mean, you could literally take 20 grand and light it on fire and be like, that's my entertainment tonight.

[A]

That's so weird to me. I've not mentally gone there.

[B]

But you know, that's, that's why I think you should really play it conservative, play it very safe until it's really sunk in. You get years of that income under your belt and then could, then at that point you could really readjust to it and figure out how you want to deploy it. Like that three years thing, just based it off three years ago. You. How would you feel about that three years from now? Maybe you could make those, those franchise.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Payments.

[A]

All right, well that's fair.

[B]

So just something to consider.

[A]

You have $50,000 in Robinhood on the talk of investment.

[B]

What's that?

[A]

They're individual stocks.

[B]

I mean, I think it's fine. So when I'm looking through a lot of your accounts, it really does seem disorganized. Like you put some random expenses over here, you got a city double cash card that you put other expenses on. There's really nothing cohesive that I can tell on this. And it seems like a jumbled mess.

[A]

Organization is definitely one of my not best skills to develop. So I actually still have quite a few business expenses still reoccurring on a lot of those personal cards that I haven't moved over once I formed the llc. So no, you're right. It's a, it's a messy situation that literally what I need to take a weekend and just figure out, yes, I.

[B]

Think I would spend the time to do that because from what I've seen there are probably a ton of random recurring expenses in here that you just don't need. And I was guilty of this for a while. It took me years to truly Go through some of the old credit card statements and look through them and think, I'm not using this. When's the last time I use this product? Some of these were charging like $100 a month. And I'm looking at this thinking, we haven't used this in over two years. Why am I still paying for this? Well, just in case. Well, let's cancel it. We need to sign up again. We will.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I've canceled so much. I've saved hundreds of dollars a month just going through some of these. I bet you could easily do that and save money. Yeah, there's a lot of. I've noticed by the way you're spending money on Disney Plus.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Also. Yeah, you did Disney Plus. You did Netflix and YouTube TV. There's no way you could possibly watch that much.

[A]

No, I mean, it's a lot of my background stuff. YouTube TV right now is for college football on Saturdays and then MasterChef every once in a while. That's really all I use YouTube TV for. Netflix there sucks these days. I could cancel it. I literally just started that because I couldn't be on my parents anymore because they cut. You know, Netflix got all straight, so I just restarted it. Actually, I've been re watching Seinfeld, but once I finish Seinfeld, I'll probably.

[B]

All right, then. Good, good. So you have an end date on that. And then which credit card do you charge hinge to? What's that? How much is that?

[A]

It's Apple bills. I might just go to my debit. Debit card might just go to my debit.

[B]

Okay, and how's that going?

[A]

Well, I get a couple matches here and there. Yeah, Lovely people.

[B]

And what credit card do you put.

[A]

That on die there? What matches?

[B]

Yeah, your matches, your dinner dates.

[A]

It doesn't. Oh, no. What I was gonna say is, I guess our matches, but the conversations just die so quickly. Like, I try to keep engaged and I send the last message and then people just. I don't know.

[B]

It sounds like you're sending bad messages.

[A]

Maybe I'm sending bad messages.

[B]

That's probably what it is.

[A]

I get my friends to review my profile and stuff.

[B]

Can I. Can I see it?

[A]

Yeah, go for it.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

It's going to be embarrassing. All right, let's.

[B]

Let's look, to me, it sounds like you're sending really bad messages or boring messages or messages that are just not engaging.

[A]

I am not verifying. First you can see my profile, and then you can just go wherever you want there.

[B]

All right, here we go. I. So this is your main picture. I hate it. You with a banana. No, there's two people in the photo with the banana. They have no idea which one you are. They can't even see your face. Isn't the bananas more prominent?

[A]

Isn't the rule when you have a first picture with a couple people? The second picture has to only be you, though?

[B]

No, I would say the first picture has to be you. Just a good photo of you.

[A]

Graham, when's the last time you've had to be out there and try to get a date? You have a fiance, sir?

[B]

I don't know. It's been a while. But you know what? I don't think these change. I think it's been the same thing for hundreds of years. It's just like people want to see a good photo of just you, not you with a friend and a banana. I have no idea what I'm looking at here. So that's so like strike one on that one. Choose our first date. I thought it said put out. It says putt putt.

[A]

I love putt putt.

[B]

Looks like put out, doesn't it?

[A]

It does. I love putt putt.

[B]

Coffee, dinner and a walk. Okay, special talent of mine. Can I. Can I click that?

[A]

A special talent of mine is being able to do a Morgan Freeman impression. But in British goes, it's like this. Hello, I'm Morgan Freeman.

[B]

What is that?

[A]

Thought it was funny.

[B]

It doesn't sound anything like him.

[A]

No, it doesn't. That's the joke, though. I. We. I saw it on someone else's hinge. I stole it then.

[B]

Did that work for that person or.

[A]

No, we thought it was very funny when we were reviewing that person's hinge. Yeah. Every once in a while, our friend, she will put hinge on the TV and will rate her profiles that she swipes on.

[B]

And she swiped on that.

[A]

I think. I think that pushed her over the edge. But maybe we just find weird things funny.

[B]

All right, two truths and a lie. I have three British friends. I accidentally bought a house. Well, we know that one s on the beach is the best drink ever made. I have three British friends. Is that the lie?

[A]

Yeah, because I guess I have two, but I don't think that's true anymore because I'm friends with their other sister, so I guess they're all fruits.

[B]

They're all true now.

[A]

At one point, they were alive.

[B]

All right, content creator, YouTube and TikTok. I would get rid of that. I don't know if I'd lead in with the Content creator aspect.

[A]

Yeah. I didn't want to push it, but.

[B]

Life, I guess where this photo was taken. Okay. Alter ego. See, the other photos are good. You need a better photo than that. I'm a way better photo.

[A]

I don't have pictures.

[B]

You know what the thing is that I think you should put on here is some of the aquarium stuff. I think that's really, really. I think it's very unique. Okay. It shows that you could take care of something.

[A]

First date, fish shop.

[B]

And that's important. All right, so where do you go to. Messages. Messages here. So give me an example of.

[A]

Okay. Someone who's also. She never responded.

[B]

Let me see. Trying to find out. I don't know. I'd like to find out. You're braver than you look. Then there's nothing she could say to that.

[A]

Well, what did I say?

[B]

Okay. She says, you're braver than you look. You respond back, what can I say? I enjoy some risk.

[A]

How do you franchising.

[B]

Text her that I'm about to do a franchise. All or nothing. From my perspective, there's. She could see that message and think, it's too much effort for me to try to think of a witty thing to say to that or something fun. When you've given her nothing to go off at all.

[A]

Let's find another one.

[B]

So that one when she has like 50 people messaging her, that one just seems like you just kind of ended the conversation. So that's. That's why on that one we're the same type. If you drink pickle juice out of a jar. Have you ever been the first to the pickle food truck? On S first?

[A]

That was my message I sent to her.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

To match.

[B]

Okay. No, that sounds amazing. Seriously, it's so good. Maybe a fun idea for a first date. Way too forward.

[A]

I'm a forward mother.

[B]

No, she knows nothing about you. Your first. All she knows is that you're into pickles. She has nothing to go off of. Your profile is mid at best. And you asked her on a date before she even knows you at all. Before she's able to kind of get a grasp of who you are. There should be some sort of banter going on in the beginning, like just something that piques your curiosity. Other than have you been the first to a pickle truck? That's the reason why.

[A]

One more.

[B]

All right.

[A]

Now. We'll leave it there. We'll leave it there.

[B]

Oh, no. Come on. We need one more. Just a third one.

[A]

She started. You should not go out with me. If I. If I'm an Ohio State fan. I do not like Ohio State because.

[B]

I'm from Michigan, so never be. Okay. I don't know if that's a good first message, but.

[A]

Well, I responded to her prompt though.

[B]

Okay. They're seriously the worst. They're so gross. I'm glad there's not as many down here. I didn't go to University of Michigan, but as a Michigander. Ew. And then you said the double text.

[A]

I'm a double texture. I'm a triple texter. I'm a. I'm a mountain. Send full stream.

[B]

All right.

[A]

Guns ablaze in Texas.

[B]

How's your weekend going so far? My friend's parents house. Okay. Oh, no, that's terrible. My weekend was pretty good. Very light conversation. Okay, so you went from you. Okay, so good conversation. But there's nothing that I see here that's like. It seems more like a friendly conversation kind of back like pen pals. This is good. How long have you been in Texas? I've been here for five years. But yeah, very hot. Still much prefer winters up there. Fair enough. That's really cool. What brings you on here? What do you mean? What brings you on here? She's single.

[A]

What?

[B]

How is she? She's single. What brings you on here?

[A]

Maybe she's not.

[B]

That's a dumb question. What brings you on here? Oh, I bored a tick tock. No, she. She wants to. She wants to meet someone. Like.

[A]

Yeah, but she's diddling.

[B]

That's a. That's a. It's a lame question. So then you follow up again. Another double text. Like you're stacking these points against you right now. So. So this is your second. Second point against you. Oh, no. Are you not interested? Sorry. And then put the lol. So it's like.

[A]

Very embarrassing.

[B]

Yeah, but. But you know what? This is how you teach people with personal finance. And this is how I will teach you not to send these messages.

[A]

You are the one with the fiance.

[B]

So I am going to. To work on behalf of everyone you've had on the show that you have reamed into. And this is my one chance where I could ream into you for this because your finances, that they're not bad. They're decent relative to how much you're doing. So you're fine. So this is my. My chance to shine here. Okay?

[A]

Shine away.

[B]

You're just incredibly gorgeous. So I just. No, come on. What?

[A]

It's all gorgeous.

[B]

Are you not interested? You're just so gorgeous. So I just. No, come on.

[A]

This is terrible.

[B]

Right? That's how she's there. That's what she's thinking.

[A]

No, this is my whole life.

[B]

Because now if she responds now she's, oh, I'm so sorry I did this. And she's gonna BS the excuse. She's gonna throw. Just crap your way. Oh, he said I'm gorgeous. Okay, let me not turn him down it then it's awkward. You're basically putting her up on a pet. She's so gorgeous. Are you not interested? You're the she. Like, you're the one now vying for her to pick you. Yeah, you're the one, dude. You're Caleb Hammer. You. You have. You have the world at your disposal, okay?

[A]

You can.

[B]

Anybody you want. You should be. You should be the picker.

[A]

I'm the one thickness.

[B]

No thickness.

[A]

Your thickness gets less choices.

[B]

You're the picker. Doesn't matter. You are the one doing the picking. You're a picker because you're the picker.

[A]

I like. You are the pick other people.

[B]

No, from now on. From now on, you are the picker.

[A]

I need to act as.

[B]

Yes, yes. You got to be the buyer, not the seller. The seller is the one trying to. Here's. Here's what I have to offer. Here's this, here's that. Buy me. No, you're the one doing the buying.

[A]

What's been fun is I've been trying to ask people in, like, you know, out in life a little more good. Which is because, I mean, that's like the classic way, but it's a little harder. And I think people are a little more barriers now to that because, you know, it is all like online dating now. Mostly rejections.

[B]

It's good. Well, fine. It doesn't.

[A]

It doesn't matter. A couple numbers doesn't matter.

[B]

You just need one good one.

[A]

My friend streamer friend Kimmy forced me, coaxed me into putting a story on my Instagram saying, hey, there's an event I gotta go to and there's a dinner, and I would have liked to date a date, and if anyone wants to go, let me know. Yeah. So you saw it?

[B]

Yeah. How'd it go? Yeah, I was curious about that.

[A]

I don't know. It was. I. I. There's a couple people who reached out, but I felt kind of weird because, again, they're from the audience probably.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And it's like, I don't want to, like, you know, is that a positional thing?

[B]

Like, because I would never think of it to be. And it now it seems like, that's the topic of, oh, you're in a power, you know, position. But what about like an athlete? Does that mean an athlete can't date a fan?

[A]

I don't know.

[B]

From my perspective, it seems like it would be like you and another person are on the same wavelength if they're in to watching personal finance videos on YouTube. That's such a small category. It's such a narrow focus of the type of person who's into that. Chances are you're going to get along very well with the person who's watching an hour long financial audit.

[A]

I just don't want to make a simple mistake like that because it's very easy. Boom. And then cancellation because. And not that. Not that. You know, a lot of that stuff isn't warranted for people who've done bad things. But still, it's like, okay, what if that is abusing a position of power that I want.

[B]

Unaware of, but my thinking is, where does that end?

[A]

I don't.

[B]

But let's say if. If you're a professional baseball player and you're out on the street and someone's a big fan, does that mean you can't date that person? Because. Because you're in a position of power. Like, you know, I think it could be different if you're in a power of authority in the terms of like a career. Yeah. And a workplace thing. Because then there's that added pressure of, I don't want to lose my job, I have payments to make, I have obligations enough, and if I lose this career, how will this affect. Affect me? I could see that a little bit more than like, hey, I'm a fan of your channel. I'm into personal finance. Because that. I think you'll find someone with a similar mindset as you. They're into personal finance, they're into business, they're into bettering themselves or into YouTube. But my point, with this message, she shut you down very politely. I've not been checking the. Sorry, I've not been checking the app consistently. I joined because I moved here, not know anyone. And it seems like a good way to go out and explore Austin, meet new people and see if a relationship comes from it. I do have a lot of traveling for work coming up. So to be honest, I'm taking a step back from hinge dates for a bit. That's her saying, not interested, not interested. But Listen, if Leonardo DiCaprio were her match, she. She'd be there in a second. No, you're okay. So then being like, oh, you're fine. When did you move here? Would you like to try to get dinner or coffee before you start the traveling? See this, to me seems like she just told you she's not interested.

[A]

Yeah. And then I did not read that.

[B]

And then it was just like, so let's go out then.

[A]

So I'm notoriously a bad texter.

[B]

So that's my dating advice on that. I think it's. You just got to reframe.

[A]

And I'm also nervous now that this video is out. Yeah, they're okay. So my income is out there. I also don't want anyone to date.

[B]

Me because they're not going to. They're not going to know. Okay.

[A]

Warn me of that.

[B]

No, I've never experienced it and my income has been out there.

[A]

Did you date a lot before? People always ask me what high yield savings account do I use for my own money. Some of you know by now it's so far I love them. It's great for my checking account needs. It's great for my high yield savings account needs. And right Now I'm getting 4.5% interest on my monies. I love that rate on my money. So if you want to get a great rate like that on your monies, just check out the link in the description below. I have a paid affiliate link link there. You can get bonuses all the way up to $250. And I took advantage of that and you should too.

[B]

I wouldn't say a lot, but it was on there. I mean it's, it's not a surprise.

[A]

At all out there on the streets of la just getting every woman.

[B]

Not necessarily, but people know what they're getting into. If they know me from YouTube, then they know I'm very frugal. I'm not the type of guy. If they want someone to spend a whole bunch of money, that's not me. But they know they don't have work.

[A]

Or worry about things. Things in general.

[B]

That's assuming it would even get to that point. And that's even a conversation to begin with. But you're thinking so far down the line.

[A]

No, you're right that.

[B]

No, I, I think you could generally sense if someone's out for the money and if they have a genuine interest in you. I, I've never experienced it.

[A]

Well, that's good.

[B]

Ever.

[A]

So that. And then the position of power have been my main worries. And that second one, that's just a new thing because, you know, this is. Has only been a recent thing. And to me, I'm I feel like the exact same person. But all of a sudden, there's an audience now. So it's like, yeah, but navigating.

[B]

But now, does that mean you can't date people because you're on YouTube?

[A]

That's what. That's what I.

[B]

That applies to everybody. As soon. As soon as they find out now what you do and they say, oh, wow. You know, whether that be impressive to.

[A]

Them, it's almost an impossible thing to navigate because no one has the.

[B]

I just think, be courteous, just be nice. Social awareness, I think is just a big thing. I think that's it. Common sense.

[A]

Fine. I'm starting a dating email that everyone in the audience can reach out to.

[B]

I would just do that. Put the email hinge at Caleb. Dude, you don't need any. I'd meet people in person.

[A]

In real life. I would love a lovely someone to eventually share it with. Eventually.

[B]

No, now you're selling. Remember, you're being the seller again. Now you're saying, this is what I have to offer. Come pick me. You want to say, I'm into this person. This is who I want to be with. Okay, Not. Hey, guys.

[A]

So this is what my financial audit has turned into.

[B]

Doing a deep dive therapy session here, I think. Is there anything else that you feel like is important to discuss? Because I'm looking through these statements.

[A]

Oh, I don't think you know this. Nobody knows this, huh? I sold 10% of my company last November, October of my YouTube channel.

[B]

Really?

[A]

Yeah. Because at that time, it was making like 10,000 hours a month. I was starting to do it full time, and then I got just very anxious and nervous. Very anxious and nervous. Sold 10% to another YouTuber. A YouTuber you've met, by the way. But you just. You guys never talked about it. Wow. So he just said, you know, he sees big potential in the channel. He wants to give me a lot of advice. And I did get a lot of advice from him. So it wasn't like completely unworth it, but obviously the return on investment he has his head has been fantastic. But this is where you'll be happy. I put a clause in there. One that was risky against me and one that helped me avoid risk if the channel continued to do well. I sold 10% for $25,000 at that time. Again, it was just an anxiety move. It was just a bad move.

[B]

That's a. I notice a theme here of impulsive decisions. Impulsive decision.

[A]

I would say that was more anxiety driven. Like, okay, I'm doing this full time now. Like I was nervous, like, what if things turned down like this? It's nice to have $25,000 just in the business, but either way, it was a bad move. Full out.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I made it that. Okay. If the business is successful and he's made a certain amount on his business within the first year, I can buy it back at $25,000. So I can buy this month at $25,000 instead of whatever that share is worth. That share is worth a lot more.

[B]

Obviously you're doing that.

[A]

Yeah. Or if the business was unsuccessful, he could take the $25,000 back out of the business. So that would have been the risk against me.

[B]

So he was able to collect on his investment.

[A]

He's been getting 10% of the profits on a monthly basis.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

Yeah, he's had a great return on investment and, you know, nothing against that. It was 100% agreed upon. He did help me a lot, especially at the beginning, you know, understanding thumbnails and, you know, just a lot of stuff and just the work around YouTube and what should be, who I should hire first for a full time employee, a lot of that stuff. Because I didn't even have, I didn't have connections to you or anyone at that time. He was the only one who was in the space that I had connection to. So. Congratulations. Yeah.

[B]

Then that worked out really well.

[A]

It worked out, obviously going to. I lost money on it, but it was, it happened.

[B]

But if you needed that to get to where you are today, you could look back at that and say, that got me in the right headspace to be able to do the show at its best. And that leveraged. I parlayed that into where it is today.

[A]

Yeah, Yeah. I mean, investing, I assume you would want more than 50%.

[B]

Yeah. So this, how much is this going to be going down? This 70. Once you buy that back, is this going to be going down a good amount?

[A]

What's. Let's see, miscellaneous in here. So miscellaneous. Well, this is also things like Adobe Acrobat, which we use to black out people statements.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

You can see a lot of those there. And then there's a lot of the payroll as well. So I do want to make sure that the people who work with me and anyone that comes on in the future, they are, you know, making good money. If I make good money, I want them to make good money.

[B]

And if you're not doing well, then.

[A]

They'Re not going to do as well.

[B]

Okay. So is it a tiered structure?

[A]

Yes. Yeah.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

A lot of it's Based on channel performance.

[B]

I think as long as you keep it as a core team, don't over expand and, you know, maintain that and continue that trajectory, I think you'll be fine on that.

[A]

Yeah, like producer and editor for what we're doing on this show. I think it's good. Then we have someone that helps on a part time basis. Just going through the statements, blacking them out and building these spreadsheets for us because it's just a lot of time. But then again, that's a part time basis. And then I have, as of the last two months, put my thumbnails in someone's hand who is like focused purely on the notice.

[B]

I noticed your thumbnails are switching up a little bit. What you should try is the YouTube thumbnail trial tester. Have you seen that?

[A]

I've seen people doing it. I couldn't find it.

[B]

They're slowly rolling it out. Try a few different thumbnails. I think you need a cleaner thumbnail, but I'm not sure because what you're doing is working quite well. But I think maybe something a little cleaner might do even better. I'm not sure though.

[A]

I mean, I. Yes, I agree. I would love to see examples so that just have a hard time picturing it for whatever reason.

[B]

Yeah. I would like seeing you saving a little bit more and investing because I think that you got like. Usually YouTube is like a five to seven year career. Assuming it does really well.

[A]

Five to seven. Oh, assuming, yeah, yeah.

[B]

The best channels I've seen two, three. Now the best channels have a lifespan five to seven. Very few crack ten. So, you know, I think if you've been doing it, be seven. Oh yeah, I knew, I knew. Getting. Oh yeah, I already know. It's like YouTube is going to have an end at some point. So that's why I've transitioned a lot more into the podcast. I'm posting less on the main channel, more on the podcast, quality on the podcast. Getting different guests on there.

[A]

We got.

[B]

So I think, yeah, wow. Yeah, we're gonna film.

[A]

We got, we got. We gotta film that. We've been going for a long time.

[B]

So I'm hoping that kind of resets the timeline so I could be like, okay, I got seven years over here, but only three on here. So I'm hoping three on here. And now I get another few years going.

[A]

I mean I watch a lot of them. I mean some of them really pop off.

[B]

We're on a rol.

[A]

Great guests.

[B]

Yeah. I think the guest selection is good. And mixing that with Shorts has skyrocketed.

[A]

Our growth and today you're getting the best guest on YouTube. What a blessing for you.

[B]

And you're gonna be coming off Bobby Lee. Ben Shapiro.

[A]

You had Bobby Lee?

[B]

Yeah, we had Bobby Lee. Oh, Patrick David. So we got those people and we got Caleb.

[A]

Was Bobby Lee all Bobby lead?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

In the episode. Oh, yeah.

[B]

We'll talk about it on the iced coffee hour. But it was one of the most unexpected videos I've ever done. I came in with a plan and he wanted none of it. Nothing.

[A]

Wait, nevermind. I don't know who Bobby Lee is. You know, I thought, I thought Bobby Lee was the new podcaster girl that everyone's calling Bobby Altoff. Is that the industry plant that everyone's calling her?

[B]

One with Drake?

[A]

Yeah. Never mind. I don't know who you're talking about.

[B]

Bobby Lee, the comedian Bobby Lee.

[A]

I need faces. I'm not a name person. I don't do names.

[B]

This guy, you've seen him. Guarantee you've seen him.

[A]

Oh, I watched that episode. That was a great episode. Yeah, fantastic.

[B]

Came in with a Finances, money and just immediately like he just said, I'm not gonna talk about that.

[A]

I think that's my favorite episode. You guys did that or Liver King. One of those.

[B]

Liver King.

[A]

That was a great.

[B]

Wow. You like that?

[A]

Okay. Very interesting. Different. Yeah. Cool.

[B]

I think people like seeing the different guests in me outside of my comfort zone, which is a lot more recently.

[A]

I assume they didn't really get the views, which is why you stopped. But I really enjoyed the ones where it was you grab and Alex, you, Jack and Alex.

[B]

Yeah, we try to have a new guest on every week. We've thrown those in midweeks, but it's just the core audience really likes it, but it doesn't. It doesn't get to Nothing for growth. And when you post that off an episode of like, you get someone like Ben Shapiro and then us three, everyone that subscribes for that looks at the next one. It's not what I subscribe for. Click off, unsubscribe, and then you don't build up that momentum.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So kind of throws a wrench in it. Well, thank you so much. That is my advice for you. Don't be stupid with your money. Play it safe. Double down. I think on what you're doing, be creative here and get better with your texting game. So in terms of my overall score, I would say that Caleb has an 8 out of 10 in terms of his spending. It doesn't really matter in the big picture because his income is so high. But I do think there's a lot that can be cleaned up and a lot that's going to be going missing purely because he's not really thinking much of it. We also have debt, which I would probably give a 1 out of 10, frankly. He could pay it off if he wants to. He's trying to leverage some of that. So I give that a low score. A 10 out of 10 in the emergency fund category is plenty of cash on hand. He could pay his taxes with it. I'm a fan of that. His retirement, I would give it a 9 out of 10. I think he could save a little bit more. I'm sure he can optimize some of his of his tax savings in this, but it's not perfect. His house score, I give a 7 out of 10 because I think it was a bit impulsive. The spending is a bit higher than where I think it should be relative to where he could rent. So 7 out of 10. Dating, however, is a 0 out of 10. I think complete failure. And I think that could absolutely be improved and needs to improve immediately. So overall, 35 out of 60. The dating score really brings it down. But I think he's got a bright future ahead of him.

[A]

Thanks again to Sofi for sponsoring this episode.

[B]

Sam.