RE-RELEASE - Chris Rock

Summary

Fly on the Wall with Dana Carvey & David Spade

Episode: RE-RELEASE - Chris Rock
Original Air Date: December 11, 2025
Guest: Chris Rock

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Overview

This episode of "Fly on the Wall" features a lively, candid, and often hilarious conversation between hosts David Spade, Dana Carvey, and iconic comedian Chris Rock. Together, they revisit their early days on "Saturday Night Live" (SNL), reflect on developing as comics, share personal insights about therapy and growth, and explore what it means to succeed in comedy. As always, their banter delivers both laughs and genuine moments of vulnerability, making listeners feel like they're eavesdropping on a conversation among old pals.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. SNL Memories and the “Junior Varsity” Cast

• Dana Carvey reminisces about how Spade, Rock, Sandler, Farley, and Schneider were brought in to renew SNL’s energy, even when the main cast was still strong ([07:00]).
• Chris Rock: “Yeah, Farley, like Kobe Bryant, came off the bench. People forget.” ([07:19])
• Chris discusses his and Farley's experience as the "new guys," likening the environment to boot camp, and highlighting the divide between stand-ups and improv actors ([09:25]).
  • Improv actors were more technically prepared; stand-ups were more mentally ready due to living and dying with their own material ([09:32]).
• Discusses the pressure of filling in the SNL “Black cast member” slot after Eddie Murphy and Damon Wayans during a time of scrutiny for SNL's lack of diversity ([12:48]):
  • Chris Rock: “You're gonna do some Eddie Murphy stuff, right? Like, I don't do any impressions... I do what I do.” ([13:25])

2. The Art of Stand-Up and Writing Original Material

• Discussion about the anxiety and excitement of participating in new sketches, and the need to repeatedly “inch your way in” ([13:35]).
• The critical eye Lorne Michaels applied when hiring new talent:
  • Chris Rock: “Lorne said the thing... ‘you guys had original thought.’ I don't think that we both had, like, a joke somewhere that he hadn't heard before. And that’s why he hired us.” ([17:35])
• Rock’s early edgy signature joke about attending abortion rallies as a way to meet women ([18:21]), reflecting his boundary-pushing comedic voice.

3. Camaraderie, Competition, and Identity in Comedy

• Exploration of how cast members discovered who had "game" around the office and at read-throughs ([19:26]).
• The comedy “tribe” and validation from fellow comedians is valued above mainstream praise:
  • Chris Rock: “The only people I care about is, like, you guys, right? Not even comedians, just comedians I think are funny.” ([40:39])

4. Personal Growth, Therapy, and Their Impact

• Deep dive into what therapy taught each comic:
  • Chris Rock: “This apartment is probably the first real purchase I've made for myself in about 28 years... Since I got that Corvette at SNL.” ([30:31])
  • On tackling childhood trauma: “Until you deal with all your childhood shit... nothing’s going to work out for you. You gotta start at the beginning. It’s like working on a script. Okay, page one.” ([30:58])
• Chris explains how childhood bullying, being the oldest of seven (yet smallest), and intense family dynamics shaped his personality—making him “bend over backwards to be nice” and avoid anger ([32:05–33:46]).
  • Chris Rock: “The last year, now I can get angry. I’m not scared of letting people know how I feel.” ([34:09])
• Dana and Chris share the ways upbringing and family trauma influenced their tendencies toward confrontation and self-care.

5. Dating, Relationships, and the Costs of Divorce (with Signature Humor)

• Chris jokes about the financial impact of his divorce:
  • Chris Rock: “I always say my ex-wife has made more money off of comedy than Robert Townsend.” ([36:47])
  • “I’m the only comedian that has to drive a cab at night… I’m gonna change that to Uber.” ([36:59–37:03])
• Dana introduces the quote: “Men want to be admired and women want to be loved by a man they admire.” Chris and David riff on whether this rings true ([40:08]).

6. Fame, Recognition, and Public Perception

• Recognition on the street spans everything from jokes to movies to Madagascar:
  • “It’s not SNL anymore. It’s more movies here or there. I’m like, I don't know… Certain people were just famous and you couldn't even figure out why.” ([43:18])
• David grapples with being recognized—not always positively ([43:24]).
• The phenomenon of "heat" (career momentum) vs. "fame":
  • Chris Rock: “Me and Chappelle always joke about it… back when I was Drake.” ([44:23])
• Surprised at the reach of new crowds and comics now selling out arenas—no longer reserved for household names ([45:29]).
  • Chris observes that comics have become the “real artists” in America as stand-up is newly respected ([46:26]).

7. The Philosophy of Stand-Up—and Its Parallels to Preaching

• Stand-up’s social role as a voice of reason and philosophy in a world with fewer philosophers and less religion:
  • Chris Rock: “Humans need people to talk… philosophers used to be famous… so the only place people can say their thoughts is stand-up. The last of the thinkers.” ([48:24])
  • Chris draws inspiration from preachers in his family and says he watches their style as much as stand-ups ([49:16], [49:26]).

8. The Joys and Challenges of Writing New Material

• The thrill of creating new jokes and performing in small clubs ([50:39–51:21]).
  • Chris Rock: “Once you get enough bits that are working... The greatest feeling is a new bit coming together.” ([51:25–51:28])
  • Unveils the origin of his classic “keep her off the pole” line regarding his daughter, which became an iconic bit ([52:08]).

9. Living Up to Expectations and Stage Introductions

• Discusses the pressure of performing as “Chris Rock,” the expectations set by MCs, and the challenge of being introduced without fanfare when trying out new material ([54:39–55:17]).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Chris Rock on joining SNL’s “junior varsity”:
  • “It’s amazing… Farley, like Kobe Bryant, came off the bench. People forget.” ([07:19])
• On the SNL Bootcamp:
  • “It reminds you that everyone got there because they were good. And then you’re immediately shit on… it’s like a wake up call.” – Chris Rock ([15:47])
• On therapy and self-care:
  • “This apartment is probably the first real purchase I’ve made for myself in 28 years.” – Chris Rock ([30:31])
  • “Childhood trauma is like some real shit. …You gotta start at the beginning. It’s like working on a script.” – Chris Rock ([30:58])
• On anger and boundaries:
  • “The guy you saw was bending over backwards to be nice. Because I was so scared of my anger.” – Chris Rock ([33:22])
  • “Now I can get angry. I’m not scared of letting people know how I feel.” – Chris Rock ([34:09])
• Classic self-deprecation:
  • “My ex-wife has made more money off comedy than Robert Townsend.” – Chris Rock ([36:47])
  • “I’m the only comedian who has to drive a cab at night.” – Chris Rock ([37:00])
• On the new wave of stand-up:
  • “In America, the standups are becoming the real artists… the nerdy tradition of coming up with your own stuff.” – Chris Rock ([46:26])
• On the thrill of a new bit:
  • “Once you get enough bits that are working… the greatest feeling is a new bit coming together.” – Chris Rock ([51:25])
• On the legacy of his iconic joke:
  • “Gotta keep her off the pole… It just came out of my mouth.” – Chris Rock ([52:22])

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• SNL, “JV”/“Varsity” Cast, Early Days: [06:55]–[09:32]
• Stand-Up vs. Improv, Lorne’s Choices: [09:25]–[13:20]
• Getting Overwhelmed on SNL: [13:35]–[14:53]
• Validation, Comedian Approval: [40:30]–[41:29]
• Therapy, Upbringing, Self-Care: [30:31]–[34:53]
• Bullying & Anger: [32:05]–[34:53]
• Divorce & Financial Advice: [35:24]–[37:04]
• Fame & Recognition: [43:24]–[44:45]
• Stand-Up as Modern Philosophy: [48:24]–[49:26]
• Preaching & Performance Style: [49:16]–[50:13]
• Writing New Material: [50:39]–[51:49]
• Pressure of Stage Intros & Expectations: [54:39]–[55:41]

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Tone & Takeaways

Throughout the episode, the tone is as expected for three legendary comics: fast-paced, irreverent, deeply honest, and warm. They move seamlessly from inside jokes and classic bits to real talk about therapy and the challenges of comedy. Chris Rock’s openness about therapy, anger, and growth stands out, as does his reverence for comedy as an art form and community. The hosts keep the chat feeling like a reunion of friends, inviting the audience to laugh, reflect, and reminisce right alongside them.

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Useful for Listeners If You Haven’t Tuned In

• Fly on the Wall offers rare, in-depth insights into the comedic process, the grind of SNL, and the evolving landscape of stand-up.
• The episode gives listeners a seat at the table with comedy greats discussing personal growth, professional lessons, and what keeps them coming back for more.
• For fans of SNL, stand-up, or just good storytelling, Chris Rock’s mix of humility, vulnerability, and killer punchlines delivers on every level.

Transcript

[David Spade]

Listen, Dana, if you're like me, you're like me a little bit.

[Dana Gould]

I think so. Yeah.

[David Spade]

Adulthood did hit me hard. And you can't run four hours of sleeping cheeseburgers forever.

[Dana Gould]

Nope.

[David Spade]

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[Dana Gould]

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[David Spade]

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[Dana Gould]

G-I-N.com Tara origin feel better from the inside out.

[David Spade]

You know, some mornings feel impossible, Dana. Like today. Freezing cold holiday to dos. Piling up. And you just want something from your wardrobe. You just want it to make your life easy and just perform.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah. You want your.

[David Spade]

Yeah.

[Dana Gould]

Something to perform. You want a wardrobe to perform.

[David Spade]

Yeah. You want a wardrobe to bring something to the table. That's why I'm turning to Quince. Their Mongolian cashmere sweaters.

[Dana Gould]

Mongolian cashmere sweaters. Awesome.

[David Spade]

Insanely soft. 50 bucks for a cashmere sweater. And looks way more expensive than they are. Italian wool coats. Structured, polished, perfect fit for these chilly months. Honestly, the down jacket, I got to get that from Quince because that's a go to it keeps you warm, looks sharp, holds up through the whole season.

[Dana Gould]

Yes, Quince really nails the essentials. They got denim and chinos that actually fit David. Outerwear that lasts. From leather jackets to wool top coats. All made from premium materials by trusted factories. And because they cut out the middleman, you get luxury quality without the crazy price tag.

[David Spade]

You were in a high school band called Denim and Chinos, if I recall.

[Dana Gould]

Yes, and BBQ was the lead singer.

[David Spade]

Actually, I've been starting grabbing a few gifts for home, bath and kitchen. I don't stop at home. I go bath, kitchen. Nice. They make perfect presents that make it feel thoughtful, but don't break the bank. Get your wardrobe sorted and your gift list handled with quints. Don't wait. Go to quince.com fly for free shipping on your order and a 365 day return. That's all year now available in Canada too. What is it, Dana?

[Dana Gould]

That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com fly free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com fly.

[David Spade]

You know this last year, Dana, after my big dinner, slipped into the old food company.

[Dana Gould]

Oh my goodness.

[David Spade]

Basically fused in with the couch. I'm talking stuffing, pie, all the fixer bread, house I tore into.

I don't remember eating it. I said just the roof.

[Dana Gould]

Oh, one of those. Yeah, I did a lot of pumpkin pie. Yeah.

[David Spade]

Anyway, now I come.

[Dana Gould]

What do you do now?

[David Spade]

Chava is my holiday reset. I keep a couple servings in my carry on stash, some at home. My friends and family show up. The snacking gets a little too nutty. Chava has a new limited edition chocolate mint flavor. Right. That's basically the holiday in the glass. Yeah, yeah. Rich chocolate, cool mint, none of the sugar.

[Dana Gould]

Crush might be my new favorite though. I still rotate in their chai and coconut.

I blend mine with nut milk and frozen fruit or iced coffee.

[David Spade]

A little extra.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah, right.

[David Spade]

Coming back. Steady energy, easier digestion, muscles that actually recover. Metabolism support and a little help for my mind and immune system. Plus it's delicious. 25 grams of plant based protein. No artificial flavors, no soy, no gluten, none of the junk. Just real all in one nutrition.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah, yeah, that's right. Food coma recovery made easy. Go to kachava.com and use Kofly for 15 off your next order. That's good job. Kachava. K.

A C-H-A-V-A.com cofly for 15 off.

[David Spade]

All right, we got our boy Chris Rock who is very good friend and great guy. A great guy and one of the funniest guys out there in real life. On phone calls, on and on stage. Obviously he did that special.

Where he finally talked about the Will Smith situation and we. Oh yeah, we helped him with that. Live.

[Dana Gould]

We were live after, after his. I think it was the biggest. Whatever the highest numbers or something.

[David Spade]

Yeah, they did one that was the first live show.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah, live. And it was global. But that was amazing.

[David Spade]

We've talked to Chris about everything. We cover the gamut. We just laugh. Basically. The sounds a little itchy because it was one of the first ones we ever did. But it's still fine.

[Dana Gould]

He's always very interesting to talk to and he, he kind of opened up toward the end and talks about is this apartment that he got and it was sort of the. One of the first times he's ever sort of bought something for himself or something like that. But we get into his childhood and all kinds of stuff. It's very, very interesting and it's always fun.

[David Spade]

Chris Rock always. Lots of laughs. Here he is. Chris Rock.

Rock said I could stay there. Hang on, Dana. I wet the bed and so I said I shouldn't stay at his house because I feel embarrassed.

[Dana Gould]

You still wet the bed. I was a bed wetter. There's no way to get out of a wet bed with any dignity. What happened, dear? But anyway, that's. We'll get to the childhood stuff in a minute. But Chris, on your. A day off for you. Not a family day, but a Chris Day day. Like, it's going to be totally off. No emails. You're going to have fun. Does that great Chris Day include having to go on a podcast.

Because, you know, you're performing.

[Chris Rock]

I love the lady, but I really love Spade.

[Dana Gould]

I know.

[David Spade]

Yeah.

[Dana Gould]

So you had to do it.

[David Spade]

Rock and I came in together. Yeah. Thank you, Brock.

[Chris Rock]

You know, almost anything for Dana, but any.

[Dana Gould]

But you guys were the junior varsity who outdid the varsity. But we had a junior varsity team consisting of Farley, you, Sandler, Schneider, and. And David. I mean, it was an incredible junior varsity team that was being trained to take over when we left in a way, right?

[Chris Rock]

No, it was. Yeah. It's amazing that. Yeah, Farley, like Kobe Bryant came off the bench. People forget.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah. Oh, yeah. We do a whole show. We go, hey, how about this guy Farley? We're just like, you know what?

[Chris Rock]

I hired us because normally they bring in the new people when the old people are, you know.

[David Spade]

You know.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, not. Not doing great. You guys were in rare form.

[Dana Gould]

I mean, that was, you know, that was the beginning of a 18, 20 person cast. When I came in, it was like basically four feature players, or there were six total. And that was the beginning. And now there's like 21. So it never went back to just five people being the cast right after that.

[Chris Rock]

No, I don't think. Yeah, I went the other night and I, I couldn't believe how long the.

[Dana Gould]

The credit roll is. Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

Like Jimmy Brokers in them on snl. Like, I couldn't believe.

It's like how many people are in this cast.

[David Spade]

We started. It was just so people know. I came on at the end four shows of the previous season. So Rob Schneider and I got hired to write for four episodes on those four Dice Clay Was always. We had a couple good ones, you know, Alec Baldwin's first show. And then when the summer came, we. We got picked up and then that's when Rock and Farley came. Right, Rock, were you a full cast? Were you a feature man?

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, me and Farley got brought on together. We were the new guys that year.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah.

[David Spade]

So we were also new together. Yeah. So we got close offices and we Rock who people don't know because he's tough on tv. So am I. I've come off like a hard ass athlete. But Rock is a nice person and I was sort of an out of my element from Arizona and we gravitated just because we were kind of in over our heads. Like everyone is there, I guess, when they start.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, I mean, well, you know, they always had that thing. It was the stand ups and the improv guys.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah, yeah.

[Chris Rock]

And the improv guys were more technically prepared for the show. But the standup guys, because we write our own material and we live and die by the crowd, we were more, I thought, mentally prepared for the show. Like.

[Dana Gould]

Cause the show. Yeah, the show is killed or it didn't kill.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, like we could, you know, I mean, like the standups I thought were less into the politics of who likes who and who's close with Downey and who's close with Lauren. It's like improv guys, because they're thinking, they're in a group, think and stand. Like Sandler, to come from writing on the show and this by force of nature make himself, you know, the biggest cast member.

[David Spade]

Huge.

[Chris Rock]

Only a stand up could do some crazy shit like that.

[David Spade]

Yeah, I think I got on, I caught on to Sandler. We always thought he's funny, but Chris, Dana, you. We all know great comedians that never pop or never make it. I'm like, I watch a guy go, this guy's better than me. And I probably make more, you know, I mean there's just.

[Dana Gould]

Right.

[David Spade]

They don't get discovered. And when you see Sandler, I think it was somewhere around Crazy Spoon Head where I'm like, this guy does not run out of ideas. He does not stop and he just fucking crushes. It's, it's every week it was a new one. I'm like, God damn, this guy's got it.

[Dana Gould]

He would, he would crawl around on all fours down the hallway. I'd be in my office and I'd hear a little knock and he would come in so gently and so quietly. But he wanted me to introduce Opera man because he'd done it once and they didn't. What? You know, so that I. From Updates, somehow I introduced it, and it was separate and he had a little stage, and that was the beginning. But when I first saw Sandler, his likability and charm. Let's just talk about him for a sec. He'll hate if he hears, hey, just sitting in a chair and leaning back. Hey. It was like, whoa. You know? And the girls liked him. Let's face it. And then he's Adam Sandler.

[Chris Rock]

But I was the original Pete Davidson. He was.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah, Pete Davidson. Great comic. But I am fascinated by who he has sex with. I mean, that's a big part of my life following that thing.

[David Spade]

Rock, I have a question about when you did your first. When your first.

[Chris Rock]

Do you have, like, questions prepared? Did you guys actually.

[David Spade]

Yeah, we care about you.

[Dana Gould]

My goal was for you not to be bored. Like, so you got an SNL and then bring the pain. Really blew up, right?

[Chris Rock]

Oh, my God.

[Dana Gould]

You know what I mean? So I have questions for you that I'm actually curious. Like, as if we were hanging out. Yeah. But if you want us to ask about anything, let us know.

[David Spade]

I'm curious about if Rock felt. If it was not fair. But I did one Weekend Update in my first four shows, and it scared the fuck out of me. We all weren't really actors. We hadn't done much. So Rock's first show, they were so salivating over Rock to come in and do all these sketches, they couldn't do that. I remember. I think they overloaded you with so many. Because there was a thing, a Confederate sketch, especially.

[Chris Rock]

Yes.

I got SNL hadn't had a black cast member in, like, nine years. Most people think I'm the black guy after Eddie. I'm actually the black guy after Damon Wayans. And Living Color was killing it at this point. And there was, like, a bunch of, whatever, snl. So white articles or whatever. And then I got hired. So, yeah, there was, like, this immediate thing where, like, you're gonna do some Eddie Murphy stuff, right? Like, I don't do any impressions.

[David Spade]

They brush off all the old pressure.

[Dana Gould]

You know, the Eddie Murphy type stuff.

[Chris Rock]

Any impressions? I don't do any voices. You know what I mean? Like, I do what I do. I mean.

[David Spade]

You know.

[Chris Rock]

But so, yeah, I guess there was pressure.

[David Spade]

You have to do act and you have to look at cue cards and, you know, just being in one sketch, you're terrified all week. Or I was. And you have to inch your way in. And you were, like, hosting that first time because I Remember, you were in a lot of sketches. They're pulling you every which way. You have a million costume changes. And the scariest one was. I was a soldier in the Confederate Soldier. I. I don't know what the sketch was. You were the first black gentleman.

[Chris Rock]

I don't know. Franken wrote it.

[David Spade]

Franken. And he was fucking roughing.

[Chris Rock]

No one should have to work with Franken. The first year on the show.

[David Spade]

Never. That's what I was getting at is he's so tough now.

[Dana Gould]

What are you doing?

[Chris Rock]

It's like, okay, you've been on two years now. You can work without breaking.

[David Spade]

God damn.

[Dana Gould]

He was intimidating.

[Chris Rock]

He's an amazing guy, but, you know.

[Dana Gould]

He'S a little intimidating because he doesn't. He's very blunt. That wasn't very funny. You know, you have to get used to that.

[Chris Rock]

He's the white Lou Gossett Jr. From Officer Hill.

[Dana Gould]

What you gonna do? Mayonnaise? Was it that.

[David Spade]

I remember that sketch.

[Chris Rock]

He's the Jewish Lou. Gossip Rock.

[David Spade]

But was it weird? Because if I didn't really think about it that way. But in Living, Keller is. Is doing great. You must feel like you're almost stuck on snl because it's like, I should be.

[Chris Rock]

I did. I. I mean, I loved it and I loved you guys, but it was a weird. You know, I'm sure Jackie Robinson used to, like, go to Harlem after the games with. With the Dodgers, and it's like, right, shit's happening uptown. Why am I here with Peewee Reese?

[Dana Gould]

But Peewee Reese, good reference.

[David Spade]

When you went on In Living Color, you finally went on there.

[Dana Gould]

Did you.

[David Spade]

Were you. Was it fun or was it not fun at that?

[Chris Rock]

No, but I finally got there. The Waynes were gone, Keenan was gone. I was like, I don't even know what the hell I was on. I was on. But it's weird. I got to work with Jim Carrey and Jamie Foxx was there.

You know, all of that SNL and Living Color, it was just for me to make friends and to kind of learn about writing and writing on a deadline. All of that was just training and, you know, I was supposed to do stand up. Thank God.

[David Spade]

It's a humbling boot camp that just reminds you that everyone got there because they were good. And then you're immediately shit on and you're immediately. It's like a wake up call. Like, oh, fuck.

[Chris Rock]

I'm not the first guy to like, maybe, you know, the show wasn't perfect for me, but, you know, Julia Louise Dreyfus, Stiller, you Know, it's like a lot of people that kind of, you know Jim Carrey.

[Dana Gould]

I auditioned with Jim Carrey, you know, I mean, and I thought, well, they gotta pick Jim Carrey. Guy's insane. But he killed on In Living Color.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, I auditioned. The night I auditioned, me and Sam were. Auditioned. We were at the Chicago Improv, and Dana Gould was so good. Know him well, I left the audition.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah.

Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

I was like, okay, this is over.

[Dana Gould]

This guy, smart, funny.

[Chris Rock]

Smart, funny. Like, whatever. Like, this guy's so much better than me. I am out of my league. And I left. And later that night, Lauren, you know, whatever, found out what hotel I was in and told me to come downstairs and basically told me I had the show. I didn't even like, that's how good Dana Ghoul was. Like, let me get the fuck out of here, because I'm wasting my time.

[Dana Gould]

I think with Lorne.

It'S like almost a sports analogy or something. He's looking at people can play well together a little bit.

[Chris Rock]

Well, I actually. I asked him that in reference to Dana Gould. It is no knockoff dick. Dana's had a great career writing on the Simpsons. Fucking great, great specials, the whole thing. Lorne said the thing. I said, what did you see in us? Because I was like, what do you see in me and Sam? Because we both were like, what the fuck are we doing here? And he said, well, you guys had original thought.

[David Spade]

Yeah, that's a big thing, is writing. They always look at writing.

[Chris Rock]

And I don't think that we both had, like a joke somewhere that he hadn't heard before. And that's why he hired us.

[Dana Gould]

What would be like at that time? Didn't Sandlers have the thing about who's guarding Wilt Chamberlain?

[Chris Rock]

Who's the Wilt Chamberlain? One of the greatest for people.

[David Spade]

For people comedy.

[Dana Gould]

Do you want to.

[David Spade]

That should be an nft.

[Dana Gould]

Explain that.

[Chris Rock]

It should be an nft.

[Dana Gould]

It was so original and so funny. But I want to know what your signature thing you might have had or your Go to your most surefire bit.

[Chris Rock]

You know, I had a bit about going to an abortion rally to meet women that I knew were fucking.

[David Spade]

I remember that.

[Chris Rock]

That was pretty radical. That was radical in 1989. 90.

[David Spade]

Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

It's like, whoa.

[David Spade]

Well, well, Rock came. Came with more hype than Sandler, I think. I think Rock. When I got there, everyone was telling me. And I also heard a lot of hype about Farley. And then we knew Sandler from the Valley. So me, Schneider, and maybe Dennis, maybe Dana were helping saying, Sandler's funny. He came soon after. But it was weird. Like first, you know, you can tell if people had game and sometimes you can just tell around the office. You can tell it read through. But I, I definitely was looking around that place going, everyone's great. It's on. I mean, when you go down to Smile, Jack Hanny, talk about original thoughts, every Jack Handy sketch I'm in read through going, you're fucking shitting me. I should quit the business. I don't even know what I'm doing. He would hit the weirdest ideas.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, I remember Mike Myers just shit that didn't get on. I still remember to this day. I'm like, what the fuck?

[Dana Gould]

I've mentioned to people, they asked me about, oh, the greatest cast, whatever. And I mentioned specifically 90 to 93 because every. There were too many cylinders firing. And again, you'd have a Toons is the Cat. Or Myers do Sprockets. You do Nat x David do this Sandler. You guys were coming up and getting a fan following. I think those three years was like, sometimes I'd sit back and go, man, that show kicked ass.

[David Spade]

Because they got the overlap, they got you guys. And we're coming up and it's crossing and then you guys all leave and then it's just us.

[Dana Gould]

But yeah, we had Phil, we had Jan, we had. You know, it's just like, that was a wild, wild time.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, yeah, insane. I learned. I learned more there than I learned, you know, any other time in my life. And good people, you know.

[David Spade]

You know what's interesting? You told me about Nicki Minaj years and years ago. I didn't know who Nicki Minaj was. And you go, I said something about her and you go, actually, she's really funny. She's. She's got a great personality. And that was the first me going, oh, really? I like that you look at it with those eyes. Because sometimes I look at. I can't help it when I meet women or. And not that you were dating them, but when you just meet women, that sort of easy, funny thing that comes out of them is always really a great quality. Because they don't try to be like Robin Williams. They're just, they're a funny personality. I love it.

[Chris Rock]

Well, you know, you're a handsome guy, David. So you think you have a chance. I don't think I have a chance.

[David Spade]

You're the good looking guy. Whenever we go out, they like Rock better.

[Chris Rock]

Okay?

[David Spade]

They always go, why aren't you Chris Rock? And I go, I can't be. He's.

[Dana Gould]

Don't you get more handsome than ever, Chris. Don't you get that?

[Chris Rock]

Oh, thank you.

[Dana Gould]

It's not like you're like. It's not like you're aging horribly. I'll just say that you're. You're very.

[David Spade]

Well, he looks cooler when he gets older.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah. If I lean back and have the mic here, I'm in good shape. The neck is not happy with this age, but this is pretty good. I. You lose volume in your face and you kind of. Your face recedes into your skull, so you need glasses. You need. This is something Jerry Seinfeld will do eventually. But can I. Do you want to. I asked you kind of off the.

[David Spade]

Kilter question last night.

[Chris Rock]

Oh, because I'm name dropping.

[Dana Gould]

Who did you have dinner with you guys last night?

[Chris Rock]

Me, Jerry, Colin, just. What the fuck? Paul McCartney.

[Dana Gould]

Good, good.

[Chris Rock]

Jimmy Fallon Jr. Did they shut down.

[Dana Gould]

The restaurant or what the fuck?

[Chris Rock]

And these.

[David Spade]

I'm sorry, which Cheesecake factory?

[Dana Gould]

So Paul McCartney goes, you know, I'd like something, you know, a little sudsy on the top and. Jerry.

[David Spade]

Sudsy.

[Chris Rock]

I don't want.

[Dana Gould]

Sorry, go ahead.

[Chris Rock]

I didn't say that as a name drop. I just. I was just feeding. Dana.

[David Spade]

Dana, go down the line.

[Dana Gould]

I do Jerry Seinfeld as a serial killer because I don't think Jerry has two gears and Fallon does this one gear. But sometimes Jerry goes, when he did his president bit, someone wanting to be president. I think I'm just the right guy for that thing. I think I could do president. He has that doobadoo, doo, doo. So I do him as a serial killer. I'm just gonna go in, cut your spleen, go down the living and do the thing anyway. Sorry. I could do Paul McCartney. Kills, killed.

[Chris Rock]

Kills killed. So what do you always kill?

[Dana Gould]

So when you're in that situation with those people, you just look at the table and kind of go, I belong. Right? I mean, you're chill.

[Chris Rock]

I mean, you. You're in that situation. We're in that situation right now. We're all pretty accomplished, us three. Yeah, yeah. I mean, hey, nobody looks at Paul McCartney and goes, I should be here. How you doing? My equal.

[Dana Gould]

He's so. He's. There's no way, Jerry.

[Chris Rock]

But, you know, through lots of therapy, yeah, I can kind of relax during this.

[David Spade]

But Carney seems like he likes to hang out with people. Funny people also get a pass. They. They like little court jesters around. I've been invited to shit out of mostly curiosity factor. They Just go, Spade, go. Keep things moving. I'm like.

You know what I mean? They like that, that you're gonna say something funny.

[Chris Rock]

You're enough, David. You don't have to be a jester. You're enough.

[David Spade]

I just got the results back. I have to be. They told me. My therapist told me.

[Dana Gould]

You know, David, last year I gifted Masterclass to my sister for her birthday and she couldn't stop talking about it. See? See how that works? She integrated it into her mornings as a little personal growth ritual. Inspired me to do the same.

[David Spade]

Okay.

[Dana Gould]

Now it's part of my routine too. Just a few minutes a day. And I feel sharper, calmer, more creative.

[David Spade]

We needed to get you like honed down into that zone.

[Dana Gould]

I'm so glad you, you just heard that. Like you've. You heard me. You felt. You felt my.

[David Spade]

I hear what you're saying.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah, exactly. You listen.

[David Spade]

That's my crime. I'm a listener. You hear, but you don't listen. You look, but you don't see what. One of the favorite classes that I've heard about is Amy Poehler. You know what I mean? Amy Poehler does a improv class. And those are, those are things you can actually use in your everyday life. People have when you're writing emails and your presentations, when you're in conversations, it sort of makes you think a little differently. But there's so many with Masterclass. I mean, there's how many 200 world classes with genius people teaching you. And the plan start at just $10 a month. Build annually so you can watch or listen anywhere on your phone, laptop, where.

[Dana Gould]

Else, or even online if you're traveling. And David, every membership comes with bonus guides and a 30 day money back guarantee. Thousands of bite sized lessons fit right into your schedule. Make it easy to learn from the best on your own time.

[David Spade]

That's right. Masterclass always has great offers during the holidays. Sometimes up to as much as 50% off. Head over to masterclass.com fly for the current offer. That's up to 50 [e-mail] fly. Okay, listen, so for.

Thanksgiving.

[Dana Gould]

Thanksgiving, yeah.

[David Spade]

I'm going to add into the mix some Omaha steaks because it's like I want to, you know, have them around because they have steaks, they have hamburgers, they have.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah, they're fun. They're fun to have around.

[David Spade]

Yeah. And then you take that and then I'm going to tell people that's a good gift idea for Christmas. You know, send them out. Take the pain out of going and shopping. Suddenly you got all this at your fingertips.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah, they come in, they come gift wrapped, USDA certified tender. I like that. Steaks, juicy burgers, cozy and convenient comfort meals. And a lot more than that, David.

[David Spade]

Oh, yeah, there's way more than that, Dana. During their sizzle all the way sale, they tied that into Christmas. That says all the way. Yeah, you can get 50% off site wide at Omaha steaks.com plus our precious listeners get an extra 35 off with promo code fly.

[Dana Gould]

I'm gonna say that's a good thing. You've had some Omaha steaks, haven't you?

[David Spade]

Yeah, you're gonna see me in the kitchen. Maybe I'll take them out on the bbq, depending on whether, weather permitting.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah.

[David Spade]

And watch me. Hey, you know, I'm over there, like, how do you like them? You know, yelling, I once dated a.

[Dana Gould]

Woman named bbq, but good night.

[David Spade]

Oh, yeah, I've actually met her with you.

[Dana Gould]

Omaha Steaks. Actually, David, you may not believe this, but they're unrivaled in quality and variety and everybody's backed by their 100% guarantee.

[David Spade]

Yeah, it doesn't shock me. Right now is the perfect time to save on delicious gifts and holiday hosting favorites. Every steak is perfectly aged to maximize tenderness and handcut by master butchers. Master butchers in America's heartland, Omaha steaks.

[Dana Gould]

Has been America's original butcher culture since.

[David Spade]

1917, if I had to guess.

[Dana Gould]

Yes. And they also carry mouthwatering burgers, chicken, pork, seafood, and actually delectable desserts.

[David Spade]

Well, save on big gourmet gifts and more holiday favorites with Omaha Steaks. Save on big gourmet gifts and more holiday favorites with Omaha steaks. Visit Omaha steaks.com for 50 off site wide during their sizzle all the way sale. And for an extra $35 off, use promo code FLY at checkout terms apply. See site for details.

[Dana Gould]

That's Omaha Steaks.com code fly. Hey, David, when it comes to gifting, you know, I've learned there are two types of presents, okay. The ones that get returned and the ones that instantly become a favorite. Do you agree?

[David Spade]

Yeah, that's Jenny Bird. Jewelry definitely falls in the second category. These designs, as you know, are very modern. They're timeless, always feel special.

[Dana Gould]

Oh, well, isn't that special?

[David Spade]

That makes it my secret weapon when I want to give a gift that really, you know, lands. That's why Jenny Bird makes it easy. The packaging is beautiful. It's very thoughtful. The pieces are comfy enough to wear every day. Y and they ship fast. That's perfect if you're last minute shopper like me.

[Dana Gould]

That's right. I mean, I just want to do this when I hear that. Way to go, way to go. And because the styles are so versatile, they always make an outfit feel pulled together. David. Without trying too hard. David, not talking about you. Some of my wife's go tos are the best selling Florence earrings which I always get compliments. And the Remy Bengal lightweight, water resistant and just as good stacked as it is on its own. These are the gifts you'll actually want to keep.

[David Spade]

And you can get 20% off your first order with Jenny Bird by visiting jenny-bird.com and using code F OTW at checkout.

[Dana Gould]

So Chris, so I, I went into therapy with Conan's therapist. I piggybacked on his therapist at five. I was in it for five years. What, what, so you went through it intensely? Right? So what's the headline? What is, what's the takeaway for you? You know, mine was, is that I have a hard time taking care of myself. I'm always trying to help other people. That'd be one of them. You know, I bought a guitar for my nephew, a really nice guitar. And then I had a hard time buying myself a guitar and I have a lot of money and I said, God, I'm sick.

[Chris Rock]

So yeah, I mean, honestly, this apartment is probably the first real purchase I've made for myself in about 28 years.

[Dana Gould]

Right.

[Chris Rock]

Since I got that Corvette for SNL at SNL. Like, like life changing purchase. Like.

[Dana Gould]

And so what was that?

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, I know what you mean. Like, yeah, always doing for other people.

I don't know. I mean, what I've learned in therapy is like, you know, childhood trauma is like some real shit. And you got to, until you deal with all your childhood shit, not you just, you know, nothing's going to work out for you. You got to, you got to start at the beginning. It's like working on a script. Okay, page one.

[Dana Gould]

So when I met you, you were a young man, but.

Were you ever kind of like snarky and spoiled in high school? Because by the time I met you, you seemed kind of like this guy. At least in maturity. You weren't bitter, you weren't snarky, you were never in a group with comedians kind of shitting on some other comedian. So I noticed that attitude you had as a young man. But I guess the childhood stuff for me, it was like I had a lot of anger and it was in my stand up, it was in my characters. And once in A while I'd go off on any kind of authority figure that turned into my dad, but I got, you know, I got past that. But how did your anger express itself then, to you?

[Chris Rock]

I mean, here's the weird thing. It's when I was. I mean, my childhood, I was bullied, ridiculously. Half of it, the bullying, because I was just a little guy. And then I got bussed to school, so I got. I was a little guy and I was black.

[David Spade]

Right.

[Chris Rock]

It's hard. So it's like I'm getting double bullied. I would. If I was white, I would have probably got bullied too, but it was.

[David Spade]

Just, like, it was supposed to be tough, probably.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, it was pretty rough, right. And it was pretty, like, every day. So I. It's weird. I had a weird temper. I'm going to. It's going to be a weird thing. I was the oldest of seven, and.

And I was weirdly smaller than my younger brothers. So it was a weird thing where your brothers, like, hey, so and so down the block bothered me, and I'm like, I got to fucking go protect Andre or Tony, and I'm fucking smaller than that. As my shrink puts it to me. You've been scared to be angry ever since. So. So the guy you saw was bending over backwards to be nice. Because I was so scared of my ankle.

[David Spade]

Yeah, I see.

[Chris Rock]

Frightened of what? You know, my. My shrink. My good. The good shrink I got, you know, like the top. Top guy.

[Dana Gould]

There's good ones and bad ones.

[Chris Rock]

There's good ones and bad ones, you know, and he broke it down. It's like, because you're a nice guy and you're so, so scared of that thing coming out of you again.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

That you let the whole world walk all over your friends walk over you, your family walks over you. Your. Your. Your female relationships, like, everybody just you over. Because it's somewhere in there they know you. There's a force field holding you back.

[Dana Gould]

Interesting.

[Chris Rock]

I'm like the opposite of you in the sense that in the last year, now I can get angry.

[Dana Gould]

Right.

[Chris Rock]

I'm not scared. I'm not scared of letting people know how I feel about that.

[Dana Gould]

My therapy was about that too, though, because I was always the nice guy holding stuff in. And not really. My aggression, my competitiveness overrode the nice guy because people ask me, who meet me now. Well, did you just allow other cast members, like, oh, no, Lauren. Do their sketch? That kind of thing? There was a natural competition in me, but in my personal relationships, I hated confrontation because when Confrontation happened at my house. Bodies flew. My dad was just really violent, so. I mean, all my siblings are like that. We don't like confrontation.

[Chris Rock]

That goes to my house too. Wasn't violent per se, but it was loud as fuck.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

So.

[David Spade]

But those things stick with you. Just loud.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah. It just sticks with you. So now. Yeah. I can kind of. I can tell you I'm. Hey, I didn't like what you said to me or I didn't like what you. Without losing my head, without hitting anybody.

[Dana Gould]

Well, that's. That's a home run for therapy. Let me ask you a question. So this apartment, I can't see much of it. So it was a mental leap for you to buy this for yourself?

[Chris Rock]

It. Yes.

[Dana Gould]

Because you're all. You were frugal too, in a way. Right. You're always you. You wouldn't be the guy I would spit spender the hill.

[Chris Rock]

I would say your best manager or agent is a low monthly nut. That is like, right. You.

[Dana Gould]

You don't want to be doing the. The fifth lead on.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah. If you can keep a low monthly nut, chances are your career will be.

[David Spade]

Make good choices.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Chris Rock]

You don't have to say, yeah. There's meetings you don't even have to take.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah.

[David Spade]

Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

When the cameo guy calls you up, you don't return.

[Dana Gould]

They call it you money in the 80s and I guess that's kind of what it is like. Or now it's just, no, thank you. No, thank you. Yeah, yeah.

[Chris Rock]

No, thank you. Yeah.

[David Spade]

When you said you were married and you go.

I think it's from Iraq that. Are you scared she's going to take 50%? You go 50, it's 80. Now.

You don't buy yourself much, but when you're married.

[Dana Gould]

Chris, didn't we have that conversation at the 40th backstage?

[Chris Rock]

What do we have?

[Dana Gould]

I thought there's so much there. You told me about the divorce and you said, well, it's half. And you know, I just mentioned that other people I'd known in the business and they go, well, it's half of, you know, community property. And then the alimony adds up to more like 60. 70%.

[Chris Rock]

It's about 70. Yeah.

[Dana Gould]

Okay, 70%, which is fair.

I'm kidding. That's insane.

[Chris Rock]

I always say my ex wife has made more money off of comedy than Robert Townsend.

[Dana Gould]

She also said once, I'm the only.

[David Spade]

Comedian that has to drive a cab at night.

[Chris Rock]

I'm gonna change that to Uber.

[David Spade]

Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

Updating my app.

[David Spade]

This time of year. Cozy. Feels like the ultimate luxury. And Bombas is making it easy to get there. From socks to slippers to tees, every piece is designed to make you feel instantly at home. I gotta say, there's something almost magical about the fresh Bomba socks. And it doesn't stop there. Their slippers have the perfect sink and cushioning. Their tees feel substantial and comforting. And all of it keeps that cozy feeling going day after day. I got the socks right here. Actually.

[Dana Gould]

Gift giving David has never been simpler. Either running socks for the marathon or soft and snug baby socks for the tiniest toes. Slippers or tees for literally anyone on your list. Even your mom's new ski lodge friend. Bombas has something for every foot, every style, every occasion.

[David Spade]

And here's the part I love most. For every item you buy, Bombas donates one to someone facing homelessness. So when you treat yourself or someone else to cozy, you're spreading that warmth far beyond your own home. Head over to bombas.com flywall and use code flywall for 20% off your first purchase. That's B O M b-s.com flywall code flywall at checkout.

[DSW Announcer]

Holiday PSA from DSW. This is your reminder that shoes are a gift, literally. So unwrap something good, like boots that inspire your next big adventure. Or cozy slippers that give you an excuse to stay in. Or sneakers that feel like pure joy. Because shoes aren't just shoes, they're exactly what you wanted. Let us surprise you so you can surprise them. Find shoes that get you and everyone one on your lips at prices that get your budget. At DSW stores or dsw.comtiktok for business.

[David Spade]

Is helping owners like you reach new customers every day.

[Willow Boutique Owner]

We saw up to a 10x return on our TikTok shop ads. A few years ago, I started sharing my love for fashion on social media and Willow Boutique was born. We're not just a place to shop. We've really become a community. TikTok allows us to find more people to have that great experience. I cannot imagine my business without TikTok. It's completely changed my life and I could not be happier.

[Dana Gould]

Head over to get started.TikTok.com TikTokapps.

What kind of choices are you making now as far as girlfriends and stuff or dating or like, how are you? And just therapies informing all of that. And I think women generally do like when someone's straightforward, you know.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, I mean, I don't know how. I'm just not as desperate as I've been In the past.

[Dana Gould]

Okay.

[Chris Rock]

You know, just, you know, I mean, like, it's not like that thing where it's like, oh, my God, I can't believe someone's paying attention to me. And then, you know.

[Dana Gould]

Right, right.

[Chris Rock]

And then you're in this weird, lopsided thing where you both. You both have one thing in common. You adore her.

[Dana Gould]

Okay, here's a quote I want you guys both to comment on.

[Chris Rock]

Worship her.

[Dana Gould]

This quote. Just comment on it.

[David Spade]

Okay.

[Dana Gould]

Whether it's true or not, men want to be admired and women want to be loved by a man they admire.

[David Spade]

It's pretty accurate, I guess.

[Chris Rock]

Yes. I mean, I don't. Men want to be admired by who?

[Dana Gould]

The woman?

[Chris Rock]

Well, that's when I make.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah, yeah.

[Chris Rock]

I mean, like, when I make the special or whatever. The only thing people I care about is, like, you guys, right?

[Dana Gould]

I'm so. Comedians.

[Chris Rock]

Not even comedians, just comedians. I think they're funny.

[David Spade]

Yeah, I know what you mean. Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

The rest I can.

[Dana Gould]

And we know. We. We're in the tribe. We know what? Like, when we see you on stage. Well, I always love how you have the cord and the way you move and you're all dressed up and you look great. The crowd's going crazy and you're just hammering it. I know what work went into that. I'm like, fuck. You know? And then to throw it all away and just be connected to it. Like, I was really curious about this particular line. You had these anthems, and one was a man's only as faithful as his options, which, it seems like it was just hanging around, but it became quotable with my friends. It's what? Not whether it's absolutely true, but it's just a very funny, astute observation.

[David Spade]

Pretty true.

[Chris Rock]

Came up with it, I think, like, one of my uncles said it to me.

[Dana Gould]

Well, that's. That's. That's coming up.

[Chris Rock]

Shoved it in a joke.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah, but that's coming up with it, you know, noticing it and I think. And use that.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, yeah. But, yeah, that one follows me everywhere.

[Dana Gould]

Really. Oh, good.

[Chris Rock]

Good and bad, you know?

[Dana Gould]

Oh, it's like everybody a little too close with for.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, it's like any girl you date, it's like the man's only as faithful as his options.

[David Spade]

You know, they're like, sir, are you out of options? You're like, well, yeah.

[Chris Rock]

I mean, hey, painted yourself in the corner.

[Dana Gould]

I had Will. Isn't that special? I can't get away from it. No, I'm kidding.

Rock.

[David Spade]

What are the three top things that people.

On the street know you for.

[Chris Rock]

They know me for. I mean.

It'S weird. It's like. Especially because of YouTube.

[David Spade]

Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

They don't even know whole specials. They just know jokes about this or that. You know what I mean?

[Dana Gould]

Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

Like. Like specials end up becoming mixed together on some level.

[David Spade]

Sure. They don't. So they just go, that joke. You told this joke.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

There's a lot of Madagascar too. I was on. I did a lot of Oprah Winfrey when. After Bring the Pain.

[Dana Gould]

I remember.

[Chris Rock]

So there's a certain amount you'd be amazed at the housewives that are the. You know, that are into that. Know what? I do. But I mean, it's not SNL anymore. It's more movies here or there. It's. I don't know. I'm like. I'm like, I don't know. It's like, remember we were kids and you just see. I don't know. I'm trying to think certain people were just famous and you couldn't even figure out why.

[David Spade]

Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

Like, why is Charo.

[David Spade]

You know what was hard for me.

[Dana Gould]

To realize when people.

[David Spade]

You're like, were recognizing me. I thought, oh, it was so great. Until I heard one people, one person say, oh, I know that guy. He sucks. And I'm like, oh, it doesn't mean they like me. It just means they know who I am.

[Chris Rock]

They just know you. I mean, I'll tell you this. That Grown ups is fun.

[David Spade]

Yeah. Grow ups is a big one. You're right. You're right.

[Chris Rock]

Any young person like, God, grown ups.

[David Spade]

We're keeping the lights on at tbs, I'll tell you, because it's on like.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, cbs, heavy rotations. Grown ups. Literally all the time.

[David Spade]

One and two. You know what question I got which you guys would might not like, in my last interview, they go, when were you the most famous? And I thought, I know what he means. And I said, the real answer is right now. Because everything's accumulation. And then they've.

[Dana Gould]

Well, there's fame and then there's heat. There's. There's hot. Where the exact. So I could tell you when I was hot.

[Chris Rock]

But, yeah, I'm more famous than I've ever been. But in around is. Me and Chappelle always joke about it. I always go, yeah, back when I was Drake, that's.

[Dana Gould]

That's like, yeah, drink. Drink them up. 2000, two, four.

[Chris Rock]

I was Drake. You know, whatever. From 96 to about 2000.

[Dana Gould]

It's like the third or fourth special in a row.

[Chris Rock]

It was like four specials. In a row. It was very Drake like. Yeah, yeah. There's no Million Dollar Nights now. But there were those.

[Dana Gould]

Are you. Well, Bill Burr, I don't know. What are these? What does he get?

[Chris Rock]

No, no, no, no. Bill Burr, please. Yeah.

[Dana Gould]

If you could do Madison Square Garden.

[Chris Rock]

You do an arenas. You know, Sebastian does two. Sebastian does two shows a night at arenas.

[David Spade]

Yeah. Unreal. It's unreal. Yeah.

[Dana Gould]

I loved it. That guy really stood out for me. I mean, in the last five years, as just five funnier.

[Chris Rock]

You especially, you go watch him at the store. You can't not laugh.

[David Spade]

Oh, I, I, I was in the back of the store and just going, oh, my God, who the is this guy? It was. And then I come in. The next time I saw his name, I go in and watch where. The funny thing now to me is when people were playing, like, Madison Square Garden, like, I think you've played it, Chris. There's these big places you hear of, like in Boston, TD Gardens, whatever it's called. There's so many big ones. The Forum, it used to be reserved for, like, Eddie Murphy, maybe, and maybe someone else. And now when you hear people that aren't even household names to me, and you go, this guy's playing this, you go, whoa, this is a whole new world where through a podcast or through YouTube or through their specials, where is a little under the radar, but they have a crowd that comes out. It's, it's, it's pretty unbelievable.

[Dana Gould]

I think the exposure and social media and everything else, they become friends with you. So it's kind of like your friend. Nobody is playing Madison Square Garden, you know.

[David Spade]

Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

And also, I think there's more. I know in Europe and around the world, they always respected stand up as a high art, but in America, the standups are becoming the real artists. Because.

In music, music's become a, A producer's medium.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

So it's, there's not a lot of singer, songwriter. There's not a lot of. No one gives a fuck about liner notes anymore. So the people that actually think are the comedians, you know what I mean? Like, so there's kind of a.

[David Spade]

Because you write your own stuff, which is hard to do.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, it's like, you know, hey, I love Rihanna. Tom Segura is a better artist, you know, I mean, writes all that. He writes all of his stuff. You know, Rihanna's great. She's amazing. You know, but, you know, in the, in the tradition, the nerdy tradition of coming up with your own stuff, would.

[David Spade]

You rather date Rihanna or Tom Segura, be honest.

[Chris Rock]

I would rather date Rihanna.

[David Spade]

Tom Segura is a great example of someone that does. I won't say numbers, but he does a podcast. And then I ran into him and he goes, we do these live ones. So he makes a shitload off his regular podcast and then it's a live one. And it's crazy. Where I go, you do not make that a three hour podcast. He's like, yeah. And then he goes, next one we did. It doubled.

[Dana Gould]

I was like, I. I don't know. Yeah, I. He's. His podcast is great. And that's an example of that. Where I often thought when the web first came out, why couldn't I. Could I get a million people to pay me a dollar a month and I'll just go ape shit on YouTube. And that's starting to happen a little bit where someone. I don't. I don't know Tom's numbers, but I would guess if he charges 10 bucks and he gets 50,000 people on his live YouTube little podcast, he's making a half million.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, I mean, you gotta understand too, like, I wanna get too technical. Humans need people to talk, right? So whatever. 100 years ago, 50 years ago, philosophers used to be famous. There's no more philosophers. People used to be religious and went to a church every week. No one goes to church anymore. So the only place people actually can hear people say their thoughts is through stand up.

[Dana Gould]

It's really hard.

[Chris Rock]

The last of the speakers and you know, I mean the last of the thinkers.

[David Spade]

Some of these preachers, by the way, are similar. They walk the stage. They're talking, they're rallying people, they're talking to. Everyone's into it.

[Chris Rock]

When I'm writing, I watch preachers just as much as I watch stand ups.

[Dana Gould]

Really interesting.

[David Spade]

You come off a little bit like that.

[Dana Gould]

You work the stage.

[David Spade]

You're like a panther.

[Chris Rock]

Well, my grandfather was a preacher. My great grandpa, like all preachers in my, in my family line, well, you.

[David Spade]

See, they're performers at what works. It works for them. They're loud. They give it to them.

[Chris Rock]

They find a premise, they milk it.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah, I would. When my. My two sons were doing stand up and they had the main problem. So I was around open micros a lot and the main thing was lack of clarity in the setup. So I actually put you on one of your special. I said, look at this guy's language. This clarity of really digging into the premise that everyone knows where he is. And then he drops the hammer. So you know that that makes Sense to me. And obviously Sam Kenison was a preacher. You could really see that, you know.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, one of the best.

[Dana Gould]

The hardest guy to follow. I followed him once.

[Chris Rock]

The artist gotta follow ever.

[Dana Gould]

I auditioned for Saturday Night Live and followed him as an unknown in 84 at the Comedy Store with no MC in between, Sam levitates the room. And now Dana Clarko.

Death.

[David Spade]

Death.

[Dana Gould]

I had no way out. There was nowhere to go, man.

So, Chris, as far as just fun as stand up, how much do you. What size room and what's the situation like for me in a small room where I've got a notepad and I have some bits and I'm trying out new stuff that is the most pure fun for me as far as stand up.

[Chris Rock]

I mean, it's weird. I'm. I start next week or the week after I go to. I'm not going to say where because I don't know when this is airing, but I'm playing a club three years, 10 nights in a row in the middle of America, doing two shows a night.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah, yeah.

[Chris Rock]

Trying to get it. Trying to get an act together so I can go on tour next year.

That is fun. Once you get enough bits that are.

[Dana Gould]

Working, I mean, isn't the greatest feeling a new bit?

[David Spade]

That's unreal.

[Dana Gould]

Coming together.

[Chris Rock]

Time is early in a tour. You've been on stage about 45 minutes, you're killing and you know, and I just feel the audience is like, oh, you motherfuckers ain't heard shit yet.

[Dana Gould]

You're loaded up, you're all, you're.

[Chris Rock]

Oh, you guys think you just heard a great joke. Wait till you hear this.

[David Spade]

And your closure's coming up.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah.

[Dana Gould]

Have you ever wrote a bit, Chris, where it came together so perfectly that you thought, man, I don't know if I can write something that good again. I mean, or equal to it. You know, I'll say this, this bit.

[Chris Rock]

When my daughter Lola was born, the doctor hands me my child and literally out of my mouth, I'm like, gotta keep her off the pole. It just came out of my.

[Dana Gould]

Say that again.

[Chris Rock]

I was like, I gotta keep her off the pole.

[Dana Gould]

Oh, that's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[David Spade]

Stripper.

[Chris Rock]

And it's like one of the best, One of the best bits I ever came up with. It was like, should I just get women pregnant to come up with me?

[David Spade]

Yeah, it's fun. It's like a song. I'm sure you ask any song. You know, people, sometimes they're one hit wonders, but there's one hit wonders where I go, this is such a perfect song. Like, everything about it is working. Everything. And you go, and you don't want to be that as a comedian. So there's only a few things when you get older that still get me going. It's like there's a few tiny things in life, and one is coming up with new ideas just. Or saying something fast. In real life, you're like, I am. Thank God my brain still works, because that's fun. And when you still like to do stand up or still like to write jokes, I'm happy because I know some people that are burned out on showbiz are burned on that, and they just don't like it anymore, but they go through the motions. Or a comic that travels with the same hour for about 20 years, which they used to a lot. Same act, same every year. You'd see them, they come around to your city, and I'm like, they didn't change anything, but it was okay. Now it's fun to. To write and see if you could scrape together another hour. That's good.

[Dana Gould]

But isn't that. Sometimes I would say I'm embittered by it, but I'm like, envious. And I'll just say, the Rolling Stones. I'm just envious of people, of. But we. We have to create new material, and rock stars can just do their job.

[David Spade]

We don't even want them to.

[Dana Gould]

And I. I really believe the Stones are better than they ever been because I think really winding down on a song over decades where you just know it so well. And Jagger never stops working. I mean, he. You know, and he can. He's. His voice is exactly where it needs to be at almost 80, but with stand up. You like, I can't. Okay. Got to start. Fuck. A whole new hour. I mean, it's like.

[Chris Rock]

Yeah, it's. It's. And it doesn't get any easier. I'm sitting here right now. I'm like, okay, I got. I literally have shows. And next. And less than two weeks, I have fucking show.

[Dana Gould]

Well, there's two. There's two things going on. There's. There's Chris Rock, unknown, surprising the audience. Now the expectation is.

You know, when they. When they introduce you to make sure they don't go over the top with it. Because I've. I've been dropping at mics, ladies and gentlemen, you know, this guy's gonna bring it. You're gonna really, you know, what's your. What. What do you want the MC to do for you in the club? He's Trying out stuff. What do you want him to say?

[Chris Rock]

I just. Just say my name. No credits.

[Dana Gould]

Just don't hype it up, you know.

[Chris Rock]

I mean, it's weird because it's like.

[Dana Gould]

You can't get away from being Chris Rock.

[Chris Rock]

You can't get away from being who you are. And by the way, you can't get away from being who you are to the guy intro introducing you.

[Dana Gould]

Right.

[David Spade]

You know?

[Dana Gould]

Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

Because that guy's a comedian and he. This is what he's.

[Dana Gould]

I met Joe. I met Joe Coy once, 10 years ago with Lovett's, or maybe it was 12. And he started tearing up just meeting me. Yeah, he started wise.

[David Spade]

We're watering.

[Dana Gould]

Go, Joe. It's okay. He's huge now. But there is that expectation. And you try to remember the way they see you, you know, the way you would see someone above the food chain when you were starting. It's interesting. Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

So I forget who used to say, somebody said at their first Letterman, they sat down and it was like talking to a five dollar bill.

[Dana Gould]

Because you can't. Yeah, you can't. Letterman. Letterman was so intimidating to me that the last few years, I. I would just get on my heels. I'd be in the wings and I'd see him. The last thing I'd say when they'd introduced my name, don't give this show too much respect. Like, pretend it's Bakersfield today. Just to get past the intimidation of David Letterman. There was something about New York, that theater in him.

[David Spade]

And I didn't know he was intimidated by Biff. Biff was standing Biff, you know what I mean? And he was like looking out and he's like, 30 seconds. I'm like, biff, I gotta go out there. And he's so casual. And I'm like, all right, I gotta get his level. Yeah.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

I couldn't believe Biff wasn't an actor.

[Dana Gould]

Yeah.

[Chris Rock]

Oh, yeah.

[David Spade]

Because he was on the show.

[Dana Gould]

He's the last thing you see.

[Chris Rock]

He actually was. And they make him work.

[Dana Gould]

He really wanted affirmation from Biff.

Biff, you all right? Oh, cool.

[Chris Rock]

I was like, biff. You know, there was a time Biff was more famous than me. It was like, yeah, where's your dressing room, Biff?

[David Spade]

Hey, guys. If you're loving this podcast, which you are, be sure to click follow on your favorite podcast app, give us review five star rating and maybe even share an episode that you've loved with a friend.

[Dana Gould]

If you're watching this episode on YouTube, please subscribe.

[David Spade]

Fly on the Wall is presented by Odyssey, an executive produced by Danny Carvey and David Spade, Heather Santoro and Greg Holtzman, Maddie Sprung Kaiser and Leah Reese Dennis of Odyssey.

[Dana Gould]

Our senior producer is Greg Holtzman and the show is produced and edited by Phil Sweet.

[David Spade]

Tech booking by Cultivated Entertainment.

[Dana Gould]

Special thanks to Patrick Fogarty, Evan Cox, Maura Curran, Melissa Wester, Hillary Schuff, Eric Donnelly, Colin Gaynor, Sean Cherry, Kirk Courtney and Lauren Vieira.

[David Spade]

Reach out with us. Any questions be asked and answered on the show? You can email [e-mail] that's a U-A C-Y dot com.