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Football Weekly
A Dier finish for Manchester City in Monaco and a Premier League preview: Football Weekly Extra
00:50:29
Max Rushden is joined by Barry Glendenning, Lars Sivertsen and Mark Langdon, as Monaco score a late penalty against City in Europe and there are straightforward wins for Arsenal and Newcastle
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- [00:00]
A
This is the Guardian. Not all journalism is the same. Take the Guardian. Our coverage has something unique. Fierce independence. Nobody owns us or tells us what we can and can't say, so we're free to report the whole picture. We connect what's happening in Washington to the rest of the globe, expose corruption wherever we find it, and give fresh perspective on everything from wellness and soccer to culture, the climate and more. Read, watch and listen to the Guardian for free@theguardian.com.
- [00:48]
B
Hello and welcome to Guardian Football Weekly. Everyone now knows that Eric Dyer plays for Monaco. A stray Nico Gonzalez boot meant the former spurs centre back could reprise his England Columbia moment and slot home from the spot to deny City the win they should have really got. Arsenal are pretty comfortable winners over Olympiacos and Newcastle are very comfortable winners at Union St. Giloise. PSG win late in Barcelona. There's that high line again. Other things we already knew, like Yamin Lemal is a lot of fun and Nuno Mendes is too. The best of the rest sees Rasmus Hojlund looking like an elite centre forward. It's just incredible how many players get good when they leave Old Trafford. We'll look ahead to a Premier League weekend, including Chelsea, Liverpool and good at set pieces. Arsenal vs bad at defending set pieces. West Ham. We have confirmation of a raft of Turkish listeners will answer your questions. And that's today's Guardian Football Weekly. On the panel today, Barry Glendenning. Hello.
- [01:40]
C
Hi, Max.
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B
From the Racing Post. Mark Langdon joins us. Welcome, Mark.
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D
Hi, Max.
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B
And hello, Lyle Sivertson.
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E
Hello, Max.
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B
Let's start then with Monaco 2, Manchester City 2. I like the start of Will Unwin's match report, Barry. It had been a subdued night in Monaco with Manchester City sleepwalking to victory until Nico Gonzalez kicked Eric Dyer in the face in a failed attempt to defend a free kick. It's quite an accurate reflection, I think. I mean, there's a bit of controversy. Not everyone thinks that's a penalty, but it was quite the moment.
- [02:09]
C
Yeah, I don't see how it could be anything other than a penalty and I'm surprised there was controversy. Pep Guardiola seems to have been quite miffed about it, but Erling Haaland, when asked after the game what he thought, said, I didn't see what happened, but I suppose if you kick someone in the face, it's probably a penalty. I'd be a subscriber to that view of Earlings. Yeah, I don't think you can have any complaints. I think I knew Eric Dyer had gone to Monaco, but Had forgotten and then was surprised to see him. But he took his penalty very well, I suppose. Yes. Manchester City were asleep, walking to victory. They didn't play especially well against the team. I think we all probably thought they'd beat fairly comfortably. Phil Foden was probably the standout performer for them. Well, him and Haaland. I thought Haaland's second goal, the header, was terrific. Foden's return to form is. Is something for Manchester City fans to be cheerful about on a night when otherwise they didn't have a huge amount to be cheerful about.
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B
Yeah, I suppose on the penalty, Lars, the counter argument is Mecca. There's not a huge amount of contact. I don't know how much there needs to be, if any. And is it that actually Eric Dyer fouls Nico Gonzalez by heading his foot, or is that not a legitimate thing? Okay, fine, Absolutely.
- [03:36]
E
I feel like Erling Holland has stolen my lines here because I was basically going to say, well, if you kick someone in the head, there's always a chance the referee is going to give a foul. Like, I think we had a comment from a listener who asked, like, are overhead kicks now banned? Which I think. I think maybe that's a slightly more interesting place to go in it. I know in this case it was a defender trying to clear, not an attacker, but it does arise a question because of one of the goals Juventus scored. I don't know if we'll probably get to that game. There are similarities, like in terms of where the boot is versus proximity to opposing head. So I think there's a question to be asked about where that leaves overhead kicks in the crowded field. And I guess very often it leaves them being given as fouls. We can all just agree if you're a defender and an opponent is going for a header, don't go with your foot. There's very little upside to that maneuver. It doesn't make it any sense. And it was really good stuff by Eric Dyer, actually.
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B
Yeah, and it did. Just watching him score a penalty, Mark, made me think of England, Columbia. And then I watched that BBC montage, one of the best montages after the game, you know, in 2018, where it just showed all the penalty misses and all the sadness and then Dyer scoring and then Bobby Robson dancing and Butcher and Waddle doing that. Anyway, I mean, it's not a question to you, Mark. I just really enjoyed it, I suspect. Back to this game and we should talk about Haaland, right, Because as Barry said, the header is brilliant because he's got to generate so much pace. And the first one is just one of those. His legs are so long. And another one of those conversations, about seven touches in a half and two of them are goals.
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D
Yes. He doesn't get involved in the build up. And I think that Pep Guardio has learned to live with that and is trying different ways to kind of, you know, reinvent maybe what he wants to do on the pitch to suit Haaland as well at times. And why would you not try to play to. To Harland's strengths when you've got somebody as good as they've got up front? You know, I think we have seen them, even in the recent weeks since Donnarum has come in, go longer and try to hit Haaland quicker and to be more direct at times. And we do take it for granted just how many goals he scores, just because it's become the sort of the norm, much like how it was for Cristiano Ronaldo and for Messi when they were sort of scoring two and threes most weeks. But the header particularly is sensational. I mean, he was up against three former Premier League defenders. The Monaco back three, Salisu, Eric Dyer and Kayra, who was at West Ham briefly. So he would have. He was up against familiar foes and probably not the biggest surprise that he managed to come out on top on that individual battle. But I think for City, so sloppy at times, this was exactly the same thing that happened against Brighton when they were in complete control, didn't go for the sort of the killer goal that would have put them to a head, felt they could just see it out and gave away a stupid penalty. And once again, just. I think there is something there for City about them just feeling they can see games out rather than play to what I still think is their biggest strength, which is in the final third. And Harland. So I think they would have been better trying to get the. The third goal rather than sort of sit on that two one.
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B
Yeah. And Barry, every time you don't win a game or you sort of show fallibility, it just means that air of invincibility that they no longer have. More and more teams think actually that this isn't, you know, they're just another team.
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C
I don't think anyone's going to think that as long as they have Haaland playing, as long as they're the players they do, and as long as Pep's in charge. Although it did almost get to that stage, or maybe it did get to that stage last season when they had that massive Wobble. But I think it would be very naive to think of them as just another team. I mean, they hit the post or the bar twice last night and not, not shots that skimmed the bar, like spanked off the bar. So on another day they could have won one comfortably. But again, I'm getting bored listening to myself saying this. These results at this early stage of the Champions League don't. They don't really matter. It's not a bad performance or a very workman like performance is obviously cause for concern, but the draw, they've got, what, four points from two games? That's fine. It's not a problem.
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D
I am one of them people that shouts at Barry when I'm listening to.
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B
Great, well, shout him. It shouted him.
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D
Now just says every Champions League game, the result doesn't matter. And eventually it must matter because not all of us can qualify.
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C
Eventually, at some point they will matter, but at the moment I don't think they do.
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D
These points, you know, add up as, as you go along and I, I.
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C
Am aware of how this league system works.
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D
Thank you, Barry. Yeah, we're three points for a win, one for a draw. Because PSG won it from, you know, way back last season. There's this belief that, oh, you can, as long as you finish in the top 24, like, it doesn't matter. But PSG got breaths in the sort in that playoff draw. Real Madrid got Manchester City and one of them teams went out and PSG then had the kind you then had to play Liverpool. So they, they won on penalties, but they could quite easily have lost that game on penalties. And people would have been saying that PSG are bottlers and, you know, there's loads. Luis Enrique might even be in charge, you know, that that's how kind of fine a line and fine margins you get in football. I think you have to give yourself the best opportunity, you know, to qualify in the top eight initially. And you know it's going to be a bum fight for those, those top eight spots because there's a lot of teams that will feel like, oh, well, that draw doesn't matter. You know, we can just finish in the top eight. And we saw last year that they didn't you buy Munich, Real Madrid, Man, City, PSG all finished outside the top eight. Bayern Munich nearly, nearly went to Celtic as well. So I think you want those, those two matches off and I think you, you really want to finish in the top eight and, you know, drop in sloppy points. It could be costly in about.
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C
Would the counter argument to that not be that Liverpool finished top of the league last season, only dropped what was three points and ended up going out to the eventual winners in the last 16.
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D
Yeah, but the, the counter, counter argument to that is that most of the other teams that. So Arsenal finished very well in the league. I can't remember the exact, the exact fees, but Barcelona was semi finalists. Inter had done very well in the league. They were semi finalists. So I think PSG were the kind of anomaly from that. And on the other side of that, where Liverpool were really unlucky, but most of the teams that finished high up in the league phase were then able to benefit from that. It was just that the ones that won did come from way back. So I'm not saying that they. I'm not saying it's desperately important, but I think there is more importance maybe than Barry thinks I would say.
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B
Yeah, what a polite row this is. And I suppose another thing, Lars, is actually, if you get, if you win the first, how many points do you need? 11 or 16? I kind of. You win the first five, then you can rest. Players, you know, there is this whole thing about fatigue. So, you know, I don't yell at Barry. You know, long term it's important for us to have a good working relationship, I suppose. But I don't know, where do you stand on the furious Glendenning Langdon debate?
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E
You know, I'm really enjoying this because I'm getting early World cup vibes. This reminds me of the discussion we have at every single international tournament when we're looking at permutations for the last round of the group stage and we're thinking, ah, if they finish there, they play. Then if they. The point that's always made is that you will eventually have to play good teams if you want to win it. And I guess this is true about the Champions League, but I am probably a believer in the idea that playing fewer good teams is more advantageous. If you can get a good draw for as long as possible, that it will help you go further. England fans would agree with that. I think I am kind of slightly on the Langdon side of this divide of actually finishing high in the league phase is quite a good idea. And at the risk of being a complete sycophant here, I'm going to give the moderator points here because I think, Max, I think your point about wrestling players is a very good one. I think it's an issue of the schedule, as we keep hearing all the time, is really punishing. So if you can have an early sort of, you get Four wins on the board in this group stage, so you can just kind of cruise for the rest of it and just pick a reserve side for a couple of these games. I think that's very helpful in terms of squad planning. So I do think it does matter a little bit.
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B
Sadly, the moderator can get no points in such a court, but I appreciate the sentiment. Arsenal 2 Olympiacos nil. Perhaps not a straightforward Barry for Arsenal as. As the score suggests they had to. You know, Olympiacos had a few chances, but I suppose unlike City, it was a game they sleepwalked into winning and won.
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C
Yeah, I would say Martin Odegaard was not sleepwalking. He was outstanding in this game from start to finish. He was really, really good.
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B
Yes, good point.
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C
Good as I've seen him in a while. So he's clearly shaken off that shoulder injury which I was worried about. Actually, I thought that might be one that would just bother him incessantly until he was forced to have surgery or something. But he seems to be okay to have made a full recovery. He was so good. He was instrumental in setting up both goals. He created two good chances that weren't converted. He should have scored but was denied by an excellent save by the Olympiacos keeper. I would say it was fairly straightforward for them, but David Ray didn't have a huge amount to do, but he made one terrific save from Daniel Podence mean either. Victor Gakker had an interesting game. I guess he didn't score. He was very unlucky not to score the goal Martinelli ended up the opener that Martinelli ended up tipping over the line when his effort hit the post. Yeah, he looks kind of out of place in that Arsenal team. I'm not saying he is out of place. He just looks. He sticks out like a sore thumb. Not necessarily in a bad way. I presume the goals will come from at some stage. But the. The goal he didn't score where he just barged through two defenders onto a through ball from Odegaard and then got his shot away. Was it hit the keeper and was diverted onto the post. Martinelli finished it off for him. But I think Arsenal need a player like that.
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D
Yeah.
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B
Are you saying sort of amidst all this sleek grace, he's a bit of rough?
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C
Yeah, yeah. Dirty bit of rough.
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B
Just.
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E
I mean, it's funny because he looks so clean, you know, he's a very tidy guy. But. No, but that was always going to be. So it's going to be a little funny if you add a sort of almost. Almost like a battering ram. Number nine I mean, he's not. He's not Paul Warhurst, Wallhurst, anything up there, but he is like someone who's quite a direct, you know, hard running center forward to a team that for so long have played with almost various iterations of a false nine. I mean, the guy who's played up front for Arsenal under Arteta the last few years is. I mean, the identity has changed, but it's usually been someone who wanders, someone who comes short. They used to have it coming, you know, come. If you bring Havertz back in there, he's going to come short more and link up with the midfielders more, and he's going to look more like he fits into that. But I actually think the fact that he's a little different is what I like about him at Arsenal because he adds a completely different dimension. Now, it might take a little bit of time for the players around him to get used to that, and it might take a little bit of time for them to spot all those runs. But I actually think that the fact that he sticks out is. Could in the long term be a bit of an advantage.
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B
And I suppose, you know, look at the debt they did have to bring on some of their A listers. I mean, it's hard to decipher, such as their squad depth Mark, but, you know, to start with a good team and have Rice, Saka, Eze, Timber, Calafiori, Mosquera and Wanieri on the bench is quite something.
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D
They have got a squad that should be able to compete on every front now, and it'd probably be a benefit to Arteta. You know, they can have strong domestic cup runs as well. Just to make sure that everybody feels part of it. That could be a slight issue. You. You sort of went through that bench there. There'll be a lot of players that feel like they. They're starters and that, you know, you know, he's calling them finishers, but you know, that essentially they're substitutes. And while you can share around the minutes, people want to play in. In the big game. So he. It's a. It's a different approach to, you know, Arteta came through under Pep Guardiola, who is the opposite and says that, you know, he wants to work with a small squad. I think as long as you're winning, everything is okay. And the second that you don't, you know, people start questioning why is this player not playing? Why is that player not not starting? And it can become a slight problem, but just wanted to shout out that raya save because 1 nil if it goes 1 or who knows how that game turns out. It was fantastic. And do you remember when he first arrived that there were a lot of people really angry that, you know, Aaron Ramsdale was about to be displaced as Arsenal's number one. And you look at kind of where Ramsdale's career has gone since and what Ray is doing at Arsenal. And that I think shows that Arteta is capable of making really big decisions. And you know, he, he obviously wants a lot of players and competition for places. It just can be a problem, I think, if you're not winning because everybody then starts to question whether you've got the right starting 11.
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B
Thanks to Chris for pointing out that Mikel Arteta is going to hire some RAF pilots to talk to the squad. He was talk barriot something. I'm sure you went to the lead better live better summit 2025 maybe you're the. You might be the keynote speaker. He was chatting alongside legendary basketball coach Steve Kerr and he said he was asked about leadership and he said, the British fighter planes. I will get in touch with those guys how they communicate because that is life or death. I'm sure they don't use 20 phrases or 20 words. If there is one word, don't say nah, the wind is coming this way now you have to turn left because boom. Dead. So it'll be one word. I suppose you have to think of ways to get to. I mean, it's easy to mock, isn't it?
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D
Well, are they always outside of their technical area as well?
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B
I don't know. It is easy to mock. I'm trying to think. Can you put me mount of defense for bringing in fighter pilots to say this, this is good.
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E
I feel contractually obliged to point out that that is something Buller glimpsed. They have a former fighter pilot doing mental coaching with the team. Anyone who's read any long read about Bodeglint in the last four years will tell you this. It's. Yeah, it has to be a part of all of those articles and it is indeed part of all those articles. But it is stuff that seems to be working for them. I think that's.
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C
I think instead of player names on the back of Arsenal shirts, they should have call signs like Maverick and Goose and Iceman and Biggles.
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B
Who gets Biggles?
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C
Yeah, that would be Declan Wright or actually Gayokra is his hair. He's got quite raffish wing commanderish hairstyle, doesn't he?
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B
Yeah, that is true.
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C
If he could grow a moustache and he could be Biggles.
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B
Look, they are good and they're defensively very good. And good defenses win things. They could easily win something this year. And then, you know, they may mock us because we do not bring a fighter pilot in before the pod to get us in the mood.
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E
Maybe we should.
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C
Maybe we should.
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B
Yeah. Yeah. Well, I don't know. We don't want people. We want people wasting words. It fills up time. It's good for us. What we don't need is one word answers. Union. Saint Gerwoise nil. Newcastle United four. I mean Newcastle won this very comfortably, Mark. I mean it's good. I guess the most important thing is they scored some goals because they've been pretty goal shy recently.
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D
Probably an easier game than it could have been. Because Union after, you know, can't play their European games at home. So they were playing Anderlecht. So maybe home advantage was negated there. But I liked sort of the way that Newcastle attacked in the game. And it was the first time that Volta, Mardi, Elanga and Gordon had started together. And you could see the idea behind it because if you defend high to negate the threat of Voltimar in the air then the wingers can run in behind. And then if you drop deep you can put crosses into, you know, a giant forward. So I think those combinations started to really look slick. And that hasn't always been the case so far from Newcastle. And you know, in midfield they're as strong as ever. I thought Tonali was exceptional. The way that he sort of drives the team forward and a really good way to respond to what would have been disappointing way to lose that Premier League game on Sunday. And as I was speaking Santa Barry earlier, you know these points are important and yeah, I think it was a big win for Newcastle having lost on match day one.
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B
Yeah. Three goals in four starts for Volta. Marta, Lars and you. You. You spoke about him already about how he know he does have a good touch for a big man and he does. And so he can sort of in a sort of Bayern way I guess. You know, he can drop deep and link the play for two quick guys alongside him. And he's also like good in the box. I don't know how much he knew about that finish but I'll give him some credit. I thought he sort of adjusted his feet quite well.
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E
Instinctive finish. Max instinctive finish.
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B
Okay.
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E
It's really the two headers in the Premier League that's caught me by surprise because that's really not something he was doing very frequently in spite of his very large size last season. But no, he's a very clever striker and it is something that. I mean Captain Obvious alert Harry for back to the call signs. But like with. With Isaac going, Newcastle kind of needed a striker. And I remember watching. I was going to watch 90 minutes of Newcastle playing Aston Villa earlier in the season and it was extraordinary because they had to play Anthony Gordon up front in the middle and they kept getting into crossing positions and there was just. It's really no point putting anything in there, is there? And it is. It seems to be something Football is defaulting back into the return of the big man which, which, which I am delighted with. I think we all are. The big centre forward is back and it's a tremendous thing to see.
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B
Yeah. This week Carl Heinz Rummenager. I don't know how much we should pay attention to him. Probably not a lot. Called Newcastle. Well, he said he congratulated Stuttgart for finding, quote, an idiot who would pay that much money for Voltimara. We certainly would not have done that.
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D
Bayern and Furious because they. He was the one that they lined up probably for next summer and assumed that that would be a succession planning kind of for when Harry Kane leaves. And I don't think they were. And they're usually in a very powerful position with other German clubs and they, they get what they want in the Bundesliga and they, they wouldn't have been expecting Newcastle to have paid that much money. But you know, I think Eddie Howe said it best when he was just talking about what the market is. What the market is.
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E
They were trying to get him this summer as well. They just couldn't. Stuttgart holding out for a price that they just couldn't pay. And I do wonder if it's sometimes that we. Because we watch a lot of the Premier League, we consume a lot of media to do with the Premier League, we cover the Premier League. We kind of assume that the prices and the money that's being thrown around in this league is in any way normal. Like the discrepancy between the financial situation in England and the rest of Europe, including a team like Bayern, is quite stark at this point. So we see our Newcastle have dropped 70 million on the striker and I say, yeah, that seems like normal behavior. Just any other place in the world, it's very abnormal. Like these sort of sums do not exist in football in the same way they used to.
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B
Two nice spots. Sam Dalling, Podder in the crowd cheering. Anthony Gordon's first penalty. And Barry, our friend Sofian Buffal there he was your Buffal.
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C
It's true, yeah. Sofian, formerly of Southampton, plays for Union. There's a few good stories there in the union lineup. Kevin McAllister, brother of Alexis, Liverpool's Alexis, he was playing for them and their captain is a fellow called Christian Burgess. During the first half on tnt, Adam Somerton was portraying him as this modern day Dick Whittington who left Portsmouth to go and play for this. Down on its luck, Belgian side Union. But instead of having a bag on a stick and a cat, he packed I think seven bags into the back of his Audi A5 and off he went. So he's the skipper. And Adam's story sent me a Googling so I found an article on the BBC. He's a history graduate and a vegan. He went to Borough at one stage and Tony Mowbray so I think made it a condition of signing him that he had to finish his degree, which seems like a very Tony Mowbray thing to do. Hats off to him for that. And then there was another fellow, Ross Sykes, who went to Union from Accrington Stanley and he's a boyhood Newcastle fan. So it was a massive deal for him to come on and get some game time in the Champions League against Newcastle.
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B
Interesting stuff. And that'll do for part one. Part two will begin with PSG's win at Barcelona.
- [25:15]
A
Not all journalism is the same. Take the Guardian. Our coverage has something unique. Fierce independence. Nobody owns us or tells us what we can and can't say, so we're free to report the whole picture. We connect what's happening in Washington to the rest of the globe, expose corruption wherever we find it and give fresh perspective on everything from wellness and soccer to culture, the climate and more. Read, watch and listen to the Guardian for free@theguardian.com.
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B
Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly. So PSG left it late. They beat Barcelona 2 1. What? A high line right at the end. Mark from Barcelona. So watching that going, what are they, what are you doing?
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D
Thinking of other ways to kind of talk about Barcelona when they're defending. But it is just such an obvious flaw in what they they do. Although hypocritical because I love watching them play and one of the reasons they're so exciting going forward is because they put pressure so high up and to do that the defenders have to sort of be on the halfway line or even beyond that times. But you know, there is a game state situation there and I think once you're in injury time, you know, don't leave yourself that vulnerable. It happened last season against Inter where they, you know, that the game won, and I don't think you need to be so adventurous at those times as well. It was a really interesting match. I think one of the. The improvements that the Champions League has made now is that you do get these sort of headline acts every single week. And, yeah, that wasn't really the case in the last group stage. It's just a shame. So many players on both sides were injured, you know, particularly for PSG Marquinhos at the back, Joan Neves in midfield, and then all of the front three were missing. And so it was an unusual front three for psg Mayulu and Bay and Barkala sort of as the front three, but they still had Lee and Gonzalo Ramos on the bench, so frightening depth, really. I think that Barcelona were the better side over the course of the 90 minutes. The Lamina Mal versus Nuno Mendez kind of battle on. On Barcelona's right was the highlight of the game. I think that the referee, Michael Oliver, was right not to send Nuno Mendes off. I didn't think that the. The foul when he was already on the yellow card on the edge of the box was necessarily a yellow card, but I know Barcelona were angry that that wasn't given and it was a decisive moment, really, because Luis Enrique reacted to that by bringing on Lucas. Hernandez played him left back, and I think that him and then Nuno Mendes were able to stifle Lamina Mao, who I thought had been the best player on the pitch for an hour. But then slowly PSG just got a grip and a handle on it and. And then won it right at the end through Ramos. So, you know, a big win for Paris Saint Germain, just in the context of proving that they can do it with so many players out. Because last season, like, it felt like they had a nice run in terms of injuries, like, you knew what their starting 11 was every week, but they've proven that they can do it other ways now.
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B
Nice line from Sid writing about Nuno Mendes saying he was going past people like Carl Lewis at a sports day. Worth mentioning Rashford as well, Lars. So I think sixth successive game he's had a goal or an assist.
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E
Yeah, he's making. He's making contributions and this is. I guess this is what they were hoping for from him and that I think a lot of people are hoping that he'll kind of find himself. He's ended up in a situation which is. Which is kind of perfect. Like he's getting plenty of minutes but it's not like he has to play every single minute and be the guy who's. Who's pulling. Pulling the cart all the time. And I think the expectations are probably a little bit lower than they were at United. It's not the same spotlight on him at all times. And it seems to be working in a pretty good way. I want to flag up that I'm continually baffled by the situation with Gonzalo Ramos, who is. He comes on and scores the winning goal. But it is slightly odd that promising and talented that he may be. That's any mayolo. Is starting ahead of him. And Ramos feels like every time I'm watching psg, he's coming on and scoring goals like it's almost constant. And you can. You can look at. Like his looking at his stats is maybe a little meaningless because he tends to be like a super sub for a team that dominates their games. But he scores an extraordinary amount of goals for the. The amount of minutes that he's on the field. But Luis Enrique seems to like quite aggressively, not fancy him. I think it's fair to say. And it's quite odd. It's quite odd that he didn't move in the summer, and it remains a little odd.
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B
I think maybe he's just happy being a finisher. That's what he likes to be in every way. Speaking of finishers, John, amongst others, came in with. It's an open goal, but we'll take it. This Hoyland guy looks pretty good. Maybe a Premier League team should take a punt. Napoli 2, Sporting 1. Both goals set up by Kevin De Bruyne. We know Kevin De Bruyne is good, but we didn't really see Rasmus Hojlund be good for Manchester United. But both. They're very different finishes. They're very different goals, Barry. But they. They look like if you'd never watched him or he'd never been in the Premier League, just go, that guy's just a really good center forward.
- [30:37]
C
Yeah. And if either of those opportunities had come to him at any point last season, you'd have bet the farm on are missing both of them. And I suppose it's just indicative of what confidence can do for somebody. And it helps that Kevin De Bruyne is providing the assists after the game. Hoyland or his people. I'm not sure whether it was him or representatives put on social media that me scoring two goals with Kevin De Bruyne providing both assists was not on my 2025 bingo card. We were discussing bingo for reasons I Won't go into before the game or before we started recording this podcast. I didn't have Rasmus Hoyland knowing what bingo is on my bingo card. I have to say.
- [31:28]
D
Well, my nan would have, Barry, because you'd have had two cards. As we were discussing. She used to play for two people.
- [31:34]
E
We do have bingo in Scandinavia. Like, it is a thing.
- [31:38]
B
Okay.
- [31:39]
E
It's not as I thought it was.
- [31:40]
C
A particularly English pursuit or pastime.
- [31:45]
B
So what's the Norwegian for bingo and is it just bingo?
- [31:48]
E
Yeah, it's very much bingo.
- [31:50]
B
Yeah.
- [31:50]
E
I assume the same. I have again. I wonder about this. Made me think, is just leaving Man United the key to success and happiness in life? And I wonder if this also applies to, like, members of staff and people who have just worked in the ticket office. You know, I swear we have. Obviously. They famously used to have a lot of staff, and now they have slightly fewer staff. I guarantee you, people who have worked for Man United and have then moved on with their lives are listening to this pod right now. They must be. And I would like for them to write in, like, has everything come together for you? Like, have you. Have you had tremendous success in your professional and personal life almost immediately after no longer working for Man United? Because it just seems to be very, very consistent.
- [32:32]
B
Yeah. I'm just trying to think who has left and gone on and played incredibly well. Of course, McTominay. Antony's done very well at Betis, hasn't he? Rashford is doing well at Barcelona. You have Hojlund here. Am I forgetting any. Am I forgetting, like, hordes of them?
- [32:47]
E
I put Lukaku in that bracket. He's gone to Italy and won the league there after leaving United.
- [32:52]
B
Yeah. I mean, it seems staggering. Or maybe we just don't notice the ones that leave and aren't good, because it sort of helps for this sort of amusement of just Manchester United getting into every conversation somewhere. I just thought they were really good goals. The first one. The first touch is good. Gets it out from his feet. Looks like he's got. He's quicker than he was at Man United. Finishes well. The second is a really brave header. You're spot on, Barry. I just think there's no way he'd.
- [33:17]
C
Have scored those ones this time last year. He wouldn't have got it out from under his feet. He tripped over his own feet. To be fair to him, while his spell at United was anything but a success, he wasn't getting much service when he was plowing a very lone and forlorn furrow. Up front.
- [33:38]
B
That is true. Karabakh 2, Copenhagen nil. Lars, you volunteered to watch this one. Tell us about it.
- [33:43]
E
Yeah, the horseman from Azerbaijan. I did watch it in the sense that it was on as I was tidying my apartment, but it was. Karabag had the better of the first half. It's kind of a weird playing surface. It was like Copenhagen were. Were sloppy than you'd expect in possession. Karabag removing the ball a lot better. Fseko improved, I thought in the second half, but they had more chances. But they couldn't find a way in to score and eventually lost to 2 nil. It was not massively eventful and life changing for me, I have to say. And on behalf of my Scandinavian brethren, I was a little bit disappointed that they couldn't get anything out of it. But that's two wins and two for Karabagh. You have to, you have to respect us.
- [34:25]
C
Karabag are subscribing to the Langdon view. The preposterous language of you that winning games early in this competition is quite handy. I don't buy it for a second.
- [34:38]
B
Yeah, you'll, you'll have the last laugh, Barry, when Carabag don't win the Champions League, won't you? British Dortmund 4 Athletic Bill bow 1. What did you make of this Mark?
- [34:47]
D
I think from Athletic have been one of, I think, the biggest sort of disappointment so far. I've had a hard enough start, you know, playing Arsenal and then away to Borussia Dortmund. But I, yeah, I expected more from them this season. Just overall. I know that Nico Williams has been injured and, you know, he's a very important player for the team, but just, you know, I don't think they should be losing 41 against the British Dortmund team that's definitely not, you know, a strong version of Dortmund. They're not as good as the ones we've had before, but Girassi is, I think one of the most, like weirdest players around because he just scores so many goals and it was a kind of, yeah, a fluky goal he got last night as well. But he's. He's sort of goal record is just sensational. But whenever I watch him, I don't actually feel like he's. He's that good. And so he just one of them players that just scores goals and lots of them, you know, they'll go in any which way. And this was one of those cases. But a good result for Dortmund. Poor, poor from Athletic.
- [35:56]
B
Does anyone have any strong thoughts on Villarreal 2, Juventus 2 or Leverkusen 1 PSV 1 Barry we discussed overhead kicks.
- [36:03]
C
Earlier and Federico Gatti scored an excellent one for Juventus. Big center half. Not the kind of goal you would expect to see a big centre half scoring. He didn't boot anyone in the head, he just struck the ball. So well done him. Apart from that, I do not have any thoughts.
- [36:21]
E
I mean, I guess the boot was head adjacent but no one really stuck their head into it I guess. But I, yeah, it was, it was a very good overhead kick for sure, I suppose.
- [36:29]
B
How late can you put your head into the foot? Like if, if, you know, if Trevor.
- [36:33]
E
This, this is the key.
- [36:35]
B
Trevor Sinclair's gone up and he's taken it. You know, if a Barnsley defender was to run into his foot now, it's unlikely the goal, you know, that would be chalked off. But you know, in the moment, could you have the presence of mind and the bravery to just headbutt any errant foot and therefore the overhead kick would be disallowed anyway. Europa League and Europa Conference League tonight Celtic, Braga Forest, Midjieland Villa go to Feyenoord Rangers go to Sturm Gratz, Crystal palace go to Dino A Kyiv, Aberdeen, Shakhtar, Shamrock Rovers at Sparta Prague and Shelbourn versus Haakon. So if anything dramatic happens, those, we'll cover those on Monday. As well as that, we'll cover the Premier League and we'll look ahead to the weekend of fixtures in just a second.
- [37:21]
A
Not all journalism is the same. Take the Guardian. Our coverage has something unique. Fierce independence. Nobody owns us or tells us what we can and can't say, so we're free to report the whole picture. We connect what's happening at Washington to the rest of the globe, expose corruption wherever we find it and give fresh perspective on everything from wellness and soccer to culture, the climate and more. Read, watch and listen to the Guardian for free@theguardian.com.
- [37:59]
B
Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly. So Chelsea Liverpool probably the, the game of the weekend and it is interesting now Liverpool are on this, you know, this disastrous two defeat run mark.
- [38:11]
D
Yeah, I, I do think there's been an overreaction following those two defeats. Players were rested against Galatasaray. It's not an easy place to go. We're talking in cliches and the palace game like first half, palace were definitely on top. Second half, you know, I think felt like Liverpool were the team that I wasn't surprised they got the equalizer and you know, they were the ones I felt were going to get a Win and I think that palace are a good side this year and you know, they've just lost it right at the end. I wouldn't be that concerned just yet. I think that there is an issue with. With Vertz just not settling in and accommodating him and being sort of one person down in midfield as a consequence as. As unbalanced and slightly. But I'd still say they're in a better spot than Chelsea who didn't have much of a pre season. I'm not sure if that's the reason for some of the injuries. PSG spoke about earlier have got injuries as well, but they're not the only two teams in that situation. But Chelsea have got a lot of defenders out through suspension or injury and that's not ideal when you're playing against that Liverpool front free and I spoke to a Chelsea season ticket holder yesterday who said he was still like behind Mareska but in his sort of friend group. There's definitely a turning with some and so I think they've got within the next sort of next few Premier League games they've got Liverpool and Tottenham. If he loses both of those, I think he will sort of lose, you know, a fair chunk more of those that are kind of on the fence at the moment.
- [39:49]
B
I mean, come on Mark. When did Chelsea ever lose to top? I mean they just never ever.
- [39:55]
D
No, no, that's a very fair point. Gary Lineker maybe, but yeah, it's. Yeah, it's a long time. Well, Dele Alli as well, but yeah, doesn't happen very often.
- [40:02]
B
The thing about Chelsea, Lars is, you know, Liverpool have signed lots of players but you sort of. You sort of have a vague idea of how they're gonna, you know, the starting 11 find myself sort of impossible to know what Chelsea will do. I mean I know it's early in the season. It takes time for teams to settle and Marcus mentioned all the injuries and so suspensions. But they're just such an odd team.
- [40:22]
E
Yeah, it does feel like they haven't quite like congealed into a consistent 11 as consistent team. That's. That's. That's true. I still feel like we can be pretty sure. I was about to start saying what I think the lineup will be and I realized no, we cannot be pretty. Halfway through that I'm like no, I don't. I don't got it. Jua Pedro will be up front, I'm sure and both Enzo and Caicedo will start and probably Pedro Neto. I guess the thing with Chelsea as Well, right now they've had three. They've had a man sent off in three of the last four games, which seems bad. Like this is very unhelpful if they're. If they're trying to get results. And I think for this game in particular now they have something like four center halves missing. So there'll be probably a little bit makeshift at the back. So against that Liverpool frontline, could we make. Could we make it four and five, I wonder. It seems like a thing that could happen.
- [41:12]
B
Who will play down the ledge, you think? Garnacho? I'm trying to think who would be up against whoever Liverpool chooses right back and whether Sobers Lie stays at right back.
- [41:20]
E
I would like to say Estevao because he looks so exciting. Like in the sort of unending stream of talented guys in their late teens, early 20s that they've been buying since the Blue Toad Bowly takeover. Estebao is the one, like obviously Cole Palmer, obvious example, but of the more sort of left field ones, Estavao is the one that looks like, my God, like this. This guy could be an actual global superstar at some point. He looks so incredibly exciting. So I would like to see him as a neutral here. Just have as many minutes as possible going forward.
- [41:49]
B
Nuno goes to the Emirates Barry, you sort of touched on this, I think yesterday. But it will be interesting to see how West Ham defend corners and if Nuno has managed to do anything against a team that scores so many more goals from corners than anyone else.
- [42:03]
C
Yeah, the West Ham will be provided with a very as stern a test as you're going to get when it comes to defending corners. Against Arsenal, it's very hard to see anything other than an Arsenal win in this game. But there is the possibility West Ham will have a bounce of sorts following the departure of Potter, I think. Did they win there last season?
- [42:28]
D
Yeah, relatively speaking. They've got a good record at the Emirates, you know, given the kind of the quality gap between the two teams.
- [42:35]
C
And this is the kind of rake Arsenal, my last season's Arsenal obviously did tread on and get slapped in the face. I don't think that will happen this weekend, but I wouldn't rule it out either.
- [42:51]
B
Ange goes to St James's park with Nottingham Forest. What have you made of, you know, Ange Ball two in the Premier League, Mark?
- [43:00]
D
Yeah, I mean, it's not started very well. It's not big surprise that the Anand started that well. I mean, to Port got a manager that's so different to the previous one in charge of A team with no pre season, that doesn't feel like the wisest decision from Mr. Marinakis. Didn't feel like it was the strongest interview process either. Yeah, I think people knew for a long time that Ange was, was going there and it was. I think it's all a bit odd really. You know, Postcode will want to get back into the Premier League, but it just feels like a tricky one to take because Nuno had done such a good job playing such a different way to, to. To have the immediate impact, I think would be hard for a lot of managers. And now they've got the Sunderland game you felt like was the ideal opportunity to get the win. They lose and then all of a sudden you've got to go to a Newcastle team that's resurgent after their Champions League win. So I think it's. Yeah, it's a horrible, horrible looking game for Postecoglou. I would, I would. I think I'd be more surprised if he was still there at the end of the season than not. I, I just don't see it working out. I have to say, this game last.
- [44:13]
B
Year, last, where Chris Wood turned into Ronaldo and scored a hat trick, was that the year before?
- [44:17]
E
I feel like that could be any game in the last couple of years. This Chris Wood thing doesn't make any sense to me, but it just keeps happening. I, I'm. I'm getting like. I don't mean to make light of this. I keep getting like Tottenham PTSD from the start of Nottingham Forest because I, I haven't watched any of the games in their entirety, so I'm not gonna have two strident opinions on this Ange boil iteration. But they keep like, not winning games. And I keep checking the stats and it seems like they had a lot of shots and stuff. And then I see Ange interviews going, oh, yeah, I thought we had the better of that game. And then I check the result and they haven't won. It was like, yeah, that's. That's very familiar. Like I've had, I've had quite a lot of that. Just sort of note of compassion to the Nottingham Forest fans who like, yeah, you, you're not alone. A lot of us have experienced this before.
- [44:59]
C
I would argue in Andrew's favor. They really should have won that game against Sunderland. Like they had a lot of shots. The Sunderland keeper had a brilliant game.
- [45:11]
D
They played well at Betis as well and still concede two goals.
- [45:16]
E
Yeah, it's funny that. It's funny how that keeps happening.
- [45:19]
B
Suddenly go to Old Trafford. Barry, you are quietly confident or perhaps loudly confident going into this game.
- [45:24]
C
I give Sunderland every chance of turning them over. Definitely. And if they do, it's going to be interesting. Last game before an international break, I would imagine. If United lose at home, given their current run of form to a newly promoted side, that will not go down well at Old Trafford in the stands or in the boardroom. Hopefully Sunderland can do a number on them just to see what happens next. You know, you'd give any team in the Premier League a chance to beat Manchester United at the moment and Sunderland have got off to a great start, so why not?
- [46:01]
B
The early kickoff on Saturday is Tottenham's visit to Leeds who I think are unbeaten at home. You know, the Elland Road factor. Mark, what's the spurs sentiment over Thomas Frankston? Seems like they get to this moment where it's all good and then they've got a game that's really winnable and they don't win it and you just go and then. Then they'll go again.
- [46:21]
D
They felt nothing more predictable than pointless. Wolves sort of turning up sort of Tottenham last week with an opportunity to narrow the gap on leaders Liverpool and you know, really struggle for 90 minutes. Leeds are good at home. Seen that already and probably kicking themselves that they didn't beat Bournemouth last week. From Topham point of view, like, if you'd have asked me this question maybe 10 days ago, I would have been really positive. But. But last couple of performances have. Have been a way short of the standards that were set in the admittedly away games actually Man City and Brighton. And because the attack's not flowing at all from open play, I do wonder whether they might actually be suited to playing away from home then. Maybe it didn't look like that on Tuesday in Norway, but generally speaking, like I think there'd just be less pressure on them to try to create big problem against Villarreal, against Bournemouth and also against Wolves. So I, I'm. I'm staying patient with Thomas Frank, but he will need at some stage to get the team clicking in. In the final third.
- [47:26]
B
Yeah, I mean I suppose part of that is, you know, is you need Javi Simmons to. To be the create. There just aren't that many creators right. With the injuries to Madison and Kulasevsky.
- [47:35]
D
Yeah, I think that that's fair and the reliance on kudos is st. Yeah, it's too much really because that has been the tactic so far this season. Give it to him and hope that he can sort of dribble past everybody and it's not a bad tactic when it works but it, it's not really sustainable. It's just where does Simons play? I think it doesn't look comfortable out on the left but when you're easing him into the Premier League as Liverpool have found with verts like playing somebody like that in the center is also, you know, I'm not sure he's fully up to speed yet with the Premier League. He had his best 25 minutes playing centrally against Brighton but I think that's very different when you're chasing the game in that situation rather than starting there. So I know he's one of Barry's favorite players. I'm sure he will come good but just a bit of patience required of him.
- [48:23]
B
It's interesting he does move like this, doesn't it? They both have that sort of languid style. The way they carry the ball, it's so beautiful but it's just no time. Not a lot happens. Yeah, quite a lot of time and then you're right. No, no time on the ball. Bournemouth, Fulham, Everton. Palace, Wolves, Brighton Villa, Burnley, Brentford, City. Anything pique your interest Barry?
- [48:40]
C
Well, palace are on this very long unbeaten run. Could come to an end tonight obviously but going to Everton, I remain unconvinced by Everton. I think they've been getting a few results they haven't deserved. Who do they play on Monday? West Ham thought that yeah they were bang average in that game both in India and Grealish. They have two really good wingers. They just have no one to finish off all the crosses and good balls that they provide and that's an issue unless I suppose it's too early to judge Thierno Barry. But yeah they need a striker who's firing and they don't have one at the minute.
- [49:23]
B
Okay, let's go to. We'll obviously cover all those games on Monday to Turkey Corner. Sadly for you Marcus not sort of a food based part of the team.
- [49:33]
D
You won't be surprised. You will not be surprised to know.
- [49:36]
C
I might get my teeth done while.
- [49:37]
D
We'Re here and I could do some Donna meat.
- [49:39]
B
So all the cliches. Yeah, lovely. We're all winners. Kore Kieng, if I've pronounced it correctly says hi on Wednesday. You're asking how many Turkish listeners you had to my knowledge. Let's face it, it's not that extensive. I'm the only one. I found Football Weekly right after Galatasaro's 32 away win against Manchester United to check what the English media thinks and I've Been an avid listener since listening to the Liverpool game. Reactions of the Pod is a full circle moment for me as a fan. I will have a nose job to breed properly next week, not a vasectomy. So Barry's unimpressed words are more than welcome. It's been 30 years since I had a big operation, so you can say I'm a bit excited. Our first nose job on the pod is very exciting. So look, good luck with that. Let us know how it goes. But you're not alone. We had a raft of Turkish listeners get in touch. Cenk presumably not Cenk. Tosin just says, hi, Max, we're here as Turkish listeners. Cheers. Rizvan says, longtime listener of Football Weekly, lifetime Galatasaray supporter. After hearing you wonder in today's episode, I can confirm you have at least one Turkish fan in me. I can also confirm that the Galatasaray goal music is the melody of I Will Survive, but based on a Turkish version of the song by Azda Pikan, who is considered Turkey's version of Madonna. I appreciate Galatasaray being considered dark horses in the Champions League this year, considering last time we were in the Champions League and had Wilfried Zaha and Hakim Ziyech. You said the team had an Expendables feel to it. Big fan of the podcast. Thanks for all you do. Lots of people got in touch talking about I Will Survive. Yannick saying, just want to chime in on your take on Galatasaray's Gold Tune. It is actually I Will Survive, specifically the version made by the Rotterdam pub Apres ski group called Herma's House Band. Okay, so we have some controversy here. It is coincidentally the only the Gold Tune of Fire, Nord, Rotterdam, Celta, Vigo and I believe Benfica. Have a nice week. Thanks for the nice podcast.
- [51:27]
C
Cheers.
- [51:27]
B
Yannick Novid says Turkish listener here who lives in Spain is a Man United fan that's been listening since 2008. My favorite member of the pod is Barry.
- [51:35]
C
Is the right answer.
- [51:37]
B
Could have been original, Novid. Yeah, you could have been original. But you chose to follow the herd like the sheep that you are. Anyway, thank you to everyone, to all our Turkish friends and to everyone around the world. Thanks for listening and that'll do for today. Thanks everybody. Thanks, Barry.
- [51:52]
C
Thank you.
- [51:53]
B
Thank you, Mark.
- [51:53]
D
Thank you, Max.
- [51:54]
B
Thank you, Lars.
- [51:55]
E
Thank you, Max.
- [51:56]
B
Bubble Weekly is produced by Joel Grove. Our executive producer is Phil Maynard will be back on Monday.
- [52:06]
A
This is the Guardian.