Max Barry (1:46)

Good, very solid start. John Bruin, Happy Christmas.

John Bruin (1:50)

Happy Christmas. As the years pass by and the beard gets whiter and the battle with the waistline continues, I begin to feel a bit more Christmas, if you see what I mean.

Max Barry (2:02)

There's a grotto waiting for you, John. Hello. Barry Glendenning.

Barry Glendenning (2:06)

Yes. Merry Christmas, everybody.

Max Barry (2:07)

Chris says, like the hootenanny recording it this far out, it's June 7th, everybody. That's when we're doing this for the tape, December 17th. So anything that's happened between then and and when this is released on Christmas Eve, you know you have. We don't know what's happened, so it's not our fault. Jesse says this show is meant to be recorded in front of an audience in Burr in Ireland. Listen to last year's Christmas special. Does anybody remember last year's Christmas special? And we promised to do this in Burr?

Barry Glendenning (2:38)

Barry, I don't recall promising to do this in Burba. I'd be wholeheartedly in favor of recording in Burr because the theater in Burr is across the street from my mum's house. So I wouldn't have far to go to get home, back to my bed afterwards. And I think I'd be reasonably confident we'd sell out in every sense of the word. Yeah, dynamic pricing for the tickets.

Max Barry (3:09)

I have a feeling that you said exactly the same.

Barry Glendenning (3:11)

I reckon I did.

Max Barry (3:14)

As you were saying, I was thinking.

Barry Glendenning (3:16)

I must have said this last that the theater is right across the street from my mom's house. So we've got off to a great start.

Max Barry (3:26)

Well, no, but Christmas is having the same conversations with the same relatives. Like we're doing exactly what we're meant to be doing. Joachim, a friend of the pod. There's always a highlight to the Christmas special. Speaking of highlights, what's been your biggest highlight of the year? I mean, a goal, a miss, a sending off, etc. It's a simple one to start with. Do we have an answer, John Bruin?

John Bruin (3:46)

Well, do you know what? I actually missed the game of the year, which was the four all on Monday because I was watching Twelfth Night Culture over here, you know.

Jonathan Wilson (3:54)

Yeah, good.

John Bruin (3:55)

Let's say highlights of the year. Well, as it's me, I'll go for a low light. And it was the Europa League final. Not a tribute to English football's quality, was it, Jonathan? You were there, I think. Yeah, it was so bad. So bad. And I've been to a few European Europa League finals sometimes with Jonathan, the Ruby Turner of our hootenanny.

Jonathan Wilson (4:20)

I don't know what that means. What does that mean?

John Bruin (4:22)

We've actually watched Hootenanny together. Jonathan and I did point this out on that occasion that Ruby Turner is on every year and Ruby Turner has not had a hit, I wouldn't have thought since about 1987 a bit harsher.

Barry Glendenning (4:34)

My. Oof.

Jonathan Wilson (4:34)

But okay then. To be honest, John, that night, I don't remember the Hoot Nanny as much as the series of serial killer documentaries we watched afterwards. It was one of the best. No, it was one of the best years I ever had. It was Fred. Fred Diner did a series on serial killers and we watched three of them back to back. It was brilliant.

Max Barry (4:57)

Right, so we have your lowlight, John.

John Bruin (4:59)

Yeah, a bit of Quadrophenia apps as well, actually. After that.

Jonathan Wilson (5:01)

Yeah, yeah, I remember that as well.

John Bruin (5:03)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, I just. It was the day that Ange Ball decided to just get it launched and Manchester United, the most famous team in football, played a brand of Imodium football that I will. And you know what was worse about it? It was my birthday.

Max Barry (5:25)

Oh, John, what about you? What about you, Wilson? Do you have a highlight or are you going to stay on this, this, this miserable trench that John has dug for us?

Jonathan Wilson (5:35)

No, I think one of the, one of the best things was how many surprise teams or teams who aren't used to winning things won trophies in May. So palace winning the FA Cup, Aberdeen winning the Scottish cup after 30, 35 years. I think it was Union Saint Giroise winning the Belgian League after 70 years and Sunderland winning the playoff final. It was two of the best days of my life. Came on Saturdays, five weeks apart. Barry was there for both of them. Only one of them did I end up stopping in Barry's arms. And that wasn't the winning, that was Tom Watson scoring, scoring the 96th minute winner.

Barry Glendenning (6:14)

Oh, I, I thought you were going to say when you were worried she wouldn't turn up. She was really late.

Jonathan Wilson (6:20)

She's tenacious like I, I, I knew there was no shaking her. Yeah, that, that afternoon it went the playoff final win. I mean, obviously it's a very parochial personal thing, but that is Sunland's. Yeah. In terms of a one off occasion. The best one off occasion since 1973. The best, you know, occasionally for Sunderland Football club in my lifetime. I'm delighted I was sharing with Barry.

Max Barry (6:41)

Is yours the same, Baz?

Barry Glendenning (6:42)

Well, I, I'll finesse it slightly. I really enjoyed that day. I loved getting to share Wilson and his Mac and mates. That made it a bit special as well. But it, I think the particular highlight of that day was the precise millisecond I realized that Tommy Watson's injury time winner was going to curl inside the post and not hit it or go wide and that was special. And then in the ensuing melee, celebratory Mali, my glasses came off my head. So then I was in a massive panic that someone would stamp on them. Luckily they escaped unscathed. I mean it's, it's recency bias of a sort. But I think even if it had happened the very first day of this year, being privileged enough to be present for Nick Voltimatti's own goal on Sunday, that will always be a life highlight. That was brilliant. And the Ireland match against Hungary and maybe the Scotland game as well. Which against Denmark, which I almost enjoyed as much even though I'm not Scottish.

John Bruin (7:55)

Yeah, I know.

Max Barry (7:55)

I think you're right. I think the, I actually found the Tottenham win sort of too much really. And you know, I think the, the, the Van der Ven clearance off the line in what was I agreed on one of the worst games of football I think I've ever, ever seen. But I actually think the, the, the, the. The moment when the palace fans knew that they'd won the FA Cup, I can't remember, like a City player shoots over the bar or something. It's a goal kick and we've had eight of five minutes or whatever it is. I can't remember the exact details but there was just this moment where the Palace f that they'd won a major trophy and they'd never won one before. And there was just that moment of just the complete relief that it was done, but it wasn't done yet. So they still had to wait for the ref to blow his whistle. And when he blew his whistle there are just so many amazing, you know, iPhone footage moments of palace fans just not quite knowing what to do and sort of putting their head in their hands, then crying and then hugging strangers and, and actually the, the Scotland one. I think my favorite of, of the Kenny McLean videos is that pub where you can't see the screen but you can see the fans and someone quite correctly says take it to the corner and someone just says what you doing? And then the whole place erupts like it's just. Ah, the timing is. It's so good. Right. Biody says how are your predictions going at the halfway Mark Sizzler similar question says wishing you Baz and the rest of you a Merry Christmas and a happy New Year. Would any of you like to make three changes to your predictions? Eg Baz with Everton being relegated.

Barry Glendenning (9:31)

I don't want to change them. I made them. That's what predictions are. You can't really change them. Everton is clearly a mistake. I had them 19th and I still find them a puzzling watch. They can be really good sometimes. They can really bad sometimes. If they had a striker I think to be or a striker who could score goals every now and then, they, they'd possibly be title contenders but. And I think I had Liverpool to win the title, that was clearly a mistake as well. I think the rest of them were fairly okay. I didn't have Sunderland being relegated. I think, I think I probably thought they might be relegated but I couldn't relegate them so I think I had them 14th or 15th, they mightn't finish that low. But no, I wouldn't change them. I had reasons for making them at the time and I stand over those reasons even though I've been proved incorrect.

Jonathan Wilson (10:32)

Well, I had Sunderland bottom so that was quite badly wrong. But I don't think it's reasonable that a team can bring in 14 players and they all suddenly gel. That's not normal. I think I was justified in being pessimistic for them and they've won a lot of games by a single goal. I think there'll be a severe regression to the mean. And the fictionist was very kind to them. They got some easy games first. We had some points on the board so that was badly wrong. And I probably overrated Chelsea. But equally I think that if Levi Coldwell hadn't got injured and if Fafana hadn't got injured I think they'd be in a much better position than they are now. And my sense that Liverpool, City, Arsenal, you couldn't quite trust any of them. I think maybe I'm being a bit unfair with Arsenal. Maybe City coming good now but I don't think that was well for Mark so. And I didn't think Wolves would be as bad as they have been although I think I did have them quite low down. So yeah, I got Sunderland really badly wrong. I overrated Chelsea and I overrated Wolves.

Max Barry (11:26)

I think I relegated Burnley, West Ham and Wolves so I think that might be quite a good one. I had City to win the title but I definitely had Tottenham way too.

John Bruin (11:34)

High actually I had Arsenal to win the league and I'm honestly not getting angsty about it. They are going to do it. It's going to be okay, honestly. Please tell me it's going to be okay. We're not worried, honestly, honestly, please no, don't say worried. I had West Ham to struggle. Reasonably happy with that. Didn't say it was my greatest prediction after watching towards the end of last season had Wolves to struggle. I think we all could see that our dear friend Vitor Pereira might not actually. Well, we didn't expect that he'd get a new three year contract and then get sacked but that, that happened and I actually my Manchester United prediction was I think to come fifth and they're sort of around there despite being absolutely rubbish. So yeah, it's a funny old game as we'll get to.

Max Barry (12:21)

Are they rubbish, John? I mean I just don't remember. I don't know if I dare ask this question. We tried to answer it after the full four, but I don't know.

John Bruin (12:28)

No, they're rubbish. They're rubbish. I mean, I'm just not having it. It's. It's just. It's not even Reuben Amaroom's fault. It's just the whole thing is just this, like. Just this grim sort of ship sailing into murky waters that get murkier and more miserable. And, you know, you need some sort of Captain Ahab figure or, you know, it's just. God, it's awful. It's just, it's just bad. Even when, even when the games are interesting. It's, it's, it's, it's just, it's just grim.

Max Barry (12:59)

Do you think that's it forever for Man United and Tottenham Wilson? I mean, I says it never was for Tottenham. That's the difference. But.

Jonathan Wilson (13:05)

Well, yeah, Tottenham, a baffling side in so many respects, but not least the fact that they're one of the big five who led the breakaway to form the Premier League. They're one of a Super League 6. They've won the league twice. That puts them on a par with giants such as Preston Burnley. Portsmouth, they put some. Yeah, they won three times fewer titles than Sunderland. They're not a big club. Come on, grow up. Big stadium, lovely stadium. So look, they should never be lower than mid table in the Premier League because of their size. And United, you say similar, but United are a funny club because they've only ever won the league under three managers. They're a really hard team to manage for whatever reason. So unless you're an absolute genius, I.

John Bruin (13:46)

Always think this argument is hilarious because it's like the only one that won them under three managers. Two of those managers were managed for 25 years. I mean, what else are they supposed to do for the rest of the time? You know, I mean, it's like they've only been in business 150 years. So it's like. So for a third of that time they were really, really successful. Oh, well, they only had two managers. Well, what does that matter? It's absolute nonsense. Liverpool always say, well, we've had six managers that won the league. Well, three of them were all worked out of the same room. I mean, come on. Nonsense.

Jonathan Wilson (14:19)

It doesn't matter in the sense. It's not a criticism. They've had two of the greatest managers of all time. It is a fact that every other manager who's ever been in charge of Manchester United, apart from Ernest Mangnall, Matt Busby and Alex Ferguson, has found it really difficult to cope with the size of the club. The list of managers who failed at United is way, way, way bigger. The Melissa managers who succeeded there, it's a really hard club to manage. United have had two of the all time geniuses and yeah, they, they, they've both been there for a very long time actually. Arguably that's one of the reasons why their successors found it so hard because those managers lingered too long. Maybe not quite as long as say Wenger did at Arsenal, but I think Busby certainly, I know it's obviously complicated by the European cup which he did win, but his methods were pretty old fashioned by the time he finally went and then of course didn't go. I think Fergie was in decline by the time he won that title in 2013. So it's. I, I don't think they should be taken as a criticism but it is a fact since since the first World War only two managers have won the League of Manchester. It's really hard.

Max Barry (15:21)

This is Barry. This is the argument at Christmas dinner that happens every Christmas where the other two just, you know, we just wander off, stick it, stick some vinyl on and pour another glass of wine. Just hope, hope the quiz is on soon. Mol says we have the Wilson scenario. What would be the Glendenning or the Bruin scenario? Barry?

Jonathan Wilson (15:41)

Well, sorry, hang on. Before anybody answers. Do people actually remember what the Wilson scenario is? Because I think it's, I think people have got it wrong.

Barry Glendenning (15:46)

Well, the Wilson scenario is. So it's a chaotic sequence of refereeing decisions involving counterattack goal that's overturned by Var and leads to. Because a penalty has been given in the. At the other end of the pitch or a penalty in a red card.

Jonathan Wilson (16:11)

No, specifically the penalty is only given because it's a goal. So when I made it, the laws were slightly different, but as it sounds now, it would have to be. There's a corner, say the keepers come up, there's a corner, the ball strikes somebody on the arm. But it's not deliberate. You know, it wouldn't in a normal run of things be a foul. But the ball drops at his feet and he smacks it. And because the keeper's out, it goes in. You can't give the goal because he controlled the ball with his arm and therefore it's a penalty. So as that ball is approaching the goal, what you need is one of you you're about to get. If that ball crosses very fast, you need Aaron Lennon, you need Aaron Lennon at his peak to sprint up and, and turn that away from goal. Or it's a penalty. That's. That's that. Yeah. Wilson scenario. It's not a quirky thing that happens. It's a. This is an obvious flaw in the laws that they haven't thought about because the laws are nonsense around and actually the.

Max Barry (17:05)

I'm really. You want them to put it wide because if they're keepers up. Oh no.

Jonathan Wilson (17:11)

Yeah.

John Bruin (17:11)

Yeah.

Max Barry (17:12)

If their keepers up, you've won any.

Barry Glendenning (17:13)

Sorry, I. I don't think it's been made at all clear what the Wilson scenario is there.

John Bruin (17:18)

No, not definitely. Didn't clear it up either.

Barry Glendenning (17:22)

It did. It definitely involved a counter attack, didn't it?

Max Barry (17:26)

Yeah.

Jonathan Wilson (17:26)

In its original formulation. They changed the laws since. But what I'm. But the. As the laws stand.

Barry Glendenning (17:32)

Sorry, where's the counterattack in the scenario he just outlined?

Jonathan Wilson (17:37)

Well, it's a. It's a. It's a very direct counter attack in a sense that it's shot from 100 yards.

Barry Glendenning (17:42)

Okay. Right. Totally confused now.

Max Barry (17:46)

Anyway, I'm with you. What's the Glendenning scenario called?

Barry Glendenning (17:50)

This Glendenning scenario? Because it's specifically the kind of thing that might happen to me if I was good enough to be a footballer. It's opening day of the season. I'm the star striker for Sunderland. I scored this fantastic goal. 89th minute to win a game against Newcastle. And I wheel away in celebration. I go full lua lua and do a series of somersaults, land awkwardly and knacker my cruise ship. And then the goal is ruled out for a fractional offside. So the goal doesn't stand. But I'm out for nine months with a cruciate knee injury. Suffered from selling. Celebrating a goal that has no longer stands. So the goal doesn't stand, but the injury does.

Max Barry (18:45)

Okay, well, thank you, Barry. I enjoyed your scenario. That'll do for part one. Nick says can we get a voice note from Mark Langdon on his ideal Christmas dinner? I assume he's not a sprouts man. Before we end part one then, some festive messages from the Football Weekly family. And you might be in Lucknick. Max, Barry. Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. Also to the listeners. Viewers might be able to see these.

Jonathan Wilson (19:11)

Trees that look like Christmas trees but.

Max Barry (19:13)

Aren'T Christmas trees behind me. Cheers. It's Jonathan here. Merry Christmas to all the Football Weekly listeners. To producer Joel and all of the team, the Guardian and to Max and to Barry and to all the other guests and to all the people who sacked and postecoglou this year.

Jonathan Wilson (19:34)

Hello. Dan Bardell here, just wanted to say.

John Bruin (19:35)

Merry Christmas to all the Guardian Football Weekly listeners and of course now watchers because the show is on YouTube as well. And also a very merry merry Christmas to Max Rushton and Barry Glenn Denning.

Jonathan Wilson (19:47)

Thank you for what you do for the show.

John Bruin (19:49)

You are two absolute heroes.

Barry Glendenning (19:51)

Have a great Christmas and as always, up the villa. Big up to Max, Barry and all of the award winning now I must say, a Guardian Football Weekly crew. It's been a great year. I've thoroughly enjoyed coming on, as I always do, everybody drink, have sex and.

John Bruin (20:09)

Dance responsibly during this very very, very.

Barry Glendenning (20:12)

Very enjoyable and emotive period of the year.

Max Barry (20:16)

And a big shout out to all.

Barry Glendenning (20:17)

The listeners that tune in to every single podcast. In particular the Chelsea fans who for two years in a row have told me they have been in a title race and for two years in a.

Max Barry (20:27)

Row I've told you back that you.

Barry Glendenning (20:29)

Are not and were not in a title race.

Max Barry (20:32)

You PI.

Barry Glendenning (20:32)

Yay motherfuckers.

Jonathan Wilson (20:40)

Hey, Ryan Reynolds here for Mint Mobile.

Max Barry (20:42)

You know, one of the perks about having four kids that you know about is actually getting a direct line to.

Jonathan Wilson (20:48)

The big man up north. And this year he wants you to know the big best gift that you can give someone is the gift of Mint Mobile's unlimited wireless for $15 a month. Now you don't even need to wrap it.

Barry Glendenning (20:58)

Give it a try@mintmobile.com Switch upfront payment of $45 for three month plan equivalent to $15 per month required new customer offer for first three months only.

Jonathan Wilson (21:06)

Speed slow after 35 gigabytes of network's.

Barry Glendenning (21:08)

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John Bruin (21:49)

Hello everyone and Merry Christmas from sunny Norway. From Norway, where we're having the fairy tale Christmas you imagine us Norwegians to have, which in reality is just 10 degrees in rain. Thanks for listening to the pod this year.

Max Barry (22:06)

Thank you for putting up with our nonsense. I should say my nonsense.

Barry Glendenning (22:12)

Other people make very sensible points all the time.

John Bruin (22:15)

Merry Christmas Max and Barry.

Jonathan Wilson (22:17)

Merry Christmas.

John Bruin (22:18)

Christmas to all the listeners.

Jonathan Wilson (22:20)

Happy Christmas, everyone.

Max Barry (22:22)

Buona pare a tutti.

Barry Glendenning (22:24)

I think I make the same joke every year about eating your panettone.

Max Barry (22:28)

But do eat your panettone or your Pandora if you prefer, because they're both delicious. Time for your French lesson.

John Bruin (22:40)

Hi, all.

Max Barry (22:41)

Mark Langen here and I'd just like to wish Max Barry, producer Joel and.

John Bruin (22:45)

All of the Football Weekly listeners a.

Max Barry (22:47)

Merry Christmas and a happy New Year.

John Bruin (22:50)

Enjoy your dinner. I will be going for a seafood starter, cockles, prawns and lobster tail, followed by a main course of two meat turkey and then either ham or beef with roast potatoes, pigs in blankets, sausage.

Barry Glendenning (23:04)

Meat and those all important Yorkshire puddings.

John Bruin (23:06)

Followed by sticky toffee pudding and custard. Happy New Year.

Max Barry (23:11)

Thank you. More Football Weekly regulars with Christmas messages for you. I hope they were nice. I haven't heard them yet. My friends Rob and Josh say they've fixed football Wilson in this way, flat ticket prices play on as a general refereeing principle that trumps other rules. You can pick out your favorite for this penalty for handball only if it's deliberate and stops the ball going in. Fouled player takes the penalty. I'm a big fan of that one. You can kick off as quickly as you want after the opponent have scored. Mandatory score from the halfway line. Challenge at halftime. No seedings in tournaments. European cup is played only by league winners. Return of the Cup Winners Cup Man City demoted to the National League. Starting 11 must have five players from the home nation. League cup renamed after staple food items. Milk, bread, egg, Etc. Your thoughts?

Jonathan Wilson (23:58)

They're terrible.

Max Barry (24:00)

Oh, Happy Christmas to you. Any other?

Jonathan Wilson (24:04)

Well, they just. It's just like. I mean, they're just terrible. Why? The only one that might conceivably work is naming the League cup after food products. Okay, maybe removing seedlings, but the champions only in the. In the Champions Cup.

Barry Glendenning (24:21)

So.

Jonathan Wilson (24:23)

The stronger tournament then becomes the Europa League. How does that help anybody? You know, it's a cosmetic change. It doesn't address the basic problem of inequality. Handball only for balls going in. So you're allowed to just sort of, you know, catch the ball and punt it. Clear. If the ball isn't going in. What does deliberate mean? We know we can't prove what that is. What's the point of this?

Max Barry (24:44)

I'm just a messenger.

Jonathan Wilson (24:46)

Your mates are terrible.

Max Barry (24:47)

Get better mates.

Jonathan Wilson (24:48)

Okay, I flat ticket price. What you're charging the same for for years. Manchester United versus Arsenal as you are for your Dagenham versus Crawley.

Max Barry (25:00)

I mean, I. I quite like a fouled player. Takes the penalty, John.

Jonathan Wilson (25:03)

Oh, but he might be injured. So what do you do then?

John Bruin (25:05)

Well, even better. Even better. You know, it does that. Escape to victory or something? No, I mean, I quite like that you can kick off as quickly as you want after the opponent scores. That's good. You know that. I mean, because there are some ludicrous celebrations now for, you know, a goal scored by, you know, Portsmouth to name a club that Jonathan has already cried.

Max Barry (25:26)

Why are Portsmouth not allowed to sell?

John Bruin (25:28)

Well, that was just a random one, but, you know. Well, you know, it slagged them off compared to, you know, Tottenham standing in the game.

Barry Glendenning (25:37)

I. I think that would revolutionize the game if everyone was allowed to celebrate calls as much as they want. Except Portsmouth, who are only allowed to pathe new style manly handshakes as they run back to the halfway line.

John Bruin (25:53)

Not even a shake of the hands, just an acknowledgment of the eyebrow. And then back to the halfway line and continue. That's all that you like. That's the. The pompey dictator.

Max Barry (26:03)

Even a smile and the goal is disallowed. Literally. That totally. They're not allowed anything.

John Bruin (26:11)

Yeah.

Barry Glendenning (26:12)

So like that year they won the FA Cup. Yeah. If anyone smiled at the trophy lift, y', all, we're taking it away from you.

Max Barry (26:22)

Oh, look, they were just some ideas. Look, no such thing as a bad idea there. Thank you.

Barry Glendenning (26:26)

I think there were several bad ideas.

Max Barry (26:30)

Oh, I quite like no seedings in tournaments. Is that.

John Bruin (26:33)

Is that.

Max Barry (26:34)

I think that could.

Barry Glendenning (26:35)

Yeah, I like that. Well, I mean, it wouldn't affect saying if, if it's the Euros, the World cup, it wouldn't adversely affect Ireland, put it that way. And not because we're not. We wouldn't be in it if we were there. We're going to be low seed.

Max Barry (26:54)

Andy Simi says who should win the second FIFA Peace Prize.

Barry Glendenning (26:57)

Barry, as far as I know, they now have a committee appointed to see who will get the second one. I think we all know Gianni and Fantino decided who would win the first one. So I was thinking it would be funny. And it's not entirely implausible that this committee, in the spirit of brown nosery that accompanies this prize, they awarded it to Gianni Infantino, the, the self award. So they FIFA awards the Peace Prize to its own president just to, you know, keep the, keep the feedback loop of self Congratulations well and truly closed. Possibly Tommy Robinson could get it. He's. I mean, he, he's football adjacent. He's. I think he's a Luton Town Fan. He's an England fan. He once spent three days in jail in Zurich after he was arrested for protesting on the rooftop of FIFA HQ because FIFA weren't going to let England players wear poppies on their jerseys. So, in the spirit of extending an olive branch, give it to Tommy Robson, who is a very peaceful man.

Jonathan Wilson (28:21)

I think what are you going to look at is it's one thing to win the Peace Prize, the hard things to retain it. I think Trump's got in his locker. I think he could dominate the early years of the Peace Prize as Real Madrid dominated the early years of the European Cup. And I think one of the things that really cemented the European cup in the popular consciousness was a truly great early champion. And I think Donald Trump can be that for the FIFA Peace Prize.

Max Barry (28:46)

Any advances?

John Bruin (28:48)

I'd like to make a prediction for December 2033 that I think Mohammed bin Salman might be a shoe in for the FIFA Peace Prize. I've just got this feeling, I don't know why, but I'm calling it now. I'm calling it now.

Barry Glendenning (29:09)

Well, he's another conspicuously peaceful man who has modernized his country largely through sport, so he would be a worthy winner, given the current criteria.

Max Barry (29:26)

Ticks a lot of boxes. Mr. Lancaster says how many combined West Ham and Tottenham managers will have been sacked by the time the new Universal Studios in Bedford opens? Just for context, the entertainment company said the transformative project was expected to attract more than 8 million visitors a year. Could open in 2031. So in 2031, what are we now, 20, 25? Five years, guys. How many Tottenham and West Ham managers will have been sacked?

Jonathan Wilson (29:54)

I reckon West Ham do about one a year and spurs do but one every. Yeah, one and a half, two years, depending if they are somehow maintaining Europa League run. So that's five from West Ham and either two or three from Spurs. Maybe West Ham do get on a good. Say, let's say seven combined.

Max Barry (30:12)

Seven combined. If somebody. I mean, obviously we need one listener to just keep an eye on when the Universal Studios in Bedford open and then takes a note of these guesses.

Jonathan Wilson (30:23)

These things never open on time, do they? So it could be. It could be sort of 2032 by the time it actually opens.

Max Barry (30:28)

Yeah, it could be. I mean, that's the thrill of the quiz, I guess.

Jonathan Wilson (30:31)

Yeah, I'll stick with seven. I've said seven. I'll stick with seven.

Max Barry (30:33)

Stick with seven. Okay.

John Bruin (30:34)

John Bruin, I suppose. Is there a crossover where Ange ends up managing West Ham? So you've got like, A, Yeah. And then Thomas Frank does a. Does a stint at West Ham.

Max Barry (30:45)

Yeah, he could do that. He could go there.

John Bruin (30:47)

Could. Could Graham. Could things go really bad and Graham Potter ends up, you know, as a caretaker at Tottenham? So it could be a big crossover here. I mean, what. How are we working this out?

Max Barry (30:58)

No, I think that's. I think they're all.

Barry Glendenning (31:00)

They.

Max Barry (31:00)

They all individually count. If, you know, if Ange gets sacked by West Ham, that is still another sacking.

John Bruin (31:06)

Do the. The new owners of Tottenham. New owners, I say the new owners that have been essentially heritage of the club today, did they decide that Daniel was right all along and bring Nuno back to Tottenham, his rightful kingdom where he was so popular last time?

Max Barry (31:21)

Yeah, also possible. But, you know, you have to factor all these into your guess. What I need, John, is your guess, because when we do the Christmas special in 2031, we'll answer.

John Bruin (31:30)

Okay.

Max Barry (31:31)

If, of course, while we're on a ride at Universal Studios, Bedford.

John Bruin (31:36)

Well, I'm gonna say West Ham, it's once every 18 months, a manager sacks every 18 months, possibly they bring back one manager again. So maybe Graham Potter gets another go. Does that count? Okay, and then, yeah, spurs every two years. It is really, isn't it? That's your boom and bust cycle. So I can't work out the sums on that, but it's three plus four and a half or something. Seven and a half managers.

Jonathan Wilson (32:05)

Yeah, seven and a half.

Max Barry (32:07)

Okay, go. We got there in the end. Blimey.

Barry Glendenning (32:10)

Is it Universal Studios in the States where they have the Jaws ride?

Max Barry (32:15)

I mean, possibly.

Barry Glendenning (32:16)

I don't really have anything of interest to contribute to the manager where Sam Sparrow's manager thingy. But I do remember, I think on the Rest Is Entertainment podcast, Marina Hyde and Richard Osmond were talking about this Universal Studios thing in Bedford. And Richard Osmond revealed the interesting tidbit of information that on that Jaws ride, when the shark comes out to inverter commas attack the people on the ride, the place where the shark comes out, if instead of looking at the shark because everyone looks right, to look at the shark. If you look the other way, that's where Steven Spielberg's office is. And. But no one ever sees him because everyone's looking the other direction. So that's where he built his office.

Jonathan Wilson (33:06)

Right. And did you get one of the Bedford?

John Bruin (33:08)

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Barry Glendenning (33:09)

I don't know.

Max Barry (33:12)

Or will he be fired by the spurs hierarchy where they realize they've made a mistake and they wanted a really good documentary. So they've got Steven Spielberg to manage Spurs. Arn says we're on to Wilson's books. Which managers coaches footballers. Have you met that said they have read Inverting the Pyramid?

Jonathan Wilson (33:29)

Well, Sean Dyche definitely has. He mentioned it in a press conference shortly after taking over Nottingham Forest.

Barry Glendenning (33:34)

So in what, what context did he mention it? What did he say?

Jonathan Wilson (33:38)

He was. He was being asked, I think about the return of more direct football. And he said that if you, if you read Inverting the Pyramid you would see that old ideas are always recurring and nothing lasts forever. And he did say it was a very good read, that that was his exact phrase. So I've always had a lot of time for Sean Dyche. As you know, I've always been a big fan of his and I think he was proving his worth at Nottingham Forest. Craig Levine definitely has read it. David Pleat has read it. I don't know beyond that.

Max Barry (34:09)

Okay, that's just a good three. Did you feel 10ft tall when Sean Dyce says if you've read Inverting the Pyramid, you'll know.

Jonathan Wilson (34:16)

Well, it was very early in his not imposed tenure so I was a little anxious that given how his Everton tenure ended that and given the. Craig Levine he talked about it when he played that 460 against Czech Republic which didn't work so I was slightly worried things would go awry. But it turns out he's absorbed Lessons of a book very well. Fair play. Well done, Sean.

John Bruin (34:37)

Actually, that was what I was going to ask actually. Are you hated in Scotland because you begat the four six zero?

Jonathan Wilson (34:45)

Yes, but I mean that's nothing to do with that.

John Bruin (34:48)

It's not the influence of Luciano Spalletti, it's Jonathan Wilson that brought this pox on the Scottish game and the fact that they've. I think he's Australian, isn't he? Lyndon Dykes that they had to get a sexual finder striker. Yeah, he. He was the answer to no longer playing forces. And Steve Clark of course, does Steve Clark. Has Steve Clark read Inverted A period? I'm guessing no.

Jonathan Wilson (35:10)

Well, something maybe could ask him before they. They have those whatever friendlies they've got in March. Okay.

Max Barry (35:16)

I'm not sure anyone will but you know, if, if one of the press packet. The Scottish press pack is listening.

John Bruin (35:21)

Ewan Murray.

Max Barry (35:25)

Rory says Happy Christmas team. Quick question for the Christmas mailbag. What football books, recent or classic, would you recommend asking Santa for P S? I've read most of Jonathan's back catalog already, thoroughly enjoyed them. So read this part out which will cover the Plug and he can answer it more truthfully. Cheers, Rory. So a a football book, past or present, that you would recommend for our listeners?

Jonathan Wilson (35:46)

Wilson I'm really struggling not to say States of Play by our friend Miguel Delaney, but I think I am going to say that because it is really good and it does tell you what's going on. And also he'll be furious if I don't say that. Among the Thugs by Bill Buford I read recently, which came out in 1990, and it's a much better book than I was expecting. I also what does a if it's sort of member of the American literati, what can he possibly tell me about hooliganism? But actually it turns out quite a lot because he got quite involved with United hooligans in the 80s and sort of admits he kind of got carried away by it and sort of got a real thrill from the violence. So it was a kind of a really sort of revealing of how intoxicating that adrenaline rush can be. Helmut Shern's autobiography I've read recently is really good. There's a bit on the Thighborne of Dresden, where he was an air raid warden is just four or five pages of absolutely incredible descriptive prose, whether it's a football book or not. It's so moving when he loses his father for three days. His father's 87 and he's sort of searching through the ruined city looking for his dad. So yeah, that's, that's. I think I came out in 1978, but I'm sure you can still, still get hold of a copy. So yeah, they'd be my three.

Barry Glendenning (36:54)

I don't really read football books. I don't read football books and I don't read listen to football podcasts because I spend an inordinate amount of time talking about, writing about and watching football. So when I have downtime, I prefer to read books that aren't about football. Ideally a good murder. Eamon Dunphy's It's Only Game was considered one of the great football books when it came out. Dunphy, this journeyman Irish footballer and now professional contrarian. After he retired, he became a journalist and pundit and broadcaster. Not just writing about football, but all sorts of, you know, Irish politics, that kind of thing. Professional contrarian. So that, that's a good book. I remember reading when I was just trying to Google it there it was like a fly on the wall or behind the scenes book. At Coventry City, Gordon Strachan was in charge. Some book was invited behind the Scenes to you Know, spend time with the team. And he wrote a book. I can't remember what it's called. I really enjoyed that. I. I like all Michael Calvin's football books. I think he's a great writer about the game. I have. If I look over my right shoulder here I have the Power and the Glory, A new history of the World cup signed by the author Jonathan Wilson.

Jonathan Wilson (38:28)

Wow.

Barry Glendenning (38:29)

Which I spent £25 on at his book launch, only to discover the following day that I could have got it for 12 quid somewhere else. So that made. That makes me sad. Wilson owes me £13. So I'm. I'm gonna try and read that over Christmas. And I've heard it is very good. Not just from the author. I've heard from other people that it's very good. Ellis James was bigging it up recently, actually. Yeah.

Max Barry (38:58)

But Ellis I think would sort of fanboy Wilson a bit too much. I don't think you can trust Ellis. His judgment on Wilson books, I would say. John.

John Bruin (39:08)

Yeah. I'm looking just on my shelf there between a book about Bob Dylan and one about Hawkwind. The Power and the Glory is there. For which I paid Barry nothing. But there you go. I also have read among the Thugs. Years ago I managed to speak to a couple. Few of the people that were actually interviewed in that were part of the. For a piece I did on Hoogism. But actually a football book that I like very much is this. It is called Football is a Funny Old Game. It's by Saint and Grievesy.

Jonathan Wilson (39:46)

Yes.

John Bruin (39:47)

And I got this when I was 11 or 12.

Barry Glendenning (39:50)

Okay.

John Bruin (39:51)

From my mum and dad. I'll read one passage from it talking about fans that they'd meet. And I'll. I won't do it in Greasy's accent, but imagine it in a Dagenham accent. I think that's where Greasy was from. Was from that way. Anyway. There was old Johnny Goldstein, Johnny the Stick. He used to deal in tickets. And his minder, One Arm Lou. Johnny was a bit tasty. And he used to have an interest in a club called Suki's, which I hasten to add, I never frequented but was well known to visiting teams. The craze were regular visitors. So that gives you a nice taste of 60s London 60s football from Jimmy Greaves there. Yeah. All the banter. Good shankly stories from the Saint. I picked that up for zero pound zero one, you know, 0.1 pence. And it's essentially whatever the. The decimalization is these days. Very good. Enjoyed it.

Max Barry (40:46)

Cost 1D it's really good. That bigs up big two bob.

Barry Glendenning (40:52)

The Coventry City book I was talking about is called Staying up by Rick Gikowski.

Jonathan Wilson (40:57)

Got it.

Barry Glendenning (40:58)

And it is. He's a Coventry fan who was allowed behind the scenes for the 1997.98 season. And if I'm not mistaken, it's in this book that it's revealed Noel Whelan was playing up front for Coventry that season and he was a. A young lad fond of a nightclub and a pint and a late night. So Gordon Strachan made him move into his house so he had to live with Mr. And Mrs. Strachan so they could keep an eye on young Noel, just to try and curb his. His errant ways. So it obviously worked because it stayed off.

Max Barry (41:39)

But what a squad there, you know, what are we talking? We're talking.

Barry Glendenning (41:42)

That's got to be Haji, the use of Chippo, isn't it? That.

Max Barry (41:47)

That's gotta be the Augie's in there, I reckon. Gary Mack, Gary Breen, Huckabee Dion, maybe Gary Mack. Yeah. Sean Flynn, Willie Bo. I go. Marcus hall, probably Willie Boland.

Jonathan Wilson (41:59)

God.

Max Barry (42:01)

Anyway, that'll do for part two. Here are some more messages from the Football Weekly family.

Barry Glendenning (42:11)

Hi, Max, Barry and all the listeners.

Max Barry (42:14)

This is Paul Watson saying Happy Christmas.

John Bruin (42:16)

To everyone and I hope all your wishes for the new year come true, especially if they involve Kurosaw beating Germany.

Jonathan Wilson (42:24)

Hello, Guardian Football Weekly listeners.

Max Barry (42:27)

Many thanks for your continued support this year.

Barry Glendenning (42:29)

It's still a dream to be part of the Football Weekly rotation. I understand my place has to be earned every single minute on and off.

Jonathan Wilson (42:39)

The pod, and it is always an honour to be selected. I hope you all have a wonderful.

Max Barry (42:45)

Holiday and if it is a difficult.

Barry Glendenning (42:47)

Time for you, that you can find comfort in the football, or if not in the football, in the musings of your favourite panelists. I know I always do. Take care of yourselves and each other.

John Bruin (43:01)

Hello. Hello.

Barry Glendenning (43:02)

Max and Barry. Or is it Barry and Max? I don't know, actually. Do you have a particular order?

Max Barry (43:07)

Are you a bit like antidec?

Barry Glendenning (43:09)

I'm sure Barry's loving the comparison to a pair of Geordie heroes. I mean, are they even heroes? Let's not talk about Geordie heroes at the moment. It's the wrong time.

Jonathan Wilson (43:17)

Anyway.

Barry Glendenning (43:17)

Hello, listeners as well. Just a quick note from me, Sam, to say Merry Christmas. Thank you. Thank you so much for putting up with my drivel over the course of the year. I hope you all get some lovely downtime.

Max Barry (43:27)

I hope you have a really stupendous.

Barry Glendenning (43:30)

I don't know why I used that word. I was just trying to think of a new word.

Max Barry (43:32)

A stupendous time over the holiday period.

Barry Glendenning (43:35)

I hope your football teams win.

John Bruin (43:36)

Unless you are a Burnley or a.

Barry Glendenning (43:37)

Manchester United fan because you're playing my football team and I will be in the away end. So I hope your football teams lose. Be a Merry Christmas, happy New Year, speak to you in 2026.

Jonathan Wilson (43:46)

Hopefully if I get booked.

Max Barry (43:53)

Boost Mobile is now sending experts nationwide to deliver and set up customers new phones. Wait, we're going on tour? We're delivering and setting up customers phones. It's not a tour.

Jonathan Wilson (44:01)

Not with that attitude.

Max Barry (44:02)

Introducing store to door switch and get.

Barry Glendenning (44:04)

A new device with expert setup and delivery. Delivery available for select devices purchased@boostmobile.com knock knock.

John Bruin (44:09)

Ooh, who's there?

Barry Glendenning (44:10)

A Boost Mobile expert here to deliver and set up your all new iPhone 17 Pro designed to be the most powerful iPhone ever.

Jonathan Wilson (44:16)

You called that a knock knock joke. This isn't a joke.

Barry Glendenning (44:19)

Boost Mobile really sends experts to deliver and set up your phone at home or work.

Jonathan Wilson (44:22)

Okay.

John Bruin (44:23)

It's just that when people say knock.

Barry Glendenning (44:24)

Knock, there's usually a joke to go with it.

Max Barry (44:26)

Like I said, this isn't a joke.

Barry Glendenning (44:28)

So the knock knock was just you knocking?

Jonathan Wilson (44:30)

Yeah, that's how doors work.

Barry Glendenning (44:31)

Get the new iPhone 17 Pro delivered and set up by an expert wherever you are. Delivery available for select devices purchased@boostmobile.com terms apply. To Max Barry and most importantly all the listeners. This is Seb here. Merry Christmas to you all and my advice over this period is, you know, try not to allow your team's bad.

Max Barry (45:00)

Results to bring you down.

Barry Glendenning (45:02)

And if they get a good result.

Max Barry (45:04)

Don'T get too excited because they'll only.

Barry Glendenning (45:06)

Have a bad result next time. Anyway, wishing you all the best and over the festive period.

Jonathan Wilson (45:12)

Dear listeners, thank you very much for.

Max Barry (45:13)

Another year of committing to listening to the Guardian Football Weekly and many thanks to Max Barry and producer Joel for their sterling work, for making sure we're award winning and making sure that I.

John Bruin (45:28)

Can put that on my cv, obviously. Just remember listeners, that if you don't get what you want for Christmas, that.

Max Barry (45:34)

I've just bought my wife a 199697 retro Stockport county kit inspired by the.

John Bruin (45:43)

Romania shirts of that era.

Max Barry (45:45)

And she will be fuming when she finds out.

Jonathan Wilson (45:49)

Max Barry, I thought stick to brand. Hello from Stoke City. Merry Christmas.

Barry Glendenning (45:54)

Happy New Year when it comes.

Jonathan Wilson (45:56)

What a year it's been. FSA Awards winning that back.

John Bruin (46:00)

I mean, I did that Video Shout.

Jonathan Wilson (46:01)

Out to shout out and no, no thanks to me. Hey, but you know, hey ho, we're a team and I'll take the victory.

Barry Glendenning (46:06)

As part of the team.

Jonathan Wilson (46:08)

You know, it's been a roller coaster year. We've got a very exciting World cup that no, none of us will be able to get to, to look forward to. So yeah, here's to 2026. Cheers. Hi, this is Barney. Happy Christmas, Max. Happy Christmas, Barry. And more importantly, happy, happy Christmas to all the Football Weekly listener family, which is a functional family and would never have one of those days where everyone argues about meat cooking times or watches Paddington in pointed silence. Obviously for me every Football Weekly day is Christmas Day and every statement on the pod is a message of peace and goodwill. But this is my Christmas Christmas message. Christmas Squared and like all the other messages, that definitely makes sense. So you all wishes and have a peaceful break everyone.

Max Barry (47:00)

Thank you for those messages. Let's do part three. Sam says hi Max Barry, Football Weekly producers and guest. Merry Christmas to you all. Before my question, just highlighting from the last episode, what could be the biggest case of the pot calling the kettle black when Barry said that the new Celtic manager, Wilfred Nancy does a lot of speaking that says a lot but doesn't really mean much, does somebody. As somebody who's listened to over 14000 minutes of this pod this year according to my Spotify wrapped. There have been numerous times I've listened to Barry and guests and thought what on earth are they on about? My question to you all times you've interviewed somebody and thought the same. Thanks very much. Merry Christmas to you all from Sam, a Leighton Orient fan. Here's a picture of Barry at the Orient taken from my seat appearing on a rooftop trying to roll a cigarette in the rain. And it is a bit. That is the very. That is the terrace that I stood on to watch us win 31 in the COVID promotion season. So yeah, an interview where the guest is you thought was talking nonsense.

Barry Glendenning (47:58)

That's 233 hours he spent listening to us this year. That's, that's 10, almost 10 full days. 24 hour days.

Max Barry (48:12)

Is everything. Sounds like a cry for help. Sam, is everything okay? Crikey, I'm trying to think so.

Jonathan Wilson (48:18)

Bad interviews?

Max Barry (48:19)

Yeah, I've done so many.

Jonathan Wilson (48:20)

I mean the two stand out. I, I don't, I don't think they're necessarily kind of people waffling on because the thing is, if people are waffling on you can always sort of extract little bits. But the two interviews that were just really dreadful to rise for Sal. Just before year 2004, there was like an England squad get together, I think, in Sardinia, and loads of journalists went over there. We journalists got paired up and then we each got a player, then we each got another player. And the idea was we pulled all the quotes and I was with Jason Burt, he's now at the Telegraph, and we got. I think we got Owen Hargreaves second, and he was fine. He talks a lot. He's a good talker. But Darius Fasal had been training apart from the rest of the squad because he had some injury. And so the first question was, how's the groin? And he was like, that's fine. Well, weren't you training apart? Oh, yeah, no, I was training apart. Genuinely couldn't remember 30 minutes earlier, he'd been training apart from the rest of the squad because he had a groin injury. So Darius Vassell was pretty bad. But actually, the one I remember just for being just completely needlessly chippy and aggressive, was the Carlisle manager, Paul Simpson. Right. Now, this must have been early August, opening day of the season, 2005, 6. Because it was the Saturday of the Edgbaston test. And I got sent by the Independent to do Wickham v. Carlisle. Maybe the Community Shield was. Yeah, the Community Shield was the following day. And obviously everybody was just watching the Edgebaston test in the press box. Nobody cared about this game. It finished 1 1. But Wickham hit the. Hit the woodwork three times. So we go at the press conference, there's me and two children there. There's, like, nobody else there. So there's a. There's a onus on me to ask the questions, which is not necessarily my forte. And I saw the first question was. Got away with that bit, Paul. And he was like, what do you mean? You don't get a golf. We're hitting the woodwork, do you? No, you don't. No, that's absolutely right. Well done. Like, just. I don't. I thought. I thought he went down to my estimation.

Max Barry (50:26)

Did you say, I've come a long way for this, I've come a long way for this. Or was it in Wickham, in which case Chippy as possible. Fair enough. Yeah. I mean, I have so many. I mean, Jeremy Piven, who was in Entourage, I think a famous actor on Soccer M, who maybe didn't say anything. I don't think he said it like. I don't think he answered any of my questions. There was one interview, a phone interview. That me and Helen did on soccer with Ian Rush, where every time I asked him a question, he couldn't hear what I'd said. So. So Helen would ask a question, he'd answer it, I'd ask the question, go, I didn't hear that.

Jonathan Wilson (51:04)

And then.

Max Barry (51:04)

And then I'd have to keep repeating my questions to Ian Rush. Like, the fifth time, it's so being like, is he. Is he in on this? Mel B. Not a great one.

Barry Glendenning (51:12)

Didn't Mel B get up and leave in the middle of Europe?

Jonathan Wilson (51:15)

Yeah.

Max Barry (51:15)

No, she left in an ad break. And Dev was dressed as Jason Lee trying to running after at the car park in a Labat's Not In Forest shirt. And she still left to get some chicken. But, yeah, I mean, too many to so many bad ones. And the thing about doing them live is you do feel mid interview that you basically want to die. You know, like, you're just like. This is. You know, what you want to do is say, we all know this is going badly. Can we just do something else, please? But you just sort of have to keep just trying your very hardest. John.

John Bruin (51:48)

I remember going to interview Clarence Seedorf and Matthew Flamini in Milan. Sounds quite good, right? Except that they would only talk about the health products that they were sponsoring. So that whenever I was asked a question about actual football, they pointed to the pr and the interview was terminated. In Matthew Fleming, his case, I actually interviewed him many years later in a restaurant, and we got on famously, but we were talking more about health products. It's obviously his thing. This is more from a press conference. Nigel Atkins, when it's Southampton manager, just suddenly started performing the poem the man in the Glass when talking about how things weren't going so well. Do you know the man in the glass?

Max Barry (52:39)

I don't know the man in the Glass.

John Bruin (52:40)

Well, I'm gonna read it, so.

Max Barry (52:41)

So I set the scene so you're there and, you know, someone says, you know, how's it all going, Nigel? And he's.

Barry Glendenning (52:47)

Any knocked?

Max Barry (52:48)

Yeah, yeah.

John Bruin (52:50)

Thoughts on the game, Nigel? Yeah.

Jonathan Wilson (52:53)

And.

John Bruin (52:55)

He came up with this, which. Which is written by. Which is called Dale Wimbro. And he said, when you get what you want in your struggle for self and the world makes you king for a day, then go to the mirror and look at yourself and see what that man has to say. He isn't your father, your mother or wife. That reflection you see on the glass, the man that you meet face to face in the light is the man who will judge you at last. Now that was before high performance. Nigel Atkins was ahead of his time.

Barry Glendenning (53:23)

Didn't Nigel Atkins. I think it was during COVID He used to do these. He'd go for his morning walk every day and he'd, you know, video himself out walking in the woods somewhere. I think he was dog with him and he'd be, you know, very perky. Got up this morning, had some muesli for breakfast and fruit. Now I'm out walking, the sun is shining, everything is lovely, the dog is happy. And it was, yeah, basically a motivational speech for all his, his followers. And after watching them for a couple of weeks, I was thinking I would go to war for Nigel Atkins. I would run through a brick wall for Nigel Adkins. Because it was at a time everyone was just fed up, stock indoors, pissed off and I, I started to actively seek out now, you know, I looked forward to Nigel Atkins's daily, daily pep talk and I be, I became invested in Nigel Atkins's career. You know, Nigel Atkins has been fired by whoever. I'm like, oh, that's sad. Poor old Nigel. But Nigel will be all right. You know, Nigel's got things in perspective. And now you've just reminded me I'd completely forgotten about the existence of Nigel Atkins. I hope, I hope Nigel's okay. Is he, is he working anywhere or. I think must be retired age. But he's very sprightly, like. I don't know if he's retirement age but he's, he's a young retirement age, a young looking one, if you know what I mean.

Max Barry (54:59)

He was most recently the manager and technical director of Tranmere Rovers.

John Bruin (55:03)

Okay, back to his territories from around that way, isn't he? I, I had a similar lockdown thing with Mark Crossley. And did you see this Mark Crossley normally his walks.

Max Barry (55:14)

Yeah, he does, he did walks.

John Bruin (55:17)

Mental health thing. I thought it was quite inspiring as well. Would I go to war for Mark Crossley? I'm not sure.

Max Barry (55:23)

But still situation where Mark Crossley is running the country and has introduced conscription, including those approaching 50, you know, so you're up, John, you know, anything for you, Mark.

Barry Glendenning (55:38)

But I can imagine Mark Crossley, you know, sitting in a trench with his back to the trench wall sharing his cigarettes with you.

John Bruin (55:47)

Yeah.

Barry Glendenning (55:48)

You know, maybe on Christmas Day someone chucks the football out into no man's land marker, be out, you know, put, put two bayonets in the ground and then stand between them, invite Germans to take penalties against him. He'd saved them all. Of course.

Max Barry (56:03)

Of course he would. Yeah, yeah, he'd Say from hell hair. Leticia would miss, wouldn't he?

Jonathan Wilson (56:10)

Of course.

Barry Glendenning (56:10)

So I think, I think, I don't, I'm not necessarily sure I'd go to war for Mark Crosby, because I don't think Mark Crossley would ever be a general like Nigel Adkins. But I'd say Crossley be good fella to have beside you in the trenches. He'd, you know, as I say, share his fags. He'd show you pictures of his sweetheart back in Barnsley or wherever it is.

John Bruin (56:33)

Yeah, and good cluffy stories as you sat out. Yeah.

Barry Glendenning (56:37)

His tin hat would be tipped at a jaunty angle, chin strapped, angling down.

Jonathan Wilson (56:42)

But then there'd be a grenade would be thrown and he'd throw himself on top of it and you'd know there's like a 1 in 10 chance it's going to just squirm underneath him and he's not actually going to stop it.

Max Barry (56:54)

Brad says, we've all heard about Barry's header. What's the best goal the other members of the panel have scored?

John Bruin (57:01)

John, I'm not sure I could tell this story, but it was actually just a pickup game with some friends. But I scored a hat trick when I was at Sheffield University playing with some friends and the night before I'd been doing lsd, so it was a fantastic experience.

Max Barry (57:22)

Jonathan Wilson, I'm guessing yours doesn't involve lsd. I mean, there was the smart money an. And it's probably with a hockey stick.

Jonathan Wilson (57:31)

But anyway, no, no, I, I, I've basically, my entire life, I've been obsessed by Ronnie Whelan's curler for Liverpool against Manchester united of the 1983 League Cup Final, which I now look back at, and it's Gary Bailey's positioning's horrible and he doesn't move his feet fast enough, but it just, he sets off miles right at the post and arcs back and I, I kept trying to score that goal, which for a right back is difficult. He's going to be on the left wing and it was once I played a game of Gated Stadium and I hit the angle of post and bar with an effort from that kind of position. There was a game in India where I took the ball from a throw in, cut in field and it went in, but I caught a bit heavy, so in the middle of the goal, so it wasn't quite right. And I sort of was thinking, they're the only two chances I'm ever going to get. And then there was a college game, my third year at university. We Had a corner, it was cleared to halfway, it was played back. So I ended up on the wrong side of the pitch and cutting onto my right foot. It was against Christchurch Thirds and they had a first team right back playing for some reason.

Max Barry (58:32)

Tough place to go. Tough place to go.

Jonathan Wilson (58:33)

No, it was home. It was home. It was on the Masters field. The Jarrett Walk and little step over, dragged it back, nutmegged him with it and set it out. And it arced in about an inch under the bar and an inch inside the post. And I looked up to my left and you could see the steps from the English Faculty library coming down, which, if anybody's seen Endeavour, the English Faculty Library, the outside of it is what they use for the outside of the new police station in Endeavour. And who should be coming down the steps but the actor, Rory Kinnear, although he wasn't an actor at the time, he was just a year below me.

Max Barry (59:09)

I mean, I have. I RECKON I'm pushing 100 goals in my career, that's what I reckon, but I haven't counted.

Barry Glendenning (59:16)

But I think it'll be a lot more.

Max Barry (59:18)

No, I don't think. I've never that, you know, you must.

Barry Glendenning (59:21)

Have played 3, 000 games of football.

Max Barry (59:24)

I don't know if I played 3,000, but I suppose if I played regularly, you know, week in, week out. Like proper games.

Barry Glendenning (59:33)

Proper.

Max Barry (59:33)

Like organized games. I didn't play a lot, from sort of 11 to 15, but proper, who knows how many games. But I did once. I scored the Zola volley against Norwich through the legs once or away at Carl shorten and. And the world stopped because no one could quite believe what had happened because I wasn't really known for doing that kind of thing. But that is the one that sticks. That sticks with me as probably the greatest goal I've ever scored. Tom says, could we have the story of the head of police? So it seems only right, Barry, if you could tell it as if it' the first time you've ever told it. And one day we will put them all together.

Jonathan Wilson (60:16)

We will.

Max Barry (60:16)

We will at one point compile them all and put them all together and just see what happens. I know there's a beaver. I know beaver's involved. I can't remember who's running down the wing.

Barry Glendenning (60:26)

Michael Littleton.

Max Barry (60:27)

That's it. Michael Littleton. We have tried to get them on the pod. We didn't this year, but we have in the past.

Barry Glendenning (60:32)

I. I made a genuine effort to get Michael Littleton on the pod and he. He was too shy, quite Possibly can't remember the auspicious occasion, but he has seen the David Squire's cartoon of the goal that was in the Football Weekly annual. So he was quite chuffed with that.

Max Barry (60:54)

Producer Joel says, we, we have managed to book Zoran Mamdani this year, but Michael Littleton evades us once again.

Barry Glendenning (61:03)

The problem with, with tracking down Beaver is that I can't remember Beaver's name right. He's not actually called Beaver.

Max Barry (61:14)

He still doesn't go as Beaver as he's a 53 year old.

Barry Glendenning (61:19)

He might go as Beaver. I mean I've a mate called Midgie who's always been. I've known him since I was 4 as Midgie then. He's Midgie now. Some nicknames just stick. Yeah. So it's, it's on the, the pitch at my school called Wembley. Yeah. Doesn't have twin towers, doesn't have stands, doesn't have seats, doesn't have an arch, anything like that.

John Bruin (61:46)

Just not even a box park, Barry. Not even a box park?

Barry Glendenning (61:49)

No, no, no box park, nothing. We're just playing our usual after school game. Michael Littleton picks up the ball on the left wing, dribbles the length of the field, beating man after man after man, then has to cut back because if he hadn't cut back then I wouldn't be as far out from the goal as I remember being when I met the ball when he crossed it. So he cuts back. So probably near the halfway line and sends across. I'm somewhere between the halfway line and the penalty area.

Max Barry (62:29)

Got it.

Barry Glendenning (62:30)

Truth be told, there was no actual penalty area. There were no markings on the pitch.

Max Barry (62:36)

The first time you told me this, it was a much bigger game than this. But anyway, carry on.

Barry Glendenning (62:41)

I'm not sure it was okay. So I, I leap. I'm like, like one of those Australian football rules players. You know how high they can.

Max Barry (62:52)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Barry Glendenning (62:53)

And they kind of hang in the air. So it was a bit like that. But I wasn't wearing a sleeveless vest that was extra tight and really short shorts and I, yeah, closed my eyes, arced my neck and flung my head at the ball. Met it perfectly. It arrows towards the goal and the next bit, I'm not quite sure of it either, hit the post, hit Beaver and went in, which would make it a known goal. So it doesn't actually count. The. Luckily there was no VAR back in those days. This would have been around 1990, 91. Whereas Beaver got a finger to it or got a paw to it, whatever. Beavers have a Claw. Beaver got a claw to it, knocked it onto the post and it dropped over the line. So I'm going to go with that and luckily there's no footage so I can't go back and check. So my version is that beaver tipped it onto the post and it went in.

Max Barry (63:58)

I mean you were saying a second ago that you know, you got addicted to Nigel Atkins. The fact that anyone has carried on listening to your 5th consecutive annual description of that headed goal which I think most, most years is an own goal but this year is, it seems like you're getting credited with it. Thank you for still listening and we'll finish with this from Tom who says hey team, I've been listening for years. This is my first email. I just wanted to say how much I loved Barry talking about his is Progress. I'm a 29 year old bloke but due to 4 open heart surgeries amongst other medical adventures, running and cardiovascular activities have never been my strong point. In 2023 I lost my best mate and decided to do a challenge to raise money. Five months after he passed, I ran a 10k in an hour and 18 minutes. Having never run before, I wanted to try and push myself one further. In April this year I ran London landmarks in 2 hours 37 with my dad to raise money for the hospital that looked after me as a child. I feel like social media makes us believe that all men run 20 minute 5ks but if you're not pbing then you're not working hard enough. I absolutely loved hearing Barry congratulate himself on running an unbroken 5K. The progress he's made in 10 weeks is brilliant. I wish we had more stories like this. I also studied a masters in sports psychology and all research shows it's important to celebrate all milestones as it makes you more likely to stick with the process when times get tough. I mean he's like he's. He celebrated the milestone of scoring ahead 40 years ago about 100 times. So there we are. I hope Barry's enjoying the training and feeling benefits beyond the physical. He's smashing it. Big love Tom. So yeah, finally Barry, another push for your half marathon and we'll raise some more money for Great Ormond Street.

Barry Glendenning (65:29)

Yeah, I have to go and run three and a half miles when we're finished this and I have to do it fast because I then we, we have a meeting in the office around lunchtime. So yeah, I've raised over 21000 already which is mind blowing. So if anyone would like to donate sparingly netting, just giving, I'm not enjoying the training, running, it sucks, it really does suck. But I, I had to go for a checkup yesterday at the doctor's surgery. Just the sort of mot. The nurse was asking me the questions and she was like, do you smoke? I said, well I, I was quite a heavy smoker, but I haven't smoked in 19 months, haven't touched a fag. And she's like, oh, that's really good. Yeah. And she said, what kind of exercise, if any, do you do? I said, oh, well, I'm, I'm training for a half marathon, so I'm doing a lot of exercise. You know, I used to be quite sedentary, did a bit of walking, but now I'm running four or five times a week. And she's like, oh great. And then the killer question, and do you drink? And the thing is, when the doctor, most men of my acquaintance anyway, if the doctor asked them, they always have the amount, you know, so if it's 20 pints a week, they say they drink 10. But I think doctors know this, so whatever you say, they double. So you, I didn't, you don't know whether to tell the truth or tell a lie. So I, I just went with the truth. And then she asked me if I'd ever thought about getting help and recommended their in house alcohol counselor. So yeah, it was all going very swimmingly until that question. But you know, we live in an era now where four pints is a binge. So yeah, it's, it's woke. Nonsense, Max.

John Bruin (67:31)

I, I, I too have had that conversation. Barry.

Max Barry (67:33)

Yeah.

John Bruin (67:35)

You know, you drunk how many last night? Four pints. Yeah, yeah, that's, you know, that's just getting started there, you know.

Barry Glendenning (67:45)

Yeah.

Max Barry (67:45)

Feels a per, feels a perfect place to end, doesn't it? The nurse asking the question we've all wanted to ask Barry. And she did it. So there we are. Thank you everybody. Happy Christmas to you and thank you to all our listeners. We appreciate that you listen to this and may you keep doing it And I hope 2026 is great for you. Thanks everybody. Thank you, Wilson.

Jonathan Wilson (68:06)

Cheers. Thank you. Merry Christmas.

Max Barry (68:08)

Thanks, John.

John Bruin (68:09)

Compliments of the season to you all.

Max Barry (68:11)

Thanks Barry.

Barry Glendenning (68:12)

Thank you. Merry Christmas, everybody.

Max Barry (68:14)

Football Weekly is produced by Joel Grove. Our executive producer is Phil Maynard.

Barry Glendenning (68:22)

This is the guardian.

Max Barry (68:27)

Foreign.

Barry Glendenning (68:32)

Hi, this is Robert Mase from the Athletic and today I want to talk to you about Boost Mobile.

Max Barry (68:36)

You know how the holidays can get.

Barry Glendenning (68:38)

With all the shopping, spending and stress between games, travel and everything else. It's a busy season for all of us.

Max Barry (68:43)

Boost Mobile is making it easy to.

Barry Glendenning (68:45)

Treat yourself and your wallet. When you bring your own device and switch to the $25 Unlimited plan, you get unlimited talk, text and video data for just $25 a month with no trade ins, no contracts and no hassle. So while you're checking everything else off.

Max Barry (68:59)

Your list, don't forget to put your own name on it, too, because simplifying.

Barry Glendenning (69:03)

Things is always a good game plan. Visit boostmobile.com to start saving. After 30GB, customers may experience slower speeds. Customers will pay $25 per month as long as they remain active on the Boost Unlimited plan.