Argentina avert disaster with controversial late comeback: World Cup Daily

Summary

Football Weekly – "Argentina avert disaster with late controversial comeback"

Guardian Podcasts | World Cup Daily (July 8, 2026)

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Episode Overview

In this breathless World Cup Daily episode, Max Rushden is joined by Barry Glendenning, Barney Ronay, and Archie Rhind-Tutt to break down Argentina’s wild 3-2 comeback against Egypt, a match packed with late drama, VAR controversy, and Messi-centric narrative. The panel also unpacks Switzerland’s penalty shootout triumph over Colombia, speculates on looming quarterfinals, and brings in US Soccer editor Alex Abnos to discuss the fallout of the USA’s exit and the circus around their campaign. The show closes with listener questions and reflections on the wider atmosphere at this extraordinary World Cup.

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1. Argentina 3 - 2 Egypt: A Late Escape and Controversy

[00:13 – 18:53]

Match Summary

• Argentina narrowly advanced to the quarterfinals, coming from 0-2 down with just over 10 minutes left, before clinching a 3-2 win in injury time.
• Lautaro Martínez’s cross set up Enzo Fernandez for a late header (“his header was textbook”). Messi missed a penalty; Egypt felt robbed by a non-given foul on Salah in the box.

Key Talking Points

• Goalkeeper Heroics
  • Mustafa Shabir praised for his “Inspector Gadget” saves (Archie Rhind-Tutt, [02:55]).
• Messi’s Performance and Penalties
  • Messi missed his second penalty of the tournament; panel baffled by his penalty woes.
    • “It makes no footballing sense that he’s bad at penalties” (Max Rushden, [00:49]).
    • “Maybe he becomes mortal in that moment... Maybe he can’t see the possibilities because it’s so linear” (Barney Ronay, [14:38]).
• VAR & Referee Criticism
  • Francois Letexier’s officiating dissected extensively:
    • Egypt denied a penalty after Salah was clipped by Alvarez before Argentina’s winner.
    • A glorious second for Egypt was chalked off for a foul many minutes earlier—contradicting the tournament’s “light touch refereeing.”
    • “If you disallow one, you have to disallow both because the fouls are pretty similar.” (Barry Glendenning, [08:54])
    • “Not a single Argentina player was booked in this game is unbelievable.” (Glendenning, [09:59])
  • Discussion acknowledges impartiality but frames it as “incompetence, not bias” (Ronay & Glendenning, [04:27 – 11:01]).

Notable Quotes

• On Messi:
  • “What’s unfair about him is that he’s never played a game of football which Lionel Messi hasn’t played. ...Every team he’s in, Lionel Messi’s in the team.” (Barney Ronay, [04:27])
  • “For the first time today I felt he was playing a game where Lionel Messi wasn’t there and he suddenly realized football isn’t much fun.” (Ronay, [07:13])
• On Refereeing:
  • “I just think it was a bad refereeing performance. I don’t think he was, you know, deliberately favoring Argentina.” (Glendenning, [10:34])

Reflections on Argentina and Egypt

• Argentina’s “trademark” of pulling through games with problems but “always finding a way.”
  • “They showed remarkable character. I thought they were dead and buried with whatever it was, 12 minutes of normal time remaining.” (Glendenning, [16:04])
• Egypt’s “game management” (or lack thereof) dissected, with emotional responses to their sense of injustice.

Wider Context

• Mention of Egypt coach Hossam Hassan’s refusal to watch the rest of the tournament due to perceived injustice ([08:01]).
• Emotional depth added by reference to the Palestine situation and tragic news from Gaza before the match ([18:07]).

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2. Switzerland 0 (4) – 0 (3) Colombia: Penalties Decide a Drab Affair

[20:46 – 25:32]

Highlights

• Switzerland edge Colombia 4-3 on penalties after a tense, cagey 0-0 draw.
  • XG at 80 minutes: Switzerland 0.28, Colombia 0.39 – little attacking threat for most of the match ([21:08]).
  • Gregor Kobel, Swiss keeper, lauded for crucial saves in the shootout.
  • Switzerland reach the quarterfinals for the first time in 72 years ([22:25]).

Panel Insights

• Not an exciting game, but the stakes make it “completely gripping” (Ronay, [24:16]).
• Praise for Murat Yakin’s tactical choices and overcoming adversity with key players out.
• Colombia’s attack, notably Luis Díaz, failed to deliver after group stage promise.

Memorable Moments

• “There are three things in that sentence that sound like you might not be that interested in watching...but it was completely gripping and I quite like an epic 0–0 when it really matters.” (Ronay, [24:16])

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3. Quarterfinal Outlook and Tournament Reflections

[25:03 – 28:05]

The Draw

• France vs Morocco
• Spain vs Belgium
• Norway vs England
• Argentina vs Switzerland

Notable Points

• France-Morocco rematch and Belgium’s inconsistency highlighted.

• England-Norway described as a “brilliant game” likely to be “close” and influenced by Miami’s intense heat and humidity (Ronay, [26:13 – 27:59]).

• European dominance in the quarterfinals noted—“a bit of a shame that there aren’t really any wild cards in there” (Ronay, [27:45]).

• On Switzerland’s history with Argentina:

  • Memories of the heartbreak in 2014 (Di María’s late winner, [25:33]).

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4. USA’s Tournament Exit and Fallout

[29:12 – 35:43]

Guest: Alex Abnos (US Soccer Editor)

Discussion Points

• USMNT’s loss to Belgium attributed to being “second best in pretty much every single category” (Alex Abnos, [29:35]).

• Abnos reflects on the emotional letdown for American fans and the challenge of building soccer culture amid such setbacks.

• The “Balogun/Trump circus” (questions over Balogun’s red card and Trump’s intervention) brought embarrassment and a distraction.

  • “Trump kind of getting involved was the ultimate Karen move… Calling the manager and asking to be refunded because you didn’t like what happened” (Abnos, [31:55]).

• Debate about whether USSF’s appeal against Balogun’s red card was justified or simply a PR disaster ([33:21]).

Looking Ahead for USMNT

• Key decision: Will Pochettino stay as coach or move on?
  • “Pochettino will have other suitors… The future of this team is going to depend very, very much depending on who the manager is.” (Abnos, [34:29])
• Pep Guardiola’s name inevitably mentioned as a pipe dream.

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5. FIFA, Infantino, and Football’s Governance

[35:43 – 38:18]

• Barney Ronay discusses the “great preening waxwork power gargoyle” Gianni Infantino and whether this tournament’s controversies might be the start of his undoing.
  • “It’s one thing about people who wield that level of executive power. You always imagine they’ll be there forever... But nothing lasts forever.” (Ronay, [36:08])
• Reflection on the “level of perceived and denied interference” in rules—diminishing the meritocratic appeal for life-long fans.

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6. Listener Questions and Lighter Moments

[38:18 – End]

• Listener crisis: How to avoid England match spoilers while disembarking a flight with two young children?
  • General consensus: near impossible, but good luck!
• Banter about live podcast shows and future travel plans.
• Show ends with warm team send-offs and production credits.

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Notable Quotes (with Timestamps)

• “What’s unfair about [Messi] is he’s never played a game of football which Lionel Messi hasn’t played. … It’s a massive advantage, but it also means … I feel like saying to him sometimes, it’s not always like this. … There are loads of games where it’s really boring and joyless because Lionel Messi is not involved.”
  — Barney Ronay [04:27]
• “If you disallow one, you have to disallow both because the fouls are pretty similar. … And I don’t understand why the threshold is higher in the penalty area than anywhere else.”
  — Barry Glendenning [08:54]
• “Trump getting involved was the ultimate Karen move. … Calling the manager and asking to be refunded because you didn’t like what happened.”
  — Alex Abnos [31:55]
• “It’s one thing about people who wield that level of executive power. You always imagine they’ll be there forever … but nothing lasts forever.”
  — Barney Ronay [36:08]

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Segment Timestamps

• Argentina-Egypt recap & controversy: [00:13 – 18:53]
• Switzerland-Colombia penalties: [20:46 – 25:32]
• Quarterfinal previews: [25:03 – 28:05]
• USMNT exit & fallout: [29:12 – 35:43]
• FIFA/Infantino discussion: [35:43 – 38:18]
• Listener questions & close: [38:18 – end]

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Tone & Style:
Engaging, witty, and occasionally exasperated—true to Football Weekly’s conversational and sardonic style, while also providing moments of reflection amid the drama.

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Transcript

[A]

This is the Guardian.

[B]

This episode is supported by Boss formal wear provider for the US Men's national soccer team. For soccer's biggest event this summer, the US is playing on home soil and BOSS will be dressing the US players and coach Maurizio Pochettino in Boss Performance business wear for their off pitch appearances. BOSS and the USMNT share the same values, discipline, precision and and the confidence to perform under pressure. US fans can look sharp too in the BOSS Performance collection and wear their passion with special fanware, capsule and embroidered badges in national colors. Own the moment with confidence. Discover the Boss Performance collection as worn by the US Men's national soccer team and the fan capsule of jerseys, polos and jackets in national colors. Wear your passion your way. Available [e-mail] or at your nearest BOSS store BEYOUROWNBOSS. Hello and welcome to the Guardian Football Weekly. Argentina make it through to the quarter finals of the World cup by the skin of their teeth. 2 nil down with just over 10 minutes left. 3, 2 up. In injury time the game was so stretched. Alvarez found Lautaro whose cross was perfect for Enzo Fernandez and his header was textbook. Egypt feel robbed was Salah clipped in the box by Alvarez before the winner. Var didn't get involved. It had earlier to disallow a glorious second for Egypt. Not the light touch refereeing we've seen so far in this tournament. It didn't look to have mattered. Egypt just went and scored. Another beauty. Messi had already missed from the spot. It makes no footballing sense that he's bad at penalties. Mustafa Shabir was brilliant in the Egyptian goal. Messi didn't do too much until the equalizer, but he and his team still have the chance to retain the trophy. They'll play Switzerland after beating Colombia on penalties. Gregor Kobel the hero. Ruben Vargas with the winning spot kick. Also today we'll look ahead to the quarter finals. U.S. soccer editor Alex Abnos is on the host's whimpering exit. We'll answer your questions and that's today's Guardian Football Weekly. On the panel today with me in la, Barry Glendenning. Welcome.

[C]

Hi Max.

[B]

Your final pod. Archie Rintut.

[D]

Hi Max.

[B]

What a journey it's been. And out in Miami. Barney, Ronny. Hey Barney.

[A]

Hi everyone.

[B]

Let's start then with that game in Atlanta. Argentina 3 Egypt 2. Argentina have never come back from two goals down at a World 20 minutes in Archer. You said this game had already over delivered and it hadn't even really started. What a football match.

[E]

Breathless at times and it will be overshadowed by the refereeing performance by Francois Lexier, ultimately, because of what happened in it, which is a shame because Egypt did so well for quite a period in this game, even if they gave up a lot of chances to Argentina. Mustafa Shabir, as you say, he showed wonderful elasticity, I think in goal. There were times when his arm was reaching out and you were kind of surprised that it still kept going to get the ball.

[B]

Inspector Gadget.

[E]

Inspector Gadget, that's the one. And for a long time, Lionel Messi did not look like the all conquering Lionel Messi that we know him to be. With that penalty miss, his second at the tournament, has you wondering why, why can he not give this up? Because it's the only thing that I think he's not good at. I mean, we don't think that he's very good at heading, but we've not seen that all that much in his career.

[B]

But yeah, the flick ons, he'd never do it for Steven Hinch, would he, in League one Anyway, he did score

[A]

a brilliant header in a Champions League final.

[B]

Oh, that's a good point. Exactly.

[E]

That's the problem. There's always a counterpoint. But yeah, Egypt go 2 nil up having thought that they'd gone 2 nil up. And then the collapse comes when Argentina finally break them down with 10 minutes to play. Cristian Romero heading in, followed by Lionel Messi with a fantastically timed. We're calling that a volley.

[B]

Half volley, half volley.

[E]

Good. Just checking. And then there's that chance for Egypt to win it as well. On the break, Omar Mahmouch running through, just has to beat Leandro Paredes. But that's exactly the thing he doesn't do. Paredes probably Argentina's best player throughout the 90. And yeah, shortly after, after a contentious not given penalty decision, Enzo Fernandez wins it after good work from Lautaro Martinez and Julian Alvarez, two players who have been vying for the same spot in the team, but coming together and working together to Argentina's success.

[B]

What did you make of it all, Barney?

[A]

Well, yeah, it was an incredible game. I mean, it was just another game of the tournament, wasn't it? I mean, I don't like the refereeing stuff. The refereeing wasn't, I mean, it wasn't great. I, I just don't like accusations of bias and fixing because I don't think that that is what's happening, even though I can see what the motivation would be for that to happen. And there have been some kind of decisions for Messi that have gone his way in this tournament. I mean, conversely, the. The fact that the referee gave a decision against the host that they didn't like is one of the things that' to kind of slightly destroy the integrity of the World Cup. And I really. I respect the fact that even in their incompetence, the referees are impartial. That is one of the sort of important things about this game. But it's impossible not to talk about Messi, isn't it? I love the way he just keeps giving. Like, I've been writing and thinking about Messi for 20 years now, and there's still more and more. It is extraordinary what he's doing. I realized something while I was watching this game that he looked unhappy. He was having a stinker for a while. And there's this thing I've been wanting to say about Messi, that what's unfair about him is that he's never played a game of football which Lionel Messi hasn't played it. He doesn't know what that is. That's his experience. His entire career. Lionel Messi is always playing, and every team he's in, Lionel Messi's in the team. And it's a massive advantage. But it also means that he really. He sway. Likes football so much because Messi is. I feel like saying to him sometimes, you know, it's not always like this. Like, you're not always playing. And there are loads of games where it's really boring and joyless because Lionel Messi is not involved. I mean, I'm sure he's probably watched some of them. Maybe he hasn't. I can imagine. He probably doesn't really notice, but that is why he's such a. His career has been so good, because every game, Lionel and his. The thing about his genius is it's a generous genius. He makes the other players better. He makes. He sees space and angles and passes that other people don't see. I don't want to make a comparison. I mean, I don't know if people have ever compared Cristiano Ronaldo with Lionel Messi, but he. Every game he's played, Cristiano Ronaldo is playing. That's a completely different experience. He doesn't know what football is like without Cristiano Ronaldo on the pitch, which is quite a weird idea. And certainly in the last few years has involved basically playing in teams where everybody's propping up and he looks kind of stretched and slightly unhappy. It's a different kind of thing. He takes stuff out of the game, whereas Messi's just having the time of his life. But for the first time today I felt he was playing a game where Lionel Messi wasn't there and he suddenly realized the football isn't much fun. He looked really unhappy and he really wasn't enjoying it. And I think part of that celebration was Lionel Messi suddenly came on probably with about an hour gone and suddenly it was what he rec and what he understood football to be, which is he's always playing and so it's good and fun and. And he looked incredibly relieved when he scored that goal. There was something different about his celebration, I thought like a and obviously he was weeping at the end. Maybe it was having a glimpse of the football that we all play where Lionel Messi is not involved and it could be really, really hard and difficult and not brilliant.

[B]

On the controversies, Baz so the manager Hossam Hassan of Egypt said he will not watch a single minute of the rest of the World cup because of the injustice his team suffered. Zico said the referee was not fair. The tournament's been fixed and look, we've had light touch refereeing all this tournament and then suddenly this, the VAR decision, the frustration is two pronged, right? They have that goal disallowed for a foul but a long time before they score and then the winner Salah is kind of kicked. He loses the ball, regains it, he's kind of kicked. Dale Johnson saying because it's in the box there's a higher threshold for var. So it's probably right, but you can totally see the sense of injustice. I don't think there's a foul in the lead up to the winner, but I don't think the goal should be disallowed the second one either, personally.

[C]

Well, I think if you disallow one, you have to disallow both because the fouls are pretty similar. I think there was two fouls in the build up to the winner. One on Fatih, one on Mo Salah. I saw what Dale Johnson said about there being a higher threshold in the penalty area. And while I he is the guru of VARA as far as I'm concerned, anytime I'm not sure what to think, I scuttle off to Dale's of course social media page so he can have my opinion for me. And I don't understand why the threshold is higher in the penalty area than anywhere else on the pitch. It's either a foul or it isn't. So I think, I think the foul on Saleh should have been a penalty for Egypt I think if you're going to disallow one, you have to disallow both. And I think the fact that not a single Argentina player was booked in this game is unbelievable.

[B]

This is unbelievable.

[C]

Romero, absolutely unbelievable. Tagliafico and Romero could both have been sent off for two yellows each. There were other sides, but like Barney, I don't think the ref is bent. I just think he didn't have a very good game. Refs have clearly been told to let a lot slide, but some teams are dirtier than others, so that benefits dirtier team.

[B]

And if you let things slide, you need to let that slide. Even if a goal for the Egypt one, you have to let that slide too. Just because a goal scored 30 seconds

[C]

later, and I mean that goal, that Egypt goal that was disallowed was brilliant. And the three players who were involved teamed up to do it again a couple of minutes later as almost as in an FU to the officials and to FIFA. But yeah, I just think it was a bad refereeing performance. I don't think he was, you know, deliberately favoring Argentina.

[B]

And then when this happens, people go back and say, hang on. Argentina scored a goal against Austria where an Austrian was fouled. Messi had that red against Algeria that no one saw. Our friend Assassu obviously is looking for excellence from the African teams. Archie said, while the referee messed up this game, Egypt's game management in the last 15 to 20 minutes. And then he did angry red, face emoji, shrug emoji, hand on face emoji, crying emoji. And I mean, that is a point. They were 2 nil up with 15 minutes left.

[E]

They were, they were. But they had been shelling chances throughout. It wasn't so much a change of approach. I think Egypt had one touch in the Argentinian box during the first half and they scored from it. They were more successful in countering in the second half. And Omar Mahmouch was will wonder what would have happened had he been able to loop it over Leandro Paredes, but he wasn't able to do that. And if you're not getting out against this Argentinian team enough, then you will be punished if you're Argentina. I'm left in the same place where I was thinking about them in the last tournament, which is, oh, they've got problems and then they always find a way. And maybe one worrying element for them is that there were warning signs for each goal that it was coming. Egypt did a very similar set piece routine before Yasser Ibrahim headed in in the first half and that counter attack that we saw where excellent run as well to help set up Zico. It was there. It was there to be seen. But Argentina were willing to take that risk. And this is the thing about them when you have Lionel Messi. And just to add to what Barney's saying earlier, there's something about the way that as much as football seems to have changed a lot around him, he's still able to do the same thing. And despite the fact that the intensity of the game, the physicality of it seems to have changed, Lionel Messi has been able to evolve without or not even evolve. He's just stayed the same and the universe moves around him. It is amazing even today how he just went up another gear and found it.

[B]

Yeah, he had that little run to set up. I think it was Lautaro and that was it. He kind of sparked on. Well, the opt are saying, look, Leo Messi has missed half of his eight penalty attempts at World Cups. The first player in the competition's history to miss two penalties in a single World Cup. They're both excluding shootouts. And producer Joel made a good point. Barney. It makes no footballing sense that he's bad at penalties. He's good at everything. We've established this. How can he be not good at this bit?

[A]

Well, it makes some footballing sense in the. His. His sort of genius. What he's amazing at is understanding all the space. He. He always knows what's going to happen and he'll make passes that just blow your mind. There are always so many options. He's got this kind of compound eye. I always imagine him having like a fly eye. Like you can just see everything so slowly. You can try to swat him but he's already gone. You chase him around the room with a fly but you're not going to get any. I mean. You know what I mean. So what's a penalty? It's. That's when everyone has that everyone can see what's going to happen. Everyone is essentially Lionel Messi. The game has stopped. It's actually a totally different experience to what he is exceptional at, which is just managing time and space better than everyone else. And maybe in that moment his brain goes into overdrive. Maybe it's too. He's that messy squared. He can see so many possibilities. It's too much. Maybe he becomes mortal in that moment. Maybe he can't see the possibilities because it's so linear. It's one kick.

[B]

So hang on. Have his eyes still. A fly's eye when he's taking a penalty. Or they're back to a normal.

[A]

Maybe he has got a fly. Maybe he becomes a normal eye and all he's got to do is kick the ball towards the goal. And that's not his normal experience. He's like this thing. The planets move around him and he can see every possibility, like a chess grandmaster. But yeah, something about the penalty spooks that process clearly. Maybe it's too easy. Maybe he needs to be energized by all those variables around him and being able to do that math so quickly. That's my explanation.

[B]

No, I understand. He's kind of the sun and also a fly in the analogy thus far.

[A]

Yes, it makes a lot of sense.

[B]

Yeah. Of the sun with compound eyes. Can Argentina keep doing this, Barry? You think the Cape Verde game, you think this one.

[C]

Well, they're doing it in a similar fashion to England, aren't they? They just keep doing enough to get where they need to be.

[B]

But you feel that argent.

[C]

And if they keep doing enough to get where they need to be and England keep doing enough to get where they need be, they're going to meet and something's going to have to give. One of them won't get to where they want to be and need to be because the other will have done just enough. But, yeah, why can't they keep doing it? I mean, they showed remarkable character. I thought they were dead and buried with whatever it was, 12 minutes of normal time remaining, 2 nil down.

[F]

And

[C]

I thought they were dead and buried. Then when they got one goal back, I thought, yeah, they're probably going to get another one now. I didn't think they'd finish the job in normal time. I thought they'd need extra time or it might go to penalties.

[A]

Can I just speak for our listeners here, please? In. In asking Barry about the idea of England doing just enough, just enough to get by, which is. I mean, that is credit. That's the most original description of what happened at the Azteca Stadium that I have heard so far. I mean, Mexico lost twice in 89 games there, never lost a World cup game there. In 10 attempts, England scored three goals. Hang on. For 40 minutes. With 10 men, to the extent that they were physically and emotionally totally drained. And it's probably the most draining experience they've ever had in their entire careers. But they managed to eliminate the hosts from their own World cup at the end of it by scoring three times at the Azteca. If that's just doing enough, I can only imagine what, like an everyday Barry Day must be. I mean, you must go to the. Well, so many. What kind of things are you doing if this is just doing enough? Because most days I just sort of do enough. But on the other hand, you could describe that as an incredibly draining, heroic performance that took every single ounce of concentration and physical strength.

[C]

It was just enough. They scraped through, back through the wall. It was a very excellent performance, but it was the bare. You know, it was. They did just.

[A]

It was the bare minimum.

[C]

No, it wasn't the bare minimum.

[A]

It didn't feel like someone doing just enough for the bare minimum. I have to say, I thought it was. It was. It was.

[C]

Well, they won 3, 2. So that. That was just enough to get through, I think.

[A]

I don't think in their minds, they felt they were just. Just doing enough to get through.

[B]

Can I bring in Kofi Annan here? Archie?

[E]

The way that England have played in this tournament so far, it's not like they've been blowing any teams away. Am I right or wrong?

[C]

Yeah.

[E]

Yeah. And which.

[C]

They really blew Mexico away.

[A]

It was an amazing win, I think. I think you just have to accept

[B]

that both can be true because they did just enough, but just enough was amazing. Just on Egypt, their manager, Hossam Hassan, has been speaking about the plight of the Palestinian people. Yesterday, he said, anyone who does not feel for Palestinians is not human. He asked FIFA to use its soft power to help Palestinians. Al Jazeera, amongst others, have reported that the Egyptian Relief Committee in Gaza has been organizing public screenings of World cup matches for displaced families across the Strip. And at about an hour before the Egypt, Argentina match, Israel killed the committee's public relations director, Mohamed Fawaz Al Wahidi, in a strike on his vehicle. Two others, including a child, were also killed, which is just really fucking depressing, isn't it? And that'll do for part one. Part two, we will do. Switzerland, Colombia. Hi, POD fans. Max here. Barry's here, too.

[C]

Hello.

[B]

Global Weekly is supported by Gradient fc. Now, Barry, with the World cup underway, we know player performance will be under a microscope, from superstars cementing legacies to upstarts vying for big summer transfers. But with 48 teams and up to six matches a day, it's hard to catch every moment. And that is where the Gradient FC app shines. Their player rankings update daily during the World cup, so you know whose performances are trending up or down on the world stage.

[C]

How does it work?

[B]

Well, Gradient's rankings use the same grades trusted by clubs across Europe's top leagues for player recruitment. Each Match is graded by a team of experts who evaluate over 2000 actions per match, not just by hours outcome but by execution. So for example, a completed pass that leads the receiver into danger is graded negatively, while one that puts the receiver in on goal is graded positively. Now I know you hate making match predictions, Barry, but maybe all that could change at the World Cup. With Gradient fc with head to head player comparison tools that show who's best across more than 100 grades and metrics, it's easy to build and defend any prediction. And here's something else that will appeal to you, Barry. It's free.

[C]

Fantastic.

[B]

Explore it for [e-mail] or download the GradientFC app from the Apple Store or Google Play.

[F]

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[B]

Welcome to Part two of the Guardian Football Weekly. So Switzerland nil. Columbia nil. Switzerland winning 43 on penalties. There was a moment when they cut to these two Swiss fans sort of crying. This man and woman who had like, you know, Swiss flags paint on their face. That really got me, I don't know, I'm just sort of tired and emotional. But it wasn't a classic. But Barry, you some have three pages of notes on this game. So away you go.

[C]

Page three is just the penalty shoe shout graph. So technically it's two. I mean it was a very good game. Switzerland did just enough to get through to the next round. It was an awful game with some controversial decisions as both sides had penalty shouts turned down. There was lots of huffing and puffing by both teams to no great effect. Very little in the way of cutting edge in the final third for either side, I think the XG after 80 minutes was flashed up was Switzerland 0.28, Columbia.39, which sort of tells you all you need to know. But then when it went to extra time and I, I firmly, I'm a big advocate of getting rid of extra time. I just think if games are level at 90 minutes, just go straight to penalties. But extra time here was actually quite good. Colombia had I would say four, maybe five good chances. Switzerland two, none. Still no one could score. And then Switzerland crept through on penalties.

[B]

Yeah, a shout for Gregor Kobel, who made one brilliant save in that shootout.

[E]

And Switzerland generally, because this is the first time in 72 years that they've reached the quarterfinals of a World cup. And they came into this as underdogs, I think, as well. Even more so when you think that their player of the tournament so far, Johan Manzambi, had a knee injury and was out. And you could see that in the first half, how Switzerland was struggling to break through Colombia's defence, which has been so good since the opening game. In fact, they leave this tournament having only conceded one goal, which was to Uzbekistan, in that. The problem was for Colombia that going forward, Luis Diaz didn't show up since that opening game. Not just on him. Of course, there were other chances that they missed Campaz with that huge chance after Granit Xhaka's failed clearance, isn't it? I think we can. We can label it. Gregor Kobel is not renowned, Max, as a great penalty saver, and he's had to wait a long time behind Jan Sommer in goal. But Jan Sommer had his moment against France in the Euros when they famously beat them. And this is a famous moment for Switzerland as well. Big moment, too, for coach Murat Yakin, who came in for criticism at the start of the tournament for picking Denis Zakaria at right back. And today against Luis Diaz, he shut him down excellently. So well done to Switzerland, the most relieved man of them all, Manuela Kangi, because having missed in a penalty shooter against England last time in the Euros, he blazed. I don't know.

[B]

And he did a. Normally, if you stutter, you don't get it that high. That's all, you know, like, it's impressive. Yeah, it was a real scoop, wasn't it? It was a real sandwich. Davidson, Sanchez hitting the bar as well. He was really unlucky because it was so close to Yerboa ing in off the bar, wasn't it? I think he'd missed one before in Copa America as well. Lots of talk about you can't have center backs taking penalty. I mean, it doesn't matter if they score, but it does matter if they miss. Did you have any strong thoughts on this game, Barney? It's quite hard to have strong thoughts on it.

[A]

Well, yeah, I mean, but it's something about the World cup that you can still be totally gripped by an occasion where Switzerland win a nil. Nil in Canada. Like, there are three things in that sentence that sound on the Face of it, kind of like you might not be that interested in watching them on tv, but it was completely gripping and I quite like an epic 00 when it really matters. And we kind of earned the drama of the shootout. It was a nice counterpoint to the madness elsewhere, I guess.

[B]

Yeah. Okay, so we've got quarterfinals. France, Morocco, Spain. Belgium on one side of the draw. Norway, England, Argentina, Switzerland on the other. Archie, what do you make of them?

[E]

France, Morocco. A replay of the semi final or one of the semi finals. Last time in 2022. Whether Ismael Saibari will be fit for Morocco, I think will have a big bearing on that game. Interested to see if Belgium can now step up and provide a second consecutive good performance in this tournament, which they're yet to do so far. And obviously pretty nervous about. England, Norway. I won't be in the bedroom in the apartment, which is a big blow to my superstition.

[A]

Terrible, terrible decision.

[E]

Argentina, Switzerland. To add, you have to remember that in 2014, Switzerland were heartbroken by Angel Di Maria losing in the 118th minute there. That was Granit Xhaka's first World Cup. Can he make a difference in this one? Manzambi needs to be back, I think, but I think there's a lot to get into with them. It's just. Yeah, you would expect it to be France, Spain and Norway. Argentina.

[B]

Okay, that's it, Barney. You were at the Azteca and it was amazing. And they now play Norway, which will have is a different challenge, I don't think.

[A]

I think England, Norway games have generally been really quite good. I think of them as quite epic occasions.

[B]

Well, the first England game I ever went to was a goalless draw at Wembley between England and Norway's. Possibly the worst football match that ever happened. But that aside, when was that? Must have been mid-90s.

[A]

Okay. I mean, I'm thinking of Graham Taylor. Those occasions were really sort of formative in. In a certain kind of period in England's time. I think it's a brilliant game. I'm really looking forward to. I'm here in Miami already. It's going to be really hot. The stadium is open air and it's incredibly humid and hot. It's going to be low 30s, so 33 degrees, but feel really, really heavy. So it might be an episodic game. It'll be one where there are lots of pale northern Europeans sweating a lot. And it'll be interesting to see if John Stone starts. He came back at the end of that game, actually looked fine. And we've seen the Tuchel video joshing about having a shoulder injury, but him against Erling Haaland would be quite interesting. It's the kind of matchup that you might actually want if you're Tuchel, but nor a really good team. They're not just Erling Haaland and I really think it could go either way. It's going to be close. It's going to be really interesting. It's interesting about these quarterfinals. They are six European teams and plus Morocco, where so much of their squad of players who came through the Ajax academy or through the French kind of machine is very Europe heavy. It's a bit of a shame that there aren't really any wild cards in there. I suppose you'd say Norway were kind of one of those. But yeah, I mean, Shakira said that we're all African once. Maybe we're all European now.

[B]

Did she also say waka Waka? Yeah, yeah. So.

[C]

And her hips don't lie.

[B]

She said that. And her hips don't. My hips don't lie, but in a very different way. And I have complained about them for a month.

[C]

I know.

[B]

Anyway, we have live shows on the 1st of September and the 9th of September. We're in Dublin at Vicar street on the 1st, Soho Theatre in Walthamstow on the 9th. Tickets selling well. Go to theguardian.com footballweeklylive Come along, please. Part 3 We'll speak to Alex Abnos, our US Soccer Editor, on that defeat yesterday to Belgium.

[G]

Every story is a technology story in one way or another. And on the interface we decode the tech that's rewiring your week and your world. On this week's episode is AI pushing us towards an infinite work week. And this year's World cup is the most technologically advanced ever. But is it making the game better or worse? Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts.

[B]

Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly. I wanted to speak to an American about, you know, the fallout of the last 48 hours. So I caught up with our US Soccer Editor, Alex Abduls on yesterday's pod. I was kind of trying to channel what I felt that you would be feeling about being a U.S. soccer fan who loves this game but is conflicted about, you know, everything that's happening in the States.

[D]

Well, first of all, I'm sorry that you had to channel anything. I was feeling, I feel, you know, a mix of feelings. I think overall, you know, when you look at just the game itself, even if you ignore everything that happened off the field. Everything with Fuller and Baligan, everything. Trump's involvement. You know, the US Easily deserved to lose that game. By the score they lost to buy. They were second best in pretty much every single category. I don't think there's any doubting that. I do wonder how much the off the field stuff played into the pressure they were feeling in that moment. I think it was already going to be a gigantic occasion, no matter what happened outside. And it really looked like, especially once that first Belgian goal went in, they were totally overawed by the occasion. Things that were normally coming off for them in the normal course of play just weren't happening and they didn't know how to deal with it. They didn't know how to solve any problems. This is a, you know, a kind of US performance that we'd seen before. It just happened to come at probably the worst possible time. So it's really disappointing, you know, like, I think everybody that is into soccer in the United States that's trying to grow the game here would have really wanted that to be the game to, for the team to put forth their best performance. Because it's when you have the most people watching, you have the most non soccer people in your life watching. And it's, you know, frankly, kind of embarrassing for them to put forth a performance like that that makes all the non soccer people in your life question what the hell it is that you're doing with all this time that you're spending on this team.

[B]

There was a really pertinent moment. I forget who was on comms, who literally in injury time said, this doesn't have to be the last game you watch for four years. And you know, there are so many fans in the uk, just that's just not how football works in the uk.

[D]

Right. Yeah, that, that will have been John Strong and I didn't know that he said that. I obviously wasn't listening to the commentary there in the stadium, but I hope that that's the, I hope that a lot of people heard that message and are taking it away and taking it seriously. Like, but it's, you know, you can't argue it's not as strong of a message. It's just like, don't worry, it's not always like this. It's not quite as good as, yes, that was awesome. And we're going to keep on going and you're going to go be a soccer fan forever now. You know, I think, I think the US probably did make some new fans, but they definitely made things A little bit harder with that last game.

[B]

Just how frustrated have you been by the Trump Gianni Baligan circus?

[D]

Frustrated. This is interesting. Like, I definitely think it was unnecessary. I think that, like, Fuller and Baligan was absolutely one of the US's top players in this tournament. I don't think they would have been totally rudderless without him in the starting lineup. I think Ricardo Pepe could have done some interesting things given some time to prepare against Belgium. I think maybe even Haji Wright could have done some interesting things had they given him a chance. I think, you know, yes. Was the red card against Fuller and Valgan unjust and really, really harsh? Yeah, I think so. But. But unfair, unjust things happen all the time in football, and you have to deal with them and you have to move on. And it's just a colleague of mine, Pablo Maurer, put it this way. He said that Trump kind of getting involved was the ultimate Karen move. It was, you know, calling the manager and asking to. To be. To be refunded because you didn't like what. What happened to you at the game. You know, it just was unnecessary. And I think it pains Americans and certainly portions of this national team in a really bad light to have that happen.

[B]

Have you been frustrated by, like, quite a few sort of U. S. Soccer commentators basically saying, hey, look, this is just, you know, this is. It's. It's right, you know, not like this stinks, like sort of trying to take away the patriotism of it. And obviously, it's easy to say from here, but I. I feel if it happened to England, I'd be like, this still stinks. You know, like, you're saying it still stinks, but so many people were just like, actually, it's fine. Yeah.

[D]

I mean, listen, like, that is U.S. soccer's argument in all of this, right, Is that the red card was not a deserved red card and he didn't end up having to serve the suspension. And that's not entirely wrong. I just think that the way it was gone about the fact that U.S. soccer on its own volition, were assembling by, according to multiple reports, it's a team of lawyers to sort of look into ways to appeal this red card that we were told in no uncertain terms immediately after the game was completely unappealable. I think that kind of says it all, you know, on one hand. I think you kind of have to hand it to them. That is their job as the federation to look into things like that. But it is frustrating that, you know, that became the main talking point and that became really the first bit of truly negative, negative, negative PR this team had when it was on such a good run. And that was given just like the ultimate exclamation point with that terrible performance.

[B]

I wonder if all the players were on board with it. I don't know. Like, it's hard to know, isn't it? And, and obviously, I don't think any other team would have said, you know, ethics here. We won't pick them. But I wonder what, what, what next for the US Men's team then?

[D]

Next is they have to figure out if they're going to keep Mauricio Pochettino. Mauricio Pochettino has to decide whether or not he wants to stay. We recorded and we confirmed that the U.S. soccer Federation has made him an offer. We don't know how much it is. One would assume that it's, you know, a mild pay raise at the very least. But, you know, Pochettino will have other suitors. He's got plenty of experience in Europe. He's a big name. There are lots of clubs that may be looking to make an early change at manager, and he'll be in those conversations. You know, I think the future of this team and what it looks like and the sort of ambition that it has is going to vary very, very much depending on who the, who the manager is, whether it's Pochettino or whether it's somebody new. If it's not Pochettino, the options are truly open. They could go with a domestic candidate that's maybe less well known, or they could look at a more, you know, well known international candidate. A lot of people are probably going to be talking about Pep Guardiola, because that is just like the first name that pops up. I think it's pretty unlikely. I would, I would be interested to see what, what Pep could do with this U.S. national team. But that is really the first step, and we have no idea what the result is going to be.

[B]

Give it Jesse Marsh. That says it all, Alex.

[D]

That says it all. I have nothing more to say.

[B]

Thanks, mate. Good mate, Alex there. Barney, you wrote a piece yesterday on Gianni saying this might even be the first significant note of Infantino's own endgame. The moment football's great preening waxwork power gargoyle flew just a little bit too close to the sun and began to melt inside his own blue suit. Is that wishful thinking or do you think it might be true?

[A]

I don't think it's necessarily true, but I have spoken to some people who have more knowledge than me of how things shake down around the place, in and around FIFA. And, I mean, it's one thing about people who wield that level of executive power. You always imagine they'll be there forever because they seem all powerful. But nothing lasts forever. And there is something about the way Infantino presents himself as football, the way he uses his own Instagram channel as the main comm source. It's not all completely rosy. He really does sail close to the edge on what he can get away with with some of these things, and I don't think everybody's entirely happy with it. On the other hand, it's almost impossible to get rid of a FIFA president because essentially the vote, such as it is, is a negotiation, as I said in the article. I mean, you just always vote for the person who gives you the most money, which I guess makes perfect sense, given a lot of these FAS rely on that money. And one thing he's been extremely good at is monetizing or helping to monetize something that was already very monetizable. And the money keeps rolling in. You've got 211 members who will vote for him again next year. But there may be a challenge, there may be some kickback. This thing is really. I think it's really quite profound that you have this level of perceived and denied interference at that level in the way the rules are administered. It's a way of making the game fall apart slightly for people who actually care about it. It's really hard to explain this to people who don't follow football and haven't followed it for a long time. But I'm sure everyone listening to the pod, you just feel this immediate sense of something's being sort of desecrated and that the rules are not the same and that the great meritocracy stops being that you're watching an entertainment product and there will be kickback against it. But I strongly suspect that Ginny Infantino will be fine.

[B]

Yeah, I think you're probably right. I did think about running against him, but it seems I just wouldn't want to go to all you have to all. I'd say no private. I wouldn't go in private. I'd do it all from the shed and then I think I'd be fine, but I don't know if I'd have as much support. I'll have a think about it. Simon says hi, Max and the team. Long time listener, first time caller. I'm in a predicament. I booked my annual summer flights Home, completely overlooking the tournament schedule. England's quarterfinal against Norway is while I'm in midair on the 11th of July. I land at Heathrow at 6am on the 12th. I need to get to Chiswick in a total media blackout. Easy. Just use noise cancelling headphones. Except I have my two sons, 4 and 6, in tow. Can I realistically navigate airport logistics with them using elaborate sign language? Worse, immigration. I can't wear headphones there. And the morning shift will be absolutely be gossiping all over the glass partitions. I'm genuinely considering slipping a Don't ruin the score note to the border officer with our passports. With game density dropping, hopefully you'll need a break from discussing Mark Langdon's vegetable intake and subsequent bow consistency to solve my crisis. Keep up the great pod. Simon in Hong Kong. How does he get through? He lands, he doesn't want to know the score and he's got to get to Chiswick. What the hell can he do?

[C]

Can he not just watch it on the plane?

[E]

I tried that on the way out here with Argentina. Austria, let me tell you. WI fi on the plane.

[B]

A lot buffering.

[E]

Too much buffering. So I think he's in trouble.

[B]

I think he's in trouble. But we wish you luck, Simon, and thanks for getting in touch. You can get in touch football [e-mail]. we won't be back tomorrow. A day as we're flying to New York.

[C]

It's not really a day off, is it? It's more aggravation than usual.

[B]

We actually have to spend more time closer to each other than we have for this month.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

And we have to get up really early.

[B]

Yeah, but that's okay.

[A]

Hang on. What are you doing tomorrow?

[B]

Just flying to New York from Los Angeles.

[A]

Oh, okay. Oh, that's cool. Where are you staying in New York?

[B]

We're staying in. I might not give you the hotel.

[A]

Are you in Manhattan?

[B]

We're in Brooklyn.

[A]

Oh, cool.

[B]

Yeah. Oh, come say hi. Thank you, everybody. That'll do for today. Thank you, Archie.

[E]

Thanks, Max.

[B]

Cheers, Barry.

[C]

Thank you.

[B]

Thank you, Barney.

[A]

Cheers.

[B]

Football Weekly is produced by Rory Simon and Matt Bentley Viney. Our executive producer is Joel Grove. We'll be back the day after tomorrow. This is the Guardian.