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Football Weekly
FA Cup quarter-finals and trouble brewing at Chelsea – Football Weekly Extra
00:45:46
Max Rushden is joined by Barry Glendenning, Nick Ames and Jordan Jarrett-Bryan to preview the weekend’s action
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- [00:00]
Jordan Jarrett-Bryan
This is the Guardian.
- [00:10]
Brooke Devard
Hello. Hello, it's Brooke Devard from Naked Beauty. Join me each week for unfiltered discussion about beauty trends, self care journeys, wellness tips and the products we absolutely love and cannot get enough of. If you are a skincare obsessive and you spend 20 plus minutes on your skincare routine, this podcast is for you. Or if you're a newbie at the beginning of your skincare journey journey, you'll love this podcast as well. Because we go so much deeper than beauty. I talk to incredible and inspiring people from across industries about their relationship with beauty. You'll also hear from skincare experts. We break down lots of myths in the beauty industry. If this sounds like your thing, search for naked beauty on your podcast app and listen along. I hope you'll join us.
- [00:59]
Max Rushden
Hello and welcome to Guardian Football Weekly. A soft launch after the international break with an FA cup quarterfinal preview. Man City Liverpool. The tie of the round with Southampton Arsenal and Chelsea Port bail the chances of a giant killing on Chelsea. There's some classic players saying stuff on international duty. Marc Cucurella and Enzo Fernandes not sounding too excited about the current setup. While the club announces a gazillion pound loss but still within PSR somehow. It's a big weekend in the championship and we haven't tackled Nigel Farage at Ipswich yet. Nick Aimes has been to Kosovo. We'll ask him about that. There's some hair pulling in the Women's Champions League to discuss and news of Barry's VIP half marathon treatment. We'll do all that, answer your questions and that's today's Guardian Football Weekly. On the panel today, Barry Glendenning. Welcome.
- [01:45]
Barry Glendenning
Hello.
- [01:46]
Jordan Jarrett-Bryan
Hello.
- [01:46]
Max Rushden
Jordan, Jarrett Bryant.
- [01:47]
Jordan Jarrett-Bryan
Hello mate.
- [01:48]
Max Rushden
And good morning, Nick Ames.
- [01:49]
Nick Ames
Hello Max.
- [01:50]
Max Rushden
Let's look ahead then to the quarterfinals of the FA Cup. Man City Liverpool Saturday 12:45. Kickoff is the tie of the round. Possibly the biggest story is Liverpool Jordan and how important the FA cup might be to them and whether it'll save Arne Slot's job.
- [02:05]
Jordan Jarrett-Bryan
My thinking with this is that I think the Champions League run would be the bigger in terms of qualifying for it was the bigger determinants of whether he is the Liverpool manager next season or not. I think a trophy in the bank that can get the FA cup will be great for them but I think the more important thing for them or him in terms of keeping his job would be finishing in that top five because I think it would optically look horrific if they went from champions to not even qualifying for the to the champions League, especially with five slots now. But obviously financially in terms of the footballing project, to not qualify for it I think would be really, really bad. So the FA cup for them I think would, would, would maybe keep the wolves at the door for a little while. But I reckon if you offer the Liverpool fans Champions League qualification or the FA Cup, I think a lot would say their take, they'd rather be in the Champions League next season.
- [02:58]
Max Rushden
It's interesting, you know Jordan, we sort of trying to work out what would save Slot's job. Do you think it is a valid conversation, Barry, that we're even asking what Slot needs to do to, to keep his job? Or do you think the Premier League title should give you grace to have another go and not work it out?
- [03:14]
Barry Glendenning
No, I'm not surprised that we're having this conversation. We have beaten the drum regularly this season that because of the tragedy that happened last summer, Liverpool should get a pass this season. Not everyone agrees. A lot of Liverpool fans are very frustrated with the way their team has been playing, with the way the manner in which they've reinforced the squad and the squad has got worse. So I guess I understand that frustration. I think the FA cup is important to them. I'm not sure winning it would help save Slot's job if he doesn't qualify for the Champions League, but winning it is certainly better than not winning it. They have beaten City in each of the last four meetings in the FA cup, for whatever that's worth. City are on a 17 game winning streak at home in the cup. They've been in seven successive quarterfinals. Pep takes his competition very seriously. I think he will put out a strong team. Manchester City can't really put out a weak team. It's really hard one to call. I think City will probably prevail, but I wouldn't be surprised if, if they didn't.
- [04:25]
Max Rushden
We saw how much Pep celebrated winning the league cup to give you, I mean and maybe read far too much into that that, you know, maybe this is his last swan song and given the title is not out of reach but will be difficult and they're out of the Champions League. You know, a double cup season is good. I mean it sounds ridiculous, of course it's good for pretty much anyone but for City it is still just about above par.
- [04:48]
Nick Ames
Would you say it would absolutely do in the circumstances? I think and I've got no doubt and as Barry says, we can be proved wrong in 48 hours that both managers all go for it in this one. It was the big ticket Ding Dong clash in the Premier League just a couple of years ago and the optics of getting Sherlocks in it are pretty bad for whoever it is. And I think this is, it's a massive chance for them both. You win, you come out of it and you probably along with Arsenal if they win at Saints, which we'll come to your red hot favorites to win the cup. And I, I do, I do think it is bigger for Liverpool, honestly. I think the, the PSG game ahead of them is, is massive but they're not going to be favorites for it at all. It's coming up, what, four days later, Wednesday. So I think there is more on it for Liverpool. But I, I think there'll be an edge to this one. I think there'll be maybe a bigger edge to it than people expect from
- [05:53]
Jordan Jarrett-Bryan
a City point of view. I've been thinking about how people have been framing their season. There's lots of talk around this being a bad, generally a bad season for Manchester City. And I was at Wembley for the Caribou cup final and after I was kind of got over Soul King and ranting and raving about Arteta's tactical flaws in that particular match, I then turned to thinking about what is a bad season, right? And I thought to myself, well, if City can win one, maybe two domestic cups, take Arsenal to the last game of the season and finish second for a big club, that should be a bad season. A bad season should be a cup or two and a title race, right? What we're seeing with United, Man United in recent years, spurs, even Arsenal in, in years gone by and Liverpool arguably this season is big team, has a bad season, fifth, sixth, seventh, eighth or even lower. That is not acceptable for a big club. But Manchester City, the talk has been this is a bad season for them. But they would say our standards are that high. Now our floor is one, maybe two domestic trophies and a title race that goes to the last week of the season. What they're doing is I think what other big clubs should be aspiring to do, which is we come in the title every single season. We come in the European cup every single season, of course, but there's got to be a minimum standard and that has to be. We've got to pick up something and push for a league title at the bare minimum, every single season.
- [07:15]
Max Rushden
Southampton, Arsenal. Nick, you probably watch more of the championship than the rest of us with your, your Ipswich supporting hat on. And Southampton are in absolutely brilliant form, aren't they? One four drew one in March. They've got this manager, 32 year old Tonda Eckert who has done an absolutely brilliant job.
- [07:34]
Nick Ames
Yeah and one of the impressive things about him is that when, when, when he took the job they had a good run straight away and everyone was like, oh, he's the real deal. Then, then they fell off a bit and you, and you think, okay, maybe that was for the new manager bounce and a young guy who, who might find it hard to turn it around again. But now they're in superb form. They look very well balanced, a lot better than they have in, in recent times. Michelle Charles looks like a very good player in midfield alongside Flynn Downs as well. And they are, they're probably the classic team you wouldn't want to face in the playoffs at this point. They're the one that is in absolutely red hot form. So I mean, why not? It's a moonshot for them against Arsenal. Now we'll see what, what kind of team Arsenal pick. We'll see. I hate bringing it down this road, but we'll see whether Southampton really want the extra one, the extra hassle of another game and juicing their squad to the max when they, when they are in such a great position now in the Championship. But it'll be a good litmus test for them to see how much they've recovered under er in, in the last few weeks and months. And I guess not too many people around there would be disappointed if they came out with a sort of honorable swinging narrow defeat and could then get on with, with the business of, of, of what has become a promotion push late in the day. So I, I, I think that's a very exciting tie actually. But I don't think there'll be too much devastation around some areas if they don't make it.
- [09:09]
Barry Glendenning
Sure.
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Max Rushden
Which takes the pressure off a bit I guess on Barry, on the sort of what the neutrals want, which is Arsenal to come second in everything. Would you, would you take Arsenal getting knocked out now or do you want them to get to the final of this and the Champions League and you know, just really, really like Hammer Home being second in everything.
- [09:29]
Barry Glendenning
I think they'll win this. I'd be very surprised if they don't. It would be a bad result if they didn't win them. Obviously a lot of this depends on how many of those, what was it, 10, 11 players who limped or were carried back from international duty on, on shields and stretchers and in the back of ambulances. How many of them managed to make miraculous recoveries ahead of this weekend? One presumes Arteta will field a semi reserve side. I would imagine Max Downwind will play, given his brilliant performance in the previous round. You know, he's a really exciting young player. I like watching him. It kind of speaks volumes about. If you look at the lineups for these quarterfinals, the eight teams involved, pretty much seven of them have bigger fish to fry than the FA cup. And the only ones who don't are Port Vale. And that's because they're more or less down already at, you know, they're at the bottom of League One and I think they're pretty much doomed. But the other seven teams all have more important things to worry about. And that's a shame, I suppose, but Arsenal should win this. It would be. If, if they didn't, I think people would start talking about mentioning the B word.
- [10:50]
Max Rushden
Don't say it, Barry. Don't say it, Barry.
- [10:53]
Nick Ames
Don't say it.
- [10:54]
Max Rushden
I think you're right. And obviously, well, that is good news. And we'll get to Port Vale, trip to Chelsea, Pavel will feel their strongest side. We'll get to that. But Jordan, as an Arsenal fan there is that. That was the problem. Not just losing the League cup final for losing the League cup final's sake and not getting a trophy, but the fear starts to come in and, and defeat here would. It would rattle anyone, actually, I think, yeah, probably, yeah.
- [11:22]
Jordan Jarrett-Bryan
If, if Arsenal were to get knocked out of two cup competitions in two games, that's obviously not very. That's not good. Especially to lower. With the caveat of respect to Southampton, who are playing quite well at the moment. But, but yeah, I mean, I, I still wouldn't expect it to alter what's happening in the League. I think that if this does, then that says a lot more about this team manager than, than even I thought. So I don't think they'll lose this game. I don't think it'll be an easy game. I think Southampton will really go for it. Arsenal will make changes. And I think the break which has divided a lot of Arsenal fans, come at a good time. Something that they would have liked to go back on the horse straight away after the final loss and got back going again. I think this break is. Been a lot of games, a lot of football from Arsenal since the turn of the year up until this point. So I think the break actually, everyone's reset, lost the final call. Let's, let's, let's, let's just refocus and hopefully kind of advance the next round of the FA cup and, and I think they Will. I think they will.
- [12:20]
Max Rushden
You had what you said was a sort of tepid take on the Arsenal pullouts.
- [12:24]
Jordan Jarrett-Bryan
Well, a mango and lime if you like, on the kind of Nando's hot sauce scale. First of all on the. Barry alluded to it earlier on about the whole talk around the pullout of Arsenal players and you know, are they just pulling a fast one? Is it Michetta influencing the Arsenal players? That may well have happened but I want to give actually Thomas Tuchel a little bit of credit. Right. Because I think what's happened there is threefold. I think the first element of this is Thomas Tuchel being a former club manager at the top level, recognizing that Arsenal and Bayern Munich, because Kane pulled out too, have a couple of really big months coming up. They really need to be with England. They really need to be around that they let them focus on on that last couple of months. Second, he doesn't want to. He wants to get those managers on side. He's extended his stay with England to the Euros. I think he wants to keep the club managers on side. Look, I'll do you a favor. You do me a favor. So I think there's a little bit of that in there as well. I don't need these guys getting injured not only for their club but for the third element of this is selfish. I need Sakura and Rice who are definitely and Kane who are definitely part of my 11. I need them fit for the World Cup. So me playing them in a two meaningless friendliest that serves nobody. The players rather have the couple of weeks off. I don't need to see them. So I know what they're going to start for me against Croatia anyway. And on Ben White's a quick point on him. I think he should go to the World cup. And just here's my take. Why I understand all the whole, you know, he can't play for England again. How dare he not give us an answer. Explain yourself. I'm ambivalent. I don't really care if he explains or doesn't. I get by the paying fans. Want to hear an explanation. I don't really care. Right. But the reason why I think he goes to the World cup is because whil Reece James is quite clearly the best right back. England have one of the best players. They have. I would say too the injury problems are a concern and Ben White is not battle worn. You want players that go to the World cup that are not knackered, that haven't played. He hasn't played a lot of football this season. So there's that. And also the best right back for. For Bakaya Saka is also probably going to be Ben White. So whilst I get the whole nationalistic how dare he put an English shirt ever again. He's a disgrace argument. All right, cool. If England win the World cup and Ben White in that team, no one's going to care. Also finally, Bar Gahi, is there a center back in that England squad that is clearly better than Ben White? I'm not sure there is. It's much of a muchness apart from Gay, in my opinion. So those are the reasons why I think he should be included. Whilst I accept he probably won't, I'd
- [14:57]
Max Rushden
say the take got hotter as it went on. Thank you very much.
- [15:02]
Barry Glendenning
On the subject of these people who are demanding that Ben White explain his reasons for leaving the England camp, do we not all know? I mean, I know why he left the England camp and if I know, I'm pretty sure everyone else knows.
- [15:15]
Nick Ames
So why.
- [15:16]
Barry Glendenning
Why does he need. He had an argument with Steve Holland over not accessing some training, doing his homework, his pre match prep, that's. He fell out with Steve Holland. He left the camp. Why do we need to hear it from him when we already know what happened?
- [15:32]
Max Rushden
I can't believe what a spoiler you've given ahead of the the documentary. I'm only on season one. I'm only on. I'm only in six at the quarterfinal. I don't know if we won yet. Chelsea play Port Vale. It was established Portvale are bottom of League One with a goal difference of -25. One win in their last five. So feels like unlikely that they will do anything at Stamford Bridge. I mean it would be marvelous if they managed it. It is a free hit for them. Mark Cucarella in the international break speaking to the Athletic was talking about how much he missed Enzo Maresca. Some interesting sort of line of chat. We knew what Maresca wanted from us. Winning a title like the Club World cup also helps strengthens the bond. You create relationships during the celebrations. When a manager gives you that confidence and offers you a platform to fight for titles, you die for him. The moment Mareska left, it had a big, big impact on us. These are decisions taken by the club. If you asked me, I would not have made this decision to make a change like that. The best thing is to wait until the end of the season. The instability around the club comes from this. In a nutshell. We had a caretaker first, then a new manager with new ideas and no time to work on them. It is what it is. They're interesting. Nick, on whether. I know Malagusto came out and said, oh, we all love Liam Rossini, but that, that is not a ringing endorsement of Rocinha from a very senior player.
- [16:45]
Nick Ames
No. And he's, he's. He's saying what almost what seems obvious to people watching on that, you know, what, what are Chelsea? What is this club? What is this side? How, how, how on earth do you find the time and space to develop something there when you're chopping and changing so fundamentally? Now, obviously Mareskia had issues with the club. I normally don't like it when journalists and fans and people are analyzing body language and stuff like that because everyone thinks they're a COD body language expert and most of the time people get it wrong. But I was watching Chelsea the other week against PSG at Stamford Bridge, and obviously the press box, as most of you guys will know, is right behind the dugout and the game was getting away from them and you can see Virginia really earnestly shouting out instructions and trying to cajole the players. And I just don't think anyone was listening.
- [17:43]
Max Rushden
What was the body language? They have their fingers in their ears going, la, la, la.
- [17:49]
Nick Ames
But, you know, sometimes you've watched enough football and seen enough stuff to know when something is. Isn't quite right. And I just got the feeling that he wasn't cutting through. Now, I like him a lot. I think I respect what he's done before. I think he's an extremely articulate, bright guy, but it just doesn't seem to fit to me. And that all feeds back in to the broader point that Cucurella made, that Chelsea are chopping and changing from approach to approach to approach, and it's not. Not helping them generate or garner any kind of momentum. And, you know, goes back to the whole four years of the, of the Blue Co kind of Clear Lake era, where it's. It's just been a, a big spending up. So far. It's been probably, I don't know, a club World cup title title doesn't sound so bad, does it? But otherwise, it's probably the biggest failure in world football. Pound for pound, I'm not surprised that the players are confused. And a point where they feel happy to tell us that they're confused.
- [18:54]
Barry Glendenning
Yeah. Because Enzo Fernandez also came out and was quite critical of the club hierarchy for firing Enzo Maresco. He said, I don't understand it. Sometimes as a player, there's things we don't understand and the way they try to manage Things I don't have an answer for you because I don't know. And then he proceeded to twerk like Miley Cyrus in the direction of Real Madrid and I think Cucarella was hitching his skirts in the direction of Barcelona. So yeah, interesting to see where they end up next season.
- [19:29]
Max Rushden
Yeah. On the subject of the money, Chelsea announced yesterday they've made the biggest pre tax loss in Premier League history. 262 million pound deficit for 2425 eclipses the 197.5 million lost by Man City in 2011. So many congratulations to Chelsea for this. Despite them bringing in 490.9 million in revenue, which the club says is the second highest total in their history. Doesn't really count if you lose 262 million more. The club insists they remain compliant with financial regulations such as profit and sustainability rules which allow losses of over 105 million over three years. Figures used to calculate PSR are different to this pre tax loss. But you know, I'm. I'm boring myself.
- [20:14]
Barry Glendenning
Well, Kieran McGuire, accounting's Kieran McGuire, friend of the show has said that you can't really read into these numbers until they post their full accounts which they haven't done yet. But apparently they will not fall foul of PSR guidelines because of that time they sold their women's football team to themselves.
- [20:38]
Max Rushden
Got it. Well, roll on them releasing their accounts. Maybe we'll do a pod special on it. And obviously the best, the best COD body language expert is Captain Bird's eye.
- [20:48]
Jordan Jarrett-Bryan
Of course.
- [20:48]
Max Rushden
Thank you so much here all week. West Ham Leeds 4 thirst. Just shaking heads. Absolute silence. Someone will have enjoyed it. West Ham Leeds, which you know we talk Jordan, about feeling weak insides but you know, both these sides, you know, I think they have to play each other in the league as well.
- [21:05]
Nick Ames
Final day of the season.
- [21:06]
Max Rushden
Yeah, I think you're right. I think they'd happily take defeat in this for a win in that one, Jordan.
- [21:10]
Jordan Jarrett-Bryan
Yeah, but why can't I have both? I mean I would love it if both really went for this one. I'm still kind of irked by the Fulham exit from the cup from the last round. I don't understand. I think Crystal palace have shown that, you know, with the right intention, with a good team you can get to the latter parts of the cup and possibly even win it. Now a team like palace or West Ham or a Leeds won't win it every single year, of course, but I just thought that they opened the door for those other teams to build to Just believe, believe. And I get it, they've got other priorities. Being in the Premier League is a cash cow, yada yada yada. But I, I would really love it if they, if they did just said, you know what, sod it, we're going to just put out a strong team. We want to win this game. You know, you're not playing Man United, you're not playing Arsenal, you're not playing Man City, you're playing another team that's down there with you as well. You can win this. That, that would be my message to both these teams. You can both win this game. So whilst again, I accept that they probably won't put out strong teams, you're probably right. Max. I would love it if they, if, if they did.
- [22:13]
Max Rushden
What a boon for Manchester United to be included in the. You're not playing.
- [22:17]
Jordan Jarrett-Bryan
Yeah.
- [22:18]
Max Rushden
Good club there.
- [22:19]
Nick Ames
Yeah.
- [22:19]
Max Rushden
What a moment that is for them. They're back on the map.
- [22:22]
Nick Ames
Yes, Nick, I think it's time for Leeds to win a game. So I wonder whether, whether he will go strong, especially with a clear week ahead. Because we've had lots of great conversations about the relegation battle in recent weeks and obviously spurs is this slow motion car crash that's about to get, maybe crash here with Deserbi and Forest, their own ludicrous soap opera. And that's all very entertaining and dramatic as well, but Leeds can't win a game of football at the moment. And they're the ones that people aren't really talking about. And I think they've only won once since I think it's mid January.
- [23:00]
Max Rushden
I mean, sounds good from a Spurs point of view, to be honest. But yeah, you're probably right.
- [23:04]
Nick Ames
Exactly. And okay, they've only lost a couple since, but they're drawing all the time. And I think, I think they're in a bit more trouble than people think. And I just wonder whether striking a blow in what otherwise. Yes, does look like a dress rehearsal for Almighty Set two in May would, would help them. I, I, I don't think they could afford to show up with a second string team and get turned over here. I think that's a slippery slope.
- [23:31]
Barry Glendenning
I think Nuno generally picks second string seams in the FA cup, so I would expect him to do the same here. Leeds have played five times in London this season. Haven't won any of them. Lost two, drawn three of the seven games they have remaining in the league. They still have to play Wolves, Burnley and Spurs as well as West Ham. So they're, they're big games for them. I think both these managers would love to not have to play this match.
- [23:59]
Max Rushden
Yeah, you might be right. Destiny in their own hands. So, all right, that'll do for part one. Part two, we'll do Nigel Farage at Ipswich.
- [24:10]
Brooke Devard
Hello, hello, it's Brooke Devard from Naked Beauty. Join me each week for unfiltered discussion about beauty trends, self care journeys, wellness tips and the products we absolutely love and cannot get enough of. If you are a skincare obsessive and you spend 20 plus minutes on your skincare routine, this podcast is for you. Or if you're a newbie at the beginning of your skincare journey, you'll love this podcast as well. Because we go so much deeper than beauty. I talk to incredible and inspiring people from across industries about their relationship with beauty. You'll also hear from skincare experts. We break down lots of myths in the beauty industry. If this sounds like your thing, search for Naked Beauty on your podcast app and listen along. I hope you'll join us.
- [25:00]
Max Rushden
Welcome to Part two of the Guardian Football Weekly. So a full fixture list in the Championship League one and League two on Good Friday and then again on Easter Monday. Such a great time to be a lower league fan. Although terrifying, obviously. The big game is Cambridge v Swindon. The Max Rushton, David Squires Derby Thursday night, 8pm kickoff in the championship bar of Millwall. Lunchtime on Saturday is enormous, Nick, isn't it?
- [25:24]
Nick Ames
Absolutely huge. You've got Bower who have wobbled a little bit in recent weeks. You've got Millwall who I think a lot of people thought were going to do well and challenge in the top six this season. They've got a hell of an identity and a hell of a consistency as well. And they've been building through the years to this Millwall sort of coming up on the rails and they are, I mean they harshly lost at home to Blackburn a couple of weeks ago, but on the whole, absolutely flying. Playing with a real vigour and intensity and starting to feel there's a confidence around them that they can really, really do this. And they came away from Ipswich with what was ultimately a deserved draw a couple of weeks ago. I think if they can do the same at boa, who plays some lovely stuff but the cutting edge isn't always quite there. Norwell just that little bit sharper sometimes going forward. I think if they can come away with something then then we will have to start looking at the really serious possibility of Millwall being back in the Premier League, well, in the Premier League and back in the top flight for I think the first time since. I think it's 89.90 kind of time
- [26:34]
Max Rushden
isn't it since Sheringham and Cascarino IBS which are in a good spot Nick aren't they. They are third 69 points. So level on points with Mill. Will they have a game in hand on everyone so they they if they win that they will would go into the automatics one point above Middlesbrough. What do you make of their current situation?
- [26:55]
Nick Ames
The. The current situation on the pitch is that they've. I mean they've got a game in hand. They will have two after. After Saturday and then they've got a month long eight game sprint which given the depth of their squad you should fancy them in. Although it's a lot of football and a lot of away games actually in, in that run I think five. So it's going to be very close. I've. I think they can do it but it's going to be a hell of a tight shave and we'll have to have to see and I guess this might be where you're going. We'll have to see what the off pitch situation is unfolded in the last week or so. Obviously it was a week or ten days ago now when, when this goes out we'll have to see what impact this has on things as well.
- [27:39]
Max Rushden
Do you think it will have an impact?
- [27:40]
Nick Ames
I mean.
- [27:40]
Max Rushden
Nigel Farage turn up at Portman Road last week. Conflicting reports on whether he was invited by the club or not. The club issued a statement saying Ipswich Town Football Club has over several years hosted representatives from a range of political parties. The club remains apolitical, does not support or endorse any individual or party. The club will continue to engage with representatives from across the political spectrum as part of its role within the community. Ipswich Town is proud to be an inclusive, diverse and welcoming organization that supports all members of the local and wider community. This commitment remains unchanged. Now obviously look, this is the Guardian. I, I can't speak for the three of you but I imagine we're not all big Nigel Farage fans. I imagine a lot of our audience aren't big Nigel Farage fans. But the question would be is if it had been a Labor politician or even a Tory or, or a Green politician, would we have the same feelings of, of rage about this or does it. Is it different?
- [28:33]
Nick Ames
Well, there is a principle here that Ipswich allow themselves to get used for political promotional means. I, I think that's incontrovertible. You had. You had a picture that, that was taken at Farage as the banner on Reform UK's X account. You had videos taken from around the stadium. You had Farage on a Reform UK video speculating about Kieran McKenna's job. I mean, I mean, goodness. And I don't think that would be acceptable if it was Labour, Conservative, Green Count, bim, face whoever. I think we have to say there was a principle at play there and there was a reason why you never see this stuff happen in this kind of way. And then obviously, yes, Nigel Farage is a divisive figure. That is exactly why there has been this reaction, because his politics does divide people. There are some people, a significant swathe of the country who like it. That is up to them. There's a very significant swathe who don't. And it's very polarizing. That is why the debate has happened, because he is who he is. And one big misconception I think about this is that it isn't about banning Farage from Portman Road. It's not about ban the fact they hosted him like personally, I don't like him at all, but I respect their right to meet him and his right as an individual to meet whoever he wants and go where he wants. We're not North Korea. This is how our country has to work. So the issue was the way in which he was allowed to jump on it and use it as essentially one massive party political broadcast that made Ipswich Town look absolutely abysmal. I mean, it has been an absolute disaster in comms handling, in crisis management, in not getting ahead of a story, in allowing something that may well have been innocent at the start to become a scandal and just taking it back to the players and team, if you like. I know for a fact that this cut through to the players straight away. I know this, it cut through. They were discussing it in the dressing room at Playford Road, their training ground the next day. It's like literally saying, how was this guy allowed to do it? It's quite a switched on, it's quite a mixed nationalities bunch. There will be people in there who are fairly politically engaged. But Kieran McKenna, the football manager, who should be bothering with preparing his team for an eight game run in that is worth an incalculable amount to the club and to people's careers and everything. And instead he's going to be the guy taking the questions because the club themselves won't answer any about how this came about, how much they knew why this came about. I, I just think the lack of accountability and communication and, and and sheer common sense in this whole thing has been absolutely damning.
- [31:40]
Jordan Jarrett-Bryan
Just briefly from me. Yeah. On this. I mean, I'm a massive cynic. Right. And we're talking about Nigel Farage possibly using Ipswich to benefit himself.
- [31:49]
Max Rushden
Probably.
- [31:49]
Jordan Jarrett-Bryan
Maybe. I wonder if Ipswich have also used this opportunity to benefit them or they've used for us to benefit their purposes because we're in the attention economy. Right. Where you started by asking if this was labor, if this was the Greens or another party, would this be a big issue? Nigel Farage is the most famous politician in the country. So I just wonder if the club. Because how do you get to make those videos and that, all those photos and all those broadcasts without the club being in? I don't. He didn't sneak in on a club tour day sort of thing and take a couple of sneaky pictures by the pitch. These look like they're properly well done. So I can't help but think the club have been involved in this and they've recognized that. If we can get some publicity through Farage, good or bad, it puts our name on the map. And the great guys at Guardian Football Weekly, we'll discuss. Discuss us.
- [32:43]
Nick Ames
I mean, that's one of the issues here that you've correctly touched on, which is how much the club knew, because the kind of briefing beforehand, because Reform signposted this the night before, tweeting, saying, we're soon going to Portman Road. And then the alarm bells started ringing among a lot of people. The briefing was, oh, this was a bit of an ambush. They booked under a different name. Vator turned up, they showed up. We couldn't stop them from running amok. In fact, a few people at the club definitely knew, so I gather for about 48 hours there was some kind of invitation given to Farage, stop by while you're in East Anglia, which he was for some campaigning. The question is, then why don't you spend those couple of days preparing for what might happen? Like, okay, let's make sure that he doesn't come in with his social media crew and just do what he wants. I'm not sure that Ipswich wanted themselves to be put alongside Reform UK for their own promotional purposes. I don't believe that at all, to be honest. But I do think that they were asleep at the wheel and didn't quite realise how big that was, big it was going to become and think it was going to blow up.
- [34:04]
Barry Glendenning
Around the same time he visited Portman Road, Farage said he'd had an invitation to go and visit Sunderland Football club. And it seems he met Juan Sartori, the Sunderland minority owner Uruguayan fella, at the Davos conference and Sartori had said to him, oh, you should come to a game. Now he hasn't had an official invitation from Sunderland. I hope he doesn't get one because the values Sunderland claimed to promote and indeed Ipswich inclusivity and tolerance could not be further removed. But. And just him saying that he'd been invited to Sunderland has already fomented a huge amount of division between Sunderland fans. Because Reform and Nigel Farage are incredibly popular in that neck of the woods. Because the people of Sunderland have been let down by the Tories and now they feel they're being let down by Labor. There's a very good chance Reform will have an MP elected in Sunderland at the next election. And I think a lot of people, a lot of Sunderland fans would welcome Farage with open arms to their club. I don't know if that's the case in Ipswich, but Reform are popular on Weir side. You know Farage, he's a great admirer of Trump. He's widely associated with xenophobia, he's been accused of racism. He associates with people who've been caught making racist comments. I think this is not a person anyone who loves their football club would want associated with their football club. He has no interest in Ipswich, he has no interest in Sunderland. He is against the football regulator. This is just naked opportunism.
- [35:48]
Max Rushden
I completely agree. And that'll do for part two. Part three. We'll begin with the Women's Champions League. Leadership used to mean having all the answers. But today's best leaders embody a more human approach. I'm Jack Myers. And I'm Tim Spangler. Tim and I have spent our careers inside media, marketing and culture and we partnered with the Acast Creator Network to start Lead Human to answer one simple question. What does it really look like to lead in this AI dominated world? The biggest tip for being a creator, it's a job.
- [36:19]
Nick Ames
What I learned from Michael Jackson, here's
- [36:21]
Max Rushden
a man who understands precision. It's about answering the questions that are hard, not about answering a bunch of
- [36:28]
Barry Glendenning
teed up questions that are fake.
- [36:29]
Max Rushden
What we're looking for are real stories and practical advice that you can use with your teams right away. Subscribe to Lead Human with Jack Myers
- [36:37]
Nick Ames
and Tim Spengler wherever you get your podcasts.
- [36:51]
Max Rushden
Welcome to Part three of the Guardian Football Weekly. In the Women's Champions League yesterday, Manchester United were one up on Bayern Munich. So it was level on aggregate until they conceded 2 in the last 10 minutes.
- [36:59]
Nick Ames
Minutes.
- [37:00]
Max Rushden
So they are out. Chelsea were 31 down to Arsenal. They beat Arsenal 1 nil on the night, but go out 3 2. I guess the most controversial moment of this is Sonia Bonpasta sent off late on. And in a post match interview. I don't know if any of you have seen this. She actually gets the phone out of the interview to say, look, Casey McCaig is pulling Alicia Thompson's hair and asking why she wasn't sent off. And I kind of think Jordan, that's, it's sort of fine for a manager to do this, to say, look, here is a thing. And because she was furious with the referee in the first thing, there was an absolutely ridiculous disallowed goal. And I think she's got a real point here again.
- [37:37]
Jordan Jarrett-Bryan
She does. I mean, I think I've ranted on this podcast before about how people respond to hair pulling in games and it's just seen as, oh, it's not, it's not that bad. It's disgusting. And, but I don't understand how anybody, any official didn't see it in real time and deemed that a red card at the time. That, that just blows, blows my mind. And I think this season alone, between the men's and women's games, there's been at least five incidents across the two top leagues, the Premier League and wsl of, of players having their hair pulled. So it's, it's, it's definitely increasing and I don't buy this. It's a reflex when someone goes past you. It's a. I, I just don't, I don't buy it. I think it's intentional, I think it's disgusting and I think I, I would give it a re. A really, really severe punishment. But you it to the punishment because it's not even being, you know, red card, it's not even given a red card offense. So yeah, and I think showing like literally, look, look, look, look, somebody is so bad. And I think unless we nip it in the bud early, this is going to continue into, into next season and beyond.
- [38:42]
Max Rushden
I would say my one year old Willie Rushton, for him is quite instinctive. See also biting. But, you know, hopefully he grows out of it.
- [38:50]
Barry Glendenning
I'm going to stick up for Katie McCabe here. I agree she pulled Alyssa Thompson's hair. I agree she should have got a red card, but I also think she didn't do it intentionally. I believe her when she said she meant to grab her shirt rather than her hair just from looking at the footage, she was immediately apologetic. She also was standing nearby looking quite sheepish. When Sonia Bombaster got sent off for complaining, I, I actually thought she was going to intervene and, and ask the ref not to punish Bombaster. So while I agreed the, the hair was pulled, I do believe her when she said she was reaching to, to pull out of the shirt.
- [39:34]
Nick Ames
Sure.
- [39:34]
Max Rushden
Which would suggest that all players just have so much hair that like you try and pull the shirt but you, you just can't avoid getting their hair.
- [39:43]
Barry Glendenning
Let's make everyone in the WSI will play with a, a buzz cut or a short back and sides. Stamp out the problem immediately.
- [39:52]
Max Rushden
Or sort of a deaf leopard haircut, you know, men's or women's. That is so much hair.
- [39:59]
Nick Ames
Yeah.
- [40:00]
Max Rushden
Poodle perm. And you will get the opposition sent off. Nick, you mentioned going to Kosovo. Tell us a little bit about it.
- [40:06]
Nick Ames
Yeah, I, I just got back. I was at the playoff game against Turkey for the World cup and it's a story that I've covered ever since they played their first official game in 2014 against Haiti, when they weren't even members of FIFA and UEFA back then. So their rise to what was the brink of a World cup spot has been pretty extraordinary. So as soon as I saw that they'd beaten Slovakia to get to the playoff final, I knew wild horses couldn't keep me away. So I hot footed it to, to Pashtina where there was a massive party. Absolutely enormous vibe going on there. There was players saying it was the biggest occasion since Kosovo became independent in 2008. Huge build up, people pouring in from all over the country and from neighboring Albania to which it's extremely closely tied. It was just an absolutely enormous carnival, like almost for, like of which I haven't seen in this specific context before the game. And that was lovely in itself to see the contrast from 12 years ago when they had this ragtag bunch of almost randomly selected players, whoever would play for them. And they were all. I remember before this game of Haiti training on this rutted pitch beneath one of the most polluting power stations in Europe. He had sort of somebody would put a penalty in, in training and then there'd be a belch of sulfur coming down from the tower above. And it was, it was absolutely, it was no, no place to prepare, but it was what they had back then. And to see them going from that to this was, was, was really heartwarming. Honestly, it's a story. I've been back several times. The game as, as everyone will know by now, they, they lost 1 nil to Turkey, Very, very close. There was a lot of, of, you know, upset afterwards because I, I think it, it was that close. They hit the post first half, the goal was a bit of a scramble from Turkey. There were chances to equalize and I think in some ways they'd have felt better if they'd lost, lost 4 nil and just been outclassed, which they weren't. But, yeah, great occasion, A very close game. I, I think Kosovo have got a lot of players waiting to join them in future years as well, hopefully from, from the diaspora, which is very wide, obviously across Europe since the sense of difficulties and then war of the 1990s. So I think they've got a bright future. And then Turkey, of course, this was a bit of a moment in modern history for them too, because in a World cup context, they came third in 2002, didn't they, and then disappeared. Nobody could qualify them. But here they are under Vincenzo Montella, who seems to have drilled out a bit of the kind of impetuousness from them and they did quite a calm, measured, professional job this time. So we'll see them back in the World cup and then maybe they're dark horses to be this year's dark horses, as we often say about them. So that on its own is an interesting story simply because of what a football hotbed Turkey is. But yeah, I think if Kosovo had made it, it would have been the most stunning story in international football in many years. And I think, you know, I probably still wouldn't have gone to. Gone to sleep since then, to be honest, because the party over there would have been crazy. But I think the progress they have made and what football means in terms of representation of what is still a very young country there is absolutely profound and I think nobody who was there will forget it.
- [43:52]
Max Rushden
I encourage everyone to read Nick's piece about that. Now, probably slightly less important, Barry, but you were very excited in the WhatsApp group group about the news that the Premier League have made all of the games ever available to watch.
- [44:04]
Barry Glendenning
On their website last night, producer Jesse revealed the news in the WhatsApp group that the Premier League have made highlights of every Premier League game available for free, which is pretty amazing, he said. To which I replied, I live alone, have no kids and haven't had a proper girlfriend since 2014, but still find this news hugely underwhelming.
- [44:29]
Max Rushden
Well, it's good news for some. You know, some people who want to go and watch Liverpool's Newcastle four threes or some Tony Yeboah or something. But anyway, it's there for you now if you have nothing else to do. Matty says, I just spent £495 on one face value ticket for England Ghana in FIFA's Last Chance Sale. Am I insane? I think by all accounts they sort of keep saying there are last chance sales, but they might be holding some tickets back. We're going to do something on ticket prices in a big way because they are frankly ridiculous. Then we heard, you know, that they're going to increase the prices of public transport as well, et cetera, et cetera. So not going to be a cheap World Cup. I don't know if anyone has an answer to this, but maybe they do. Do any of the panel have any matchday superstitions? If not, do they want some? I have far too many and I'm looking to offload some before next season. Asks Shalott. Or not.
- [45:19]
Barry Glendenning
My only superstition, and it's not a match day one. Well, if it happened on a match day, is saluting magpies when I see them.
- [45:28]
Nick Ames
Right.
- [45:28]
Barry Glendenning
Which is quite annoying when I'm out running because I tend to bump into quite a lot of them.
- [45:34]
Max Rushden
I see. And you stop and have to bow or can you carry on running?
- [45:38]
Barry Glendenning
Well, it's just if you see a solitary magpie, you. You just give him a salute and say, hello, Mr. Magpie, how's your wife? I think I've mentioned this before.
- [45:47]
Max Rushden
I think you have, yeah. But you know what? If that costs you victory in the half marathon, you lose by half a second because you're blowing in mile 12 and you've had to say, hello, Mr. Magpie. Well, can't imagine Wilson Kipkitto doing that in the, in the Olympics.
- [46:01]
Barry Glendenning
I'll take my chances. If it cost me victory, so be it. I did discover I've been offered VIP treatment in the London Landmarks Half Marathon.
- [46:10]
Max Rushden
Wow, okay.
- [46:10]
Barry Glendenning
I was rather hoping this would mean being carried around the course on a sedan chair, but that's not how it worked. But I will get to. I'll have access to what has been called a luxury toilet. Toilet. So, wow, forward to seeing that. And I'll also possibly be rubbing shoulders with ian Beal from EastEnders, aka Adam Wood yet Joe Wiley. And who's the other one? Singer that won? Oh, Alexandra Burke.
- [46:40]
Max Rushden
Okay.
- [46:41]
Barry Glendenning
Quite low rent celebrity entries to the London Lover.
- [46:45]
Nick Ames
Yeah.
- [46:45]
Max Rushden
Oh, you can't. Not Wiley. Orion Beal for that matter, or Alexandra Burke. Bleeding love, wasn't it?
- [46:51]
Barry Glendenning
That was like.
- [46:51]
Max Rushden
That was a banger.
- [46:52]
Jordan Jarrett-Bryan
Did she sing Leona Lewis, I think that was.
- [46:54]
Max Rushden
Oh, my apologies. Okay. I mean, that's not really hers, is it? My apologies, Alexandra, but you know, I
- [47:00]
Barry Glendenning
just have a decision of going to use the luxury toilet. Adam, would you or Ian be coming out and going? I'll give it 10 minutes.
- [47:11]
Max Rushden
Feels as good a place to end. I should end on this. You know, we did a lot on how sad we were for Italy, but football fans never forget Invincible Asterix. Writing not a question. But as a one eyed Aussie, I will forever enjoy Italy not making the World cup as karma for Grosso's dive in 2006, even if it was a penalty. I did feel a bit sorry for Nicky though. Yeah, well, Lucas, Neil should never have gone to ground. But you're right. Massive dive. An absolute outrage. And you are right to hold on to these bitter things for the rest of your days. Anyway, that'll do for today. Thanks, everybody. Thanks, Jordan. Cheers, pal. Thanks, Nick.
- [47:43]
Nick Ames
Thank you, Max.
- [47:44]
Max Rushden
Thank you, Barry.
- [47:45]
Barry Glendenning
Thanks.
- [47:46]
Max Rushden
Football Weekly is produced by Taya Papula and Jesse Howard. And our executive producer is Joel Grove. Back on Monday.
- [47:58]
Jordan Jarrett-Bryan
This is the Guardian.
- [48:11]
Brooke Devard
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