Liverpool are back and Van de Ven scores a goal of the season contender – Football Weekly

Summary

Football Weekly – Liverpool are back and Van de Ven scores a goal of the season contender

Date: November 5, 2025
Host: Max Rushden
Panel: Barry Glendenning, Johnny Liu, Nikki Bandini
Producer: Joel Grove

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Overview

This episode of Football Weekly dives deep into a pivotal midweek of European football. The main theme centers on Liverpool’s resurgent, statement win over Real Madrid in the Champions League, highlighting a revitalized side under Arne Slot. The panel also breaks down Mickey Van de Ven’s astonishing solo goal for Spurs, Arsenal’s relentless defensive solidity, Bayern’s dramatic win over PSG, Sunderland v Everton, and broader talking points from European and domestic football. Throughout, the episode maintains its hallmark blend of informed analysis and light-hearted wit.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

Liverpool 1–0 Real Madrid: Statement Win at Anfield

Liverpool’s Performance and Midfield Masterclass

• Johnny Liu (01:19): “I think it was a brilliant performance actually. [Liverpool are] capable of generating a really high level when it clicks... They look like a more functional team with Mac Allister, Gravenberch, and Schobozlai together.”
• The panel notes this feels like the most convincing Liverpool display of the season, with real cohesion especially in midfield.
• Real Madrid looked unusually flat – possibly a delayed hangover from El Clasico.

Dominik Szoboszlai Steals the Show

• Barry Glendenning (03:24): “Szoboszlai was everywhere. He provided the assist for the goal. He had shots saved. Another fine performance from Thibaut Courtois in the Real Madrid goal.”
• Despite fears that new signings would push Szoboszlai out of the side, he has established himself as indispensable.

Conor Bradley vs Vinicius Jr. and the ‘Trent’ Theatre

• Max Rushden sets up the subplot where Bradley impresses at right-back, limiting Vinicius Jr. (06:11).
• Johnny Liu (06:37): “Bradley was absolutely fantastic... brings them a real energy and dynamism.”
• The return, booing, and underwhelming cameo of Trent Alexander-Arnold at Anfield after his controversial move to Madrid is likened theatrically to ‘being dumped’ (07:39 – Johnny Liu: “If I was a Liverpool fan... imagine it’s kind of like being dumped, right?”).

Courtois’ Heroics

• Nikki Bandini (04:43): “It felt like it was very much Courtois against the world for a lot of this game... The more you watched it, the more sensational it looked.”
• Despite Real’s 62% possession, Liverpool’s intensity and organization proved decisive.

Real Madrid’s Struggles

• Johnny Liu (11:18): “There are still gaps in the system, glitches in the mainframe... when the game starts coming for them, they have to come up with solutions on the fly, the base level of understanding isn’t quite there yet.”
• Nikki Bandini (12:46): Emphasizes underlying squad tensions, Xabi Alonso’s stricter management style, and potential issues in integrating big personalities like Vinicius Jr. and Mbappé.

Referee and VAR Drama

Best VAR Moment – Handball Decision

• Max Rushden (14:45): “This was the best moment of the game.”
• Johnny Liu (15:22): “This felt like common sense... Reigning finally.”
• The referee opts not to give a difficult handball penalty after VAR intervention, earning podcast admiration for applying ‘common sense’ rather than rigid literalism.

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Spurs 4–0 Copenhagen: Mickey Van de Ven’s Wonder Goal

Goal of the Season Contender

• Barry Glendenning (16:37): “He kind of set off between two defenders at top speed... skipped around the third defender, all before the halfway line, bursts between two more and has a crack from just outside the box. Boom. What a goal.”
• Nikki Bandini (18:03): “A coast-to-coast is always magic. When it's a center back, it's even better... it's why you go to watch a football game.”
• The panel describes the thrill and theatrical build-up as Van de Ven, a centre-back, dribbles through half the Copenhagen team to score.

Spurs: Entertaining Again

• Barry (19:21): “Much of the criticism Thomas Frank has been shipping this season... they're not entertaining anymore. Tottenham fans can have no complaints about that match last night.”
• Johnny Liu (20:22): Notes the narrative correction after Spurs' previous horror show against Chelsea and the value of this result for their mood and European hopes.

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Arsenal’s Relentless Juggernaut

Another Win, Another Clean Sheet

• Nikki Bandini (22:54): “There’s been some nonsense asking if the title race was already over. Arsenal are playing very, very solid football at the moment.”
• Arsenal’s defensive solidity sets them apart; clean sheets becoming routine.
• Barry Glendenning (26:15): “They’ve won 10 in a row now; not conceded in eight; scored 18 since their last conceded goal… they just love keeping clean sheets.”

Set Pieces and Squad Evolution

• Nikki notes Arsenal now dominate even the set piece phase, once a weak point, and that fringe players like Dalman are given historic Champions League moments (25:00).

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PSG 1–2 Bayern: Bayern’s Perfection, PSG’s Malaise

Bayern’s Impeccable Record

• Johnny Liu (27:40): “It was the performance of the night, to be honest. Almost two great performances—first half pressing, then a classic backs-to-the-wall defensive display.”
• Bayern now 16 wins from 16 in all competitions.

PSG’s Problems

• Johnny Liu: “Something does seem to be missing... that little flash of lightning that made them so devastating last season.”

The Diaz Red Card Debate

• Barry Glendenning (29:32): “It was nasty... he caught Hakimi like scissors.”
• Producer Joel and the panel debate whether Diaz’s challenge was red; sympathy for Hakimi, who leaves injured and could miss the AFCON.

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European Round-Up

Juventus and Napoli’s Problems

• Nikki Bandini (31:34): Spaletti trying bold approaches as Juve struggle for results; Napoli’s European woes under Antonio Conte’s management continue inexplicably.

Atletico 3–1 Union Saint-Gilloise & Other Results

• Barry (34:27): Highlights Antoine Griezmann’s spectacular mullet; Ross Sykes’ memorable goal for Union.

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Domestic Football: Sunderland 1–1 Everton, Wolves Manager Search

Sunderland v Everton

• Barry Glendenning (38:38): Recaps a game of two halves—Sunderland slow starters, but roar back for a well-earned draw.
• Johnny Liu (40:41): Everton’s lack of attacking ambition and their striker woes noted: “Beto is a very Everton striker... will score maybe one legendary goal that everybody remembers in about 28 games.”

VAR Again: Handball Consistency

• The handball law and its application frustrate panel and fans alike.

Wolves Managerial Drama

• Wolves’ failed pursuit of Gary O’Neill discussed; Barry notes fans’ skepticism and the toxicity of fan reaction influencing managers’ decisions.

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Women’s Football: Mary Earps & Coverage of the Women’s Game

Mary Earps and Public Attention

• Johnny Liu (45:05): Reflects on Earps–Hampton controversy as indicative of “women’s football’s attention economy”—the need for players to build brands rapidly, with fleeting fame and little long-term security compared to the men’s game:

  “It is in many ways quite exploitative—a game that ultimately doesn’t really benefit anyone except the people getting content out of it.”

• Nikki Bandini develops the point: windows for mainstream exposure are fewer and more intense in women’s football, intensifying pressures and stakes.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “It’s kind of like being dumped, right? You don’t get to take your dream move and move on and expect it to happen on good terms.” — Johnny Liu on Trent Alexander-Arnold’s Anfield return (07:39)
• “A coast-to-coast is always magic, and when it’s a center back, it’s even better.” — Nikki Bandini on Van de Ven’s goal (18:03)
• “Antoine Griezmann’s mullet is a thing of just quite extraordinary beauty.” — Barry Glendenning (34:27)
• “We want consistency and we want common sense, but you can’t have both. So just cherry-pick whichever you want as it suits you.” — Barry Glendenning on the handball law (43:25)
• “It’s almost hard to explain quite why Conte’s teams are so consistently bad in Europe. It’s not been a year or two—it’s like a decade.” — Nikki Bandini on Napoli and Conte (36:19)
• “It says a lot about the attention economy of women’s football and the way people follow it.” — Johnny Liu, on the Mary Earps–Hannah Hampton story (47:44)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Liverpool v Real Madrid analysis: 00:15–15:22
• VAR handball debate: 14:45–16:12
• Van de Ven’s wonder goal / Spurs v Copenhagen: 16:12–22:24
• Arsenal’s clean sheet streak: 22:24–27:25
• PSG v Bayern & Diaz red card: 27:25–31:31
• Juve/Napoli in Europe & other European results: 31:31–38:10
• Sunderland v Everton: 38:10–43:35
• Wolves manager search: 43:35–45:05
• Mary Earps & women’s football coverage: 45:05–50:35

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Tone & Atmosphere

The panel’s tone is a blend of sharp analysis, easy banter, football lore references (“theatre,” “pantovillain”), and the show’s characteristic wit. There are plenty of laugh-out-loud asides—Johnny imagining the ‘breakup’ with Trent, Barry on Antoine Griezmann’s mullet, and playfully referencing listener questions and inside jokes (“most expensive bench”).

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For the Listener

This episode delivers a comprehensive, often hilarious, and opinionated overview of the week’s biggest matches and ongoing football sagas. From tactical breakdowns to fan culture, VAR controversies, and the subtleties of women’s football media scrutiny, listeners are kept up to speed and entertained—no prerequisite listening required.

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Listen for:

• Tactical and cultural takes with personality
• Unscripted moments of hilarity
• Context and backgrounds for headline games
• A vivid sense of the ongoing narratives and dramas of the 2025 football season

Transcript

[Johnny Liu]

This is the Guardian.

[Max Rushden]

Hello and welcome to the Guardian Football Weekly. Liverpool beat Real Madrid 10 in the Champions League. But for Thibaut Courtois it would have been much, much more. This was Arne Slotside's best performance of the season. Last year's midfield, three all brilliant. And Conor Bradley giving Vinicius absolutely nothing. While the panto of booing Trent Alexander Arnold happened over on the other side. Elsewhere, Micky Van De Ven turns into Son Heung Min and Gareth Bale at the same time and scores the kind of goal you see in a computer game and immediately think this game is unrealistic. You don't get those goals in actual football. Arsenal winner get a clean sheet obviously. Also there's a statement win for Bayern at psg. We'll look back on Sunderland's draw with Everton, Gary o' Neill turning down Wolves and discuss Mary Earps and Hannah Hampton. As always, we'll answer your questions.

[Nikki Bandini]

And.

[Max Rushden]

And that's today's Guardian Football Weekly. On the panel today, Barry Glendenning. Hello.

[Barry Glendenning]

Hi Max.

[Max Rushden]

Now welcome Johnny Liu.

[Johnny Liu]

Hello.

[Max Rushden]

And hello. Nikki Bandini.

[Nikki Bandini]

Morning.

[Max Rushden]

Let's start there at Anfield. Liverpool 1, Real Madrid nil. Brilliant performance from Liverpool. And we kind of said on Monday that maybe Liverpool weren't as back as some has reported. But this feels, Johnny, like a very significant result and a win they totally deserved.

[Johnny Liu]

Yeah, I think it was a brilliant performance actually. And I think there is always a danger and I think we've seen this not just with Liverpool but with all the big clubs this season. There's always a tendency to overreact to one result, one performance. You know, Liverpool were, you know, they were going to walk the title earlier, weren't they? And then they were incredibly lucky and then they were finished in crisis slot, eternally bald. And now they're back again. I think what we're seeing is obviously quite still a slightly fitful and inconsistent team that, that is capable of generating a really high level when it clicks when, when the new signings and when that, when the, when the parts all fit together and that's what, that's what we saw. I think, you know, the main issue, the main factor really is is the fact that that midfield appears to be back. I mean Mac Allister has had a, you know, he's been injured for part of this, this season and now he's back and he. And they've got Graven Busch and they've got Schleich not playing back in the center and they just look like a more functional team. They look like a more functional, organized, confident, driven team with, with those three in the center. And it's no secret, I think that, that when they, when they haven't had those three in tandem and fully fit, they haven't really looked like a. You know, they haven't really been firing and 1 nil. Could have been. Could have been a lot more. To be honest, I thought Real Madrid were really poor. They looked totally bummed out. I don't know whether it was like a delayed reaction to the Clasico or whatever, but. But they were, you know, the number of 50, 50s where they just didn't even look like getting the ball. I thought Dean Howson was, was. He had an abysmal night, to be honest. But I think, you know, to. To a large, A large extent this is because.

[Nikki Bandini]

This is.

[Johnny Liu]

This is because Liverpool put so much pressure on them. The press looked organized. So. Yeah, are we declaring, you know, we're declaring them back? Are we. We're putting their name on the trophy.

[Max Rushden]

I mean, I. You've got to say, Barry, look, because it was just such a brilliant performance and like of those three in midfield, I thought Soboslie was just ridiculous in this game.

[Barry Glendenning]

Yeah, he was brilliant. Yeah, it was. It was a bad night for former Bournemouth players who went for big money during the summer because Kirk was dropped and Hussein was. Was poor or housing. Sorry, was poor. Sabazlai was everywhere. He provided the assist for the goal. He had shots saved. Another fine performance from Thibaut Courtois and the Real Madrid goal. I thought he won for his English haters, even if he did emerge on the losing side. But suppose like I saw him being interviewed after this game.

[Max Rushden]

It was.

[Barry Glendenning]

It was an interview Jamie Carragher conducted for that is it NBC banter show. But he. He said his favorite position is even deeper than the one he was playing last night. But he also stressed, you know, I'm happy just to be on the pitch, so I don't really mind where I'm playing. But he has been outstanding. Everyone thought that the arrival of Verts would lead to him having to fight for his place and probably end up being a substitute. But he has made himself totally indispensable this season wherever he ends up being on the pitch.

[Max Rushden]

And actually Nikki Slot managed to get Virt into the team as well. And Virt played well as well.

[Nikki Bandini]

Yeah, I mean, it felt like more or less everyone played well, didn't it? There wasn't a particularly a play you looked at in their livepool lineup and thought had a. Had a Weak performance. I think they completely owned the middle of the pitch, which is. Was interesting when. When you take a. A view on just the. The bold stats of the game. I think Real Madrid had like 62% of the ball. It didn't feel like that, obviously. That's just because of how the ball was used and the intensity, which I think Johnny was already referencing, just felt so much different on one side of this picture than the other. And to an extent, I do think that is the reality of this extended Champions League group. Real Madrid didn't need to beat Liverpool, but it still wasn't like they came here expecting or wanting to lose and certainly didn't expect to lose like that. I would say in a game where it felt like they were in the end only really close because of Thibaut Courtois who was absolutely sensational. I thought his first half saved from Silverschleid in particular, the one with his foot was. The more you watched it, the more sensational it looked because the body control to keep his foot there and wasn't just one of those. I think sometimes when a keeper saves their foot, it's just because they're close and they hit it into their foot. But he really didn't. He used his whole body there. So it felt like it was very much Courtois against the world for a lot of this game. And in the end, I suppose the Liverpool world won.

[Max Rushden]

Aiden says, would a super league be worth it if it means Conor Bradley can play against Real Madrid more often? It was perfect, Johnny, wasn't it? In that he is having this absolute worldly against Vinicius Trent Alexander Arnold isn't on the pitch and then finally comes on the pitch and then gets booed and doesn't really do anything. All the while Vinicius is just kind of. I mean, Conor Bradley is kind of shepherding the ball out of play with him. This is sort of tugging at him and everything He. He was, he. It was such a great. That whole theater was perfect.

[Johnny Liu]

That was a great little subplot, I thought. You know, Bradley was. Was absolutely fantastic. And you see that the sort of player he can be when again when he's fully fit and he can cover that. That whole flank. He brings them a real energy and dynamism and. And a final ball.

[Max Rushden]

Then.

[Johnny Liu]

Then of course, you know, you have the. I guess the, the Trent entrance. I don't know. I don't know what you call it. A little vignette because, you know, it's hard to. The trencher and the trencher there we Go. There's a, there's a, there's a sub, a former sub talking and you know, because it's hard to say that he had very much impact on the game itself at all. I mean almost none. But obviously everyone was, everyone was waiting for this. Everyone was, wanted to see what the reaction would be and the reaction would be. I guess what everyone assumed the reaction would be. I mean this is, this is, you know, you don't get to take your. I'm not a Liverpool fan, but if I was a Liverpool fan and I have been dumped, you know, I imagine it's kind of like being dumped, right? You don't, you don't get to take.

[Max Rushden]

Did you relentlessly go around town booing?

[Johnny Liu]

I mean the murals of her were defaced. I was shit talking her on the Internet. I burned the jersey I had with her on the back. That's a four running dry here. But yeah, I mean the Hearns bathrobe.

[Barry Glendenning]

Ends up in the fire.

[Johnny Liu]

But you know, you don't get to take your, your dream move and move on and, and expect it to happen on good terms. I think that the amount of pearl clutching that has been, you know, there's been over this, this, this is not how modern football fandom works. And, and yeah there is, there was a pantomime element to it, but there's also I think real genuine feelings. He's not having a great time under Alonso by all accounts, Alexander Arnold this season. He's not, he's had to fight for his place with, with Valverde. I, I wouldn't surprise me if he, you know, he, he, he saw coming back to Anfield as, as almost a way of making it, really making it real. They, this is, this might be the point where it's all basically the lot. The whirlwind of the last six months finally sunk in. Yeah, this thing is, is totally done.

[Nikki Bandini]

It was interesting that, that Alonso then throws him into the game in that situation. Honestly, because the game was going so badly already for Madrid at that point. It's the 82nd minute. It's not like there's an expectation. Maybe there is an expectation, maybe there's a hope from Alonso that this is going to galvanize him and he's going to come into the game and in eight minutes provide this injection of oh, I can't wait to show those guys and turn it around. But it felt like especially leaving it that late, I think maybe if you do it with half an hour it feels a bit different. But leaving it that late, it felt A bit like. It felt a bit like throwing him to the wolves. To me it felt a bit like you could have given him more of a chance than that if you wanted him to try to use this moment to get some uptick in something out of him, I guess.

[Max Rushden]

Yeah. I mean, sort of almost did it for the script writers, you know, almost better not to bring him on. Charlie says would Max boo James Richardson if he ever came on as a panelist? I mean, I guess the thing is, Barry, booing is quite fun and I suspect a lot of people who booed him actually quite like Trent, Alexander, Ronald, and were just having a bit of fun having a boo. Cuz like you don't get to boo very often.

[Barry Glendenning]

Right.

[Max Rushden]

You know, unless you're an ever.

[Barry Glendenning]

Yeah. Abby. There is genuine resentment among quite a sizable proportion of Liverpool fans over the manner in which he, he left them without the club being able to get a transfer fee. And that's fair enough, I suppose. I think I would probably be fine with it. He was a good servant. He was there a long time. He helped them win loads. I think the mural being defaced and this seems to be, you know, when men of a certain age get angry, they immediately reach for the paint pot and brush. I suppose it's better than going for a more dangerous weapon if the worst thing you're going to do is deface a mural or paint around, about, have at it, you know, it doesn't really bother me. Probably doesn't even really bother Trent. I'd be curious to know what he makes of it. He probably doesn't care. He knows what. He probably had a fair idea what was going to happen. Some people lap that stove up, some people might be hurt by it. I'd imagine he's probably somewhere in between.

[Max Rushden]

What did you make of the Real Madrid performance, John? I mean, you've said already it was bad, but it just felt really, you know, all so many of their stars were bad in this game. In fact, so many of their players were bad in this game.

[Johnny Liu]

Yeah, I mean, I think again, you know, we're talking about Liverpool as a slightly inconsistent team. That, that has a, that still has a really high top level. I think you could say the same about, about Real Madrid. They looked, I thought, really good in the Classico. They, they, they rose to their level for that game and then, but, but then obviously that there have been, you know, the Atletico performance, for example, where they've looked totally disjointed and you can see that what Alonso is trying to impose on Them, it's still coming together. There are still gaps in the system, there are still glitches in the mainframe and this was one of those. I, I, I think the physicality and, and the, the quality of Liverpool and it just got in their faces really early on. And I'm not going to say that they weren't up for it, but I think they're still not able to come up with the solutions in real time. I think if Alonso sends them out and he says this is going to happen and then it's going to unfold like this, and then you do this and you do this, I think they know what they're doing, I think they can live with that. But when the game starts coming for them and they have to come up with solutions on the fly, you can tell that the base level of understanding and cohesion isn't quite there yet. So, you know, I think it's still a work in progress. I still really, I rate Alonso very highly as a coach and I think they have a, again, I think they have a lot of potential with the players they have. It's potentially very exciting what they're doing, but it's just still not quite there yet.

[Nikki Bandini]

Just to add, I mean, I don't know how much, of course, like when you get these European games made and I'm sure, I know definitely, like Johnny and Baz and Max are all watching a lot more European football than may, maybe some people who just watched the Premier League are right. And so like, you have some of the, the background going on here that I don't know if everyone who's listening would, which is like the stuff with Vinicius Jr. In the Classico and, and the, the apology that managed not to include an apology to Xabi Alonso after the game. And there has been some underpinning tension. Yes, they've had some, some great performances. But there is this feeling to me, at least with Real Madrid, that Xabi Alonso still hasn't yet shown that he's got control of this squad. And I think that's always the question for Real Madrid managers coming in. It's never about is there enough talent here to do something? It's never about is this squad capable of doing something. It's about how you can manage that. And I think that in general, it's always been the question coming in with Xabi Alonso in general. In recent years, the most successful managers have often been those who have been able to be a bit more hands off, who've been willing to let those big personalities and Talents express themselves with a bit less control. And the Alonso experiment is fascinating because he isn't like that. He is going to be very much wanting it done his way. And so far, his way has been a bit less generous to Vinicius Jr. Than the Old way was. It has been more about Kylian Mbappe, who had a disappointing game last night as well. And there's just a bit of tension about exactly what that looks like for Madrid. There's just a bit of. Despite all the winning, despite being five points clear in La Liga, is the camp as happy as it could be? And I think that maybe these. There are relatively few games in the season where they really get tested, and this is one of them. And maybe that's also part of the picture of a team not completely rowing in the same direction at the moment.

[Max Rushden]

Matthew says this referee just unknowingly made himself a hero of the pod with this decision. He should get a segment named after him. This one is for the purist. Max, we are back. Yes. This is the fact that the penalty. Well, it was a handball that was given against Tchouameni from a Schobozlai shot. Then the ref had to go to the screen because it was inside the box, not outside the box. And then he decided it wasn't a handball. Mark Clattenberg joined the comms to say he couldn't believe it was overturned, that Tchouameni knew what he was doing. He was like 10cm away. Alan Shearer said it should be given. People have lost their minds. This Johnny was. This was the best moment of the game.

[Johnny Liu]

Well, yeah, I mean, I like that the referee had the. I guess the. He felt like he had the autonomy to be able to. So obviously the var sent him to the screening. I think this is inside the area. And he's like, oh, I don't think this is a handball. You know, it's like when. When someone sends you to the shops and, you know, to run some errands and you decide to take it upon yourself to, I don't know, get a few. Get some salted peanuts and maybe a little can for the train home. It's one of those where. I think we've despaired quite a bit about how the handball law has been applied. I think there was another one in the Slavia Arsenal game, which we might come to later.

[Max Rushden]

Oh, we will.

[Johnny Liu]

This felt like common sense, and I do hate that term, but this felt like common sense. Reigning finally.

[Max Rushden]

Yeah. How Clattenberg can say honestly that, sure, many knows what he's doing. I mean, he's so close anyway. Istvan Kovacs will forever be. Whenever there is a good var decision, we will sing his name. Tom says, is there a pitch that can contain Mickey van der Ven? Spurs for Copenhagen nil and Barry. Mickey van De Ven scored the. It is a ridiculous goal. It is absolutely ludicrous.

[Barry Glendenning]

Now I think Paulina deserves some credit for the assistance.

[Max Rushden]

Max.

[Barry Glendenning]

First off the bat, it was him that robbed the ball from Muhammad El Yusi gave the ball to Van der Vane and he, he kind of set off between two defenders at top speed. N to 60 is quick as Wesley Fulfana Lamborghini on the hard shoulder, skipped around the third defender. This is all before the halfway line. Then burst between two more and has a crack from just. I think it was just outside the box or just inside and boom. Yeah, what a goal. And no one saw it coming, really. I don't know if he even saw it coming. It was like a cheat code or just this terrible charge up field and yeah, he was obviously delighted with himself.

[Max Rushden]

Yeah, I mean it's some finish. You know, after all that way you. So I think you have to score this. Like you just can't. You can't not score this. I'm trying to think, Nikki, like it, it's like what is the best kind of goal? I mean this is obviously a ludicrous question, but because there's something about the way the crowd like the crescendo with the crowd as every man, he passes and you know, like it's just building and building to this moment is just. I, I wonder if this is the best type of goal or maybe one that comes out of nowhere. I don't know.

[Nikki Bandini]

I think best type of goal is always going to be very subjective, isn't it? I've. I've got a soft spot for a volley off the underside of the bar. There's something about that satis thumb off the underside of the bar that always feels, feels good. But I mean a coast to coast is, is always magic. And when it's a center back, it's. It's even better, isn't it? Because I mean, gosh, it's a very long time since I played any football, let alone 11 a side football. But that feeling when you are a defender and you start running and you suddenly see the pitch in front of you is like a bit open. You think, hang on, go somewhere here. Never ended for me like it did for, for, for Van De Ven, let me tell you. But it's it's, it was a brilliant, brilliant goal. I really liked the way that, that Joe Cole was framing it on, on the goals show for tnt. Just said it's why you go to watch a football game. And it is. Right like that is, especially for those of us who watch a lot of football games. Those moments when someone just takes it onto their own shoulders and does something that's completely outside the frame of what like they're trained to do every day. The systems and the, the structure that are so important to top level football. It. It's just magic, isn't it? And it was, it was a, it was a magic goal. Would be a magic goal for a center forward, but the fact that it is not a center forward definitely makes it a bit better.

[Barry Glendenning]

Much of the criticism Thomas Frank has been shipping this season or since taken over from spurs is that they're not entertaining anymore. I, I think, I don't think Tottenham fans can have any complaints about that match last night because it was very entertaining. I mean, the, the, the fourth goal was superb as well. I thought it looked for a moment like Christian Romero was going to say, hey, I wanted on this action a counter attack from a Copenhagen corner. That was a really good goal as well. Just a really fun game. Very entertaining. Copenhagen didn't offer much in the way of opposition, but as they say, you can only beat what's in front of you.

[Max Rushden]

Yeah. I wonder what Angel's thinking, seeing Van de Ven and Romero up there. Look, it's what I know it is only Copenhagen and you know, with all due respect to Copenhagen, Johnny, but there were signs. Xavi Simmons had a good game. Kolo Muani missed some chances, but looked like a good center forward. I suppose those are the things that, if you're a Thomas Frank will give you hope after, you know, especially the weekend against Chelsea.

[Johnny Liu]

Yeah, so I didn't, I didn't watch the Chelsea game live. I came to it later. So I, I saw the discourse first. I saw lots of people saying this is the worst spurs performance of the season. This is worse than anything they did last season. I saw, you know, some people saying it's the worst, is one of the worst Premier League performances of all time, certainly since they started measuring. And so, so I. But then, so I saw all that first and I came to the performance and I actually watched it later and I thought, well, this is obviously horrifically bad, but it did also feel a little bit like, like a little bit of a freak show. Not, not something, you know, the individual errors that just sort of dribbling it into Chelsea players. It didn't feel like that was representative certainly of what I'd seen from spurs this season. So it, it almost felt like just, just one of those horror shows where, you know, you say, okay, that was a, that was a horror show. Let's, let's draw a line under it now. Copenhagen and not Chelsea, right? They're not, they're struggling in the, in the Danish Super League. They've been leaking goals, they've been lacking a lot of confidence, they've had a lot of injuries and, and spurs are, are a streaky sort of team. They're still, you know, again, as we see it at this, at this point of the season, there are lots of teams that are still working things out. But that, that I think was a lot more representative of what Frank is trying to do there. I think he's, you know, there's been a, there's been a little bit of talk about, about how Spurs Spurs League position is a little bit false, how the underlying numbers aren't, aren't, aren't quite matching up to, to what they're putting up in terms of results in the table. But that is the sort of, that sort of performance that really just changes the mood and changes the narrative and changes the weather again. And, you know, just in terms of this competition, given the fact that the league table is going to be so tight and so many teams are going to be level on points, you know, a win, you know, a big win like that is just. Is really useful for goal difference. You know, I think you're going to see teams that go out on goal difference or teams that make it through on goal difference. So again, from that aspect.

[Max Rushden]

Okay, that'll do for part one. Part two will begin with Arsenal's win in Prague. Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly. Nikki, what, what more to say about Arsenal? You know, a comfortable win and a clean sheet. I mean, we're running out of things to say and it's the 5th of November, so we've got. They need to do something different like in the next few months. So we're really stuck.

[Nikki Bandini]

Well, I mean, I suppose the only place to go, Max, is after the in no way hyperbolic coverage I saw in the last week or so, asking if the title race was already over. I suppose the only, the only question to ask now is, is the Champions League already over?

[Max Rushden]

Already over?

[Nikki Bandini]

Yes, because Arsenal won another game without conceding. I see. I. This is, there's been, there's been some in my Opinion, absolute nonsense that's been happening in the coverage in the last, the last few weeks, with people deciding that a season can end in November. But, but Arsenal are playing very, very solid football at the moment. And I, I do, like, understand, because I'm a fan myself, like, I do understand that feeling of, like, when you're a fan of anyone else and you're watching this team that looks like a juggernaut, you're like, just show us something, show us some crack of vulnerability. And right now, Arsenal aren't. I don't think Slavia Prague was ever particularly the place that they were likely to show that crack of vulnerability. It's not the place that you expect them to go and show some. But they certainly didn't. And I think it's fair to say that there might have been past versions that might have had a different night there. Going away from home. The first little bit of the game was a little bit. They were a little bit slow to come into the game. I think it's an exaggeration to say it was a little bit wobbly because it wasn't really like they gave up any chances in that time particularly. They just didn't immediately sweep, sweep their opponents away. They did need. I don't know, I. I think it is a penalty in the current rules, but a very boring kind of penalty, I suppose, to get the lead in the first half. But when you're this hard to score a goal against, and they are really stinking hard to score a goal against, it becomes a lot easier to win football matches. And when you've got. I think the other thing that, that's just big picture. Even though everyone is probably bored of hearing about a set piece as well. Another thing that is, is big picture. Definitely a, a takeaway from this round is Liverpool obviously scored from a. A set piece against Real Madrid. And when you get into the underlying numbers, you see that actually Real Madrid, oh, there was. I think this is the Athletic. I saw it in Real Madrid. If you look how many chances they give away from set pieces, if they're in the Premier League, they'd be like the third or fourth worst team at giving away a chance from set pieces. So that's something that clearly they've targeted. It's something that clearly Arsenal target in every game. And seeing a game like this against a team where you've got some absolute giants, I mean, the centre forward who's just like towering over all your defenders and going away on a night like that, where you think, well, you know, where the Quality is tilted in this matchup. You know, Arsenal, a team that have more quality in absolute terms because the money is. With Arsenal, it's just the boring reality of football. But the fact that you go there and you're also the better team at set pieces feels like a. A shift from where they might have been in the past and in less successful chapters because they're dominating even the parts of the game that the lesser team might in the past have fancied itself of being able to control. But Arsenal were great. They even got to bring on Max Dalman and have him be the youngest to play in Champions League history. So pretty great night all around for Arteta and Arsenal, really, isn't it?

[Max Rushden]

Like we said, just show us something. I mean, you could at least let the opposition have a shot is what I was thinking. Just one. Just one shot for one team. One shot a month. The opposition get, don't they?

[Barry Glendenning]

They've won 10 in a row now. They've not conceded in eight. They've scored 18 since they last conceded a goal. Yeah, Slavia Prague got a penalty and Arsenal's players were furious a because it shouldn't have been a penalty, but they really don't want to concede a goal and the penalty was correctly overturned. But they just love keeping clean sheets and sadly that'll all come to a sorry end on Saturday when they have to go to Sunderland and Granit Xhaka scores against them. As is written in the Stars need.

[Nikki Bandini]

To say again, even though everyone knows I think what he is football, it's still great that Mikel Marino scoring two goals again and just being the guy when the guy who's meant to be the guy isn't there. Right. He does keep doing it for someone who I think gets probably more flak than he deserves, given it's not like he's shown up there with some ego about himself saying, look, I'm supposed to be this guy. I think his contribution has still been absolutely brilliant. And exactly as Baz says, the thing that marks great teams apart sometimes is that furious competitiveness. And Arsenal have it in absolute buckets, don't they?

[Max Rushden]

Yeah. PSG won Bayern too. Bayern. Speaking of teams who are doing quite well, Johnny have won all 16 of their games in all competitions so far. It doesn't seem far fetched to say in that first half because obviously the sending off of Luis Diaz changed things in the first half. They sort of destroyed psg, Johnny.

[Johnny Liu]

Yeah, I mean, I thought it was the performance of the night, to be honest, and really a performance of it was almost two great performances rather than one because yeah, the way they hunted PSG in the first half and then after the sending off after psg, then Paul won back the absolute, you know, the rear guards, the, the clearances, the clearing of their lines. I thought, I thought Conrad Lima at right back, he's normally, you know, normally a midfielder, but at right back was absolutely incredible. I thought Pamukano was fantastic. And, and yeah, I mean just in terms of, in terms of psg, I. They haven't, you know, they haven't been setting Ligue on a light this season. They haven't been sending the Champions League. I like this season and some. Something does seem to be. To be missing from last season. I know Dembele hasn't really been starting for them. He's been struggling with injuries and I think you see how crucial he was to the way. Not, not just in terms of his goals, but his build up. But, but it's also kind of the speed of pass and the speed of thought and that, that little, you know, flash of lightning that made them so devastating last season. That's. Something is missing from there. And I think Bayern have really, you know, I've managed, they managed to pick out those, to pick at those, those weaknesses. I thought, you know, did you see the, the second goal where basically Jaz takes it off, off Mar. It was absolutely shambolic and I, you know, Marquinhos.

[Max Rushden]

Well, I mean, you said speed. You said speed of Thor. It was like someone had accidentally unplugged Marquinhos. He was buffering, but he looks over his shoulder.

[Johnny Liu]

I mean, I don't see any way he can't see Diaz coming. I just think he can't get his feet in order. And you know, I think that that epitomized the difference between them last night.

[Max Rushden]

Barry, the Luis Diaz red card. I thought it was soft. Producer Joel said it was a horror challenge. Maybe I'm just a dinosaur. I don't know. He does jump into it, but I don't know where you sit on that, on that decision.

[Barry Glendenning]

I'd be somewhere in the middle. I thought it was nasty. I think he jumped into it and he caught Hakimi like a, like a scissors, basically.

[Max Rushden]

Yeah.

[Barry Glendenning]

And seemed to squeeze to deliberately hurt him. And he has hurt him. Hakimi left the ground on crutches wearing a plastic boot. He was very upset when he had to go off. Obviously he plays for Morocco. The AFCON is in Morocco in December and he, he had the ear about a man who thought maybe the AFCON Jig at home is up for him. Yeah, could be ligaments, could be broken. I don't know.

[Max Rushden]

Dr. Barry, how many weeks you. How many weeks are you giving him, Dr. Barry?

[Barry Glendenning]

I'd say a couple of months. Yeah. Right. But he might. He might get lucky. He might get lucky. Okay.

[Max Rushden]

Producer Joel says I. I edited out that he'd said it was very clumsy and the outcome is horrific. Not the intent and to be fair, I didn't see the. The outcome from the high line, the highlights that I.

[Johnny Liu]

It's a yellow, isn't it? It's a yellow. But exacerbated by the fact that it. It was a quite a bad injury and I think also exacerbated by him looking really upset about it.

[Max Rushden]

Yeah, I think so. I mean, we haven't really talked about Lewis Diaz at all, Nikki. And you know, in. But when we talked about Bayern because Kane is having a ridiculous season because Elise has done so much, but he is a brilliant footballer. Right. We've talked about actually Liverpool missing him more than how he's benefited Bayern Munich.

[Nikki Bandini]

Yeah, I think he's been really important to Bayern Munich at the start of the season. I think like as great Kane is at leading the line, a little bit of control in that area behind the attack is really important. And I think that I've heard people talk about this with Bayern, that the moving on from Thomas Miller has been this protracted thing that's gone on and perhaps he's really helping with that. That area of the pitch and a little bit of leadership in that area of the pitch as well, to be honest. And yeah, he's having a. Having a strong start to this season. Bayern having strong starts this season. And obviously before he got sent off was having a great night last night as well.

[Max Rushden]

Juve won Sporting One. You wanted to talk about Spaletti, Nikki?

[Nikki Bandini]

Yeah. Well, it's just a fascinating moment, isn't it? Spaletti coming back in. Obviously got plenty to prove to people after a pretty dismal time in charge of the Italian national team. Ending of course with that absolute shellacking 30 by Norway. And I think. I think I've had some reservations about how this was going to unfold because I think that there's a lot of much deeper issues at Juventus at this point than. Than just the manager. And they certainly hadn't started the season well under Ego Tudor and I think it's far, far too soon to draw any concl. Juventus, they didn't win last night. Clearly they drew his Sporting and. And both they. And Napoli, who also drew last night, really are going to have to start winning some games at some point in this group because they really could get themselves in trouble and not make it through even to the out of the top 24 if they're not careful. But I, I have really liked some of the stuff that Spilletti's done so far. He started with coup Miners at left center, back again in this game, same as he had at the weekend and I'm not sure if that's a long term gambit. Koop Miners did his best work for Atalanta as a midfielder who did a lot of running on from midfield. To be behind the attack is kind of one of the symbols of everything that's been done wrong at juvent in the last couple of years because they spent a lot of money on players who, I mean some of them aren't even there, like Douglas Lewis who's a 50 million euro player who isn't even there. Obviously there's been players from the next gen squad they've leave like Dean Heussen who's gone on to do better things Housen and then you've got Koop Miners who was signed for a lot of money and hasn't been good, hasn't left, but it just hasn't been good. Moving him to that left centre back position, I thought that's a bit out there, isn't it? But they won at the weekend and afterwards you said part of why I've put him there. He said he's played there for his Nash team before, so it's not completely out there. But part of why I put in there is because I want to send the message to my players that we're not trying to draw these games, we're putting attacking players on the pitch because we intend to take the game to teams and try to win. And whether that's going to work I don't know. But I do think it's an interestingly bold approach, especially for someone who again had such a bad time with Italy. He's come in trying to do something quite aggressive and I'm, yeah, I'm going to enjoy watching it with Spoleto. He's always, he's always produced teams for fun to watch. He's also always given incredibly chippy press conferences. I think it'll be an interesting chapter elsewhere.

[Max Rushden]

Last night Athletic beat Union San Juan 31 Monaco won one in Bodo Olympiacos 1 PSV 1 Napoli drew Nilner with Eintracht Frankfurt. Bit of a shame that eintracht Frankfurt, they're 5:1. Either way, record is over. Barry. Johnny, anything that piqued your interest for any of those games?

[Barry Glendenning]

Well, I saw Atletico were quite lucky to beat Union San Jua. There were two one up. Louis Patrice had a brilliant opportunity to equalize for Union. Deep in injury time. Header, entire goal to him. He just couldn't get any power behind his head or put it straight into Oblack's hands. The other thing that's. And then Atletico went up field and scored to make it 3:1. So Union could probably feel a bit hard done by their. Ross Sykes, formerly of Acquaintington Stanley, got to score Union's goal at the Wanda Metropolitana, which was probably a career highlight for him, one imagines, even though his team lost. And the other thing to take from that game is Antoine Griezmann's mollus is a thing of just quite extraordinary beauty. The shag, the volume. He looks like he should be playing as a ruckman for Collingwood in the afl. Just superb.

[Max Rushden]

Yes.

[Barry Glendenning]

I could never pull off a mullet. Not many can. I've seen Johnny Lou pulling off before. But Griezmann's is a thing of extraordinary beauty.

[Max Rushden]

Barry, maybe you could grow a mullet for your half marathon. I mean, I guess it could slow you down a tiny bit. And like, we don't need any of that. We don't need any air. Any air any more. Air resistance commentator that I was watching called Ross Sykes, Big Man Sykes. And for a small moment, I just thought he had been christened Big Man Sykes. And then to turn into such an enormous man, I was utterly delighted. Napoli nil. Eintracht nil. I mean, it's interesting, after Napoli were thrashed by psv, wasn't it in the last round that they didn't get a victory in this one? You know, Conte's terrible record in Europe.

[Nikki Bandini]

Mickey, it gets to a point where it's almost. It's almost hard to explain quite why Conte's teams are so consistently bad in Europe. It's not like it's. It's been a year or two or a moment. It's. It's like a decade of just consistently different clubs managing to. To not produce anything like the same football in Europe as they do domestically. And this was such a frustrating watch because Frankfurt, you alluded to the. The five ones. Either way, in. In the Champions League, max, I think they'd conceded 11 goals in their first three Champions League games. They'd conceded 19 goals in their first nine Bundesliga games. They are not a good team, defensively they're a team that's got some things going for them going forwards. They're a team that can attack you but they are not a good team defensively. And, and the fact that Napoli really, until a final left it too late, throw everything at the wall, push when they, they could have scored, I mean Tom and probably should have scored late on look to exploit that at all. It's hard to explain. Napoli are definitely imperfect. They are I would say behind where they were last season. There was a lot of talk when De Bruyne got injured that maybe they'll get back to where they were last season because now McTominay can move back inside and he has been so much the, the heart of the team over the last year or so. I think that people have maybe underestimated that. De Bruyne, even though the dynamic between them wasn't perfect, was helping create scoring chances in the first part of the season. So I think people may have underestimated that. I haven't got all the numbers in front of me right now for quite how disappointing Conte's European record is but it's something else when you look into it. When you look at the clubs he's had and the results, they are really hard to explain quite how poor they've been and I think Napoli are in serious danger in this group more than Juventus of finding a way to stuff it up.

[Max Rushden]

All right, that'll do for part two. Part three we'll begin with the draw between Sunderland Everton on Monday night. Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly. Barry, you predicted a comfortable win for your mob against Everton. It was a draw in the end, really intense. It was full of robust challenges, kind of what you'd expect from Sunderland Everton I think.

[Barry Glendenning]

Yeah, it was a weird game. Sunderland started really, really badly, as bad as I've seen them this season. Could not hold on to the ball, kept giving it away. Illiman in Jai scored a lovely solo gold put ever in front and they missed a couple of excellent chances to extend the lead. Jack Grealish hit the post with his shot from outside the area. Tierno Barry missed an absolute sitter on the 28 minute mark and that just sparked a complete turn around that miss and Sunderland dominated from then on. Equalized just after halftime with a slightly fortune. Well a very fortuitous granite jacker shot that took a horrific deflection that completely wrong footed Jordan Pickford. I think he'd probably have saved it otherwise. And then it was, it was all sunderland for the second half really I think they had 16 shots after that tier. No Barry miss and probably should have won. I think both point is all right considering how bad they were in the first half hour. They welcome Arsenal to the stadium alike on Saturday and I don't think people are expecting it to be the straightforward Arsenal win they might have a couple of months ago when they were looking at the fixture list. But Arsenal may well be too good for them. Everton are a funny team. I've said this repeatedly. They're, they, they're a half decent striker away from being a half decent team. But the two they have better and Barry are hopeless. They have a goal between them this season and unless one of them starts firing, I'd still worry for Everton because they're just awful. They're so bad the chances they miss.

[Max Rushden]

Poor Barry. Poor Barry. What do you make of Everton, Johnny?

[Johnny Liu]

Yeah, well, it's almost like, you know, they have a, a really solid back five and then they have a, that they've added some flair in the middle with likes of Dewsbury hall and Grealish and you have NDI who's I think, you know, a really, really top player. And then they get into the final third and it's like, oh gosh, what do we do now? You know, it's like, you know, they've spent so much time working on how to progress the ball and once it gets into the final third, you know, I do, I think Barry is, has a lot of potential to him. You know, it did really well in La Liga last season. Beto is, is better. He's, you know, he's a very evident striker. A guy who will score maybe one legendary goal that everybody remembers in about 28 games. You know, he's going to end up with a, with a, with an Everton record of about 13 goals in 112 appearances. 74 is substitute that, that, that sort of record. Yeah, I think slight, slightly, slightly worrying how lit, how little ambition they showed on Monday night. I thought, especially after they, they scored the goal that they just sat back and you know, this is, I know Sunderland have been good this season. It's also a mark of how, how much respect Everton paid them that they, they showed that they could actually control a game in which they had the ball rather than, rather than simply, you know, sitting tight and trying to hit on the break. They were the ones who were having to make the, the running and I thought that that showed a side of Sunderland that, that maybe we haven't seen so much from them this season.

[Max Rushden]

A mate of my Tom who's a Sunderland fan messaged me to say does this mean we're a proper established mid table Premier League club? Again on the fact that Sunderland have formally written to the Premier League and PGMOL seeking clarification as to why they were not awarded a penalty in last night's one all draw with Everton. Sunderland are keen to hear more on both the onfield decision and the VAR rationale which determined no offense occurred or no further review from the referee Thomas Brammell was required after Michael Keane's handball in the 73rd minute. Give me strength world.

[Johnny Liu]

Not quite enough AI. I think that it needs to be a little bit more AI and then they can call themselves solid mid table Premier League stalwarts.

[Barry Glendenning]

I mean I I have no complaints over that. It was a Michieli cross that hit Michael Keane's outstretched hand. I've no big the problem with it not being given as a penalty, but they are often given as penalties so that's that. But again, you know, we're discussing the handball law again in a podcast and this is the second where's the consistency?

[Johnny Liu]

Where's the consistency? All you want is the consistency in a sport where no two situations ever replicate.

[Barry Glendenning]

Well, we want consistency and we want common sense, but you can't have both. So just cherry pick whichever you want as it suits you.

[Max Rushden]

Wolves wanted Gary o'.

[Nikki Bandini]

Neill.

[Max Rushden]

They can't have him because they were in talks with him over the weekend and on Monday before he pulled out, he was finalizing his backroom staff. Club felt he was the ideal candidate to galvanize the squad. The fans definitely didn't. Wolves had maintained dialogue with other candidates. There was a belief that o' Neill would take charge this week. No clear reason why he had a change of heart unless he logged into social media.

[Barry Glendenning]

I guess I'd say that might have had something to do with it. There is talk that he wanted a longer contract than they were prepared to offer him, but I imagine having seen what happened to Russell Martin at Rangers and Anj at Forest, he probably went, nah, I don't fancy that. And I think if he had taken the job, his first game is away at Chelsea, I think so he's already on the back foot before balls even been kicked, you'd imagine.

[Max Rushden]

Don't know who the next I heard somewhere that, well it says here that Eric 10 Hag at 5 to 2 and Rob Edwards at 3 to 1. I did see somewhere that Sam Allardyce was the favorite and I was like, yeah, I'll definitely take that. I'll take that. Why not? Now, Johnny, you wanted to talk about Mary Earps. An extract from her book featuring the Guardian on Friday drew a lot of attention. She says she protested to Serena Vegman that bad behavior was being rewarded when rival goalkeeper Hannah Hampton was restored to the England side. It was interesting. Chat about this on the Guardian Women's Football Weekly. So download that wherever you get your podcast. But you wanted to talk about that situation more broadly, about sort of what this means for how women's football is covered.

[Johnny Liu]

Yeah, so, I mean, yeah, obviously, like Faye, Susie and Sophie covered it. You know, the, the substance of, of what Earp said, you know, really well on, on, on the women's pod this week. I think it's quite interesting. It's a bit like, you know, when, when two players start squaring up on the pitch and, and everyone, you know, starts clutching their pearls and shaking that. I know nobody wants to see that. And secretly everybody does want to see that. I. I think one of the, One of the really interesting things this has shown about, I think, women's football discourse and coverage is that the extent to which this sport, I think a lot more than men's football is, is dependent on. On reputation and pr, where you're almost having to. To build a personal brand at the same time as you're trying to build a playing identity and a football career in a team sport. We see this so often where individual players become. They get elevated into this huge stature overnight, which is basically what happened to her. She got thrust into the limelight, really, from nowhere, almost winning BBC Sports Personality and being on the front page and all of that. I don't think anything, certainly in women's football prepares you for that kind of elevation and the fact that it is by definition transitory. I don't know the details of Mary Oates personal finance, but I'd say she's not set up for life and she knows that this is a very, very narrow window. Unlike men's players, you're not earning millions and millions of pounds and you are struggling for attention in a very competitive attention economy. And I think that the pressures that we put women's players under to absolutely milk every last drop of capital and cultural clout and attention and the way we demand them to sell themselves and build their brand and sell their bodies almost is. I think it's something, It's a part of women's football that is very, very different from men's football. And I think it is in many ways quite exploitative a game that I think ultimately doesn't really benefit anyone except the people getting content out of it. So I don't want to comment too much on the rights and wrongs of what Earp said about Hampton and whatever and the details of that, but I think the way that that discourse has been shaped and, and I think the toxicity of a lot of it, I think it says a lot about, about the, the attention economy of women's, women's football and, and the way people follow it.

[Max Rushden]

The camera. She, she wrote this, she wrote the stuff, didn't she? But do you think she's under pressure? She's, she, she's playing so. Because she understands.

[Barry Glendenning]

Right.

[Max Rushden]

If you, you know, we all know that if you write a football book and you say, I think I don't like them, I don't like them, I don't like them, you'll sell more books than I thought. Everyone was lovely to play with and we all had a few bust up, but that's what happens.

[Johnny Liu]

Yeah, no, she's playing this game. She, she's.

[Nikki Bandini]

I'm not certain that it is true that everyone understands that, Max. I think that's, that's like an easy thing to say when we sit here and cover it every day and do all this. But the assumption that all footballers, women or men, are fully understanding of the media environment, I think is, is, is unrealistic. And I think you could even point to just your last night, a slightly terse exchange between Wayne Rooney and Van Dyke in the post game interview for Liverpool. For I think even someone who's been at the center as much of, of the men's football world as Rooney was perhaps not quite realizing how his podcast was going to get listened to and, and responded to by real footballers, which real footballers, I mean current footballers. Don't know why I use the word real there. I think it's, it's actually in that, that part of it is, if anything is, is like quite a repetitive scene that you see. Footballers will spend their time as professionals lamenting how ex pros talk about them. Then as soon as they become exposed, they do the same thing. It's like a pattern that goes on and on. I think I agree. To bring back to Johnny's point, I agree the nature of, the nature of women's football because it doesn't get the same amount of coverage, doesn't get the same amount of eyeballs on it all the time, means that your career is distilled so much more down into those moments when the world is watching. And of course big international moments, tournaments are Those moments when the world is watching. Which is why as, as Johnny was saying, really shot into. Because she didn't come from nowhere, actually. She played really well for a really long time. But what Johnny means is in the public perception for a lot of people who don't pay attention to that, she. She shot into public consciousness very quickly. And I don't think it's completely alien and unrelated to what can happen in men's football, but I just think it's so much more intense because sadly, still the amount of time that most football fans are, I don't know, maybe the most is the wrong way of putting it, but the time when you have a huge audience is smaller than it is for the men is the reality of it. The men have a huge audience at the top level all the time, whereas women only get it for those big events. And so your. Your window is. Is much more. Is much shorter and much more intense. And I think that Johnny said all the rest of it very well. So I need to repeat it onto.

[Max Rushden]

Another business on the subject of benches and the most expensive bench. And producer Joel was trying to think of the most expensive bench of footballers, and I was just trying to think of the most expensive bench and we found one on the Hudson River. Not in the river, but near it, in a park that was very expensive. Sean Bon Jovi says has sent me this. Scarborough Station is home to a grade two listed bench said to be the longest bench in the world. It seats 239 people. He says it's basically priceless. So thank you for that. And many people got in touch on this subject. Brad said. Will Max and Bass be seeking a return of a favor from the mayor elect of New York? Clearly, the endorsement of Max and Bass via Football Weekly in September paid dividends for Zora Mamdami. Tom says Zora won the election. Yeah, he did. Following his Football Weekly exposure.

[Johnny Liu]

That's how I discovered who are you.

[Max Rushden]

Electing next and where. It's another one, Barry, isn't it? You know, you come on this podcast, you get elected.

[Barry Glendenning]

Yeah, well, I hope he does a better job than the last man we got elected. Up your game, Kier.

[Max Rushden]

Look, it's not talk politics. For more on. If you need any more reaction to the New York Merrill race, go to today and Focus. But I think we pretty much covered it in all the detail you need. Just there. Whatever it is more proof that the. This podcast runs the world. And that'll do for today. Thanks, everybody. Thank you, Johnny. Thanks. Thanks, Nikki.

[Nikki Bandini]

Thanks.

[Max Rushden]

Cheers, B.

[Barry Glendenning]

Thank you.

[Max Rushden]

For Weekly is produced by Joel Grove. Our executive producer is Phil Maynard.

[Johnny Liu]

This is the Guardian.