Palace pull off Liverpool hat-trick, plus the Premier League previewed: Football Weekly Extra

Summary

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Football Weekly – "Palace pull off Liverpool hat-trick, plus the Premier League previewed"

Date: October 30, 2025
Host: The Guardian (Max Rushden)
Panel: Barry Glendenning, Jordan Jarrett-Bryan, Robin Cowan, Ewan Murray (for the Scottish segment)

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Episode Overview

This week’s Football Weekly dives into a dramatic round of Carabao Cup action, headlined by Crystal Palace’s impressive win over a youthful Liverpool at Anfield—their third victory in a row against the Reds this season. The crew preview the upcoming Premier League fixtures, discuss managerial intrigue at Liverpool and in Scotland, and provide the usual blend of sharp analysis and gentle ribbing, including a detour into throw-in bureaucracy and the highs and lows of Wolves’ light shows.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Crystal Palace 3-0 Liverpool – A Cup Hat-Trick at Anfield

[00:47–11:31]

• The panel leads with Palace’s win over a heavily rotated Liverpool, crediting Palace for achievement despite their own changes.
  • Robin Cowan: “You had Will Hughes coming in, he hasn’t played much this season…they’re just a very, very well-coached team.” (02:37)
• Focus shifts to Liverpool manager Arne Slot’s selection policy. Several teenagers started; five more on the bench. Was this a calculated risk or signs of deeper trouble?
  • Jordan Jarrett-Bryan: Compares squad rotation to being a zookeeper’s understudy: “If you have them on the bench then you’re not resting them. If you’re the lion keeper in the zoo…and you still have to come in and supervise the understudy…that’s not a rest, is it?” (04:23)
• Speculation on whether this creates a crisis narrative at Liverpool, especially given a tough upcoming fixture list: Villa, Real Madrid, and Man City.
  • Max Rushden: “If they lose all three of those games…you’re then into the kind of territory that Man City were in last season…then you’re looking at a really, really poor, not only poor title defense, but you’re then kind of dragged into a top four race.” (08:46)

Notable Quote

“Some of their [Palace's] goals were really good. Their second and third goals I thought were just like, just beautiful football. I just wonder if Glasner wants that Liverpool job.”
— Jordan Jarrett-Bryan (08:46)

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2. Liverpool’s Dilemma: Cup Choices & Fixture Pressure

[09:20–11:31]

• Reflection on Slot’s post-match comments about team depth compared with Man City and Chelsea.
  • Barry Glendenning: “Chelsea can bring in Estebao after I made two substitutions…we had six teenagers…” (09:20)
• Discussion over how quickly pressure can ramp up. Is Arne Slot a "busted flush" already?
  • Robin Cowan: “He’s starting to come out with comments that can be made a joke of…‘teams are changing their style against us’—well, yeah, they do that because you’re good.” (10:11)

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3. Premier League & Carabao Cup: Review & Preview

[11:31–24:20]

Chelsea 4-3 Wolves

• High-scoring, error-laden match. Joy over Jamie Gittins’ wonder strike – debated volley vs. half volley.
  • Jordan Jarrett-Bryan: “For a half volley, the ball has to be still in contact with ground. In my opinion, it certainly wasn’t. Brilliant strike off the outside of his right boot.” (14:08)

Long Throws and Football ‘Dinosaur’ Discourse

• Old-school set pieces are back in style; Tony Pulis being vindicated.
  • Barry Glendenning: “Tony Pulis wrote…needless to say, I had the last laugh column.” (14:50)

Spurs’ Defeat to Newcastle – The Shoelace Incident

• Spurs undone by Jed Spence’s lengthy boot-tying as Newcastle score from a corner.
  • Barry Glendenning: “The first goal…was basically down to Jed Spence tying his shoelaces for what felt like 25 minutes.” (17:41)
  • Jordan Jarrett-Bryan: “…He was kneeling down, taking an age to tie his shoelace…I don’t know if Jed Spence just isn’t very good at tying his shoelaces.” (17:41)

Upcoming Key Premier League Fixtures

• Spurs vs. Chelsea: Both in dire need of a win, particularly after recent form stumbles. The panel predict a draw.
  • Max Rushden: “If they have ambitions on trying to get a Champions League spot…this is an opportunity for Spurs to really assert themselves as one of those key chasing sides.” (20:22)
• Newcastle at West Ham, Wolves at Fulham: Wolves’ poor defensive record noted, as is Newcastle’s away form.

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4. Arsenal Continue Strong Run – Brighton Beat as Title Talk Begins

[25:48–29:02]

• Arsenal beat Brighton 2-0; discussion about the depth and flexibility of the side.
  • Max Rushden: “We look so impregnable at the back and able to score across the board up top. Yeah, it’s looking worryingly good for us at the moment.” (28:02)
  • Jordan Jarrett-Bryan: “I was really happy for [Ranieri] because he's gone from the hot guy to being dropped...keeping him involved and scoring goals just makes him feel like he is a part of this.” (26:31)

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5. Manchester City: Cup Progress & Bournemouth Preview

[29:11–32:08]

• Man City continue in the cup with goals from several players—not just Haaland—easing fears about goal reliance.
• Discussion about City’s record vs. Bournemouth and teenage goalscoring stats (Franny Jeffers, Robbie Fowler, Nick Anelka named as previous teen records).

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6. Tyler Adams Interview: US Soccer, World Cup, and Diversity

[32:16–34:30]

• Jordan Jarrett-Bryan introduces his Channel 4 interview with the USMNT captain, covering diversity in the squad, pay-to-play problems in the U.S., and the difficulty of getting British athletes to talk meaningfully about social issues.
  • Jordan Jarrett-Bryan: “I just found a very articulate, interesting young guy that has some thoughts on things beyond football...” (33:10)

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7. Football Bureaucracy: Should There Be a Countdown on Long Throws?

[34:30–36:53]

• IFAB is considering time limits for long throws due to an increase in their use.
  • Jordan Jarrett-Bryan: “If it gets to a point where, you know, Michael Coyote is taking eight minutes to take a throw in, then yes, I guess. I think it should probably be left up to individual referees discretion.” (35:32)
  • Barry Glendenning: “IFAB, sort out the handball law. Preach worry.” (36:53)

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8. EFL & Other Carabao Highlights

[36:53–37:52]

• Cardiff beat Wrexham in the Welsh derby. League One and Championship sides make rare cup progress.

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9. Scottish Football: Celtic Madness and Managerial Intrigue

[39:25–51:59]
With guest Ewan Murray.

• Celtic Saga:

  • Celtic part ways with Brendan Rodgers in an explosive manner, with principal shareholder Dermot Desmond issuing a scathing statement.
    • Ewan Murray: “I think it was overly personal, overly spiteful…whatever you think of Brendan Rogers, he wanted the best for Celtic…” (39:56)
  • Immediate appointment of Martin O’Neill as interim, which energizes the fanbase but raises nostalgia questions.
    • Ewan Murray: “He’s the youngest 73-year-old you ever see…privately, 100% Martin O’Neill will believe he can still manage Celtic on a long-term basis.” (42:56)

• Rangers:

  • Danny Rohl’s arrival and measured optimism after early wins.

• Hearts:

  • Riding a positive wave with six wins in a row before a recent draw.

• Aberdeen:

  • Quirky new sporting director Lutz Pfannensteeel’s wild CV: penguin theft, modeling, near-death experiences.
    • Ewan Murray: “He once stole a penguin. He has spent 101 days in a Singaporean jail accused of match fixing, not penguin theft related…” (51:04)

Notable Moment

“He reeled off pretty much word for word what I’d written six or seven years before…when he was Ireland manager, he used to spend too much time…he used to read everything…”
— Ewan Murray on Martin O’Neill’s legendary memory (45:39)

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10. Correspondence & Listener Banter

[51:59–55:44]

• Listener emails on “divorced Belgians,” amusing wedding shout-outs, and reflections on Football Weekly’s role as a lifelong companion.
  • Andy Johnson: “I can now say that the Football Weekly podcast has been a longer constant in my life than marriage…” (52:51)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [00:47] Crystal Palace’s win at Liverpool—full panel analysis begins
• [02:37] Robin praises Palace’s coaching and depth
• [04:23] Jordan’s “zookeeper/lion keeper” analogy
• [08:46] Jordan speculates on Glasner and Liverpool job
• [10:11] Slot’s odd post-match comments and pressure at Liverpool
• [14:08] Gittins’ volley/half-volley debate in Chelsea–Wolves
• [17:41] Jed Spence’s shoelace and Spurs’ downfall at Newcastle
• [20:22] Spurs–Chelsea preview
• [26:31] Arsenal–Brighton recap and Arsenal’s prospects
• [29:20] Manchester City’s cup win, multiple goalscorers
• [32:16] USMNT’s Tyler Adams discussion
• [34:30] Long throw-ins: bureaucracy or part of the game?
• [39:25] Scottish football chaos: Celtic, Martin O’Neill, fan perspectives
• [51:04] The legend of Lutz Pfannensteeel at Aberdeen
• [52:51] Listener correspondence and wedding shout-out

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Memorable Quotes

• “If you have them on the bench then you’re not resting them…If you’re the lion keeper in the zoo…and you still have to come in and supervise the understudy…that’s not a rest, is it?”
  — Jordan Jarrett-Bryan (04:23)

• “He’s the youngest 73-year-old you ever see…privately, 100% Martin O’Neill will believe he can still manage Celtic on a long-term basis.”
  — Ewan Murray (42:56)

• “Some of their [Palace’s] goals were really good…just beautiful football. I just wonder if Glasner wants that Liverpool job.”
  — Jordan Jarrett-Bryan (08:46)

• “I can now say that the Football Weekly podcast has been a longer constant in my life than marriage…”
  — Listener Andy Johnson (52:51)

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Tone & Style

As ever, the tone is warm, irreverent, and sharp—mixing informed debate and analysis with banter, self-deprecation, and the occasional surreal analogy. The panel blend big-picture reflections on team and manager trajectories with hyper-local trivia (shoelace mishaps; penguin heists) and reminders that football is, ultimately, meant to be fun.

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This summary serves anyone wishing to catch up on the week’s Football Weekly, providing insight into both footballing events and the distinctive humor of the show.

Transcript

[Max Rushden]

This is the Guardian.

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[Barry Glendenning]

Hello and welcome to Guardian Football Weekly. Dust down the carabao box and hear it sing. Crystal palace knock a very young Liverpool side out of the competition at Anfield. Does this add to the crisis? Did Arnold Slot pick such an inexperienced team and bench so that it wouldn't matter if they lost? Palace's prize is a trip to the Emirates in the quarter final. After Arsenal rode their luck early on before beating Brighton. Another clean sheet for Mikel Arteta. Chelsea win a not quite classic 43 at Wolves while Holder's Newcastle comfortably see off Spurs. Thomas Frank's next job is to get spurs up for Chelsea at home in a game they routinely lose elsewhere. Man City. Bournemouth looks interesting, as does Forest, Manchester United and Liverpool Villa. Ewan Murray joins us to discuss the Celtic madness. And we'll discuss whether there should be a countdown clock for long throws. We've had excellent correspondence, including some divorced Belgian adjacent stuff. As always, we'll answer your questions. And that's today's Guardian Football Week. Cleave on the panel today, Barry Glendennick. Welcome.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Hi, Max.

[Barry Glendenning]

Hello. Jordan. Jarrett, Bryan.

[Max Rushden]

Morning, mate.

[Barry Glendenning]

And good morning to Robin Cowan.

[Robin Cowan]

Morning, Max.

[Barry Glendenning]

Okay, the quarterfinal draw, then Newcastle will pay. Fulham, Manchester City, Brentford, Cardiff City, Chelsea and Arsenal. Crystal palace only one place to start, which is at Anfield. Steve says, as a Liverpool fan, I made the decision to watch last night's Bake off instead. Traitor starts in a minute. Was this a better use of my time or should I have jumped out the window? He says. Toddy says should Liverpool sign Ismail Sar just to stop him scoring against them. Seven in nine for Sar, against Liverpool, for palace and for Watford. And I suppose we should start Robin by praising Crystal Palace. I mean, third time in a row they've beaten Liverpool. If you include the Community Shield, which I guess we can. Sar's second was a beautiful goal. That one too with Jeremy Pino who looks like a really good player. And palace hadn't been on great form either. But clearly as soon as you saw the starting lineups you were like they'll probably win.

[Robin Cowan]

Yeah, I mean I think we need to, we should credit palace because even though, yes, you know, Liverpool obviously rotated a lot and didn't really have any big names on the bench either, they still had to get the job done. It's still an Anfield and, and they dispatched them really well. They also made quite a lot of changes as well. Crystal palace. But actually it's just a show of they don't have amazing depth in sort of Premier League terms. But still, you know you had Will Hughes coming in, he hasn't played much this season. You know he's, he's a very, very good midfielder. Soza as well. So actually you know that they're just a very, very well coached team and clearly they, I mean Liverpool kind of had a couple of chances early on, didn't they? But then it just seems to be they concede and then they, they kind of, I wouldn't say fall apart. That might be a bit too dramatic but they the kind of floodgates open and, and they just seem to be a bit soft at the moment. Again with the massive caveat that they clearly change the team a lot. And yeah the discourse around this is very interesting, isn't it? And I think, yeah you said in your intro did it on purpose. And I'm just thinking if he did then fine, you know, is that, is that a bad thing? Because actually if, if they'd put out the strong team and they lost that possibly would have caused more damage.

[Barry Glendenning]

Sure. And I suppose no guarantees that had they put out their first team they'd have won this game. Given, given the form that they're on with apologies to palace, the story is Liverpool Barry, isn't it? And look, they started three teenagers, they had five others on the bench and so it was such an inexperienced side. So it's hard to gauge does this, is this a totally disconnected performance from the crisis elsewhere and should we compartmentalize it in the carabao box that we can't find or does this, you know, it's, it's not totally unconnected surely?

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

I think it is. I don't think it's in any way related to the current slump in form. Maybe if they hadn't lost four Premier League games in a row and were on a winning streak, he would have fielded a stronger team. But I totally get why Slot rested all the players, the senior players, because before this four of or five of Liverpool's last six games were away from home. London, Istanbul, London, Frankfurt, London. He's given rest of the players. People are saying, oh, but he should have had them on the bench so that they could come on if things went sideways as they did. But if you have them on the bench then you're not resting them, you're not giving them a day off. If you're a lion keeper in the zoo and you're working really hard and you get a day off, but you have to come in and supervise the understudy linekeeper and be on hand in case he gets mauled by lions and you have to step in and take over, that's not a day off, is it? It's not a rest because you still have to turn up, you still have to go through all the motions. So I think it was a wise move by Slot to rest all those players, give them the day off. I don't think it really matters that they got knocked out of this competition. He has done this before and. But as soon as you saw the lineups you thought, yeah, they're going to lose this. It'll be quite a feat if they don't. And they. Julie did go and lose it but as Robin said that they started quite well and then Everton went to hell in the handcart very quickly just before halftime.

[Barry Glendenning]

I like how matter of fact you presume, you know, that's what the supervisor at the zoo often has to do. It's just, oh no, another one, another one's been mauled. Another teenager didn't understand. I'll just go in again. Just doesn't clean up this mess. God's sake, someone tell the family they.

[Robin Cowan]

Have to do the subs. Is it like a sort of similar subs warm up? They have to do. It's like kind of very half hearted. Do I go, he hasn't even got.

[Barry Glendenning]

He hasn't even got his khaki jacket on. He's not ready. This is a total disgrace. Where do you stand on this, Jordan? You agree with Barry or sort of wider on the. I suppose we just don't know until Villa and they've got Villa, Real Madrid both at home and then man City away. Right. That is a tricky set of fixtures and I suppose it's after them you decide. Well, he was smart to rest players or not.

[Max Rushden]

Yeah, I don't have an issue with him playing a weakened team. I think he tried something different. I agree there's no point having the big boys on the bench because then as Barry says they're not technically being rested then I' if an issue. If it's an issue of being rested though, I just think it's an issue of just bad form and him working out what their best 11 needs to be. I mean I must one of the few idiots that still until yesterday still believed that they are not out of the title race. Because my mentality, my thinking would have been this. From Liverpool, Arsenal in terms of the league haven't shown they can put together 10, 11, 12 winning games when it matters. If we can get to January with a gap no more than 8, 9 points max, bring in a couple of center backs, make some really brutal but decisive selection decisions, you, you never know. But I know and I get that League and Cup are very different competitions but watching last night's game, they got smashed, they got absolutely battered last night. And I think even though they're at the cup, as you mentioned, the next three games, Villa, Real Madrid and Manchester City, if they lose all three of those games and they could lose all three of those games, you're then into the kind of territory that Man City were in last season where I think it was nine defeats and 11 when it, when it, when it was at their worst. And then you're looking at a really, really poor, not only poor title defense, but you're then kind of dragged into a top four race. And to go from Premier League champions to being a top four race I think is a really, really bad look. So I don't think you're getting knocked out of the cup on its own is a particularly big deal. I just think it's the accumulation of games that they could lose which could really be bad for their season. Just a quick note on palace, some of their goals were really good. They're playing some really good football. Their second and third goals I thought were just like just beautiful football. I just wonder if Glassner wants that Liverpool job. That's three wins now against Liverpool in 12 games and three different stadiums. I wonder if he's got his eye on, you know what next season. I wonder if, wonder if I could be in that hot seat at Anfield.

[Barry Glendenning]

Do you think, do you think if he didn't want the Liverpool job, he wouldn't have tried to win.

[Max Rushden]

Well, no, no, no, of course they're troubled the game same way. But I just find it funny that he's beaten him three times at three different grounds. Within, within, yeah. 10, 11 games.

[Barry Glendenning]

Just on the age of the bench, the Sizzler says. Has there ever been a higher total of squad numbers than Liverpool's bench tonight, nine substitutes. I've added up all the squad numbers together. Would anybody like to have a guess what's the. What number of nine substitutes?

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

I'd say around 600, 583.

[Barry Glendenning]

Very good, Barry. Yeah. Arna Slot said. Look, I saw cities 11. They didn't have one starter from the weekend, but it felt like their best 11. Like 10 changes in city. Like true City do have depth. That's a bit of an insight. Chelsea can bring in Estebao after I made two substitutions tonight we had six teenagers but I thought Liverpool had loads of debt. I mean he just didn't. That, that, that answer, Robin, is odd because he didn't. He could have selected more experienced players. He just didn't select more experienced players. And the interesting question is they play Villa, right? And we'll sort of mix the Carabao cup stuff with the Premier League preview. Villa on a really good run. And so you've got these three games for Liverpool and like there would be no shame in losing any one of those games, right? Losing to Villa who are playing well or losing to Real Madrid, losing to City. But you could lose all three. And I suppose the question is about the pressure on slot. How much does winning the league. Surely that buys you some time. That's not easy to do.

[Robin Cowan]

I mean you think so, but it seems like actually some are thinking, well no, he's already a kind of busted flush, so it's ridiculous. I think the only thing I'd say is he's starting to come out with some slightly strange, not strange, but like comments that can be made a joke of like, oh, people, you know, teams are changing their style against stuff. It's like, well, well, yeah, they'll do that because you're good and that's what people, that's what teams do to try and win games. But no, he's got, he's got a huge amount of time. I just think last season there was very little adversity for, for him apart from like, you know, there was some injuries and also the Salah situation was, you know, a lot of noise around that he's now lost. I just wonder if there's first of all too many, maybe one too many changes to the squad in terms of like, you know, let's give him some time to try and see because it, if it, if it clicks, you feel like it will really click. You know, they've got so much talent in that squad but you know, they lost Alexander Arnold, Darwin Nunes. I know, you know, wasn't you know, contributing loads. But then Diaz Elliott. It's just a lot of turnover, isn't it? And the other thing is again, we need to say he's dealing with the biggest bit of adversity that you can in grief with, you know, Diogo Jota. So I just think it. It's a very unique situation he finds himself in. But as we know, if as Jordan just said they lose these next three games, then yes, of course the pressures going to come on him.

[Barry Glendenning]

How do you think the Villa game will go, Barry?

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

I don't know is the answer. But I do know Villa's record at Anfield is atrocious. Villa's record against reigning champions away from home is atrocious. But they are on a run of four wins in a row in the Premier League and Liverpool are on a run of four defeats in a row. So I don't know how it'll go. I haven't a clue. But Villa do have a terrible record at Anfield. Recent record anyway.

[Barry Glendenning]

I suppose since the last. Since Matty Cash did that amazing pass and then that great goal with his right foot and left foot. I mean the money should be on some sort of extraordinary headed winner for Matty Cash or something like that. So that's Liverpool Villa. Palace played Brentford there into the quarterfinals as well after a 50 win at Grimsby. If you watch the highlights, it just looked like one team were just much better than the other one. And they were. Brentford won 4 and 5. Palace hadn't won in four before that Grimsby game. Chelsea won 43 at Wolves. This Robin was a fun game. It needed to go 33 then 43 to be a classic. But it was still like Wolves made it fun after looking after sort of wilting in the first half.

[Robin Cowan]

I mean a dreadful defending. I think this is the problem with Wolves actually. They look like they can score, you know and. And they showed that against Burnley as well with you know, the last game where know they possibly should have settled for a point. They probably felt like they couldn't and then they kind of got caught and they lost. But no, just very or just bad defensively. But I saw a, a post from Steve Madeley at the Athletic who said it was a bizarre build up to the game at Molyneux. 11 changes including four centre backs and two wing backs now for. For Wolves. And then he said there was also a light and dance show to build up the atmosphere which was not. Which he says was very much at odds with the prevailing mood. You just think a carabao when you're on a crap run and you decide to pop on a light show. Yeah, I mean, that's. That's. I'd say I'd question that.

[Barry Glendenning]

It would have to be such a good light show, wouldn't it? Like.

[Robin Cowan]

Like it would have been bloody brilliant. Like Coldplay to get to Jean Michel.

[Barry Glendenning]

Jar to turn people around. People are, I don't want this shit. And then suddenly go watch. Hang on, hang on, Dave. This is something else.

[Robin Cowan]

You know, I'm up for this Caraval cup now.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Then when they end the light show for kickoff, the crowds start booing more.

[Robin Cowan]

Leave en masse.

[Barry Glendenning]

I mean, the highlight of this game, I guess, Barry, was the Jamie Gittins goal. Owen says, actually, granted, no one likes a snitch, but Max, I need to report that Chelsea's official account has referred to Gittens goal as a volley, categorically a half volley, but he hit that beautifully.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Well, it wasn't a half volley, so we've had this debate before because it had bounced up quite high. That is not a half volley.

[Barry Glendenning]

Oh, I need to watch it. I need to watch it again. You carry on.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Yeah. So for a half volley, ball has to be still in contact with ground. In my opinion, it certainly wasn't. But it was a brilliant strike off the outside of his right boot. Fizz past the keeper. I'll be honest, my favorite goal here. And there's just. The world of football journalism is swamped at the moment with articles about the return of the long throw. Tony Pulis wrote, I think, a column for the BBC in, you know, needless to say, I had the last laugh column.

[Barry Glendenning]

What a prescient signing that was to get Pulis in.

[Ewan Murray]

Well done.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

He went full partridge. People used to call me a dinosaur, eh? But anyway, my favorite goal was. So it was a Mosquero long throw and then like a stone being skimmed across the lake. A lake. The ball just went from one head to another head to another head and then dropped for David Moller. Wolfer at the far post and he spanked it home. I prefer that goal to Gittens. I'm prepared to concede Gittens was the more difficult strike and the more visually, aesthetically pleasing. But for me, the long throw that skimmed across the lake was the better goal.

[Barry Glendenning]

Now, on the technicality, Gittins, it's bounced a couple of times, but he hits it right on a bounce. So it's still in the half volley bracket for me.

[Max Rushden]

Did anybody get like Sisay vibes against Oreniki Chelsea? Remember that goal at Stamford Bridge.

[Barry Glendenning]

Oh, a little bit, yeah. It's the other corner but I know what you mean.

[Max Rushden]

Yeah, it's the other corner. Yeah, that's. It reminded me of that goal. I loved it. I love that technique because it was amazing. My only takeaway from this game was how stupid is the lap If I'm the manager, I'm raging.

[Ewan Murray]

He was.

[Barry Glendenning]

Maresca is. He says. Look, he called it stupid and completely deserved. He said after the yellow card I told him four or five times to keep calm. But Liam is a player that when he's inside the pitch probably he'll be playing the game for himself. And he struggles to realize and to listen around him, which I guess is. Which is quite damning for your manager to say. He's selfish and stupid, isn't he?

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Yeah, he's a thicker.

[Max Rushden]

Yeah, basically. I mean the second yellow card could have argument a red card in of itself.

[Robin Cowan]

I agree. I think both of them could have been actually.

[Max Rushden]

Yeah, yeah, it's so I'd be. Yeah. I mean he was livid from those quotes there, Max, but you've your short up front with the personnel as it is. You're in a bit of a weird run generally. The last thing you need is a player you've been waiting to come back to now get himself suspended for. Is it one or three?

[Barry Glendenning]

I think it's one he's suspended for. He's suspended for the spurs game on Saturday. So let's look ahead to that after we've done. Spurs defeat at Newcastle. You tweeted yesterday, Barry, or you blue skied. You woke lived hard. Jed Spence tying his laces is being discussed at great and tedious lengths by adults on Sky. Tune in to the Guardian Football Weekly tomorrow where it'll almost certainly be discussed at even more tedious lengths by other adults. Yeah, I mean it was. I mean it's the story of the first goal. I mean Newcastle deserved this. I'd watched it. Spurs were pretty average, I thought, even if the stats said they had more shots than shots on target. Late in the game they got some saves out of Ramsdale. But the first goal, which is always important, was basically down to Jed Spence tying his shoelaces for what felt like 25 minutes.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Well, I'm not sure it was, but that's the narrative afterwards. Newcastle had a corner. Sandro Tonali was waiting to take it. And about five yards away from him, Jed Spence, who had lost his boot in a while challenging for the ball in the build up to the corner, was tying his shoelace. I don't know if Jed Spence just isn't very good at tying his shoelaces, but it doesn't take me that long to tie a shoelace, put it that way. And I wouldn't say I'm brilliant at it.

[Barry Glendenning]

But.

[Robin Cowan]

Where would you say, yeah, where would he rank?

[Barry Glendenning]

What's your world ranking?

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

I don't know, I haven't a clue. But yeah. So he was kneeling down, taking an age to tie his shoelace I think it was. Took him over a minute and then he, he stood up and just. Did he even jog a slow.

[Barry Glendenning]

I would say amble. I would say amble an amble back.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Towards the mixer and while he was mid amble, Tonali got the signal to take the corner, sent it in. Fabian Shahr rose highest above Bergval and thumped home aheader. Now I don't know if the presence of Jed Spence in that, on the edge of that six yard box or in that penalty area would have made any difference, but the fact of the matter is he wasn't there. Loads of Tottenham players complained to the referee, Chris Kavanagh after the game. Thomas Frank said, I have spoken to Chris about it and we will keep that between Chris and I. Now I really want to know what was said because he's made what I'm certain was a very banal conversation between him and Chris Kavanagh. Sound incredibly interesting.

[Barry Glendenning]

Sound like Frost Nixon.

[Robin Cowan]

A bit of insight actually. Thomas Frank goes to speak to the referee after every single game no matter what happens. So he's, he's quite late to interviews post match.

[Barry Glendenning]

That's in a way that's good because it's annoying when you get feedback from a boss when they haven't, you haven't heard from them for like 25 years. And they go, I hated that bit you did. And you go, well, what about all the good bits I've done?

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

I wonder who you could be talking about, Max.

[Robin Cowan]

But you are speaking my language. When you, when you get that, when you see your phone, you think, oh no, it's never good news, never good news, never good.

[Barry Glendenning]

But if Thomas Frank always goes in every single time, unless he always, unless he always says they've been shit, you know, then at least he's, you know, he's building up, that he's building up, like that's good management if you ask me. Not a lot to make out of this game. Matt Voltima scored another header, was bad goalkeeping. But Spurs, Chelsea now is a, is a really big game, Jordan for both these teams actually.

[Max Rushden]

Well, if the Guardian Listeners, remember, I actually had Tottenham finish third in my predicted standings.

[Barry Glendenning]

Stop the count. Stop the count.

[Max Rushden]

And I'm an Arsenal fan, so I've. I've. This is not something I want to happen. I think for Tottenham's point of view, if they have ambitions on trying to get a Champions League spot, I think they have to take advantage of beating a Chelsea team that, as I mentioned earlier on, have been a little bit up and down all over the place. Don't have any particularly great forwards in particularly good form at the moment as well. And I think it's an opportunity for spurs to really assert themselves as one of those key Champions League chasing sides for Chelsea. Yeah, I mean, those that did say at the start of the season they were, they were in the title race. This is the sort of game they need to win. If they do have any lingering, any lingering feelings of being in that race, I think it'll end up a draw, which I don't think is the worst result for either side.

[Barry Glendenning]

There is a sense of disquiet at the Tottenham Hotspur stadium, Robyn. I guess because most of spurs points have come away from home. But, you know, you go to all the home games, you're sort of a bit sad to see another disappointing defeat. But I feel like they're attacking the attackers they brought in. None of them have really. Kudos aside, none of them have really clicked, I think.

[Robin Cowan]

Yeah, it's, it's. It's a tricky one, isn't it? Because clearly the Premier League season last year was a total disaster, wasn't it? And you got to think that actually with this new era and, you know, Tony Pulis being brought back to do columns for the BBC, that Thomas Frank is the perfect custodian for this, really. Yeah, I get your point. I think it is, it's. The feeling is very much. If you're a season ticket holder and you're. You're not so good at home and better away, it. I think it gets amplified. Definitely. And maybe they haven't been. Been so good, but beat Chelsea, it'll all be. Is this at the Tottenham Hotspur stadium?

[Ewan Murray]

Yes.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Yeah.

[Robin Cowan]

Because this was the. The scene of that absolutely mental game.

[Max Rushden]

Yes.

[Barry Glendenning]

Yeah. The amazing nine men high line.

[Robin Cowan]

You'll never see anything like that again.

[Barry Glendenning]

Years ago.

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Yeah.

[Ewan Murray]

Yeah.

[Barry Glendenning]

That was when the wheels fell off, actually. That was actually the wheels completely falling off. The adrain at Spurs. Newcastle obviously beat spurs. Go to West Ham. Is that on Sunday, Robin?

[Robin Cowan]

Yes, I'll be there.

[Barry Glendenning]

You should know. You're. You're going. Do you think you'll be the only person left in the stadium.

[Robin Cowan]

I might be the only one left in the stands. I'm just thinking, is there. Is there set to be another mutiny? Do you remember that one a few years ago when West Ham was it a beds Burnley and Mark Noble was kind of there, you know, trying to try to calm things down. He might have to come down from the.

[Ewan Murray]

Yeah.

[Robin Cowan]

Because he's a sporting director now. So I'm just thinking, yeah, this is. This could be a real, I mean, shit show, basically. It's just been terrible, haven't they? Newcastle haven't won away from home this season. I think that might change. That's all I'm going to say on Sunday.

[Barry Glendenning]

Yeah, Nuno does need to start winning games. Brendan Rodgers is, you know, he's sort of wandering about now, isn't he? Wolves who lost to Chelsea. They go to Fulham the weekend. Fulham are through to the quarterfinals. They beat Wickham on penalties. Josh King scored an absolute beauty. Sort of not quite as good as Zola, but still a backheel volley from a corner. And then Henri Leconte saved lots of Wickham's penalties. May not have been Henri Le Conte, but it's what it sounded like to me.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

I'm starting to feel a bit sorry for Wolves because the last two matches have been home games where they started really badly. The crowd have massively got on their back. Then they've made this rousing comeback, got the crowd on side and lost both games ultimately. So I'm still convinced there's something there that can be salvaged. And I'm still not convinced. Wolves are the worst team in the Premier League, but they really need to win this game. But they're playing a Fulham side who have lost four in a row. And I think if Fulham were to lose this, you know, people at. At Craven Cottage might start choking on their olive stones and. And hummus.

[Barry Glendenning]

You might have a point. All right, that'll do for part one. Part two, we'll begin at the Emirates.

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[Barry Glendenning]

Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly. In the break, Robin, you can tell us all because it was funny about West Ham.

[Robin Cowan]

Yeah, no apologies. I don't know who who posted this, but it just caught my attention that Jared Bowen is like the only human being in a Muppets film, which I thought was beautifully observed.

[Barry Glendenning]

Anyway, to the Emirates Dan says if Arsenal become too reliant on goals from open play, they beat Brighton 2 nil. Two goals in the second half from Manieri and Saka Jordan. Brighton started the game quite well actually. Arsenal probably lucky to get a clean sheet in this game, but it's still a clean sheet. You know, D started it's all looking quite rosy for your lot, isn't it?

[Max Rushden]

Three nil down max. We were very lucky in that first 15 minutes but yeah, wrote a little bit of luck but it is looking good. Clean sheets galore for for the great Arsenal. Dman got some good minutes and impressed once again. Ranieri's finish I thought was neat and tidy and there's a nice, nice strike. I was really happy for him because he's gone from when Saka was out injured last season to being like the, the hot guy to kind of being dropped second half of the season. I know he signed his contract in the summer, but I think to keep him involved and him scoring goals just makes him feel like he is a part of this because he is, he's one of the young players that is a part of this journey so I'm glad that he got minutes and a goal. I thought there was one, one or two more dropping of players than I would have liked. I I thought I was wired a little bit at the top at the start of the game, I won't lie, I thought was slightly weaker than I would have liked, but Mikola Teta's got the team in the groove. You know, Brighton are no. Are no easy team to get past now. Record against Brighton the last few years isn't great, especially at the Emirates. So, yeah, to kind of get past them with that team, I thought. I thought was very impressive as well. My boy Marino, who I love, I love. I love Nikki Marino. That flick to set up that. The second goal, I think it was just. Was just delicious. Lewis Kelly involved in that as well. So, yeah, it's all looking good for Arsenal. We're going to do the quad.

[Barry Glendenning]

Well, I was about to ask sort of how. How comfortable does it sit with you that a lot of people are now just saying Arsenal have basically won the League.

[Max Rushden]

Not comfortable at all, because anybody from here can mess it up. It's Arsenal fc, trust me. I think we just got to focus on ourselves. I think it's a cliche, of course, but I think Arsenal just got to just block out the noise of what's happening with Chelsea, City and Liverpool and just focus on doing what they're doing and just build the buffer up. Liverpool will win games again. City will go in a run again. Chelsea will get better. We've got to make sure that by the time that happens, we've got enough of a buffer and a gap that it doesn't really matter when our dip comes because we will have a dip. We will have a dip for sure. But right now we just look so impregnable at the back and able to score across the board up top. Yeah, it's looking worryingly good for us at the moment.

[Barry Glendenning]

You have an Arsenal podcast, John. What's it called? JJB's Hot Takes because.

[Max Rushden]

Or not quite. That was. That was my vote. But it got. It got outvoted because the world needs another Arsenal podcast, doesn't it?

[Barry Glendenning]

And the loose.

[Max Rushden]

The loose cannons, me and a couple of friends, Turkish and James, we'd like to think with the balanced Arsenal fans, we're not too right.

[Barry Glendenning]

Okay.

[Max Rushden]

We're gonna win the League. Ah, Sat the manager.

[Ewan Murray]

Get him out.

[Max Rushden]

It's more considered. So go check it out on YouTube and all of your podcast platforms.

[Barry Glendenning]

All right, Cool. Brighton, by the way, home to Leeds this weekend. Man, City won 31 at Swansea. There was a. There was a bit of hope, wasn't there, Robin, that this could be the big upset?

[Robin Cowan]

Yeah. Yeah. And actually with the. With the current guys of Manchester City, they're not in the kind of form that they were in last season where you think all this could happen. It could have happened, but it was Great strike, wasn't it? By Franco. I thought, I thought actually that was my favorite one. That was my favorite one. It was kind of looping and then in off the post it was very aesthetically pleasing. And then yeah, I mean just man City just showed know you their, their depth. You know Doku had a big deflection from Doku Mahmou with a, with a. Absolutely leathered it and a Cherokee as well. So I mean it was fairly comfortable in the end but it just shows just they are still a little bit vulnerable. Manchester City and yeah really good forward. Seeing the their game against Bournemouth I.

[Max Rushden]

Think it's important though that they did have goalscorers that weren't Haaland. We know they've got lots of great attackers but my reasoning for having Liverpool was a bigger contender to our challenge than City was that for the hot form that Harland's in, he seems to be only person scoring goals at. At City when he doesn't score they don't seem to win games. So I think this was a good game for them to not play him and have multiple other attackers hitting the back of the net.

[Barry Glendenning]

You mentioned it Robin. Man City, Bournemouth, Barry. Which is fascinating actually.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Yeah, it should be a really good game. My only concern about it is Manchester City have won all eight of their Premier League home games against Bournemouth. Bournemouth I think have only beaten City once in the Premier League and 16 meetings. Now I don't know how much you can read into these historical records and they probably shouldn't make any difference but they, they do for some reason or other. I'm not sure why. Bournemouth are just have been brilliant so far this season. City being a bit up and down. Erling Haaland is obviously on a one goal, one game goal drought. So I suspect he may rectify that situation on Sunday. I saw on the BBC website actually Eli Croupy is looking to score in his fourth consecutive Premier League game for Bournemouth. And if he did score against City he would become the fourth teenager in Premier League history to score in four more consecutive games. Can you name the other three? Rooney? Nope.

[Robin Cowan]

Owen?

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Nope.

[Barry Glendenning]

Giggs?

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Nope.

[Barry Glendenning]

Are any of them easy?

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Yeah. Shearer? Shearer? No.

[Robin Cowan]

Ronaldo?

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

No. Two of them are Scousers and one of them played for Liverpool but is not English.

[Barry Glendenning]

Franny Jefferson.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Yes.

[Robin Cowan]

Oh, nice one.

[Barry Glendenning]

Thanks so much. Put us out of our misery.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Robbie Fowler, Franny Jeffers and Nick Inelka.

[Barry Glendenning]

Ah, interesting. Thank you, Barry. I enjoyed that little quiz. Jordan, you did an interview with Tyler Adams about the World Cup. It was interesting. Tell us about it.

[Ewan Murray]

Yes.

[Max Rushden]

Sat down with the U.S. men's captain and it was interesting because I've been trying to get into him for a little while because as is my remit at Channel 4 News, I'm a news sp sports journalist. So where the two cross over and he's someone's going to be at the center of what's going to be the biggest event next year, the World Cup. And we're seeing what's happening beyond the, the, the football obviously in, in that country. I thought we could try to sit down with him and get some, get his thoughts on leading out his nation. We spoke about a number of things. It was really interesting on diversity and how he feels diversity of the US Squad is a massive part of their, is a massive strength of theirs and why they, he thinks they can go far in the competition. And I asked him basically, you know, okay, that's all well and good, but the president of your country actually is kind of rowing back a little bit on the whole idea of dei. So how's that going to work out? He spoke a little bit about pay to play.

[Ewan Murray]

I don't know if you guys know.

[Max Rushden]

What pay to play in the States is. To simplify it, very simple system in the States whereby parents have to pay to get their kids to play soccer outside of school for clubs. Obviously here it's not the same system. But I wanted to ask him about that because I feel it makes the sport in the US a lot more middle class and it rules out a whole generation of young boys and girls to play soccer in the States. And I don't think it's a good thing. So I've got his thoughts on that. We spoke about that awkward trophy lift from Donald Trump and Rhys James that moment the club World cup final and asked him, you know, how long he would give it before he would wait for Donald Trump to exit the stage and not photobomb his big moment should they become world champions. But I just found a very articulate, interesting young guy that has some thoughts on things beyond football. And I think as we all know in this country it's very difficult to get athletes in the UK in my opinion to really speak on issues beyond their game with any particular intellect, in my opinion. Now that might be because they don't really have the intellect or it might be because they don't want to speak about wider things. But a lot of the, the US based athletes are very interesting when it comes to speaking about things beyond sports. So I found him interesting and yeah, hopefully he'll get to the World cup fit and healthy to lead out his nation on home soil.

[Barry Glendenning]

Just on pep and set pieces. You know, he's. He did some good stuff in the presser talking about Sean Dyche, you know, and so, so good. He was in fact so, so good about Dyche. Allardyce Pulis, you know, I remember a long time ago with Dyche. Bernie were incredible threat in long balls, second balls D1 of the best by far in these kind of aspects. It's not new. Or Sam Allardyce. I remember when I was not here, Stoke City. Do you remember Stoke City when they made the throws? It happened in that time and he.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Went on and on.

[Barry Glendenning]

But on the subject of long, long throws, IFAB and are looking at how long it takes Barry. It took Brentford 10 minutes to take nine throws against Liverpool, which actually I'm in fully admiration for that. But IFAB have discussed the possibility of limiting how long a player can spend on a throw in. They want the ball to stay and play. I kind of get it. According to stats performed, there were more than twice as many long throws in the Premier League the opening weeks of this season compared with last season as a whole. Which is a massive jump, isn't it? Do you care or would you like to see a big countdown while Michael Coyote is, you know, arching his back?

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Personally, I don't care. I've never watched someone dry the ball with a towel and wait for everyone to get in position and then take their big long run up and launch the ball trebuchet style into the box. I've never found myself going, oh, this is a waste of time. I wish you'd get on with it. I probably would if it was happening against my team and they were losing and there was a long left. But I would suggest there are far more pressing issues IFAB should be turning their attention to in terms of the laws of the game than how long it takes somebody to take a throw in. I mean, if it gets to a point where, you know, Michael Coyote is taking eight minutes to take a throw in, then yes, I guess I think it should probably be left up to individual referees discretion so that they can apply the common sense we all want, but then we also want consistency and obviously you cannot have both. I think it should be left to individual referees discretion. If they think someone is taking the piss, then get them to hurry up. Otherwise I think it's fine. But IFAB sort out the handball law. Preach worry.

[Barry Glendenning]

Preach, Barry, Preach. One other game in the Carabao, Cardiff City 1, 2, 1 at Wrexham, which is, you know, big in Wales. Bragging rights terms. Cardiff doing really well in League one, Wrexham doing okay in the championship.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

I actually watched this game. I was hugely impressed with Cardiff. They absolutely massacred Wrex him in the first half but they only had a one nil lead at half time. They should have been three or four up at least. Reuben Caldwell, brilliant player, far too good for league one. I'm basing this on the evidence of one 45 minute performance. Yeah. Keefer Moore scored against his former club Cardiff with a header shortly after halftime. But Cardiff won it in the end and deservedly so. Very impressed by them.

[Barry Glendenning]

Yeah. The only non Premier League sides left in the competition. Four more games we haven't talked about. Forest Man United, Brighton, Leeds, Fulham, Wolves, Sunderland, Everton, which is on Monday night. Robin, it is worth a word on Forest Man United because that there's all sorts of fun. Whatever happens, it will be, you know, there'll be fun stories off the back of it.

[Robin Cowan]

Oh yeah, yeah. Now Sean Dyche is back especially. Yeah, I mean this is the. Again, we kind of. Are Manchester United back. I think this will be, this will be another test. Although again, if they win they'll still say, well, people will say, well, Forest aren't in great, great shape. Although they look slightly better than, than they did. Although not a great result against Bournemouth at the weekend. So no, no, this should, this should be fun. Yeah, I'm very scared that Manchester United are in fact looking quite good. A little bit concerned by that. I'm just on the IFAB things. Do you think they'll apply it to tying the laces as well?

[Barry Glendenning]

You will have two and a half minutes because if you do them really well, you know, who knows, maybe Jed Spence was ambling slowly because he just thought, wow, my, my feet are so ensconced in this boot. I've done this. So. Ah, Newcastle have scored. Anyway, that'll be for part two. Part three, we go to the Jazz bar and Ewan Murray is standing by.

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[Barry Glendenning]

Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly. Let's talk to our Scottish football correspondent, Ewan Murray. You had a busy week, Ewan?

[Ewan Murray]

Yes, I've had quieter weeks, max. That's fair to say. Yes. How are you?

[Barry Glendenning]

Yeah, I'm all right, thanks. Let's start with Celtic, then. They beat Falkirk last night, 4 0. The Martin O' Neill effect. But let's go back to the start of the week. Brendan Rodgers resigns. This is an incredible statement from principal shareholder Dermot Desmond eviscerating Brendan Rodgers. I just wondered how you, what you felt about what happened, where to begin.

[Ewan Murray]

I mean, I mean, the most remarkable thing is that Martin O' Neill's return to the Celtic dugout, age 73, is not the most remarkable thing, because otherwise that would be. That would be quite stunning. I mean, I've never seen anything, anything like this in football, I think. Had Brendan Rogers resigned on Monday? They just lost 31 to Hearts. They're eight points behind in the league. Had he resigned and the club had said, you know, we were aligned differently in terms of how we, we saw the club going. Brendan was going to leave in the summer anyway and we thought it was better to expedite that process, something like that. Or even actually the initial statement the club put out, which was, which was kind of mundane enough, I think people would have said fine and got on with stuff. But Dermot Desmond's statement, put out in the club's website within 15 minutes of the resignation being announced, was, Was extraordinary, absolutely extraordinary. I, I think it was overly personal, overly spiteful. I think whatever you think of Brendan Rogers, he wanted the best for Celtic and if he was as self serving, I'm using Dermot Desmond's words, as Der Desmond had said, he could have resigned when the transfer window closed, a failed transfer window. He could have resigned at that point, being a martyr with supporters and taken a lot of the acclaim. He didn't do that. He worked on, so we couldn't get through it. But I find it hard to square a lot of the language that Dermot Desmond used and I think it was, well, I can't be two faced. Well, journalistically it was fantastic. I think it, I think it was a bad look for Dermot Desmond and Celtic. Yeah.

[Barry Glendenning]

And where do the fans, you know, are the fans on team Rodgers or Team Desmond?

[Ewan Murray]

That's interesting because the fans have been squarely set against Derma and the board for quite a number of Months. And I think also there was a growing sense among supporters that the Brendan Rodgers element wasn't working and that there had to be a change in the dugout. But the fans, I think, also object to the language used towards him by Dermot Desmond because in their eyes, Dermot Desmond and the board are deflecting from, from their own feelings. And I think this is a long term thing with Celtic. I think the board and the management of the club, they don't believe they do much wrong. They think they. The statement says it, you know, we've had great success over 20 years, etc. Etc. Well, that's true in a domestic context, but there's been a lot of embarrassing European episodes and it's not just Brendan Rodgers, it's been Brendan Rodgers twice. Ange Postecoglou, Neil Len and Ronnie Dyla as all managers who have been critical of the transfer processes at the club. So there's a bigger picture there that the fans are, I think, likely cognizant of. And while not completely admonishing Brendan Rodgers from blame, I think Deborah Desmond's statement, you know, irritated those funds even further.

[Barry Glendenning]

Bringing Martin o' Neal in is a master strike though, isn't it? Or is it? I mean, it feels like it. Feeling just for vibes, right. Just hearing him speak after the game yesterday and you know, he's obviously, he's sort of like fancy free and like really open as a manager going, oh, they were good, this was fine. You know, it just feels nice. Maybe it's just a nostalgia for everyone just hearing Martin O'. Neill.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

I agree.

[Ewan Murray]

And he's the youngest 73 year old you ever see. He does not look or sound or act that age. I mean that this is another fascinating element to this. But Mar o' Neal has been adamant this is interim, this is short term. I'm only holding the fort. But I know that privately, 100% Martin O' Neal will believe he can still manage Celtic on a long term basis. That's how he thinks.

[Barry Glendenning]

Yeah.

[Ewan Murray]

And if he beat, you know, the Quay Rangers in a League cup semi final on Sunday, he's just seen off Falker 4. Now if they go and hammer Rangers at hand, and I'm not saying they will or they won't, but it's possible, you know, is there this weight of support behind Martin o' Neill because the fans love him, the players? Well, the immediate reaction has been a positive one. Does there become a campaign to get him the job? It's really interesting.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Martin o' Neill is a regular on The Jim White show on Talksport on Monday mornings. And it's quite funny because he's very opinionated and some of his best riffs are being incredibly bitter about the manner in which he was dismissed from Nottingham Forest, being incredibly bitter about the manner in which he was dismissed from Aston Villa, railing against modern newfangled jargon like XG and heat maps and all that stuff. But he was on, on this Monday morning talking up Hartz's chances of winning the Scottish Premiership. And then when I heard later on that he'd been appointed interim manager, I went, you old dog. You never mentioned that this morning. But apparently he did not know. So the call came after the show had finished at 1 o'. Clock.

[Ewan Murray]

He got a call at 5 o' clock when he was in the King's Road in London. I mean, that is an example of how utterly mad and manic this whole thing was. He and he. And he means, I think. I mean, there's no chance, if he knew he had even the slightest opportunity of going back into Celtic, that he would have. He would have talked up Heart's chances of winning the league and also criticized Celtic. He said they lacked physicality, I think he said in the same show. So that's the example of how weird and wonderful the situation was. My favorite example of the. One of the kind of stuff you speak about, Barry, is. Keith Andrews was obviously very critical of Martin when he was the Republic of Ireland manager. And I knew, and I knew this would happen as soon as Keith Andrews got the job at Brentford, where he seems to be doing very well. Martin took great delight in saying, well. Well, you might see how difficult it is when you're not sitting in a pundit's chair and you have to. You have to be the manager. He'd been waiting on that for umpteen years and he finally got the chance.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

He. I really like Martin. So do I. Incredibly bitter man. He really knows how to hold a grudge.

[Ewan Murray]

I get on well with him, but I get on well with him because he pulled me up umpteen years later over something I had written. And I was at a dinner and he said to the organizer for dinner, tell you and Murray I want to speak to him. And I thought, this can't be. This was years removed. It was when he was a public filing manager. I'd written something and I went up to see him and he said, yeah. And he reeled off pretty much word for word what I'd written six or seven years before. And he said. And what he did was he said, look, he said, go back and read it and take my number and give me a phone and you can see what you think. And then he referred to something else I'd written afterwards, which I certainly didn't remember. I was like, oh, anyway, I like him. He was self deprecating about it. And he said that when he was Ireland manager, he used to spend too much time. He had too much time in his hands. He used to read everything, et cetera, et cetera. But we get on well now. But that was my introduction to the world of Martin o'. Neill.

[Barry Glendenning]

That's so funny. Cabin Ozzy says, as a Hearts fan, which Celtic appointment would Ewan fear the most? So what would you fear? Like the O' Neill bandwagon, the O' Neill train, or Kieran McKenna? Ange Postecoglou mentioned, of course, Craig Bellamy mentioned. Robbie Keane mentioned.

[Ewan Murray]

Yeah, I don't think Postecoglou will happen. I think. I don't think Celtic were entirely amused by the circumstances by which he went to Spurs. I'd be surprised at this point if that happens. McKenna is clearly possible. They've liked him for a while. I think he has to balance, obviously. Will he get a decent Premier League job from Ipswich at this point and I don't know. Or is he better served going to go into Celtic? But it hasn't been knocked out the park or, you know, dismissed yet, which makes me think he at least has a notion to think about it. Bellamy, I would be surprised. And also he seems to have decent fish to fry with the World cup in the horizon. To answer the question, o' Neill probably is the one, as an opposition fan you would fear, Even though it's 20 years removed from a managing Celtic. He knows the environment. He will get so many people behind him. He could get the club going quite quickly. So I think probably he would be the one not to dismiss McKenna, who's clearly a very, very fine coach. You would be wary of what Martin, you know, could do with Celtic.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

I was interested to see that Robbie Keane was linked with the job because Celtic fans have a famous kinship with Palestinians. Keane managed Maccabee Tel Aviv. How would that go down if he was appointed?

[Ewan Murray]

Yeah, I'm conscious not to generalize, but there's an element of the Celtic support to whom that would be a big problem. Yes, that is an element. Whether the Celtic board would care about that and whether I am overstating that. Maybe I am, but that is a factor in all of this. I also think I don't know how to be Semi respectful. If it wasn't Robby Keane, I think if you looked at his career so far, would you think he's qualified to manage Celtic? I'm not sure you would.

[Barry Glendenning]

Let's talk about Rangers. You and Danny Roll is in as manager, having previously rolled himself out. Thank you, producer Joel. They beat Kamanik at the weekend 3 1, his first win. How was he like? I was quite impressed when he went into the crowd when they lost that game and he sort of said, yeah, you know, I'm. I'm with you kind of thing. Have you been impressed with how he's carried himself so far?

[Ewan Murray]

Yeah. Although I think we've seen in recent times that Rangers managers can carry themselves. It's getting results. That's a bit. Bit more of a problem.

[Barry Glendenning]

Of course.

[Ewan Murray]

Listen, he's worked at Bayern Munich. He's worked with the German, the German national team. He's clearly no clown. He knows what he's doing in coaching circles. It's very early. They were horrendous in that European game last week, although he was just in the door. They beat Kate comfortably on Sunday, which I would argue they should do, and hems with a penalty last night, which would have made that game one each, and probably the mood would be slightly, slightly different. I think Majors fans will get behind rule. I think it's unfair to compare him to Russell Martin. And listen, he faces Celtic in this semi final on Sunday, and as I said, Celtic could beat Rangers quite easily. Rangers could beat Celtic as well. We're in that kind of situation. I wouldn't call a clear favorite in that game. And if he beat Celtic in his third game in charge, he's won himself an amazing amount of breathing space.

[Barry Glendenning]

Yeah. What about Hearts?

[Robin Cowan]

Drew?

[Barry Glendenning]

Last night had been, well, a lot. How many wins? It was six wins on the spin until last night. But I guess when you're on this roll and you're going well and you drop any points, you must think, oh, come on, guys. Because the hope a good mate of mine's a Hearts fan. He's like, I can't deal with this hope. Like, it's been crushed before.

[Max Rushden]

Yeah, I.

[Ewan Murray]

Sorry, it's got to be rules. Fourth giving charge. Not third. Third domestic game.

[Barry Glendenning]

That's all right. That's right.

[Ewan Murray]

I don't agree with you, mate, because I have. I think I have pretty much seen and heard and sampled all with Hearts over decades, but I. I'm enjoying this. I think you roll with it. I think. I think it's great fun and I think with what's going on there. There's reason to think it will get better. So I'm. I'm not particularly setting myself up for the disappointment. I'm enjoying the ride. Last night was a. Was a brilliant game which Hearts could have won and Hearts could have lost. And actually a point in Paisley is not a terrible outcome. They played Dundee at home on Saturday, Dundee United at home the following week. If they get six points from there, they're. This is if they're in a terrific position. But there's a. There's an upwardly mobile, exciting feeling around Hearts, which I think is unavoidable despite drawing 2:2 at CIN.

[Barry Glendenning]

Finally, Aberdeen have brought in Lutz Pfannensteel as a sporting director. His CV is quite remarkable. He once stole a penguin. He has spent 101 days in a Singaporean jail accused of match fixing, not penguin theft related. He's modeled for Armani. It's just a great story, isn't it?

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

You.

[Ewan Murray]

I thought you were going to say Max fixing there. What penalty? What penalty?

[Barry Glendenning]

Yes, well, that's a different thing, is.

[Ewan Murray]

What penalty would that carry?

[Barry Glendenning]

Enormous, absolutely enormous penalties for Max fixing. So I got this gig.

[Ewan Murray]

Yeah, but this guy's. He seems to be highly rated. I, I'm. I'm maybe needlessly cynical when someone like that arrives in Scotland from Germany. I think, why, why, why are you not in the Bundesliga or the second tier in Germany anyway? Yeah, he's a colorful character. I think it's, you know, we'll all know he's around. Aberdeen have had a bad start to the season, but one at Kilmarnock, one nil last night, which, which felt like a big result and, and maybe the manager, Jimmy Taline, will benefit from that support. I mean, it's amazing. A year ago now I was on here talking about Aberdeen's rampaging start to the season and how they were. Were they not going to be challengers for the. For the Scottish top flight? And they've. They've been in liquid relegation candidates for much of this one. So, yeah, nothing stays the same up here.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Can't help but feel, Max, you glossed over the most interesting part of his CV there. The theft of a penguin was an actual penguin or a chocolate bar of the same name. You.

[Barry Glendenning]

And do you have the details? I'm looking up his penguin theft.

[Ewan Murray]

No, I must admit, I assumed it was a legitimate live penguin. Maybe it is a biscuit. No one would know if he stole a biscuit, would they?

[Barry Glendenning]

Well, I don't think it would be as big A story, but we'll dig into where he stole a penguin from.

[Ewan Murray]

We should try and get him on.

[Barry Glendenning]

He was on loan to Bradford Park Avenue and was declared three times dead, three times on the pitch after his lungs collapsed following a collision. So that's also, you know, another interesting part of his life. Anyway, look, we'll do more on Lutz plan and shield for certain, but thank you, Ewan, appreciate your time.

[Ewan Murray]

I think I need to go and find this guy. He put this in my head now.

[Barry Glendenning]

Yes, absolutely should. Cheers. Ewan, just a bit of AOB on the subject of divorced Belgians. We asked to get some divorced Belgians to email in. Actually, the cupboard is pretty bare. David says, hello. I'm friends with a divorced Belgian, but she doesn't listen to Football Weekly. Andy says, Max, Barry and the team. I'm a first time writer. I have listened since the 2007 glory years. Though I'm not from Belgium, I have been to Bruges and Centre, parks there, enjoy Belgian beers and an episode of Poirot. I didn't even write him when I had a vasectomy, but felt the time was now to write and I got married in 2008. No blessings from Barry in those days. Was happily divorced earlier this year. I can now say that the Football Weekly podcast has been a longer constant in my life than marriage. To paraphrase the old saying, you can change your wife, you can change your religion, you can change your politics, but you cannot change your football podcast. Thanks. All from Andy Johnson. Presumably not this one. Finally, Krista writes and she sent a lovely video on Instagram. Hi, Max. Hi, Barry. My partner, Graham Smurthwaite, who hails from lovely England but lives here in the States, listens to your show religiously. We're getting married on October 19th. So sorry we're a little late, Krista. I know the only gift he would want and would surprise him the most would be a shout out from you and Barry. I'm not sure how many shows you've recorded just yet, but if you could throw him a shout out, I'd be deeply grateful. She said in the video. Yeah, he's a super fan. He loves Mrs. Rushton's predictions. The first one of the first things he ever told her about on a date was the video in the Barry of me slapping the chair. So Lord knows why you stayed on past that conversation, Krista, but you did. First thing she bought him was a mug of me, this mug of me slapping the chair. Here it is. And he drinks his coffee from it every Morning. So, look, Graham, we love people like you. Thank you for listening to this podcast and many congratulations.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

It was an incredibly nice video from Krista and sadly, we didn't see it in time for the wedding. I'm putting that to blame for that squarely. Your Adoramacta Klan is still struggling to come to terms with Instagram messaging and all that. It was such a nice message. So I'm really sad we didn't get to wish them well before the big day so she could show it at the wedding. And I hope it didn't ruin the occasion of Krista's wedding. I hope she wasn't suffering from anxiety or anything because we let her down.

[Barry Glendenning]

Imagine if that ruined her wedding. I mean, you've got to hope. No, I'm not dancing.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

There's something missing, but I can tell from just from the evidence of that video alone, Graham is doing very well for himself. So don't. Don't it up, Graham.

[Barry Glendenning]

Yeah. There you are. It's a lovely message to you and to everyone else out there. Don't it up. And that'll do for today. Thanks, everybody. Thank you, Jordan.

[Ewan Murray]

Cheers, mate.

[Barry Glendenning]

Thank you, Robin.

[Robin Cowan]

Thanks, Max.

[Barry Glendenning]

Thank you, Barry.

[Jordan Jarrett-Bryan]

Thank you.

[Barry Glendenning]

Football Weekly is produced by Joel Grove. Our executive producer is Danielle Stevens. We'll be back on Monday.

[Max Rushden]

This is the Guardian.