← Football Weekly
Football Weekly
Was that the night Arsenal won the Premier League? – Football Weekly
00:52:51
Robyn Cowen is joined by Barry Glendenning, John Brewin and Jonathan Liew as Manchester City drop points against Nottingham Forest and Arsenal extend their lead at the top of the table to seven points
Loading summary
Transcript111 lines
- [00:00]
Jonathan Liew
This is the Guardian.
- [00:09]
VRBoCare Advertisement
With VRBoCare, help is always ready before, during and after your stay. We've planned for the plot twists, so support is always available because a great trip starts with peace of mind, day or night. VRBoCare is here 247 to help make every part of your stay seamless. If anything comes up or you simply need a little guidance, support is ready whenever you reach out. From the moment you book to the moment you head home. We're here to help things run smoothly because a great trip starts with the right support. And hey, a good playlist doesn't hurt either.
- [01:00]
Robin Bairner
Hello and welcome to the Guardian Football Weekly. A prime night of prayer. Premier League drama was this the night Arsenal won the title? An unconvincing victory at Brighton, a deflected goal that should have been saved and a Seagull onslaught survived. Plus drop points for City at the Etihad. See the Gunners go seven clear at the top. An ugly win. The sign of champions Or a setup to what would be the most painful of title concessions. Forest's first goals and points at the Etihad in the Premier League keep them clear of the relegation zone on goal difference after Somerville wins it for West Ham. And who knew William Aula had that in his locker? Michael Carrick is handed his first defeat as Man United coach on his return to Tyneside against 10 man Newcastle to shake up the race for Champions League football and the car crash that will be spurs against palace tonight. Oh, Premier League, you do spoil us. We'll look ahead to the FA cup this weekend. Will lightning strike twice for Wolves against Liverpool? Will it be Mansfield to halt Arsenal's hunt for the quadruple? And how many times will Hollywood be mentioned in the match between Wrexham and and Chelsea? We ask how much KSI paid for Dagerman Redbridge and ask exactly who KSI is. All that plus your questions. And that's today's Guardian Football Weekly. On the panel today, Barry Glendenning. Good morning.
- [02:16]
Barry Glendenning
Hi, Robin. I had to Google KSI. I don't mind admitting it.
- [02:21]
Robin Bairner
Oh, we were going to ask you, but you've already done your research. But that's why. That's why you're, you know, you're paid the big bucks and you're. You're the head honcho show here. John Brewing. Good morning.
- [02:31]
John Brewin
Hi. I got KSI mixed up with the shamans. LSI love sex intelligence. There's one for the teenagers out there.
- [02:42]
Robin Bairner
So on Brand and Johnny Liu, good morning to you again. You have your posse with you?
- [02:48]
Jonathan Liew
Yeah, the kids are still Roaming around. I think like the first, like seven or eight times it was charming and now it's just intensely annoying. Not just to panel. And it's actually beginning to look like it's a, like it's a staged event now. But hopefully it's not. It's not.
- [03:04]
Barry Glendenning
Johnny was saying it's International Book Day and we're all very disappointed that his two kids aren't setting off for the day dressed as upside down pyramids. But they've gone down a more traditional romantic route, I think.
- [03:20]
Robin Bairner
Yeah, we need to, we need to gather the information. How many have gone as one of Jonathan Wilson's books? I'm sure it's in the tens. We'll have to, we'll have to gather that in the census. Let's go to the football there. Manchester City 2, Nottingham Forest 2. And after a seven match winning run for Manchester City, Barry, their sort of vulnerabilities that we've seen occasionally this season actually more on one occasion creep in again.
- [03:43]
Barry Glendenning
Yeah, it's a game they dominated and they didn't win. They looked vulnerable on the counter. They had 70% possession, 21 shots. But their performance once again and this keeps happening. Them dropped off in the second half. They've now dropped 13 points from winning positions and it's really hurting them. And this could be a really decisive night in the title race. It could also be a really decisive night in the relegation battle. And I would take my hat off to Nottingham Forest for scoring two excellent goals. Coming back from being behind twice. I, I'd argue, man, City maybe should have had a penalty. But apart from that, I, I think it was completely fair result and City aren't learning from their mistakes.
- [04:37]
Robin Bairner
I think it's fair to say David has got in touch saying, is it only a mentality issue when Arsenal drop points or are City weak and fragile now? And Nick says held at home by strugglers after being ahead twice the second of manic corner on Manchester City, big old bottlers brackets. Am I doing this right, Johnny? We love to label a team bottlers, don't we? I'm not sure Manchester City do come under that category. What do you think?
- [05:00]
Jonathan Liew
Yeah, I mean, there's a huge, you know, discourse about whether, whether it's a bottle. What, what constitutes a bottle. What constitutes a choke? As if, you know, as if these are kind of technical terms. And, and yet the whole time people have been waiting and watching like a hawk for, for Arsenal to slip up and they've almost sort of forgotten the fact that City, that all this, this Season have had this really consistent flaw. A problem that they they've tried to sort out with with personnel with signings in in January but ultimately Rodri isn't the Rodri he was. And this you know once you you know this, this is the root of actually quite a lot of their problems. They try to solve it in lots of different ways. You know he's you know started to put O'Reilly in in. In midfield and, and that that hasn't you know that hasn't really worked. But and, and so when when you know Elliot Anderson strides through their, their midfield where you know you would expect a midfield to be there isn't and he gets the ball back and the finish is great. And and that the first goal from. From Gibbs White again it's it's. It's one of those you know it's a really good improvised finish that clearly neither Dias or Donnarumma are are expecting. But this is a recurring pattern. This is what happened against spurs when they gave up a two nil lead. You know they, they were hanging on a little bit against Newcastle you know conceded you know quite quite against the run of play there. And then you know if you watch the Leeds game at the weekend they're kind of hanging on in that last 10, 15 minutes. Leeds are throwing everything at them in a way that is really not. It's not becoming of a team that you'd expect to win for a title. I know that you know this we're going to talk about Arsenal later and how they kind of got away with it a little bit last night. But this is not, this is. I think people are still expecting the city that we got in the you know, in the imperial years. And it's not I mean a lot of the players, I mean about half that team has not won the League before. I think we are dealing with a very different kind of city here and that's why you know consistently all the way through. I've said, you know Arsenal I think Arsenal have got this not, not because of you know they are. They are great champions or you know that they are unbeatable or anything like that but because City just have so many flaws in them.
- [07:13]
Robin Bairner
Yeah that's going to go down well but we'll go down. So we'll talk about Arsenal a bit later that it yeah won't be them to win the title. Him two fantastic goals from Nottingham Forest and Manchester City felt they could have had a couple of penalties those Rodri. That one was kind of not sure about that one Personally, when he. He shot and was caught sort of after that. But on. On Forest, John, I mean, this was a big result because Vito Pereira, it's not okay in Europe. This was his first point since being appointed as. As Forest boss. In particular with West Ham with a good result as well last night. This was very big for them.
- [07:49]
John Brewin
Vital. Pereira hasn't won a Premier League game yet this season, has he? That's the. So I think he's not actually got many points either. So Forest looked and have looked since Pereira's gone in there like a team fighting for their lives, which at various. Over the. Various managers they've had this season, that hasn't always been the case. And I suppose if you look at the goals and the players that scored them, why are they in that position? I mean, Morgan Gibbs White is a high quality player, we know that. And Elliot Anderson is, you know, the heir apparent in. In England's midfield. And it was a fantastic goal. You mentioned, Jonathan mentioned the word bottle. Can I. I was reminded of this.
- [08:32]
Jonathan Liew
Do we.
- [08:33]
John Brewin
Do we know. I'm sure you've gone over this. Do we know the origins of this?
- [08:37]
Barry Glendenning
I. It's something. Yes, I do, yes. It's to do with cockney rhyming.
- [08:43]
John Brewin
It's cockney rhyming slang, you know, a regular feature of Guardian Football Weekly. But yeah, it is bottle and glass ass. So it means essentially, if you've lost your bottle, you've lost control of your bodily functions in the. In the intestines, shall we say? Let's put it politely. And it's. So that's it. So if your bottle's gone well, you could make a hell of a mess. Are City bottling? No, I think they're playing to their potential. As Jonathan said that there's quite a few players there that haven't been and done that before. Pep Guardiola is talking afterwards about how they probably didn't give the ball enough to Erling Haaland. I do think that was a penalty, by the way. And that's it. City have changed. City are reliant on the big players, one of whom, Rodri, understandably, is not the player he was before because of the. He's still coming back from an ACL injury and they're looking to Donna Rummer, they're looking to Harland and it's. It's a new scenario for them and they. And towards the end of games, they are vulnerable and that's what Forest took advantage of and were able to get a hugely important point and one that those Teams around them would not have expected them to get. Which I suppose is a very important
- [10:08]
Robin Bairner
point, and they could have won it. Yates with a header wide. Murillo also had one off the line. He just looks like such a heroic defender, doesn't he? And that was. That was great positioning from him. Yeah. No, I really enjoyed Sangari, who clearly was just so knackered trying to run the ball out when Nottingham Forest were under the kosh and he was just robbed. I mean, looked like, as I said on the group, I could have run faster than that in my third trimester. I was pretty certain of that. It was absolutely. It was incredible. But, yeah, heroics from Nottingham Forest. And John, before we move on, you were very taken with their MOD physio, weren't you?
- [10:43]
John Brewin
Yeah, I mean, I've seen this guy before, but. Yeah, I mean, I mean, in Manchester. Well, I mean, where is the home of mod? I suppose it's. It's London, isn't it? But that the mod.
- [10:56]
Robin Bairner
All the physios have their hair. Have that haircut in Manchester.
- [11:00]
John Brewin
Well, Manchester. Well, it's not me, I suppose it's the Ian Brown. It's the. It's the. No, the Liam Gallagher. It's the Noel Gallo at various points. It's that, that hairstyle. It's. It's Paul Weller though, really, isn't it? It's that era. It's. It's the. The true Mod. But yeah, maybe there's a big mod scene in Nottingham I don't know anything about, but I think that. I think actually there probably was the one back in. But he's still living the dream. Yeah.
- [11:29]
Barry Glendenning
Our gentlemen of a certain age who rock that haircut. Known somewhat unfairly as Whalens.
- [11:36]
John Brewin
Yeah, well, it's one of those. I think it's one of those hairstyles that's unforgiving if. If age starts to catch up with you, you know that there is a. A certain. The aging Paul Weller hairstyle. If you, if you're. If you're running out of hair is. Is one hell of a look, isn't.
- [11:56]
Robin Bairner
Goes from that to sort of got Svengar and Ericsson a little bit too quickly.
- [12:00]
John Brewin
Yeah, exactly.
- [12:01]
Robin Bairner
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Meanwhile, on the South Downs, Arsenal overcame a pretty stern test to beat Bryce and make the gap seven points at the top. This was a one nil win. Bukayo saka. Ninth minute. I mean, it was an okay effort. It took a deflection. Let's be fair to Verbruggen. It looked like he possibly could have kept it out and, yeah, quite a lot of beef here. Herzler looked like he was spoiling for a fight with anyone who would have him. And then afterwards he said Brighton were the only team who tried to play football. I will never be that kind of manager who tries to win in that way. I mean, words said by a man who's just seen his team lose. Never hear that, Barry, do you? From a. From a coach whose team have just won.
- [12:40]
Barry Glendenning
Yeah, I think he had a bit of a point, boss, when if you don't take anything from the game, you just. And you say things like that, you just sound like a sore loser. And he clearly was sore at losing and Brighton should have done better. There's no denying that this is not a criticism of Arsenal. This is just a description of what happened. They won by a single goal for the 10th time this season. They scored a slightly lucky goal early on and then they didn't have another shot on target to the 88th minute. But they got three points. That's all they're after. And if they win the title, that. That'll be fine. If they don't win the title and their fans are being put through the ringer like this, there will almost certainly be repercussions and certain sections of the fan base will want Arteta out. But as Johnny said, it looks like Arsenal have got this covered. It wasn't a good game. I'd like if Belieba had scored that goal early. Early doors. When David Raya presented him, gifted him the ball, he tried to scoop it over his head and. And Gabriel, who was outstanding all night, in the absence of. Of William Saliba alongside him, he headed it away. If that had gone in, that would have made things really interesting. But as. As it happened, the game never really got interesting. Brighton had a few chances, didn't score them and they lost. And Herzler had a big moan afterwards, as I say, sounded like a sore loser. He is a sore loser. He always. It's not uncommon for him to piss and moan on the touchline and get in the year, the fourth official and his opposite number. But there seems to be genuine enmity between him and Arteta. And when Arteta was told what he'd said, he just sort of went, well, I take those comments seriously. If, you know, it depends who says. He clearly has little or no respect for Hersler.
- [14:41]
Robin Bairner
This child is in charge of this team. Yeah, he said what a surprise when he was told about Herzler's complaints. And, yeah, there were celebrations at the end, a sort of double Celebration after they heard the score, the Arsenal fans that the ETI had as well. And I just have a horrible feeling that those scenes are going to come back and it will be a meme from these, these Arsenal fans. I just have a horrible feeling about that. But we even talked about it yesterday. Jordan Jarrett Bryan, who's a big Arsenal fan, he kind of wants more from this Arsenal team. And Johnny, I guess it's like, oh, if they win the title, it'd be people going, oh, not like that. No, we don't need to win the title like that. That's not that, no, that doesn't count.
- [15:21]
Jonathan Liew
Yeah, I mean, this is, it's obviously, it's obviously discourse. But, you know, I guess it also is a question that strays into, you know, cultural, like philosophical almost, you know, almost kind of political questions about what the point of sport is. I mean, the one point I do want to make and, you know, I think Arsenal obviously have their own mythology. They have a history of winning with style. They also have a history of losing with style very spectacularly. So I think they will, they will judge obviously that the end justifies the means. I mean, the one thing I do, you know, want to say is that people keep going about the product, right? People going, what is this doing for the product? And I think, you know, as a journalist, obviously you have to, you're covering the League and you have to have a certain measure of context. If you're like, if you're a fan or a, you know, even a player or what, why would you give the tiniest about the product? Like, of what, of what concern is it whether the Premier League is marketing itself, positioning itself in a crowded marketplace for the modern attention economy? I don't think that's any concern of yours. So I think a lot of this, I've written a column this morning about this whole declinism, footballing declinism, middle aged men just going, the game's gone. This isn't the football I grew up with. When actually if you look back at the, the long ball set piece, heavy cross heavy football of the, of the 80s, it actually kind of was the football you, you statistically grew up with. But I, I, yeah, I think that, that, I, that is all part of baiting Arsenal, I think. And Arsenal are very batable. They are the most batable club I think, possibly up there with Liverpool. And you know, they need to, they need to make their peace with this, that the entire apparatus of football that is not Arsenal is really heavily invested in Arsenal cocking this up.
- [17:08]
Robin Bairner
Yeah, John, I mean, this is the thing. But isn't this being perpetuated a little bit by the. By coaches? You know, Arne Slot was saying his football heart is, you know, is broken. And then you got Herzler saying they weren't playing football. I mean, is this, you know, are they concerned about the product, do we think.
- [17:25]
John Brewin
Well, Arne Slot's comments became a real hostage to fortune, didn't he, when his team then played like a drain at Molyneux. It's like, well, you know, you could have a bit of a say in this. And let's just say if the LMA have an end of season, do I don't. I wonder who sits next to Fabian Herzler. I get the impression he's not the most popular among his counterparts, don't you? I suspect a bit like the Arsenal fan that just wants to win the League. He doesn't really care about that. That's not. He's not here to make friends. And the disciplinary record, we knew about that when came from Sam Pauli, I think he was sent off four times in a season there. And he came over promising to behave himself. A promise he hasn't kept. But with Arsenal, Jonathan talked about how they had this history of winning with style. Well, again, I'm going to do it obvious. If you're of a different age, mine and Barry's age, then you remember a different Arsenal that won with a distinct lack of style, though it was a style in itself. I remember the Arsenal team of, you know, with the famous back five or whatever was a fascination in France. They couldn't believe this team that would just turn up and just bore themselves through UEFA Cups and all the rest of it because they were just. And a Cup Winners cup, but just, you know, like how, how good can you be at defending? How strong are these guys at doing the job? And that's what this current Arsenal are. I mean, listen, I don't ever use XG other than to make a point. Right. Okay. Because I'm not really an XG type of guy. But I did see that their XG for the first half was 0.01. Now if that's not making a statistical point, I don't know what is. And. But I don't know how that counts because Saka did take on that shot that could have sort of gone in and did. But I mean, Verbruggen made a. Made a hell of a mess of it. Listen, I suppose there's a few things Arsenal fans, if they win the League, they will celebrate Wildly. It will be one hell of a night. It'll be one hell of a summer. The rest of us are going to have to put up with it and, well, whatever, that's okay. That's fine. But I suppose one thing is that playing with style offers you a bit of a fig leaf at times, doesn't it? Because at least we played with style. At least. And if you only play to win and you don't win, that's when the brick bats come. That's when the criticize criticism comes. And that's what Arsenal. And that's the, I suppose the, the, the, the tightrope that Arsenal walking, playing that style of football. But it's, you know, to go back to old man cliches, grinding out a win away from home on a cold Wednesday night. That's how titles are won.
- [20:26]
Barry Glendenning
Anyway, can I just ask, if England go to the World cup and Bukayo Saka and Declan Rice are taking corners for England and England adopts the Arsenal approach to set pieces. Will all the people currently criticizing Arsenal be fully on board with England doing this if it starts to prove effective?
- [20:49]
Jonathan Liew
I made this exact point in my column this morning. The 2018 team, set pieces and, and whatever. But that's not how people, that's not how people decide their opinions.
- [20:58]
Robin Bairner
No, we'll be handing back the, the trophy to trump.
- [21:01]
John Brewin
The England team that won the 2003 World cup are regarded as probably the. The dullest team to win the Rugby World Cup. But, you know, the streets were filled of celebrations and wildness, even for those that weren't actually big rugby fans. So, you know, success is okay, but if you don't do it with style and you fall short, that's when the criticism comes, I suppose. And that's maybe a tightrope. England are gonna have to walk.
- [21:28]
Robin Bairner
Right, that'll do for part one. In part two, we'll do the rest of last night's action. Welcome Back to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly. Aston Villa 1, Chelsea 4. So two wins in nine now in the Premier League for Aston Villa. And it was sort of a story of a malfunctioning offside trap from a Villa perspective. And Joao Pedro with a hat trick, a really instinctive finisher. And there was quite a big moment, wasn't there, Barry, in this game when Ollie Watkins thought He'd made it 2:1. He was just a whisker offside. And then Joao Pedro, just before the break, managed to. Well, he was a whisker on side. I mean, you could say that that turned the game. But I think Aston Villa just looked ragged again.
- [22:18]
Barry Glendenning
Yeah, this was their heaviest home defeat in two years. I think it could have been a lot heavier. Four one flattered them a little. They're really missing John McGinn, Yuri Tillemans and Booby Car Kamara. Huge loss for them with those guys injured, but they're still well placed to finish in the top four. But they, they need to get going again because it's just one win in seven for them. I think their last two matches of this season are against Liverpool and Man City there. They could be really tough encounters. But unaimer is quite philosophical after the game. He, you know, admitted they were well beaten, admitted they're in a, a bit of a rush and, you know, you can't both admit that because it's quite obvious to everyone who's following their progress, but they need to just look at where they are in the table and, and try and regroup and get on with things. But this was all about Chelsea, I suppose, and all about Pedro, who's been a brilliant signing for them. And I think at the start of the season people were wondering, oh, who'd be Chelsea's first size striker? Him or Liam delap? And there's no question about who's first choice now.
- [23:46]
Robin Bairner
No, absolutely. Yeah. No, Unai Emery was very sanguine about this. He's, you know, still in their hands. They can wrestle this back despite this poor run. But I think Barry makes a really good point about Xiao Pedro, Johnny, because I feel like we don't. I feel like I certainly haven't appreciated just how good he is because Chelsea, you kind of, they're a bit of a banter club in terms of their transfers. But he's, I mean his instincts, his, his movement, he's a very intelligent player. Yeah.
- [24:12]
Jonathan Liew
I mean this scatter gun, this carpet bombing of signings which is. Is almost kind of overwhelming to take in, but obviously some of them are going, you know, occasionally one of them is just going to come really good. Cole Palmer was an example of that. Oh, wow. He's actually really good. Estebao as well, Pedro. I think it wasn't entirely clear whether he was going to, whether they went. They signed him as a 9 or 10 initially. I think he, he ended up playing 10 a lot because, because of Palmer's injury. But he, if you, if you watch him play, he gets into real, what I call real number nine positions. The way he anticipates the, the through ball just to be able to get that half yard on the Defender who's also obviously anticipating the through ball. He's quick, but he doesn't, you know, he doesn't rely on his speed. He's strong, but he doesn't rely on. On physicality and, and his finishing this season has been absolutely elite. I mean, this is, this is a guy who, yeah, who we weren't sure whether he was going to. To make that leap from Brighton and you know, six months on, they've. Chelsea have basically solved a problem that they've been trying to solve ever since Diego Costa left. That. That number nine position has been a real huge problem for them. You know, it was a Nicholas Jackson problem. It's a Liam Delap probably Delapse probably, you know, within 12 months. He's probably going to be on loan at Forest within. Within the year. So Pedro has, has just. Has managed to make that. That issue go away through, through sheer relentless excellence.
- [25:38]
Barry Glendenning
It's probably worth giving Alejandro Garnacho his flowers for this game as well because he was brilliant. He had Matty Cash on toast. But
- [25:49]
VRBoCare Advertisement
day or night, VRBoCare is here 247 to help make every part of your stay senior. If anything comes up or you simply need a little guidance, support is ready whenever you reach out. From the moment you book to the moment you head home. We're here to help things run smoothly because a great trip starts with the right support. And hey, a good playlist doesn't hurt either. With verbo care, help is always ready before, during and after your stay. We've planned for the plot twists, so support is always available because a great trip starts with peace of mind.
- [26:37]
Barry Glendenning
When he puts in a performance like that, it's almost infuriating, I'd say, if you're a Chelsea fan, because he does it so infrequently, you're going, but why don't you do this more often? You don't expect it every game. But he, he was outstanding last night as well.
- [26:54]
Robin Bairner
No, you're right. It just. Yeah, seems to be sort of one in every six or seven. That's the problem with Garnacho. But yeah, clearly, I mean, still, still a long way, you know, still very, very young and yeah, can. It can certainly improve that consistency. So aston Villa remaining fourth. Chelsea and Liverpool behind them on two points. And they are. And Manchester United in third after a very entertaining game at St James's Park. Newcastle 2 Manchester United 1. Jacob Ramsey sent off for a second bookable offense after a dive, sort of. But it looked like he wasn't really asking for anything. And then he Was given a yellow card. But despite that Newcastle managed to to get through this game. And I know Barney Ronne has alluded to this. But Michael Carrick looking more like a detective in a gritty crime drama set on the coast. By the day perhaps his best friend's daughter has gone missing and he owes him a favour. Even when Manchester United equalised it he still had that look. That thousand yard stare. And so John Carrick out first defeat. Now under his charge.
- [28:04]
John Brewin
Here's where the decline begins. Here's where we all.
- [28:08]
Robin Bairner
Darkness my old friend.
- [28:10]
John Brewin
Yeah. Here's where we reach for the criticism of Jim Ratcliffe. Jason Wilcox out. What a disgrace. One of the reasons Manchester United United lost it is because they were trying to win it at the end which they left themselves open for a Sula to score that fantastic goal. And it was a fantastic goal remember Actually he scored very early in the season a late goal for Newcastle against Liverpool and then was overshadowed by Unger Moa's late goal in. In you know an early season classic that we had. What a finish by the way. Brilliant goal. Michael Carrick of course remained impassive in the style of a detective in Midwestern. You know, us town. You know.
- [28:55]
Jonathan Liew
He.
- [28:56]
John Brewin
He and. And took the defeat really well. There was no Amarim style histrionics afterwards of digging out the players or anything like that. I suppose Michael Richards made a good point which is that United are asked to play over twice in a week and sagged a little bit with. With the. With having to do that. Casemiro you'd suspect probably isn't capable of playing two games in a week these days picking up a couple of injuries. But let's. Let's actually credit Newcastle for the grit. Kieran Trippier a manager's dream, isn't he? I mean Kieran Tripp is one of those players that you watch is either hurt himself hurting someone else or is down or is talking or is at it. You know that's. That's his game. And I think he. He sent Usula away for that goal. But before that he was. He was saying that he was injured and that his calf or something had given out and just. He's all action. I remember watching him play as a. As a youth player and that was what he was like then. He was just sort of. He's either. He's just always in the action and a few Newcastle players have felt that like a player who's obviously key to them staying up and key to their establishment that it was time up for him. But he's one of those players a bit like say Seamus Coleman for Everton and Ireland that you know, put him into a game and he'll do that job for you. He is. He's a warrior. And a Dan Byrne of course, is that, you know, the. The classic of that. And Newcastle dug it out. Credit to them. It's something that they've not done enough this season. You could see the relief on Eddie and Jason's face when afterwards, you know, they were trying to remain calm. And when the. When the final whistle came, there's just this great big gleam from Jason Tindall. He could only gleam. I suppose it was. It was, yeah. But you know, United, Manchester United I should say because of course is of course Newcastle United have a poor record at St. James. It's one of those places and it always seems to be played at night, that game. And it's always a big stormy occasion and that they fall foul there. And if there's anyone aside from Sunderland that Newcastle enjoy beating, it is what they call Manuel. So there you go. Credit to them. Great win. Brilliant goal.
- [31:24]
Robin Bairner
Yeah, I mean they did deserve it, didn't they? I mean they started really well and then you thought, oh maybe, maybe that it won't be their night because of the red card. But Anthony Gordon scored a penalty after Bruno Fernandez brought him down. And then, yes, that, that goal from, from William Azula. I mean the stepovers looked like he was trying to step over a particularly tall stile in a field. It was a bit. But the finish was there. The finish was there. He managed to get over it.
- [31:47]
Jonathan Liew
Sorry. What I do want to say about United and Carrick is that when Carrick took over there was a lot of stories coming out about how much more fun his training sessions were. The anonymous sources, anonymous dressing room sources were going to the sun and saying, look, Ruben made us do tactics. He would stop the sessions incessantly to move people around and do tactics. And Carrick doesn't make us do that. Carrick, his training sessions are shorter. They're really intense. They're like 60 to 75 minutes long and they're much, much more intense and he doesn't make us do boring tactics. And I find it interesting now a few weeks on that this really intense training sessions that last about 60 to 75 minutes have led to them conceding a lot of goals after the 60th to 75th minutes. So they can see that there was a late goal against Arsenal. There was 85th and 90th against Fulham. Now 90th against new half of the goals that they've conceded under Carrick have been after the 80th minute. They're in totally uncharted territory. Like, hang on, this game lost 90 minutes. I'm knackered. We haven't trained for this. But you know, I think personally that's why I think Carrick maybe hasn't. He's obviously done a lot of work on culture and tactics and basically getting the vibes right, getting the dressing room back on side. He doesn't seem to have done a lot of work on the longer term strategy, which suggests to me that there may be no longer term strategy, that maybe he doesn't want it. Maybe he's not really looking beyond these few weeks because what he seems to be doing, how he's training these players is exactly what you do if you're looking for a little short term burst of energy but you're not thinking too much about how it's going to pan out in the longer run.
- [33:37]
Robin Bairner
I mean, you couldn't blame him really given, given what's going on there. But. But yeah, so, yeah, a bit of a blow for Man United's European push. Newcastle, I mean realistically have nothing to play for on the league now go up to 12th but. But a great night for them. Onto Fulham. Nil. West Ham United. One huge win this for West Ham United. Somerville with the. The winner. Eight goals in 13 in 2026 now. And it seems, Barry, that Nuno, is a sort of, I don't know, a kind of striker whisperer sort of. He's working his magic that he, that he managed with Chris woods on Somerville now.
- [34:11]
Barry Glendenning
Well, I mean if West Ham needed anything, it's a striker whisperer. They could have done one with one about 20 years ago. And yeah, if, if that is his gift, then hold on to him for dear life. West Ham, I mean, they must have got a great boost when they saw the Fulham team sheet and Harry Wilson wasn't in it. That's. That would have definitely put a spring in the collective West Ham step. He was out with a foot injury apparently. I thought it deserves this win, to be honest. Fulham weren't great. West Ham were quite courageous in that they weren't prepared to settle for a draw. They tried to get the win and eventually they got the win and they had to rely on a sort of comedy mix up between Burnt Leno and Calvin Bassey to get their goal. But it was a well taken goal with Jared Bowen teeing up Somerville to, to score into a sort of empty net. And this is I think spurs fans will be watching this game with their heads in their hands. This is a terrible result for Spurs. It's a brilliant result for West Ham. I, for one, am delighted because I can't be the only person who thinks it would be absolutely hilarious if spurs relegated.
- [35:35]
Robin Bairner
Yeah, we have had word from our noble leader who's back in Australia, who just simply said spurs are after that. So, yeah, more on that later.
- [35:44]
Barry Glendenning
He also, he also texted me to tell me to. To buy a Euro millions ticket. So he might be planning on, you know, just fleeing. He's trying to get a war chest together.
- [35:58]
Robin Bairner
Yeah. We could join you on your post. England World cup victory. Ex. But yes, back to, back to. Back to this game. I mean, it could have gone either way, couldn't it? They both had penalty shouts turned down. Well, actually, it was given Fulham's one, but it was overturned by VAR players
- [36:18]
Jonathan Liew
like Juan Bissaka and Duif and who spent most of the season basically being condemned as not good enough. You know, we looked at this West Ham team and said, like, they are knocks in terms of individual quality good enough to stay up. But, but that's, you know, that's not always how it works. You know, the signing of Castellos has given them a lot of energy. I think it's given them a new dimension. Somerville is turning into their, you know, Carlos tevez. They're like 2007 Carlos Tevez. And, you know, I thought the goal, like, the goal looked like this kind of almost random, freakish piece of quasi football, but if you look at what actually happens, Jared Bowen, it's a long ball from Fernandez and Bowen chases it down and he's chasing down like it's basically a lost cause because obviously Leno's going to get there. There's a defender in the way. Why are you chasing this down? But it's the perfect metaphor for the West Ham mission. You are constantly chasing down this entirely hopeless cause. And Bowen's the perfect guy to do it as well. The guy who will chase down that cause all night. And, you know, just every so often it pays off and he wins the ball and Somerville puts it away. And I just thought that was a really telling symbolic moment of what it is to play for West Ham, to support West Ham, to just follow this walking zombie corpse all the way through to the end. And I can't, honestly, I can't believe they'll stay up. Which is exactly, I think, why they'll stay up.
- [37:50]
Robin Bairner
West Ham remain in the bottom three, but now level on points with Forest on 28. So a Bona fide relegation fight we have, which we haven't really had in the last couple of season. Now, on to tonight's game. Oh, when you don't have skin in the game, this is going to be absolutely glorious. Spurs against Palace. Macy says our spurs actually a social experiment on how much the human psyche can endure. And yeah, I mean, that's a good, good question. And I mean, the, the introduction I feel of Igor Tudor has really elevated the spurs social experiment as well. I mean, he's rode a little bit back on the criticism of every single aspect of his squad ahead of this one. He says, it's me sending a message to everyone that I do not accept the situation. We move on. We had a good but short period to prepare for the next game and I've seen the guys react really well. John, you're at Tudor's press conference yesterday. Your impressions of the man?
- [38:47]
John Brewin
Well, people say he's aggressive, but I'd say he's more, more passive aggressive in a fairly.
- [38:55]
Jonathan Liew
He.
- [38:56]
John Brewin
He's actually quite good company in a way. And you could. I. I ended up teeing up, you know, how much pressure do you get are you feeling at the moment? And he said, oh, well, seven. And I was like, what, seven out of ten? He's like, oh, never said how many it's out of and all this. So he's slightly playful with it. He. He's. He's over. I think I got the impression that someone had told him not to completely keep digging out the players in the fashion he did. But he still did say that this is probably the biggest problems that he's ever had when he's gone into rescue club. So, you know, the players were talking to each other and it seems to suggest that that's, that's a good thing. It's. He's in such a difficult position. There were wild and crazy rumors that this is his final game in charge, which I think is absolutely crazy. And if that does happen, that's actually, that's not actually Igor Tudor's fault. That's the people that run Tottenham's fault. If that happens, they've made a completely wrong choice. He's just like, well, eventually we'll have to work out and find the solution. At no point did he say, I've got the solution to this. He spent a lot of time talking about the players that were injured, which probably tells you that he, he holds out hope that some of them might return. Just, just spurs at the heart of spurs. And I find this there's been such a complacency at that club. There's been such a complacency that this was the club that wanted to be met. A member of the Super League that just thought by hiring big name managers that could become part of, remain part of the elite and then, you know, they actually win a trophy and. But, but pay. It seems to pay. And I've sacked the manager. But then just thought, okay, can we can just reset as a top six club again and, you know, back we go. But that can't just happen and it hasn't happened. And players, they have are not fit for what they're supposed to be doing. And even the better players are either too young, in the case of, say, Bergwell and Archie Gray, or, or flawed in the case of Romero and Mickey Van de Ven. It's just, it's a mess and it's a, it's a lesson to everybody that you just can't try and get away with it. And that seems to be what they've done. And then at the heart of the club we had the change of Daniel Levy and then we don't even know. I think someone was saying the other day that the people that actually own the club aren't even on the, the directors list or anything like that. It's just a complete mess. And it's of their own making. And if you're a Tottenham fan, you're paying all that money, you're just looking at it going, how did we get in this mess? Igor Tudor cannot be held responsible for the state that Tottenham are in at the moment. And I think he knows that. And I think he knows that eventually he'll get a bonus if they stay up, but I don't think he'll be staying next season. You know, no one's clamoring for Igor to stay, probably least of all the players, you know. But anyway, that game against Palace. Yeah, massive. I mean, who, who would have thought that Spurs v Crystal palace would be the game of the season that we all want to watch? But it feels like it, doesn't it? It feels like. It feels like, yeah. Oh, God, I can't miss this one. Can I cancel all plans tonight? Yeah, all right. I'm staying in for that one.
- [42:14]
Robin Bairner
Well, because also palace have Oliver Glassner who seems to be on a knife edge the whole time as well. But Johnny, your perspective as, as the, as the spurs fan here, how, how has it come to this? I mean, how much you that. Do you agree with, John?
- [42:26]
Jonathan Liew
I, I agree with, well, pretty Much all of it. I mean with, with I guess a little bit of. A little bit of a company and gallows humor. Lots of. Anyone got spare to. To QPR away on the group chats next season, I think it would be marvelous, absolutely fantastic if spurs had a season in the championship. And I, as. As part of, you know, kind of research for this, I was looking up West Ham's 20023 season because I think, you know, that they were pretty much the, the, like the best team. And certainly in terms of points, I think they went down with 42 points. But also in terms of, in terms of quality, you know, and, and you look at a squad that, that has, you know, Freddie Canute and Jermaine Defoe and Joe Cole and Michael Carrick and Trevor Sinclair and. And Lee Bowyer and you think how. How did you go down? And I think people will look at this spurs team and, and look at the quality in it. I think how. How did you do it? How did you end up with 12 points from 19 games? And they're going to like, like if they carry on. On their trajectory on this. This. They've been relegation form since about November, like, and, and well, relegated as well. Not even close. It's got, it's got to the point where they actually have to turn things around now. I think they, they can't rely on West Ham dropping points and Forest dropping points. They have to. I think they have to believe that they're going to probably need four or five wins to. To. To keep themselves up. Otherwise that's. That that's going to be it for them. And if that doesn't. If that doesn't induce a sort of sense of mission and resolve that is going to keep them up that I don't know what is, to be honest, because there's, there's just nothing happening there. The patient, the patient is basically dead on the slab and it's, it's. It's like defibrillation time.
- [44:13]
Barry Glendenning
It's.
- [44:13]
Jonathan Liew
It's clear and you're plugging the wires together.
- [44:16]
Robin Bairner
Oh, it's just too delicious, isn't it? Yeah. Put the kids to bed early. Open a bowl. Lincoln.
- [44:21]
Jonathan Liew
Lincoln City against Tottenham is going to be a league game next season. A League game between Lincoln and Tottenham.
- [44:30]
Robin Bairner
It will be Friday night on Sky Sports. EFL and I will be watching. Yeah, wonderful stuff, everyone. That'll do part two. In part three, we'll preview the FA cup and talk KSI becoming a shareholder at Dagenham and Redbridge
- [44:47]
VRBoCare Advertisement
with Verbo care help is Always ready before, during and after your stay. We've planned for the plot twists so support is always available because a great trip starts with peace of mind. Support is available 247 with VRBoCare. We're here day or night, ready whenever you need help because a great trip starts with the right support.
- [45:26]
Robin Bairner
Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly. So, yes, the FA cup returns this weekend. Wolves against Liverpool again at Molyneux on Friday. And then on Saturday we have Mansfield against Arsenal, Wrexham against Chelsea, Newcastle against Manchester City. Barry, any. Any of those really tickle your fans? There's quite a few interesting ties there.
- [45:47]
Barry Glendenning
Yeah. I've had a feeling for a long time that Wrexham are either going to win the FA cup or get promoted to the Premier League this season. They're at home to Chelsea Saturday night. Obviously we'll have all the Hollywood nonsense. Given how good they were last night. I would not be at all surprised if Chelsea were an absolute dog's breakfast on Saturday at the racecourse. They should win. No idea what kind of team Lemur Sr Will pick, but that is obviously an interesting tie given the Wrexham story. I presume everyone wants Mansfield to beat Arsenal because it's a classic giant killer fair and they're at home. But Arsenal, whatever team they put out, should be more than good enough to beat them. You never know. Yeah, the Wolves. Liverpool one's a bit. Meh.
- [46:40]
John Brewin
Don't.
- [46:40]
Barry Glendenning
Don't really care who wins that. I mean, Wolves should be going all out to try and win the. The FA cup. But they probably won't win it, you know, because they probably won't be good enough to win it. But who knows?
- [46:54]
John Brewin
I'm going to that one, Barry. So I'm glad you really teed it up for me.
- [47:00]
Barry Glendenning
Well, I think it's. It's obviously the least interesting of.
- [47:04]
John Brewin
Yeah, oh, I'm sorry.
- [47:05]
Barry Glendenning
I forgot about Newcastle, man. City. That's beautiful. Newcastle should be going all out to try and win the FA cup as well.
- [47:12]
John Brewin
I was thinking the results this. This week meant that Rob Edwards won't rest players for the. The relegation. What was his decision over resting players for the Premier League? Because Wolves are probably cooked by now. I mean, funny enough, when I was at Tottenham, a few of the. The sort of cub reporters there. We're trying to work out how many points Wolves can get because they were now considered a threat to Tottenham in. In the relegation belt. You mentioned Wrexham. I don't know. Did we do this story about how Ryan Reynolds and Robert Mack, as we have to call him these days, are going to be doing their and it's probably not good news for you this Robin doing their football commentary debut during Wrexham's match with Swansea on Sky. You can listen to them commentating. They've asked for the BLEEP button because they're wild and crazy guys. I mean you can imagine my thoughts on this. I, I probably don't.
- [48:14]
Robin Bairner
This is another game's gone moment, isn't it? And I for one hope they totally mess this up and awful obviously in my interests but I mean it might be really good. I think it could be good and this, I think this might be the where it's going actually. You know TNT had, they kind of dabbled with it in the Women's FA Cup. They had comedian Maisie Adam and I think her podcast pal Susie Ruffle doing a little bit of the commentary or it might be on sky actually. So yeah it's, you know these experiments are there.
- [48:45]
John Brewin
So TNT had Noel Gallagher, didn't they when City got good by sporting Lisbon and Noel didn't say a word in the second half. It was great listening actually. It was it.
- [48:58]
Robin Bairner
So the Saturday ties look, look fairly good ties. Fulham against Southampton, Port Vale against Sunderland. Yeah great for Port Vale after they, they beat Bristol City in midweek. And I mean this feels like a big opportunity for Sunderland actually Barry to make the quarterfinals of the competition.
- [49:18]
Barry Glendenning
It is a big opportunity and it's also I'm looking at it and thinking it's one they could very well lose. So and obviously the, the people's choice will be Portville to win that they're at home. I guess Regis Lebrill give a chance to fringe players although he doesn't really have much of a choice at the moment because Sunderland have quite a few people out injured. But that's ripe for an upset. But Sunderland should win it. I'm drawing Leeds. Norwich is clearly the least interesting of all the the ties I think but it's a Daniel Far Derby there. So that, that's the, the main talking point there, isn't it?
- [50:03]
Jonathan Liew
Sam Byram Derby. You know there's a few snob John
- [50:07]
Robin Bairner
Nome just thought Leeds and Norwich would be a well trodden path.
- [50:10]
John Brewin
Robert Snodgrass Good stuff.
- [50:12]
Robin Bairner
Good knowledge. Yeah. On Monday West Ham against Brenford. I mean neither side will be another
- [50:18]
Jonathan Liew
of those Friday to Monday deals as well. Yeah it's like a, like a really Nations League. I, I, I don't know. It's not. Yeah we talked about Wrexham and you know it's not for me it's Not, I don't find it interesting or I'm not going to talk it, you know, the FA cup. It's. I, I plan other stuff for, you know, on FA cup weekend because it just holds very little interest for me. But that's just me.
- [50:39]
Robin Bairner
Well, occasionally it's gone from Thursday to Tuesday I think sometimes. So yeah, just be, just be grateful that it's just the four day spread this time around.
- [50:46]
Jonathan Liew
It's a disgrace.
- [50:47]
Robin Bairner
Well, talking of a disgrace, KSI has. Well, as you know, that's a bit harsh. That's a bit harsh, isn't it? So he has taken over at Dagenham. His money is from YouTube subscribers. So 17 million.
- [51:00]
Jonathan Liew
He's got, look, I mean I, I watched him, I remember watching this would have been like 10, 12 years ago watching him. He played FIFA. That's how he got famous. He played FIFA on his YouTube channel and he was very entertaining. You could watch him play FIFA and he would just scream and shout and gesticulate and people, people flocked to him. Young, young, young people liked to watch this guy go nuts playing FIFA. And then came, you know, the, the rap, the rap career, the music like career, the, the business investments. He, he, you know, this, like this energy drink, this prime energy drink. That's him. There was the boxing. He's symptomatic of this era. Era, right, where if you can get people's eyeballs, that is basically the currency of the world these days. Everything from politics to sport to the media. Your metric is how many people can you get to look at you. And if you're good at that, if you're skilled, and he undoubtedly is, he's a genius at that kind of stuff, then you're qualified to do anything somehow. You can be, you know, you could be a football commentator, you can be a football owner, you can box, you can, you can make, make drinks to sell us. The, the world will just reward you in endless ways. And so, you know, I don't, I, I don't, you know, condone or con. No, I do condemn this because I, I think it's a, it's, it's a really morally redundant world that we've created. But that is, that is what he is. He's the guy who could, who can play this world and who embodies it better than anyone else. And just the doors will swing open because everyone is after that, that essential currency. How do we get young people, how do we get young people to, to watch this thing and, and everyone is trying to crack this code and he's cracked it. And you know, he has the keys.
- [52:43]
Robin Bairner
Producer Joel has asked, how do we get those eyeballs? And I will tell you, Barry, live streaming, your jog. They're gonna come in their millions. Are we going for a run today?
- [52:53]
Barry Glendenning
Yeah.
- [52:54]
John Brewin
Yeah.
- [52:57]
Robin Bairner
Those sound too enthusiastic.
- [53:00]
Barry Glendenning
I'm not enthusiastic. I hate it. It's really unpleasant. And, yeah, people keep telling me, oh, you learn to love it and. Nah, it's not. I just hate it every time. It's not too long today, though. It's only. I think it's only four and a half miles today, only in inverted commas, but yeah, that's a nice short one these days.
- [53:23]
Robin Bairner
Yeah, it's very impressive though, Barry. And even more impressive, we've just learned the totalizer is over 44 grand at the time.
- [53:30]
Barry Glendenning
Wow.
- [53:31]
Robin Bairner
I mean, it's quite incredible, the pressure
- [53:34]
Barry Glendenning
on this man, the generosity. But it's not generosity, it's. It's vindictiveness. And I. I can see through these people with their generosity. And every penny of that 4,44 grand is going to. Towards sick children. And I begrudge them every penny of it. I should be getting at least half.
- [53:58]
Robin Bairner
Give me that drip. If you want to. If you want to contribute, just search Barry Glendenning on Justgiving. And that'll do for today. Thank you very much, Barry. And, well, I won't say enjoy. Endure the run.
- [54:14]
Barry Glendenning
I will indeed. Yes. Thank you.
- [54:16]
Robin Bairner
Thank you so much, Johnny.
- [54:18]
Jonathan Liew
Cheers, Robin.
- [54:19]
Robin Bairner
And thank you to John.
- [54:21]
John Brewin
Thanks for having me, Robin.
- [54:24]
Robin Bairner
Our hero returns on Monday. Max will be back live from his shed in Melbourne. Probably.
- [54:28]
Barry Glendenning
I thought I was the hero for all my good work for charity that I don't like to talk about, but somehow managed to mention every week without fail.
- [54:38]
Robin Bairner
Yeah, no, absolutely. You hate to talk about it. And Max hates to talk about how little sleep he gets as a father of two. I'm sure that won't be mentioned as he. Yeah. Returns to his shed in Melbourne. Yeah, probably on about three hours sleep, but he has had a very long flight, which. Which is wonderful. Solitude. Football Bleakly is produced by Tayo Popula and Jesse Howard, and our executive producer is Joel Grove.
- [55:08]
VRBoCare Advertisement
With Verbocare. Help is always ready before, during and after your stay. We've planned for the plot twists, so support is always available because a great trip starts with peace of mind.