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How Marcas Grant Uses the Waiver Wire to Win Fantasy Championships | The Pretend GM Podcast
01:05:42
On this episode of The Pretend GM, Alfredo was joined by Marcas Grant to discuss everything about fantasy football, his favorite strategies to win championships, and how to use the waiver wire. Subscribe to the Podcast: - Apple: - Spotify: ...
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- [00:00]
Marcus Grant
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Podcast Host
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Marcus Grant
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Podcast Host
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- [01:00]
Marcus Grant
So what are we having for launch? Dude, work here is done.
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Podcast Host
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Marcus Grant
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Podcast Host
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Marcus Grant
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Podcast Host
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Marcus Grant
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- [01:30]
Podcast Host
If you're not aware, I'm speaking with Marcus Grant. You should be looking at the title of this episode. But Marcus, you're referring to there's now the merger between ESPN and NFL. Man. I mean like obviously I know there's things you can't say, but how, what's, what's the feeling right now? I know from a lot of people on the outside looking in, it's just like wow, feels like Disney's everywhere now.
- [01:55]
Marcus Grant
Disney is everywhere right now. And I say this to somebody who works part time already for Disney out here in LA. I part time work for ESPN 710 in Los Angeles. So I've already sort of, you know, been hand in hand with the mouse for a little while. Gotta say, lands a pretty good perk, especially when you have a six year old son. It's a really good perk. I was. As for the merger, it's interesting. I think there's a lot of mixed feelings because those of us who've been with the NFL for a while, it's been rumored for the last four or five years. I think for a lot of us, it dragged on to the point of, like, we just want something to get done, you know, like, we were tired of. Of monitoring Andrew Marchand's Twitter feed to find out news about what was happening with our company. So now that it's happened, you know, I think there's a sense of relief that, okay, at least the rumor part of this is done. You know, I would admit there's definitely some uncertainty, because right now it's so new. There's not a lot of concrete answers as to what's going to happen. But I think everybody at this point is just kind of ready to move forward and ready for whatever this new chapter is going to be with espn.
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Podcast Host
Yeah, man. I mean, I'm sure it's exciting. I'm sure there's a little bit of nerves there, too. Just like anything. Like, there's a bunch of differences. You said you're moving. Where are you headed to?
- [03:12]
Marcus Grant
You don't understand. I'm standing sound. I'm not moving far from where I currently live. But, you know, again, school kids trying to find a good school district in a good school. So, you know, moving sucks, man.
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Podcast Host
Yeah, I just did it. I just did it, like, four months ago. It's a nightmare.
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Marcus Grant
If you ever want to find out how much useless crap you have, pack it all up and move it somewhere else. So. So that is. That is the journey my wife and I are going through right now, man.
- [03:42]
Podcast Host
And moving is like. I know. It's like, it's. It's sometimes good because you clean out all the crap that you didn't want. For me and my wife, it ended up being a thing where we realized how different we are in terms of. I wanted to throw away everything. And she was like, well, we're probably gonna need that at some point. Just. Just. Just a nightmare. Just an absolute nightmare.
- [04:03]
Marcus Grant
I've lost track of how many trips to Goodwill I've made so far. And I'm gonna make plenty, plenty more. We're sort of downsizing, too. We're going to a little bit of a smaller house. And I'm like, I feel like this is good. We can clear out things we don't use. My wife's like, I don't know. I'm so worried about it like, I'm like, look, there are things we've got in like this garage that we haven't touched in three years. Like, if we haven't touched it in three years, we could probably let it go.
- [04:26]
Podcast Host
That's, that's a general, just good, general rule of life. Three years, no use. Let's get it out of here. But man, I'm so happy that you're joining me here today. This, this, this whole project, this idea of the pretend GM has been to connect fantasy football players with the analysts that do this for a living and try to bridge that knowledge gap, so to speak. And not that like, oh, we are so smart and we know everything, but it's just like what goes into the day to day of like, why we think the way we do and, you know, a peek behind the curtain that, that person that's just playing in their, their home league with their friends, you can be just as good at this and be able to look at the game the same way. And so, like, the first thing that I know that I always hear from people is, oh, man, you got to be watching every game and you've got to be on, on every single waiver wire and every single this and that. And how many leagues are you in? That's so many leagues. How do you find the time? So I know with you, your husband, your dad, you do a bunch of other things outside of football. How do you find the time for this? I know it's your job, right? So you kind of have to. But how do you find the time?
- [05:31]
Marcus Grant
I will say that it's become a lot more challenging since I have become a husband and a father. You know, back before, like when I started this job at the NFL way back in 2011, I was a single dude living in a one bedroom apartment. And so, like, I would work and I'd come home from work at the office and, you know, I make dinner, maybe watch an hour of tv and then I would just start grinding stats and, you know, watching games and that sort of thing. I have sort of learned how to manage my time a little bit more, right. Obviously, Sundays, Mondays, Thursdays, I'm watching games, I'm watching as much as I possibly can. What I have sort of learned now because, you know, I still want to spend time with my. I want to be married and still have a child at the end. It's really nice, you know, so what I've learned is to sort of prioritize, like things to watch and things to research, right? Like where once upon a time When I, you know, live by myself, I probably would use, you know, I'd use like the NFL stuff, like, you know, the. I'm like, why am I calling it game pass? But whatever, I'd watch, I'd watch the condensed games. You know, I'm a bad employee. I can't remember the name of our products, but whatever, I would watch like the condensed games and go through like every single thing, every single game in a particular week. Like now I will tend to watch the games. Like, if I didn't get to see it, I will watch a game that I feel like has more broad fantasy relevance. Right. Games where there are guys that, you know, are a bunch across, you know, that people have across a bunch of their teams. So, you know, I will try to watch every game, but I'm not necessarily going to lock in on a ton of Browns games, for instance, right. Like, I'm not going to lock in, I'm not going to lock in at a bunch of Titans games. I will, you know, I would definitely make sure I catch a couple across this the course of the season. Because you want to see how guys are performing. You definitely want to see if guys are improving or, or getting worse or what have you. But I'm not, you know, I'm not going to lie to you. I'm not going to sit here and see all 17 Titans games this year, right? So it's about prioritizing, it's about managing time. It's also just about realizing that, you know, from August to January or February, the hours are just a little bit longer. So I, you know, I work during the day, I do shows, I write columns, I do podcasts. But I do make time to come home and have dinner and like, you know, do bedtime with my kids. So sometimes that means, you know, it's, it's after 10 o', clock, it's after 11 o' clock, and I'm, I'm still grinding things. So, you know, you figure it out. I always tell people, especially now, this will be season 15 for me at the NFL. Thanks. I, I am sort of like that NFL veteran who, like, I know, I know how to get my body in shape for training camp, right? Like, I'm not gonna be like that, you know, young rookie or second year guy who's just grinding like crazy and hitting the weight room and doing all this off season training. Like, I know enough to get myself in shape for when the preseason starts and week one comes around. I think I've just, I've just figured that out after all these years.
- [08:39]
Podcast Host
But I think the, the thing you were referencing was that NFL Pro.
- [08:45]
Marcus Grant
That'S definitely a good thing, for sure. But yeah, I mean, no free ads, by the way.
- [08:49]
Podcast Host
But you know, we'll, we'll do that for you.
- [08:51]
Marcus Grant
That's fine. I appreciate it. NFL plus, it's, you know, you guys know what I'm talking about. You can watch all the games. You know, it's like Red Zone. It's got stuff, game replays, like, all that, all that kind of stuff, you know?
- [09:02]
Podcast Host
Yeah, that's something that I've, like, tried to use because, like, you, obviously, you can't watch every single game all at the same time. You end up, you're watching Red Zone, you'll get the highlights, but you can't watch every single thing. And then all of a sudden, a guy pops off for 30 points and you've never heard of him. You're like, oh, to go watch that now and figure that out. And like, so that, that could be a good resource for the people watching or listening. Sure. But you know what I think is always fun to do is try to see, like, where we, where we kind of connect with the people that are consuming our content. Because there's always a time where, like, I'll ask everyone, what's something from your background that you people wouldn't expect, but ends up being something that totally shapes how you approach fantasy football? Like, what's maybe a skill set you have or an experience that you had that changes the way you look at this game? And then there's always someone that goes, oh, same thing here. I, I just like that. And they, they relate to you so easy. What's that one thing for you?
- [09:54]
Marcus Grant
I think it's, it's being a guy who, like, I wasn't, before I started this job, like, I wasn't like some football die hard, some football junkie. Like, I watched the NFL, I enjoyed it. I, I grew up in Northern California as a 49er fan. Like, I, I, I grew up in the heyday of, like, Joe Montana, Steve Young, Jerry Rice. Like, it was a good time to be a 49er fan at that point, but I was never like, a football junkie. So like, even now, as I come to this job and I do this, I'm not a, I'm not a tape grinder, right? I'm not out here doing X's and O's, right? Like, I, Matt Harmon is one of my good friends, right? Like, that dude grinds tape. He's watching live.
- [10:31]
Podcast Host
He is a tape.
- [10:32]
Marcus Grant
He really is. He really is. I'm not. I'm not a spreadsheet warrior, right? Like, I'm not one of those guys who's building algorithms. I feel like what I want to do is sort of connect with everybody. Who else is like that, right? Because, like, most people who play fantasy don't have that kind of time. I try to come to this from the aspect of, like, I want to learn all these things, right? Like, I read all the people who do these things and I follow them, I watch them, I try to learn from them every day. And I feel like my job is to kind of distill all of that and explain it to people who are just sort of, you know, from like the Die Hards to the casuals, right. Like, I think. I think part of what I've learned working at the NFL is that we have a wide user base, right? So we've got the hardcore folks, you know, who are looking at next gen stats and grinding that kind of stuff. But we have a lot of people who just play, like, in an office league or a home league, and they don't. They just don't want to look like, you know, jerks, you know, in their. Their respective leagues. I mean, like, I. My wife played for a number of years, right? And so I'm like, how do I explain this to her? Because, you know, she doesn't care about yards per route run, but, like, how can I explain to her why she should, you know, why she should draft Jacoby Myers in the late rounds or something? I'm just making. I'm just pulling names out of. Out of the thin air right now. But, you know, it's. It's. So I think that is sort of my. My lane that I've tried to stay in is just being that guy who can explain things to everybody and sort of, you know, incorporate everybody in. I think some of it is just, you know, I spent years in radio before I got here, and just being able to talk to a wide audience about a variety of subjects I think has sort of, you know, helped me kind of stay in this lane where I don't necessarily live in one world or the other, but try to marry them as best as possible.
- [12:26]
Podcast Host
Man, I love that you said that you did radio. I got to do radio for a little bit. I started out as a intern, then producer, and then I got to take a little thing on the side side. But it truly makes. You have to, like, rethink how you say things. It's almost like being a teacher, right? Like, just because you have it one way in your head doesn't mean you can get it out to people. And it's like, it's so important to be relatable. And with this, we are taking game. Like you said, there's spreadsheets and data, and there's people who know what they're watching when they're watching the games. And. And like, if you can't make it relatable, it almost doesn't matter. You're not a very good analyst if you can't make the information comprehensible to the people that are trying to get this from you. So let's do this to make this as simple as possible for someone that's watching or listening. If you had a. Not that there's. We can ever break it down to just one thing, but if you had a one general rule of thumb from Marcus Grant on fantasy football, something I'd put in the thumbnail with your face and look all fancy, what would that rule be?
- [13:22]
Marcus Grant
Draft good players.
- [13:25]
Podcast Host
That's a pretty good one.
- [13:26]
Marcus Grant
I'm not going to draft good players. I think, honestly, I think. I think the simplest thing is draft players. And I mean, it's going to sound simplistic and it's going to be kind of an offshoot of that, but draft players on teams that score a lot of points, right? I mean, like, I think. I think that's kind of what it comes down to. And like, we break it down into different stats and metrics and all these sorts of things, but essentially what it is is the players that tend to help you win in fantasy, they are usually coming from offenses that score a lot of points. They move up and down the field, they pick up a lot of yards. Because in its essence, the game is simple. You want guys that catch the football or run the football, that pick up a lot of yards and that find the end zone. That's really what it is. And everything else that we use to analyze basically just gets you to that end game. I know that for people who don't necessarily play fantasy or who care for fantasy, there's a lot of people out there who watch football who don't care for fantasy. That's fine, whatever. I always try to explain to them that what we do, that our podcast, our TV shows, whatever, we're just a football show, and we're just talking about football the way a lot of other people talk about football. The difference with our stuff is that at the end of all of our analysis, we basically say, and that's why you should Start him this week. That's pretty much what it is. So for all of the, like, the highfalutin numbers that we put out there, it basically just comes down to, man, hey, man, the Bengals are probably going to score a lot of points this year. Like, you should try and draft as many Bengals as you can.
- [15:00]
Podcast Host
Yeah. Honestly, I'm a per. Such a big believer in vibes still matter in the NFL. Like, as much as we love data and film and all these other things that are. Are tangible. Right. And I think that's what a lot of people get stuck on, is you need the tangibility of it. But there, there's. This is still a game with people and emotions and things that are out of our control. And so the intangibles really matter. So, like saying this is a good player on a good team, the vibes are great over there. Like, that's actually a real thing. Right? Like, like, I. We'll see. This is going to release mid season, so it could end up being totally wrong. But, like, a lot of people have been worried about the vibes of the Miami Dolphins, you know, the team that I root for. And it's just like, okay, mid season, let's find out where we're at. It's good players on a good offense, but we, we just don't know. And when I, when I think of that, I think back to, like, when I first started playing fantasy football, where it was as simple as get good players on good teams and good situations that they're going to score. Like, I remember saying, man, Calvin Johnson, he's going to catch a bunch of touchdowns. He's got a good quarterback and he's an incredibly talented player. I'm going with him in round one and then round two on the way back. I really like that Marshawn lynch fella. He's probably going to score a lot of touchdowns, and it was so simple, but I'd find myself winning league. So if you could rewind back to when Marcus Grant first started playing fantasy football, what has changed in the way that you view the game from then to now?
- [16:21]
Marcus Grant
Well, it's very simple, first of all, because I'll tell you, like, my first fantasy experience, I was a freshman in college way back in the late 1900s.
- [16:32]
Podcast Host
You called it the late 19.
- [16:33]
Marcus Grant
The late 1900s, when I first started playing fantasy, I actually shared a team with. With my roommate. I was working at the student radio station like it was. The commissioner was one of the seniors on the staff and he needed, you know that a couple spaces open so me and a roommate shared the last space and we would. My very first draft pick in fantasy football, and you're a Dolphins fan, was Dan Marino, right? Which nowadays, if you like, I spent my first pick on a quarterback, you get laughed out of the room. Like back then, back then, like we had an evolved draft strategy to that point, right? And so, like, we looked at it as, hey, man, Dan Marino throws a lot of touchdowns, he throws for a lot of yards, he's gonna score a lot of points. And like, it just made sense. People drafted quarterbacks in the first round. Like that was, that was, you know, it wasn't a big deal. Like, obviously now all these years later, like, you would warn everybody against that. In fact, if you heard people who were saying that, you're like, can I, can I be in your league? Because I want to, you know, I want to draft against you. I mean, so I think that part of it, like, we have obviously evolved strategy and stuff a long way. I think the biggest part of it. So I think. But I think part of how that's evolved is the democratization of fantasy football. And the Internet has gone a long way toward that. Because also part of my experience when I first played, I'm going to let you know right now, I'm going to use a whole lot of old timey words when I talk about my fantasy football experience. Oh, boy. When we set our lineups, we had to use a telephone and call our commissioner's answering machine and tell him, so this is, you know, hey, we want to start this guy at quarterback and this guy at running back and wide receiver and blah, blah, blah.
- [18:17]
Podcast Host
Would you send a fax?
- [18:19]
Marcus Grant
So he would send a fax with these stats, like at the end of the week. Like if we, like if we woke up on Sunday morning and you found out, you know, that one of your guys that was a scratch for whatever reason, like you'd have to get back on the phone before kickoff and be like, hey, we need you to take this guy out of the lineup. Put this guy back in the lineup. The other part of that is you didn't know who your opponent started. You could sort of look at their roster and maybe, you know, maybe guess, you know, you got like, look at the Ross. Be like, okay, they're probably starting this guy, this guy, that's guy, whatever. But you didn't know for sure. And then for us, part of it was that because our commissioner lived off campus, you know, he might not get us the stats right away. You know, it might be Wednesday or Thursday. Sometimes before we got station stats, it's like, it was like whenever he was on campus and available to kind of drop them off, it. It sometimes felt like a drug deal. Like, he would call. He would pull up to the front of my dorm and, like, would call my room, be like, hey, I. I got the stats. And, like, I would run outside and he'd roll down the window of his car and he'd hand me a packet and I'd run back inside and we would. We would, like, dig over them. But, like, you know, a lot of times we would look. I would get. I would get the LA Times on a Monday morning or Tuesday morning, and we'd go through the box score. We would try to kind of hand calculate what our. Our score totals were for the week. You know, so, like, you really had to want it to play fantasy football back then. So nowadays, like, you know, if. If I get a tweet from somebody because, like, the app glitched and, like, they've had to wait seven minutes for their Saquon Barkley touchdown. I'm like, hey, man, sympathy there. I'm like, relax, bro. Like, you're gonna be fine. It's gonna be okay. But. But I think because the Internet made it so much more accessible, obviously it brought a lot more people in, and it. It brought a lot more people who think about the game and are trying to basically solve for X within the game. So, you know, the Internet's gone a long way toward changing literally everything we know about. You know, what essentially started off as Dungeons and Dragons for sports nerds.
- [20:20]
Podcast Host
I've never heard anyone call it Dungeons and Dragons for sports nerds. I love it so much. Just D and D for. I. I love what you said about it being accessible, because that's the first thing I started to think of is just like, going back to how you said, like, it was something that if you were playing, it's because you loved it because you had to take so many steps each week and you were just really grinding it out. But now it's become so accessible. Not in a bad way, like, in a good way. There's so many people playing it. Like, I don't think we. There's as many jobs in this market if it's not as accessible as it is. Like, we're probably not doing this. There's probably like six people doing it in the entire world. But with that, I think also just becomes, I would say, a greater spectrum of error with more players. Obviously. There's just. There's more different ways that people play and more common mistakes and more like more beginners just starting out. So what would you say to someone who's just starting out? Because, I mean, we see a lot of these common mistakes that happen. And then someone will jump into fantasy football and make like six of those common mistakes in their very first season and be like, okay, well, don't do that again. Got it. So what are the most common mistakes you see happening?
- [21:31]
Marcus Grant
I mean, honestly, I think, you know, it is still. People still draft quarterbacks probably too early. You know, I. I think, I mean, I always say this especially for analysts. For people like us who do this for a living, I always remind them, like, jump in a home league or jump in a league with, with, you know, folks who are a little more casual and, like, see how they draft. We're so used to doing these expert drafts where, you know, it's almost like a game of chicken to see who's going to take the first quarterback.
- [22:01]
Podcast Host
A lot of times, dude, I'm telling you. We just did an episode, we were talking about ADP, and I referenced that Drake Mays, ADP is in the 10th or 11th round. And then I looked at an industry league draft. I did this last week where he went in round 14. It's like, you're 100% right. It's just playing chicken. It's not even close to what the average consumer is doing.
- [22:22]
Marcus Grant
Right, exactly. So you play in a league just full of just, you know, like a regular office. An office league that doesn't, you know, center around football or something like that. And like, there might be four quarterbacks gone by the end of the second round, depending on, like, how the league sets up. So, I mean, that's definitely a mistake people make. I think people will make the mistake of drafting, trying to fill out all their starting roster spots, like, at the beginning, right? Feeling like, okay, I got my. I got my running backs and I got my wide receiver quarterback. Like, you know, you'll see people who are like, okay, well, I got to fill out my kicker and my defense spot, right? And so it's like, you know, the ninth or 10th round and somebody's taking a kicker, right? So I think, you know, whatever. A defense, right? Like, oh, yeah, I got to get my defense. So I'm going to take the Eagles defense here in round 10. Like, you don't. You don't have to do that. But I think that's sort of how people operate. Then I'll fill in my bench spots afterwards. That's how it works, right? So I think it's stuff like that. But while, you know, you try to warn people against stuff like that, what I always tell people, especially who are doing it the first time, is you're going to make mistakes. I mean, we've done this for years, and every now and then we still make draft mistakes, right? There are things that. There are things that we do, like in the moment, right? You pick a player in the moment, you're like, ugh, why did I do that? We still do that. So I tell people, don't be afraid to make mistakes, first of all, but make it an experience that's going to be enjoyable, right? And sometimes, sometimes that means drafting players you like or avoiding players from teams you don't like. I going back to my first ever fantasy league, right? I was, one of the people in our league was the girlfriend of the commissioner, and she was from the Boston area, and she really didn't know anybody outside of Patriots players. And so she drafted. You know, this is at the time, too, when the Patriots were mid at best. Like, yeah, this, this was before Tom Brady. They were mid Ben Coates era, right? And so she drafted Drew Bledsoe and Ben Coates. I can't remember who their running back was. And, like, at the time, we just sort of laughed. We're like, the Patriots are not even that good or whatever, right? But Bledsoe and Coates were awesome. And she, she steam. Like, I know my team didn't make the playoffs. She steamrolled us. I'm friends with her now to this day, 30 years later, I'm friends with her, and she's still, every now and then, like, lets me know about it, that, like, the time she steamrolled the NFL's fantasy guy in our league. So, like, yeah, but I tell people, like, have fun with it. Make it an enjoyable experience. Because, yeah, you're going to make mistakes and you're going to do things that you kick yourself about, but at least if you had fun, if you have players that you enjoy watching, if you had an experience that's memorable, you're more likely to come back the next year and you'll. And you'll learn more and you'll try to correct those mistakes. If you make mistakes and on top of it, you're like, this is miserable. I'm a Eagles fan, and now I drafted, like, you know, CD Lamb and Dak Prescott, and I got to force myself to watch the Cowboys. Like, you know, as they say in south park, you're going to have a bad time, like, just. Just make it so you don't have a bad time, because then you're more likely to learn more, come back, and continue to improve.
- [25:19]
Podcast Host
Man, I. I think that one of the things you said in there about, like, the starting lineup rings so true, because I think the social media of it all makes it something that we just want to share, where you. You draft the team and someone goes, hey, what do you think of my roster? What do you think of my lineup here? And they rarely ever send. What they'll do is they'll just send, like, here's my starting lineup. What do you think? Man, I was like, it's good. It's good.
- [25:42]
Marcus Grant
Yeah. You know what I've learned, and you probably know this, I've learned with some of those people. Like, you can tell the people who just want validation.
- [25:47]
Podcast Host
Yeah.
- [25:48]
Marcus Grant
For their rosters. And so, like, you know, I will, like, I'll try to, like, give a little bit of, like, hey, man, I. You know, your running backs. Yeah. But, like, I love your wide receivers. I think your quarterback's gonna be great, you know, because, you know, a lot of people, that's all they. They just. They just want validation. Right. Like, they just want somebody to tell them that they did a good job. Job. And so you start to learn to kind of figure out who those people are. And, you know, while you try to offer a little bit of. Of constructive criticism, I think for the most part, people just, you know, they just want to feel good about their chances going. Like, everybody's got hope in September. You just kind of want to offer people that hope that they've got in September.
- [26:21]
Podcast Host
Yeah, Honestly, like, that. That's where I think the fandom of NFL and fantasy football intersect the most. Because it's all just hope. Like, there's just a lot of excitement and everyone becomes a little kid for the moment. Drafting a team is easy. Like, just sit there and pick players. But then it's like the week in, week out of, like, O to scour the waiver wire, I got to figure out who to start. Now I got to go make a trade. Like, that's where you start to see, like, who's actually really playing it for real and putting the time and effort and stuff. And so once we get past that draft and you're just looking at your team, how do you prioritize maybe keeping an upside stash on your roster versus saying, like, ah, I really need a player who can get me X amount of points each week. I hear that all the time. Who's the guy that's Just going to get me like 10 points every single week versus, you know, this guy's got a lot of contingent upside. If I just keep him on my bench, this could really pay off for me later on.
- [27:12]
Marcus Grant
I mean, I'll be honest with you, a lot of it depends on. On how the team itself is doing, right? You can tell a few weeks into the season, generally speaking, how good your roster is, you know, and even I've even had teams that maybe have started bad, but it's like, I look at the roster and I'm like, okay, well, these guys are playing well, or there's something just slightly off. Like, I believe this team is going to turn around. If I have a team that's good or a team that at least I feel like, you know, actually has some potential there, I'm more willing to kind of take that chance on. On the upside stash, right? Like, believing that my starters are going to figure some things out and that maybe late in the season, if I can make that playoff run, you know, this rookie or this guy who's currently an RB2, that might take over the gig. Like, maybe that's the guy to put me over the hump and get me into the postseason. If I look at a team and. And they're on the struggle bus immediately or I lose a guy and I know he's going to be out for six weeks and I'm just trying to plug holes, that's when. That's when, yeah, you're going for the floor play, right? I just, I need this. I need a Jalen Warren. Maybe I try to trade for Jaylen Warren. Like I joke, Jalen Warren lives in a tiny house, right? Because the floor, the floor is kind of steady and it's fairly high, but the ceiling is also. It's pretty low, right? It's a tiny house that he lives in. But if I just need that week to week production, right, If I need that weekly 10 to 12 points, you know, he might be the guy to keep my sort of bad team afloat until maybe I can swing a bigger trade or one of my injured guys comes back. So it really is sort of dependent on, you know, how I. How I evaluate the roster after the first month or so.
- [28:54]
Podcast Host
Jaylen Warren, noted architectural enthusiast, very special house. It's like that takes me into sort of. The next thing here is I know that a lot of us, like, we'll look at the app that we're on, right? Like wherever we're playing, and then the first thing that we'll see is These are the projected points you have. You're projected to lose by 30 this week, and then that'll often, you know, sway how you're deciding your starting lineup. Or it'll be a very even matchup. And then I'll often hear like, well, I don't want to take a lot of risks. So how do you balance that? What's the approach there? When you see the projections, do you follow that or do you sort of more so go with your gut on picking players that you like, matchups and things like that?
- [29:32]
Marcus Grant
I use it as. As a guideline. I don't. I don't consider it gospel because obviously across apps, too, projections are going to be different and that sort of thing. And obviously it depends on formats, a lot of things, so I'll use it sort of as a guideline. But, you know, if I'm looking at two guys and their projections are fairly similar and I'm trying to decide between one or the other, I think that's when I sort of have to lean on my gut. Right. Maybe it's the matchup. Maybe it's just, hey, man, this team is just playing really, really well right now or something, you know, and sometimes that means I'll pick the guy who has a lower projection just because there's something about the matchup or the player that I see that gives me a little bit more confidence or something like that. I mean, I think of it like. Like, you know, say Google Maps or Apple Maps, right? Where, like, you plug in your destination and it gives you a route. And you look at that and you're like, there's no way I'm doing that. Like, you know, like, you look at, like, hey, man, it's. It's four o' clock on a Friday. Like, there's no way I'm driving near lax. Like, you must be out of your mind, right? And so, like, Like Google Maps might tell me that's the fastest route, but, like, I live here. I know that that's not the best way to go.
- [30:39]
Podcast Host
I just referenced GPS in the last episode I did with Bob Harris, where I'm like, it's the GPS. Where it's like, my mom will tell me, make four rights. It's next to the old McDonald's. Go. Like she knows what she's going without GPS, like, I'm lost. And I feel like that's how. That's how fantasy managers get. Like, without the projections, sometimes they get too lost.
- [30:56]
Marcus Grant
Yeah. Yeah. And so sometimes, like I said, I'll use the projection sort of as A guideline and try to figure some things out. But definitely, I think there's a moment where, you know, it helps because you and I studied this stuff and we are reading about it and watching stuff all week long. There are times where it's just like, no, this. This doesn't feel right. I'm going to go with my gut now. Look, I'll be honest with you. Sometimes it works out, sometimes it really doesn't. Sometimes you're just like, oh, yeah, the projection had it right. I probably should have done that. But, you know, like, it's at least worth doing that. Right? It's. It. Because part of it's that part of this is. That's the fun of this. Right? Is that we get to make our own decisions and we get to play the game. You know, if we just. If we just let the algorithm handle it all the time, then, like, what are we even doing here? Thank you.
- [31:36]
Podcast Host
Thank you for saying that, man. Because, like, that's what I feel like we're constantly doing is searching for this skeleton key, the thing that's gonna solve fantasy football, the thing that fixes it for us every week that we don't have to try. And it's just like, that's not the game. Right, Right. Like, if not just play basketball, that's what that's for.
- [31:53]
Marcus Grant
Which, by the way, side note to that is why I am in the. You know, I realize it's a. A shrinking minority or growing minority, whatever. I still like kickers. Like, I still like kickers because Jake.
- [32:05]
Podcast Host
Seeley will have words with you.
- [32:06]
Marcus Grant
Jake and I have. Jake and I have had it out about this a couple of times. Right. Like, he knows. He knows where I stand on this because I always feel like the argument against kickers basically boils down to we can't predict them. And I'm like, good. Because I think there's an element of randomness that you sort of want, because even in football, for as much as we have analytics and metrics and stuff, there's still an element of luck. Right? I mean, you can do all the analytics you want. That doesn't tell you that Eli Manning is going to throw up a prayer and some guy's going to pin it to the top of his helmet and, like, help him win a Super Bowl. I just think. I think there's an element of luck that comes with kickers that in some ways levels the playing field a little bit, that allows maybe a more casual player to compete with somebody who is, you know, deep in the. In the woods on this whole thing. So, yeah, I, I like the idea that we can't necessarily predict everything. And so, like, I want to keep kickers. Like, it makes me a little bit sad that people are like, we should get rid of tight ends. I'm like, I get it. There's only like five of them that maybe are worth anything. But like, it adds an element of randomness and difficulty that I think sort of helps level everything out. Like, if it's just quarterbacks, wide receivers and running backs, like, we've figured out pretty much how to analyze those guys. Just. I think it just, it makes it less fun.
- [33:26]
Podcast Host
The pretend GM has now created a rivalry between Marcus Grant and Jake Seeley because Jake also just removed tight ends from the flex league. And now it's. Now it's just a tight end slash wide receiver flex that everyone chose as wide receivers. So, yeah, I'm sorry for this new rock.
- [33:44]
Marcus Grant
I say that, by the way. I say that as somebody who's Scott Fishbowl team has a grand total of one running back. Like, you know, because. Yeah, because it's like, it's basically just nothing but flex positions. Right?
- [33:54]
Podcast Host
Yeah.
- [33:54]
Marcus Grant
And like, especially if you plan, you know, you're playing on a certain app, you get more points for receptions, you get tied in premiums or whatever. So, like, I did that and I drafted basically, you know, three quarterbacks, a whole bunch of wide receivers and tight ends. I think I drafted like one running back really late. I think it was like I wasn't even Jalen Warren. No, it wasn't Jalen Warren. I thought I was going to draft him. I think somebody took him like two or three slots before. That would have been great. But yeah, that's it. So, yeah, while I, while I sit here and I. I poo poo. Jake's idea. You know, I sort of tried to game the system in the Scott Fishbowl too.
- [34:29]
Podcast Host
Well, I mean, like, that's important too, is to obviously understand the league that you're in, the settings that you have all that. And I think the thing that like really separates people throughout the fantasy season is ends up like, how they approach waivers. And I've seen all different kinds of opinions on how to, you know, how to focus on waivers either, you know, get it early because that's when you're going to get the most value out of these players. They end up having a full season role. It's like a free space in your draft board versus, I've heard, hold on to all of your fab or your waiver priority for that time, you really need it later on in the season because that's, you know, you're. You're going to wish you had it.
- [35:05]
Marcus Grant
Yeah.
- [35:05]
Podcast Host
So what's your framework for deciding, like, okay, I need to go all in on this player, or I need to cut bait on a player that I maybe draft a little bit higher, and they're just underperforming. What's that thought process like for you when it comes to the waiver wire?
- [35:19]
Marcus Grant
I. I feel like getting. And not blowing all your fab necessarily, but I do think if you're going to find that waiver wire hero, the guy that we're always talking about at the end of the season, you are much more likely to find that guy within the first three weeks of the season. Right. Because usually it's, you know, maybe it's an injury, maybe it's just a rookie that somehow steals a job and comes out of nowhere, you know, but that guy usually reveals himself fairly early in the year. So I am not opposed to spending a good chunk of fab on that guy. I still will try to hold some back until later because, you know, inevitably there are things that you just can't prepare for. There are mid to late season injuries, that sort of thing that, that you just have to be aware of. So it's always nice to kind of hold some back. I will also admit that I am sort of bad at estimating what everybody else in my league is going to bid on a player, you know, because you also never really know how much somebody values a player or somebody else is just going to, you know, go hard on the waiver wire early. So it's like, I always feel like. I feel like I either severely underbid on a guy or severely overbid, right? Where it's like, I'll put, you know, 70 fab dollars on a guy and like, I think the next closest bid is like 30. I'm like, oh, wow, I really, really overshot that one. You know, like, that's a hard thing. But I do think, I think. I think, you know, it makes sense to kind of fill in the waiver wire slots and to play it all week, all year long. But you really, if you want that guy, that's going to be the man, I should have jumped on him. Like, that's going to happen probably before the end of September.
- [37:06]
Podcast Host
So with this, like, I mean, I know with waivers, a big thing is, yeah, we want to know if that player is producing, they have the opportunity. But I think also we tend to look ahead. Like, what's that schedule going to be like for them going forward? What's the schedule like for my current players on my roster? Do you find it advantageous to be looking further ahead in the schedule? And if so, how far do you look ahead in advance?
- [37:28]
Marcus Grant
I think it's only worth looking maybe two or three weeks in advance, you know, and I know for the sake of the content machine, which is always in motion, you know, we will always do strength of schedule stuff. People will look ahead and do playoff schedule stuff. Like, you know, I've done it. You know, I'm. I'm sure when we start, you know, when the podcast is up, when Fantasy Live is going on, we'll store it. We'll do all of the, you know, playoff schedule sort of thing. But, I mean, you know, this. How many times do we look at the start of the season, we're like, man, this team's got a really good playoff schedule. And then by the time you get to mid season, you're like, wow, this schedule's rough. I think this is. This is not going to be great at all. Just because one, obviously teams change drastically from year to year, and they change over the course of the season. Right? I mean, remember once upon a time when the Miami Dolphins hung 70 points on the Denver Broncos and everybody was like, oh, man, like, target the Broncos. Right, like, target all your guys. But then by the end of the year, that Bronco defense had gotten to be pretty good. So, like, a team that we thought was going to be kind of a doormat in the fantasy playoffs turned out to be a team that's like, you know, like, I don't know if I want to be messing with, you know, Pat Certan, the second in the fantasy playoff sort of thing. So, you know, I think that's. I think it's worth looking at, but I would try to limit my focus to more than, you know, to not more than two or three weeks in advance because it feels like, you know, that's. That's when team, like, if you're bad for two or three weeks and your. Your coaching staff isn't immediately looking at like, okay, so what do we need to do? Like, how are we switching things up? I can show you a coaching staff that's probably going to get fired by the end of the year. So it's probably better just to keep your. Your focus kind of narrow.
- [39:09]
Podcast Host
I. I like that you said, you know, looking maybe three weeks in advance. I do think that this game, obviously it's played week to week, but I really do Feel like it's played in pockets. Like, I, I, I view this almost like how a fan of the NBA would view a game where, like, the games are kind of, they're a, It's a game of runs, like, it streaks back and forth of, okay, now this team scored 10 points in a row, and that's sort of how it ends up being in the NFL, where I think too, like, if we're going to use the schedule in reverse and go, like, back to look at stuff, we always hear, well, this team is allowing the most points to running backs or something like that. And then you'll look and be like, but for the last three weeks, they've been really, really good against running backs. So, like, is that something you try to make sure, like, you're giving that context as well? Like, I know just a shameless plug here for football guys is I'll use the fantasy points against tool that we have there and just look back at recent weeks as opposed to the entirety of the season, because there's always going to be, like, injuries and things that change and scheme change, things like that. Is that something that you try to add that context to as well?
- [40:06]
Marcus Grant
Absolutely. Yeah, it is. It's, you know, like, you take in the number as a whole and you try to figure out where teams are. But then, yeah, I do make it a point to go back over the space of a few weeks, right? Because, you know, maybe a team looks like they're bad against wide receivers or something like that, right? Like, even, even over the space of a month, like, the last four games, they've got a really bad number against wide receivers. But then you break it down and like, you know, Jamar Chase in one of those games went for two Bills and three touchdowns. Like, you know, so, like, that's going to skew that number really dramatically. So I think it is important to kind of have that context. Like, it is, it is a lot easier when you look at a defense and like, every single week they're giving up a couple touchdowns to wide receivers, and you're just like, oh, you know, that's just a bad secondary. But, you know, sometimes it's like, hey, this isn't a terrible defense. They just had. Either they had one bad week or they just played a guy who was really, really good and that dude took advantage of them. And so I think, you know, it's important to sort of point that out. You know, like, you talk about vibes, though, so I'll, I'll let you in on maybe one of my biggest you know, swings and misses ever. So you're, you know, the, the amazing Nick Foles was a 27 touchdown, two interception season that he had. He threw, you know, he threw what, seven touchdown passes, I think in a week, or six touchdown passes in a week.
- [41:28]
Podcast Host
Something crazy.
- [41:29]
Marcus Grant
The very next week, the, the Eagles were playing the Raiders, and I went on national cable television and said, the Raiders are my sleeper defense of the week because there's no way Nick Foles could throw six touchdown passes again this week. Guess who threw six touchdown passes again that week? It was, it was Nick Foles. Yeah, that was kind of a big oops. But yeah, context is always, is always important for these things.
- [41:54]
Podcast Host
Context has been kind of the, like, hidden theme across every episode that I've had here where it's like, in one way or another, it's gotten brought up by each guest and just like, in the way that they use things. And I think what also, like, happens, whether it's people in the industry or even just fantasy managers that are playing, we sometimes see that certain concepts get misused or data gets taken out of context and misused. And even just like the example we gave here where it's like X team is first against running backs and it's like, well, have they really been lately or was that, you know, three easy weeks, the beginning of the year? So what do you normally see as the concept or like data point or just that philosophy, the thing that gets misused or misunderstood the most in fan football?
- [42:41]
Marcus Grant
I think home road splits are one.
- [42:44]
Podcast Host
Okay, I like that one. That's the first one I've heard of that.
- [42:46]
Marcus Grant
I think home road splits and like, I think for some people, they are, they are actually sort of concrete data, right? Like, I think about Jared Goff and they talk about his home road splits, right? Like my, my friend and colleague Adam Rank very famously dubbed Jared Goff as being an indoor cat, you know, because, like, when he's inside, you know, in Ford Field, Jared Goff is a very different cat quarterback than, you know, he is when he's on the road, especially when he's outdoors. Like, I, I mean, I'm old enough to remember when he had his pro day at Cal, right? And everybody was like, jared Goff can't throw a wet football or whatever. And just by happenstance, it happened to rain in Berkeley on the day of Jared Goff's pro day. And like, he ended up having a pretty good pro day. And I was like, oh, it's all over. It's not a big deal. But, like, he can do it. He can do it, like. But now we've seen throughout his career that like Jared Goff outdoors in the elements is a very different quarterback than Jared Goff, like indoors, you know, under a dome in like 72 degree conditions. But I think for a lot of guys, I don't think it's necessarily the home road splits. I think it's more sometimes the teams they are playing at home versus the teams they are playing on the road. Right. And I think, I think again, if, if, you know, if today's secret word is context, the context is sort of looking at who those opponents are. And maybe if you start to separate the signal from the noise, maybe you will see that certain guys really are better at their home stadiums. But I think what we're really talking about, we talk about home road splits is just that, like, hey, man, this team had a really tough road schedule and maybe an easier home schedule or vice versa. And I think sometimes, you know, it's easy to just, you know, peg it all in one thing where, you know, sometimes it's just harder to kind of break it out and figure out like, no, what really is going on here.
- [44:29]
Podcast Host
Here with that, man. It's, it's funny because I think the toughest thing for us to sort of pin down because we just don't know the information always ends up being injuries. Like, that's, that's the thing that gets really tough. And that's why I also, like, I just, I kind of just remind myself like, there is an intangibility to fantasy football and just watching it in general. But we do get this all the time where we'll hear, well, we're gonna see how player X is on game day. You know, before the game, he's gonna go out in warm ups, we'll see how he's doing, and we'll probably have him on a snap count. Right. Like, that can be super frustrating. As a fantasy manager, how do you factor that into your start sit decisions? Because I know like, once the season kicks off and we get that first injury, we are going to get that question 10 times a week, every single week until the season is over. So how do you factor that in?
- [45:21]
Marcus Grant
Yeah, I mean, obviously following practice reports throughout the week is a, a big thing. You know, we always say, like, if a guy, you know, if a guy does his practice, you know, Monday, Tuesday, even Wednesday, like, it's not a big deal. If he's not out there on Thursday, red flag goes up. If he's not out there on Friday, then it's time to really start thinking about making some other decisions. I mean, I feel like the worst words in the fantasy lexicon are game time decision, because then it really is like, you know, at some point you just sign up, you put it up to the football gods in Tennessee, how it is. I think at that point you're just sort of, you know, how good is this player? How integral is this player to their offense and my fantasy roster? And then you sort of decide based on that. I think the other thing to keep in mind is the reason there are injury reports are basically because of folks like us, right? It's because of fantasy players. It's because of gamblers. Like, there's no. There's no sane strain of the multiverse where a coach would willingly tell you that their players are injured and what body part is hurt and where it just doesn't ever make sense and how.
- [46:31]
Podcast Host
They'Re exactly going to deploy that player.
- [46:34]
Marcus Grant
Like, there's no strain of the multiverse where that actually makes sense to do. But it exists, especially in the NFL, because it is beneficial to a lot of the folks who consume the sport and play those peripheral games that help keep the sport going. In fact, if you. If you want an example of that, look no further than the injury reports, right? Like, one of my early jobs at the NFL was on Sunday morning having to go in the website and. And list the inactives, right? The inactive players for each team. Everybody has the eight inactive players that they have to listen. But also what we have to do is go list all the guys who were, like, questionable or doubtful, right? Even if they're playing, Just put the, you know, put so and so, you know, ankle questionable, he's playing whatever. And no team was more petty about it. And this is not going to surprise you than the Bill Belichick Patriots, right? Belichick would put every single minor injury, you know, so and so, stubbed toe, questionable, you know, so and so bruised ego, doubtful. I'm like, you know, it's just.
- [47:46]
Podcast Host
It's like a laptop without his blue light glasses.
- [47:49]
Marcus Grant
Exactly. The week it really is. It was like. It was like somebody told Bill, it's like, hey, the league says you got to list all injuries. He's like, all right, well, I'll show you. You know, so, like, so, like, obviously we're always monitoring this because we want to make sure we get the best possible lineup in there. You know, I think there's an element of, like, you know, you watch practice reports, you see how guys are working through the week, but also just an element of. Sometimes coaches are lying liars who lie, and because it's not in their best interest to tell you that their starting quarterback has a bum knee and maybe can't move around all that well.
- [48:22]
Podcast Host
Yeah, man, it's. That, I think, becomes the most frustrating thing in fantasy. And there's so much that ends up being out of our control, whether it's. It's injuries or, like, sometimes just game plan stuff like we don't know about. Like, players will always have an off week because a coach decided to deploy them in a totally different way.
- [48:41]
Marcus Grant
Arthur Smith. Yeah, thanks for that.
- [48:45]
Podcast Host
I just brought up, like, so much ptsd, but, you know, like, I know, like, the, the best way that we could try to counteract that always ends up being waivers or, like, one of my favorite things to do, it's just like, exhilarating is trades. Like, just find someone in your league that you can trade with. But it also becomes one of the most frustrating things to do because everyone views a trade differently. And I, I gotta be honest, man, everyone feels like they're the smartest person in the room in a trade. And, like, I'm just not about that life. Like, I just want this to be really simple and I want to be like, hey, you need this, I need that. Let's, let's, let's do that. I'm not trying to get one up on that person. How do you go about, like, even just pursuing a trade, looking for that team, looking for the player, you know, sending the offer, all that?
- [49:28]
Marcus Grant
Stu. I mean, it really is for me about trying to find a deal that is mutually beneficial, right? If I, if I need wide receiver help, but I've got a surplus of running backs. I'm gonna find a team that has a ton of wide receivers and, and maybe needs help. You know, I just, I want to. I want everybody to sort of win in this deal. And I think part of the problem is everybody feels like they've got to win the trade, right? They've got to feel like they got over on everybody.
- [49:56]
Podcast Host
Post a picture and, like, send it to your friend or post it on socials, right?
- [50:00]
Marcus Grant
Like, and like I always tell people, like, the best trades really are mutually beneficial, at least on paper. Mutually beneficial. Like, you never know what's going to happen. Like, you make a trade, a guy gets hurt. Like, that's, you know, that's sort of out of your hands. You can't do anything about that. But at least if everybody comes away from the deal feeling like they got something to help their team, I Think that's really the best. I think what's made it one, because everybody wants to win the trade, that makes it hard. The other part, I think is for somebody who's in the industry and who does this one, there's a tax, right. Like, I'm pretty sure, like in my home league guys that I've known most of them since high school, you know, because I do this for a living.
- [50:41]
Podcast Host
Yes.
- [50:42]
Marcus Grant
If, if I'm inquiring about a player, it becomes, what does Marcus know about this guy? Right. Like, he must know something. So now, you know, I'm more likely either hold on to him or I'm going to ask for a whole lot more in return because obviously something's up, something that I haven't checked on is going on. So there's kind of that tax to pay for this, you know, and then the point that you mentioned, just, you never know how people value a certain player. Some people just, they have more of an affinity for certain players than you realize, and that forces you to sort of, you know, to pay more necessarily. So I will say that of all the questions, the types of questions that I get across, the season trade ones are sort of the hardest. Right. Because you don't know all those other factors. The other part is, you know this. When people send you a trade offer that's out there, you also don't really get to see the rest of their roster. You just see the handful of players involved in a deal, and it's like, you know, I don't know, did I win? Did you win? I don't know. Sure. Like, I have no idea what you have on the rest of your roster. Maybe this is good. Or maybe now you've got three tight ends and you just don't know what to do with any of them. Like, I have.
- [51:52]
Podcast Host
Yeah, I. I think the thing with, like, these trades is that people always want to know if they won or if they got the betterment of. Of the deal. And it's always just like, maybe this week, dude, I don't know. But like, in three weeks, it's. It's not the same. Like, any one of those players can get injured, Anything can happen. And it's just. It's not the same deal as before. Like, no matter what, even if you feel like you got the better side of the offer, it's always still a risk.
- [52:17]
Marcus Grant
Still a risk. I was. Other people who send me a trade, they're like, it's already been completed, right? And they're like, did I do good? And I'm like, it doesn't matter. It's done.
- [52:26]
Podcast Host
It feels like like your kid coming home with like their arts and craft project. Like, yeah, do good.
- [52:32]
Marcus Grant
I do good. I'm like, I mean, at this point it's like no take back. So it doesn't even matter if it was a good trade or not. Like, it's done now. Like, these guys are on your team, so that sort of thing. One funny thing, I'll tell you this. There are these guys that on Twitter, I assume they were brothers, right? They had the same last name, they were about the same age. And they would both always, like, separately DM me, like, you know, start sick questions or whatever. And one week, obviously one proposed the trade to the other because they both sent me the same trade offer separately on DMs, like, should I take this? And the guy's like, is this a good offer? And I'm like, I'm like, I feel like this is a brotherly thing and I probably shouldn't get in the middle of this. Like, if you guys are doing separate starts at questions, I'm down to answer that. Like, I don't think I want to get in the middle of this family squabble over fantasy football. So I think I just left those dms just. I think I left them on red that week.
- [53:24]
Podcast Host
So the thing that's going to happen naturally with us as well is like, as much as we try to help people, we are undoubtedly going to be wrong. Like, it just happens. We are humans and it happens. But when you are wrong about a player, whether it's on a start sit decision or the way you draft the, the waiver wire pickup, you make the trade you make, how do you go back and figure out like, why you missed the call? I know that every situation is going to be different, but what's that process like for you? Because I think a lot of times what, what? Not just we, I mean, we as like the royal. Like everybody who will say, well, the process was right, you know, like I, I had it there, but it just, it wasn't the right result. So I'm going to keep going back and doing it the same. Like, what's the, the process like for you and figuring out what you got wrong?
- [54:06]
Marcus Grant
I mean, I think it is looking at sort of the situation, sort of the game. Sometimes there is no real easy answer, right? I mean, you know, I remember years ago, Sean Payton randomly giving Kobe Fleener like three goal line carries. And you're like, I. I don't know what to do with that. Right. Like, you know, it's like, hey, man, he's got Mark Ingram here. Like, why wouldn't, why wouldn't you give the ball to Mark Ingram a couple of times? But no, you're going to be tricky. Like, you just can't, you can't really account for that. But I think, I think when you're front facing, you know, I do think just a sense of honesty about it goes a long way. Right? Like, hey, you know, I thought this is what was going to happen. You know, turns out that, you know, the Eagles decided to defend differently that week. And so, you know, Dak had to feature George Pickens more than maybe I thought he would, something like that. You know, I think, I think it is about being open and honest about the fact that, hey, man, you made a mistake. Like, this was my process. Obviously that didn't work out this week. You know, it is as Ian Hart always says, we're gonna study the game field, we're gonna try to get better next week. You know, I mean, I think that's just, that's really, that's really part of it is, is just owning up to your mistake, saying, hey, look, this is why I thought it was going to happen. It obviously didn't happen. Let's kind of figure it out and let's, you know, let's see if this is a thing that's sustainable, right? Like, hey, you know, if, if all of a sudden Ricky Piercel is getting all these targets in San Francisco, like, let's figure out why that is. And is this a one week thing? Is this based on how they were defending the Niners or is it that like Kyle Shanahan sees something here and now they really want to try to work that in? I mean, I think that's important as owning that mistake, but understanding whether this is sustainable or it just happened to.
- [55:53]
Podcast Host
Be a one off, I, I love that. And it, because it's. There is no kind of clear cut, one size fits all answer for all of this. Like, it just, it has to be on a case by case basis. If that's how we evaluate the things we want to get right, that's kind of how we have to evaluate the things that we do get wrong. It's got to be case by case. I think the interesting thing is seeing, I mean, like you've recently just experienced it, the future of fantasy football and like where it's going and, and the apps and the businesses and everything. This is absolutely a loaded question, but I kind of want to get your simple answer on it, it's just like, where do you see the game of fantasy football evolving to over the next few years? Because we've seen a lot of changes over the last 10, 20, 30 years. Like going forward. What do you see from it?
- [56:43]
Marcus Grant
I think at its core, I think it's not going to change dramatically because I think for the majority of people, you know, who just play in say your 10 team, 12 team office league, you know, I think you'll see incremental changes. Right. Like those folks, they're, they've moved from, you know, standard scoring to PPR to the point that PPR is kind of standard scoring now. Right. You know, maybe they eventually move to, I don't know, maybe they eventually move to super flex or to qb. But I think that's a long time in the works. I think basically the, the basic game is going to stay the same for a really long time, but I do think we're going to see sort of more permutations. I think we're going to see more gamification of it for, you know, I don't necessarily love that word, but I think that's kind of where it's going. Right? So like, for instance, like best ball leagues have become a big, big deal, I think. I think Guillotine leagues are going to start to be, you know, kind of a bigger thing, right? Because one, it gives you a thing you can play all year long. But also like, hey, if you get knocked out of your Guillotine league in like the first couple weeks, you can always start another one. You know, you can kind of keep going on that. It's just a fun different way to sort of approach the game because I think at some point we've done a pretty good job of solving for X and doing the different things of like, you know, how to draft and that. So I think we have to sort of keep changing things around. I also think whether you love it or not, for better or worse, I think the sports betting world and the fantasy world are going to continue to merge. I think that that Venn diagram is going to start to overlap a little bit more. And so, you know, things like, I mean, daily fantasy is sort of part of that, I think, but I think even within, you know, whether you're, you're placing bets on, on specific plays or whether or not like how many fantasy points can Ja' Marr Chase or Saquon Barkley or Bajan Robinson get in a quarter? I think, I think there's going to be some sort of marriage of that. So you Know, I think those things, though, will remain sort of, I don't want to say on the fringes, but it'll be people like us who have played for years, who've played a bunch of different formats and who are looking for something different. I think we will kind of push the limits of how the fantasy space and fantasy game exists. But I really do think for the vast majority of people, it's always going to kind of be the same game. Because I think for a lot more people, it's really more of a social experience than it is necessarily a competitive, trying to dominate your league and win a bunch of money experience 100%, man.
- [59:14]
Podcast Host
Like, that's honestly what it is. It's a social experience. It's. It's the fun of doing your draft, it's the fun of the trash talking week after week and then it's the fun of gloating that you won the championship to your friends for the, for the rest of the year there. By the way, don't think I didn't notice I heard you properly pronounce Bijan Robinson.
- [59:31]
Marcus Grant
Bijon Robinson, man. He is. His name does not rhyme with a variety of mustard. All right? It's just. It does not rhyme with mustard. That's it.
- [59:41]
Podcast Host
I was talking to my co host the other day and he's like, well then why would he do a Dijon mustard? And I'm like, well, maybe you've just been pronouncing the mustard wrong the whole time.
- [59:48]
Marcus Grant
Why did Joe Theisman change his name from Joe Theisman? Because he was in a Heisman campaign at Notre Dame. Joe Theisman for the Heisman. Doesn't work. It doesn't work.
- [59:58]
Podcast Host
Make it work for you.
- [60:00]
Marcus Grant
That's it. That's it.
- [60:02]
Podcast Host
Well, we referenced a community here and that social aspect of it. And one thing I love to do at the end of each show is to bring in questions from the audience, people that just want to know a little bit more about you. They're always non player specific questions. So first one I have here is from a gentleman that, you know, Jagger May, who wants to ask, you know, what has been your experience in growing a brand and doing something different outside of football? Like 32 bit, for example, how's that experience been for you? And what advice would you give to someone building something?
- [60:35]
Marcus Grant
It's been fun. It's been fun in part because it's just sort of nice to every now and then take a break from football. Right? And you know, I mean, I know you guys are doing it with your, you know, Your, your movies and your pop culture podcast and stuff like that. I think in part just because, you know, we are all well rounded people that, yes, what we do primarily is fantasy football, but we all have interests outside of that. And so I enjoy being able to kind of take a break from the other things. Also, though, for me, you know, as much as I enjoy this and I've, you know, I've been very fortunate to have a great career here. You know, I don't, I don't think I want to do this forever. I don't, I don't think I want to do this for the rest of my life, you know, and so I'd like to be able to somehow create a path or an avenue to blossom into something else, to pivot. Right. And so, you know, I would love to pivot into something that I enjoy. Like, I, yeah, last couple of years I've been fortunate enough to do a live stream in the mornings about Dodger baseball because I look, I'm going to spend my evenings in the summer and fall screaming about the Dodgers anyway. I might as well try to figure out how to make it a job at some point. So I think it's always worthwhile because I also just think it helps you stretch your muscles in a lot of ways too, because I think the people who are best at one thing, it's because they take from other things. You know, I remember hearing Rick Rubin on a podcast, the great music producer saying that the music that he enjoys most, the producers he enjoy, enjoys most, they are taking from other styles, right? And so it's like, you know, maybe you're a hip hop producer, but you listen to heavy metal, you listen to classical, you listen to electronic stuff, as opposed to the hip hop producer who only listens to hip hop. Eventually that kind of sounds the same. And so I feel like, you know, even in your other works of life, if you're doing fantasy, why not do a podcast, a pop culture or a movie podcast or something about other sports? Because I think you can sort of incorporate that and make your primary content seem a little bit deeper and more rich.
- [62:41]
Podcast Host
I have actually a follow up question here from another person who asked something similar because you're talking about audiences and, and this, you know, just engaging with people. And from Optimus Fantasy Football over here on Blue sky, they ask Marcus, how do you manage to engage your audience and maintain sanity in such a social media driven world? I mean, you just mentioned that you're doing all these different things from Dodgers to 32 bit to NFL fantasy to fantasy life. Like, there's. There's just so many different things you have done or are doing. How do you maintain sanity while still giving the people what they want?
- [63:14]
Marcus Grant
I think honestly it's still. Because I. I have tried to be sort of less online, I think, over the last couple of years, especially in the off season. Right. Like, in the season, I think I'm very much online partially because, you know, you're. You're consuming news, you know, keeping up with beat reporters, you're promoting your own work, you're promoting other people's work. So in season, I'm definitely a lot more online, but I think once football season ends, I try to unplug a little bit. I'm not always successful. Like, I'm still. I'll still open the app and I'll still scroll and stuff, but I'm not necessarily engaging a whole lot more. And I think that, you know, that sort of helps keep me sane. I try to, as they say, go touch grass every once in a while. But also, I think. I also think that my social media feeds. Like, I'm surprised people follow me, to be honest with you, because I go back and I look at, through. I looked at some of my old posts and there's no real coherent thread to any of them. You know, like, I'll just.
- [64:10]
Podcast Host
Me going through your Twitter right now.
- [64:11]
Marcus Grant
Seeing what you're talking about. I just, I will kind of post whatever is sort of top of mind at the time. Maybe I'm watching something. Maybe I'm just having like a random thought of something and. And I'll post that just, you know, kind of out of nowhere. So, like, I feel like people who, who follow me initially for fantasy football, I'm surprised that they don't just get fed up and unfollow because, like, I'll go long stretches, especially offseason, without posting anything football related. So, like, you know, I. I think that sort of helps, at least helps my own sanity in the end. I don't know if I'm always necessarily serving the consumer, but it definitely helps, I think, keep me a little straight.
- [64:49]
Podcast Host
Well, I mean, honestly, man, like, that should make you feel better. Especially if you're saying, like, not everything there is coherent from the like or connected from one thing to the next. I hope it's coherent. But like, I mean, like, connected from one thing to the next, like, that just means that people like you, like, they enjoy you, man. You should, honestly, you should take that as a huge compliment.
- [65:07]
Marcus Grant
That's cool. Yeah.
- [65:08]
Podcast Host
Because like, like, I, I Genuinely, like, I enjoy your personality. I love your work. Like, just spending this time with you has been great. And. And I gotta say, man, like, I feel like I've learned a little bit more from doing this, this sit down with you. I know that our audience has as well. And, man, I just, I can't thank you enough for joining me here today, Marcus. Yeah, I know it's the end of the show here. If you could please let everybody know what it is that you're working on and where they can find all your work.
- [65:36]
Marcus Grant
Yeah, absolutely. I think most of the places you can find my stuff. I'm not really so much on the X site anymore. I still have my account there at Marcus G. M A R C A S G. Mostly over on Blue Sky. Same thing. Marcus G there. But you know the NFL Fantasy Football podcast, We're three times a week. Wherever you find find podcasts, you can also find ours. I'm in NFL Fantasy Live on NFL Network. We're on five days a week there. Also, in case, you know, you're not sick of me, I'm on Sirius XM on Saturday mornings. Let me get these times right. I got to do it in my head. Eastern, 10 to noon Eastern. Right. 10 to noon Eastern, 7 to 10am Pacific on Saturday mornings. Me and a guy named Chris Manzo. It's not always fantasy. It's a lot of nonsense, but it's a lot of fun. And then like I said, occasionally, every once in a while, in case you want to hear me moan about the Dodgers, which I think nobody really wants to hear me moan about a team that spent a billion dollars on free agents and won the World Series. But in case you do the ESPN LA YouTube channel, you can find it over there.
- [66:36]
Podcast Host
Nice, man. Well, I as, once again, thank you so much for joining me here today. And as always, for everybody that is watching or listening all the way through, I can't thank you enough for being here with us. For myself, for Marcus, thank you. We'll see you next time. Adios. What do you think makes the perfect snack?
- [67:03]
Marcus Grant
Hmm. It's gotta be when I'm really craving it and it's convenient.
- [67:07]
Podcast Host
Could you be more specific?
- [67:08]
Marcus Grant
When it's cray venient.
- [67:09]
Podcast Host
Okay.
- [67:10]
Marcus Grant
Like a freshly baked cookie made with real butter, available right down the street at am, pm Or a savory breakfast sandwich I can grab in just a second at am, pm.
- [67:18]
Podcast Host
I'm seeing a pattern here.
- [67:19]
Marcus Grant
Well, yeah, we're talking about what I.
- [67:20]
Podcast Host
Crave, which is anything from AM PM.
- [67:22]
Marcus Grant
What more could you want stop by A&PM where the snacks and drinks are perfect for craveable and convenient. That's cravenience ampm Too much Good stuff.
- [67:32]
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