Mini-Ep 431: For A Good Job Call…

Summary

Podcast Summary: Forever35 - Mini-Ep 431: For A Good Job Call…

Release Date: February 19, 2025
Hosts: Dorée Shafrir & Elise Hu
Title: Mini-Ep 431: For A Good Job Call…

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Introduction

In this mini-episode of Forever35, co-hosts Dorée Shafrir and Elise Hu engage with their listeners by addressing submitted questions and comments. The episode emphasizes self-care, mental health, and practical advice, all delivered with the show’s signature humor and self-awareness.

Mental Health and Therapy

[02:26] Elise Hu:
Elise opens the discussion by highlighting the increasing demand for mental health professionals and the reciprocal need for these professionals to seek support themselves. This segues into a heartfelt conversation about the importance of therapists also having their own therapists to maintain their well-being.

[03:24] Dorée Shafrir:
Dorée muses on the cyclical nature of therapy for therapists, playfully contemplating the endless loop of therapists treating each other: “John goes to Susan, Susan goes to Tom, Tom goes to Jessica, Jessica goes to Paul, and Paul goes back to John.”

Notable Quote:
Elise Hu at [02:26]:
"Mental health professionals also need support. So mental health professionals are seeing their mental health professionals."

Listener Questions: Scalp Itchiness and Hair Care

A listener shares concerns about an itchy scalp and increased hair shedding, potentially linked to recent wildfires.

[05:30] Dorée Shafrir:
Dorée suggests using an anti-dandruff shampoo, mentioning her personal experience with products like Nizoral to promote hair growth and alleviate dryness.

[06:39] Elise Hu:
Elise advises checking for active ingredients like ketoconazole in shampoos and recommends adjusting hair care formulas with brands like Prose for personalized solutions.

Notable Quote:
Dorée Shafrir at [05:30]:
"Using an anti dandruff shampoo, even if you don't have dandruff, is supposed to help with hair growth."

Elise Hu’s TED Talk

[07:14] Elise Hu:
Elise discusses her recent TED Talk, which delves into how beauty standards are influenced by social media algorithms and filters. She explores the potential future where AI continues to shape our appearance, pushing towards more "cyborgian" looks.

Preparation and Delivery Challenges:
Elise shares the rigorous preparation process for the TED Talk, including working closely with a curator, multiple rehearsals, and a stringent fact-checking system. She candidly describes the anxiety of performing live, despite her extroverted nature.

Notable Quote:
Elise Hu at [07:14]:
"What filters go for more arched eyebrows, then we also want more arched eyebrows... AI like, we're going to look more and more cyborgian over time."

Listener Questions: Shopping for Tween Clothes

A listener seeks advice on where to shop for fashionable yet age-appropriate clothes for her ten-and-a-half-year-old daughter.

[17:35] Dorée Shafrir:
Dorée shares insights from her daughter Ava, who recommends brands like Hollister, Target, H&M, and Old Navy for their range and quality in smaller sizes suitable for tweens. The discussion emphasizes the balance between trendy and appropriate clothing.

Sustainable Shopping:
Elise highlights the importance of sustainable shopping habits, suggesting platforms like Depop for buying secondhand clothes to reduce the impact of fast fashion.

Notable Quote:
Ava [20:39]:
"I think Hollister would be the best. Or Target, like Target shirts, Old Navy sweaters, or like basic T-shirts."

Workplace Advice: Handling Micromanagement

A caller working for a nonprofit expresses frustration over a boss who has started micromanaging amidst federal funding uncertainties.

[28:17] Elise Hu:
Elise empathizes with the caller, recognizing the widespread impact of funding threats on workplace dynamics. She advises approaching the situation with empathy and suggests having an open conversation with the supervisor to set clear, specific requests and boundaries.

[30:38] Dorée Shafrir:
Dorée echoes the sentiment, recommending leading with empathy and framing the discussion around mutual support and collaboration. She emphasizes the importance of specific communication to address the underlying needs.

Notable Quote:
Dorée Shafrir at [30:38]:
"You want to lead with empathy and kind of acknowledge that this is a really difficult time. And I would sort of frame it as, like, how can I help you?"

Promotions and Advertisements

While the main content focuses on listener interactions and personal insights, the episode intersperses promotional segments for various brands:

• HoneyLove: Revolutionizing wireless bras with comfort and support.
• Prose: Custom hair and skincare tailored to individual needs.
• Quince: Affordable luxury clothing with ethical manufacturing practices.
• Masterclass & HelloFresh: Educational and meal kit services offering exclusive discounts to listeners.

These advertisements are seamlessly integrated, maintaining the podcast’s engaging flow while providing listeners with relevant product recommendations.

Conclusion

Forever35 Mini-Episode 431 successfully balances personal anecdotes, listener engagement, and practical advice, all while fostering a sense of community among its audience. Dorée and Elise’s candid discussions on mental health, personal challenges, and everyday concerns resonate with listeners, making the episode a valuable resource for self-care and personal growth.

Final Notable Quote:
Dorée Shafrir at [35:12]:
"Like a Jennifer Garner and Alias type spy. I mean, look, this is probably all just, like, total wishful thinking, but I was still so excited..."

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For More Information:

• Listen to the full episode: Forever35 Podcast
• Contact: Email at forever35podcastmail.com or call/text at 781-591-0390
• Follow on Instagram: @35podcast
• Shop Favorite Products: Shopmyus.slashforever35

Transcript

[Unnamed Speaker 1]

My dad works in B2B marketing. He came by my school for Career Day and said he was a big roas man. Then he told everyone how much he loved calculating his return on ad spend. My friends still laugh at me to this day.

[LinkedIn Advertiser]

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[Elise Hu]

How are those peepers feeling?

[Bausch and Lomb Advertiser]

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[Dory Shafrir]

Hello and welcome to Forever 35, a podcast about the things we do to take care of ourselves. I'm Dory Shafrier.

[Elise Hu]

And I'm Elise Hu and we're just two friends who like to talk a lot about serums.

[Dory Shafrir]

And this is a mini episode where we hear from you, we share your comments and your thoughts, and we answer your questions to the best of our ability. But please remember we are not experts. We're podcast hosts and we always encourage you to seek support first and foremost from a medical and or mental health professional as needed.

[Elise Hu]

I wonder how busy mental health professionals are these days. And then oh boy Mental health professionals also need support. So mental health professionals are seeing their mental health professionals.

[Dory Shafrir]

I was just thinking, but I just.

[Elise Hu]

Hope everybody is resourced up. We need to get resourced up.

[Dory Shafrir]

Oh, man. I know. Like, I just. I always think about Tony Sopranos. Therapist. Therapist.

[Elise Hu]

What if you were just a therapist to therapists? Like, your job was only, like, your clientele was only other therapists.

[Dory Shafrir]

I feel like that must exist. But then it's also like, where does it end? Who is the ultimate therapist? Or is it just circular? Like the. The top therapist go ends up going back to the, like the first therapist. You know what I mean? It's just, I'm the therapist.

[Elise Hu]

Right. It ends it. Yeah. It's like how parallel lines never meet. Yeah. Yeah.

[Dory Shafrir]

John goes to Susan, Susan goes to Tom, Tom goes to Jessica, Jessica goes to Paul, and Paul goes back to John.

[Elise Hu]

You know, it's like a very complicated math problem or just a very simple circle.

[Dory Shafrir]

Right. I feel like every, every therapist must have a therapist. If you're a therapist. Yeah. Let us know you believe in it. You have a therapist. How do you, like, how do you find a therapist? What do you think about therapy for yourself and for mental health professionals? I'm. I'm very curious, actually.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah. Yeah. I need to ask my therapist next time. Like, how did you decide on who your match was? But I assume it's the same way as we all decide, you know, like, is this a fit? You know, if. Are these per. Is that. Does this person sort of see me and get me and challenge me in the right ways or challenge me. Challenge me in the ways that I want to be challenged in my introspection and self understanding and all of that. So, yeah, call in. I know we have some therapists in our listenership, so let us know how you're doing because it's a very psychologically unsafe time for this country. It feels. And how. Who you. How you decide who your therapist is or going to be. On a totally separate request, since this is our mini app and a lot of folks call in with advice for us when we have questions too. The other question that I want to throw out there is, like, my scalp is very itchy. I'm guessing because it's dry. It just started happening over the last couple of days and y'all have really good wrecks for that. I. I've also noticed I have, like, hair falling out. I'm really shedding in the shower. But I think that might have to do with just the last couple of weeks. It started a week after the fires, so I think it's pretty acute. But also I'm sort of itchy at the base at the nape of my neck. So any. Any advice y'all have there is welcome.

[Dory Shafrir]

Do you think. Have you tried using an anti dandruff shampoo?

[Elise Hu]

Yeah. Yeah. No, I. I don't know if it's dandruff because it. I'm not like flaky or anything, but I could just have dry scalp, you know, so I've tried like a traditional one from Neutrogena or something.

[Dory Shafrir]

I. I learned on TikTok that using an anti dandruff shampoo, even if you don't have dandruff a couple times a week, is supposed to help with hair growth. So. Yeah, so I've been using Nizoral, Nizara. I don't know how you say it. I try to use it a couple times a week and, you know, I don't know. I'm also doing a whole bunch of other things to help with hair growth right now, so it's hard to say, like, is that the thing? But I don't know. Might be something to try.

[Elise Hu]

And then Sarah makes one I think that people have recommended.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah. You want to make sure that it has keto conazole in it.

[Elise Hu]

Okay.

[Dory Shafrir]

All right. And I think not all of them do, so.

[Elise Hu]

Okay.

[Dory Shafrir]

Just.

[Elise Hu]

I'll check my ingredients.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah, check your ingredients. You can also go back to our sponsor pros and tweak your formula and tell them that you have dry scalp or irritation and they will send you a new formula.

[Elise Hu]

I need to go back.

[Dory Shafrir]

Will help with that. Yeah.

[Elise Hu]

Okay. That's a great idea. Because I loved my pros. I loved my pros last summer. It made my hair feel great. But obviously I have different needs now.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah.

[Elise Hu]

So it's time to update it.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Elise Hu]

Okay.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah. Elise, we got two separate texts asking for you to talk about your TED Talk. One person said, tell us about the TED Talk that Elise did. And then someone else said, elise, congratulations on your excellent TED Talk. I'd love to hear about what the process of preparing and delivering a TED Talk was like.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah. So my TED Talk just came out on YouTube, I think last week, and then it came out on Ted.com, the week before. It was sometime at the beginning of February or very end of January. And I gave it last October, end of October in Atlanta at the new TED main stage, which is called TED Next. And it was extremely nerve wracking. It's about a big idea that I've been talking about a lot over the last couple of years and is in my book. And it's about the way that our beauty standards are now getting influenced or set by what we see in our feeds and what the algorithm shows us and what filters are showing us as what matters. And so, like, as filters go for more arched eyebrows, then we also want more arched eyebrows. As filters automatically put like a little highlighter at the tip of your nose, then we are also actually putting highlighter at the tip of our noses. And you see it a lot in celebrity culture, but, like, where's the end point to this? Because AI like, we're going to look more and more cyborgian over time. And in some ways we kind of. You're kind of seeing that bear out among some celebrities who can afford to spend a lot of time on their appearance. And so the talk is about that it was born out of an idea that I had been reporting on and writing about and really fleshed out in the technological gaze chapter of my book. And I prepared for it first by just trying to outline kind of the major idea that I wanted to talk about. I think the TED curators are pretty rigorous about, like, what is your idea? Like, what is the provocative idea? What is the idea that other people could kind of like spread pretty easily and. Or how would they talk about it if you, after you gave a talk about it, so you really kind of hone the idea and then break. Break out the structure of it. And then I just kind of did a pass. I did a first pass to make sure I hit all the major points that I wanted to in the outline. I had a really good curator. So, ted, if you're giving a TED Talk, they assign you a curator who really works with you rigorously over not just the talk itself and that material, but also the delivery of it. You have to give rehearsals on Zoom and then in person over the course of a couple months so that they can kind of battle test your idea. And then there's like a pretty rigorous legal and fact checking process. Every slide needs to go through a legal clearance. There's a lot of stuff. So the process is long. Delivering it was really anxiety provoking. I think we talked at the time door on the show in the fall after I'd gotten back like that. I was picking fights with Rob every day because he had come with me to Atlanta at the talk. And I was just like, very uncertain about how it was gonna go because it feels fine when you're rehearsing it a million times, but Like, I was really nervous about the high wire act and I don't actually like to speak in front of crowds despite being a very extroverted person and speaking in front of mics. So just getting over that was really hard. But I did it and I felt great after. That was like one of my favorite days of 2024. All of us in the same TED session getting together for dinner after we had gotten to give our TED talks and our plus ones came along and we were all able to like thank them for coming to our TED Talk, which is now a cliche, but it was funny to literally be able to say that. And so, yeah, thanks y'all for checking it out. It's on Ted.com and it's on YouTube if you Google just Elise Hu TED Talk. And I'd love for you to watch it if you haven't and to hear yalls feedback too.

[Dory Shafrir]

Love that. What a cool, what a cool, cool thing.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah.

[Dory Shafrir]

Thanks for taking us. Yeah, thanks for taking us behind the scenes.

[Elise Hu]

That's what this show is for. That's what y'all get.

[Dory Shafrir]

That's what this show's for. Please call or text us at 781-591-0390. Email us at forever35podcastmail.com we're still taking your questions about friendship and everything else, so send those on over. Our website is forever35podcast.com. We're on Instagram 35 podcast. You can sign up for our newsletter at forever35podcast.com newsletter and shop our favorite products at Shopmy Us. Slash Forever35. We're gonna take a short break and we will be right back.

[Elise Hu]

We'll be right back.

[Dory Shafrir]

February is the month of love and there's nothing I love more than treating myself to a comfortable bra. Seriously, life is too short to wear bad bras. Luckily, today's episode is brought to you by HoneyLove, the brand that has completely revolutionized the wireless bra. I love my Honey Love crossover bra, maybe more than any other bra ever. It's comfortable and supportive and can be for all shapes and sizes of boobs. I don't have to pull it down or adjust all day because it's actually comfortable and fits me and my body. And if you are tired of bras that cause bulging in the back. Honeylove's bras are designed with back smoothing fabric to prevent bra bulge. Check out their V neck bra for a totally smooth fit under clothing. It offers the support of a traditional bra without the uncomfortable underwire. It has molded cups that are designed to lift and separate. It's not a shelf like bra so you won't get a uni boob effect. Treat yourself to the most comfortable bra on Earth and save 20 off site wide at honeylove.com forever. Use our exclusive link to get 20 off honeylove.com forever. After you purchase they'll ask you where you heard about them and please support our show and tell them we sent you. Treat yourself to Honey Love because you deserve it.

[Elise Hu]

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[Dory Shafrir]

Yes. So I've actually used this to great results. I used to have a leave in conditioner from Prose which I liked. Yeah. But I was like I think my hair is feeling a little dry. And I went into their review and Refine Feedback tool. I told them this and they sent me a conditioner to use in the shower like a regular conditioner and it has made a world of difference. I also have adjusted the fragrance. You know I do like a touch of fragrance sometimes in my shampoo. Yeah. You know I'm very picky about fragrance so I'm always tweaking. But I love the Prose fragrances. They're. They're like the perfect hint of fragrance.

[Elise Hu]

Yes, yes, subtle. So whether you're looking for stronger strands or brighter skin, discover the difference of custom hair and skin care that's made just for you.

[Dory Shafrir]

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[Elise Hu]

Little luxury now and then, and the best kind of luxury is the one you can afford. Quince offers a range of high quality items at prices within reach like 100 Mongolian cashmere sweaters from $50. Washable silk tops and dresses, organic cotton sweaters, 14 karat jewelry. That's 50 to 80% less than a similar brands. And denim. Right door.

[Dory Shafrir]

Oh yeah, they have amazing denim. I just got my first pair of jeans from Quint. I got the comfort stretch high rise relax straight jeans. I know that's a lot of adjectives. They're like a, like a, like a semi wide leg with a high rise with a little bit of stretch. And they are just, they're just perfect. I'm wearing, literally wearing them right now. I've worn them almost like almost every day since I got them. They're the jeans I was looking for and they're $50. You would think these are like designer jeans.

[Elise Hu]

I love it.

[Dory Shafrir]

I'm fully obsessed.

[Elise Hu]

Amazing. Well, Quince also cuts out the cost of the middleman, which is probably why they're $50. And passes those savings on. And only works with factories that use safe, ethical and responsible manufacturing practices and premium fabrics that you can tell are in Dory's jeans. And Quince only works with factories that use safe, ethical and responsible manufacturing practices and premium fabrics and finishes.

[Dory Shafrir]

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[Unnamed Speaker 1]

My dad works in B2B marketing. He came by my school for career day and said he was a big roas man. Then he told everyone how much he loved calculating his return on ad spend. My friends still laugh at me to this day.

[LinkedIn Advertiser]

Not everyone gets B2B but with LinkedIn you'll be able to reach people who do. Get $100 credit on your next ad campaign. Go to LinkedIn.com results to claim your credit. That's LinkedIn.com results. Terms and conditions apply. LinkedIn the place to be. To be.

[Dory Shafrir]

All right, we are back with a question that I just love. All right, I will read it. Hi there. I have a sort of random question. Where do you shop for quote cool tween clothes? My daughter is ten and a half and starting to take a strong interest in her wardrobe. I love this for her and want to nurture her self expression. But I'm not sure where to shop with her for clothes that are cool but still age appropriate. Elise Your daughter is obviously quite cool, so I thought you might have a little insight in this area also. I know this is a small thing in light of everything, but I'm trying to stay sane by leaning into the things I can control that and calling my senators a ton. Thank you both for this pod. It's a consistent bright spot.

[Elise Hu]

Oh, that is very sweet. And that's really sweet. We talked about this last week. But keep up the calls. Sustaining calls to your lawmakers about whatever issue you care about. A lot matters. Yes. We talked about how the right wing continuously calls on every matter and that that skews reality for lawmakers because they're judging the pulse of America by these calls. So you can influence that. You can influence their unscientific surveys by calling a lot and calling consistently.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah. And I think it's important to call wherever you are, but especially if you are in Republican controlled states. Yes, yes, please, please keep calling. But also, you know, also in places that have Democratic representation, like, we need to be telling those. Those representatives to also speak up and keep fighting.

[Elise Hu]

Totally. And they use it to take a pulse on, like, what matters to people. So, you know, there's the assumption that we all care a lot about the price of eggs and not about Ukrainians, for example, or Gazans or whoever. But if you do call about the issues that matter to you, then that's an opportunity to just kind of, like, help create that or help paint a clearer picture of the mosaic of interests that exist in that district or in that state that you live in.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yes. And now back to the question at hand.

[Elise Hu]

Yes. Yes.

[Dory Shafrir]

Elisa's oldest daughter Ava, was kind enough to record a voice memo for us. Yeah.

[Elise Hu]

Because we couldn't answer the question. Yeah. Yeah.

[Dory Shafrir]

I was like, I don't know.

[Elise Hu]

I don't. I'm not cool.

[Dory Shafrir]

No. But, you know, Ava is very cool. So here we go. I'm gonna play this.

[Ava]

Hi, it's Ava. Thank you for the compliment. And it's so cool that your daughter is starting to get interested in fashion. I think that when I was her age, I really liked Hollister, which is, like, a really good brand, especially for, like, people who are maybe like, smaller, because Hollister has extra, extra small and extra small adult. So you can get small sizes. That's what I did when I was her age. And I also really like Target clothes. Like, Target's starting to get, like, a lot of style and like, like teen fashion style. I also like H M. I like H M. Because they also have extra, extra small and extra small and small. Old Navy has really good jeans. Old Navy has also, like, really soft and cute sweaters and jeans. Jeans are. Jeans are great for, like, Hollister. Like Hollister. I've seen, like, people with short legs or long legs can wear Hollister jeans. Hollister has, like, a really wide range. I feel like Hollister would be the best. Or Target, like Target shirts, Old Navy sweaters, or like basic T shirt. Like the basics. Old Navy has all the basics if you want some basics. And like. Yeah, thank you.

[Elise Hu]

There's so much in there. It's so funny because she's like, when I was her age, 18 months ago. Right.

[Dory Shafrir]

She's 12, so it's not like 12.

[Elise Hu]

Your daughter is 10 and a half. Um, but yeah, so she shop. It sounds like she shops at adult places, but, like in their smallest sizes because she couldn't fit into a lot of the adult clothes when she was ten and a half.

[Dory Shafrir]

I love all these recommendations and also.

[Elise Hu]

That Target is cool now. Like, I remember kind of being ashamed when I was little if I got clothes at Target because it seemed, I guess, not cool. But what, what great marketing and branding work Target has done. Or maybe they've changed their. Obviously they've changed a lot of their vendors and suppliers and so now Target is cool.

[Dory Shafrir]

Well, I think they also just decided to rip off other brands, like Universal. Thread is a madewell knockoff. You know what I mean? Like, they just, they just were like, we're gonna just do this. And honestly, it seems to be working for them, so.

[Elise Hu]

It does. It does seem to be working.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah, it's so, it's so interesting. Like, you know, Henry, he has. He definitely has preferences, but he. And we've taken him shopping once. We actually took him shopping at Target and he picked. He did pick some stuff out that he wanted. Mostly like Halloween themed things that he wears year round. But yeah, he's not really at the. At the age where he has, like, super strong opinions about it. Maybe it is also like a girl boy thing. Like, I don't know.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah. My younger daughters are not as particular about their clothing as my oldest. My oldest is just. She's a Virgo. I always say this. I mean, it's not just because of her star sign, but she's just always been very intentional and deliberate and specific about what she likes, what she doesn't like. And Luna doesn't care. You know, Luna will wear pajamas to school. She often does. You know, she just doesn't have that same aesthetic sense or interest. And then Issa, now that she's nine. She is more into it, but I almost think it's an influence from her sister. And I don't know if it wasn't for having to live in the same house as a tween, whether my middle daughter would be as interested in like certain cuts of jeans or whatnot. I do think Ava has too many clothes. I don't buy clothes for her because I think she has like too many, she's too many pairs of jeans, for example, and just doesn't need it all. But you know, her dad does because she's often shopping on the weekends with Maddie and they're usually with Maddie on the weekend evenings. So they do a lot of shopping. And then also she gets a small allowance. She gets like $12 a week. She gets her age in allowance.

[Dory Shafrir]

That's cool.

[Elise Hu]

And so she just saves up her money. She buys on Depop sometimes she also sells on Depop because all the kids like that's a great resale site for kids. So Depop is another recommendation, I guess from us adults that's a good place to look because the harm of fashion has already been done there and you're recycling rather than.

[Dory Shafrir]

Right.

[Elise Hu]

I have a lot of concerns about fast fashion and so I don't love the idea that she likes H M, you know, but yeah, I, I, I'm doing my, I do buy nothing months as much as possible. And so she, I, I really encourage, especially for clothing that is not going to be trendy a year from now. Just get it on Depop. Get it on Teapot.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah, I think that's a pretty good rule of thumb generally is like check a resale site first. The thing with resale sites is like you, you kind of need to know what you're looking for. There's not as much like browsing as there would be at a, at a, at a non. Secondhand. Non secondhand store that what? But you know what I mean with.

[Elise Hu]

The tweens, they're often following trends. So you can look for that specific FL sweater or that specific numbered T shirt, the one with 87 on it or whatever. So like I actually think for tweens is the great age group because if you're trying to follow the trend of what your friends are wearing or what you're seeing on out there, then you can look for it specifically. So there's that.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah, for sure. Well, so cool that you got Ava to respond. Thank you, Ava. Yeah, thanks for insights and listener. I hope this is helpful for your daughter. All right, we are going to take another Short break and we will be right back.

[Elise Hu]

We'll be right back.

[Dory Shafrir]

All right, we are back. And we have another voicemail.

[Unnamed Caller]

Hey, guys, I have a question about work. I just a little background. I work for a nonprofit, and ever since last week, when or two weeks ago, the threat about federal funding possibly coming to a halt, it has changed the environment and it got everyone a little on edge. And I have felt since that time that my boss has been really switched it up and has been micromanaging me. My question is, how do I approach this conversation? Because I feel like accusing her of being micromanaging isn't probably going to go well. But I also want to be sensitive to the issue at hand, and I understand they probably need to get into the nuances of everyone's role if they're concerned about making cuts. My supervisor before her in the same company was very much a millennial manager and just let us do our job and praised us where she could. I'm having a hard time adjusting. I will take any advice that you've got. Thanks so much for all you do. Talk to you later. Bye.

[Elise Hu]

That's really tough. I'm hearing about that all over the place. And even, like, major foundations who have DEIJ programs because, like, who could argue with equity and inclusion, they're trying to rename it, you know, and just call it something else so that you don't become the target for either culture wars or defunding or whatever it is. And so everybody's trying to be careful and while maintaining their programs, ideally. So just observing what your boss must be going through. I think I'm empathetic to it, but I can see how the management style does have an effect on you. So just want to acknowledge, like, it's difficult all around, and it must be very frustrating for you as somebody who has to report to somebody in power who is kind of stressed out, clearly. Door. What would your advice be in terms of how to handle.

[Dory Shafrir]

So I think in this situation, you want to, like, sort of along the lines of what you were saying. Elise, I. I would really, like, lead with empathy and kind of acknowledge that this is a really difficult time. And I would sort of frame it as, like, how can I help you? Like, maybe we can come up with a plan together of how to sort of approach this. This new world. I wouldn't like, lead with feeling like you're being micromanaged, because I think most managers don't love that feedback, even if it's true, and especially now that she's in a very high stress Situation I also didn't totally get from your voicemail, whether it feels like, like a switch has been flipped ever since, you know, the new administration, or if she was always sort of micromanaging because you said that your old manager was a millennial and let you sort of do what you wanted. So it sounded like this has maybe been going on for a little longer. So I wasn't like totally clear on that, but I think, I think you need to have a conversation with her and maybe discuss like what is realistic for her to check in on and maybe set up some sort of like guardrails there.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah. In any relationship. Yeah. Well, in any relationship, because we're all different, idiosyncratic, unique human beings. You know, what we emotionally need may not be what the other person can emotionally deliver. And so, and I understand it. And that's kind of like a core dynamic of human relations. And so whether it's your boss or with somebody else, what I've been trying to do in my one to one relationships, if something needs to change, is to be very specific about the request. Just like, hey, my core need might be that I need somebody off my back more like. So my core need might be independence. And so flowing from that need, what is my request? You know, my request is maybe check in on me. We need to do fewer check ins. Like I'd like to be checked in on, only on Mondays or I will write to you on Slack to check in instead of having to have like lots of face to face zooms or face to face meetings. And so anyway, if you can get to specific requests and maybe the need at the heart of it and articulate those, that's one step. I mean, who knows? Because I don't know the specific boss, but specific requests always help because then they know like this is, this is a clear, tangible thing that you're asking for.

[Dory Shafrir]

I like that. I also just want to plug that. I have a new column in Slate called Good Job where I am responding to workplace advice questions. So if you have any questions, you can send those over.

[Elise Hu]

Send them to Slate.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah, well, we will link to the column in our show notes and there's a, there's also a link in the column to submit. They want a form, so there's a form to submit for questions.

[Elise Hu]

So yay, and congratulations. Congrats to Door on her new role as a workplace advice columnist. Are you excited about this?

[Dory Shafrir]

Thank you. Yeah, yeah, it's cool.

[Elise Hu]

They have Dear Prudence there. This is like a whole new thing. Yeah, they have Dear Prudence can be kind of wild.

[Dory Shafrir]

They have. Dear Prudence. They have a parenting advice column. They have, like, a sex advice column. So I think they're just trying to sort of, like, expand their advice column purview. And it's going to be. It's me and another great journalist named Laura Helmuth, and we're switching off, so I think it's running twice a week. And mine are coming out on Thursdays, and hers are coming out on Tuesdays.

[Elise Hu]

Awesome.

[Unnamed Speaker 1]

Yeah.

[Dory Shafrir]

So check that out. And we are just gonna end with a Trader Joe's recommendation. A listener named Jen wrote in to say, I highly recommend the Trader Joe's elevated mixed nuts. I got hooked a couple weeks ago, and my husband and I finished.

[Elise Hu]

Sounds so good.

[Dory Shafrir]

A one can in a day or two. I think we buy at least two of these cans per week. I would honestly buy more. It's 5.99 for one can. I just want to note that I think this, like, elevated thing is a new, like, branding for them, because I bought their elevated crackers, like, for cheese and crackers, and they were really good. Like, people were like, whoa, where are these crackers from? And they were definitely, like, more expensive than the typical Trader Joe's crackers. So I'm curious if they're, like, doing this. They're trying to, like, have a premium brand within their brand.

[Elise Hu]

Well, while we're on the subject of. Yes. So the elevated line, I have to try. And then while we're on the subject of Trader Joe's nut mixes, you all know that I ride hard for the everything but the bagel, cashews and almonds. And that's not in a can. It's in a bag. So I see your elevated nut mix. Yeah. And I raise you the everything but the bagel bag of cashews and almonds.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yes. Yes. Love this. Love this wreck. All right, well, thanks, everyone, for listening. Elise. Thank you, as always, and we will talk to you all soon.

[Elise Hu]

Okay. Until next time.

[Dory Shafrir]

Bye. All right, I'm gonna let you in on a secret, Elise.

[Elise Hu]

Okay.

[Dory Shafrir]

I kind of always thought I could be a really great spy.

[Elise Hu]

I could see this.

[Dory Shafrir]

I'm just saying, like. Like a. Like a Jennifer Garner and alias type spy.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah.

[Dory Shafrir]

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[Elise Hu]

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[Dory Shafrir]

I also love just how much of the mental load HelloFresh takes off of me. It's not even so much the cooking, it's the coming up with the ideas of what to make for dinner. Like seriously, it takes that away. They have this one meal that is mozzarella and herb chicken with roasted carrots and this like really nice buttery couscous that is so delicious, it's so flavorful and it's also really filling and also really easy. So it like hits all of my hits all of my requirements.

[Elise Hu]

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