Bears - Cowboys, must win for Ben Johnson

Summary

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Forward Progress - A Chicago Bears Podcast

Episode: Bears - Cowboys, Must Win for Ben Johnson
Hosts: Dan Bernstein, Matt Abbatacola
Date: September 17, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode centers on the Chicago Bears’ looming matchup against the Dallas Cowboys, which both hosts categorize as a “must win”—particularly for new head coach Ben Johnson. Dan and Matt break down the stakes, analyze both teams’ glaring defensive struggles, and dive into the development—or lack thereof—of rookie quarterback Caleb Williams. Key Bears personnel issues, coaching accountability, and the culture of leadership both on and off the field are scrutinized in detail with characteristic candor and humor.

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Main Discussion Themes & Key Insights

1. Bears vs. Cowboys: “Get Well Game” or Rock Bottom?

Timestamps: 00:15–06:32

• Both Chicago and Dallas have severe defensive problems. The Bears are giving up 9.9 yards/attempt (2nd worst), Cowboys 9.4 (4th worst).

• The defensive schemes, notably the “bend but don’t break” Tampa 2 under Matt Eberfluss, have failed on both sides: “They’re bend and break at this point.” (Dan, 01:28)

• Both teams are prone to surrendering explosive plays—Cowboys have given up eight 20+ yard and four 40+ yard pass plays, both league worsts.

• Quote:

  “If Colston Loveland cannot play in this game, if he cannot contribute in this game, something is really wrong because he doesn't have to know much in this game. Run straight, run the seam... run the seam and put your hand up.”
  — Dan, 03:44

• Despite the home field and national spotlight, Dan stresses that if the Bears are to reach even a modest seven wins, this is one they must secure.

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2. Offensive Opportunities—And Worries

Timestamps: 04:32–10:39

• Matt questions whether the offense can take advantage: “What about this offense in these two games says they can compete in a shootout?” (05:50)
• Self-inflicted wounds (penalties, long 2nd/3rd downs, turnovers) plague any progress, despite a theoretically easier defense to exploit.
• Concern that Dallas will “run up the scoreboard,” especially as the Bears defense struggles to cover playmakers like CeeDee Lamb.
• Quote:

  “I just can't see the Bears defense stopping them from scoring and... I can't see the Bears offense getting out of its own way to match those points.”
  — Matt, 06:32

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3. Personnel Issues and Depth Concerns

Timestamps: 13:23–20:59

• Bears are battered: Jalen Johnson (out), TJ Edwards (week-to-week), Kyler Gordon (week-to-week), Grady Jarrett (playing injured).

• Backups with limited upside or experience are being thrust into starting roles, leading to existential questions about the depth chart and drafting.

• Notable exchange:

  “What is there? You don't have to know the playbook to be a defensive tackle. What's stopping him from getting on the field?”
  — Dan, 15:27
  “That should be the position... yeah, get out on the field, stop the run, get the quarterback.”
  — Matt, 15:38

• Critique of recent draft picks—high selections (like Shemar Turner) and free agency signings are underperforming or inactive.

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4. Front Office & Roster-Building Failures

Timestamps: 20:59–29:09

• Sharp criticism of GM Ryan Poles’ penchant for veteran signings (“stop signing 30-year-olds”), drafting special teams players early, and an inability to find contributors in rounds 1–3.

• “Maybe draft football players that can play on your team immediately... in the first round, definitely the second, maybe the third round...”
  — Matt, 20:59

• Matt & Dan ask: How many Pro Bowlers has Poles drafted?

  “Zero. And they just lost their one.”
  — Dan, 29:05

• The episode reflects deep exasperation at a lack of game-changing picks and the perpetual cycle of losing offseasons and drafts.

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5. Coaching Accountability & Practice Habits

Timestamps: 37:03–46:05

• Breaking news during the episode: Ben Johnson tells media, “Our practice habits are yet to reflect a championship caliber team” (Dan, 43:36)
• Both hosts dissect whether this is an honest admission or a scapegoating tactic.
• Concerns raised about team culture: Are the players or coaches at fault? Is this a shot at the GM’s assembly of talent?
• Quote:

  “When publicly you indict the whole roster, privately everyone knows you’re not... you’ve got whispering going on about who’s dogging it at practice... This is the kind of thing that contributes to losing cultures.”
  — Dan, 45:20

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6. Leadership Void on the Roster

Timestamps: 47:30–48:22

• Lack of “internal cops”:

  “That shit doesn’t slide when you have someone in the locker room step up and knock this shit off.”
  — Matt, 48:11

• Who leads the team? Discussion on candidates like Cole Kmet, but clear uncertainty lingers.
• Leadership, both from coaches and among players, is seen as a missing ingredient in building a winning culture.

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7. Is Ben Johnson the Right Leader?

Timestamps: 38:16–44:09

• Matt shares his wife’s corporate-executive perspective: Johnson doesn’t project strong leadership qualities.

• Dan is not yet convinced this is a problem, but notes “his body language has been bad” since the 0–2 start.

• Quote:

  “If we're already talking about the fundamental essence of leadership, that should be determined at the job interview.”
  — Dan, 40:23

• The hosts debate whether early warning signs of leadership issues should alarm fans.

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Memorable Quotes & Moments with Timestamps

• “They're bend and break at this point.” — Dan Bernstein, 01:28
• “If Colston Loveland cannot play in this game... something is really wrong.” — Dan Bernstein, 03:44
• “What about this offense in these two games says that they can compete in a shootout? Nothing.” — Matt Abbatacola and Dan Bernstein, 05:50–05:56
• “Stop signing 30-year-olds. It rarely helps.” — Dan Bernstein, 20:03
• “Zero. And they just lost their one.” — Dan Bernstein, 29:05 (on Pro Bowlers drafted)
• “Our practice habits are yet to reflect a championship caliber team.” — Ben Johnson (relayed by Dan), 43:36
• “When publicly you indict the whole roster... this is the kind of thing that contributes to losing cultures.” — Dan Bernstein, 45:20

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Notable Segments & Timestamps

• Bears vs. Cowboys Defensive Struggles: 00:15–03:44
• Offensive Opportunities & Issues: 04:32–10:39
• Personnel Problems & Injuries: 13:23–20:59
• Draft/GM Critique: 20:59–29:09
• Culture/Practice Accountability: 37:03–46:05
• Leadership Discussion: 47:30–48:22

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Tone and Style

Consistently passionate, irreverent, and unsparingly critical, Dan and Matt toggle between analytical and raw emotional takes, blending stats-heavy analysis with a fan’s exasperation. Their dialogue is peppered with inside jokes and deep football knowledge, all delivered in the language of true, long-suffering Bears followers.

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Summary Takeaway

The consensus: This is a critical moment for the Bears, their new coach, and their front office. The matchup with Dallas is both a “must-win” and a microcosm of larger, systemic issues—shoddy drafting, leadership concerns, and questionable front office strategy. The episode crackles with urgency, skepticism, and a call for real progress—on the field and in the locker room.

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Next Episode Preview:
Courtney Cronin joins the show for further inside perspective; discussion on Tom Brady’s broadcast "conflict of interest" follows.

Transcript

[Dan Bernstein]

10219219.

[Matt Abaticola]

Forward progress A Chicago Bears podcast with Dan Bernstein and Matt Abeticola on 312 Sports.

[Dan Bernstein]

Let's talk Bears on forward progress. Dan Bernstein, Matt Abaticola and the 02 Bears now will reconvene for practice after their day off. First normal week that they've had with a Sunday to Sunday interv here now with the opportunity to come home on national TV once again, the featured game and try to beat a team that is as bad, if not worse at defense than they are.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah, it's as of right now, looking at the numbers, they're, they're equally as bad. And Dan, since 1970, 400 teams have started the season with an 02 record. 38 of those teams have reached the playoffs. That's 9.5%. So the odds of making the playoffs starting 02 are quite low since 1990. Let's go a little sooner. 32 of the 279 teams have made the playoffs. So you're right around 10% chance of making the playoffs after starting 02. But yeah, the Dallas Cowboys are, statistically speaking, just as bad. Slightly, slightly better than the Bears from what the numbers tell us. As far as their defense is concerned.

[Dan Bernstein]

They're uniquely bad for a team that runs the defense that they run. It's the Matt Eberfluss defense and he's been relatively successful even with the Bears in playing a bend but not break style and their bend and break at this point. Because the whole idea of the Tampa 2 is to force a team to march down the field with a lot of plays and very few mistakes and make sure that you get every chance as a defense to turn them over or force them off of schedule. And sometimes you can do that and it can mitigate a team that isn't all that good. But when you're giving up the big plays that they're giving up, it is the exact opposite of what the COVID 2 base is designed to do.

[Matt Abaticola]

Do you think maybe he made a mistake when he handed out his syllabus and instead of bend, don't break, he wrote bend and break. And the players were like, hey, we need to bend and also break. And if you look at the number of plays they have right now, the Cowboys are giving up on defense, on passing attempts, 9.4 yards per attempt, slightly better than the Bears, 9.9. But that 9.4 is fourth worst in the NFL. The Bears are second worst right now. They've also given up those big plays you mentioned, eight passing yards of 20 or more. I'm sorry, eight plays of 20 or more passing yards and then they have given up four plays of 40 or more yards. So that's big, big, big. Those are both worst in the NFL.

[Dan Bernstein]

This is a get well game and I'm not making any predictions, but if you start saying, oh, the bears will go seven and 10 this year, this has to be one of the seven. You've got to get to seven somehow. And this would a home game coming off of two losses with still relative compared to how they're going to look in November and December, still relative health that you got to win this game. And the defense is begging for you. The Cowboys defense is begging for you to get this figured out. And the good news is, because you know what you're getting, you're not going to see anything exotic. If you can block well enough, just run verticals, stress their their zone, take the top off the zone. This is a get well game for all your whether is D.J. morgan happy that nobody's finding him? If Colston Loveland cannot play in this game, if he cannot contribute in this game, something is really wrong because he doesn't have to know much in this game. Run straight, run the seam, run the seam every time. Run the seam and put your hand up.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah, you know, I agree with you, Dan, but we don't know what the philosophy is going into this game with the tight ends. Are they going to be held back for protection like they did in the Vikings game? Has he not practiced hard enough to be a big enough part of the game plan? Because that was brought up.

[Dan Bernstein]

No. Let me answer the first part first. No, they're not going to be needed for protection because Matt Eberfluss doesn't generally like to blitz. This is not Brian Flores. This is not a bunch of exotics that you're preparing for. This is a team where you can beat their blitz because people are open, throw it to them. It's been, it's happened to him all year. The Giants torched them. Absolutely torched them. The Bears should too.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah, I don't disagree with the fact that they should, but their offense hasn't shown me enough to say that they can put together a complete game. And they're hurting themselves more than the defense is hurting them. The defenses they're playing against, they can't go a series without committing a penalty. They can't get out of second and long or third and long situations. If they don't move the ball on first down and gain some positive yards and they put themselves in a hole, they have not shown these two games to be able to fight against that. Now the Dallas Cowboys defense is going to give them the opportunities to do so. But I also look on the flip side. I mean this, this could be an ugly game as far as just points. Points run up on the scoreboard on both sides of it.

[Dan Bernstein]

Great. That makes it fun where that deck.

[Matt Abaticola]

And ugly as far as an ugly defensive game.

[Dan Bernstein]

But win a shootout, I don't mind. Hey, good old fashioned country shootout, right?

[Matt Abaticola]

But what about this offense in these two games says that they can compete in a shootout?

[Dan Bernstein]

Nothing.

[Matt Abaticola]

Right? Nothing.

[Dan Bernstein]

But this is different because these defenses are worse.

[Matt Abaticola]

Okay. Yeah. No, I mean, yeah, it's there for the taking and it's basically a pick them game. If you look at it from a Vegas standpoint. I just don't know how the defense is going to keep the Cowboys from scoring and allow the Bears offense to stay out of its own way and get more points on the board to be more productive.

[Dan Bernstein]

And just don't lose the turnover battle. If you're giving away possessions, you're in trouble. So take, if they, if they take care of the football and they can pass protect, they should win this game.

[Matt Abaticola]

Dak Prescott is thrown for 549 yards. That's fifth best in the league through two games. Completion percentage near 72 touchdowns, one interception, a rating of 89. First down plays they throw about 31% of the times they've had five plays of 20 yards or more for passing. He's been sacked three times so for loss of 18 yards. So I mean they haven't gotten to him quite a bit in those two games. He does have the ability to throw the ball downfield and I just, I think CD Lamb is going to go off like crazy this weekend. I just, I just do. Tell me who's in a guard. Him. Who's going to prevent him from getting 200 yards, 300 yards this game? You know they're going to have the ability to throw the football. I just, I can't see the Bears defense stopping them from scoring and. And I can't see the Bears offense getting out of its own way to match those points.

[Dan Bernstein]

I want to hear Dennis Allen tomorrow because Thursday is coordinator day and maybe he's just kind of not used to the way things work, but I didn't like it last week when he got a little pissy with the media over continuing to ask him questions about the previous game. So he'd better understand.

[Matt Abaticola]

Wait, Media availability day. He was mad because they asked him about the previous game, even though they hadn't talked to him yet.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah. Oh, I guess you guys are still going to be asking questions about Minnesota. I don't know. Because they've moved on to Detroit. Nobody cares. Nobody in that room with a tape recorder cares.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah.

[Dan Bernstein]

What you've moved on to because you're going to. There are questions about what happened in the fourth quarter of the previous game and the. That was a historically bad defensive performance in the last game, one of the worst defensive performances in the history of the Chicago Bears. Does he really think that all the questions tomorrow are going to be about how they're preparing for the Cowboys and Dak Prescott? Does he really think that?

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah, they can't. Especially when the NFC player of Week one was the quarterback they won against. And the winner of Week two is going to be Jared Goff.

[Dan Bernstein]

It is. It already is.

[Matt Abaticola]

Oh, did they name it? I'm sorry. I totally. I didn't even see that. I thought they hadn't named it yet. But the fact that you've gone against two quarterbacks and both have been named NFC Player of the Week, especially after J.J. mcCarthy looked awful in Atlanta and then suffered an ankle injury, but your two quarterbacks you've gone against have been an NFC Player of the week.

[Dan Bernstein]

And if you're not prepared to step up and answer those questions and, or take blame and point the thumb at yourself and tell everybody what's going to get better and how it's going to get better, then that, especially for somebody who's been a head coach a couple of times already in the league, to not get that is weird. And why do we wait for Thursday to talk to coordinators?

[Matt Abaticola]

I don't know, man.

[Dan Bernstein]

I just know that the way it used to be is the game's over. You talk to everybody.

[Matt Abaticola]

Well, we'll talk to Courtney tomorrow. Courtney Cronin will join us here on Forward Progress, and we'll get a little from the inside perspective, her being around the team every day, because I'm curious to know why there's all the. All the virtual. All the virtual stuff takes place like Ben Johnson. Yesterday was Grady Jarrett and DeAndre Swift. I thought all that stuff was done like live at Hallis. But. And maybe that's been going like that for a few years now.

[Dan Bernstein]

I think it has. But I think that the coaches stand there in front of actual reporters on Monday. I don't know why that's. Maybe just everybody kind of said, oh, it's easier and we don't have to get in the car and drive up to hell on a Monday.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah, we'll ask her as we have her on the show tomorrow. The Cowboys right now through two games are, are gaining 6.4 yards per pass play, 5.1 yards per carry.

[Dan Bernstein]

Okay.

[Matt Abaticola]

Bears defense has given up 9.9, 31st in the league and 5.3 on carries, 28th in the league. So again, I, I, you know, yeah, it's going to be a shootout. I just, I can't see the Bears offense cleaning it up enough to get out of their own way to score enough points to win the game Sunday at home.

[Dan Bernstein]

The worry is penalties more than anything else. Penalties and turnovers. Yeah. And if you avoid those, you're fine. If you stay on schedule against this team, you're going to have your spots. And he's going to have to have just enough time to drop back and find somebody running free because there is no way that this defense, the way the Cowboys have it constructed and the way they have it game planned, can stop lots of vertical routes. This is a, this is a get well stat game. This is where if I'm Roman Dunes a, I want 200 yards receiving and two more touchdowns to pad my total. That's how I'm going into this.

[Matt Abaticola]

All right, then who guards CD Lam?

[Dan Bernstein]

Well, you're going to have to stop.

[Matt Abaticola]

Him from running up and down the field.

[Dan Bernstein]

You're going to have to bracket him obviously that it's, that you're not, that's not going to be a one on one. And I don't know if Dennis Allen can play Cover 1 and not have more resources devoted to CD Lamb, but that's okay. Just outscore him. Just don't settle for field goals. Okay? Don't settle for field goals. Got to win this game 43 to 42. Go ahead and do it and just entertain the hell out of us for an entire afternoon.

[Matt Abaticola]

You know, talking about the Bears secondary, you know, there's only been so far through two games, there's only been one pick six in the league so far this year.

[Dan Bernstein]

Nayshaun Wright.

[Matt Abaticola]

Nayshaun Wright was your guy and I was looking up the next gen stats. This is really interesting. His 74 yard interception return against the Vikings against JJ McCarthy is the current 10th longest play in the NFL this season.

[Dan Bernstein]

Huh?

[Matt Abaticola]

At 88.7 yards. Looking up the next gen stats. Do you do a lot of that? Do you look up the next gen stats stuff a lot?

[Dan Bernstein]

I don't generally look them up myself. If I, if they're used in something I read to make a larger point I, I certainly accept their validity as a data point. I don't look at next gen the way I look at Statcast or base or other more, you know, the measurable, modern measurable baseball stats.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah, I don't, I don't look. I haven't looked it up at all actually, until this when I when I was looking up stats here of Cowboys and Bears and saw that there's only been one pick six the entire season. Knowing it was your guy. Nishan Wright wanted to see where it fell in and to see that it was the 10th longest play of the season was pretty interesting. But only one pick six and it's your guy. So hopefully he has an impact Sunday against Dak Prescott again. I just don't know if they're going to be able to match the output that I think the Cowboys are going to put on the Bears defense.

[Dan Bernstein]

We know the defense is going to be undermanned because Jalen Johnson is out. We're still waiting on imaging or decisions. I don't know if they've done the.

[Matt Abaticola]

Imaging or just sharing the information.

[Dan Bernstein]

Right. We might hear it from Johnson via Twitter, knowing him and just have him say what he's if he's deciding to get surgery or not or they're seeking other opinions. So TJ Edwards week to week so he's going to be out for a while. Kyler Gordon week to week going to be out for a while. Jalen Johnson is out. So Grady Jarrett was on a bad knee. We know that. So I don't know what the expectations are for him right now and what they're going to ask of him.

[Matt Abaticola]

Well, he, he met with the media yesterday and was asked about his knee. He said his knee is doing well. As he went on to talk more about it, he said it's not 100% treating his knee to mitigate the injury. On game day though, he says, quote, ready to roll and put his best foot forward. Also says that it's not his first rodeo dealing with in season mishaps. Got to do what you got to do until he gets all the way back to 100%. So that was, that was what he said. So he has to do what he has to do until he gets all the way back to 100%. So we know he's less than 100%. It certainly has been evident in his play the first two games. I think we all expected to see a lot more. I just don't know like how long has his knee been bothering him for? Is it previous injury that he come into the bears not 100% on that leg. And so he's clearly not 100% and says that he's not 100%.

[Dan Bernstein]

Okay, so when does she mart Turner play? You already cut Zach Pickens, another top three pick from this team that's been cut.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah.

[Dan Bernstein]

So you got a second round pick who's known for his aggressiveness. There are reasons why certain positions are complicated and people can't get on the field. Defensive tackle should not be one of them.

[Matt Abaticola]

It shouldn't be, you would think, in their, in their rotation for sure.

[Dan Bernstein]

What is there? You don't have to know the playbook to be a defensive tackle. What's stopping him from getting on the field?

[Matt Abaticola]

Well, again, you know, we look back at what Ben Johnson talked about this week. Who wants to practice hard, who wants to be involved in a game plan going Sunday, we don't know if that was again targeted at those three individuals, those names that were brought up, or if that was a blanketed statement for just the offense or if it's for the entire team. So we don't know. As far as the depth chart, guys that are reserves and backups, are they doing enough to get more playing time are like, who is not practicing hard, who's not what they've seen on film, who's not doing what needs to be done to get more, more playing time. And is it so bad that a less than 100% starter should get more of the snaps because the backup just isn't trying hard enough, Isn't practicing hard enough? I don't get it. But, but in that one position, that should be the position where, yeah, get out on the field, stop the run, get the quarterback.

[Dan Bernstein]

And we know we're going to see some guys who've been struggling who have to play. Tyreek Stevenson is, is your most experienced cornerback right now and he gave up, I believe, a near perfect passer rating on balls that came his way in the previous game.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah.

[Dan Bernstein]

And that is, he's your number one corner, like it or not. And then it's Nishan Wright and after that it's Nick McLeod. You keep seeing that name out there with. It's a great question. Who is Nick McLeod? If we're already talking about essentially a Bears starter and we're asking who are you and what do you do? Nick McLeod is a 6191 pound cornerback who went to Notre Dame. He was an undrafted free agent out of Notre Dame in 2021 and he has been bouncing around the back ends of rosters Since May of 2021 Buffalo free agent there, waived waiver claim to Cincinnati. Waived by Cincinnati, practice squad in Buffalo, activated for a game in Buffalo, waived by Buffalo, claimed by the Giants, then got an RFA tender by the Giants, actually played there a little bit and then left the Giants to go to San Francisco and was on the practice squad there, activated for a little bit and unrestricted free agent after last year and the Bears signed him.

[Matt Abaticola]

So he's a guy.

[Dan Bernstein]

He's maybe a guy.

[Matt Abaticola]

Maybe a guy. Not even a guy.

[Dan Bernstein]

No, he's usually. He's the kind of guy who you see after you're really hurt. That's like December level hurt. When most practice squad guy. With the guys who are not Week three, Right. With the guys who are now driving an Amazon truck are going to be at a practice squad. The guys who are.

[Matt Abaticola]

Go ahead. I'm sorry.

[Dan Bernstein]

The guys who are doing actual jobs are eventually going to be at a practice squad near the end of the year.

[Matt Abaticola]

Am I seeing this right the way. Did Turner not get on the field at all?

[Dan Bernstein]

No, he was inactive lines.

[Matt Abaticola]

Oh, he was inactive.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah. Yes. He was one of the Ryan poles high draft picks who remained inactive.

[Matt Abaticola]

Okay.

[Dan Bernstein]

He would a third round pick in Amagadji. And you had two second round picks in Turner and Tropillo.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah, that totally slipped my mind. I just, I don't get it. Especially when, when, when he's not healthy, like Jared's just not healthy. How do you not have extra legs in that, in that area of the field?

[Dan Bernstein]

And I'm so tired. I'm so tired of these, these bad old free agent signings with the argument being made of, well, as a leader in the locker room, that's always. You're telling me you think he's bad, he's not going to matter. You lead through your play, you lead through your example, you lead through what you're getting done on the field. What would Grady Jarrett be doing in the locker room? Come on. It's just. And they said the same thing about Keenan Allen.

[Matt Abaticola]

Isn't a veteran player supposed to be helping the younger players? And how can the younger players get better and learn from that guy if they're not playing?

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, you don't. If a guy's sitting in the tub, what do they learn?

[Matt Abaticola]

Right. How to take care of injuries.

[Dan Bernstein]

Right. What do you learn? Yeah, what do you learn? Stop signing 30 year olds. It rarely helps. It rarely, rarely, rarely works to your advantage. And it's often just a sign of a team in bad shape. It's a team that's drafted bad when you have to sign 30 year olds and even Joe Tuney. Yeah, it's a left guard. He's a Pro bowl level left guard for some time. That is just a minimal impact on your team. Above replacement level left guard, you'd rather have it. It's better. But that's another one. You have veteran leadership. We fall for that Okie doke all the time. Good. It's a young man's game, more so than ever. The twitchier, faster, more explosive younger.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah, I was going to say, instead of signing the older veterans to be leaders, maybe draft football players that can play on your team immediately. That might be the better route to go. Someone should point that out to Ryan Polls. Hey, draft guys that can start maybe in the. Definitely the first round, definitely the second, maybe the third round, maybe those guys are guys that should be starting on your football team and leave the grizzled veterans elsewhere and have those young guys that can play an entire season and impact a game. Maybe have those guys play.

[Dan Bernstein]

And there's usually a reason that those guys become available. Joe Tunney became available from the Chiefs because he was too old and expensive and they had to make some decisions.

[Matt Abaticola]

Because they've signed their center, right?

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah. Creed Humphrey.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah.

[Dan Bernstein]

And the other, they had another offensive lineman too in there whose name escapes me at the moment. But we always see this and we always fall for the same thing. Well, you know, he's a great talker and he's been so productive. Okay, well, what is he at the moment? What is he now? How does he help? And I hope Grady Jarrett comes back and contributes and is terrific. But right now all your team leadership is a guy who's. Who's limping around the field.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah. And you know, he just said Yesterday he's not 100% and is working his way back to get to 100%. And you know, maybe, maybe that happens in a few weeks, maybe it doesn't this year because of age and trying to play through it. It just, it never gets to 100% again. That just add that to the list of things that the general manager who's here through 2029 has done as far as free agency is concerned.

[Dan Bernstein]

All right. Something else that has to happen this week, I think is figuring out how to properly deploy your running backs to make them something other than the least effective in the league. Is that too much to ask?

[Matt Abaticola]

No, it's not too much to ask. But again, there are just so many issues to clean up on the offensive side of the football There's, There's. There's too many things to fix in this game.

[Dan Bernstein]

I would say. I would say commit to the run and pound away at the run, but this is the wrong game for that because they're past defenses where you can clobber them and they're going to come out in the zone and you can, you can, you can just crack the zone. Crack their zone.

[Matt Abaticola]

But how do you know that they're the Cowboys front four won't create enough pressure to disrupt what they want to do passing wise. I mean, asking to take the top off and get downfield. Yeah, they haven't yet, but they haven't played the Bears offensive line yet either.

[Dan Bernstein]

Well, it's funny because I think the Bears offensive line would be okay if I trusted their left tackle, and I don't because I think you just. You just push him back the moment the ball is snapped. You don't have to be fancy with Braxton Jones. He's just. His ass is too high in the air. His pad level gets high. He doesn't have his feet underneath him. And you can just push him back into the quarterback every time.

[Matt Abaticola]

Okay, and so that says pass protection. How?

[Dan Bernstein]

Well, you can move Caleb Williams away from that side or you can have.

[Matt Abaticola]

Your tight ends there to help. Correct?

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, but that's them away from the passing game. Yeah. You're already done. You got to get them down the field. This is, this is a. This is a Colston Loveland breakout game is what this has to be.

[Matt Abaticola]

I hope so. I hope so. Maybe that's. That's a number we can look at for our picks for tomorrow.

[Dan Bernstein]

I'll be really interested to look at that number because this absolutely should be. Because he doesn't have to do anything. Just be a wide receiver, be a big wide receiver and, you know, number 84 should be in the middle of the field with a matchup against a linebacker in the zone and using his body and his ability to shield him off and just get the ball there and let him make some plays on it.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah. And that's why I'm excited tomorrow to talk to Courtney about that question she asked Ben Johnson when he gave us the whole answer of guys aren't practicing hard enough. We'll see who wants to practice hard to be part of the game plan for Sunday. Is he one of those guys? Is that why in the first two games we haven't seen him make an impact and even be part of the packages that are used to move the ball downfield?

[Dan Bernstein]

I don't know. I don't know. I hope they're looking at it the way we're looking at it. And this goes back to the question that we've had about the Bears coaches and what are they seeing and what were their expectations? I mean, I'd love to know. We said this after the first game, but I would really like to know how this tracks with where they thought they were coming out of camp and whether all the rhetoric was just kind of whistling into the wind or whether they really believed it, that they believed that there's no reason why we can't win now. I see a ton of reasons why they can't win now. Did they see those things at the end of training camp?

[Matt Abaticola]

Well, Dan, everything they've shared with us about training camp, it was a great training camp. And the defense was great. You know, we get the first game that was very winnable, that they choked away with the defense in the fourth quarter. And we still got, you know, Ben Johnson saying he's learning who Caleb Williams is. He's getting to know the players still. But I just. I can't imagine that they came out of training camp and said, yeah, it's going to be a real mess. Like, there's no way they thought that maybe. They didn't think, yeah, oh, we could win now. But there's no way that after two games that he's sitting around going, yeah, this is kind of what I thought we were going to be. This is the team that I saw in training camp. This is what I thought we put out of the field when the games matter. There's. There's absolutely no way.

[Dan Bernstein]

See, I don't think so either. And I don't think when Ryan Polls sat down with Ben Johnson and made his pitch, and I know Johnson said, I want the job. I want the job. I want the job. Do you think Polls said, hey, this is. This is a heavy lift. We've. We've got a long way to go here. Our roster is not as competitive as we need it to be. We've had some misses here, and it's going to take some time to put this back up among certainly within the division where we're going to be competitive day in and day out. So, hey, Ben, get Caleb on the right track. Get him fixed. We'll work on everything else. But the most important thing you can do is reclaim and restore Caleb Williams.

[Matt Abaticola]

I don't think so.

[Dan Bernstein]

I don't think so, either.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah, I don't think so because Ryan Poles hasn't shown me a consistent ability to Evaluate talent properly. So there's no way he sat down and had that conversation that, hey, this is a heavy lift. Get Caleb Williams on the right track. That's our main goal for this year. He went out and spent money on the interior of the offensive line. He brought in defensive players that he thought were going to have an impact with an offensive line to have an impact to win games this year. There's zero shot that he sat down with Ben and said, it's going to be a heavy lift. Your main goal is to get Caleb right. Zero chance of that.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah. And ironically, the Bears off seasons have been where they make the most news.

[Matt Abaticola]

And in large part because they win every off season.

[Dan Bernstein]

Sadly, though, they don't win the most important part of the off season, getting the right players.

[Matt Abaticola]

What do you mean?

[Dan Bernstein]

Draft night.

[Matt Abaticola]

Oh, get. Yeah, no, I mean that's. And that's. That's been consistent with him as the GM, and yet he's here through 2029 for more drafts. Yeah, we have 26, 27, 28, 29. Four more drafts. That's a potential. Of how many players a draft? What do you get? Average how many players they bring in? 8 to 10 to 12.

[Dan Bernstein]

Well, depending on undrafted free agents. Yeah, depending on how many of those picks you trade away.

[Matt Abaticola]

Okay, so let's, let's.

[Dan Bernstein]

Seven or eight conservative.

[Matt Abaticola]

That's. Let's say 24 more players and that maybe two become starters. Three. What's his numbers at.

[Dan Bernstein]

And how. How many Pro Bowlers?

[Matt Abaticola]

None.

[Dan Bernstein]

Zero.

[Matt Abaticola]

Zero. Pro Bowlers.

[Dan Bernstein]

Zero. And they just lost their one.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yes. Yeah. Your. Your best player in defense is gone for the. For the year. Most likely in that injury that is completely unrelated to the previous injury that he had.

[Dan Bernstein]

I think the narrative of the season changes with a win, even if it is just, you know, by the skin of their teeth. 38 to 33 win. They need it so badly. They shouldn't need it this badly. But this whole Bears thing is too desperate, too soon, too soon in the season, too soon for these coaches. And I don't want to hear, well, it takes time. And, you know, it took a while with the Lions. That was an organization, a very different place. And this. If they're honest about it, it's different. If they say, if this were Theo Epstein who walked in and said, hey, basically, it's going to be ugly for a while, I can write your columns for you. I know what you're going to say, and I'm prepared for it. And if you go back and actually listen to that press conference, it's hilarious because he basically said, you're all gonna act like idiots. I know you're gonna act like idiots. Don't pretend you're not gonna act like idiots' cause you're gonna pretend to not understand what's going on. But we understand what was going on. That was such a whip your dick out moment. And go back. And then all the people who collected everything that was said, like, this guy doesn't walk on water. This guy doesn't. This. This doesn't make any sense. Why are they losing so much? You don't recover from losing. You learn how to lose. Losing becomes craz cultural and they win the World Series. But the Bears didn't do any of that. The Bears. The Bears are not saying, we're committed to Ben Johnson. We're committing to Ryan Poles. They're on the same timetable.

[Matt Abaticola]

We're committed to Caleb Williams.

[Dan Bernstein]

Just be patient. It's going to take time, but it will get there.

[Matt Abaticola]

Because you know who does that? General managers that build their team through the draft. And Ryan Poles has been unable to do that, and yet he has four more drafts to do that for the Chicago Bears. His ability to successfully diagnose and assess talent has just been bad. Bad. Whether it's free agency or it's through the draft, he has not been good at evaluating talent. He's just not. Tell me I'm wrong and I can give you a list of players to show you that it's not incorrect.

[Dan Bernstein]

Well, he can't be wrong about the quarterback. He can't. He cannot be wrong.

[Matt Abaticola]

I mean. I mean. But, you know, but here's the thing, though. If he is. If he is wrong on Caleb Williams, you know, he's not the only one in that area. Now, there are some. Caleb's not going to be the guy that they think he is, but a majority of people, including us, thought that. That he would be that guy at the NFL level.

[Dan Bernstein]

Okay, let me bring this up just to kind of rub salt in. In the wound here that you're kind of. That you're just. As long as you're just kind of picking at this, I might as well do this. Do you see the numbers for Tyler Warren? I want you to look, I believe he's among the best. The Colts tight end who so far, I think he's. He's up there. And he was nominated for NFL Rookie of the Week in for the. For the second week. And this was the tight end that everybody wanted. Remember, he had four receptions, 79 yards, some critical catches in the Win over the Broncos. And he's. I think he's got like 155 yards or something like that total.

[Matt Abaticola]

He is 11 catches, 16 targets, 11 receptions, 155 yards. He's averaging 14.1 along of 41. He has two carries and he has no touchdowns, though.

[Dan Bernstein]

But can this happen in consecutive years where there's somebody better at the position you draft in the first round, like immediately after you draft?

[Matt Abaticola]

Yes.

[Dan Bernstein]

That's horrible. That's horrible. And it's something I've always done in the NBA. I remember I did a. I took a whole afternoon because somebody asked me to do this, and it was called the next guy theory. And it wasn't basing your pick against everybody available in the draft. It was your pick against the next guy. And it's easier in basketball because positions don't quite mean as much. Especially now in the NBA, everybody's can score and rebound and dribble and shoot and all that stuff. So it's. How, how effective have you been with your pick compared to the very next guy? Very next guy picked.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah. I like that.

[Dan Bernstein]

In football you'd have to change it a little bit because of positionality and because of the very specific nature of what everyone's. It's not apples to apples, but if in consecutive seasons with your pick, you take the wrong guy at that position, that's really damning.

[Matt Abaticola]

When was, when was your guy, Bucky Irving, selected? Isn't he. Wasn't he a fourth round pick?

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah. Running back?

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah.

[Dan Bernstein]

You're running backs anywhere.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah, but I, I'll have to look it up here. But wasn't he, Was he taken, if you could recall, ahead of or after the Bears selected the punter?

[Dan Bernstein]

Oh, don't even start with that.

[Matt Abaticola]

Oh, okay.

[Dan Bernstein]

They've drafted two punters now.

[Matt Abaticola]

Then take it, Take it back. I won't even start.

[Dan Bernstein]

Then they've drafted two punters. This. This punter was the next special punter who can change everything and flip the field and be an incredible weapon, just as they're changing all the kickoff rules so he doesn't really have to do that. And then he hasn't even been that good at the actual punting part of things. You drafted two punters?

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah. You took a punter in the fourth round.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah.

[Matt Abaticola]

A team that just had so many glaring holes.

[Dan Bernstein]

Well, and now in Jake Moody, their emergency kicker, or their kicking threat to the guy who's supposed to be there to scare Kyro Santos and being good, wasn't he. Was he a fourth round pick? Was He a third round pick.

[Matt Abaticola]

Oh, God.

[Dan Bernstein]

Was he really Jake Moody out of Michigan? Yeah, he was supposed to be.

[Matt Abaticola]

I think he might have been.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, I think he was.

[Matt Abaticola]

I think he was.

[Dan Bernstein]

You're right because he was. He was the kicker of kickers who nobody had seen anything like this coming out in forever. Yeah. Third rounder.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah. Good call.

[Dan Bernstein]

2023. Jake Moody was a third round.

[Matt Abaticola]

I remember that.

[Dan Bernstein]

It's only because I, when they, when they got him, I was shocked that a 25 year old kicker with his pedigree was available. But he went mental and they even said it like it was in his head and he just needed to change the scenery and the booter got booted.

[Matt Abaticola]

Oh, man. All right. Tyler Scott, fourth round pick.

[Dan Bernstein]

Cut. Yeah. Don't, don't. You're gonna, you're gonna make yourself really miserable if you start to do this.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah.

[Dan Bernstein]

I'm telling you, you're going to make yourself miserable.

[Matt Abaticola]

Well, Dan, there's. He's got four more. Four more drafts to go for the Bears.

[Dan Bernstein]

Four more. I mean, contractually, contractually speaking.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yes, he does. And I, like you, just cannot have confidence that he has the ability to assess talent properly.

[Dan Bernstein]

Ben Johnson is meeting with the media as we speak and this quote is already circulating. Ben Johnson, quote, no one practice hard.

[Matt Abaticola]

We're not playing Sunday.

[Dan Bernstein]

Quote, our practice habits are yet to reflect a championship caliber team.

[Matt Abaticola]

Okay, we got into this a little bit yesterday and we talked about reasons why guys don't try hard and you put out a list of good reasons behind it. When is it that players don't listen to coaches?

[Dan Bernstein]

Usually when they think the coach is a complete idiot. When they think the coach is going to be fired or at the end of a season that's kind of over and they're just, they don't care as much anymore.

[Matt Abaticola]

Okay, let me, let me. Here, stay with me for a second. Because my wife, she, she watches football with me. She. And we've, we've always watched Bears games together, but she has never gotten into the NFL or, or Bears stuff on a deeper level. But she has this, this year because of our podcasts. She listens to the podcast and she's more in tune with what's happening with the Bears.

[Dan Bernstein]

Okay.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah, she's going to hold that against me, and that's fine. She's been an executive for over a decade in cybersecurity and tech companies. Okay. And so she works with a lot of leaders. She's been an executive that has worked up and has worked, you know, parallel with executives. And leaders helping leaders become better leaders. We're having this conversation yesterday and she, she says to me just what she hears and sees of Ben Johnson. She just, she just doesn't feel like he's a good leader, that he seems too quiet and too meek and doesn't have, as she put it, what a good leader has to be. A good football coach.

[Dan Bernstein]

Well, I do this with trepidation. I don't agree with her yet.

[Matt Abaticola]

Okay.

[Dan Bernstein]

I don't see that. I say his first press conference was an absolute perfection.

[Matt Abaticola]

Okay, but why, though, Dan? What were you comparing it to? What were you. Why, why did it make you feel that way?

[Dan Bernstein]

Well, I wasn't directly comparing it to Matt Eberfluss, but I thought, I thought he came into this job saying everything, right? Taking accountability, talking about the size of the job, talking about where he was going to start, what mattered. I. Answering every question directly. He spoke in complete sentences.

[Matt Abaticola]

See, you're comparing, though. Yeah, you're comparing.

[Dan Bernstein]

I'm not ready. I'm not ready to go there yet. It's too soon.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah, I'm not saying you have to, but I'm just taking, I mean, her years, 20 years of corporate experience and working with leaders in big companies. I mean, these are known name companies. And looking at, just from a leadership standpoint. And she's really good at it. She's really good at what she does.

[Dan Bernstein]

I know.

[Matt Abaticola]

Can meet with leaders and say, yep, you know, this guy's got it, this guy doesn't. This gal's got it, this gal doesn't. She says that about him. It frightens me. It bothers me that that's what her vibe is. That's, you know, her little spidey sense goes off.

[Dan Bernstein]

Okay, well, that's noted. I mean, that's obviously, that is, that is duly noted. And I certainly hope she's wrong. If we're already talking about the fundamental essence of leadership, that should be determined at the job interview. I didn't see anything that suggested that to me. There's all kinds of personality types that can succeed in the NFL. Not everybody has to be Dan Campbell. Not everybody has to be Bill Belichick.

[Matt Abaticola]

Right. And that's not what it is. It's not like he's not. There's not enough fire and passion. He's not meatball enough. That's just not it. It's just the way that it's presented.

[Dan Bernstein]

Okay.

[Matt Abaticola]

So now let me go back. His opening press conference, you said you nailed it, loved it. Everything was great about it. Compare that to where we're at now what you've heard and seen. What's the dichotomy there?

[Dan Bernstein]

Well, it's very different in that he talks a lot about body language and his body language has been bad. They talk about attention to detail. Attention to detail, making sure that everything goes. Nothing goes uncoached in a practice. And we're not seeing that translate to effectiveness on the field or discipline on the field. I see an undisciplined team, and that is often a sign of whether it's bad practicing or lack of attentiveness from somebody. And to see that quote today. Our practice habits have yet to reflect those of a championship caliber team. Why? And more importantly, when did you decide that? Did you see that in May? Did you see that in August? When? And what did you do to change it or stop it? Is it only because you're 02? Had they not blown that lead on Monday night?

[Matt Abaticola]

And they're one and one.

[Dan Bernstein]

And they're one on one. Is he saying that like that's. How much of this is outcome bias?

[Matt Abaticola]

I don't know. I don't know. It's a great question. But. But everything we heard about training camp was. It was great. He even said it the other day that they're not living up to the standard or playing the standard of football that they were presenting and showing defensively in training camp. Going against the Bears. Fucking offense.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah.

[Matt Abaticola]

So now going into week three, you've decided your team hasn't shown the work ethic or the ability to be a championship level team. So either. So what's happened? What's happened since it was showing that to where it's not now? Or was it never and you weren't being honest about it? Or was it never and you just didn't realize it because you don't know yourself which is most frightening.

[Dan Bernstein]

I was going to say which. You got to pick one of these. And I don't like my options. Unfortunately, I didn't like the option. But I really would like to know when you came to this conclusion about the practice commitment.

[Matt Abaticola]

Say that quote again. What was the quote exactly?

[Dan Bernstein]

All right, let me hold.

[Matt Abaticola]

Sorry, sorry, sorry.

[Dan Bernstein]

You make me scroll.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah, I know.

[Dan Bernstein]

Our practice habits are yet to reflect a championship caliber team. Our practice habits, Our practice habits. Is that before practice. Is that. Is that meetings? Is it the kind of thing. You know, I always remember some of these vivid Brian Bilek things where he would. He'd leave a candy bar wrapper next to a door in the hallway and see if it got picked up little things like this, like where. How tight is the operation? How much do people care?

[Matt Abaticola]

So now we have that quote today with his quote from Monday talking about how guys aren't practicing hard enough. We're going to have a hard week of practice to see who wants to be part of the game plan on Sunday.

[Dan Bernstein]

Right.

[Matt Abaticola]

So now we get two days later and it's just our practice habits.

[Dan Bernstein]

Who, When? Yeah, how is it being addressed? But the problem is when you say that you indict your whole roster. And if I may just, if I may just, you know, you, I know you're a youth coach, but this is sort of from my experience, when publicly you indict the whole roster privately, everyone knows you're not within the walls of Hallis Hall. I guarantee you, you've got whispering going on about who's dogging it at practice. Like, man, we're getting, all our asses are getting called out because, because of that guy or these guys or this guy, this guy and this guy. And now, and now I'm part of this too. I'm here as a Chicago Bear. And now our practice. I'm not, I'm not a champion. And I'm not practicing hard enough to be involved in the game plan because, because of this slug and this guy pouting over here or this guy who we know isn't really hurt, but he's over there riding a bike like this. This is the kind of thing that contributes to losing cultures. This is the kind of thing that begins to eat at a team two games into the season when a coach is backed into saying our practice habits. Well, that's you two. It's the coaches who are in charge of the practice habits. And you start, you start insinuating that without naming names and without making it clear. And all these other players like, hey, hey, hey, hey. I'm busting my ass out there every day at practice. And now with all these generalizations, I'm dragged into it.

[Matt Abaticola]

And these are how much of this could be a defense mechanism from a head coach, a first time head coach who's 0 and 2 and really in ugly fashion that, hey, it's not me, it's not us. Like, hey, we're out here doing all the right things. You know, we're putting game plans in place that they're not executing. And it starts with the practice that no one's practicing hard and our practice habits are bad. Is this a shot at the general manager? You know, he put this roster together and it also, it indicts an internal Leadership issue, too. If you look back at Lovey Smith's Bears, if there were guys out of line, there's the internal cops that are putting their foot down. Olin Kreutz would have put his foot right up your ass. Whether you were defense or offense. He'd have come after you. He'd have told you that bullshit's not going to happen here. Who's doing that for the Bears? You have the natural leadership positions, and the center is new. The quarterback is young and hasn't performed up to the level that he said he would, that everyone thought he would. So who's your internal leadership, Joe? Jalen Johnson's out and hurt. He's your best player. DJ Moore. He seems more upset about lack of individual stats than overall team stuff. Your running backs aren't going to be vocal. So who's your internal leader?

[Dan Bernstein]

It should be Cole Comet. That's the guy who's been publicly available after wins and losses. Always seems to have something constructive to say. I think he's been honest. You know, on the teams that I've covered, it's almost always an offensive lineman.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah. Three are new. Two are, you know, are like their positions have been questioned for most of their careers here, you know, with. With the Bears.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah.

[Matt Abaticola]

You know, you covered a guy like. Like Grady Jarrett. He's vocal, but, you know, he's not producing enough. And he's new.

[Dan Bernstein]

He's in the tub.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah. So who is the internal leaders on this team? That is part of a winning culture. That shit doesn't slide when you have someone in the locker room step up and knock this shit off.

[Dan Bernstein]

Well, that is an interesting move on the part of Ben Johnson today to toss the entire team there. Our practice habits. The whole team. Not championship practice habits. Well, that's on you, too. That is.

[Matt Abaticola]

He's talking about the coaching staff. Maybe they're showing up late to practice.

[Dan Bernstein]

And forgetting to wear pants.

[Matt Abaticola]

Eating candy bars. Yeah.

[Dan Bernstein]

Smoking cigs. I don't know. But that is. Well, we'll see where this goes tomorrow. We'll see what some of the reactions. Because immediately, if I'm reporting, the moment I hear that the moment there's open.

[Matt Abaticola]

Locker room, you're going into. Oh, yeah, I can, too.

[Dan Bernstein]

I'm talking everybody, everybody and everybody. So coach just said practice habitat. Are you seeing that? Do you feel you've been. Your practice habits. That's what you do. You go, you ask everybody. Are your practice habits a championship caliber? Are you seeing anybody else's practice habits that aren't like, you got to you got to go in there and follow this immediately.

[Matt Abaticola]

Yeah. All right. Well, we'll get some more insight, too, tomorrow when we have Courtney Cronin on the show. She'll visit us here for forward progress and really looking forward to talking to her and getting her perspective from being there and being around it and getting a better vibe of seeing guys talk and hearing guys. So excited to have that conversation tomorrow.

[Dan Bernstein]

And also, we're gonna talk a little bit, too, about the Tom Brady conflict of interest and how silly the whole thing is about how we're putting the TV product in front of the football product in some ways for no apparent reason to accommodate somebody who isn't even all that good at the job that he's being asked to do.

[Matt Abaticola]

Right. And especially it's. It's really bothersome when there are so many good ones out there.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yep. Yep. And we're going to see if he's gaining all sorts of important knowledge, as when he's in there with the headset on and the Raiders coaching booth. And now he gets to talk to all the powers that be within the Chicago Bears to learn their special football secrets. That's all stuff.

[Matt Abaticola]

I mean, we get Tom Brady this week, so that's exciting. Very exciting. Another. Another. Another spotlight game for your Chicago Bears.

[Dan Bernstein]

And that is forward.