Ben Johnson's media session after reviewing the Packers loss - what we learned about his offense

Summary

Forward Progress: A Chicago Bears Podcast

Episode: Ben Johnson's Media Session After Reviewing the Packers Loss – What We Learned About His Offense
Hosts: Dan Bernstein & Matt Abbatacola
Date: December 9, 2025
Producer: 312 Sports

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Episode Overview

This episode features a full, in-depth review of Bears offensive coordinator Ben Johnson's media session following the Bears’ tough loss to the Green Bay Packers. Dan Bernstein and Matt Abbatacola provide their signature blend of analytical breakdown and genuine Chicago fan angst—all aimed at uncovering hard truths about the Bears’ offense, Caleb Williams’ performance, and the coaching staff’s mindset as the playoff race intensifies.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Playoff Picture & Upcoming Browns Game

• The Bears slipped from the #1 to the #7 playoff seed after the loss. Both hosts stressed the urgency of the next game (vs. Browns).

• Quote:
  “They must win on Sunday because then if they don't win Sunday, it's a coin flip.” – Matt (00:38)

• Both hosts discuss how the remaining schedule (at Cleveland, then hosting Green Bay, at San Francisco, hosting Detroit) means every outcome massively impacts playoff odds.

2. Ben Johnson’s Media Session – Full Breakdown

Dan and Matt play Ben Johnson’s media Q&A, pausing to analyze and react after each key answer.

A. Offensive Struggles: Starting Slow

• Johnson admits: “Offensively we need to start faster than what we did. Obviously 71 yards in the first half wasn't good enough. Only three points on five possessions...” (Ben Johnson, 04:09)
• Special teams also called out as a weak spot, with the hope Bears can exploit Cleveland’s poor coverage units.

B. The Final Throw to Cole Kmet

• Media asks: Caleb said the throw to Cole was a mental error, not difficulty.

• Johnson’s take:
  “…had we seen it a little bit sooner and given Cole a better chance, I think we would have been pretty happy with that result.” (06:22)

• Dan/Matt react by questioning Johnson’s repeated use of “we” instead of stating “Caleb” directly.

  • “He’s trying to protect his ego, are we trying to coddle the kid? Everyone knows what it means.” – Dan (07:34)

C. The Lack of Connection with DJ Moore

• Johnson surprised DJ Moore had only one catch; said Moore was featured in the game plan more than any other player (08:48).
• Hosts debate whether this is a subtle criticism of Caleb Williams for not finding the open man.
  • “If the coach is surprised, that tells me that there are plays on which he's the first or the second option.” – Matt (10:48)
• Questions about Moore’s effort, body language, and whether injuries or being a clear #2 option have impacted his motivation.

D. Can Ben Johnson “Serve” Caleb Williams?

• Johnson: “How can I best serve him to get him in a rhythm early in games…”
• Hosts push back, wondering if a pro OC should have to “warm up” a QB rather than just run the offense.
  • “You can best serve him by running your offense, right?” – Matt (14:04)

E. Clock Management and Aggressiveness

• Johnson defends his decision to let the clock run and aim for the go-ahead score with little time left for Green Bay.
  • “I feel really good about that. I feel really good about how we moved the ball down the field…with a quarterback playing as well as Jordan Love was… The last thing we wanted to do was give them enough time to respond…” (Ben Johnson, 14:50)
• “He was trying to win the game…We're just not used to that around here.” – Matt (16:22)

F. Caleb Williams: Flashes…But Still Inconsistent

• Media points out ongoing inconsistency (“really high potential, but also…struggle for a stretch”).
• Johnson:
  “There’s certainly some that you talk about each week where…guys are open and we can give them the ball on time…And then there’s that mix of ‘oh my gosh, that’s one of the most incredible plays I’ve ever seen in my life.’” (17:13)
• Hosts: This nails their season-long perspective—Caleb makes “superman” plays, but isn’t reliably executing on-schedule.
  • “That’s a cry for help.” – Matt (20:59)
  • “You don’t build around the superhuman off-script stuff. You have to build with what’s in the offense.” – Dan (22:44)

G. Johnson’s True Evaluation Timeline

• The hosts speculate about when an offensive coordinator “knows” if a QB can run their offense at a high level.
• Matt: “No, but that’s okay…If this is it, if he's topped out here, no [you can't win].” (25:24)
• Both agree Johnson has internal benchmarks to evaluate Caleb’s progress and expect continued scrutiny as the rookie contract timeline advances.

H. Protection and Offensive Line

• Johnson: Packers’ front was tough but Bears handled it well overall. Admits the protection plan sometimes didn’t match the scheme thrown at them, but there were also “really clean pockets.” (26:51)
• Hosts want more transparency—how many clean pocket opportunities did Caleb have, and how’d he do with them?

I. Rhythm, Playcalling, and Caleb’s Preferences

• When asked how to get Caleb in rhythm early, Johnson relays, “His feedback is, you call it, and I'm gonna go ahead and make it work…That's who he is. He doesn't care. You want to start the game with the deep ball, go ahead and call it, and I'll make it work…”
• Hosts call out the disconnect: “Okay, well, you're not though. That's the problem. So what do we have to do to alleviate this issue? There's a definite disconnect.” – Dan (33:06)

J. Kyler Gordon’s Injury Woes

• Johnson seems frustrated: “With him being out as much as he has, I haven't really got to see him on the field and competing…He's kind of in this rut now that we're not able to get out of.” (40:11)
• Both agree his durability could impact future planning.

K. Adjustments (or Lack Thereof) and Starting Fast

• Asked what adjustments were made after halftime, Johnson: “Not one. I stuck to the game plan and…we ended up doing a better job executing…” (41:43)
• Hosts: Reiterate importance of starting fast, especially against playoff-caliber opponents.

L. Endgame Execution

• Further praise for Johnson’s “no regrets” approach to clock management:
  “I thought we handled that situation as beautifully as you possibly could, minus the execution on third and one.” (43:18)
• “I love that…If I had to do it all over, we’d do it exactly the same way.” (43:54)

M. Defensive Breakdown Before the Half

• Johnson on Melton’s pre-half TD: “We can defend that play better…There were some elements on the back end…I'm not going to get into specifics…” (44:35)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “[Caleb] makes the throw all the time in practice…” – Ben Johnson, questioned by Dan and Matt for potential excuse-making. (09:56)

• “Timing and accuracy, timing and accuracy, timing and accuracy.” – Matt, emphasizing what's lacking from Caleb’s execution. (22:55)

• “If coach is surprised, that tells me he was supposed to be found.” – Matt, on DJ Moore’s lack of targets. (10:48)

• “You don’t build around the superhuman off-script stuff.” – Dan (22:44)

• “How do we get the ball into the end zone? How do we score?... The last thing is, well, I would call this play here, but I need him to be warmed up.” – Dan, critiquing Johnson’s “serving” Caleb remarks. (13:16)

• “He was trying to win the game. We’re just not used to that around here…” – Matt, on Johnson's aggressive late-game approach. (16:22)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Playoff context and urgency: 00:23–03:21
• Ben Johnson’s opening remarks post-Packers loss: 04:05–04:40
• Final drive/call management: 14:40–16:22, 43:11–44:02
• Caleb’s inconsistency and coaching approach: 06:22–14:08, 16:49–24:41
• Connecting with DJ Moore (missed opportunities): 08:30–11:11
• O-line/protection analysis: 26:51–27:45
• In-depth about Johnson’s quarterback benchmarks: 24:41–26:24
• Kyler Gordon injury frustrations: 40:11–41:03
• Adjustments after halftime—Johnson's philosophy: 41:41–42:42

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Tone and Takeaways

The conversation is candid and sometimes caustic, shot through with the weary hope and perpetual skepticism that marks true Chicago Bears fandom. Both hosts push for accountability, challenging coachspeak and drilling into WHEN and HOW this offense will reach its potential, particularly under the rookie quarterback. Through Ben Johnson's own words—and the hosts' honest reactions—listeners get rare clarity on how close (or far) the Bears’ offense is from being elite, and what hurdles remain on the road to the playoffs.

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For Listeners: Why This Episode Matters

For Bears fans—and NFL observers at large—this is an eye-opening look at the intricacies of modern playcalling, the delicate art of developing a young QB, and the stakes of every decision as postseason hopes hang in the balance. If you want to know what’s really happening inside Halas Hall and where the Bears’ future hangs in the balance, this is essential listening.

Transcript

[Dan Bernstein]

I mean, if you're a Bears fan, you're thinking forward progress. Come on.

[Matt Abeticola]

10, 2, 19.

[Ben Johnson]

2, 19.

[Dan Bernstein]

Forward progress. A Chicago Bears podcast with Dan Bernstein and Matt Abeticola on 312 Sports.

[Matt Abeticola]

The Bears are 9 and 4. They're no longer the number one seed. They are the number seven seed at the moment. But there's a lot of mo. A lot of shifting, a lot of things that are going to happen. One thing that absolutely has to happen is the Bears have to beat the Browns on Sunday.

[Dan Bernstein]

They have to win.

[Matt Abeticola]

They must win on Sunday because then if they don't win Sunday, it's a coin flip.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah. If you don't win Sunday, you're at your host Green Bay. You're at San Francisco, you host Detroit.

[Matt Abeticola]

It's coin flip.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah.

[Matt Abeticola]

That point it is 50% chance of making the playoffs if they lose Sunday.

[Dan Bernstein]

And then this weekend, Green Bay is at Denver. The Lions are at. Where the Lions at? Where the Lions at?

[Matt Abeticola]

There the number. I think regardless of what happens. Like just the difference between a win and a loss.

[Dan Bernstein]

Oh, yes. For their percentages.

[Matt Abeticola]

Enough to make you throw up right now. You got to win this game. And as I believe they were opened as over touchdown favorite. Seven and a half.

[Dan Bernstein]

Was it seven and a half now? I think I saw seven when it opened.

[Matt Abeticola]

Oh, I saw seven and a half. Maybe we're just looking at different places, but that is. They got to have this one. And I think for Ben Johnson, now it comes down to tone setting for this week. This. This isn't now about hooray for everything or this player that play. This is just about making sure they're focused and ready and. And thinking only about this game.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, the Lions are at the Rams.

[Ben Johnson]

Forgot that.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah. Lions at the Rams. Green Bay at Denver. So lots happening. Bears win, Denver lose. And the. And the Bears win. Denver wins. Bears are back to the two seed.

[Matt Abeticola]

Denver's 110 in a row.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, they have.

[Matt Abeticola]

Well, those. Those two defensive ends are hell on wheels.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, I got to take a look at their numbers. I'll do that before the week's up too, because Denver was on a pace to break the sack record. Miles Garrett is on pace to break the individual sack record. He's at 20 now. He needs a two and a half. That's high three with four games to go to take the lead, break the record. He didn't get four last weekend like I was predicting.

[Matt Abeticola]

I would line him up on Aussie Tripillo all game if he wants to get a couple of those.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, I Let him go wherever he wants.

[Matt Abeticola]

Well, I know where if he's. Unless there's a problem with him, he would want to line up against the rookie. Yeah, that's. That's where you want to put him.

[Dan Bernstein]

But the Bears have got to get the win this weekend at Cleveland. A lot can happen. We talked about it going into last week's game with Green Bay that the NFC playoff picture, very fragile. And that's where it was. Bears were one. Now they're seven. They win, the packers lose, the Bears are back to two. The Green Bay packers are back down to seven. So it just, it's all there for you. Which makes even. Which makes Sunday's game in two weeks. Well, Saturday's game, the 20th with Green Bay at Soldier Field even more significant.

[Matt Abeticola]

Yeah, it's. It is variable. It is precarious. There are all kinds of descriptive adjectives regarding the remaining movement that is assured in the NFC playoff picture.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yep. All right. What I want to do today is Ben Johnson met the media yesterday. We normally play clips from it, but I want to play the whole thing today.

[Matt Abeticola]

Oh, but we can respond as he.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah. So I'll just, I'll pause it after each. Each answer so we can respond to it. I just thought it was really good, but media asked all the questions I'd like to ask and of course they can't get everything in because they're limited in time, but I thought it was all good. So we'll just go through and start from the very beginning.

[Matt Abeticola]

Don't forget because they allow their own websites reporter to ask questions in a media session which not be allowed.

[Dan Bernstein]

All right, so this is Ben Johnson yesterday. So this is after he watches the game film. He reviews the Bears packers game and can get a little more in depth with his answers on some of the questions.

[Matt Abeticola]

All right.

[Ben Johnson]

Yeah, just like I said yesterday, really.

Really feel like offensively we need to start faster than what we did. Obviously 71 yards in the first. First half wasn't good enough. Only three points on five possessions defensively gave up too many explosives. And then special teams wise, didn't feel like our kickoff or kickoff return units played like they're capable of doing. So we dug ourselves into a hole. Credit to the guys. They came through and made a game there in the second half, but just wasn't enough when, when you're facing a good team on the road like that. So go ahead and open.

[Dan Bernstein]

Want to stop there real quick. One note I want to, I want to share. Just looking ahead to the Browns. The Browns are currently the worst team in the NFL on punts and kickoff coverage. So if there's an opportunity here for. For the Bears to take advantage, I.

[Matt Abeticola]

Think the opportunity for Devin DuVernay to move forward. I know he had the big one. He had the big 50 yard one. Yeah, but, man, do something. I turn on these other games. That guy on Thund Maniac, on Philadelphia.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah.

[Matt Abeticola]

He catches the ball, he fumbles the ball. He picks it up, he runs for it. He fumbles the ball, he picks it. Like, I don't want that.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah. I don't understand the whole running at.

[Matt Abeticola]

A guy thing and falling down.

[Dan Bernstein]

Like, find space and run towards that.

[Matt Abeticola]

That's Cole Comet's job.

[Dan Bernstein]

Right. Cole Comet was the catch and fall immediately. Fall down immediately. Right.

[Matt Abeticola]

That's apparently what he's told to do.

[Dan Bernstein]

Vernay, like catch the ball and try to avoid the guys. That's what I would do.

[Matt Abeticola]

That's a good plan, but good coaching there.

[Dan Bernstein]

The Browns have. They've given up two punt return touchdowns, one kickoff return touchdown. That's the most in the league right now. All right, so it's an opportunity to get healthy here for that.

[Matt Abeticola]

Just because of the way DuVernay moves out there. He just doesn't.

[Dan Bernstein]

Well, maybe they'll have a good week of practice, and under the guidance of Coach Hightower, they can find a weakness here to exploit in the Cleveland punts and. And kickoff coverage. Okay. All right, so this is Ben Johnson, and we'll go right into the questions and answers.

[Ben Johnson]

Put it up from there.

[Dan Bernstein]

Courtney.

[Courtney]

Hey, Ben. Caleb. We talked to Caleb after we talked to you about that final throw to Cole, and he said that the difficulty of it wasn't a problem, but he was thinking too much. When you watch that back. Like what, execution wise should have gone differently for him with that.

[Ben Johnson]

Yeah, I haven't talked to him yet. We're gonna watch the tape together after. After this. And I'll get a better feel for when he says he was thinking too much, what that means. But, yeah, from my perspective, it was a. It was a play that had a lot of options, just like I alluded to last night. And Cole happened to be the one that popped the most. And, you know, it's a good play by Nixon for them. He came off of his guy and made a play on the ball, but had we seen it a little bit sooner and given Cole a better chance, I think we would have been pretty happy with that result. So I still feel the same way I did last night on that play.

[Matt Abeticola]

We is doing a lot of work.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, we is.

[Matt Abeticola]

We is doing that. We. We'd seen it a little sooner that.

[Dan Bernstein]

You know, I mean, he's. He's. Again, we've talked about this. His. The interchanging of the pronouns or, you know, directly mentioning Caleb.

[Matt Abeticola]

Obvious. There's only one person in charge of seeing it.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, I know.

[Ben Johnson]

Yeah.

[Matt Abeticola]

That is. Your offensive linemen aren't seeing it. That's.

[Dan Bernstein]

So why. Why. Why The. The deliberate use of we there softens it from what, though?

[Ben Johnson]

I.

[Matt Abeticola]

Maybe.

[Dan Bernstein]

I mean, we trying to protect his ego? Are we trying to coddle the kid? Everyone knows what it means. If Caleb had seen it sooner.

[Matt Abeticola]

What.

[Dan Bernstein]

What's wrong with saying it there then?

[Matt Abeticola]

Maybe it does. If everybody knows that.

[Dan Bernstein]

Is that going off of last week where he felt like the need to walk it back. Hey, I wasn't singling out Caleb here, so I'm not going to single him.

[Matt Abeticola]

Out now moving forward in some way. You answer your own question there. Because if we all know what we means, then it's not serving any purpose to soften anything. It's just. It's just there in front of us.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah.

[Matt Abeticola]

Caleb needs to see it sooner.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah. And have you. Have you watched that play from many different angles or. And just how open it was?

[Matt Abeticola]

He had it. He had it. He had it and he blew it.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah. Especially with mixing because Mixon was on DJ and he has to come off. So he's covering two guys.

[Matt Abeticola]

All he did. And you just give him a little distance to run toward it. Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Bernstein]

Just throw it in the wrong spot. He just. He gets in that back corner of the end zone.

[Matt Abeticola]

Too late. Too. Too inaccurate. Yeah.

[Courtney]

And I know his. The passing game in the first half, like, I think to that third and 15 that he and DJ couldn't sync up. And I think he only had like one completion over 10 yards early on, like. But specific to that play, what did you notice about the overthrow there and why those two didn't seem to be on the same page yesterday?

[Ben Johnson]

Well, yeah, I don't know if there was anything with. With DJ I thought he ran some pretty good routes over the course of the day and we just couldn't give him the ball, which that was not the intent. You know, I thought going to the game we might have had more for him than. Than any other player in the offense, and so was a little surprised at the end when I saw the stat sheet for one catch like he had. So that was, like you said, disappointing on that particular play. Was good with the decision. We just. We just left It a little bit high there early in the game and something that I've kind of talked about, you know over the last few weeks is with, with Caleb is man, how can I best serve him to get him in a rhythm early in games. So where we can. We can have some strong starts to the first half and you know it's when you're asking your first completion to be a 18 yard dagger out, that's. That's not always the easiest thing particularly in those elements on the road like that. So something that he's certainly capable of doing. He makes that throw all the time in practice and, and yet we weren't able to do it there there yesterday that early in the game. So Sean.

[Matt Abeticola]

Makes the throw all the time in practice.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah. Makes it a hard. A hard. A hard throw as your first one 18 yard dagger in those conditions. Like stop making excuses.

[Matt Abeticola]

Come on.

[Dan Bernstein]

Like if it's, if it's a play in your playbook then you have it in there.

[Matt Abeticola]

You're a 9 and 3 team playing in front of the nation and don't. Why is it a hard throw? Why what's hard about it?

[Dan Bernstein]

So here's, here's a couple things too that came out of that for me was remember we talked about going into this game who was going to step up with Rome out. You know, is an opportunity for. Opportunity for DJ to kind of have a game or is it for Luther to step up and have a game and.

[Matt Abeticola]

Or Loveland.

[Dan Bernstein]

And so to see him say that he was surprised that DJ only had one catch because he set it up that DJ was going to be the mania.

[Matt Abeticola]

Why.

[Dan Bernstein]

Why have they not connected the show. I get it. That you have Rome. I get it. And that was his blankie.

[Matt Abeticola]

If the coach is surprised, if he's saying he's surprised, that tells me that there are plays on which he's the first or the second option. There's plays where he's expected to be found or seen any given number of times. Is that a veiled criticism of the way the quarterback is seeing things?

[Dan Bernstein]

See. Cause I heard that as I was surprised he only had one catch. He. I saw that he ran. Ran some really good routes. So what I heard was opportunities were there for dj. He was the primary guy more times than maybe in any other game plan with Rome being out and he wasn't found and they're not connecting.

[Matt Abeticola]

So it's a long and oblique way of saying that he should have been targeted more because he was open.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah. And why so. But I don't Understand why? All season long, though, there's an issue.

[Ben Johnson]

I don't know.

[Dan Bernstein]

I know we can talk about some of the effort and what we've seen from DJ Moore on the field. Early on, his coach talked about his body language. We saw the lack of effort on routes. Is it all injury driven? Is he just knowing that he's not the guy so he's just not putting it all out there? I mean, that's a really hard criticism.

[Matt Abeticola]

That ruins an entire play. The offense is predicated on everybody selling what they do. If you're on the backside and not running your route like it's real, you're not putting defenders in conflict. You're not forcing real decisions.

[Dan Bernstein]

But he said there that he saw him run some really good routes. Another thing out of that too is when Ben Johnson said, how can I best serve Caleb to get him going? And Caleb talked about it a week or two ago about his legs weren't warmed up. He wasn't, you know, didn't have his legs underneath him. Is it your job as the offensive coordinator to make sure your quarterback is warmed up and ready to go? Like, how can you best serve him like that? That doesn't speak to me of a game plan or a playbook.

[Matt Abeticola]

The game plan is to score.

[Dan Bernstein]

Right. And you need to be ready when the balls kick.

[Matt Abeticola]

Yeah, there is. There should be nothing in a coach's mind when the game starts that should have anything to do with anything other than how do we get the ball into the end zone, how do we score, how do we set up if it's setting stuff up for later. But the last thing is, well, I would call this play here. We've got the look, but I need.

[Dan Bernstein]

Him to be warmed up. Exactly how do I best serve him?

[Matt Abeticola]

That's what I wonder. Like, where in that is a change in decision? Man, we got it. We've got this long dagger, but we can't throw it because he's not ready to throw it yet because I haven't determined he's warm.

[Dan Bernstein]

But so then. But then, doesn't that contradict the whole idea of having scripted plays to start a game? Like, are you scripting based on the fact that we need to get him to a point of being ready to go? Or is it scripted and it's like, hey, if the first three plays are pass plays, you better be ready to go?

Yeah, I just, I didn't like that whole idea of how can I best serve him? Like, you can best serve him by getting him prepped during the week. And here's the game plan. You better be out there and ready to go no matter what I call. If it's 18 passes to start the game, hope you're ready to go because that's your fucking job.

[Matt Abeticola]

You can best serve them by running your offense, right?

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[Matt Abeticola]

All right.

[Dan Bernstein]

More.

[Matt Abeticola]

Yeah.

[Ben Johnson]

Hey, Ben, I was just wondering if you could walk us through your thought.

[Matt Abeticola]

Process there in those, those final two.

[Ben Johnson]

Minutes and letting the clock run down as you guys did. Yeah, I think that was actually.

Really well done by the whole team there on that one. You know, you get the ball back with 330 and.

You got a decision to make. Do we go as fast as we can and if we stall out, we get another possession potentially, or do we go ahead and let this one be the last one? And you know, we went with a ladder. I feel really good about that. I feel really good about how we move the ball down the field. Felt really good about our execution throughout, minus the third and one and the fourth and one there at the very end. The two most important with, with a quarterback playing as well as Jordan Love was playing in that game, you know, they had eight possessions and four touchdowns and he was finding receivers down the field and explosives and all that. The, the last thing we wanted to do. Well, let me say this. The first thing we needed to do was score a touchdown. All right. But the last thing we wanted to do as well is give them enough time to respond because of how dangerous they had been on offense. And so best case scenario would have been scoring a touchdown with under 30 seconds there and, and then letting our defense go out and hold down the fort there for the, for the very end to win the game. But we didn't, we didn't make enough plays there on that last drive to earn that. Right.

[Matt Abeticola]

I don't get the questioning of the clock management at the end. I completely understand. He was trying to win the game.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah. And he just told you right there because we wondered, would you go for the tie? Go for two. He was going for two.

[Matt Abeticola]

Of course.

[Dan Bernstein]

Going for two. Get the lead, you're up by one and have less than 30 seconds. Your defense hold on ye that he.

[Matt Abeticola]

Was trying to win the game. We're just not used to that around here. Everything is so based in fear and worry that this is the modern NFL here. Yeah, we have confidence in our offense. We're going to drive it down and score and we're going to get two points and leave them nothing. We go when we win.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, he addresses that more too, as it goes on later on.

[Matt Abeticola]

So we'll.

[Dan Bernstein]

We'll get into that too. Jason.

[Ben Johnson]

Hey, Ben.

[Jason]

It's another game with Caleb where we see a lot of the really high potential, but we also see him struggle for a stretch.

[Matt Abeticola]

Have you.

[Jason]

Do you identify any reasons for the inconsistency and when do you think it's reasonable to expect him to level out?

[Ben Johnson]

Yeah, you know, there's certainly some that you talk about each week where.

Feel like guys are open and we can certainly give them the ball on time and give them a chance to run after catch and all that. And. And then there's. There's that mix of oh my gosh, that's one of the most incredible plays I've ever seen in my life type deal with him. So I do acknowledge your point there, and that's something we're striving to do is. Is combine both of those worlds to where we think we're going to have a really good quarterback in this league, really dangerous quarterback in this league, really dangerous offense, really good team for a long time when we're really able to combine both of those thought processes. So we're not quite there yet. We're working diligently every day. I've said it every week that you see growth in so many other areas that, you know, I think when that last little bit comes along, I think we're going to be really pleased with where we are.

[Matt Abeticola]

Boy, did that hit on what we talked about on DBU today. Yeah, it really did.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah.

[Matt Abeticola]

Notice that.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah.

[Matt Abeticola]

You know, it's great. We could be on time and have run after the catch and all that.

Yeah, yeah. Can we have that?

[Dan Bernstein]

I like the question where, like, when's he going to level out? And it's. It's unfair to ask that question now because you can't put a timetable on it right now.

[Matt Abeticola]

There's. There's.

[Dan Bernstein]

There's no proper timeline. But you're working towards the idea of, as you mentioned in dbu, Caleb getting it and being the guy. What. What is a fair timeline to look at? Like, are we just. Are we. Are we questioning it harder now? Because they are 9 and 4. And it's unexpected.

That, you know, going into, into week, like going into week 14, they were leading the NFC north and so are we, are we accelerating this timeline? Is it fair to accelerate it? Is it unfair to do that to a guy who basically is in his rookie year once again.

[Matt Abeticola]

Who'S also the number one overall pick and believed to be a generational talent?

[Dan Bernstein]

Right. I know it's. It's a really, it's a really hard balance to find. Like what's, what's reasonable to say and.

[Matt Abeticola]

Who does have all the talent?

[Dan Bernstein]

He's.

[Matt Abeticola]

He's got everything. Athletically, he's got everything. No, it's not unreasonable. But boy, just to hear the way he described it though is what I think is key. It's like yeah, the auto, you know, the, all the stuff that he can do.

[Dan Bernstein]

We love it.

[Matt Abeticola]

But can you. Can you. I don't know if you can re rack it. You probably can't. But it's really. I would just like to hear what he said about, you know, being on time and having run after the catch and all that. That's what he want. That's what Ben Johnson expects and wants. That's critical to this knowledge.

[Ben Johnson]

Your point there, and that's something we're striving to do is is combine both of those worlds to where we think we're going to have a really good quarterback in this league, really dangerous quarterback in this league, really dangerous offense, really good team for a long time when we're really able to combine both of those thought processes. So yeah, we're not quite there yet. We're working diligently every week that you see growth in so many other areas. You know, I think slightly earlier than that comes along talking about really pleased with where we are and make enough plays there on that last drive to. To earn that right.

[Dan Bernstein]

Jason.

[Jason]

Hey, Ben, it's another game with Caleb where we see a lot of the really high potential, but we also see him struggle for a stretch.

[Matt Abeticola]

Have you.

[Jason]

Do you identify any reasons for the inconsistency and when do you think it's reasonable to expect him to level out?

[Ben Johnson]

Yeah, you know, there's certainly some that you talk about each week where.

Feel like guys are open and we can certainly give them the ball on time and give them a chance to run after catch and all that there times.

[Matt Abeticola]

Each week where guys are open, we can give them the ball on time with a chance to run after the catch. Yeah, that's a cry for help.

[Dan Bernstein]

Well, I mean it's just that's something Dan, that we've been talking about all season long with Caleb Williams.

[Matt Abeticola]

You know, it happens those, you know, you know like he makes those unreal.

[Dan Bernstein]

Superman plays but yet the plays that are designed in the offense to be on time at a point where a guy can catch in stride and keep moving like you watch with Aman Rossane Brown.

[Matt Abeticola]

That's the getting it right?

[Dan Bernstein]

That's the getting it.

[Matt Abeticola]

That's the offense.

[Dan Bernstein]

And see that's why when we've been critical and me more so critical than you of listen to him of Caleb. That's the stuff that I'm saying than Johnson is saying, save that because if the opportunities where again and I preface it with a clean pocket and a firm foundation from which to throw, those are the opportunities he has to hit. And it might be two or three or four game.

[Matt Abeticola]

He hides it in his casual tone. He hides it by saying it very nonchalantly. But then he keeps adding descriptors. Yeah, yeah. You know there are times when you got a guy open and you can hit him on time in a way that allows the receiver to run after the catch.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, he's.

[Matt Abeticola]

He basically telling you like, yes, like that's where we're going. But of course there are the other, these superhuman things that he does which make up for some of that. But going building toward the future, you don't build around the superhuman off script stuff.

[Dan Bernstein]

Right. You have to build with what, what's in the offense.

[Matt Abeticola]

That's it.

[Dan Bernstein]

And that's it. That's being a confident pocket passer that understands the offense and sees the defense pre snap and knows where to go.

[Matt Abeticola]

Timing and accuracy, Timing and accuracy. Timing and accuracy.

[Dan Bernstein]

See and that's why when I'm critical of Caleb Williams and we talk about it, we've talked about it all season long. It's not about being perfect. It's not about going 35 for 35. That's not what I'm asking for. If, if you can get three or four more completions and you take that 52% and make it 59%, I mean you're. Or you take that 62, when you make it 67, not only. I mean you're getting closer to it.

[Matt Abeticola]

I kept saying and this is something that if you listen to DBU today, the stats will take care of themselves. When the offense works right, when it is on time and on target, when it's thrown correctly at the right time and accurately, the receipt instead of being a 12 yard reception, it's a 22 yard reception or a 45 yard reception.

[Dan Bernstein]

Or a 67 yard touchdown.

[Matt Abeticola]

Yes, that's how this works. Those numbers will take care of themselves when things are on time and accurate.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, no, for sure. This answer will finish out then for us.

[Ben Johnson]

And then there's that mix of oh my gosh, that's one of the most incredible plays I've ever seen in my life type deal with him. So I do acknowledge your point there and that's something we're striving to do is, is combine both of those worlds to where we think we're going to have a really good quarterback in this league, really dangerous quarterback in this league, really dangerous offense, really good team for a long time when we're really able to combine both of those thought processes. So we're not quite there yet. We're working diligently every day. I've said it every week that you see growth in so many other areas that, you know, I think when that last little bit comes along, I think we're going to be really pleased with where we are.

[Dan Bernstein]

So again, I understand it all, I get it all. But I would really love to know how Ben Johnson really feels right now. Like, I would love to hear just full transparency. Does he get of his evaluation of Caleb.

[Matt Abeticola]

Caleb Williams, does he get the offense?

[Dan Bernstein]

And I would love to know because Ben Johnson's been doing this long enough, Dan, he knows in his brain that if we're not at this point by this period, it may not happen. So let me ask you this question.

If this is the guy Caleb Williams is.

Can you win with Caleb Williams and win consistently the way he is right now, with the way Caleb Williams is right now?

[Matt Abeticola]

No, but that's okay because we were all presuming that he's going to do exactly the things his coach wants, that this is his rookie year essentially and with everything you've already said, oh, no. If this is it, if he's topped out here, no.

[Dan Bernstein]

So then you. Do you agree with me that Ben Johnson has a pretty realistic timeline in his brain that if we're not here by here, it may not happen?

[Matt Abeticola]

Well, they're going to have to make a decision on that fifth year of the deal. Yeah.

[Dan Bernstein]

But do you think he's going to take five years for Ben Johnson to say, Well, I mean, because we're in year two, so we have three more years after this. Do you think it's going to take more?

[Matt Abeticola]

You have two more before or one and a half before you start making that decision. Yeah, he's got next year Essentially.

You.

[Dan Bernstein]

Think he has like, he has to have it figured out in his own brain. He has to understand and I think he's got.

[Matt Abeticola]

Marking points. I think he. Yeah, I think that's what I'd love to see statistical. I think.

[Dan Bernstein]

No, it's not just, it's not, it's not about stats.

[Matt Abeticola]

That's his job.

[Dan Bernstein]

Right.

[Matt Abeticola]

His job is to know it when he sees it or know it when he doesn't see it.

That's, that's what he's here to do, you know.

[Herb]

Kevin.

[Kevin]

Hey, Ben, obviously you guys faced a really good defensive front yesterday. How did you think everybody from line to tight ends to Caleb handled the pressure, especially considering who's kind of coming up on Sunday this week?

[Ben Johnson]

Yeah, I mean that was a, it's a really good unit that we just faced and.

You know, I thought they're really well coached too. That's, that was one of the better third down defenses we've gone against just in terms of what they threw at us. Schematically. They gave us some issues on our protections and, you know, something that we're going to have to address and clean up going forward. But for the most part, I thought our guys tried to handle our protection plan. We had a couple that our technique and what we're trying to get done needs to align a little bit cleaner. But we also had instances of really clean pockets as well where Caleb had plenty of depth and width and time to deliver a good ball also. So I thought overall, considering who we were going against, you know, that was not an area that I felt needed to be addressed.

[Dan Bernstein]

So real quick, back to that one thing. I would love to see his markers. I would love to see that. That would be amazing to see. But on what he just said, there, there were plenty of times where he had the depth, the width, width and the time to throw the good balls. I, I'd love to know how many of those there were in his mind and how did he do in those opportunities? Like that's what I want to see. Were there eight of those opportunities? Were there 12? Where there are four?

[Matt Abeticola]

Is the number decreasing, increasing or staying the same?

[Dan Bernstein]

And then how's he performing Based on what you see as those opportunities where that is a clean pocket and it.

[Matt Abeticola]

May just be that a lot of this is also that we don't have. There may be multiple variables involved, in which case it's more of a calculus equation than it is a mathematical equation because it could be that he hasn't. That the whole offense isn't in yet. You know what I mean?

[Dan Bernstein]

Right.

[Matt Abeticola]

Like, he's, he's, he's. They've thrown a lot of stuff at him and it might be in stages. It might be. You've got to see this, in this before I'm going to start showing you more complex stuff and more nuanced stuff and more option routes where you and everybody have to be on exactly the same page. So maybe Johnson's like, look, I, I wanted, at this point of the season, I wanted to be here. We're not there yet.

We're going to do some simpler things because that's where we are. And then in the off season, we're going to really drill down and pound and I'm going to show. I don't know. We don't know. He's not going to tell us.

[Dan Bernstein]

No, he's not going to tell us that. Right?

[Matt Abeticola]

He's not going to tell us. He's having all these conversations in late nights in his office with his most trusted assistants. That's when he's talking about the real stuff.

[Dan Bernstein]

But I would have loved a question after that of, well, how many of those opportunities were there and how did Caleb do in those opportunities? And how is that a fair question for him to answer?

[Matt Abeticola]

Are there more of those opportunities? Is he delivering on a higher percentage of those opportunities now than he was at the start of the season?

[Dan Bernstein]

Right.

[Matt Abeticola]

And if not, why not?

[Ben Johnson]

Herb.

Herb.

[Herb]

Herb.

[Matt Abeticola]

Herb. The Dew boy himself.

[Shopify Announcer]

Herb, you, we can't hear you.

[Matt Abeticola]

Herb, you're on mute.

[Shopify Announcer]

No, we'll come back to you. Sorry.

[Dan Bernstein]

It's our guy.

[Matt Abeticola]

Come on, Herb.

[Dan Bernstein]

Adam, they get back to him.

[Matt Abeticola]

Look alive.

[Adam]

Hey, Ben, a quick follow up about the interception. DJ Comes open kind of late in that. I'm just curious what type of realistic option he is for Caleb in that moment.

[Ben Johnson]

Yeah, I didn't see him as being the answer in that time. I think he came open more after the ball was released from Caleb. Nixon was man to man with DJ and was trailing him and, you know, ended up falling off and making a play on, on Cole there. So, you know, it was a good play by Nixon and, and yet I still don't, I don't think if we get the spacing right and all that and a good ball, that, that he's going to be able to cover both of those players like that and then.

[Matt Abeticola]

To go, if we hit the spacing right in a good ball.

[Dan Bernstein]

He's not wrong.

[Matt Abeticola]

Nope.

[Dan Bernstein]

I mean, like a guy shouldn't be able to cover one guy then fall off and take another guy's ball away. Correct back.

[Adam]

What you said about getting Caleb in rhythm early in those conversations that you've had with them, like, what type of feedback have you gotten? Like, do you have a better sense now over the past few weeks of what he's looking for, what works, what could potentially help lead to some easy completions for him?

[Dan Bernstein]

Good question. Right. Following up on where we were discussing before, Right?

[Matt Abeticola]

Yep.

[Adam]

Okay, so he's in a rhythm.

[Ben Johnson]

Yeah. I mean, his feedback is, you know, you call it, and I'm gonna go ahead and make it work. You know, it's. That's who he is. He doesn't. He doesn't care. You want to start the game with the deep ball, go ahead and call it, you know, and I'll make it work. You want to start with quick game. You want to start with screen, whatever. He really doesn't care, so. And that's really, I think, where you want your quarterback to be. So I appreciate that mindset. And. And yet, you know, I just want to hit us, hit the ground running a little bit better than what we have been. You know, we talked a week ago about the passing game needing to improve, and, you know, that first half, we didn't quite make the strides that we had hoped for over the course of the week. So we'll just go back to work again this week and, you know, get back after it again.

[Matt Abeticola]

Now, what he says about Caleb, that's great. That's exactly what you want Caleb to. To say in his approach. You call it, I'll execute it.

[Dan Bernstein]

Right.

[Matt Abeticola]

Call whatever you want. I'm ready.

[Dan Bernstein]

Okay.

[Matt Abeticola]

It's great.

[Dan Bernstein]

Great.

[Matt Abeticola]

But he may feel like.

See, he came really close there. Ben came very close to possibly revealing how he feels about what he can call and what he can't. Maybe he does feel he's got to get him established or build his. Oh, I hate this phrase. I can't believe we're saying this. Build his confidence.

[Dan Bernstein]

But, Dan, he said earlier in this media session that he needs to best serve Caleb to get him into that rhythm early.

[Matt Abeticola]

I don't want to get too much into this.

[Dan Bernstein]

I know, but the feed. The feed. The feedback is the feedbacks. What's the feedback? Oh, call whatever you want. Caleb has even said my legs haven't, but they weren't underneath me. I got to get warmed up. I got to get better at doing that. Okay, there's a disconnect here.

[Matt Abeticola]

I agree.

[Dan Bernstein]

It can't be. Hey, what can I do to best serve you? Oh, whatever you want. Just call it. I'M gonna execute it. Okay, well, you're not though. That's the problem. So what do we have to do to alleviate this issue? There's a definite disconnect.

[Matt Abeticola]

There is.

[Dan Bernstein]

While the attitude and the answer is a great response, but what really can help? How can I best serve him? He said those words himself. Yeah.

[Matt Abeticola]

This is so delicate.

[Dan Bernstein]

It's very delicate.

[Matt Abeticola]

This is so delicate from a coaching perspective because you never really want to say the obvious, which would be, hey, man, I love your attitude. I appreciate your attitude. But the, the actual evidence shows that there's certain things that, that aren't working early in games. Let's figure out why he even set.

[Dan Bernstein]

Himself an 18 yard dagger route to start a game. That's not easy to do.

[Matt Abeticola]

It's too much. Why.

[Adam]

Right?

[Dan Bernstein]

Why, why? And how, like, how can I best serve him? Like, what does that mean? What do you, what do you need called to get yourself into the game? And why aren't you into the game from the start? I just don't get it.

[Matt Abeticola]

Some guys are jumpy. Some guys just need to settle in. I kept using that term when it came to the last game. Even wrote it down like, this game needs to settle down.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah.

[Matt Abeticola]

Because it felt a little chaotic.

[Dan Bernstein]

It did. It did. And maybe, maybe he just needs pressure in order to get himself in the right mindset. I don't know. I don't understand it.

[Matt Abeticola]

It's such a weird sports thing. It's like the, it's like standing over that first tee. Sometimes your second ball is always, you know, the second golfer is always better than the first golfer.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah.

[Matt Abeticola]

After your breakfast ball. The. There's certain hockey goalies where that first shot, they're jumpy. You just need to. They need to see a little rubber. They need to kick a couple away no matter how they warm up.

There is something to that. It's unquantifiable, I think in sports about what every different athlete needs. Is there a boxer that.

Needs to.

[Dan Bernstein]

Get hit before get a couple shots for your loose.

[Matt Abeticola]

Yeah.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah. And I'm not trying to make a greater point to this. It's just the things that the both of them are saying, just don't. They don't. They don't work together. That's the whole point.

[Matt Abeticola]

No, and I would like to think that you're. You just don't need to deal with that. You don't need to. I don't want to coach worried about it.

[Ben Johnson]

Right.

[Matt Abeticola]

I want to coach. Have his full playbook.

[Dan Bernstein]

Right.

[Matt Abeticola]

Have equal trust in whatever he can do if on the second play of the game they get the coverage they might not get again in the game.

[Dan Bernstein]

Right.

[Matt Abeticola]

That's the chance to exploit it. You have to be able. You must. Because it could change what's called the rest of the game.

[Dan Bernstein]

Right? Because I.

[Matt Abeticola]

That's it. That play. It's the second play from scrimmage. You, you, you, you ran off tackle two yards, you got second and eight.

[Dan Bernstein]

And what was it? What, what game was it, Dan? Was it the Giants game where there were two deep opportunities early, like one in the first drive, one in the second drive. Remember there was one, the Rome, there was 1. The DJ that he just missed early on. Taking long shots on like 3rd and 7 and 3rd and 8. Might have been the Giants game.

[Matt Abeticola]

It was. Let's see. I should write these down.

[Dan Bernstein]

First drive there was 1, 2, I want to say Rome. And then second drive of the game, they were both third and seven. Third and eight situations.

Just overthrew D.J. and then I think he just, he missed Rome. I don't have my, all my game notes with me.

[Matt Abeticola]

I'm going to. I bad throw Caleb Williams chagu in the 44. I'd have got that in the Steelers game. Near INT, bad pass, punt, then the interception and then bad throw by Caleb Williams on the 44. It might have been the Steelers game you're talking about.

[Dan Bernstein]

Okay, but remember, I'm talking about first drive was third and seven. Second drive it was third and eight and was. I wondered and I jotted in my notes why we taking these shots downfield? Because those are the opportunities that we're given. Right? Remember?

[Matt Abeticola]

Yes, I think, I think this is this, right?

I gotta find either way. Yeah, either way. I would have to. I would. These are in the right order. Yes, I would. I can't, I can't read some.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, I'll double check my notes when I get home.

[Ben Johnson]

But.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, but, yeah, but here's the whole point though is when they game plan and they prep during the week for their opponent, what they are likely to see in the first series or the second series, I want Ben Johnson to be able to say, all right, I have my full playbook here. In the first series, in our scripted plays or our second series, I don't want him to have to say, all right, is he going to be warmed up enough? Is he good to go? Am I best serving him by asking him to throw an 18 yard dagger route on the first series?

[Matt Abeticola]

Well, I got this from the Giants game on the first series. They started their own 40 and it was the near int on the throw to DJ Moore. That's the one that Brian Burns blew up on the, on the screen.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yep.

[Matt Abeticola]

Short on 3rd and 7 and then 4th and 4. Incomplete in the end zone to DJ Moore. Turnover on downs.

[Dan Bernstein]

No, it was. I got, I'll. I'll look when I get back home. Took my notes because it was, it was first drive, third and seven, second drive, third and eight. And they, I mean, they were nowhere near the end zone, but they were two balls where both guys were open and just the passes missed. I'll double check it though, when I get home. All right, here's more of Ben.

[Ben Johnson]

Pat.

[Jason]

Ben, I know Matt LaFleur was asked about the quick handshake at the end. We didn't ask you about it. Did you make anything of it or not?

[Ben Johnson]

That feels like every handshake I have at the end of a game.

[Jason]

What do you think that there's something that your guys learned? I know you're not into moral victories, but what did you learn that may carry over when you do see them again in a week and a half, two weeks?

[Ben Johnson]

Yeah, I don't know that anything will carry over that. It's a, it'll be a brand new game when we go against that opponent again.

But I, I just, I know who we are at this point of the season. It didn't take that game for me to know that. I know we're a physical unit. I know we're resilient. I know that we play hard for each other for 60 minutes and you know, I think we're going to make things very interesting when it's close in the fourth quarter, you know, each and every week and so unfortunately we didn't come through with the win there yesterday, but I feel really confident in our group of finding a way to pull through these games.

[Matt Abeticola]

Dan? Yes.

[Ben Johnson]

And what exactly happened with Kyler before the game yesterday? Yeah, he was warming up in pre game and felt that, you know, felt his groin and so, you know, we didn't feel like we were in a good spot to have him play and compete and put him in that spot and, you know, we'll see how it goes from here on out.

[Matt Abeticola]

That doesn't sound good.

[Ben Johnson]

He's suffered a few of these injuries.

[Matt Abeticola]

In non game settings.

[Dan Bernstein]

Where does your patience level rest when.

[Ben Johnson]

You have a player that's in and.

[Matt Abeticola]

Out and in and out as frequently.

[Ben Johnson]

As he's been since you got here? Well, it's disappointing. You know, I, I wish I had a better feel for the individual, but with him being out as much as he has, I haven't, haven't really get to see him on the field and competing and get to know him like I'd like to at this point yet. And so I do know that the biggest predictor of, of a soft tissue injury is having a previous one. And he's kind of in this rut right now that we're not able to get out of. And so we're going to exhaust all of our resources in and outside of the building to make sure that we're addressing it and doing what we can to get him back and healthy again.

[Matt Abeticola]

Not sound happy. No, you can't be. How do you build around a guy who's, you're worried about getting hurt in warmups, game plan in if.

[Dan Bernstein]

If the predictor of a soft tissue injury is a previous soft tissue injury, has he come back too soon?

[Matt Abeticola]

I don't know. They're going to need to sit everybody down at the end of this year, Gordon, their strength and conditioning staff, their doctors, Gordon's people, whoever, and just figure out a plan. Figure out something whether it's diet, nutrition, stretching, whatever his off field hobbies are, whatever any of that is, he's going to have to figure that out.

[Dan Bernstein]

Herb.

[Herb]

Coach, what, what, if any, adjustments did you make offensively from the first half to the second half when you were able to really get going in the second half, but obviously not able to get going in the first?

[Ben Johnson]

Did I make?

[Herb]

Yes, sir.

[Ben Johnson]

Not one. I stuck, I stuck to the game plan and, and we ended up doing a better job executing and, and guys played hard and we made some plays to that point.

[Herb]

To that point. Is this a game you can look at as you go down the stretch here and you playing other teams that have legitimate aspirations of playing the last game of the season to say we gotta find a way to start faster? It's cool that you can come back. You've shown that time and time again all season. But is there an emphasis on how you have to start faster, especially with the games down the stretch?

[Ben Johnson]

When you play good teams on the road, every little thing matters, all the details matter. You know, we start off on offense with two penalties in the first two drives and we don't overcome them. And so every little thing matters and you know, we just didn't start well enough. I think. To your point. Yeah, you got to play and you got to utilize all 60 minutes of your brand of football. And we dug ourselves into a hole and it certainly wasn't where we want to start.

[Dan Bernstein]

That Game Two more, Courtney.

[Courtney]

Ben, I know you talked about the third and fourth down there on that final drive and using timeouts and your game plan for, you know, executing the clock at the end there, the plays beat or the time that went off between the. When Kyle ran for three yards on second down and then the no gain on third down is like 117 to 35. Did. Did that play out the way that you had hoped for? Were you maybe hoping that you guys would have moved a little bit faster to be able to get that playoff?

[Ben Johnson]

Are you what for?

[Courtney]

Just in terms of it was the urgency where you wanted it to be?

[Ben Johnson]

Yeah, I thought we handled that, that situation. I don't. I don't know a better way to do it, to be honest with you. Like I said, the less amount of time that we would have left on that clock to score, the better off we would have been. The entire offense knew that we were looking to milk that clock down the moment it got under a certain level. I then relayed it to the quarterback. Okay, now we're good to score the touchdown. And so we were all on the same page and I thought we were. We. We handled that situation as beautifully as you possibly could, minus the execution on third. Third and one.

[Dan Bernstein]

Awesome.

[Matt Abeticola]

Okay.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah.

[Matt Abeticola]

There you go.

[Dan Bernstein]

So it's like. I love that. Oh no, I do too.

[Matt Abeticola]

That's what I wanted to do. Here's why I wanted to do it. And if I to do all over, we do it exactly the same way.

[Dan Bernstein]

Right. Because they would have scored the touchdown there with under 30 seconds and then gone for two.

[Matt Abeticola]

They're trying to win the game.

[Dan Bernstein]

29, 28 point lead and then there you go. Defense has got to hold on.

[Matt Abeticola]

I get it. We have one more here.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah.

[Herb]

Last one.

[Matt Abeticola]

Okay.

[Dan Bernstein]

Son. Kevin.

[Kevin]

Hey, Ben. On the. The touchdown to Melton at the end of the first half. Just curious your. Your diagnosis on that. You and DA talking about it today, what you guys saw.

[Ben Johnson]

Say it again. Which one?

[Kevin]

The touchdown to Melton. Just curious what you and DA kind of saw as you went back and watch today.

[Ben Johnson]

Yeah, the one before halftime.

[Kevin]

Yes.

[Ben Johnson]

Yeah. Well, just in general. 114 left on the clock and you know, before half that's. We can't allow a touchdown. Our guys know that something that, that we're going to address and clean up. But in that particular coverage, we, we. There were some elements on the back end. I'm not going to get into specifics there that we felt like we could do a better job of. Of taking that ball away. So yeah, I'm. Like I said, I'm not going to get in specifics on what that thing should look like. I think that's, that's for our guys in, in house here, but we can defend that play better.

[Matt Abeticola]

That's Ben Johnson. I think I have the answer to your question with the overthrows.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, what was it?

[Matt Abeticola]

Vikings game, third and nine overthrows Roma Dunes A. It was their first drive. Second drive overthrows DJ Moore.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, okay, that's exactly what it was.

[Matt Abeticola]

It was at Vikings.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, you're right there. Yep, I knew what it was.

[Matt Abeticola]

I didn't quite go far enough, but there we have it. Before we finish up, we have some breaking news. Philip Rivers is doing it.

[Dan Bernstein]

Is he really?

[Matt Abeticola]

He has, he is signing to the practice squad. So as of right now, he's still eligible for the hall of Fame as a practice squad member of the Colts. I did not know he was a grandfather, but I'm reading the story right here. Rivers, who is now a grandfather, has been coaching high school football in Alabama, lacing up his cleats. This is from Pro Football Talk.

He is signing with the Colts practice squad after retiring following the 2020 season. 44 year old Philip Rivers.

[Dan Bernstein]

I wonder how many, how many grandpas have taken a snap in the NFL.

[Matt Abeticola]

How many grandfathers?

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, I'm sure there have been. I mean, Bland had to have. Yeah, oh yeah, because there were some old, old heads that played through. But I mean, it can't be more than it had to be. It's got to be single digits, right?

[Matt Abeticola]

Well, Blanda played into his 50s, didn't he?

[Dan Bernstein]

Is it single digits, you think?

[Matt Abeticola]

No, He, Blanda, in August 1976 was the oldest player at 48, a mark that still stands. One of only three players playing four different decades. But yet George Blanda was the sport's oldest player at the age of 48.

Yeah, he.

He started with the Bears in 1949.

Then he played again in 1976.

That's unbelievable.

So it's gotta be, it's gotta be Blanda.

[Dan Bernstein]

All right, well, this is, this is a Google search. The question, has a grandfather ever played in the NFL? And this says quarterback Brett Favre, who played primarily the packers, was the first grandfather to play in the NFL. Rivers would be the second grandfather to ever play in the NFL.

Okay, that just doesn't seem right though. Right?

[Matt Abeticola]

Well, some guys looked really old. Like, do you remember?

[Dan Bernstein]

Well, back in the day, everyone looked, looked older guys. That guy's 70. No, he's 35. Right.

[Matt Abeticola]

Do you remember When. When Greg Landry. How old was Greg Landry when he came back to the Bears in 84?

Because I remember they brought him back for one guy. I thought they brought it. Didn't they bring avellini back for one game?

I want to say the 84 bears because they. Because they were. Everybody was hurt all year.

[Dan Bernstein]

How old is Philip Rivers now?

[Matt Abeticola]

44.

[Dan Bernstein]

44.

[Matt Abeticola]

All right, so Lander was 38 when he came back to the Bears in 84.

[Dan Bernstein]

These are the oldest quarterbacks to appear in an NFL game. Blanda at 48, Brady 45, Steve Deberg, Warren Moon, Vinny Testaverde, all 44 at Philip Rivers there now. Doug Flutie, 43. Earl Morrell, 42. Aaron Rodgers, 42. Drew Brees, 42. Mark Brunel, 41.

[Matt Abeticola]

Okay, well, the starting quarterbacks for the bears that year, McMahon Fuller, Rusty Lish, Bob Avellini was only 31. He started four games and then Greg Landry started one game. I think that was at Houston, if I remember correctly.

[Dan Bernstein]

And I want to dig more into that about grandfathers.

[Matt Abeticola]

And then that's funny. When Dave Craig was on The Bears in 96, how old was he? How old was.

[Dan Bernstein]

Well, he wasn't in his 40s, obviously.

[Matt Abeticola]

No.

Who's. Who else they had. They've had some old guys. They had. What was. What was the guy that. Who didn't want to play? Chris.

Oh, shoot. Well, come on. The guy who, like, had his golf clubs with him the whole time. The goodbye was on the.

[Dan Bernstein]

Pat Manley?

[Matt Abeticola]

No, not Pat Manley. Oh, Chris Chandler. Chris Chandler. He was old.

Dave Craig, those guys. But no, they weren't like not 44. Yikes. I guess 44 doesn't sound as old. And you're right. The 48 year old picture of George Bland looks older than I look now.

[Dan Bernstein]

Wait, so. No, this can't be right. Dave Craig, 1996, was on the Bears?

[Matt Abeticola]

Yeah.

[Dan Bernstein]

So he was born in.

[Matt Abeticola]

It'll have his age here in Pro football Reference. When he was on the Bears, he was 38.

[Dan Bernstein]

I wasn't even 40 then.

[Matt Abeticola]

He was 38 in 19, but he played at age 40. He played for Tennessee in 1998.

[Dan Bernstein]

Yeah, he had 13 starts in two years with Tennessee.

[Matt Abeticola]

He was only 38 on the Bears. Yeah, but remember, he couldn't even really. He couldn't throw. He kind of. He kind of like threw it like a dart.

[Dan Bernstein]

That's. That's a tough goal for a quarterback, right? You can't throw.

[Matt Abeticola]

Well, he couldn't like wind it up and throw. He Couldn't fully throw, I guess.

[Dan Bernstein]

No. Kind of like skipping rocks. He was.

[Matt Abeticola]

No, it wasn't that underhand. It was more like darts. It was okay.

[Dan Bernstein]

So. Throwing darts?

[Matt Abeticola]

Yeah. Okay.

[Dan Bernstein]

How'd that work out?

[Matt Abeticola]

Not great. Okay. He had a rating of 76.

[Dan Bernstein]

Hey, guys, we. We have a. We have a quarterback issue here on the team. We don't have one. I got a guy who. Dave Craig. Can he throw? Not really.

[Matt Abeticola]

He had 14 touchdowns and 12 interceptions.

[Dan Bernstein]

So Philip Rivers is doing it.

[Matt Abeticola]

He's. He's at least joining the practice squad.

[Dan Bernstein]

There you go. Congrats, Grandpa.

[Matt Abeticola]

Whoa. Okay.

[Dan Bernstein]

Hey, if you haven't gotten the new 312-sports app, I have. So I have it. Not you. I meant, like, them.

[Matt Abeticola]

You. You're talking.

[Dan Bernstein]

Well, them. You. Them out there. You. You. I'm talking to you right there in the camera.

[Ben Johnson]

You.

[Dan Bernstein]

If you haven't gotten the app yet, go ahead and go to the Apple App Store or Google Play and get the app today. Once you get the app, you can then register. And then if you use promo code for Bears. Bears promo code. B, E, A, R, S. We got great rewards there for you. Chicago Firehouse restaurant, Giordano's Smash Burger. Go on there. Use the app. You can send Dan messages. You can send Dan voice messages.

[Matt Abeticola]

You are.

[Dan Bernstein]

And please keep doing that.

[Matt Abeticola]

There are a lot of them.

[Dan Bernstein]

And if you want to email Dan, you can just do that at Daniel sports. Com. You can go right directly through the app, though, now, and do it a lot easier. He really likes the voice messages the best, so leave him several in a row. If the time runs out, just add another one. And if that time expires, add a third. And if your thoughts aren't complete in the fourth one, add a fifth. Just do that for Dan because you love him.

What? Nothing to say?

[Matt Abeticola]

No. Okay. No, I'm just. I'm just waiting for the show to end.

[Dan Bernstein]

That's what you get for throwing me under the bus with Larry McCarron.

[Matt Abeticola]

I was just gonna say, I heard that after the show, you're going to TP Larry McCarron's house. Get off my lawn.

[Ben Johnson]

Now.

[Matt Abeticola]

My story begins in 19. Dickety two. We had to say Dickety cause the Kaiser had stolen our word 20. I chased that rascal to get it back, but gave up after dickety six miles.

All right, that's forward progress. Matt, congratulations. That game was worthy of being part of the longest rivalry in the history of the NFL. How do you feel? I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missouri.

Get us out of here. 219 219Forward progress a Chicago Bears podcast.

[Dan Bernstein]

With Dan Bernstein and Matabeticola on 31 2Sports.

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[Dan Bernstein]

Thanks.

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