Caleb Williams and Chicago Bears minicamp positional battles and more with Kevin Fishbain

Summary

Forward Progress - A Chicago Bears Podcast

Episode Title: Caleb Williams and Chicago Bears minicamp positional battles and more with Kevin Fishbain
Hosts: Dan Bernstein and Matt Abbatacola
Guest: Kevin Fishbain (The Athletic)
Date: June 12, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode brings on Kevin Fishbain from The Athletic to break down the Chicago Bears’ minicamp storylines and positional battles, with a particular focus on the development of Caleb Williams, the wide receiver situation, the offensive line, and some under-the-radar camp competitions. The discussion mixes detailed analysis with humor and candid fan anxiety from hosts Dan and Matt, providing both insight and honest emotion. While the NFL’s wider picture is nodded to, the bulk of the content centers on current roster dynamics, coaching philosophies, and the state of the team entering training camp.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Roma Dunze’s Foot and Injury Concerns

Timestamps: [03:32]–[08:28]

• Dan expresses worry about WR Rome Odunze’s comments regarding his “remodeled foot,” comparing it to past Bears WR flame-outs due to early injuries (Kevin White/David Terrell).
• Kevin clarifies that Ben Johnson was asked about it (by Courtney Cronin), and the response was the standard “he’s fine” answer.
• It was “jarring” for the media to hear Odunze admit the foot “isn’t going to be the same,” but Johnson and the staff aren’t publicly concerned.
• Dan’s anxiety:
  • “That’s why. I don’t know, I’m just a little more easily scared, more easily spooked by some of this stuff, perhaps, than others.” [05:36]
• Kevin links Odunze’s health to his market value:
  • “The moment he said that he’s worth less on the open market... isn’t he the guy with the thing with the foot...” [07:20]
• Kevin notes a huge range of possible outcomes—star status if Odunze stays healthy, but the risk lingers every time “foot” appears on the injury report.

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2. Kyler Gordon’s Availability and Coaching Frustration

Timestamps: [09:00]–[12:37]

• Host and guest discuss Ben Johnson’s apparent frustration with nickelback Kyler Gordon’s inability to stay healthy or “power through” injuries.
  • Dan: “That's a coach who's exasperated and has finally decided to use his pulpit to place a little bit of public pressure on that player...” [09:00]
• Kevin elaborates: Coaches want availability, and there’s a growing concern Gordon could be one of those “100 percenters”—players who won’t play unless fully healthy.
• Depth behind Gordon is thin: Malik Muhammad, Tyreek Stevenson, Jaylon Johnson, Josh Blackwell, and Cam Lewis are mentioned as alternative options, but none have Gordon's unique skill set.
• Bears’ effectiveness at the nickel may hinge on Gordon’s availability and willingness to play through “being hurt” (versus “being injured”).

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3. Defensive Line and “Coaching Better”

Timestamps: [12:37]–[15:09]

• Hosts are skeptical about new claims from defensive staff that “coaching better” (less scheme, more fundamentals) will improve the D-line.
  • Dan: “Why weren’t you coaching them better before?” [12:37]
• Kevin provides context: Players like Gervon Dexter describe it as “night and day”—less confusion, more foundational drills (especially focusing on get-off at the snap).
• Both are hesitant to buy into yet another “breakout year” narrative for Dexter.
  • “If a guy doesn’t break out by year three...” – Kevin [14:08]

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4. Left Tackle Position Battle

Timestamps: [15:09]–[20:23]

• Braxton Jones appears to be the Week 1 starter, taking all first-team reps in OTAs/minicamp, “it’s his to lose” [17:44].
• Main competitors:
  • Kiran Amogadi (also working at left, loved by front office)
  • Theo Benedet (swing tackle potential, reps at both tackle spots)
  • Jedrick Willis (not yet “competitive”)
• Jones’ strengths: Solid, experienced, but not a star. Weakness: Prone to getting bull-rushed and pushed into the QB’s lap.
• Proximity to quality guards (Joe Thuney, Jonah Jackson) can help mask imperfections.
• Matt: “Any play caller with the ability that Ben Johnson has can make life easier for the tackle...” [18:16]

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5. Eric Studesville and Run Game Innovations

Timestamps: [21:42]–[26:17]

• Addition of Eric Studesville as RB coach excites hosts; his Miami background blending Shanahan-style runs with inside/outside zone could diversify Bears’ run game.
• Kevin reveals Ben Johnson loves designing the run game:
  • “One of the things I learned about Ben Johnson last year... was how much he loves designing the run as part of his playbook.” [23:26]
• Projected heavy usage of 12 and 13 personnel, with preseason focus on running “smash mouth” (Philly win cited as the archetype).
• New RB Salvon Ahmed noted as a potential depth add, with ties to Studesville/Miami.

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6. Caleb Williams and Offensive Operation

Timestamps: [26:17]–[28:55]

• Caleb is “farther along” than last year installing offense; operation is smoother, fewer pre-snap errors.
• Kevin: “Caleb Williams was perfect in 7-on-7, which a good quarterback should be.” [27:15]
• Assertiveness and command at the line have improved (noted urgency in hurry-up situations).
• Training camp and joint practices with Cincinnati will be telling.

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7. Long Snapper Competition

Timestamps: [28:55]–[31:04]

• Two untested long snappers (Garder from Georgia and Luke Elkin) competing.
• Bears have “cared about special teams under Poles/Hightower,” but are rolling the dice on youth.
• A veteran could be brought in if neither impresses by late August.

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8. Media Relations & Player Interviews

Timestamps: [31:04]–[34:34]

• Favorite interviewees:
  • Kevin Byard (“Mount Rushmore of Bears interviews”) – media savvy, open.
  • Jaquan Brisker – never predictable, “good sound bites.”
  • Jonah Jackson – emerging as O-line spokesperson.
  • Kobe Bryant (fun with podium banter).
  • Potential: Garrett Bradbury (good media reputation).
  • Grady Jarrett (defensive leadership and candor)
• Question remains: Who becomes the new vocal leader after departures (Byard, Brisker, Edmonds)?

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9. Center Position: Bradbury vs. Logan Jones

Timestamps: [33:35]–[35:05]

• Garrett Bradbury has experience; Iowa rookie Logan Jones is viewed as “already mature,” possibility to start if he proves ready.
• Coaching staff is open to meritocracy:
  • “If Logan Jones... is better than the veteran, I think they’ll be perfectly fine putting him in there.” – Kevin [34:36]

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10. Light-Hearted Endings: Parenting, Baseball, and Hockey

Timestamps: [35:05]–[39:57]

• Kevin shares pride in former players he coached as youth baseballers; currently, his own kids’ sports journeys consume his summer.
• Dan provides advice for parents of young hockey goalies and catchers, poking fun at the cost and gear obsessions in youth sports.
• The segment ends with jokes about bat pricing, sporting goods stores, and parental commiseration.

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Notable Quotes

• Dan on Rome Odunze’s market value:
  “The moment he said that he’s worth less on the open market... isn’t he the guy with the thing with the foot, it just changes his value or the perception of his value.” [07:20]

• Kevin on Ben Johnson’s run game excitement:
  “His vacation is sitting down with Eric Studesville and watching Miami tape.” [23:34]

• Dan on the left tackle battle:
  “Any play caller with the ability that Ben Johnson has can make life easier for the tackle and cannot ask as much... but it maybe takes some things off the table that he would like to do ideally.” [18:16]

• Kevin on the center competition:
  “If Logan Jones goes out there and understands the calls, knows what he’s doing and is better than the veteran, I think they’ll be perfectly fine putting him in there.” [34:36]

• Dan (with self-deprecation):
  “They should. They should. I’ve always referred to myself as the Deerfield warrior.” [06:30] (in response to being called 'Dan Concernstein')

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Important Segments and Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment/Topic | |-----------|------------------------------------------------| | 03:32 | Rome Odunze’s injury & foot comments | | 09:00 | Kyler Gordon’s injury availability | | 12:37 | D-Line/fundamentals coaching debate | | 15:09 | Left tackle camp battle (Jones, Amogadi, etc.) | | 21:42 | RB coach Eric Studesville/run game innovations | | 26:17 | Caleb Williams/offense installation update | | 28:55 | Long snapper battle | | 31:04 | Best Bears for media/interviews | | 33:35 | Bradbury vs. Logan Jones at center | | 35:05 | Parenting, baseball, and hockey stories |

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Tone and Style

• Direct, analytical, with a mix of humor and “long-suffering Bears fan” candor.
• Willing to challenge team narratives and raise skeptical questions about coaching, injuries, and depth, but still excited about the upside under Ben Johnson and Caleb Williams.

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Summary for New Listeners

If you missed this episode, you get a spirited deep-dive into the Bears’ most pressing training camp questions—especially at wide receiver, left tackle, and in the all-important QB room. Expect lively banter, honest skepticism, and solid reporting, plus insight into new coaching hires and a realistic look at player development. The personal stories at the end add a relatable, fun touch for fellow sports parents.

Transcript

[A]

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[C]

I mean, if you're a Bears fan,

[D]

you're thinking Forward progress. Come on. 10. 219. 219.

[C]

Forward progress a Chicago Bears podcast with Dan Bernstein and Matt Abeticola on 312 Sports. It is here on 312 Sports that we give you Forward Progress as we cover the Chicago Bears and the NFL. And I thought with everything that is going on on the field that we would bring in somebody who covers the team regularly and that is Kevin Fishbane of the Athletic, our longtime friend who is on socials at K. Fishbane and with us here now on Forward Progress. How you been? Hello. Happy summer.

[D]

Hi Dan. Does this mean we're not going to talk about the stadium?

[C]

You know, I think, I think I handled that fairly well, especially with the the news that broke last night that the Bears haven't even applied for permits in Indiana yet, that they didn't even go through with that aspect of the ruse to actually, you know, start doing the work that would have to be done to begin the beginning of the process of evaluating that site. That's, you know, it's no big deal. They just don't have any permits.

[D]

Yeah, that's fine. You know, I'll say this, that what's funny about it is it's the type of thing that people say they're sick of hearing about, but it's the only thing anybody ever asks me about.

[C]

Me, too.

[D]

And I kind of. And I get it 100%. And sometimes I'm like, listen, you guys, you have a quarterback, you have a coach. Like your team has expectations like you want. Let's. Let's talk some ball.

[C]

And here's the other thing. They're going to be at Soldier Field for the foreseeable future and maybe forever. And I don't know if any of these stadium sites are going to work and they're going to have to crawl back and renegotiate their Soldier Field lease probably anyway. So just, just if you want to concentrate on this year's team and the Ben Johnson and Caleb Williams era, don't worry about where they play. Don't worry about it. What I am worried about, and, and this is. It's bugged me. And I need to ask you straight up, why didn't anybody in the, in the beat media follow up with Ben Johnson about Roma Dunze's comments about his remodeled foot that he said isn't going to be the same that he, he has to get used to? I thought that was a huge deal. Why hasn't there been more reporting on those comments?

[D]

He got asked one. He got asked about it on, let's see, Wednesday. Courtney Cronin asked him. Okay, good about it. And his response was. I think it was. I'm pretty sure I transcribed that one, too. But it was simply like, as far as I know, he's. He's fine. He's good. We're good. I don't know if you saw Dan Alan Robinson posted on Twitter that he had this happen to him early in his career and it took some adjusting and then it happened to him again on his other foot, like later in his career, I think. I don't want to fully quote that, but. Yeah, but, but Ben was asked about it. He gave us kind of the standard coach. Like, he's not worried. You know, I could tell you just From. I know it's just a few practices. You watch Rome out there and you're like, okay, he looks fine.

[C]

Okay.

[D]

I couldn't, you know, so. But yeah, it was when he said that and you. You probably watch it. It was like the way end of Rome's media availability, and it was one of those things where we're all like, I'm sorry, what was that about your foot? And it was like, it was at the end, so there wasn't a whole lot of opportunities for us to follow up. But yeah, Ben was asked about it and kind of just made it seem. Made it clear that he's not concerned about it.

[C]

Okay, fair enough. I. I am, and I'm going to remain concerned about it just because I, you know, my, My memory goes back to Kevin White. It goes back to David Terrell and highly touted wide receivers who were never able to recover from early injuries. They could recover enough to play and enough for a coach to say they were okay, but neither one recovered enough to be an effective football player anymore. So that's, you know, that's why. I don't know, I'm just a little more easily scared, more easily spooked by some of this stuff, perhaps, than others.

[D]

That's fine. I got him. As I said, when he said it, we all. Eyebrows raised all across the room. Like, that was jarring to hear from somebody that talented, picked that high, that important to the future. Has anybody ever called you Dan Concernstein?

[C]

They should. They should. I. I've always. I've referred to myself as the Deerfield warrior.

[D]

Let's bring that out to the. In the lexicon. But I, you know, here's the other thing about Rome is. So last year, they have dj. You know, DJ does his thing, they trade him because Luther comes up. Right. I kind of wondered when I was doing mock drafts and looking at different options. And I don't know. I mean, I don't want to put this on Xavon Thomas right now, but like, if you want to play some hypotheticals, Dan, you know, if Rome is fine and Luther Burden takes off, like many are expecting, and let's just say Xavon Thomas looks awesome and, and you're. You have some concerns long term about ro. Like, like, this is, this is what.

[C]

That's what I said. I said the moment he said that he's worth less on the open market. Like the. When you bring that in or you put that in the league bloodstream, where anybody. Isn't he the guy with the thing with the foot, it just Changes his value or the perception of his value.

[D]

Yeah, it's one of those things. Even before I knew that about the foot, he was kind of the guy I had circled as this is a massive year for him because he goes, if he gets 1500 yards receiving and 12 touchdowns, you're talking about a gargantuan contract. And this guy, you know, they're building statues for him in Chicago, and if he's just fine and Luther Burden's great, then you, you don't have to do that, and you can figure something out down the road and, and maybe you sit there and you're like, well, we got a good quarterback and we've got Ben Johnson. We could just plug him another guy in there. I don't think it's gonna be that simple. And I, I hope for Roma Dun that he's fine, is able to play well. I mean, he's, he's. I, I know, I know fans might roll their eyes of this, but, like, he's the guy we all love talking to.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

And from all, everything we've learned about him, you know, good guy. And, and, you know, the fact that he volunteered to be the, the face of the schedule video and do that little bit.

[C]

Yeah. And he acted. It was good. Yeah.

[D]

You, you want a guy like that, obviously, you want all these guys to be healthy and be successful, but someone like him, you know, you hope and, and yeah, it's, it's something that anytime something's going to come up, the first moment Dan, that he's on the injury report with foot parentheses, everyone's going to be understandably concerned. Steamed.

[C]

Yeah, this is going to stick. Speaking of injuries, it sounded to me like Ben Johnson is sick of Kyler Gordon's in, in availability, unavailability, however you want to say it, he's tired of it. And that, that is a coach, that's a coach who's exasperated and has finally decided to use his pulpit to place a little bit of public pressure on that player, as if to say, you know, I, I, I don't think you're faking it, but you got to do whatever you can do to learn. What every football player has to learn is there is the difference between being hurt and injured and you start pulling everything. You know, the best of ability is availability. You can't make the club in the tub. And, but when it comes from the coach going out of his way to say what he said, what are the feelings that are, are not specifically being mentioned, that are bubbling to the surface?

[D]

I think you're yeah. You're sensing frustration now. I want to go out front and say that I don't know how injured or hurt Kyler Gordon is right now. I don't know how much is. This is like you've had these soft tissue things. So we're just going to be uber cautious and just wait. But I mean, I remember early in my career, Dan, I'm sure you went through this, especially when you're covering teams. Like the first time you ever heard the term of 100er, you know, the guy and I. And again, I'm not saying that is Kyler Gordon. But you came across guys who it's like, oh yeah, unless they're a hundred percent, they're not out there. And I will. I'll again, not saying that that's what Kyler Gordon's situation is. But those are players that exist. And based on what we know about Ben Johnson, you know, he wants a guy he. He doesn't want. He's not excited about guys like that. Also, Dan juxtapose the way he responded to Kyle Gordon, the way he talked about Diodangbo this week where he said, it's a bonus for us that we got this extra week of practice because the doctors, they did not think he'd be able to pray. And he go and he specifically said Dio wanted to be out there. Now, again, I'm not saying that that was. He was subtweeting Kyle Gordon or anything like that. I'm not saying that. But it gives you an insight into what matters to the head coach and how important it is. You know, we always talk about this voluntary stuff and you always put voluntary in quotes. The coach wants these guys out there. He wants them playing. He sees how the value in it. So yeah, the Kyler, he's been open. He goes. He's pretty much said, I barely know the guy. I don't know what he can do. I'll finish this with this, Dan. The one issue the Bears have, they don't have another Kyler Gordon. And when, and we saw it in the Rams game in the playoffs, like when that guy is healthy and out there and doing his thing, he's very good at a position that requires a specific skill set that he has. And Dennis Allen mentioned him in Dennis Allen's intra press conference. They didn't go bring in a nickel. I don't think Malik Muhammad like to not say he can't play there, but that's not what Malik Muhammad was drafted for necessarily. Tyreek Stevenson's not sliding inside. Jaylen Johnson's not sliding side, side. You got guys in Josh Blackwell and Jalen Jones, and the other guy to keep an eye on would be Cam Lewis, who they signed for Buffalo, who can play safety and nickel couldn't. Couldn't.

[C]

Feman in a pinch and Kobe Bryant.

[D]

I mean, Kobe played. Played nickel when he came into the league, too. So, yes, I mean, you have two safeties who have that ability, and it gives you some chess pieces, for sure. But this team's so much better when Kyle Gordon's healthy and Ben Johnson knows that.

[C]

They also have said that the defensive line and the front seven is going to be better because they're going to coach him better. And I have rolled my eyes at that because, well, why weren't you coaching them better before? And they said, well, we. We realized we were doing too much scheme and not enough fundamentals. Too much of where they're not enough of how. Whatever, man. Is this just a head coach that is happy to win games 48 to 42 and wants all his toys on offense? He just like, da, you figure it out. You do what you got to do. But as far as the resources, they're going to tell the story, or do they really believe that their reprioritized coaching is going to make NFL players better?

[D]

Well, if they don't, then they're the ones in the hot seat, right? They're the ones that we're going to, you know, you guys said they're going to coach better. They didn't put up the production. So is it on you or is it on the front office? Because it's almost like you sit there and you're like, well, are you guys just blaming yourselves because you don't want to blame the front office for not getting you better players and you just want to, you know, just take the heat now. Now, Javon Dexter, when he talked to us last week, he. He called it night and day in terms of being able to kind of strip things down, practice these fundamentals, not have their head buried in scheme. And he seemed to appreciate it.

[C]

And we do this every year with Javon Dexter. Every year's the breakout year. Every year's like, well, now he's figured it out. Now he's ready to go. Now this is okay. Okay, fine.

[D]

Yeah, well, I know. And I'm not like, I'm kind of. I'm with you there with your Von Dexter. Like, to me, if a guy doesn't break out by year three, like, it'd be great, obviously, if he can. And they didn't Sign a replacement or draft a replacement. So we'll see. But it's, it's one of those things where it's like, what narrative do you go with when you did not sign or draft anybody to help you? That's the narrative they chose. Whether or not that's true, I don't know. But they're sticking with it. And you watch some of the drills at minicamp and you can see, oh, they are clearly working on the get off. They are very intentional in practicing just to get it off the snap. And that's something they've all said was a problem last year. So now we wait and see. Because like right now, yeah, they're saying to us, hey, we have the guys just wait. Once they're coached better, who knows? But yeah, and then if they're not coached better, is it the coaches fault or do then they go sign new guys.

[C]

Braxton Jones is apparently at the moment the starting left tackle and we haven't heard much about how that battle is going to shape up. It's Karen Amogadi, who looks like the other primary contender at the moment with Jedrick Willis being of indeterminate competitive capability right now and Theo Benedict working over on the right side. How do you see this shaping up and what are the, the marking points of, of timing for the coaching staff for Dan Roshar to get this where they want it, when they want it.

[D]

Last year took a while, if you remember in training camp, like it, it as he opened up there and it didn't, it didn't last that long, maybe a couple weeks. And then I remember Theo Benedict coming out of nowhere to take some reps there and then went back to Braxton Jones and Crown. Magogie was hurt so he wasn't really in it. I, I think they would. You know, they always say that they don't care, but I'm sure they'd love to get this done, you know, yesterday. And look, Braxton took every rapid, the first team left tackle that I saw in OTAs and minicamp and I, I think that they are content if he keeps this up and doesn't slip and doesn't get hurt, that they're comfortable with him being the week one starter. The guy's got a lot of experience and before the ankle injury I think he was like, what did I call him? Like a Charles Leno light. Like he's just, he's fine, he's solid. You know what you're getting. And he's not going to make Pro Bowls, but he's going to do his job, you know, pretty well and he's not going to have these giant gaffes that are gonna. That's gonna cost you. And then the ankle injury happened and everything changed. So you go, you know, you see where he's at. I, I think he's got the lead Bennett. It's interesting because he looks like he, he looks the part right now like you could tell he did some work on his body that he like looks more and more NFL ready and he had that game tape last year. He is working on the right side and I'm a gotcha working more left side. But I have seen times where Benedet will go like 2nd team right tackle and 3rd team left tackle because they want to give him reps on both sides. So he's probably your swing. I'm. I guess if there's a, A. I haven't seen anything from Jedrick Willis to think that is going to be a big storyline. It might be, but I haven't seen that yet. If anything, Amagaji is interesting just because you knew how much his front office loved him and maybe he challenges. But right now I think it's going to be Braxton Jones. It's.

[B]

He.

[D]

He didn't love this phrasing but it's his to lose and I appreciate that he understood that. That was a question that was tough for him to answer when phrased that way. But yeah, look, if he's healthy and the other thing too, Dan, and, and you and I probably talked about this at this time, you know, like during the season or in the fall. They're like when you have Joe Tooney next to you, you have Jonah Jackson, Darnell right on the other side. You don't need that left tackle to be at all pro. Like it makes it a little bit easier to have a guy who's maybe more around the league average.

[C]

I also think it depends on the kinds of plays obviously that and the time what you're asking the position do in any play caller with the ability that Ben Johnson has can make life easier for the tackle and cannot ask as much. But it maybe take some things off the table that he would like to do ideally. And I understand that when we see this offense fully fledged, really out there ready to go with a somebody you could put on an island to win and count on to win, it might even further open up everything that they want to do.

[D]

Look, this was a coach who was able to move Toonie to left tackle in the biggest game of the year last year. Now Tunis a unicorn in a sense. But, but part of doing that was taking a guy in, Jordan McFadden who had barely played and having him started left guard and they did okay. So I think that you're right. I think Ben Johnson can find a way like the key for that left tackle is like don't be the one who, don't be the revolving door because.

[C]

Right. Or but him. The problem with Braxton Jones isn't as much revolving door as it is just being too movable an object. His problem is getting shot shoved into Caleb Williams's lap. It isn't the, the, the lookout block where the guy gets around you and you're just waving at the quarterback. It's, it's much more so falling backwards into the quarterback.

[D]

Yeah. And he's been really open with us in past off seasons about like very aware that that is his weakness and, and the things he's done the work on it and I'm excited to see how much better is, I mean Ben Johnson said in April how like what great shape Jones was in. And again we've learned about Ben Johnson. He doesn't blow smoke for just, just to do it and yeah but you have to see it on the field when the pads come on. How is that mental confidence for him going to work? Is he, is he fully past worrying about this ankle? Because that was as he said this week, that was an issue last year and conditioning wise he was just not as good after halftime in those first three games.

[A]

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[B]

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[C]

waiting on a piece to be written about this. This like a full piece and maybe you've talked about it at the Athletic and it has to do with the addition of Eric Studesville as the Bears running backs coach. And I go back to when a very, very young Eric Stoonsville was Dave Wanstadt's offensive quality control guy. He was just a tape guy back when I was covering the team and then he's gone and worked for multiple teams. And what he did and helped do in large part with Miami is fascinating to me. Where they took some Shanahan type gap scheme runs and they married that with some outside zone and some inside zone. There is a little bit of fullback action and I'm trying. I was starting to think, well, what the Bears do out of 13 personnel when you used to see Durham Smythe or this year, if it's, if it's going to be the rookie who's going to come through there, put his hand on the ground and they motion that guy into fullback stuff that Ben has got to be really excited about what he might be able to tell him. Now the personnel at the moment at running back is the same. You still have that Swift Minung guy, Roshan Johnson, Britton Brown. And I know that that last, the last two may transpose, however that would work. But are you thinking what I'm thinking about Ben Johnson just getting super excited and maybe not, you know, waiting to spring on some people, some of these run game leverage concepts we saw you so successfully in Miami being incorporated into the mix here.

[D]

One of the things I learned about Ben Johnson last year that was so illuminating was how much he loves designing the run like as part of his playbook.

[C]

Yeah, I remember his, his response to that one Jonah Jackson block. Do you remember that? It was, it was almost this, this kind of like full body arousal when he knew that that was the block that had to be made and they wanted, they recruited that guy to make that block in the offense like that level of detail. And he gets so excited.

[D]

I mean the, the win in Philadelphia was like his was like Ben Johnson's master piece. It was like his perfect game. And you think about these new age offensive coaches and you think, oh, all these guys, all these former quarterbacks do want is pass, pass, pass. They'll have their offensive line coach design a run game and be a run game coordinator and he'll deal with that for when they have to run the ball. But Ben Johnson's different. He likes that. So I, I think you're onto something. He mentioned it yesterday when talking about things he'll do on vacation. His vacation is sitting down with Eric Stuville and watching Miami tape. And I'll throw something into the running back conversation, I think Salvon Ahmed, I don't, I don't know the exact pronunciation who came over as a free agent. They signed him like right before OTAs, I want to say was in Miami last year, I believe before he went

[C]

to Denver's practice squad and then Indy.

[D]

Okay, so there's some overlap there. And he's, he's playing in the end. I mean he's, he's played a little bit. And again, just curious if he ends up being a, a third or fourth guy if he factors into a competition there because something different. But yeah, I mean like, we know they're going to run a lot 12 and 13. We know Ben Johnson loves to run the ball and, and just smash mouth against some of these, these defenses. And it, it worked in one of the, it was, I mean that Philly win was such a signature moment that this team had not had. Obviously they got extra signature moments in the two Green Bay wins, but that one was really the one that's like, okay, this, this team is for real. And they just bludgeoned Vic Fangio's defense by running the football. So I think that you're absolutely onto something that there's something there with. And we, I remember asking be Eric B. Enemy last year actually, like, how much do you love working with a head coach that wants to run the ball? Right. This is not like I actually was for something separately. I was looking up the old quotes from 2019 from Matt Nagy after he said, I know I need to run the ball.

[C]

I'm not an idiot. I'm not an idiot. Yeah.

[D]

And then the next week they lined up an eye formation like 30 times against the Chargers. And, and he kind of the next week goes, yeah, I didn't come here to run the eye formation, but it's what I had to do. This is, this is a coach Ben Johnson likes to run the ball. And I think we've seen in recent Super Bowls that that matters a lot. And I think that, that the Studsville marriage there could open some more things up.

[C]

Does the offense, from what you can tell, and I know there is really isn't that much to see, but we're hearing the usual things about, well, Caleb Williams is so much further along right now, last year when we're installing all these new things that he's much more conversant. And we heard at this time, and certainly when actual camp started, the offense looked bad, that they said it. Just people watching and saying it was clunky. They had problems with simple things. Any evidence of that at the moment? Or is. Is that this mechanism better oiled now, just moving better, operating better than it was last year at this time?

[D]

Oh yeah, the operation's better for sure now. Like were there tons of moments where it was like across the field and touchdown, touchdown, touchdown. Not as much. I will say Wednesday's minicamp practice. I think Caleb Williams was perfect in 7 on 7, which a good quarterback should be.

[C]

Better be.

[D]

Yeah, you and I have seen enough quarterbacks in this town not be perfect in 7 on 7 that like I think that that is important and that matters. But yeah, as far as the operation goes, you do see the difference. I'm fascinated to see what it looks like in training camp, the joint, the joint practice. Cincinnati will also be kind of eye opening to see where this, what this thing looks like because training camp was rough. I mean the pre snap flags were a problem. Just that was probably our first glimpse of the accuracy issues that ended up being obviously a bugaboo for Caleb. The whole, you know, so ball placement is obviously gonna be on everyone's mind throughout training camp. But just as far as getting out of the huddle, gaining the line, getting the playoff. And I will say you probably saw the reports from yesterday from Caleb Williams with Luther Burden, time to get on the football. I saw something last week where a play they decided to call a hurry up and he, I mean Kayla was barking at these guys to get on the ball so they can get the snap off. That assertiveness has certainly been more evident this year and as you would expect, what that means in the season, who's to say. But that stuff is definitely looks improved. I started Ornod in 2013 and we make bike apparel. The best part of Shopify for me is our ability to run the business as essentially non technical people. We're able to admin everything on the back end, front end and sell things online easily. If Shopify were a bike accessory, I think it would actually be the bicycle. It's the thing that you do, the thing on we run the business on Shopify. Start your free trial on shopify.com

[C]

have you been Is anybody paying attention to the long snapper battle and do we know why they have decided to go with untested NFL long snappers rather than signing a veteran? Is this just somebody inexpensively is going to grow with the team? Do they feel that it's much more of a fungible position once you get to a certain competence level?

[D]

You and I both know which beat writers got the finger on the pulse of the long snapper battle and I, I, I, I've not paid a ton of attention to it in the spring. I am, I am excited to watch it this summer. I will I will make a big deal about is interesting though because the other thing about Ben Johnson and Ryan Poles I'll give polls credit for this. Since he got here he has really cared about special teams. You see it in the guys he drafts, the guys he signs. The Bears special teams under Richard Hightower have been pretty good. Not the best but pretty good. So it is interesting that they're trusting these two young guys to battle it out now come late August there's a lot of 30 plus year old long snappers who are available in a pitch and maybe that's what they decide to do if this just doesn't work out. But I think they've obviously see something. I mean this gardener kid who's like 65 out of Georgia and for whatever long anyway won the Patrick Manily award was considered. I think our our guy Dane Bruger is the second best long snapper. So you have he's got obviously this rare athletic build for the position and then Luke Elkin was here last summer. So yeah it's, it is fascinating that they're that they're doing this because of how much both coach and GM care about special teams. But again I always leave the door open on a position like that. Like that is something you can kind of bring in a guy late and he'll figure it out. But they talk about position you can't get wrong like you, you know you can't. It just takes one and you don't want to be scrambling around in October looking for a new long snapper.

[C]

You said before that you enjoyed talking to Roma Dunes A before we let you go. I'm just with this crop of bears or with some guys with another year of seasoning on them. Who are your your go tos? Who have you found? Like this is somebody who when we talk to this person we learn things or they're just fun or different or interesting. Get to know your Bears.

[D]

Well, we've got to find a couple new ones this year to replace. You know, Kevin Byard was everyone's goto. I mean, he was one of the, he's on my Mount Rushmore in really 13 years in the Beat. Yeah, he was awesome because he was one of those guys who got it, who didn't necessarily load up cliches. And then you could go up to him later and be like, hey, I'm working on this. Can you help me? You know, give me some anecdote, give me some context. And he was awesome because he's a media guy.

[C]

Like he's hosted a show before. He, he knows what we're doing.

[D]

He, he totally gets it. Jaquan Brisker on the in a little bit of a different way was fun because you never knew what, you know, he, you never knew what he was going to say. And it. You could get some good sound bites out of him. So I was like, Kobe Bryant had a little fun with us at the podium this week. He came up there and said, everyone's phones off. No phones up here. Right after the, the incident from the week before. So little soft. More soft spoken than Byron and Brisker, but you can sense a little sense of humor there. I love talking Jonah Jackson, he's kind of like the guy in the offensive line room who's been, you know, he's, he's not outspoken, but for that group, he kind of has become the spokesperson. I, I enjoy hearing from him. I will say this, I haven't got a chance to talk to him yet, but Garrett Bradbury was like a consistent PFWA media Good guy award winner in previous spots. So I imagine he will be someone that, that people like to talk to. And thinking about the defensive side of the ball here. Gray Jared is Gray Jared's fun, I think. Gray Jarrett. I know obviously fans want more production. I get it. But like there is something to the leadership element that he brings for a defense that this will be a conversation topic this summer. Dan I talk about Buying and Brisker and Tremaine Edmonds being gone. Like, who's going to be that vocal leader and sometimes that stuff gets overrated. But I'm, I'm curious to see in training camp who, who those guys are. So, yeah, those are some of the people that I've that certainly guys I've enjoyed talking to. And again, I'm looking forward to talking to Bradbury a little bit as well as the season gets going.

[C]

Was Bradbury going to keep that job because I get the feeling everybody's rooting for Logan Jones to, to prove that he's ready before people think.

[D]

I say it's time to get 54 back on the field. Dan.

[C]

That's right. That's right.

[D]

From Iowa.

[C]

I am not talking about Brian Cabral, my friend, that there's, there's a lot of, I'm just wondering. I know outside the organization there's that feeling, but maybe internally, like, hey, kid, if you want to show us that we don't need a stopgap, go ahead.

[D]

They, they talk about how mature he is and that's the position. Like the biggest gap between him and G Garrett Bradbury is experience. And then all they do is talk about how when a guy comes from Iowa, he already has that experience. He already knows how to do all these things. They talk about how he's married, like, he's just different than other rookies. So it's kind of funny because, like, well, yeah, Garrett Bradbury's got the experience, but you keep talk telling us that this guy.

[C]

That's why I'm asking.

[D]

Yeah, I, I, I think it'll be, it's something to watch this, this summer. It'll be and this look, you've seen Bears teams and I saw them earlier in my career where draft or not draft cachet, where it took a while for a rookie to really get on the field, even if he was clearly the better player. That's not this coaching staff. If Logan Jones goes out there and is and understands the calls, understands, knows what he's doing and is better than the veteran, I think they'll, they'll be perfectly fine putting him in there.

[C]

All right. Do you get a summer break here before training camp starts? Are you going to go away or do you have baseball to coach and, and family to take care of?

[D]

I'm long retired from coaching. Although it was fun this year, Dan, and you'll appreciate this through your baseball journey. The kids I that I coached and the best team I ever coached, 2018, were seniors this year and led my alma mater, Highland Part two conference championship. Hey, so that was really fun and like the pitcher of the year in the conference I coached, the hitter of the year in the conference was on my team.

[C]

That's so cool.

[D]

They've got a junior who was on that team who's committed to Lafayette after high school. So that was real proud moment for me. All I want is for them to just play. I just hope that they still have the passion for the game and I would love for them just keep playing, but I get how hard it is to. To make it all the way to varsity. And for me to be able to see, you know, a couple of these kids I coach, that was. That was a lot of fun. And, yeah, I will be. My hands will. My hands will be full all summer with my. My own children who, you know, I just. I just want them to love something, Dan. And they do. Are they the exact things that I loved when I was this age? Not yet. But you know what? You'll like this. My middle child is obsessed with hockey. No idea where that came from.

[C]

You've got a falcon.

[D]

But all he wants to do is talk, watch, and play hockey. And so I got him in ice skating lessons.

[C]

There you go. You're right. It's Centennial, right? I mean, you're just.

[D]

He's. He's over. We're a little. Well, we're. We're having him in south of Centennial. We're in the New Trier district, so.

[C]

Oh, okay. So. All right. I know where you are. I know that. That program, that rink. And he's how old?

[D]

He's right now. He's three and a half.

[C]

Perfect. Perfect.

[D]

And he just loves. Every time a goal is scored and we're watching, he goes, dada. The goalie fell down. He loves watching the goalie and. Okay, he wants to be a goalie, so.

[C]

Oh, he wants to be. Oh, no, you're gonna be a goal.

[D]

I want to be goalie Dan. I took him to a baseball game recently. A travel.

[C]

Wants to be a catcher.

[D]

He was sitting behind the backstop doing the catch.

[C]

Wants to be a catcher because he. You got one of those. I think you might have one of those where Start saving your money. And I want you. If you haven't. If you're not a member at Play It Again Sports.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Get that membership right. Damn. Now, I will also give you all of the Canadian warehouse websites for the clearance sales on leg pads, goalie skates, chest pads. Welcome to it. And I'm always here. I'm always here for advice.

[D]

I knew you'd appreciate that. I hope. I hope he continues to enjoy it.

[C]

That's awesome.

[D]

I would love to have those financial problems to pay for them to play sports. But I did. I did go to Dick's. I guess I shouldn't have said the name of it, but I did go to it Is the only sporting goods store there. Is one of my.

[C]

Yeah, but not for hockey. A lot of it's not for hockey. They don't carry Anything But I went

[D]

for his older brother. He had his first, like, season of like full season of T ball coach pitch. And I was looking at that bat rack and I was like, oh my gosh. I. I couldn't believe the prices. I was like $600 blown away, like 6 of. Understand why my dad didn't get me like a brand new bat until I got to high school. It was always played against sports or hand me downs all the way until I got to high school. I'm like, dad, I get it. I never complained about it. I was always fine with it, but I totally. I totally get it now.

[C]

It's insane. We were. We cleaned out the basement last weekend, and we found this Mizuno super technical bed. It looks like a gun almost. This thing looks like a. And it's. It was, I don't know, four or five hundred, whatever it was. And it's sitting there in the basement. And he doesn't even use it because he. I don't even think he remembers what end of the bath to hold because he'd been a pitcher only for so long. And like, what are we doing with this as we're throwing it out? And she's like, well, he's. He's gonna go. Gotta go sell it and play it again. Like, not for his money. Give me that money. He didn't buy it. So the. The. The whole bat thing is out of. It's completely out of hand. And the number of team needs three bats.

[D]

My oldest, the bat that he's using is already, I think, too light for him.

[C]

So it's like because of the league rules. Is it because of the drop rules?

[D]

No, he. He found a bat that he liked and happened to be cheap, so I said, great, get it even. I barely. Look, I just made him. I had him swing it in the store so I could make sure he could swing it and he could. And then he's the biggest kid on his team and one of the other dads. I think. I think he needs a different. I think he needs a different bat. So. Yeah, you know, these are things that will consume and consume my summer. You remember these days?

[A]

Well, yeah.

[C]

Oh, I. And I miss him. And enjoy them. That's awesome.

[D]

I am.

[C]

Enjoy them. And thank you for being our guest today. As always.

[D]

Thanks for having me.

[C]

That is Kevin Fishbane of the Athletic, who knows all about your Chicago Bears. I also want to remind you too, if you don't have the 312Sports app, you got to get it. It's in the Apple app. Store and Google Play, and that's because we have the rewards section. You can also find it at 312Sports.com. But I urge you, once you get in the app, you got to get registered and get all your information in there. And then you can use our code word to win great prizes. All you do is enter the promo code on any reward for a chance to win. That promo code for this month is Cody, our producer's name, C O D Y Cody. And you can win a $100 gift certificate to Abba, that is the Mediterranean restaurant with a California influence in Fulton Market. A $100 gift certificate to RPM Italian.

[D]

I don't need to tell you about RPM, you know that.

[C]

And Six Flags Great America tickets there. Family fun, Endless thrills, the thrill capital of the Midwest. If you are into music and absolute shredding. Guitar Joe Bonamassa is playing Ravinia August 12, 2026 and you can put in to win tickets there as well. Tickets for the 2026 season are on sale now at ravinia.org Again, the promo code on those things, Cody C O D y. That's the 312 Sports app. Make sure you have that and also go to the pro [e-mail] or the app. Buy your stuff, get your things. Get your there's DBU stuff now. DBU merch 312 sports merch. And if I see you out in the wild, I'm going to hug you. And I I may do other things that you're you're gonna have to call the authorities to have me dragged away from showing my love to you for reparations presenting 312 sports. But that is going to do it today for Forward Progress, a Chicago Bears podcast here on 312 Sports. Progress is stopped. Forward Progress, a Chicago Bears podcast with Dan Bernstein and Matabeticola on 312 Sports.