← Forward Progress - A Chicago Bears Podcast
Forward Progress - A Chicago Bears Podcast
Chicago Bears: Injuries Keep Piling Up in the Secondary
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- [00:02]
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- [01:02]
Dan Bernstein
I mean, if you're a Bears fan, you're thinking forward progress.
- [01:05]
Matt Abeticola
Come on. Forward Progress Chicago Bears podcast with Dan Bernstein and Matt Abeticola on 312 Sports.
- [01:24]
Dan Bernstein
You got forward progress and it's brought to you by Giordano's Back to school means back to busy between practices, homework, and everything in between. Give yourself a break with Giordano's, so treat the kids and yourself to Chicago Style Pizza. Everyone can agree on make tonight a Giordano's night at Giordano's.com or visit your local Giordano's restaurant today. Giordano's the one for Chicago style pizza. Props to NBC. Last night it was just nice to kind of have football on or something that vaguely resembled football. It was good to kind of get back in the rhythm a little bit. Nobody was taking it too seriously, but NBC unveiled their new crew. And I will admit that when I glanced up and I saw the tableau like who? Who is? And I knew in the background I knew Mike Tomlin had replaced Tony Dungy. But I didn't recognize Mike Tomlin on set. He looked like 20 years younger. Now that he's not coaching, I'm not
- [02:32]
Matt Abeticola
kidding, he's probably healthier.
- [02:34]
Dan Bernstein
He looked like a healthy, happy young man. And he's, he was smiling. You know, his eyebrows are kind of up. You don't really because usually he's sort of like his eyes are like this or he's wearing a baseball hat. You really don't see the top half of his head and like, who. I know that face. I. Holy. It's Mike Tomlin. And, and I thought he was really. I'm just happy that Dungey's not there. It's so great that that sanctimonious blowhole isn't there anymore. And Mike Tomlin was pretty good. And they, they, they did bring up the Mike Vrabel, Diana Rossini story. They talked about it. And I thought Devin McCourty was. Did a nice job saying it. It could affect how the players view him. It could have sort of pierced this. The. The armor of the infallible coach. You follow into anything. If you walk into every stadium and the guy's just getting dragged. So. And then Tomlin said, yeah, they. They gotta win early because if they don't and this starts to hang over him, it's the kind of thing that could end up getting, you know, turning worse on them.
- [03:36]
Matt Abeticola
So what we've heard so far from Patriots players that have spoken out is that, you know, he's our coach. We love our coach. None of that matters to me. You know, we're gonna. He's. He's still our guy. So it was, it was nice to hear a player's perspective of maybe people that aren't. Have been. Have not. Have not been vocal or at least had their thoughts shared that this could certainly have an impact. And of course, I mean, you have to think that realistically and logically, yeah, some guy may look at him differently. So we'll see how this does impact and maybe influence what happens in their. In their season so far. Also to Carson Beck, what are the 15 of 19. 188 yards. A touchdown.
- [04:19]
Dan Bernstein
That's the Bernstein effect there. Yes, that's what that is. That's the Bernstein kiss of life.
- [04:23]
Matt Abeticola
So, yeah, he didn't. Didn't look terrible. Certainly isn't going to be their starter, at least for the near future. Jacoby Brissette is their guy, at least for right now. But he didn't look terrible. And then we got to see our guy, Big Bill. Big Bill back on the field. Big Bill. Big Bill, he.
- [04:45]
Dan Bernstein
What do you think he. Compared to last year? He's up £50 at least.
- [04:51]
Matt Abeticola
Right? At least. Right.
- [04:53]
Dan Bernstein
Has to be like, at some point, you just can't move well enough at that weight.
- [04:57]
Matt Abeticola
But I guess I can still move. It's.
- [04:59]
Dan Bernstein
He must have said my. I thought that the Bears told him just be fat. Yeah. And now they've taken that to a whole new thing, like be a. Be a planetoid. He's.
- [05:10]
Matt Abeticola
He's Enormous planetoid.
- [05:12]
Dan Bernstein
No, he is. He's like a dwarf planet. Like. Like Pluto or is it Ceres? Is that in his C E R E s? Isn't that right? Sure. Yeah, I think it is. I think Ceres is a dwarf planet. Yes, it's a dwarf planet. I was right. Damn it. In the main asteroid belt between Mars and Jupiter. It's the largest without a moon.
- [05:36]
Matt Abeticola
So that's. That's Big Bill.
- [05:38]
Dan Bernstein
Big Bill is now also classified officially as a dwarf planet.
- [05:42]
Matt Abeticola
The largest NFL player without a moon.
- [05:46]
Dan Bernstein
Correct. And don't make that a challenge to him, because I don't want to see any moon.
- [05:52]
Matt Abeticola
No, no, no, no, no. We had enough of that at the Cubs raise game.
- [05:57]
Dan Bernstein
Everybody okay down there? Are we all right? Everything okay? No, no. It's not good for Big Bill.
- [06:07]
Matt Abeticola
Yeah, we got a little. Little bit of football last night in a. In the hall of Fame game. What? Panthers. I think they. They pulled that out 33 to 30. So if you're betting on that, good luck to you and my friend.
- [06:19]
Dan Bernstein
You're betting on that.
- [06:23]
Matt Abeticola
I want to go to the Bears. And there was a late injury yesterday that. That happened in the secondary after we were done recording forward progress, so we didn't talk about it, But Jalen Jones went down and missed the last two portions of practice yesterday. Jalen Jones, who had stepped in at the slot nickel and was taking the reps with the number ones because this was something Cam Lewis was doing, who moved to safety after Kobe Bryant got injured. So Jalen Jones was in. At the nickel corner in running with the ones though he goes down, misses the last two portions of that. So then Malik Muhammad is getting opportunities there to go with the ones at the nickel corner spot. So if I have this correctly, let me make sure I get this correct. Elijah Hicks is out with a shin. Dallas Flowers went down yesterday with teammates circling around him. Knee looked bad. Jalen Jones goes down yesterday. Kobe Bryant's out what we thought was eight to 10 weeks because of what Adam Schefter said. Ben Johnson questions that and says, where'd you guys hear that from? He said that yesterday.
- [07:38]
Dan Bernstein
Did anybody say Adam Schefter?
- [07:40]
Matt Abeticola
Not. Not that I saw.
- [07:42]
Dan Bernstein
So he.
- [07:42]
Matt Abeticola
But he knows I would think he has to, right? Maybe he didn't, but now he does. I'm sure.
- [07:47]
Dan Bernstein
I'm sure he knew.
- [07:48]
Matt Abeticola
So Kobe Bryant, we don't know how long he's out for. Maybe less than eight weeks, maybe more than 10 weeks. Who knows now? And then Kyler Gordon, we got an update yesterday from the coach who didn't say very much, but to me said a lot. And the update on Kyler Gordon was, yep, there's no update, which means he's not doing anything, which means there is absolutely no baseline conditioning taking place for Kyler Gordon. Because he would share that. He would say he's running, he's doing this, he's doing that. But no update means there's no baseline conditioning taking place for Kyler Gordon.
- [08:23]
Dan Bernstein
Or maybe it means whatever I told you last time, or whatever. Whatever I said last time is the latest official comment I've gotten from trainers or anything that would be official. Official, which is clearly he's still there. It sounds like he's rehabbing.
- [08:41]
Matt Abeticola
Yes. Yeah, I mean, we saw, we saw a video of him signing autographs.
- [08:44]
Dan Bernstein
Right?
- [08:45]
Matt Abeticola
So he's rehabbing. He's not doing any football activity of any kind, just rehab stuff. So that tells me, I mean, you're, you're three weeks away from the end of August where he needs to start running. Okay. You're 37 days away from week one against the Panthers. So he's a little bit over five weeks away. What can happen in a five week period is what I started thinking. What can he do to get himself ready for week one? If that's even possible. So what I did last night, Dan, and I spent too much time on this, and I have a lot of different information that I learned in going through a lot of this medical stuff. I'm sure you'll be able to talk about intelligently off the top of your head, but there's some things I wanted to share and because maybe some of our listeners, you know, don't have the same breast of knowledge that, that you have as far as medical stuff and, and being a reporter around all this stuff a lot. So. Because I, I don't. So here's where I start. I started with Kyle Gordon last year just to look at his injuries. Okay? So during the 2025 season, Kyler Gordon was limited to 117 defensive snapshot. That's just 10.9% of the team's total defensive plays. So he was in on 11% of their total defensive plays. Last year, he missed 14 regular season games and faced two separate stints on the IR due to three distinct lower body soft tissue injuries. Now, we've never been told that it's the same leg that he's been dealing with, but given these soft tissue injuries, a hamstring, the groin or adductor strain, and a calf strain, it's pretty obvious to say that these have, what I've learned is called a one sided cascading failure. Okay, so one injury leads to another injury, leads to another injury within the same leg.
- [10:39]
Dan Bernstein
It can.
- [10:40]
Matt Abeticola
It can. Yes, yes.
- [10:42]
Dan Bernstein
It's not necessarily 100% provable, but it is a common kinetic chain issue.
- [10:47]
Matt Abeticola
Yeah, correct. And we've never been told it's the same leg, but we're going to go based on the injuries that he has, again, a hamstring, a groin and a calf, that it's the same cascading effect. Okay, so the hamstring injury, the initial August setback that delayed his integration and baseline explosion of being able to perform as a football player, which then led to a secondary injury. We're assuming the severely limited his lateral agility and forced his first IR stint and that was the groin strain. The third recurring issue was the calf strain that flared up during rehab, ultimately cut his brief late season return very short. Okay. So again, the NFL and players and teams don't have to say left or right or give us. We don't even know if it was. But we're assuming, however, that the biomechanics in the injuries strongly suggest that he's dealing with the same leg, which is that, that cascading effect. Okay. Now the hamstring, groin and calf, as you mentioned there, as you just said, it forms the athlete's principal kinetic chain within their leg. Okay. That declares explosive deceleration, lateral cutting. When one link breaks, it can cause two roadblocks that can emerge. Okay.
- [12:03]
Dan Bernstein
And we talked about this yesterday when we were looking at the research project regarding the extent to which Dennis Allen bears responsibility for defensive backs injuries. And I'm thinking of everything sort of in the context of the, the information we revealed yesterday. And, and by the way, thanks for the feedback on that, especially from Saints fans like, duh, what did you expect? What did you expect? This is what happens. This is why we told you. This is why he was fired. We told. Yeah, and we read the quote. Mickey Loomis said this is why they fired him. They blamed him. So there was also some people saying
- [12:39]
Matt Abeticola
like you don't know.
- [12:39]
Grainger Announcer
You don't.
- [12:40]
Dan Bernstein
Well, no, that's why we just sort of present the information, put it out there for you.
- [12:43]
Matt Abeticola
Right.
- [12:44]
Grainger Announcer
When you're a maintenance engineer in a beverage manufacturing plant, you keep production lines moving and quality on track because there is no room for slowdowns. With Grainger's vast selection of high quality motors, sensors, belts and hard to find parts, you can get what you need fast and all in one place. So nothing gets in the way of getting the job done. Call 1-800-GRAINGER, click grainger.com or just stop by Granger for the ones who get it done.
- [13:14]
Matt Abeticola
So if there's a breakdown in the principal kinetic chain, there's two things that can happen. It can lead to asymmetry and overcompensation and then scar tissue thresholds. So asymmetry and overcompensation returning before a muscle is completely healed causes the nervous system to subconsciously shift the mechanical load. And nearby healthy muscles like the groin or the calf are instantly overloaded to pick up the slack. So if you're dealing with a hamstring injury, it can affect the groin, it can then affect the calf. Okay, scar tissue threshold thresholds. So torn muscle fibers heal by laying down stiff scar tissue. This tissue lacks the pliability of the original muscle muscle fibers, dramatically dropping the threshold for subsequent strains under high velocity movements. So if you have the scar tissue building up, you're not going to have the same ability to cut, to explode, to accelerate, to make lateral movements, which then can therefore cause other injuries, which is why we see this cascading effect. If you have a groin, it could lead into a hamstring, which could lead into a calf, or vice versa, or any one of the others. A calf injury can put extra strain on your hamstring. So this isn't, this isn't uncommon or not normal, but pretty much what we assume he's dealing with in this cascading effect in this leg injury. So then I thought, all right, what's the next thing to look at? Are there players that have dealt with similar things that lost time on the field that have recovered and gotten back to performing at 100% level? And there's a few guys that I found. Number one was Christian Watson within the Bears division his fourth year. Well, this is his fifth year in the league. He's played 14 games, nine games, 15 games and 10 games. So he suffered chronic returing single leg hamstring strains. So multiple seasons, multiple hamstring strains in the same leg. He received off season imaging at the University of Wisconsin which revealed a 20% muscle asymmetry between the legs. So what they did in his rehab is they targeted heavy weight room overload, which brought the imbalance under 6%, completely stopping his re injury cycle. Okay, so the imbalance overload was so significant that they couldn't, they couldn't stop this cycle from happening. So they had, they had to change up the rehab and what they were doing and target those certain muscles to get that, that imbalance under what would be acceptable. And at this point, he, when he got back to healthy, was under 6% re injury cycle.
- [15:48]
Dan Bernstein
And the way they measure this stuff is not, it's not gospel. It's just guidelines. They can't actually say this muscle's working hard because it's a lot of it's guesswork and a lot of it is eye test. And a ton of it is the feedback and description from the patient, the actual person themselves.
- [16:10]
Matt Abeticola
Absolutely, absolutely.
- [16:11]
Dan Bernstein
So this is an inexact science.
- [16:14]
Matt Abeticola
No, it's not. But there's things that you can do more than just, oh, I feel this way, I feel that way. There's things in kinesiology that they can understand about the body in the comparison of the two muscles. My left calf muscle is much smaller than my right calf. My right calf, I had a cast on in fifth grade. I mean, this was fifth grade. From my knee to my toes, when
- [16:35]
Dan Bernstein
I, my, my quads, my VMO on the side of my injury where my knee reconstruction will never be the same.
- [16:43]
Matt Abeticola
Never be the same. And even legs are the same.
- [16:45]
Dan Bernstein
Even though the leg is as strong, the muscles aren't as big.
- [16:49]
Matt Abeticola
Correct. And that's how my calf muscle is. So you have the two. The two muscles in the calf, the
- [16:54]
Dan Bernstein
soleus and the, the gastrocnemius.
- [16:57]
Matt Abeticola
Yeah, yeah. Yes. And so mine, the one muscles are both the same size, but the outside one is much smaller. On my left leg, my left leg is just as strong. It's just, it's much smaller.
- [17:08]
Dan Bernstein
Yep.
- [17:09]
Matt Abeticola
And, and so there, there's things you can do to, to target those body, those muscles, and obviously in kinesiology to understand that. So, um, another guy. So, you know, we saw some. The proof there with Christian Watts and what they did to help balance out that imbalance. So Cooper cup, another guy, high ankle sprain, altered his gait, leading to cascading injuries and severe hamstring spasms. So they used neuromuscular re education and neurophysiology tracking. This is pretty interesting. To rewire his brain to muscle firing patterns, successfully returning to elite volume. Okay, yeah, I know, I know. Again, it's just stuff that's way beyond my understanding, but stuff that I've read about. And it's just, it's really cool. What, what they can do more than just you need to rest and rehab that muscle. There's other things they can do from a neurological standpoint, of course, a physiological standpoint, to get some recovery going. And of course the last one I thought of and this was the last one. And it should have been the most obvious, but he didn't have to look any further than his own locker room. And Jalen Johnson, who was dealing with severe groin injury and what he had to do.
- [18:16]
Dan Bernstein
Yeah, I've been tore off the bone. Right. Wasn't that a full evulsion?
- [18:20]
Matt Abeticola
Yes. And so this was. This is really cool. So they did strict, eccentric load training, strengthening the muscles while they're elongating under tension. It sounds really painful, but again, a very targeted process. And now all reports of what we're hearing about Jalen Johnson so far, is that good to go? And. And he seems closer to normal than he has over the last 18 months. Right. So what I'm curious to know is what's taking place with Jalen Johnson. And I know they're not going to give us, like, descriptive information as far as what he's doing in rehabbing.
- [18:57]
Dan Bernstein
See, I'd more like to know what they really think of if. If he's what he was as a player. I know we'll decide. I can decide based on last year, the answer was no.
- [19:08]
Matt Abeticola
Right.
- [19:08]
Dan Bernstein
Last year he looked bad.
- [19:10]
Matt Abeticola
And we can take the responses from the head coach and the general manager so far this year, get healthy, stay healthy, and got to earn that spot back. We kind of get a sense of what they're feeling or thinking.
- [19:23]
Dan Bernstein
So about Gordon, not necessarily about Jalen Johnson.
- [19:26]
Matt Abeticola
About Gordon, I'm talking about. Yeah, yeah.
- [19:27]
Dan Bernstein
Because Jalen. What I'm saying is Jalen Johnson might not be any good anymore.
- [19:31]
Matt Abeticola
He might not. And all early reports from people who have eyes on him are saying he looks. He looks the part again. But we'll see when it. When it. When it. When it. When it's. When it's meaningful, when it's not just practicing with another team or doing these preseason games, however much he plays. Yeah, we. We won't know until the first week of the season when it's actual. You know, it's go time, but, you know, so what we know about Kyler Gordon is what the head coach has said, what the general manager said, still rehabbing, no update, nothing different. And until we get eyes on him, that he's doing actual baseline conditioning, running, and looks like he's running normal, running without pain. I don't know if three weeks till the end of August to start running, five weeks from the first regular season game is enough time. So my concern about Kyler Gordon is that he might start the season on the reserve PUP list, which means you're. You have to miss the first four games it's four. Now it's four. Okay, so I, again, I mean, these aren't things I can't answer. And this is information that we're not going to get from the Bears straight out. But what is, like, what's the, what would the timeline be to say? Here's the objective date. If he's not doing XYZ by this objective date, the possibility of him starting the season on the roster just diminish or go down. Is that fair? And you understand how I'm asking that?
- [20:58]
Dan Bernstein
Absolutely, it is. He's earned nothing but pessimism.
- [21:01]
Matt Abeticola
So what, what I'm wondering is, what is that date? What's that cut off? What are they looking for to say we need to make the decision? Because when you put someone on the reserve pup list, it doesn't impact your 53 man roster. It's not like they're, they're losing a spot because of him, but if they do that, he'll miss the minimum, the four, the first four games of the season.
- [21:19]
Dan Bernstein
Oh, I'd pencil him in for that.
- [21:21]
Matt Abeticola
That. That's how I'm leaning. Yeah, that's how I'm leaning because again, and I don't know what they're doing and they're not going to tell us, but you know, I think if he's not running at least full speed by the end of August, which is three weeks, I don't see how he's ready to play in 37 days.
- [21:36]
Dan Bernstein
Let me bring up another possibility here. And we're learning with this coaching staff, right? So it's possible he could be practicing tomorrow and he could be. No update. No update. The update. They'll give an update when he is out there practicing and say, oh, yeah, but yeah, he's, he's, he came back from practice. There's our update.
- [21:59]
Matt Abeticola
Yeah, you're, you're very well.
- [22:00]
Dan Bernstein
Right?
- [22:00]
Matt Abeticola
I mean, I could have gone through all this and he's, he could practice tomorrow.
- [22:04]
Dan Bernstein
I just want to make sure that we understand it's possible that they're just not interested in screwing around with it. And, and they, they are going through workouts. He is running and sprinting and cutting and doing all this stuff and he's very close. I don't think it's true because I think we'd get a report that it was. Yes, but, but that is a, that is a, a possibility that he's just going to show up and they're going to say that's it. He's, he's full speed now.
- [22:30]
Matt Abeticola
The. The reason why, I think it's more of a negative slant because of the number of injuries that have happened over the last couple days to the secondary. The secondary was going to be a strength of this team, remember so much. So Ryan Poll said, oh, the secondary is going to be so good, opposing quarterbacks will hold the ball longer. That's going to help our pass rush. Well, now your secondary is blowing up left and right.
- [22:50]
Dan Bernstein
And your pass rush is still bad.
- [22:52]
Matt Abeticola
And your pass rush is still bad. Correct. And now you lose your price, safety, free agent signing, and Kobe Bryant, which shifts everyone around to different positions you maybe didn't expect. So I think we would be hearing more about Kyler Gordon, given the injuries to the secondary. And again, now we don't know what the timeline, the exact timeline is for Kobe Bryant. Is it less than the 8 to 10, is it longer than the 8 to 10? And if he comes back in weeks four or five or six, is that the same time we might be able to expect to see Kyler Gordon if he were to land on the PUP reserve list and miss the first four games of the season?
- [23:27]
Dan Bernstein
It's August.
- [23:28]
Matt Abeticola
What? The way it looks like it's August 7th. But, Dan, the way it looks like you. I mean, you could start your season and you could miss the first quarter of your season, could play your first quarter of your season without Kobe Bryant, without Kyler Gordon, and maybe with the
- [23:42]
Dan Bernstein
Jalen Johnson who isn't back to being good.
- [23:44]
Matt Abeticola
And I was just gonna say, and with a question mark on Jalen Johnson, of what kind of player is he coming back?
- [23:49]
Dan Bernstein
Yep.
- [23:49]
Matt Abeticola
That's how your defense could start this season. No Kobe Bryant, no Kyler Gordon, and a Jalen Johnson question mark, which could be answered pretty early for us after the first game.
- [23:59]
Dan Bernstein
And then what's the next question that I know that you're jumping to right now as you listen? Does Ben Johnson care?
- [24:07]
Matt Abeticola
Right. Well, no. My next question was, how does this impact Dylan Feneman, who's starting at safety and possibly using Malik Muhammad in a very important position of nickel corner? Because then after those two guys, you have Elijah Hicks and Black. Josh Blackman. Blackwell. Blackwell, sorry.
- [24:25]
Dan Bernstein
Yeah.
- [24:26]
Matt Abeticola
I'm thinking Charlie Blackman from yesterday, too. What we're talking about, the leadoff homers, Josh Blackwell. Like, are those. Are those two guys that you want as regular starters in your defense?
- [24:38]
Dan Bernstein
Right. No. You want them as core special teams people.
- [24:43]
Matt Abeticola
And here's the thing. What makes me more nervous about Kyler Gordon now, if you're. If you're a wide receiver, Rehabbing from similar injuries. You. You control what happens to you on the field.
- [24:56]
Dan Bernstein
You know where you're going.
- [24:57]
Matt Abeticola
You know where you're going. And you can design routes or call routes and say, all right, listen, we know he's about 80%, but 80% of him is better than 100% of this guy. So you're going to just run straight out, and you might run, you know, some exaggerated post routes or some out routes where you're not doing heavy cutting. Okay. With a defensive back, you don't have that luxury. You've got to mirror and react, and if your muscles. And if you're. If you're not healthy enough to do that, react that way. That. I mean, a. You're not going to be as good of a player and be more susceptible to injury. Again, that's why it sucks as a defensive back. Like, with a. With a wide receiver, you can. You can slowly build up that process. With a defensive back, you don't have that luxury. It's. You're lined up out there. You better mirror this guy wherever he goes, as quick as he goes, and you might not have that ability to do it. Which means. So why. Why. Why rush him back out there if he's not fully ready to go? Despite the fact that your secondary seems to be falling apart left and right every practice?
- [25:59]
Dan Bernstein
I'm very, very concerned about the defense. I'm so. I just really concerned about the defense.
- [26:06]
Matt Abeticola
I mean, I'm just. This is all hypothesis and guessing here, and hopefully I'm wrong. But if he. If he ends up on the PUP list and misses the first four, and you already know Kobe Bryant is probably going to miss the first four.
- [26:21]
Dan Bernstein
Maybe more.
- [26:22]
Matt Abeticola
Maybe more. I don't know. It just, you know, three weeks to the end of August, 37 days of the first game, doesn't seem like enough for a guy who had significant injury within possibly the same leg of a groin, a hamstring, and a calf.
- [26:41]
Dan Bernstein
Did they give us any indication of when and how this injury happened?
- [26:48]
Matt Abeticola
Not. Not that I've seen.
- [26:49]
Dan Bernstein
I haven't either.
- [26:50]
Matt Abeticola
Not that I've seen. So, you know, we don't know how the initial. Because the initial thing was the groin. Like, how did that happen, which then led to the hamstring and a calf.
- [26:59]
Dan Bernstein
All I want at the moment, personally, I just want questions about what they knew about what the Saints said regarding why they fired Dennis Allen. Now that. Now that you're in the midst of this, you are in a crisis in your secondary right now. You just.
- [27:18]
Matt Abeticola
He's another Guy I forgot to put on there because he got hurt the other day too.
- [27:22]
Dan Bernstein
Where is Terrell Smith? Where's. Where is he? What keeps happening to him?
- [27:28]
Matt Abeticola
Yeah, he was back and then hurt and he left practice. So it's Rel Smith. So that's six.
- [27:31]
Dan Bernstein
We don't. And we don't know if he can even come back from a torn patellar tendon that he suffered last year. Why is this happening? Did you know what the Saints said about Dennis Allen? And. And if so, why is. Why. Why was he if, if vetted properly, why was this not a concern? Did you think you had something under control? Did you think you had something that there were guardrails that would change the way that players were practicing or working out or doing the famous up downs or anything like that? But the if this was known that there was believed to be injury causation correlation by his previous team, I don't know if they're right or wrong, but they believed it.
- [28:18]
Matt Abeticola
So let me ask you when you. When you said because on the heels of the Kyler Gordon stuff, you went right into asking about Dennis Allen and when the Kyler Gordon injury happened, he finished the 2024 season fine. Correct.
- [28:36]
Dan Bernstein
I don't remember if he did or not. I know he missed some games. I looked.
- [28:40]
Matt Abeticola
So was that something that bled into the 2025 off season, into the 2025 season, or were you asking that about Dennis Allen based on him getting to Chicago and. And the injury with Gordon starting after that? Is that. Is that. I mean. And I'm not asking that's. Why Is that what you asked?
- [28:59]
Dan Bernstein
I guess I just like to unwind all this. I'd like to know what. When you. When we talk about all these kinetic chain injuries and putting little flags in here and saying this happened here and this happened here and this happened here and then if he's given other workouts to do or he is instructed do this but don't do this or rest this muscle and don't do this on consecutive days or all those things? There's got to be a plan here, a strict preparation plan. And maybe he is following it and maybe he just isn't made of strong stuff. And some people defy all that. The are some people who just get hurt.
- [29:33]
Matt Abeticola
Oh yeah. Gordon played 15 games in 2024. He missed weeks eight and nine.
- [29:38]
Dan Bernstein
All right. It was eight and nine. Thank you.
- [29:39]
Matt Abeticola
With a hamstring injury. So he came back and played, you know, weeks 10 through.
- [29:45]
Dan Bernstein
Okay, good to know.
- [29:49]
Matt Abeticola
Okay. Yeah. Interesting. Yeah. I don't know I don't know, I don't know what to, what to make of all of it. I know I just got, I went down this rabbit hole of reading a lot and looking at other players and I, I just, I just don't know. With what Ben Johnson said yesterday and again, you know, the NFL teams don't share a lot. They're never going to. And they share less and less it seems like every year. But having no update on him, I just, I asked, I asked the question. Is 37 days enough to get this guy ready?
- [30:20]
Dan Bernstein
Probably not.
- [30:22]
Matt Abeticola
I'm leaning that way without, without knowing. You know what I mean? Yeah. It doesn't sound like. Yeah.
- [30:27]
Dan Bernstein
Based on who it is and what keeps happening and how teams talk about injuries where you can't be a coach who, who is preaching. Oh, every day you miss, you fall further behind. Availability is your best ability. Every day you miss, you fall further behind. We're doing stuff here and you're, you're not going to be able to make up this time. That's all coaches ever say.
- [30:48]
Matt Abeticola
Right. But, and, and what they, and what they can't do. Because Ben Johnson, he got bit twice on this last year. You can't expect him to be ready to go week one and then have not out there and, and lose a roster spot like it happened twice last. He's, he's not going to play that game again.
- [31:04]
Dan Bernstein
Getting hurt.
- [31:05]
Matt Abeticola
He's not going to allow that to happen.
- [31:05]
Dan Bernstein
No. No.
- [31:06]
Matt Abeticola
So if you're not, that's, that's what, that's why I'm kind of leaning towards if he's not fully ready to go.
- [31:10]
Dan Bernstein
Trust, he doesn't, he can't trust him. He doesn't trust him. I, I, you're not going to leave me a man down in my game plan.
- [31:17]
Matt Abeticola
It's not going to. It happened once, it happened twice. Shame on me. You do it a third time, shame on me again and all of us and, but you know, if he's not ready in 37 days for week one, I just see them going that reserve pup list where then he's out for
- [31:32]
Dan Bernstein
four games, minimum packs are packed, schedules are filling up and somehow everyone is hungry at the exact same time. Yeah. It's back to school season. So when you need an easy win, make it a Giordano's night. Treat the kids, treat yourself to the Chicago style pizza everyone loves. Whether you're celebrating the first day back or just surviving the first week, dine in pickup or order delivery, visit giordano's.com or visit your local Giordano's restaurant today.
- [32:04]
Grainger Announcer
When you're a maintenance engineer in a beverage manufacturing plant, you keep production lines moving and quality on track because there is no room for slowdowns. With Grainger's vast selection of high quality motors, sensors, belts and hard to find parts, you can get what you need fast and all in one place. So nothing gets in the way of getting the job done. Call 1-800-GRAINGER clickranger.com or just stop by Granger for the ones who get it done.
- [32:34]
Matt Abeticola
And I hope I'm completely wrong and maybe he, he'll be out in practice tomorrow and get two interceptions and I don't care. I don't care if I'm completely wrong on it. It just, this is just how I feel and hearing what they're saying about it and what they're not saying. And then you just compound that with all the other injuries that are happening in the secondary. It's just, it's a terrible, terrible situation. Some other news and notes in the NFL, Dan, I'm sure you saw this about Jameer Gibbs.
- [32:57]
Dan Bernstein
Yep.
- [32:58]
Matt Abeticola
Gets his 3 year $67.5 million extension which could go up to 75.75 million, 51.5 million guaranteed. The highest paid running back in NFL history. Jameer Gibbs.
- [33:12]
Dan Bernstein
Yeah, we have to stop doing that with these. Every next year's contract is going to be that.
- [33:18]
Matt Abeticola
Yeah.
- [33:18]
Dan Bernstein
Is going to be the neck because money isn't worth what it used to be worth primarily. And, and people make more money with each sort of opportunity here. So.
- [33:29]
Matt Abeticola
So congratulations to Mr. Gibbs.
- [33:32]
Dan Bernstein
Yeah.
- [33:33]
Matt Abeticola
Big contract. Yeah.
- [33:34]
Dan Bernstein
Because running backs have really short careers. I'm always with them on, always with football players generally. I'm with, you know, labor generally, but I'm certainly with football players about getting everything that they deserve when they are at their best. And I think football's done a pretty good job of that of making sure the best players make the most money when they're the most important to their teams. So more power to them.
- [33:59]
Matt Abeticola
And one other note, former Chicago Bear CJ Gardner Johnson had some comments. Looking ahead to the the upcoming season. He was asked about week one when they're going to play the Houston Texans, his former team team he was part of before he came to the Bears. He said all the bullshit that came out, it was all lies, but whatever, I just can't wait to see them. So he's talking about looking forward to playing the Houston Texans and exacting some type of revenge because of all the bullshit and all the lies they put out there about him. If you don't recall what happened, he got on the sideline of a game, got into it with Kamari Lassiter that Derek Stingley Jr. Had to get in the middle. Apparently they were. They were about ready to do a fight and Stingley had to step in. And then it was after that 03 start that they released him. And D' Amico, Ryan's made a point to come out and said, hey, this was fully my decision as the head coach. I made that call to release cj, gj, which ended up being a very positive thing for him and the Bears, obviously how he played. But it just so happens the NFL gods looked down and said, all right, we're going to have the Bills, his new team, play the Texans in Week one. And he's already talking shit about it and apparently going to be just fine from that calf strain that he's dealing with and we'll be ready to go for Week one.
- [35:14]
Dan Bernstein
It was a meaningful player for the Bears last year, and they were lucky that he was available to do whatever he was able to do, even if he couldn't keep up with some of the speed out there. Hell, Jalen Johnson couldn't do that either.
- [35:27]
Grainger Announcer
Right.
- [35:28]
Dan Bernstein
I also wanted to note. I forgot we were talking about the NBC thing. Just something else that came from last night. Before we finish up, did you see Luke Keakley?
- [35:39]
Matt Abeticola
I didn't, but when? Just by asking the question, I'm assuming he probably looks smaller than me or like a regular guy now.
- [35:46]
Dan Bernstein
He does look smaller than you.
- [35:48]
Matt Abeticola
Okay.
- [35:49]
Dan Bernstein
You're the same height, but he's. And he doesn't look bad. He still look. But he just looks so normal.
- [35:57]
Matt Abeticola
He looks like a regular human again, you mean.
- [35:59]
Dan Bernstein
Right. That Luke Keakley, one of the greatest linebackers of all time, is at a point now where he could walk into a room and you would not ever think that's an NFL football player.
- [36:11]
Grainger Announcer
Yeah.
- [36:12]
Dan Bernstein
Like, he looks like a golf dad. He looks in shape, but thin and reasonable looking. Yeah. He was never a massive dude, but he was at, what, 240? I think he played around 240 pounds. He is at least 60 pounds lighter. Wow. Because the arms, the leg, like his legs are so thin.
- [36:38]
Matt Abeticola
Yeah. It's interesting to see because we, I mean, we've been around a lot of current players, former players, and some guys are just built big. They're just big. And we've.
- [36:47]
Dan Bernstein
No, James Big Cat Williams is not getting any smaller.
- [36:50]
Matt Abeticola
He's just a big guy. And we've even seen older Guys, like in their 70s are still just big guys. And then there are guys that are really great athletes that just put a lot of extra muscle on their frame and it's just not normal or natural. They wouldn't be that big. The first time it really. It really hit me was when I met Tom Thayer in person. I mean, a huge offensive lineman from my childhood, you know, my childhood team. And I'm, you know, and. And I just. I remember thinking, you know, he didn't look bad. I mean, he probably kicked, you know, kicked the shit out of me. But it's just like, oh, you're. You're a lot smaller than I expected you to be. Still a big guy, but just not. Not what I remembered from my childhood. That's when it. It first hit me. I was like, oh, man, these NFL players, they probably can't wait to be done, so they can just be regular again.
- [37:36]
Dan Bernstein
Look at Olin.
- [37:37]
Matt Abeticola
Oh, yeah, Olin.
- [37:38]
Grainger Announcer
Olin.
- [37:39]
Matt Abeticola
Well, Olin's in fucking fantastic.
- [37:40]
Dan Bernstein
He's in great shape, but he's not.
- [37:43]
Matt Abeticola
No, but, yeah.
- [37:46]
Dan Bernstein
Yes.
- [37:47]
Matt Abeticola
Handsome. But yeah, I mean, there are.
- [37:50]
Dan Bernstein
That's. I get an appreciation for what this sport asks of people when I see the, the amount of an offensive lineman,
- [37:59]
Matt Abeticola
especially the change of the human body,
- [38:01]
Dan Bernstein
being asked to carry 100 pounds that your body doesn't want, and your poor heart and lungs and vascular system and everything trying to keep up with all this. All this size that your body doesn't necessarily want. And you gotta have it because a lot of it is just protective because if you don't have it, you're gonna break in half out there.
- [38:25]
Matt Abeticola
Yeah, for sure.
- [38:26]
Dan Bernstein
And I. And again, did you see. Did you look at Caleb Durbin last night on the Red Sox?
- [38:31]
Matt Abeticola
Yes.
- [38:32]
Dan Bernstein
Didn't like what's going on with him? I don't know, because he looks like he's going to play NFL football somewhere.
- [38:40]
Matt Abeticola
He does.
- [38:41]
Dan Bernstein
Like, man, you. He's got that, like. He, He's. His. His upper body's like a triangle.
- [38:47]
Matt Abeticola
Yeah, it's. And it's. It's. I mean, it's hard to make it out through the, the grainy, blurry Blair Witch camera they use.
- [38:53]
Dan Bernstein
So. But there, you know, there are people in the scoreboard.
- [39:00]
Matt Abeticola
Oh, you mean inside the manual scoreboard?
- [39:03]
Dan Bernstein
Inside the manual scoreboard.
- [39:04]
Matt Abeticola
Okay.
- [39:04]
Dan Bernstein
There are.
- [39:05]
Grainger Announcer
Who?
- [39:06]
Dan Bernstein
There are people in there.
- [39:07]
Matt Abeticola
Thanks for letting us know that.
- [39:08]
Dan Bernstein
I. I thought there were. I thought it was elves for all these years. I thought the magical scoreboard elves with their pointy ears and their shoes with the, with the curly toes. Oh, you thought it was scoreboard ghosts. Oh, yeah.
- [39:24]
Matt Abeticola
I thought it was like the ghost of Babe Ruth doing the Red Sox scoreboard.
- [39:28]
Dan Bernstein
And Ted Williams's head. It's Ted Williams's floating, frozen head stuck to the. The empty aluminum can of T. The
- [39:39]
Matt Abeticola
ghost of Babe Ruth just there doing the numbers,
- [39:44]
Dan Bernstein
making sure that these, These, these aluminum scores get put up there. You know, there's. And you know what else is. When it's 95 degrees out.
- [39:53]
Matt Abeticola
Hot. Hot. Yeah. People inside the manual scoreboard and it gets hot. Yep.
- [39:58]
Dan Bernstein
And boy, you know, in summer days. Hot.
- [40:01]
Matt Abeticola
Thank you.
- [40:02]
Dan Bernstein
That also made it the greatest baseball game ever.
- [40:05]
Matt Abeticola
Yeah, Just ask Buster Olney. He'll tell you. Yep.
- [40:08]
Dan Bernstein
Buster only and Dan Pleasak said that
- [40:11]
Matt Abeticola
season game ever and the one before
- [40:13]
Dan Bernstein
also, greatest regular season. Half of these runs are made up pretend runners who didn't reach base. Stop it.
- [40:20]
Grainger Announcer
Yeah.
- [40:21]
Matt Abeticola
So, okay, now you. That's the second time you've said that. Do you, do you not like that rule?
- [40:26]
Dan Bernstein
I. I get it. I understand the reason for it. I just.
- [40:30]
Matt Abeticola
I understand it, too, but I don't like it. I think it's. I don't like it.
- [40:33]
Dan Bernstein
Well, that's why they don't do it in the playoffs.
- [40:34]
Matt Abeticola
It's good.
- [40:35]
Dan Bernstein
If they liked it that much, they would do it in the playoffs, right? They don't do it in the playoffs because they know it's stupid. Like, okay, that's the indicator there. It's like hockey, fighting the playoffs. They stop, right?
- [40:48]
Matt Abeticola
It's like, hey, Cubs, here's a game that you could. You couldn't do anything. But hey, you know what? You get a. You get a lucky line drive homer in the bottom of the night, and we're going to give you a guy on second base. You haven't had that the first eight innings of the game, but here you go, right?
- [41:01]
Dan Bernstein
So none of those really count.
- [41:03]
Matt Abeticola
But I'll take it though, because we won.
- [41:04]
Grainger Announcer
But.
- [41:05]
Matt Abeticola
But I still don't like it.
- [41:06]
Dan Bernstein
I think I've been around this game for 37 years, and this is the greatest game I've ever seen in my life. And I was like, on my couch, like, what am I missing? Like, this is fun. It goes back and forth.
- [41:20]
Matt Abeticola
You've had some big moments, especially when it's like, oh, we don't want 17 inning regular season games. And you get position players. You get position players pitching in the seventh fucking inning not too long ago. It's like, all right, then make that illegal then before the ninth inning if you're trying to avoid that shit in the 15th or the 17th or the 18th? Let baseball be baseball, man. If it's too long, then go home or turn your TV off. I also like the length of the game.
- [41:43]
Dan Bernstein
I also really do want to. Did. Was anybody else confused as to who Mike Tomlin was last night? Anybody else? Because here he's like, you know, he's. He was younger than I thought, and the smile threw me, like. Did they. Tomlin, Isn't he your age?
- [42:02]
Matt Abeticola
I thought he was. I thought he was.
- [42:04]
Dan Bernstein
I thought he was, like, 52. I thought around that. But he's. But, you know, he's.
- [42:09]
Matt Abeticola
No, he just. He just turned 54.
- [42:11]
Dan Bernstein
Okay.
- [42:11]
Matt Abeticola
You're older than.
- [42:12]
Dan Bernstein
Right. Yeah. Right in between us. And he's.
- [42:15]
Matt Abeticola
I don't know.
- [42:15]
Dan Bernstein
He just look. He looks way younger than I look.
- [42:18]
Matt Abeticola
Yeah, well, it's just happier now.
- [42:20]
Dan Bernstein
That's why he was smiling. He's not coaching anymore.
- [42:23]
Matt Abeticola
Doesn't have to deal with all that.
- [42:24]
Dan Bernstein
He's not coaching. Okay, great. Good for him. I think it'll be good. And the fact that Tony Dungy is off our television for.
- [42:33]
Matt Abeticola
Makes you happy.
- [42:33]
Dan Bernstein
Yeah, because they always used to go to him because he was like, everybody's, like, moral, spiritual guide for things, even though he doesn't like gay people. Like.
- [42:47]
Matt Abeticola
Like.
- [42:47]
Dan Bernstein
I don't know how he ascended to this throne of personal behavior, despite the fact that his own beliefs are totally odious.
- [42:54]
Matt Abeticola
He also. He looked like the. The Red Vapor dude in. In. In Endgame, when you got to go sacrifice somebody to get that stone, you need Red Skull.
- [43:04]
Dan Bernstein
Yeah, he looked like Red Skull, not Red Vapor Dude. That's Red Skull.
- [43:07]
Matt Abeticola
Yeah, Whatever his name is. But they look. They look very similar.
- [43:11]
Dan Bernstein
I'm sure Red Skull has a name. Yeah.
- [43:14]
Matt Abeticola
Isn't it Red. Red Vapor Guy thing.
- [43:17]
Dan Bernstein
No.
- [43:18]
Matt Abeticola
What's his real name?
- [43:19]
Dan Bernstein
The Red Skull. His secret identity is revealed to be George Maxson.
- [43:25]
Matt Abeticola
But doesn't. So look at Red Skull's face. It looks like Tony Dungy. Right? Kind of. He's a little bit.
- [43:32]
Dan Bernstein
He's thin. Yeah. I'm not exactly sure who his alter ego is. Either Johann Schmidt, George Maxson, Albert Malik, or Cynthia Schmidt.
- [43:44]
Matt Abeticola
All right, That's a lot to look up.
- [43:46]
Dan Bernstein
That's too much. I got. I got too much going on with Red Skull here.
- [43:49]
Matt Abeticola
Yeah. And I got. I got a call, and I got. I got Car Chicken to get to, so.
- [43:54]
Dan Bernstein
I'm so excited for Car Chicken stories. Yes.
- [43:58]
Matt Abeticola
Yeah.
- [43:58]
Dan Bernstein
All right, well, that will do it for forward progress. Remember which pod I'm doing?
- [44:05]
Matt Abeticola
Yeah, right. Which one are we on?
- [44:06]
Dan Bernstein
Ford Progress. Let's just hope by the end of this weekend no more members of the Bears secondary have been injured.
- [44:14]
Matt Abeticola
Who's left? I mean, you know, Jalen Johnson, Tyreek Stevenson, Malik Muhammad, Cam Lewis.
- [44:21]
Dan Bernstein
Blackwell.
- [44:22]
Matt Abeticola
Cam Lewis.
- [44:22]
Dan Bernstein
Yep.
- [44:23]
Matt Abeticola
Oh, and then the kid from Vanderbilt they just brought in Sewell. Marlon Sewell. Yeah.
- [44:31]
Dan Bernstein
If you're Marlon Sewell, you got to wonder what am I getting myself into here? Yeah. So that's our goal for the weekend.
- [44:36]
Matt Abeticola
How long before I'm hurt?
- [44:37]
Dan Bernstein
Right? This has been brought to you by Giordano's Back to school means back to busy between practices, homework, everything in between. Give yourself a break with Giordano's. Treat the kids and yourself to Chicago Style Pizza. Everyone can agree on and make tonight a giordano's night@giordano's.com or visit your local Giordano's restaurant today. Giordano's the one for Chicago style pizza where progress has stopped Ted 219 2019.
- [45:11]
Matt Abeticola
Forward Progress Chicago Bears Podcast with Dan Bernstein and Matt Abeticola on 312 sports
- [45:22]
Grainger Announcer
when you're a maintenance engineer in a beverage manufacturing plant, you keep production lines moving and quality on track because there is no room for slowdowns. With Grainger's vast selection of high quality motors, sensors, belts and hard to find parts, you can get what you need fast and all in one place so nothing gets in the way of getting the job done. Call 1-800-GRAINGER clickranger.com or just stop by Grainger for the ones who get it done. When you're a maintenance engineer in a beverage manufacturing plant, you keep production lines moving and quality on track because there is no room for slowdowns. With Grainger's vast selection of high quality motors, sensors, belts and hard to find parts, you can get what you need fast and all in one place so nothing gets in the way of getting the job done. Call 1-800-GRAINGER clickranger.com or just stop by Grainger for the ones who get it done.