← Forward Progress - A Chicago Bears Podcast
Forward Progress - A Chicago Bears Podcast
Dennis Allen and the Bears defense - what can they do?
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- [00:02]
A
I mean, if you're a Bears fan, you're thinking forward progress. Come on. Forward Progress, a Chicago Bears podcast with Dan Bernstein and Matt Abeticola on 3one2 Sports.
- [00:23]
B
Time to talk some Chicago Bears as we give you Forward Progress and Chicago Bears podcast on 3one2 Sports. Your last one of 2025. So enjoy it, appreciate it, savor it, enjoy it that much harder. Bears and Lions will get going at 325 at the same time that Philly and Washington will get going. Are the Bears the number two seed? Are they the number three seed? Well, you, Matta Batticola and you, the forward progress consumer should know the following. This was posted by Eagles beat reporter Jeff McLean of the Philadelphia Inquirer. The Eagles are expected to rest quarterback Jalen Hurts and most starters in the season finale. Sources have told. The Inquirer says it shouldn't come as a surprise based on Nick Sirianni's comments when asked about the benefit of having a bye week heading into the playoffs. So we'll see how Eagles fans react. And just in the early going when I'm trying to see what you'll just get a sort of a quick glance at what the reaction is, I think. Connor McKee. Tanner Tanner.
- [01:43]
A
Tanner McKee.
- [01:44]
B
What are these white guy names? Tanner McKee is Philadelphia speak for Tyson Bagent? There's a, I don't know if they have an equivalent name as the bagency, but the McKee foundation or whatever it is, boy, they love themselves some Tanner McKee man. And they can't wait for the former Stanford quarterback and sixth round pick in 2023 to be unleashed and unfiltered and allowed to have after the competition. Enjoy.
- [02:17]
A
Well, they're going to unlock him, Dan. That's what they're doing. They're going to unlock, there's Hannah McKee.
- [02:22]
B
They love them.
- [02:23]
A
So I wonder how, I wonder how Philly like how, how do you think Philly fans will react to that. So basically what the, what the, the Eagles are doing is they're, they're just forfeiting the opportunity, their best opportunity to win the two seed. Now it doesn't mean they still can't win this game against the Commanders over the weekend. And still, you know, if the Bears were to lose, the Lions could jump into the two seed which would then give them the packers going to Philadelphia for the wild card round. If the Bears slipped to the three seed, they would get the Rams coming to Soldier Field for the wild card round. So now the packers are virtually just saying, all right, the Bears this is, it's yours to take and keep. Basically.
- [03:03]
B
Yeah.
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A
The Eagles are coming into Philadelphia or Niners.
- [03:08]
B
So they want the NFC West. That's what it sounds like to me. Right.
- [03:18]
A
I think, I think though, yeah, I think, I think the Niners will stay at the five seed, although the Niners play Seattle. But Seattle needs that. Needs that game as well. Yeah, I think, I think, I know the packers are locked in at seven. The Rams, I think the Rams are at six. I think, I think Philadelphia would get the Rams five would go to four, which is probably gonna end up being Carolina. So that thing on the, on the NFC south that we didn't dive too deep into real quick, if Tampa wins and if Atlanta wins, you have a three way tie. And by virtue of that three way tie, you go to head to head competition. And even if Tampa beats Carolina, Carolina would get in to the playoffs, win the division if Atlanta wins.
- [04:01]
B
Well, the other thing we have to note is that the Commanders are starting Josh Johnson. So there's no guarantees here that Tanner McKee and the Eagles backups aren't going to win the game anyway.
- [04:16]
A
Right. No, you're. You're correct on that. And I think, and I have a look at the schedule just to make sure. But I think when I looked at it earlier today, I think I saw that Tampa and Carolina play Saturday and then Atlanta plays on Sunday against the Saints. So Tampa could essentially win on Saturday and then have to wait all day get into Sunday and then root for the Saints to beat the Falcons. And if the Falcons do win, Carolina wins a division despite losing the last game of the season to the team they were competing against for the division title. Wow. Okay, so if that holds out, Carolina would be the 4 seed. The Niners would go to Carolina for a playoff game. The Rams would go to Philadelphia for a playoff game. The packers go to Chicago for a playoff game. Seattle is the 1 seed and gets the buy.
- [05:11]
B
All right, so I'll hear that and then 30 seconds from now I'll forget all.
- [05:16]
A
Yeah, and it's fine. And you don't need to remember because that could all change too. You just, you know, game slappy played. But the big news for Bears fans to know, if you hadn't seen it or heard it yet, that Philadelphia is sitting most moist of their starters. For starters, their voice starters for. For the game against the Commanders. And it's certainly a game that they can win with backups playing against a. Not very good and also hurt Washington commander's team. So that's the news of the morning that just came out of Philadelphia sitting most of their starters for the final game of the season.
- [05:49]
B
The other note that I see here is that the packers are adding quarterback Desmond Ritter. So to what? I think they need an arm if they're going to be sitting people as well, because like you say, they're locked in because you. And you also have Malik Willis with a bad shoulder, Jordan Love in the concussion protocol, you need somebody to throw balls. So somebody who.
- [06:11]
A
Oh, that's right. Because they're. I think their third was an emergency quarterback was Josh Jacobs.
- [06:15]
B
Yeah. So they've.
- [06:16]
A
So that's why they had to add an arm. Okay.
- [06:18]
B
Yeah. They needed somebody to do something for them. And I guess Ben Johnson has been updating some injury stuff also as we speak. Noah Sewell indeed injured reserve with an Achilles injury. And we'll let you know more as we find it out. But the major question that I have right now is, is there any band aid for the defense? Last two games, 880 yards has been surrendered by the Bears defense. And the glaring number is that. Let me ask, how many yards do you think the Bears allow on first down per play so far this year?
- [07:05]
A
I have no idea, but I'm gonna guess, I'm gonna say somewhere between 6 and 7.
- [07:09]
B
6.1. 6 and 7. Yeah. But 6.1.
- [07:14]
A
Okay.
- [07:15]
B
The Bears are 28th in the NFL on first down defense. I don't think the headline for me is. I don't really think there's anything you can do in a week or a couple weeks to make a bad defense good. I think you can make things look different. You can change a little bit of playing time and that. I think that's why people are reaching out about DeMarco Jackson. It was like, well, why aren't they playing more player of the week? It was so good. You only have a limited number of spots. It's also a linebacker.
- [07:47]
A
Well, now, with Noah Sewell out, that. That's going to impact that right there.
- [07:50]
B
Sure. But modern defenses only use two linebackers. You just, you don't. You generally aren't going to have three. You're not fast enough. You're just not fast enough to match up with three linebackers on the field. You only have two starting linebackers, so you know who those are. Those are Edmonds and Edwards, Edwards and Edmunds. And you'll have rotations, but those two guys are better.
- [08:18]
A
Now, you can do different things with the way you. You disguise your packages and. And your fronts. You can do variations on player rotation. You know there's one suggestion I made the other day, and I know that they'll never going to do this, but I'm trying to think of anything possible to help. That front four is moving Montessuet to the interior because to me, he does better on a power rush than he does on a speed rush. And, you know, and, and I'm not saying for. For the entire game, but give it a try where you have a couple looks with sweat on the inside with. With Grady Jarrett, and then I put on the outside booker and, and try on showing. If he's. If he's on a concussion protocol. If he's.
- [09:04]
B
It'll be Domino. It'll be Dominic Robinson then is showing out he's in the concussion protocol. I don't know.
- [09:12]
A
Okay, well, if he's. If he's okay to play, if he's able to play and he gets through the concussion protocol, I'd rather have him out there than Dominique Robinson, who I think is just pretty much useless at this point on defensive downs. But if that's the case and he doesn't play, then, yeah, give it a try. Give it a couple looks and just try something different because there's really not much you can do. We're going into week 18. You're not adding people unless you want to take a look at the brothers digs. And if you want to bring Trayvon in for a look, I mean, it's going to be very cheap, so it's not expensive. And I know he's had some issues in Dallas as far as fitting in and being part of the culture and the team, but my only question is, is he playing good football? If he's not playing good football, I'm not interested.
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B
No, he hasn't been. I mean, signed that big contract, signed a huge contract years ago, but then he's only played in 21 games in two years.
- [10:07]
A
Yeah, he missed a lot of games with injury, but there was a torn.
- [10:10]
B
Acl and then there was a. Was. Was it a cartilage graft like he's.
- [10:15]
A
I'm not even sure what it was. I know the torn ACL for sure.
- [10:18]
B
Yeah, there was. And then there was a second procedure. So he's had a lot done. I don't think he's the same player. And then the team was fining him for not rehabbing on their schedule that he wasn't in the voluntary programs and they got mad at him. They put him on the pop list and he was. But him being mad at Matt Eber Floose, I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing because. And he was, he was mad because Iberflu is playing too much zone. I'm like, dude, that's.
- [10:47]
A
You can't be mad at.
- [10:48]
B
He's his own guy.
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A
That's what he does.
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B
He's his own coach.
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A
And the whole idea of Trayvon Diggs also too, is that it doesn't, it doesn't address your biggest, your glaring need, which is a pass rush. I mean, he's not a, he's not a defensive lineman.
- [11:01]
B
Let me go back to your other point about Montez Sweat on the inside.
- [11:07]
A
Yeah.
- [11:08]
B
The Bears did that with Julius Peppers, if you'll remember that they, the Peppers would be an end. And then on third downs they used him at three technique. But I mean, but you're talking about a Hall of Fame special, special athletic talent.
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A
Right?
- [11:31]
B
Sweat is a really good player or has been a really good player, but he's not that he's.
- [11:36]
A
He's not. But I also think, and I know that they have, they do they stunt at times where the interior lineman will swing outside and he moves inside. I'm talking about the lining him up on the inside because again, what we've seen, his strength, his strength is not speeding a speed rush. He's not a speedrush guy. He's a guy that engages the body in front of him and tries to work through it. That's how he, he works. He's not like a guy like Booker, who Booker, as he's learning and developing still as a young player, works and uses his speed to get around where sweat will go through. All I'm saying is give it a try because there, there isn't much else that you can do going into week 18. You're not adding, you know, an edge pass rusher that's going to come out and get, you know, two sacks on this weekend. That's not happening. And we're asking for what are things that we can do. This is just a possibility, something I threw out there that seems realistic and reasonable to put in for one week.
- [12:27]
B
So as much as we were discussing the idea of Trayvon Diggs and I think the question that you ask, and it's the right one, can he play right? Is he the same player that he was before the injuries somewhere in there? And I don't think that that's a decision that you make the week before the playoffs. I think that's an off season decision perhaps. And I guess if I, if I had to say yes or no, thumbs up, thumbs down on Diggs right now, I would say no.
- [13:01]
A
So I'm not totally opposed to the idea because he is a two time, you know, all pro cornerback, obviously before the injuries. But the issue being that doesn't address your biggest need. And your biggest need is putting pressure on the quarterback because even if he is healthy and playing well and you're giving a quarterback five or six seconds to survey the field and make a throw, guys can get beat. Even if you're a Pro bowl cornerback, all pro cornerback like Trayvon Diggs, if you give a guy that much time. So it doesn't address your biggest need. And I just want to know, I'm not concerned with the culture stuff. I'm not concerned with the behavior stuff. Maybe he just needs to get out of there and needs a change, and I'm fine with that. We've seen that happened once so far this year with the Bears. Can you ask for that Twice in the same season? And bringing guys off the, you know, off the garbage heap and hopefully they can be contributors and stay, you know, be good citizens as well in the locker room for a time. Again, I just. The biggest question is, can he play good football? And the second thing is that I would use as a factor is it still doesn't address your biggest need of putting pressure on the quarterback. So like, is it, is it worth it? If they feel it is, it's a cheap cost. It's, you know, it's less than 600, $700,000 total.
- [14:13]
B
That's a non issue.
- [14:14]
A
It's a non issue. The finances of it.
- [14:16]
B
Where my mind goes, though, when we're contemplating the question of a former Pro bowl player and in what form is he right now?
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A
I know where this is going.
- [14:28]
B
If you don't know, I think you do. If you didn't know the names on the back of the jerseys and you were just scouting and watching people move and watching effort and watching everything involved and then said, is this a good player or not? I think it's more important right now for the Bears to make that determination about Jalen Johnson than it is about Trevon Diggs. What is he right now? Why are you pulling him at halftime? Mm. Why?
- [15:05]
A
Why?
- [15:05]
B
Why is Tyreek Stevenson getting more of those reps if in fact Johnson is what he says? You know, this guy is more than a, than just a guy. He was at one point taking away a whole side of the field at one point. He was a game plan around and because of type of lockdown coverage corner who was also willing to come up and make plays in the run game. I don't know that he is that right now. And if that is injuries, of course he's going to say he's 100%. What's he going to say? I can't move like I used to move. I don't have my legs under me. All the euphemisms that players will use and fall back on, but they've got to be brutally honest. And maybe they are. Maybe the fact that Stevenson came in for a supposedly 100% Jalen Johnson, you know, that's. That's the biggest deal right now. Right.
- [16:05]
A
Because he was. He was your best defensive player going. He was your best of the season.
- [16:10]
B
He was your best player going into.
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A
The season for sure.
- [16:13]
B
He was your single best football player relative to position.
- [16:18]
A
Yeah. And again, we still don't know the full nature of what the injuries were that he was experiencing, what he's dealing with. And we just don't know what time it's going to take, what the timetable is to get back to 100% football health. Yeah, he's physically healthy because he's cleared the play, but he's not. He's clearly not at football health because, Dan, he's not the same player.
- [16:37]
B
He's just not holding something back. It just doesn't look like he's engaging in the same kind of way and sticking his nose in there and trying to get off block. So I don't know. And as we're talking about that, you know, I've got a rule of thumb that I've mentioned before, and that is in the way we consume a lot of media right now. Never miss a beat writer's mailbag, whether it comes out online or in print or anywhere else. If you're just seeing bits and pieces in your various feeds. Never miss a mailbag because things get buried in there that would otherwise be a lead.
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A
Okay.
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B
Because sometimes a beat writer can share information casually or deeply in something where it's not going to put them out there and put their name on it in the same way.
- [17:32]
A
Is there something new? Are you referring this to the Tyreek Stevenson Jalen? Okay, there is something new. Okay.
- [17:37]
B
There is something new. All right. And this speaks to what we're discussing. And it came out in Brad Biggs's mailbag today. Okay, just listen to this. While defensive end Montes Sweat has not been on the injury report of late, this is Brad Biggs. I suspect he's dealing with something. No one has shared any information with me. It's just a hunch I have. Sweat was on the field for 45 snaps, 62.5% at San Francisco and 49 snaps, 68.1% the week before against Green Bay, which is below his typical rate. Generally, he plays a little more than 75% of snaps, considering both games were very close. I'm of the mind, says Biggs, that he's dealing with some kind of ailment that has led the coaching staff to closely monitor his playing time. So my. I think, I think he does know something. There's no way somebody as informed and careful, and I should mention generally conservative, small C in the way he reports things. Biggs is keeps a very even demeanor when it comes to his report. He doesn't try to race to beat people to stuff. He is not in any way a rampant, wild speculator. That's just not his style. This says something to me when somebody as informed as he is, as tight in as he is decides to place this in the back end of a mailbag. Yeah, because that's a, that's a headline. I suspect Montez Sweat Is Hurt is a headline. And so we see it all the time at the end of the year. By the way, he went in for some. For a knee scope or he's having his hip looked at. Or like Roma Dunes A. He's got a thing in his foot. We don't know.
- [19:57]
A
Does the deliberate use of the word ailment stand out to you at all? Because that. That stood out to me because it.
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B
Might be an illness or.
- [20:05]
A
Yeah, because ailment doesn't always include injury. Like, ailment is very broad.
- [20:13]
B
Mm. I mean, what did chronic fatigue syndrome.
- [20:18]
A
I don't know, dude. I'm just saying it just like if you, if you think he's dealing with something, you don't say ailment. If you think. Think he has an injury he's dealing with. Or maybe you do. Maybe I'm just looking at it incorrectly, but ailment seems more of a broad umbrella term, and maybe he is doing that because it is speculation. Although I don't. I don't really think he's speculating. He's not the kind of guy that just speculates.
- [20:38]
B
I don't think he would throw that.
- [20:40]
A
Out there, you know, if I could just. I just, I want to wrap up on Jalen Johnson, though, real quick, too, because I. From what I've watched in that guy play and what I've heard him and how he talks about playing, I don't see his. The. It's. For me, it's not a lack of effort. I think if he's not playing the game that we're used to seeing him playing, it's because he isn't at that level to do that right now. I don't think he's holding back. He's not. To me, he's not the kind of guy that's holding back, that would never hold back in his career. He doesn't hold back on the football field. So I think that. And what I've seen more is that I just haven't seen the smooth, fluid body actions and body motions of Jalen Johnson. I just don't think he's quite there yet. Mentally, he wants to be there. Physically, he's not there.
- [21:29]
B
It's just not responding that he's. He's not. He knows where it's supposed to go and the right neurons are firing, just not the right.
- [21:37]
A
Just the body hasn't caught up yet to it because, dude, again, we don't know what the injury was and we don't know how long it's going to take to be not just healthy and clear to play, but be football healthy. And the impact level player that he is, he's just not there yet. And I'm sure he's frustrated and we heard that come out in saying, I am 100% healthy. Well, sure, you are cleared medically to play 100% healthy, but you're not there football wise yet. He's just not. And I don't see that guy holding back ever.
- [22:02]
B
Well, if in fact a week off would help him get, you know, approximate his normal effectiveness for a playoff game, that would be an interesting decision.
- [22:13]
A
So, okay, let's, let's talk about that real quick because I'm down with Jalen sitting. I'm down with Rome sitting. Even if he's able to play. I like this, this game against the Lions. I know it's important. And now with the Philly news, that changes my perspective a bit on things. And you take a guy like Jalen Johnson and say, hey, take this week, get yourself ready. We have a divisional game with the packers coming up. Get yourself fired up for that. Roma Dunes is the same thing. Like, I'm good with those. If those two guys are able to play and they choose not to play them, I'm very good with that.
- [22:45]
B
I think I am too. And I've heard all kinds of speculation about Roma Dunze, some more informed than others, especially after we were talking about, and I said that I thought that at the end of the year, one way or another, he will have a procedure, and this is what they're able to get him through at the moment without making anything worse. And I did. After we put our speculation out there, I did hear from a sports orthopedist who was speculating that it's a fifth metatarsal fractures. For a lot of pro athletes, it's usually a surgery, but you can hedge your bets a bit. If he had surgery four to six weeks ago, he'd be done for the season. But if the damage was done and the surgery would be the same either way, you can let him play, see what he can do. If he's still better than the next guy on the roster, there's little risk in trying it, he said. You can rest him, you can limit the participation, you can get him back even in limited capacity for the playoffs, and the moment the season's over, you go and get that surgery. That's a reasonable belief based on what we've heard between finally the words stress fracture got out there and now it's probably just maintenance and seeing what you can get out of a guy who's going to be playing in pain.
- [24:04]
A
Yeah. And what we saw in his production, his catch percentage has gone down since that Cincinnati game significantly from where he was the previous seven games. And if he's a guy that can get out on the field for the playoffs and still be a guy that defenses have to think about and worry about and plan for at times, and you're using him more as a decoy and not so much a guy that's going to be the number one receiver for your quarterback as they establish that relationship early in this year, I'm okay with that. If he's not going to make it worse for himself. Because I'm confident in DJ Moore, I'm confident in Luther Burden, I'm confident in Colson Love and those three options and what Ben Johnson can scheme to get those guys successful on the field. And then, you know, you have the occasional Jedi Walker. He seems to be taking advantage of every opportunity thrown his way. I'm okay with that. And if Rome gets a few catches and not expect him to be the main guy, but he can be out there and not hurt himself further, great, then let's. Let's go for it. And then on the Montez sweat thing again, I know, keep bouncing back and forth, but yeah, that's just that. That is not. That's not something just to gloss over. If Brad Biggs throws that in there. There's. There's something there that he knows and is Just unable to or unwilling at this point to come out and say this is what he's dealing with. But he knows something, that that dude's too locked in love the way you put it about. About his work with the Bears, because he's not a guy that's racing for stories. He's not a guy that you hear him in media sessions. All right, Brad, your turn. All right, Brad, you're up. That's not his. That's not his thing. And for him to put that out there, there's a definite reason for it.
- [25:35]
B
No, and it's not a guy who's also trying to. He doesn't have a podcast to promote. You know, he does his. His hit on the score and he writes his stuff. He writes a week's worth of stuff and puts that in the 10 things, and then that's in the print edition for the rest of the week and posted piecemeal form. You know, he does like a big story dump once a week to sort of time out his football week. It's an incredible amount of work, an incredible amount of content.
- [26:02]
A
Oh, he's great.
- [26:03]
B
But the way it's timed is certainly different, which is why when I see this, you gotta comb through these mailbags and especially people who are close to the team. I would also say, you know, when it comes to Bulls, sometimes Casey Johnson will, because he's a team side guy now, will slip some things in there that you can pick through and say, well, maybe they didn't want to have a banger of a story. Sp Media has changed a lot, and this is a topic for another time. But there are a lot of. There's a lot more team control. There are a lot. The competition among reporters to actually get you stuff and find stuff that the team doesn't want out there is being. Just being handled in a different way. And it's hard, especially in the NFL, it's hard to get stuff. So I may, I may overinflate something like this just because of. It's become increasingly rare to have somebody say, hey, you know what? I think I've got a hunch. There's no way you go with something if it is just totally, completely a hunch out of thin air. There's got to be some awareness of something.
- [27:11]
A
Yeah, no, I agree with that. And it's not piecemeal. It's piecemeal. Just so you know, it's piecemeal. Yes.
- [27:16]
B
The Ben Johnson version is piece mail.
- [27:19]
A
Trying to, you know, like, amend relationships. It's peace mail.
- [27:23]
B
So I was Wondering this, you may have the answer. What does any wagering at the moment or line setting say about the perception of championship chances right now?
- [27:39]
A
I do have that, Dan, and I'm glad you asked because I actually wanted to get into that because I was curious about to see where the Bears were at the two seed. I wanted to see how they looked as far as the NFC scenario is concerned. And so I go to my bookie to look at the current favorites to win the Super Bowl. Right now, the current favorite to win the super bowl at my bookie is The Seattle Seahawks at +510. Los Angeles Rams +570. From there, you go to the Denver Broncos, The San Francisco 49ers, New England Patriots, Philadelphia Eagles, Buffalo Bills, Jacksonville Jaguars, Houston Texans. And then at 20 to 1 odds, we get the Chicago Bears. So in the NFC, the Bears are behind the Eagles, the Niners, the Rams, and the Seahawks. So they're behind the NFC west and the Eagles.
- [28:37]
B
Okay.
- [28:38]
A
Behind the Bears are the Packers. Well, actually, not even behind. They're the same odds. Bears, Packers, Ravens. Now, Bears and Packers are the same. 20 to 1. Ravens, then next, Chargers, Steelers, and then the Panthers or the Buccaneers would be the last one on the list.
- [28:56]
B
That sounds about right. I don't know that I'd make a bet on the Bears at 20 to 1.
- [29:04]
A
I did. Because I'm a meatball. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, God. Of course you did. I put a little number on him, too.
- [29:14]
B
Really? Yeah. All right. Okay. Good luck to you. Thank you.
- [29:20]
A
No, when, when, when What?
- [29:23]
B
Did you do this?
- [29:24]
A
I did it earlier today. That's what I was looking at.
- [29:26]
B
Oh, you did it today. Yes, you did. You are such a meatball. Go Birds. That's awesome. Like, you needed more incentive to want the Bears to win.
- [29:42]
A
I needed more incentive to have my heart explode while watching a Bears game. Yes.
- [29:46]
B
Oh, my God.
- [29:46]
A
That's exactly what I did.
- [29:48]
B
All right, good for you. There are people like. Yeah. Yes.
- [29:54]
A
And again, it wasn't, you know, it.
- [29:55]
B
Wasn'T a small number.
- [29:57]
A
All right, I have one. One other one I wanted to share with you today, too, so I'm glad you brought this up. The Coach of the Year. Can you guess, according to my bookie, who's the favorite right now to win Coach of the Year? Who would you guess?
- [30:10]
B
Well, it had been variable all year, and yet here's a late run, perhaps by Liam Cohen of the Jaguars. I'm going to stay with variable. I haven't looked.
- [30:25]
A
Okay, so there are four guys ahead of Ben Johnson. So Ben Johnson's fifth on the list.
- [30:30]
B
There are four guys ahead of Ben Johnson.
- [30:31]
A
I know. I know. There are four guys ahead of Ben Johnson. Okay, before I tell you what order they're in, can you tell me the. Mike Vrabel is one. Can you tell me the other three guys ahead of Ben Johnson? Mike Vrabel being one. There's three others.
- [30:47]
B
Okay, I said Liam Cohen.
- [30:49]
A
Okay, Liam Cohen.
- [30:53]
B
How about you have both those, right?
- [30:55]
A
Mike Vrabel and Liam Cohen are ahead of Ben Johnson.
- [30:58]
B
Okay, let's go with McDonald.
- [31:02]
A
McDonald, also ahead of Mike Johnson. And if you don't know, Mike McDonald is the head coach. Ben Johnson. Mike McDonald is the head coach of the Seattle Seahawks. If you are aware of that as a listener. And then because, you know, I didn't know that Zach Taylor was the head coach of the Bengals for, like, three years. I saw a picture of him. I didn't know. I'm not talking about recently. This is years of. In my. In my. My wilderness journey of going through sales, I saw a guy picture with the Bengals, like, stuff on. And I'm like, who's that guy? And I had to Google it, and I didn't use racist Google. I did regular Google, and I found out that he was the head coach of the. Of the Bengals. I thought, oh, when did they hire this guy? And then I had to look it up, and I found out he'd been the head coach, like, three years. So. Mike McDonald's.
- [31:45]
B
I've got two names. I've got. I've got two names, and one of them's right and one of them's wrong. One has. They both have. Are established, respected, successful coaches, one of whom already has a ring.
- [32:05]
A
I know who you're thinking, so.
- [32:07]
B
And I'm going to. I'm going to say, because of what he's dealt with this year, perhaps quarterbacks and all that, I'm going to say Kyle Shanahan.
- [32:17]
A
So here's the order. 1 through 5. Mike Vrabel, 1. Kyle Shanahan, 2. Mike McDonald 3. Liam Cohen, 4. Ben Johnson, 5.
- [32:26]
B
And then Sean Payton.
- [32:27]
A
Yeah. And then Sean Payton is six.
- [32:28]
B
All right, I got it. Okay.
- [32:31]
A
DeMarco. Ryan's is seven.
- [32:33]
B
D'. Amico. Yeah. D'.
- [32:34]
A
Ameco. Ryan's. Yep. Sorry. And then Dave Kanellis.
- [32:39]
B
Yep.
- [32:40]
A
And then Luke and Ellis. That's weird. He's in there. Sean McVay, Nick Sirianni, and then Mike Tomlin.
- [32:48]
B
All right, Okay. I just. Yeah. Shanahan's gotten a lot of credit for what he's done and what He. I also think part of that is people don't think Brock Purdy is all that good. I think people tend to believe that that is Brock Purdy is a product of incredibly well designed plays.
- [33:03]
A
I'm not one of those guys, so don't. Don't try to lump me into that group. But people don't think Brock Purdy's very good. I've never said he's not a very good quarterback.
- [33:11]
B
I know you haven't, but yet. Now, here's another thing, too. I know you got some response to what I thought. We went out of our way to describe our little Caleb Williams statistical thought exercise as just that.
- [33:27]
A
That's all it was.
- [33:27]
B
I thought we described it. We created these rhetorical parentheses around the point that was made. And yet still anybody. People are. You've got these. The Caleb Williams Anti Defamation League that wants to go through everything that's written or said to possibly find umbrage or indignation or any kind of thing that could be even perceived as possibly not thinking he's the greatest quarterback who's ever lived. And you were dealing with some of those people.
- [34:01]
A
Yes. So just make this clear because I don't think I can say any more clear. I love Caleb Williams. I'm ecstatic that he's the Bears quarterback. I think he's going to be the greatest quarterback to ever wear a Bears uniform. I still think he'd become a better passer. Those two things can live together.
- [34:15]
B
Controversial, apparently.
- [34:16]
A
The whole idea of the exercise was just to show what this season could look like, what it could look like in the future with Ben Johnson as the head coach and Caleb Williams as the quarterback. And when I said, hey, let's add 16 more completions, let's add 32 more completions, let's add 48 more completions, it wasn't a criticism of Caleb Williams. It was just looking at statistical numbers. If you want. If you're. If this makes you feel comfortable and happier as a Caleb Williams lover, let's say that those 16 extra completions he gets are drop passes that turn into catches. Has nothing to do with his throw. If you add 16 more catched, like caught balls. Catched Catch the balls and itchy balls and these nuts. And I have an audience who just got that, so. Oh, no, I know. I know I'm being stalked, but you.
- [35:08]
B
Know that Frank doesn't speak English. I know Frank can probably do a D's Nuts joke, but.
- [35:12]
A
No, it's not Frank. Okay? But the. The whole. The whole idea is if. If they were just. If they were 16 extra catches and how it would change what his season looked like or you know, you went extreme and you added 48 more catches because apparently the Bears have had a thousand drop balls this year. The whole idea is what this offense could look like as Caleb Williams continues to progress. That's all it was. It wasn't a criticism of Caleb. Although I'll say it again. You can love Caleb Williams and still want him to become a better passer. Those two can live together in the same house. They may not share a bedroom, but they can live together.
- [35:49]
B
That's all. Okay. I think that's well said. See, I understood that.
- [35:53]
A
I hope so. If you get it, I'm an idiot.
- [35:57]
B
You're an idiot.
- [35:57]
A
If you get it. The smart audience should be able to understand what we're saying.
- [36:01]
B
Exactly. Because it's so funny that if, believe me, the stuff that is being sent in. We get so many incredibly well thought out emails where people are showing their work. People are sending us attachments of Excel spreadsheets to say, I've looked at these plays and these plays or the plot charts on axes with little bears logos and say, this is where these people are in these situations relative to their peers. There's certainly a subset of the hardcore listeners in forward progress who are way smarter than the hosts.
- [36:39]
A
Yes. 100. Oh God. Yeah. That is way smarter.
- [36:43]
B
That's not just presumed. That is in evidence.
- [36:46]
A
Yeah.
- [36:47]
B
So for something like this, if I get it, I thought you should be.
- [36:52]
A
Able to get it as well.
- [36:52]
B
I understood.
- [36:53]
A
Yeah.
- [36:53]
B
Every quarterback has dropped balls. There are always things outside of a quarterback's control. And passer efficiency rating is just that. It is not the overall measure of a quarterback's effectiveness. It is just passer efficiency.
- [37:07]
A
However, he can improve.
- [37:08]
B
Yes. However with he. He can be a more efficient passer and then everything else will also stay good and everybody loves him and everything will get better. And it's not a threat to you. It's okay. No one's taking anything away from you.
- [37:23]
A
Right.
- [37:23]
B
Keep all your guns. Yes. And I wasn't even going there. I was just saying nothing to do with that.
- [37:31]
A
You can keep all your guns. You don't have to get vaccinated. It's fine. I know you love Caleb Williams.
- [37:36]
B
I don't think we've got a huge crossover in like military. Don't you Second Amendment. Like, like people in.
- [37:43]
A
In. Well, if I continue using World Militia.
- [37:47]
B
Right. Who also are the die hard Caleb Williams anti defamationists. I don't. I don't you don't think there's talking about the same people?
- [37:56]
A
I think you're more.
- [37:56]
B
Well, I'm gonna definitely keep using Tanner McKee people or the. Or the agency on that side of things.
- [38:03]
A
I'll keep using Racist Google. See if we can increase the audience across.
- [38:07]
B
Yeah, I don't know. I. Yeah, it's, it's. It gets a little scary and like also when it automatically gives you an AI summation of things and it's filled with errors, that's a problem. You got to double check everything.
- [38:20]
A
Everything.
- [38:21]
B
Yeah, everything.
- [38:22]
A
Yeah, I've gotten. I've gotten AI stuff before that has referred to Ben Johnson as the lion's head coach.
- [38:28]
B
There's so many things that are wrong. And I know you're lazy. I know we're all lazy, but man, when it comes.
- [38:37]
A
He just called you lazy up there.
- [38:38]
B
You. Me talk to.
- [38:40]
A
No, you. When you said you. Because you weren't calling me lazy, you were calling them lazy.
- [38:45]
B
Not necessarily. We're all. It's just, it's You Google something and it comes up and the chances automatically believe it.
- [38:51]
A
Yeah.
- [38:51]
B
Is wrong.
- [38:52]
A
Yeah.
- [38:52]
B
There's a really good chance at least something in there is wrong.
- [38:56]
A
Yep.
- [38:56]
B
And I'm trying to explain that sometimes to people in my house. Where did you get that information? Did you check your sources? Was it AI? Was it racist?
- [39:06]
A
Racist Google? Yeah.
- [39:07]
B
Right. It could be because sometimes you do. They're. Well, I mean if you.
- [39:10]
A
They're brothers and they share parents. All right, let's. Let's wrap this up here.
- [39:13]
B
They do.
- [39:15]
A
It's. I don't believe. Wow. Well, thank you, Racist Google.
- [39:24]
B
They are brothers. They are actual brothers, but with actual family and. Oh, really? Well, I kind of didn't ask that. Racist goo.
- [39:32]
A
I didn't. Racist goo. But thanks for sharing.
- [39:34]
B
Yeah, thanks for letting me know.
- [39:35]
A
That wasn't the question, but kind of.
- [39:37]
B
Tell it on yourself there.
- [39:40]
A
All right.
- [39:40]
B
I just, I also want the record to reflect that the moment we get done with this, I'm going to go watch the first episode of Heated Rivalry. Right. So I got a little gay sex for the rest of the afternoon coming my way.
- [39:55]
A
Well, hey, what time am I coming over? Right?
- [39:58]
B
No, it's. So I'm.
- [39:59]
A
Yeah.
- [40:00]
B
Watching more episodes.
- [40:02]
A
I'm sure you will. You'll go enjoy that. You'll watch the full season, I'm sure. Only six episodes. I'm gonna go start getting my middle aged school boys onto their social calendars going. Because it's New Year's Eve and apparently at, you know, 13 and 11 almost 12. You have more plans than. Than your dad. So that's what we're gonna do. I'm about to Uber.
- [40:20]
B
They should.
- [40:21]
A
Yeah, I'm gonna take them to where.
- [40:23]
B
They'Re supposed to go, give them a lecture and. And make sure that they don't do anything stupid and then get them on, find my friends and stalk them the whole night.
- [40:31]
A
Oh, I do that already. Yeah, I know you do.
- [40:33]
B
I know you do.
- [40:33]
A
All right, say goodbye now.
- [40:35]
B
That is forward progress a Chicago for the year.
- [40:38]
A
It's forward progress for the year for the.
- [40:40]
B
That's it.
- [40:41]
A
We're done for the year tomorrow.
- [40:43]
B
Tomorrow is. It's entirely new. We get to. It's a clean slate. We start over. We get to define forward progress of Chicago Bears podcast tomorrow for. For 2026. And I'm excited for that.
- [40:57]
A
I am, too.
- [40:58]
B
Do you have the thing loaded up or not? I do.
- [40:59]
A
Yeah. I'm waiting for you to stop talking because I'll just play it over you then if you keep talking.
- [41:03]
B
I'm finished talking.
- [41:04]
A
What are you going to do now?
- [41:06]
B
What am I going to do?
- [41:07]
A
Yeah, right now. What are you going to do?
- [41:08]
B
I was going to get a snare. Progress has stopped.
- [41:18]
A
Forward progress a Chicago Bears podcast with Dan Bernstein and Matt Abet on 312 Sports.