Herb Howard - The Bigs Media / Chicago Bears beat reporter

Summary

Forward Progress: A Chicago Bears Podcast

Episode: Herb Howard – The Bigs Media / Bears Beat Reporter
Hosts: Dan Bernstein & Matt Abbatacola
Date: December 25, 2025
Guest: Herb Howard (@HerbHoward411), Chicago Bears beat reporter (The Bigs Media)

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Episode Overview

This candid, energetic episode welcomes beat reporter Herb Howard back to deliver insider Bears perspectives ahead of a hopeful postseason. Dan and Matt leverage Herb’s locker room experience, diving into padded practices, player development, the enigmatic Bears offense, and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. The trio discusses the mysterious “cheese grater” hat, the psychology of Caleb Williams, and what separates this team from its “lucky” predecessors. The tone is equal parts analytical, storytelling, and passionate fandom—a must-listen for Bears diehards and NFL aficionados alike.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. NFL Padded Practices Rules & Impact

[01:09]

• Teams get 14 padded practices per year (11 in first 11 weeks, 3 in final 6; one per postseason week).
• Herb’s insight: Fewer padded practices mean players must continually reacclimate to full-contact intensity, especially post-injury.

  "Every week you're gonna have to go through this process of kind of re-acclimating to the physicality of the game." (Herb, [02:35])

• Example: Jalen Johnson returning from injury and regaining physical form.

2. Players Returning from Injury—Jalen Johnson’s Journey

[04:11]

• Jalen Johnson hasn’t yet hit All-Pro stride post-injury, but he’s improving.

  "[Jalen said,] 'I don't think I can just snap my fingers and return to some all pro form. I'm just, you know, trying to take it one snap at a time.'" (Herb, [04:11])

• First games back showed mental lapses and hesitation; progress seen gradually.

3. Defensive Standouts: DeMarco Jackson vs. Tremaine Edmunds

[05:09],[05:49]

• DeMarco Jackson’s “player of the week” story (from cut to starter).
• Still, Tremaine Edmunds’ return was a no-brainer—his size, range, and red-zone prowess make him indispensable.

  "You stand next to him and he's every bit of 6'5", 6'6" broad shoulders. He's long… He creates such a problem for quarterbacks down in that red zone..." (Herb, [05:49])

4. Bears Pass Rush and Defensive Tactics

[07:10],[08:22]

• Lack of front-four pass rush is the top concern for postseason viability.
• Herb’s solution: Be better on 1st/2nd downs to force 3rd-and-long, making pass rush more effective.

  "The best thing they can do to help that pass rush is to play better on first and second down...put themselves in situations where they can kind of dictate what's happening." (Herb, [08:22])

5. Andrew Billings: Embrace Your Identity

[10:10]

• Dan’s theory: Coaches leaned into Billings’ massive frame, accepting he won't get faster but can dominate as a classic nose tackle.
• Herb shares a hilarious locker room story poking fun at the D-line’s size:

  "'What makes you think you could just bend over, pick up the ball? And then what?'...Dex is like, 'He’s like, shut up. You know what? Just go. Just go. Bill's like, just, just, Just go. I'm like, I'm out, man.'" (Herb, [11:30])

6. Grady Jarrett’s Resurgence

[12:52]

• Grady Jarrett’s explosiveness has returned as his knee has healed.
• Described as “well put together, completely packed with muscle”—his early-season drop-off was purely health-related.

7. Caleb Williams’ Growth: Cadence, Ball Handling, Mindset

[14:04]-[16:49]

• Huge strides in cadence delivery and using it to manipulate defenses.

  "Now, both of those things are far, far better than they were when he first got here." (Herb, [14:44])

• Quotes a D-lineman: “Get that weak ass cadence out of here” from early practices.
• Ball fakes and under-center mechanics now improving; still room for next-level mastery.

Best at it?

"Aaron Rodgers is really, really good at it… His handoffs and his play actions look exactly the same." (Herb, [16:54])

8. The Caleb Conundrum: Thrives in Chaos

[17:22]-[21:43]

• Caleb excels under pressure, third downs, late-game situations; is far less sharp early in games.

  "Once the game is on the line or they're in these tough situations, he doesn't think as much. He just kind of relies on his natural ability and he goes and he just plays the game." (Herb, [18:50])

• Caleb is aware—jokes with Herb about “play better earlier in games.”
• Dan likens it to Seabiscuit, needing competition/trailing to “turn on the engine.”

9. Offensive Complexity & Player Development

[23:24]-[27:02]

• Bears offense is based on teaching whole-play concepts vs. role-based memorization.

  "They're teaching us the entire concept of the play… so that you can move around and do it, and it's very beneficial..." (Herb, [24:22])

• Contrasted with other teams (e.g. last year’s Commanders) who simplified for rookies.
• Ben Johnson’s philosophy is “raise the standard”—players must rise to it.

10. Offense Ranking High Despite Room to Grow

[28:48]

• Bears ninth in NFL scoring; could be even better, leaving ~1 TD/game on the field.

  "I've been watching Bears football for 40 years. I never thought I'd see it, period, never mind this season." (Herb, [29:46])

• Credits Johnson for assembling a teaching-focused staff that elevates backups and young players; expects assistants to be poached by other teams.

11. Locker Room Stories, Decals, and Player Relationships

[31:24]-[39:54]

• Kyle Manounguy’s helmet decals always come off—Herb says it’s his fearless running style.

  "His physicality and his stature I think is what adds to how often his decal is coming off because he's just a physical, physical runner and he doesn't shy away from contact." (Herb, [32:07])

• Manounguy, a 7th-round pick, is a cheerful, unassuming guy—not the bruiser you’d imagine.
• DJ Moore’s “cheese grater” hat: Origin unclear. First appeared in Caleb’s locker, circulated through team after the game.
• Players Herb loves to see: DJ Moore (“silly”), Kyler Gordon (“smart”), Josh Blackwell (“super nice, thoughtful”), Jaquan Brisker (“like a big 10-year-old”—plays angry, acts sweet).

On DJ Moore's first winning season since high school:

"Having some stability helps him out a lot, but I think he's such an even keel guy. He doesn't get too up, doesn't get too down..." (Herb, [38:30])

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On padded practices:
  "I'm old, so I'm, you know, I'm used to guys putting on pads for practice...this new edge way of doing things...it does seem like every week you're gonna have to go through this process of re acclimating to the physicality..."
  — Herb Howard, [02:35]

• On coaching approach:
  “Coach Johnson came in and he understood right away, I'm not meeting you anywhere. You're going to meet me. But it's going to be way up there…get comfortable being uncomfortable. The standard is going to be set higher than it's ever been set."
  — Herb Howard, [27:02]

• On the Bears leaving points on the field:
  "Did you ever think from where it started…that they'd be ninth in scoring? And you could reasonably say they're leaving a touchdown a game, which would put them over 30 points a game?"
  — Matt Abbatacola, [29:46]
  "I've been watching Bears football for 40 years. I never thought I'd see it, period, never mind this season."
  — Herb Howard, [29:46]

• On Caleb’s mindset:
  "Once the game is on the line or in these tough situations, he doesn't think as much. He just relies on his natural ability and he goes and plays."
  — Herb Howard, [18:50]

• On Jaquan Brisker:
  "He's like that little brother. Like, he's just...he's silly. He's goofy in a way that's, like, adorable..."
  — Herb Howard, [36:37]
  "He plays like a violent, angry human being...but as a person, he's just a big kid, always big bright smile..."
  — Herb Howard, [37:44]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [01:09] — Padded practices and player readiness
• [02:35] — Jalen Johnson’s return and physicality discussion
• [05:09] — DeMarco Jackson and Tremaine Edmunds: linebacker depth
• [08:22] — Pass rush struggles and potential fixes
• [10:10] — Andrew Billings embracing “big body” identity, locker room stories
• [12:52] — Grady Jarrett’s knee, recovery, and play
• [14:44] — Caleb Williams' growth in cadence and ball-handling
• [16:54] — Best QB at ball fakes: Aaron Rodgers
• [18:50] — Caleb’s performance under pressure and mental make-up
• [21:43] — Athlete psychology, “Seabiscuit” parallel
• [24:22] — Offensive install philosophy: teaching concepts
• [27:02] — Johnson’s approach vs. “meet them where they are”
• [29:46] — Scoring output vs. what’s left on the field
• [31:24] — Helmet decals, Manounguy’s toughness
• [34:58] — “Cheese grater” hat and team culture
• [36:03] — Herb’s favorite locker room personalities
• [38:30] — DJ Moore’s journey through instability and first winning season

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Listener Value & Takeaways

• Insider access: Herb’s stories and observations give listeners a feel for the personality and psyche of key Bears players.
• Tactical depth: Smart breakdowns of Bears’ technical issues, coaching choices, and why they’re succeeding.
• Human touch: Unfiltered locker room stories reveal the people behind the pads (and helmet stickers).
• Big picture: Contextualizes the 11-4 Bears in both historic and contemporary NFL terms—what’s different, what’s lucky, what’s sustainable.

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Episode Summary:
A rich, revealing discussion on the 2025 Bears—from the nitty gritty of padded practices and pass rush o-line play to the minds and hearts of stars like Caleb Williams and DJ Moore. Herb Howard’s unique blend of candor, access, and humor makes this a must for Bears fans who want more than highlights; they want to know what truly makes this surprising Chicago team tick.

Transcript

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[C]

You'Re thinking Forward Progress. Come on. 10 to 19 to 19.

[B]

Forward progress, a Chicago Bears podcast podcast with Dan Bernstein and Matt Abeticola on 312 Sports.

[A]

We keep our promises on Forward Progress, a Chicago Bears podcast here on 312 Sports. And when we last had Herb Howard on from the bigs, the Bears beat reporter, we said at the end of that interview, you know, we were going to have that man back. And here he is. He is findable on socials at Herb Howard 411. And the Bears beat guy is with us now on FP. What's happening, man? How you been?

[C]

I am excellent. I'm excellent. How y' all feeling?

[B]

We're good, man. It's great to see you again. One thing I wanted to follow up on real quick before we start in with Herb Dan, we, we were talking yesterday with Pat Finley about padded practices.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And I got, I got an answer from Pat after, after we had talked, and I wanted to bring it back for us today. We found this, or we found this very interesting, the number of padded practices an NFL team can actually have during the season. So each team, Dan. Gets 14 padded practices. 11 of them have to be held in the first 11 weeks. So that leaves you three practices over the final six weeks of the regular season. Post season, teams can have one added padded practice per week. That's just insane to me. Wait.

[A]

But postseason team gets one added practice from the moment they clinch or per the postseason week.

[B]

I would, I would assume it's per the postseason week.

[C]

All right.

[A]

This is really interesting, too, because. And Herb, the reason this came up, I'd love to know your opinion as well. It has to do with the understanding that, you know, players will always say there's a difference between college and pro, a difference between preseason and regular season. And that next big step about understanding a different pace, a different physicality is when the playoff games begin, that it really is different even for these guys who do it for a living. And I'm just wondering how, you know, without being able to really line up and hit a little bit, how you get guys ready for.

[C]

Seems tough, man. I'm, I'm old, so I'm, you know, I'm used to guys putting on pads for practice and all those types of things. So, you know, this, this new edge way of doing things. I, I understand that you want to keep the guys safe. They're the product. I get that you want to mitigate as much as possible their risk of injury and certainly you can get injured in practice, so I understand why they do it. But it does seem like every week you're gonna have to go through this process of kind of re acclimating to the physicality of the game. Right. Especially you get guys that are coming off injuries and how do they, how do you get them ramped back up? I was watching, watching Jalen Johnson as he kind of came back from his injury and you know, he's been a pretty physical corner throughout his career. Not saying he's looking for contact, but he's not afraid of it. As he's been coming back, it's like he's been ducking a little smoke a little bit. He's been making some decisions, some decisions just a little bit. And you know, this, this past game against the packers, he was a little bit more physical, a little bit more engaged in the running game than he was prior to that. So I don't know how you get guys ramped up. I certainly understand it, but it's interesting for sure.

[B]

You know, I like that you bring up Jalen Johnson, because I then sparked back a memory or thought that I had about a question watching him play. And you've been keeping your eye on him since he's been back. There was an out route, I want to say it was just this packers game. There was an out route where it looked like his legs weren't quite underneath him. And maybe he just, maybe it was just as simple as just stumbling and slipped, you know, who knows? But when the camera gets to it and you see him, he just, he just didn't look right. Has he looked right to you on the field since he's been back?

[C]

No, he hasn't regained his all pro form yet. And I think it's just issue of just having missed so much time and not being in the flow, not covering these world class athletes on a regular basis. And it just takes time. I asked him a couple weeks ago, post game, I can't remember exactly which game, but a couple weeks ago, post game, I asked him like, how long do you think or do you think there's enough time between now and end of the season for you to get back to your normal form of being an all pro caliber player? And to his credit, he was honest. Like, I don't really think so. He's like, I don't think I can just hit the switch like that. He's like, I'm just gonna take it one day at a time. I'm obviously doing all the extra work and trying to get as many reps as I can, but he said, I don't think I can just snap my fingers and return to some all pro form. I'm just, you know, trying to take it one snap at a time. And he is improving. I have seen that first game back, I was like, ooh, his eyes were in the wrong place. His, he didn't, he didn't look like himself. And he still doesn't look quite like himself. But he is getting better as well.

[A]

As DeMarco Jackson played. And really it was a hell of a story. A guy being NFC defensive player of the week and a guy who has been cut before, who was a fifth round draft pick playing his way into this role and taking it from Noah Sewell. Tremaine Edmonds is a different cat. He, you, it's, it's clear that you're talking about a pretty special height, weight, length, blend, speed, all of it out there. And I guess I forgot a little bit and I shouldn't. But when you see the difference that he can make in the area that he can cover, I start to understand a little bit why they wanted him back so quickly.

[C]

It's that recency bias. I had people ask me a couple of times last week, how are they going to take DeMarco Jackson off the field? And I was like, real easy. Tremaine Evans basketball, you just take 48 off, you put 49 on. That's, that's it. It's not, it's not a tough decision for DA or the rest of those defensive coaches to make. Tremaine Evans is a freak, man. You stand next to him and he's every bit of six, five, six, six broad shoulders. He's long. He can one of those guys that can scratch his knees standing up like he's got the speed and the range. I'm, I questioned that he comes out in those, their dime packages. And I've asked DA about this, I've asked remain about this because I don't know that it's the best thing to take him off the field, especially in the red zone. And I know they played phenomenally in the red zone on Saturday night, which is the only reason they were able to, you know, be in the game, to come back for it. But I think he, he creates such a problem for quarterbacks down in that red zone, especially in that low red area because of his length and athleticism that I wonder why they ever take him off the field in those situations. But yeah, once he was healthy, no brainer to bring him back into onto the field.

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Book now at vrbo.com you know one area of the Bears this year on defense, Herb, that hasn't created issues for opposing teams is the pass rush. And specifically looking at the front four and we've talked about it and you know the Bears are at a point now in the season where they, they can, they, they are a contender for the Super Bowl. I mean this is a big blob season and they're 11 and 4 and they're, they're winning football games and there's no reason why they can't have a playoff run. And Dan and I both made a list of things that we thought would prevent them from winning this year. On the top of our list was that that pass rush and what that lack of pass rush does, it opens up opportunities for good quarterbacks and good game callers to find those matchups that are mismatches. And we've seen it the last few weeks even in Cleveland. And we saw it with Green Bay where you get TJ Edwards one on one, you get Kevin Byard one on one, you get CJ GJ one on one with wide receivers and that's not a good, a good battle for those guys to have. And maybe there isn't a good solution. But what can the Bears do to elevate this pass rush? Because you're not changing the roster, you're not bringing guys through. But what can they do without going to an all out blitz that again will expose you to a good quarterback?

[C]

Yeah, I think they have to play better on first and second down. I think they got to play better against the run now. It'll put them in more advantageous situations when they do face the pass. Because I'm 100% with you on the mismatches that can be created against their secondary and their linebackers in the passing game. They're really, really good players. They all do what they do very well. CJ is phenomenal. 12 to 15 yard box area. He can come in, he can help in the run game. You can send him off the edge and he can cover in that range. You get a man to man covering guys on deep crossers or straight goals, that's not ideal for him. It's not ideal for a guy like Tyree Stevenson to cover man to man on a 40 yard crossing route across the field. It's, it's not ideal for him. As good as they are, what they do, you want to keep them out of those situations. So I think the best thing they can do to help that pass rush is to play better on first and second down, put themselves in situations where, where they can kind of dictate what's happening. They're too often they're in third and two, third and three, and the entire playbook is open to the offensive play caller and it just slows you down just a little bit. And that's not a pass rush that can afford to be slowed down even a little bit. They have to understand we're pin our ears back, we're going to get after the passer and then they can create different things with stunts, with pressures. They can do different things if they know they're in passing situations. And I think the best thing for him to do to figure out how to get more consistent pressure on the quarterbacks to play better on first and second down.

[A]

Can I bounce my Andrew Billings theory off of you and just see if this holds water? It's clear that Billings was never an ideal fit for what Dennis Allen wants to do. And maybe he figured, look, he's good enough, we'll get a year out of him and then we'll make a decision on what the roster is going to look like, what Shemar Turner is going to do, et cetera.

[C]

Sure.

[A]

And every time I've seen Big Bill this year, I think he's bigger than when I saw him the last time. My theory that may or may not be true. My theory is the coaching decision was, you know what, you're not going to get faster, but you can get bigger. So if you're going to be enormous, lean into that. Just be enormous and do what you can do is like an old school nose and we'll figure the other stuff out.

[C]

I think that's the best way to approach any player is like just lean into what they are. If they're here, if you're not going to get rid of them, then lean into what they are and what they do well. Don't try to make them be something else. He's not going to be this penetrating defensive tackle. He's a massive, massive human being. I'll tell you, this is probably like three weeks ago after. After a game. This was at Soldier Field. So, yeah, after a game, and I'm talking to Javon Dexter and all those D tackles, they're all together in the back of the locker room. And I'm talking to Javon Dexter, and we're talking about. It was the game where Javon Dexter, I think Montez, had forced a fumble, and Javon thought he could scoop and score. And I was like, dude, I went back there to mess with him. And he knew it, and he slowly.

[A]

Bent down for it. Yup.

[C]

As soon as I walked to the.

[B]

Locker room and he's.

[C]

I walked back there to him. Yeah. He's like. He's like, don't come back here with that shit. I was like, no, I'm coming. I'm coming. I was like, what? What were you thinking? Like, you are 6, 5, 330 pounds. What makes you think that you could just bend over, pick up the ball? And then what? And then what? Like, what happened after that? I saw green grass. I thought I was gonna go. I was like, you weren't gonna go? I say, fall on the ball, dude. So we get to talking about how big he is. That's crazy. And then he goes into Billings, and I'm like, yeah, Big Bill. I'm like, he's like, 330. But he's like, 5, 9. And so he does 330. Dex is like, 3, 30, 30. And Bill's like, shut up. And I'm like, what are you, like, 350? And so Dex is like, he's like, shut up. He's like, you know what? Just go. Just, Just go. Bill's like, just, just, Just go. I'm like, I'm out, man. Yes.

[B]

So they see you coming, and they're like, we don't want this guy around.

[C]

Oh, Dex knew I was coming to mess with him about that scoop and score, Tim. I was like, what were you thinking? Like, I was going to pick it up and score. No, you weren't.

[A]

No.

[B]

Pick it up and take a step. Hey, so I, I, I love your, your, your anal that you watch guys play. So I want to. I think you'd be a great guy to ask. What I've seen from Grady Jarrett the last few weeks has been a next level of his game. Is it just a matter of that knee getting healthy because he's playing different on the field?

[C]

Yeah, I think it is the knee. Because he was playing really, really well throughout the summer. At training camp, he was disruptive he was in the backfield often. They were telling them, hey, let the quarterback throw. You can hit in training camp. You can hear him out there all the time. He's talking loud. He's telling guys that they better run the ball that way because you know, such and such and such and such. He's just going off and I was expecting him to start the season that way and it just didn't really happen. And then you hear about the injury and they went in there and they did a little procedure and then you see him in the locker room and he's got their draining fluid still and he's got the brace and he's walking with a little bit of limp and he's. He's talking about Billings being 5 8. Grady's about the same. They, they are not tall guys, right? So I just think that the knee injury wasn't allowing him to be who he wanted to be coming into the season. I do agree with you that I've seen it now. He's starting to see that burst, that explosiveness because he is a big strong man. Like, I don't know what I thought about him. I thought he was more of a rounder kind of guy when he was in Atlanta. I've never seen him in person, so I just kind of thought he was. But he is very, very well put together, completely packed with muscle. And you're starting to see that explosiveness and that strength come back now that he's getting comfortable with the knee.

[A]

While we're doing scouting stuff. Let me ask you this. To what extent do you think Caleb Williams has improved at both the delivery of his cadence and the use of his cadence like he's now in charge of it. It doesn't look like he's sort of reciting it by rote or by memory. It looks like he's now in charge of it. It also seems some of the more advanced sleight of hand is starting to settle in a bit with how to deliver a real fake. When you turn the shoulder position, the hand position, it's not there yet, but it's notably better to my eye. What about yours?

[C]

Now, both of those things are far, far better than they were when he first got here. I remember practice last year and he's going through a cadence and he's trying to get guys to jump and I don't remember who it was. It was a D tackle that they had and he's gone. But anyway, he said, get that weak ass cadence out of here. Like you can literally hear him say that on the field, like, get that weak ass cadence out of here. And nobody jumped. And so I don't think he had much experience with it. And so he's just gotten better at it. And then once you get better at doing it now, you can understand, hey, this is actually a weapon. I can use this thing. It's not just something for me to kind of go through the motions. I can use it now and it helps him a lot. And then Big Bill, he does this move and that gets everybody going. It sometimes it makes the defensive linemen jump themselves. He got the packers with it the other day. Like he does that thing and I think he's been helping Caleb with that. Just kind of how they go about that kind of cat and mouse game at the line of scrimmage. So he's gotten much better at the cadence. It can still be. He can still use it more effectively. The better he gets at it. He'll understand when and how to use it, how you can kind of rush up to the line of scrimmage and then use that to get things going. So he's much better at that. And then I think the ball handling and the sleight of hand type of thing that you're talking about, that just had to come with some familiarity of being under center. He wasn't even used to it. And so you don't have the same type of ball handling mechanisms. You don't have that in, in the gun. And so people talked about, is he going to be able to turn his back to the defense and then turn back around and then find his reads and find his answers. That's one thing. But people don't think about exactly what you're talking about. It's that ball handling and how you go about your play. Fakes, play action don't mean nothing if you can't actually fake anybody out. And so some of the best people who've ever done it, they were phenomenal at ball handling. Some people like to actually use the ball and stick it out there. Some people would say that's a no, no. But if you can do those types of things, it's another thing that you can use to trick the eyes of the defenders. And I do think he's gotten a lot better at it.

[A]

Who's the best you've ever seen at it with some of the hand fakes?

[C]

Aaron Rodgers. Aaron Rodgers is really, really good at it because he does both. He'll go empty hand, then he'll go ball. And he's just really, really. He's Got those quirky movements that he has and then those off platform throws that he can make so he can come right out of the play, fake and spin and just drop his arm angle or throw off his back foot. He's really, really good. It looks all the same. His handoffs and his play actions look exactly the same. He's, he's probably the best I've seen in terms of the play fake.

[B]

Yeah, no, that's a good call. And I remember always watching him with the packers obviously and always being jealous as a Bears fan because he just, he looked so comfortable and, and I, and, and I love it because that the Browns game and I said to Dan after, you know, our post game show and the week after the Browns game leading up to the Packers, I just said that was the most comfortable that I've seen Caleb Williams play. The NFL quarterback position. He looked in full control and command and you know, don't come at me with, oh, it's the Cleveland Browns. They've been competitive most of their games. Defense, that's a real good defense and he, he looked like he was in full control of it. So. And I know you've been deliberate this year in getting to know Caleb and spending time talking with him. So I want to ask you. There's two different Caleb's that we see that we've seen in this season. There's the guy and some of his numbers are. And I could send you these numbers if you haven't seen these. When the Bears are trailing on third down. He's one of the best in the game. I mean his completion percentage alone, third down when trailing in games, he's completing 71% of his passes and he's just, the numbers are just off the charts. Good. Yet you see a guy when it's not a high pressure stakes situation. It's the first quarter, it's the second quarter. He just, he's not the same guy. What have you learned about him and his personality, his makeup, his mindset that says, all right, there's two guys here and is it just a switch going on? Is it just. He really prefers where the house is on fire and he just has to go, go, go. What have you learned about him as a, as a person?

[C]

I don't know what that is. The best I can come up with is that once the game is on the line or they're in these tough situations, he doesn't think as much. He just kind of relies on his natural ability and he goes and he just plays the game. And versus when he's thinking through things and he's thinking mechanics and he's thinking reads and like progressions. I don't know what it is. I wish I did. I wish, I wish Ben Johnson knew. I wish Caleb knew. Like, how do you just switch this thing on so that we can throw 70% completion percentage in the first two or three quarters? Like, how can we take advantage of these opportunities that we have early? But time and time again, you see the ball sell on them in the first quarter. You see them missing guys and progressions in the first quarter. It's like, can we get out to these earlier leads in the tunnel Saturday night? He just walks up to me, puts his hands out and I'm like, hey man, listen, my blood pressure is too high for this, bro. Like, you can't like this. We can't keep doing this, man. He's like, you know how it is. I'm like, I do, but stop. But he's aware of it. He's aware of it. I was coming up to him to tell him something about something that he said in a press conference, this was a few weeks ago in the locker room at Hallis. And I said, listen man, I need you to do me a favor. And he's like, what? Play earlier. Better. Play better earlier in games? I was like, yeah, no, definitely that.

[A]

Yes, that.

[C]

Definitely that. So he, that's assumed. Yes, he's aware of it. Coach Johnson often refers to the fact that the Bears need to play better for a full 60 minute game. My assumption was that they would not be able to pull off games like this. When you put yourself down by 10 to a team like the Green Bay packers, that that's not going to work in the way that it worked against the New York Giants. But what do I know? They continue to do it.

[B]

What's the whole thing with, with Caleb and taking time to warm up and get warm, get his legs underneath him. What is that all about?

[C]

I don't know. I don't know if he needs to improve his pregame routine. I don't know. Some guys need to get hit, you know, like in a game or you get fighters. Like, I just need to get hit first and then I can get myself into. I don't know what it is with him that he needs to look up and see that we're down a score or two and now we're good. And now I can go into my iceman thing. It's like, hey, if you just, you know, if you just complete a couple balls in the first quarter, you don't have to go hero at the end. You don't have to do that. It's great that you can, but you don't have to.

[A]

You know, Matty, you were around horse racing for a while.

[C]

I'm trying to.

[A]

There was at least one famous racehorse that was like that that they would say they would. The jockey needed. They didn't want to get out to an early. Was it Seabiscuit? It was Seabiscuit.

[B]

Or Secretary?

[A]

Well, Secretary. Just Secretary would just kick your and eat your face and step on your family and ruin your life. I don't think it was Secretariat, but it was. That's a great. One of the great athletes of all time. But it was, it was somebody who just couldn't run with a lead and had to, had to see everybody around him was like, oh, okay. Oh, you're here next to me. Hell, yeah, I'm gone.

[B]

No, it was, it was Seabiscuit.

[A]

Yeah, it was Seabiscuit.

[B]

Yeah. Red Pollard and Tom Smith. Yeah. So he needed, he needed to trail a horse in order to get his, his engine going and get his juices flowing. So he needed a trail to pursue.

[A]

I knew it wasn't crazy, but it's not, it's not like it's uncommon in athletics because there have been fighters like that. There have been fighters like, oh, okay, all right, I lost a couple of rounds and now. Now you're done. So if the fact that Caleb is aware of it makes it really interesting, because he knows it, that I wonder, I wonder what he would do or how he would adjust with all of the voices around him and everybody suggesting so many things to him.

[C]

I don't know how he, how he deals with it, but he's just, he's. Like you said, there's been so many athletes that are just like that. And I imagine that he'll get better at it. I imagine as he gets more comfortable with Ben Johnson's system, I expect for his year two, year three in Coach Johnson's system that they'll be able to get out of the gates a little bit faster. They'll be more in sync and on the same page for what they want to do and what they want to take advantage of. Because Coach does. He's. I mean, he draws up a good first 15. He's got a good plan coming out of it, and they were doing well with it earlier in the season. They were coming out and they were getting first quarter points and first draft points, which they absolutely could not do at all last year. So they were okay. With it. But it's just like, man, you got to get out to a lead so you can dictate the terms of these games, and that's what you want to see as that next step. I think he'll figure it out, but he's just one of those guys like. Like Tank Davis the boxer. Excuse me, the Tank Davis the boxer. He's that way. He's losing. He'll lose the first like four or five rounds as he's just kind of downloading information on the fighter and then set them up and then boom, and now it's over. So I guess Caleb is just like that.

[A]

You've been watching this team since day one, since OTAs, and just have been around. And it was really interesting to me when we were talking about the formation that we saw with the double tight ends and swift behind that they call bully that we now know is descended from the. The reptile or lizard, the Greg Roman stuff. We traced it back to Ditka and ed Hughes in 86 with their eagle formation. And then Cole Comet said, yeah, we put that in in training camp. And I thought, well, wait a second. You use that formation in training camp and then dragged it out. You're 10, 11, 12 games into the season, and now it's starting to come out. What else is there? And I'm wondering, is there anything that you saw in an open period of practice or when you are watching some of the earliest full team practices that you haven't seen yet this year that you're wondering, well, I wonder when they're going to spring that.

[C]

Nothing in particular like that jumps out to me. But I will tell you this. They talk the route con the plays as complete concepts, right? Not these individual components to a given play. And what it's allowed them to do is move guys around the formation and still run the same play because they all understand it as a complete and total concept. I remember talking to Colston Loveland about it. Some of the receivers just like, what's it? And it's like, we're trying. They're teaching us the entire concept of the play. So it's not like, okay, X has this, Y has that, Z has. It's like, no, you have understand the entirety of the concept so that you can move around and do it, and it's very beneficial from them. I brought this back up to Coach Johnson last week when it became apparent that Roma Dunes A and Luther Burden were not going to play. I said, well, now, how valuable is it now that you taught these guys these plays? As complete concepts and with the understanding that Cole Comed and Colston Loveland can do these things. And you get a undrafted rookie that makes the game tying play at the end, like. But I think because they taught those things as concepts, it allows them to now pull out things or adjust to things differently than if they were just only able to learn one singular position. And so they have the ability to now go into whatever. However deep in his bag Ben Johnson wants to go, he has the ability to get down there and pull that out because the guys can do so many different things. I thought that was extremely valuable through the spring and summer, and now you're starting to see it pay dividends. That's.

[A]

You know why I love hearing that, because that, that is a response when the comps come in to last year's commanders. And there are a lot of reasonable comparisons where you're a good team and your record may be better than it would otherwise be because of winning a lot of close games, you're getting a lot of turnovers. We don't know what's sustainable. So it's okay to say there may be a little luck involved. You can be good and also have some luck involved. But I think when you describe that, it tells me that in the right way that they're not that team because they. They made their offense so simple for Jaden Daniels. They stripped everything out of there, and it's not right or wrong. I'm not judging them. But their decision was, we want him to be plug and play. We want to give him some of the same stuff he did in college, some of the same terms he did in college. Just go do it and that's okay. But then you do make yourself more. You're more predisposed to have some things turn against you when there's more film on you and when some of the luck goes away. Maybe the Bears are inoculating against that ahead of time. That's great.

[C]

Yeah. No, I have a podcast called Herb and Two and my co host, Tucson. It has nothing to do with sports, but we debate often about this idea of whether to meet somebody where they are or set the standard and make them elevate to it. And he's so much on, no, you don't compromise. You tell your kids this is the standard and they will rise and meet it. And in a lot of cases, I'm more so, hey, meet a person where they are and then bring them along to where you want them to be. But in football, I'm kind of the opposite. Right. It's like, I understand the philosophy of saying, let me meet you where you are. Let me do what you're capable of doing now, but what's the long game here? Right? And Coach Johnson came in and he understood right away, I'm not meeting you anywhere. You're going to meet me. But it's going to be way up there. Like he told them in his, in his opening, in his introductory press conference, you know, get comfortable being uncomfortable. The standard is going to be set higher than it's ever been set. And that's what he did. And he put so much on their plate, especially Caleb. He just threw it on there, threw it on there, threw it on there. See how much you can digest. And if you can, it's okay, make some mistakes. And so while we as reporters and rewriting every day, oh, this looks terrible. He's incomplete here and he's incomplete there. And he's like, whatever, we're okay with that, we're okay with that because we're just overloading all of these guys with this information. And so again, going back to learning, learning the places concepts is starting to pay off now. You're starting to see kind of what that looks like. But I think the Bears, they did it the right way and I think it's allowed them to be a little bit ahead of schedule. And they've had some breaks this year. Everybody talks about all the backup quarterbacks they've played and how many starting quarterbacks they've missed. And sure, that's fine, but it is what it is. They're, they're one of. If the 49ers win tonight, the Bears are one of five teams in the NFC that have 11 wins. And so you don't apologize for that.

[B]

Yeah, and certainly not. And especially with the number of injuries the Bears have faced themselves, I think they've, they're in the top three. They, at one point they were leading the most missed games in the NFL and yet they're still doing that at a, at a very high pace of winning football games. It's interesting when you look at the offense, they're currently ninth in scoring in the NFL. And you could clearly say that they're not really hitting on all cylinders for their offense. And if you look at it and say, all right, well, Maybe they've left seven to 10 points on the field per game this year. Did you ever think from where it started to where they are now at 11, 4 on top of the NFC north that they would be ninth in scoring? And you could, you could reasonably Say they're leaving a touchdown a game, which would put them over 30 points a game, would put them towards the top of the league. Did you ever think you would see that in. In week 16, where this, where this all started?

[C]

I've been watching Bears football for 40 years. I never thought I'd see it, period, never mind this season. No, it's. It's. It's a thing, man. And you look at the stats and you watch. You watch the games and it's like, well, they're leaving so much out there on the field. And then you look at the stats and you see the rankings, like, well, they're. They're also getting a lot done, too. And so, you know, you try to find that balance between what I'm seeing and then also what the stats are saying, and it's been really, really impressive. And I think their ability to navigate through some injuries and through a lot of turnover, it's a credit to the coaching staff. And Coach Johnson built a phenomenal coaching staff. And he talked about when he was coming in, he's like, I'm not. I didn't just bring all my friends in here. I brought some guys in here I've met. But I respected their ability to coach the game. I think they're great communicators. I think they're great teachers. And so he's put together such a good staff. And so time and time again, when you go into a game with none of your three starting linebackers and they still produce at a very, very high level, or you go into a game and you're missing a couple of your receivers and you're still able to win the game, or you got turnover at left tackle, and all these types of things are happening, but they continue to play at a high level. I think that's just such a great credit to their coaches. And it's. This staff is going to get poached, too. Like, I don't know how soon or how many, but I. I don't expect Al Harris to be here next year. I think he'll be a D.C. somewhere. Like, you just kind of figure out what happens with the rest of it. But I think the coaching staff has done a great job of preparing these guys like they're going to be in the game, even though there's no foreseeable path to them being on the field. And then you look up and now they're out there and they're able to produce. So I think they've all. They've done a really, really good job with that.

[A]

Let me ask you this before we let you go, especially considering your Javon Dexter story and your relationship with the players. Has it come up yet? Has anyone else noticed that in every game, Kyle Manounguy's helmet stickers are coming off? Every single game, one of the C's gets peeled off or twisted. And I think it's because of the amount of actual like helmet to helmet contact or because of the him running to contact and fearless.

[B]

It's Ricky hazing. Damn.

[A]

Through contact. I don't know what it is. I've heard of tearaway jerseys. I've never heard of tearaway helmet logos. But is he aware of it? Is Tony Medlin aware of it?

[C]

T, man, listen, T Med and Kalmanunga are probably the same height. So that probably has something to do with it, right? I had a great one on one with Cal guy after the game on, on, on Saturday night and it's up on the Big's YouTube page from inside the locker room segment. But we had a great conversation and it came up about his running style. And because he had that play where he caught the ball and he runs for 30 yards and there's nobody around. And as he's running and I see this DB coming, I'm like, I know he's not, he's not going to step out of bounds. He's not even going to try to run around the guy. He's going to go right through him. And that's just how he runs. And he says, I listen. I was trying to set the tone. They're out there talking crap. We know what the rival is. I'm just trying to set a tone. And he says for his entire life, people look at him in stature and he's like, they think he's sweet. They think they could just come knock me down. And I want to let him know, doesn't matter if it's DBs, if it's linebackers. I want to let him know that it's not going to go that way. And he's. He runs that way. That physicality, he lowers his head even though he doesn't really need to get any lower to the ground. And then you have these guys that are just hitting them and they're hitting him in his helmet. Like he just. His physicality and his stature I think is what adds to how often his decal is coming off because he's just a physical, physical runner and he doesn't shy away from contact.

[A]

But he really is a nice kid. He really is just nice and smart. And like, if you. If you just met him and talked to him, you wouldn't think that this guy's a bruising running back.

[C]

No, he doesn't have that kind of demeanor. Now you can look at him and he see he's very well put together. He is super rocked up, but he's just a nice dude, soft spoken. He wore a Derrick Rose Simeon High School jersey to the game. And so I was asking him about that, and he's like, man, I'm from Jersey, but everybody respect Derrick Rose. He's like. And it's, you know, he's from the city and it's a big game. And so I just figured I would, you know, pay homage to him on this big game. And I was like, man, well, you did that and you are on your way to building your own legacy here in Chicago. And so listen, there's a lot of talk about what the Bears needed to do coming into this offseason in terms of improving that running back room. They needed to do more in free agency, and they needed to figure out how to get up and move up and get Ashton Gentian. They should have jumped up and gotten the kid that the Patriots got, and they end up with this kid in the seventh round who has been as productive as they could have imagined.

[A]

So, yeah, better than I thought. I'm right there as one of those people and, yeah, way, way better than I thought.

[C]

No doubt, no doubt, no doubt.

[B]

A couple of last things for you. Just, you know, fun, fun little, little, little tidbits after the game on Saturday. And we. We talked about this during the week that DJ Moore comes out wearing the cheese grater hat thing. Do you have any idea where. Where that came from? Because I know Caleb was wearing one the next day. Doing community work, too. Do you have any idea where they got a hold of those?

[C]

I don't know. It was in Caleb's locker. It was in. It was in Caleb's locker at Soldier Field. And so that was. That was the first time. That was the first that I saw of it. It was. It was in Caleb's locker, and then somebody, one of the other players, like, grabbed it out and put it on. And so I don't know. I don't know that they're two different ones. I think. I really think it was the same thing. I think DJ had it, but I think, like, I know it was in Caleb's locker. That's the first place I saw it.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

So I think DJ Took it and put it on and then probably gave it back to Caleb, and then he wore it out at his event. But that was. That's as far. That's as much of the origin as I can give you on that, Matt. It was incredible.

[B]

That's good. That's good. So, I mean, we're getting narrowed down now. We need to figure this out. Need to figure it out. And then, last thing for you, I know that building relationships is really important to you in. In how you do your work, and it shows in your work, too. So I appreciate that with you, my man.

[C]

Thank you.

[B]

Who is the one guy that you just. You look forward to seeing in the locker room? And maybe you've mentioned him already on this podcast, but is there. Is there one guy that you're just like, every time you're out there, or whether it's game or practice, you're going to make a beeline and look forward to seeing that guy?

[C]

I got to give you a few. It's dj. He's just fun to talk to. He's silly. We've developed this thing. I don't do the scrum. I don't do the media scrums. It's just not my thing. But when he has one, I'll go past it in the back and I'll just stare at him with a blank stare. And inevitably, at some point, as he's going through answering his question, he's panning across, he catches eye contact, and he's like, God, Saturday. He's like, you gotta stop doing that. I was like, no, I don't actually have to stop doing that now.

[B]

You do it more, right?

[C]

Love dj. I love Kyler Gordon. He's really, really smart guy, really great to talk to, really nice guy. And Josh Blackwell is one of my very favorite people on that team. Like, he's. First of all, he's just phenomenal player. He's one of the best in the league at what he does. We've seen him win games, blocking kicks. We've seen him take a touchdown on a kick return back at Lamb last year. He's got interceptions, he's recovering onside kicks. He's really, really good at what he does. But he's just a super nice guy, super smart, very caring, very thoughtful. Love talking to him. And then last would be Jaquan Brisker because he's. He's like that little brother. Like, he's just. I don't. It's like he's silly. He's goofy in a way that's, like, adorable. It's like you just want to talk to Jaquan Richter. And it's like, dude, I just love this dude. I'm talking to him in the locker room and he's got on his suit on Saturday and he's like, hey, is my tie good? And can you, can you fix my tie? And I was like, yeah, we can get this done. And so he's, he's like a big 10 year old or something.

[B]

That's funny because his, the way he plays, it wouldn't come across that way, that that's what his personality would be because he plays very differently.

[C]

He plays like a violent, angry human being. He's always having fun, but he plays with that reckless abandon. But as a person, he's just a big kid, always big bright smile. It was. We were the last two people in the locker room and he's like, no, let's just, let's do it on. Let's do it on the camera. And we were just hanging out, just talking. Man, I love Jaquan Brisker. So those are some of my favorite guys to talk to.

[B]

That's cool to hear. And then with dj, how is DJ doing? I really like DJ more as a player and I've seen some bits and pieces of him off, off the field, and he seems like family's important and that he's a really good, really good dude. How is he doing? And has there been any conversation between you two about the fact that this is his first, like winning football season since high school? Which is remarkable to think about.

[C]

It's insane. We've had that conversation before. Not recently, but just coming into it, like, because I was having these conversations about, like, none of very few people on this team have experience with sustained success. And so you get Joe, Tony comes over here and he just. All he does is win. So maybe that's just what it is. I mean, so. But I've talked to DJ a lot about, you know, the turnover that he had at quarterback. He's like, I had like 18 quarterbacks at Maryland, and then he had like another dozen or so in Carolina. And then he gets here and he's the Bears quarterback, Will is what it is. And so I think, you know, having some stability helps him out a lot, but I think he's just such a, like, even kill guy. He doesn't get too up, doesn't get too down. He told me in the, in the interview from the locker room the other day, he's like, why are you trying to start stuff? I'm like, I'm not trying to start anything. I just wanted to know why they don't throw you the ball. Like, you know what I mean? Like, it's a good idea to throw perhaps your best player the football. And so he's like, don't start stuff. I'm like, not starting stuff. I'm just asking you. And he ended up answering it. But I think that's one of his best qualities. And I think it's probably. Probably because all the turnover that he's had, he's had to just understand, listen, it's just going to go how it's going to go. I'm going to be who I'm going to be, and it'll come my way when it comes. And if it doesn't, I'll line up and still run as hard as I can on the next route.

[A]

Herb, this was awesome. As always, love the stories and the opinions. I know that you. You really have developed into one of the best journalists out there when it comes to being the eyes and ears of the fan in that locker room. So it's a great job and thanks for making us a part of what you're doing.

[C]

That is extremely, extremely high praise from you. It means a lot to me. It's just something I enjoy doing. It's the way I wanted to cover the team when I wasn't covering the team. And it was like, if I could be in there, I would just be a guy. I would just treat the guys like regular people because I think that's just. That's all they are. They're exceptional at football, and then other than that, they're regular people. Guys try to treat him that way and, you know, it. It works out. It builds. Builds a bit of a connection and build some trust, and we able to have some pretty good conversations on and off the record that are valuable to what I do. So it's just my style to work.

[B]

Appreciate. Merry Christmas to you, pal.

[C]

Merry Christmas to you guys, too. Thanks so much for having me.

[A]

Thanks, Herb. That is Herb Howard at Herb Howard 411 from the Bigs Media. And this has been Forward Progress, a Chicago Bears podcast on 312 Sports.

[B]

Forward Progress, a Chicago Bears podcast with Dan Bernstein and Matt Abeticola on 312 Sports.