← Forward Progress - A Chicago Bears Podcast
Forward Progress - A Chicago Bears Podcast
Patrick Finley of the Sun-Times Shares Hit Thoughts on the Off-Season for the Chicago Bears
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- [00:00]
Patrick Finley
From Geico Subconscious News, I'm Tammy. Racing thoughts tonight. You just left for work and had a non specific feeling that something was
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Dan Bernstein
happening to your place and it wasn't good, Dan.
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Patrick Finley
Exactly, Tammy. It could be smoke damage, theft or just too much caffeine, but you can't stop thinking about it. But with renters insurance through geico, your
- [00:17]
Dan Bernstein
stuff is covered so you don't have to worry.
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Patrick Finley
And that's great. Cause the weekend is coming up and it's chock full of social obligations that are ready to fill that void. Oh boy, will they.
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Dan Bernstein
Dad. It feels good to worry less.
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Patrick Finley
It feels good to geico, a support group for barely functioning adults.
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Dan Bernstein
It's the Dave and Mahoney show. You know, I did a phone sex operator.
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Patrick Finley
Did she know that you were dating? They would have to go into like
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Dan Bernstein
a call center, cubicles and stuff like that.
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Patrick Finley
Having phone sex with some lonely guy while you're sitting in a cubicle, do
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Dan Bernstein
you think that it would make you more competitive?
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Patrick Finley
Yeah, I got one.
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Dan Bernstein
He's done. Oh my gosh.
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Patrick Finley
Grab the Dave and Mahoney podcast now on Apple Podcasts, on Spotify and@david mahoney.com
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Dan Bernstein
and Doug, there's nowhere I wouldn't go to help someone customize and save on
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Patrick Finley
car insurance with Liberty Mutual. Even if it means sitting front row
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Dan Bernstein
at a comedy show. Hey everyone, check out this guy and his bird. What is this, your first date?
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Patrick Finley
Oh, no.
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Dan Bernstein
We help people customize and save on
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Patrick Finley
car insurance with Liberty Mutual together. We're married. Me to a human, him to a bird. Yeah, the bird looks out of your league anyways. Only pay for what you need@libertymutual.com Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Forward Progress a Chicago Bears podcast with
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Dan Bernstein
Dan Bernstein and Matabatacola on 312 Sports. Forward progress on 312 Sports. Dan Bernstein with you. Matabaticola on vacation. And we are joined today by somebody who knows a whole lot more about the Bears than I do. And that's why I'm happy to have him. Here it is Patrick Finley of the Chicago Sun Times, who covers the Bears and the NFL. How are you, Pat? Good to see you again, man.
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Patrick Finley
I'm good. How about you?
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Dan Bernstein
I'm good. The. The dust has settled now after these the first wave of free agency and the secondary tertiary waves have come rolling into our bare feet here on the beach. And now it's receded and the metaphor continues for some horrible reason. And what have the Bears now? I'm looking at a lot of defensive tackles on the depth chart. I'm looking at a remaining unsettled left tackle situation. What does this say about how you think they're going to look at the draft and what do you think they actually have achieved in free agency?
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Patrick Finley
Not a lot. I think that they've made their defense more in the likeness of Dennis Allen. I think when you look at linebacker and safety, those, the speed there and the versatility there is what Dennis Allen wanted to do when he got to Chicago and really was unable to do because Kyler Gordon got hurt, Jaylen Johnson got hurt. You know, he was kind of da. Was kind of holding on for dear life most of the year because of the injuries. Now I think this looks a lot more like a Dennis Allen defense. But now on paper, are they any better than they were a month ago? No, they might be worse. But, you know, if you look forward to the draft now, maybe, you know, the best thing they did in the first wave of free agency is get that second round pick for DJ Moore. And now I think you're looking at drafting the lines in the first and second round. Maybe all three of those are, you know, in some order. Defensive end, defensive tackle, offensive tackle.
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Dan Bernstein
You still think they would go defensive tackle? We were looking at it yesterday and I do see a lot of guys, you know, you, you, you see Kentavious Street's name there, Neville Gallimore and James lynch, and there, there isn't a name here that would preclude the use of a, even a first round pick on a defensive tackle. I'm just not quite sure how their board is set up with prioritization of who might fall to them there.
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Patrick Finley
Yeah, and, you know, if James lynch is the thing that keeps you from drafting a tackle, like, shame on you. I don't think that's going to be the case. I think that they have enough depth at all those spots. I mean, shoot, Braxton Jones shouldn't keep you from drafting an offensive tackle either. They have enough depth at all three of those positions, positions that if they have to pivot, if the board doesn't fall their way, I guess they could. You know, the dirty little secret about draft time is everybody talks about taking best available, and best available often lines up with the guy who you need the most. And, and I think that that's what we're looking at. One of the cases when it didn't and when you saw GM actually pivot and go a different direction was with Luther Burton last year. And the Bears, I would argue, are reaping the benefits of that now, is that there's no way they trade DJ Moore and get that too, unless they find Luther Burton in a position where they really didn't last season. So maybe they do that again. I would hope that they stick to what they need. I keep getting back to this. The last defensive player the Bears drafted was in round one was Roquan Smith in 2018. That is a long, long time ago. And when we wonder why this defense, you know, can't be sustainable when we look at, you know, every stat but takeaways. Last year considered the Bears a bottom third defense in the NFL. And if we wonder why that is, part of it is you're not devoting draft resources to them the way that you've been doing on offense. I think it's about time that they start doing that.
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Dan Bernstein
I found it fascinating that with all of the turnovers and the gaudy interception numbers that they had that that propped up a defense that was prone to getting gashed, that the main providers of those advantages are gone. And Nishan Wright and Kevin Byard, who both had spectacular seasons, were allowed to parlay those numbers into greener pastures for themselves elsewhere. Kobe Bryant, the main splash is the free safety as he's listed. Cam Lewis, also from Buffalo, is there. There really had to be an investment and a trust in Dennis Allen to say, you know what you're doing, Tell us who's not good enough, tell us what you need. And I imagine in the film work, when they went back, they say, yeah, they had all these interceptions, but it wasn't enough to outweigh the number of times that they, they weren't fast enough to stay with receivers or versatile enough to properly disguise how they wanted to stay with receivers. Is that right?
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Patrick Finley
Yeah, I think that's fair. And you heard Ryan Paul say it a couple of weeks ago that starting with the first Packer game, it was clear to them that their defense wasn't fast enough. And if you go back to that game, I think at the end of the first half, you know, there's, you know, in my mind's eye, I can see a Packers receiver streaking across the middle of the field for a 40 something yard touchdown. Because as good as Nishan Wright was, as big as he was, he's the biggest corner. I think he's tied for the tallest corner in the history of football. He. He wasn't a runner with who like
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Dan Bernstein
David Fulcher or somebody. I'm trying to remember.
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Patrick Finley
I know I don't. It's. I think they're like three guys. I wish I could Pull that I cannot. And, you know, as good as Jaquan Brisker, I thought played the best game he's ever played in the last game he played with the Bears. But nobody's going to mistake him for being a quick safety. Not that you necessarily need that at free safety, but they needed an upgrade in speed, and I think that that is. Well, I know that, you know, that's what brought them to Bush at linebacker. That's what brought them to Kobe Bryant at safety. And now you wonder they still need probably another corner. Unless you want to invest in Tyreek Stevenson some more. They need another safety. That's a place they could go in that draft. As much as I'd like them to draft the lines early, you could convince me that a safety, you know, in the late first round makes sense, you know, but the focus there is going
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Dan Bernstein
to be on speed, couple big pieces. I need to know before making some of these decisions is, is Jalen Johnson this year going to be the Jalen Johnson that we saw two seasons ago? Because if he's the guy who came back last year, they've got a major problem because he couldn't run. He was bad, and he was still hurt. I'd also like to know that Terrell Smith can get back on the trajectory where he was trending to be one of these guys who was ready to be a starter elsewhere. They were finding series for him, and then was the first big injury they had in training camp. So how is Johnson? How is Smith?
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Patrick Finley
Well, Johnson was the first to say last year when he came back that he wasn't 100% and that he didn't feel like he was a very good football player. So you would hope that. That recovery, you know, it's pretty major groin injury, you know, twice in. In two months. You would hope that that recovery goes well? We'll see. I mean, age catches up to people in the NFL very, very quickly. And I would hope for Jalen's sake and for the Bear's sake that it hasn't quite gotten there yet. You know, Jalen was saying even. Even at the end of last year, Jalen was saying, listen, I am not myself. I'm just trying to hang on here and help where I can. And with Smitty, I mean, I feel like with Terrell Smith, we say this every year, that he's, you know, his build is great for this Dennis Allen defense. It's kind of like Nishan Wright. He's big. He can get into you at the line of scrimmage, but he. He Gets hurt a lot. And again, you know, if you're sitting here in March, the question is, who can we count on? I'm not sure you can count on Terrell Smith and for different reasons, I don't know if you can count on Tyreek Stevenson. And because of that, I wouldn't be shocked if they end up with another competitor cornerback in the draft.
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Dan Bernstein
Who's the third wide receiver right now because Khalif Raymond is. It looks like he profiles more as return guy, fourth wide receiver in that Devin Duvernay role. And with Alamade Zakias gone, are they ready to give Jade Walker that job as his to lose?
- [10:20]
Patrick Finley
I don't know about his to lose. I think they're willing to give him a long look at it though. And you know, they talked about this last year. They could have cut him at any point at the end of training camp, during training camp, in the early weeks of the season and tried to get him back on the practice squad. But they were convinced that he would be gobbled up by somebody and they liked him too much to do that. You know, most of the season he is, you know, active or he's on the 53 man roster and not really playing. But they stashed him thinking that they had something. I, I would rather him get hit 60 times than Khalif Raymond get hit 60 times. Just given the body type Raymond is, you know, if you saw Raymond walking down the street, he doesn't look like a football player. He is a, you know, he's a little scat back sort of return man. And I think that it may not be Jades to lose, but I think he's going to get a long look there. I would hesitate if I were them giving anybody that unproven, you know, the keys to the car in the off season without having some, you know, fairly serious competition for him. I don't know whether that's Raymond, honestly. You know, you would have said last year that, well, he knows Ben's system and that's beneficial and he comes in with an advantage. But everybody knows Ben's system now. And I think that, you know, whatever sort of edge he has from that experience isn't what it would have been, you know, if we were in Ben's first year.
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Dan Bernstein
Still. I don't like the options at left tackle. I understand why they're doing what they're doing and it might make more sense if they have if they there was a draft pick out there that was going to develop or if they were declaring that Darnell Wright Was the left tackle. They try somebody else at right. What's the larger conclusion if there is one about what tackle means to Ben Johnson. If and he. And he. There's plenty of lip service like, you know, block your guy and keep our quarterback clean. But it certainly appears that the urgency at guard, center, guard was obvious and tackle is lacking a similar urgency.
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Patrick Finley
I go back to Drew Brees, I really do and you know, the whole idea when he went to New Orleans was that Drew is short and Drew need. And because Drew is short, you need to protect him up the middle before you even start worrying about the tackles. And say what you will about Caleb Williams, Caleb Williams is short. And I think that there is a emphasis being put on protecting him in the middle. That said, if there had been, I mean, I mean right now, Joe Tunney could walk away today and knock on wood, Lord knows Bears offensive linemen apparently tend to do that. Joe Tuning could walk away today and he'd be one of the best, I don't know, half dozen guards in the history of the sport. If the Bears could have gotten one of the best half dozen tackles in the history of the sport in a trade last year, they would have done it. And I think that the lack of a less tackle is more relative to the fact that the opportunities to get one just don't come along the way they do an offensive guard. That said, I mean Braxton Jones is a late round draft pick. You know, Charles Leno before him, late round draft pick. The Bears have not devoted draft resources to one of the foremost important positions in the sport. And you know, Ozzy Trapillo was kind of them putting their toe in the water and actually doing that. And then, you know, he had one of the worst injuries that you could have. So. And I'll be curious to see whether in, in round one or two they go with left tackle. If they do, if they draft somebody 25th, that guy is your starting left tackle on day one. He has to be be, you know, beyond that, you know, you're just adding more guys to a con to a competition that, you know, maybe Ozzy's your answer in two years but you can't count on that either.
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Dan Bernstein
I look at running back and I something about me is always trying to replace DeAndre Swift for some reason as good as he's been and he's, he's answered every challenge here. You get Kyle Menungai out of nowhere and yet it is a young man's position. That is a spot where you get somebody in the draft and every Single year. By the time we get to mid season there are a bunch of fresh legged kids who end up making an impact. I don't know if Ben Johnson has a role for a third back. I don't know if he is as and I know when the season started Swift was bad and they and he got a lot better and he began to hit the hole harder, he began to run more decisively. They're not married to Roshan Johnson in a way that maybe the some of the previous regime was. I don't know what has been seen in Roshan Johnson that it just somehow not manifesting itself on the field but are we going to see a young set of legs in this mix?
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Patrick Finley
The leading rusher among Bears running backs beyond the two you mentioned last year was a guy named Britain Brown and he had five carries and that was on a day in Cincinnati when DeAndre Swift didn't go and that was the Kyle Manunga game. Remember when he ran for a billion
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Dan Bernstein
yards against it was Loveland catch.
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Patrick Finley
Yes, yes, but against one of the worst rush defenses at the time in the literal history of the sport. So if there's room for a third running back, Ben didn't show it last year. Now you could argue maybe a couple of those D.J. moore carries could turn into something you give a third running back and that makes sense. I, I don't blame you for being a little cynical about DeAndre Swift. And it's because the year before we saw DeAndre Swift be not good at all. I mean one of you know, a hindrance to his team, not a help. And I think right now drafting a third running back and trying to develop them to take Swift's place in a year, I think that's a luxury and I don't know if the Bears roster wise are at the point where they can be spending, you know, high draft picks on a third receiver or a third running back or a third tight end, even though it may help fill out the roster further down the line.
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Dan Bernstein
We saw that Durham Smythe decided to follow his nominal offensive coordinator Declan Doyle to the Baltimore Ravens and he played a lot. I know that's not a name that we heard called a lot, but the number of times the bears were in 13 personnel and the deployment of Durham Smythe, as you know, we used to call it an H back where it's a hybrid position of tight end and fullback, allowing you to be in an eye formation with your hand on the ground to motion into that, to motion out of it. Could they also open up the Possibility of however you want to say third tight end as somebody who has been more of a fullback profile type, more of this idealized sort of Kyle use check or the last time they had their Kari Blassing game. And I'm not saying necessarily hand him the ball are all isolation blocks. But if it's going to be a hybrid position anyway, does that give you some flexibility in how you're going to staff it?
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Patrick Finley
I wonder if it's going to be a hybrid position if you don't just put Theo Benedict there. Quite honestly, you know, he's somebody who was used as an extra blocker a lot. Maybe, maybe there's some version of, of Theo Benedict coming in and playing 15 downs a game as that third tight end. I still think they'll end up with somebody else to compete. I think what Stephen Carlson is still
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Dan Bernstein
on this roster is that the Dan Skipper kind of job that in Detroit.
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Patrick Finley
Yeah.
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Dan Bernstein
That we're talking about. Okay.
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Patrick Finley
Yeah, maybe.
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Dan Bernstein
Yeah.
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Patrick Finley
Less fun than they had with Dan Skipper. But yeah, I think I want to say late in the year, I mean they threw a ball to Theo Benedict that he dropped and he is, he is super athletic and somebody who, I think when they need an extra blocker they could do that. Also that, you know, that, that the blocking tight end job, I don't know whether you give it to a fullback, but it's also one where they're going to be a lot of those available even after the draft. You know, if you want to bring in a veteran or two, I think you can find that position, you know, as late as cut day during training camp. And you know, so long as they know how to pick up a playbook, you know, maybe it makes sense doing it that late.
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Dan Bernstein
I know you got to get rolling. You have important things and responsibilities that you have to do. Today you are volunteering. You know, you have the famous Lunch Lady Doris we know from Springfield in the grade school there. I don't know if you can be Lunch Lady Doris, but I just want you to make sure that these students are happy, well fed and prepared for the second half of their day in their studies.
- [19:08]
Patrick Finley
Yeah. As long as they don't throw food at each other at my kids school, I'll be a happy man. And I appreciate the Simpsons reference. I have an 11 year old and that is the language we speak to each other.
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Dan Bernstein
I believe. Lunch Lady Doris favorite. I remember when she's, she's holding up, she's filling a vat with like horse testicles and she says extra iron, more testicles means more iron.
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Patrick Finley
More iron. Yes. Very good, Very good.
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Dan Bernstein
So go get him. Patrick Finley, our guest, always a pleasure to have him on from the Chicago Sun Times covering the Bears and the NFL. Fun stuff. And this is the type of Bears fan where it may seem like nothing is going on, but all hell is about to break loose soon as we're we're taking our break watching a little bit of college basketball to take our mind off our Bears draft homework. But we're still doing this. Did you see this quote, by the way, from Kobe Bryant? Because I didn't think about this possibility from then. The new Bears safety was asked on, I think it was NFL Network about the Bears schedule has a game at Seattle. So the Bears are on Seattle's home schedule. Of course, we know Seattle will have their ring day, their ring ceremony for that first game and it might work out well if one of their players happens to be there. So could we see the opening game being Bears at Seattle? And what Bryant said was I wouldn't mind starting the season off there, honestly. Weather will be nice, the whole world will be watching. And it would be matching up the game that we never got to see. And I'm glad we didn't get to see it because I said it at the time and I believe it now, that Seattle would have embarrassed this Bears team and it would have been a massive upset win because I just don't think that this year's team was quite ready for that. But yeah, bring it. Make it the Seahawks and the Bears, Week one, kick it off. Make the Bears prove it on that very, very first night. I have absolutely no problem with that. Looking around the league a little bit, there are a lot of people paying attention, especially here in the NFC north about the quarterback situation now that Carson Wentz has returned to the Minnesota Vikings and what is going on on their depth chart. We left out a name when we were talking about it yesterday because the they've had last year, JJ McCarthy, Sam Howell, Brett Rippon. And what I don't like about this situation is there the speculation has been it looks like it's Kyler Murray's job, but they're setting up McCarthy to have an opportunity to take it from him. And they want to use this as a test of his competitiveness and they don't know if he's got the makeup to handle this. So they're going to use this, this crucible of this competition to try to forge Stronger Steel in JJ McCarthy. Good luck to you. I know that you're putting a lot on the plate of Kevin o'. Connell. The speculation here from Pro Football Talk. He says with Murray becoming the carrot for McCarthy, Wentz is now the stick because he needs had to have multiple quarterbacks ready to go. Will McCarthy remain committed if he lands on the bench behind Murray, or does he count the games until he gets a fresh start elsewhere? And man, if you didn't figure that out already, if you didn't, if you haven't, if you're still playing psychological games to try to get the most out of JJ McCarthy, how is that a proper use of your time? Isn't that just heat loss right now? If that's your world, like, well, I don't know it's going to take to this competition. You're trying to win games right now. Why don't you just make Kyler Murray your starter and not worry about J.J. mcCarthy? And I just, I don't mind a little bit of quarterback stress elsewhere in the division. It would bother me more and frighten me more as, as a Bears observer, if somebody said, look, it's Kyler Murray and he's the number one right here. If he's hurt, we'll figure out who to play next. They can battle it out and it privately, you can let JJ McCarthy prove himself as to whether or not he can be the number two. So I guess it's my way of saying that it's. A Bears fan can look at another team having all of these quarterback issues and just kind of enjoy. I guess we're, we're allowed every once in a while to do that. And also, have you been following as little as I have and I can't get into this, but the idea of all of the negotiations for all the television rights for football, I know this is part of our lives that we are absolutely going to have to reconcile and we're just going to have to make peace with the difficulty in finding some games. And I don't want to be old guy with this thing. I'm looking at what's happening in baseball right now. We have not cut the cord yet, which is kind of stupid because our situation at home is a weird one. We've created this, this bizarre TV monster that we have because I'm not giving up my DirecTV and it's, it's my psychological problem that I just, I need to say something is on TV or it's not on tv. I don't look at the TV as this blank canvas and I can put anything on it I want at any time. I know I'm Going to get there, kind of. But I didn't grow up like that and I struggle a little bit. But we still have. We're still paying for all the. Everything else and it's going to be increasingly difficult and they're going to start moving things to other tiers. I just have a generalized anxiety about it, about where things are going to be. The one, the DirecTV seems to help. It seems to help if you, you know, assemble fellow olds where I can. I can figure out where it is, I will be able to find it. I'll be. And I. And I have trouble flipping. Also, my DirecTV package is so ancient that even the people at DirecTV don't know what to do with it when I say, because I've never had red zone. And they don't quite know why I don't have red zone because I have other things I'm not supposed to have. I don't have any package. I don't have anything. It's. But they have. I can't use the term grandfathered in anymore. That's. That has been canceled. It's legacy. My DirecTV package has been legacied in and it just kind of. They said, leave it. You got a great rate. Just don't touch it. We don't know what the hell it is. Don't poke it, don't, don't. Something might drop off or pop on. Just. Just kind of ride with it. So that's where I am. It's not a comfortable position to be in, but I still need the idea of either something is on TV or it's not. As much as I get made fun of, but I am. I do get a little worried with every next contract that comes up with the NFL that I'm going to have to confront rearranging everything and becoming terribly confused. It's like when they rearrange the grocery store without asking me and they need to ask me. And like the last time they did that and I panicked and I almost just sort of sat down in the middle of the grocery store and threw a tantrum and said, change it back to the way it was because now you're messing me all up. But it's inevitable it's going to happen. But my daughter was making fun of me because I was flipping on the channels the other night and she said, dad, what are you doing? Because I was kind of grumpy. I'm like, ah, there's nothing good on. She said, what do you mean there's nothing good on? Like the entire concept of there's nothing good on. Didn't mean anything to her. She said, watch what you want. I said, I don't know. I like to flip. Maybe, you know, it's another time I'll watch the end of my Cousin Vinnie or the middle act of Shawshank or something, or there'll be a college basketball game that's interesting to me because it's fun. That's just what I do. You flip and it's fun and you find things and you find something you wouldn't otherwise find. You run into a nature documentary or something, and you cede that control to forces beyond yours. And she's like, ted, you can get YouTube. Put something on. Whatever you feel like watching, put it on. And then I got incredibly anxious. I couldn't deal with the fact that I could watch anything. And then I realized it was the same feeling that I got when they created those yum brands. Pizza Pizza, Taco Hut or no, Pizza Chicken Hut. Remember those? It was kfc, Taco Bell, and Pizza Hut all at one drive through. And I couldn't handle it. I didn't even know I couldn't drive close to it. The entire concept freaked me out. The idea of it existing freaked me out. I didn't know what to do. And I think that's kind of what happened when she said, just put on whatever you want. And I said, no, I think it's probably good for you. And she's like, don't say it's good for me. I said, no, honey, I think it's good for you to have to flip channels and then make a decision about what you're gonna leave on. And then you may find something you wouldn't have otherwise found that you would find interesting, and you can expand your horizons in that way. And then she said, you're not going to expand your horizons. You're going to flip until you see, like, Blades of Glory or something, and you're going to watch it again, that you're looking to actively not expand your horizons. So don't give me some kind of lecture about how you want to see yourself and excuse your basic laziness and try to make it about a parenting lesson. And I said, I don't appreciate being so easily dissected that quickly and that easily, and. And. And just left here in complete defeat. And she had already left the room by the time I was done with that sentence. So I don't know if that's either here or there, but welcome to my life in that regard. I just know that when it comes to football games. Being able to find everything on your terms. Like. Like DirecTV is set for the NCAA tournament. Man 2 45, 2 46, 47. Everything is right in order. It is packed in there and then here in the office they got us on whatever this is and I got in the remote's all weird and it's like being at my parents house except the subtitles aren't on so I'm all screwed up and that's that. And that is going to be Forward Progress, a Chicago Bears and NFL podcast. We thank Patrick Finley for joining us. We thank Dan Zampillo for stepping in and being a producer today. Thanks for hanging with us. And next week is going to be we're rocking and rolling. Maddie is off all next week. The guests that we have lined up, the other things that we're going to be doing on both DBU and on FP and even owc. Jason's going to be home so it's going to be a full contact. Organizations win championships where we get to punch each other and bother each other and he tries to give me wet willies and I elbow him in the neck. So we're going to do that. But it's going to be very sort of longer format interviewee and guesty next week as the as the tournament continues and rolls on. So we're looking forward to that. Thanks for hanging. Have a great first weekend of spring. We will talk to you on Monday on Forward Progress. Chicago Bears podcast on 312 Sports.
- [31:47]
Patrick Finley
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