Founders Podcast — In-Depth with Todd Graves (Raising Cane’s)

Host: David Senra
Guest: Todd Graves
Date: November 9, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode features an extended conversation between David Senra, host of Founders, and Todd Graves, founder and CEO of Raising Cane’s. The discussion is a masterclass in the mindset and methods of a modern founder who’s built a $20B restaurant business with relentless focus, radical simplicity, and enduring purpose.
Listeners are treated to an inside look at the challenge, philosophy, and fanatical drive it takes to create—and keep—an iconic brand.
Todd breaks down his entrepreneurial journey, including the risks, near-catastrophes, hands-on management, and philosophical lessons learned over 30 years of relentless, undistracted execution.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Founder’s Mindset: Obsession, Sleep, and Business as Life

• Entrepreneurial Obsession and Sleep Patterns

  • Todd describes how his work obsessions disrupt his sleep, a trait he and other founders share with icons like Jiro (sushi chef), Michael Ferrero, and Leonardo del Vecchio.

  • He often sleeps erratically because his brain is working on solutions even at night; sometimes he wakes up and works immediately (01:13).

  • Quote:

    “I just have a really erratic sleep… what really dictates it is what I have going on in business... My brain will be working as I'm sleeping… I'll actually wake up pretty refreshed thinking about, you know, that problem I had and then go jump on the computer in my underwear.”
    — Todd Graves (01:13)

• Historical Patterns in Founder Behavior

  • David and Nathan discuss biographies where founders literally dream their way to breakthroughs. It’s a recurring archetype: obsession, persistence, inability to “turn off” at night (02:27).

2. Radical Simplicity: Single Focus, Craveability, and Doing One Thing Well

• Rejecting Bad Advice:

  • Conventional wisdom said a “chicken-fingers-only” concept would never work in Louisiana; “veto votes” (i.e., worry about people wanting variety) dominated fast-food thinking.
  • Todd doubled down after seeing In-N-Out’s singular focus; In-N-Out reinforced his belief that specialization and consistency build cult-like customer loyalty (03:30–05:52).

• Quote:

  “You have to focus on doing one thing and do it better than anybody else. Some people call it a simple menu. I say, well, it's not simple, it's focus… our chicken has to be exactly right… it's not a simple thing, we can focus on those things.”
  — Todd Graves (08:09)

• Craveability as the Core Metric:

  • Quality and consistency are non-negotiable; “death by a thousand cuts” occurs if quality is compromised for cost savings.

  • Every detail is engineered for repeat business—a “craveable” experience (09:22).

  • Quote:

    “If you cut that quality… you start cutting a little bit here, a little bit there, it's death by a thousand cuts. Then your food one day is not craveable. That's what's happened to so many quick service chains over the years.”
    — Todd Graves (10:34)

3. The Power of Refusal and Proving the Doubters Wrong

• Opposition as Fuel

  • Todd explains that being told “no” is rocket fuel for entrepreneurs.

  • Early business plan for Raising Cane’s got a B- from his professor with the comment that the “concept won’t work,” which only motivated him more (14:00–26:46).

  • Quote:

    “The best thing for a aspiring entrepreneur to be told is, I don’t think that’s a good idea… Your first thought immediately is, you know what? I’m going to prove it to you.”
    — Todd Graves (14:00)

• Entrepreneurial Fanaticism

  • After hundreds of rejections by banks, Todd worked extreme jobs—boilermaker and Alaskan fishing—to fund his dream, risking his life to save capital.
  • “Retreat is not an option.” He even held a campfire “oath” with his partner to promise never to stop, win or fail (31:56–34:34).

4. Growth, Scaling Pain, and Staying in the Details

• No Work/Life Balance at the Start

  • “You don’t have quality of life and work-life balance when starting a business. Flat out, you don’t.” (17:43)
  • Built the first store by hand, did all the plumbing/construction except electrical (20:16).

• Staying Close to Customers and Crew

  • Todd still works in-store shifts, values hands-on work, and expects his corporate staff to understand frontline realities (55:10, 63:53).
  • The original store is a “sacred” example; every detail has a story and a reason (56:00).

5. Financing by Sheer Grit—and the Katrina Crisis

• The insane founding story:

  • Multiple angel investors were boilermaker co-workers (“Wild Bill”), odd jobs, and maxed-out high-interest credit cards. Eventually got an SBA loan after two years of grinding (26:41, 52:55–54:23).

• Scaling to 28 Stores, Leveraging to the Hilt

  • Series of community bank loans and subordinated debt (“sub-debt” deals) to keep equity while funding expansion; incredibly risky, but leveraged early cash flow (105:37).

• Hurricane Katrina nearly ends it all:

  • "21 out of the 28 [stores] were down … no cash coming in… I had the company levered to the hilt."
  • Reopened before any competitors, which created huge goodwill and enduring new customers. But the lesson: “Never again” on overleveraging; now keeps highly conservative financial ratios (110:59).

6. Never Sell Out: The Founder’s Imperative and Purpose

• The Case Against Selling

  • Todd rails against “start, scale, sell” culture; warns that selling to private equity kills soul, quality, and crew culture.

  • Shares lessons from Trader Joe’s and Kinko’s founders, both of whom regretted selling (36:59–47:48).

  • Quote:

    “If I sold the business, what happens to my management who support their families?… If you lose that founder personal [touch], decisions get made differently… It’s personal to them.”
    — Todd Graves (39:30)

• Focus on Purpose, Not Dollars

  • For Todd, business is about giving, not gaining—“it’s not what you make, it’s what you give. That’s a better way to keep score.”
  • Admires anti-business billionaires: Dyson, Jobs, Chouinard—all obsessed with product excellence and keeping control (47:48, 49:08).

7. On Delegation and Staying in the Details

• Delegation Is Not Abdication

  • Todd challenges advice that founders should delegate themselves out of the details.

  • “If I can do it at 95 out of 100, hiring someone who can only do it at 85 means I need to supplement them until they get to 95 or higher” (78:54).

  • Details are the magic, what creates the emotion around a brand—lose the details, and you lose everything (82:46).

  • Quote:

    “Details matter. Walt Disney said, ‘If we lose the details, we lose everything.’ These are not afterthoughts… This is what makes the magic.”
    — David Senra (82:46)

8. Company-Owned Over Franchising

• Rejected Franchising Model
  • Early on, Todd experimented with franchising for expansion, but franchisees never matched the operational standard or flexibility of company stores (92:07).
  • Bought back all franchises; company-owned stores ultimately result in much higher company valuation and maintain culture/quality.
  • “For me… the company model just rules.” (95:59)

9. Culture, Intrinsic Motivation, and Crew Development

• Positive, Hands-On Culture

  • “Praise costs nothing and means everything” (60:37).
  • Respect, recognition, and reward for crew: holidays off, peer-signed hard hats, salmon tokens, point-based rewards (67:01).
  • “It is 100% heart, man. If you’re intrinsically motivated to do really well” (62:59).

• Leadership Example:

  • Les Schwab (tire company) as a business hero: insists management must always stay close to staff and customers; “take my name off the business if you’re not going to run it this way” (65:26).

10. Fanaticism as the Founding Virtue

• You Cannot “Out-Compete” the Fanatic
  • “If you want to come compete with me, just understand, I’m on this 24/7 all the time.” (38:23)
  • Same mentality as elite athletes, musicians, and fighters: obsessive preparation, emotional connection, and intensity (38:29).
  • The best founders are “mildly obsessive-compulsive” (103:15).

Notable Quotes (with Timestamps and Attribution)

• “If you cut that quality… it’s death by a thousand cuts. Then your food one day is not craveable.”
  — Todd Graves (10:34)

• “Retreat is not an option. Burn the ships. We are going to succeed or I'm going to… you will know when I give up, because I will be dead.”
  — Nathan Latka, referencing Elon Musk (34:21)

• “Fanaticism is what carries you through… nothing ever happens unless someone pursues a vision fanatically.”
  — Todd Graves (34:34)

• “If we lose the details, we lose everything.”
  — Walt Disney (cited by David Senra) (82:46)

• “For me, business is... what you give. That’s a better way to keep score.”
  — Todd Graves (39:30)

• “Most franchisees are at 85 out of 100, but we need to be at 95... For me, the company model just rules.”
  — Todd Graves (95:59)

• “The distracted do not beat the focused.”
  — Nathan Latka (90:25)

• “Do something you love and you’ll never work a day in your life. It’s a passion, it’s just what you do.”
  — Todd Graves (99:14)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• [01:13] — Obsession, sleep, and working through business anxiety.
• [03:30–06:54] — Inspiration from In-N-Out and radical menu focus.
• [08:09–10:34] — Why “simple” is really singular focus; craveability as the core.
• [14:00] — Being told “no” and how it spurs founders.
• [26:41–34:34] — Wild jobs for funding; the fanatic’s oath and commitment.
• [52:55–54:23] — How Todd financed the first store (credit cards, SBA, “Wild Bill”).
• [105:37–112:53] — How he financed up to 28 stores; Katrina catastrophe and the never-again rule on financial leverage.
• [36:59–47:48] — Founders who regret selling: Trader Joe’s and Kinko’s stories.
• [67:01] — Building a “Kane’s Love Department” and crew culture.
• [78:54] — The real meaning of delegation and staying in the details.

Memorable Anecdotes & Themes

• Todd reconstructed the original Raising Cane’s location by hand—plumbing, murals, construction, imbuing the space with history and soul. (20:16)
• Used “sub-debt” and community bank loans to explosively scale — a move that nearly cost him everything after Hurricane Katrina.
• Holds quarterly town-hall–like meetings in stores to pull feedback from employees, keeping hierarchy flat and the vibe communal (22:14).
• Bemoans how investor-driven “start, scale, sell” culture robs founders and customers of meaning and magic.
• Company departments are built around “love,” including a recognition and points system for crew members.
• The franchise vs. company-owned dilemma: bought back all the franchises to keep quality, control, and culture.

Lessons for Aspiring and Working Founders

• Focus, then focus more: Don’t diversify until your core offering is unbeatable.
• Quality is non-negotiable: Never cut for short-term margin.
• Obsession is an entrepreneurial virtue: The best founders are fanatics.
• Delegate only after mastery: Supplement others until they reach (or exceed) your standards.
• Never abdicate learning: Stay in the details—“the magic is in the minutiae.”
• Find your ‘why’: Make purpose—not profit—your scoring system.
• Hold the line: Resist the temptation to sell; don’t bring in partners whose goals are not aligned.

Final Reflections

Todd Graves’s conversation is a rallying cry for devotion, craft, and founder control. He makes it clear—through vivid personal stories and philosophy—that enduring companies are always built by the obsessed, and that love, detail, and refusal to compromise are the ultimate competitive advantages.

“Nothing ever happens unless someone pursues a vision fanatically.” — Todd Graves (34:34)

For listeners eager to internalize the lessons of history’s greatest entrepreneurs, this episode is both a blueprint and an inspiration.