Podcast
Fourth Estate
Hosted by 2SER · EN
Every week, we discuss how the media has covered the news and analyse issues affecting the industry - with some of the biggest names in journalism in Australia and around the world. Broadcast live on Sydney's 2SER 107.3FM, with the financial assistance of the Community Broadcasting Foundation.
20episodes
Episodes
Newest firstAll episodes
The Stories We Tell Ourselves: China, America and Australian Self-Reliance
Yesterday01:08:24Tap to summarizeFor decades, China was seen in Australia as an opportunity. Today, it's more often described as a threat. But how much of Australia's understanding of China reflects reality — and how much is shaped by the stories we tell ourselves? As Prime Minister Anthony Albanese speaks of an "ideological disagreement" with the United States, and as global tensions expose vulnerabilities in supply chains and energy security, a broader question is emerging: is Australia prepared to think more independently about its place in the world? This week, Fourth Estate examines the media narratives, strategic assumptions and political debates that have come to define Australia's relationship with its largest trading partner. Host Tina Quinn speaks with former Labor leader and University of Canberra Vice-Chancellor Bill Shorten about Australia's fuel security, sovereign capabilities and what self-reliance might look like in an increasingly uncertain world. Then, a panel featuring Professor Wanning Sun (University of Technology Sydney and a frequent contributor to Crikey), Peter Hartcher (Political and International Editor, The Sydney Morning Herald and The Age) and Ben Doherty (Senior Reporter, Guardian Australia) explores how China is framed in Australian media, the influence of the United States on Australian foreign policy, and whether Australia's assumptions about alliances, security and sovereignty need rethinking. Are we seeing China clearly — or through the lens of geopolitics, fear and strategic rivalry? And as the balance of global power shifts, what does Australian self-reliance actually look like? Get in touch, we'd love to hear from you! Tell us your thoughts and email us at fourthestate@2ser.com. You can also tweet us at @fourthestateau. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →Sarah Wilson on Complexity, Collapse and Making Art in the Apocalypse
1w ago01:07:26Tap to summarizeSarah Wilson has lived through almost every era of modern media — from becoming a newspaper columnist in her early 20s, to editing Cosmopolitan magazine and hosting MasterChef Australia, writing bestselling books, podcasting and independent publishing. But in recent years, her focus has shifted toward much bigger questions: how do we live meaningfully in an age of ecological crisis, political instability, information overload and growing civilisational anxiety? In this conversation with Tina Quinn, Sarah discusses her new book, I Eat the Stars, why she believes our resistance to societal collapse needs to evolve, and why making art, finding beauty and embracing uncertainty may be more important than ever. They also discuss why Australian media often struggles to grapple with complexity, the pressures of the modern attention economy, and how Sarah’s own long and unconventional career has shaped the way she now thinks about journalism, culture and the path forward. Get in touch, we'd love to hear from you and 2SER needs you! Head to love2SER.com and tell us your thoughts, or email us at fourthestate@2ser.com. You can also tweet us at @fourthestateau. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →One From the Archives: Sophie McNeill and We Can't Say We Didn't Know
2w ago00:42:17Tap to summarizeAs the war in Gaza continues — and journalists covering the conflict are being killed at unprecedented rates — we return to the Fourth Estate archives for a conversation that now feels more urgent than ever. In this 2020 interview, former ABC Middle East correspondent Sophie McNeill joins then-Fourth Estate host Sharon Davis to discuss McNeill’s book We Can’t Say We Didn’t Know: Dispatches From An Age Of Impunity and the years she spent reporting from Gaza, Yemen, Syria and Iraq. Together, Sophie and Sharon unpack the realities of frontline journalism: documenting war crimes, navigating questions of objectivity and advocacy, and bearing witness to immense human suffering in an era increasingly defined by impunity. The conversation also revisits the extraordinary case of Rahaf Mohammed, the young Saudi woman whose plea for asylum led Sophie to fly to Bangkok — sparking an international story that blurred the lines between reporting and intervention. Listening back now, the interview is striking not only for how sharply it anticipated many of today’s debates around war reporting and press freedom, but also for the insight it offers into the convictions that would later draw Sophie away from journalism and toward international human rights advocacy and a career in politics. This episode was originally broadcast in March, 2020. Get in touch, we'd love to hear from you and 2SER needs you! Head to love2SER.com and tell us your thoughts, or email us at fourthestate@2ser.com. You can also tweet us at @fourthestateau. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →Red Scares: The Budget and the Backlash
3w ago01:04:20Tap to summarizeFrom accusations of “broken promises” to cries of socialism, class warfare and even communism, the media reaction to the Albanese Government’s federal budget has been fierce. But how radical are the reforms actually being proposed? This week, Tina Quinn examines the political and media framing surrounding the budget — from the rhetoric around debt, aspiration and intergenerational burden, to the backlash over modest changes to negative gearing and capital gains tax concessions. First, Tina speaks with Ben English, editor of The Daily Telegraph, whose paper branded Treasurer Jim Chalmers’ budget a “big-taxing communist manifesto.” Then, a panel featuring Phil Coorey (Political Editor, Australian Financial Review), Shalailah Medhora from (Political Reporter for Hack, Triple J), Jason Koutsoukis (Special Correspondent, The Saturday Paper), and Kalila Welch (Cheek Media), unpack the politics, economics, lobbyists, scare campaigns and media narratives shaping the national debate. Is this meaningful reform — or moral panic? And if even soft changes provoke this level of outrage, what does that say about the future of economic reform in Australia? Get in touch, we'd love to hear from you and 2SER needs you! Head to love2SER.com and tell us your thoughts, or email us at fourthestate@2ser.com. You can also tweet us at @fourthestateau. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →Blunt Tools: Rate Rises and Media Tropes
May 701:00:45Tap to summarizeAre we asking enough questions about the way Australia manages inflation, and the way the media reports on it? Every Reserve Bank decision is treated like a national event. Interest rates rise, borrowers brace, and economists debate whether inflation expectations remain “anchored”. But has economic journalism become too narrowly framed around the logic of the Reserve Bank? And are governments escaping scrutiny as economic management is increasingly outsourced to unelected technocrats? Host Tina Quinn is joined by Stephen Long, Emilia Terzon and Hugh Riminton to discuss fiscal policy, media narratives around inflation, and who really bears the cost of fighting it. The panel also examines the proposed Seven West Media–Southern Cross Austereo merger, tensions surrounding Kerry Stokes’ influence over the company, looming restructures and job cuts at Nine News, and the fallout from the Kyle and Jackie O controversy at ARN. Plus, a reflection on the death of Ted Turner — the CNN founder who transformed television news through the advent of the 24-hour news cycle. We'd love to hear from you and 2SER needs you! Head to love2SER.com and tell us your thoughts, or email us at fourthestate@2ser.com. You can also tweet us at @fourthestateau Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →A Woman Who Won: Antoinette Lattouf on Taking on the ABC — and Winning
Apr 3000:49:06Tap to summarizeIn December 2023, Australia’s national broadcaster made the decision to dismiss one of its radio presenters, claiming she had brought the Australian Broadcasting Corporation into disrepute after sharing a social media post from Human Rights Watch highlighting atrocities in Gaza. Within hours, The Australian had reported on her removal. But it was her decision to challenge the dismissal in court that turned the story into a national flashpoint. In June 2025, Antoinette Lattouf won that battle — with the Federal Court finding she had been unlawfully dismissed and ordering the ABC to pay compensation. On this episode of Fourth Estate, Lattouf sits down with Tina Quinn to discuss her new book Women Who Win. She reflects on the women who inspired it, her own experience taking on one of the country’s most powerful media institutions, and what her case reveals about journalism, power, and the limits of speaking out. We'd love to hear from you and 2SER needs you! Head to love2SER.com and tell us your thoughts, or email us at fourthestate@2ser.com. You can also tweet us at @fourthestateau Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →2SER on the Brink and Remembering James Valentine
Apr 2300:38:55Tap to summarizeCommunity radio station 2SER could be off the air within months, after the withdrawal of long-standing university funding. In this episode of Fourth Estate, we examine how the station reached this point — from the timeline of key decisions to growing concerns from staff, volunteers and alumni about transparency and leadership. Former 2SER Program Director and Fourth Estate host Anthony Dockrill joins us to unpack what’s gone wrong — and whether the station can still be saved. We also pay tribute to beloved broadcaster James Valentine, who has died aged 64. We reflect on his remarkable career across radio, television and music, and the legacy he leaves behind, with former colleagues Sarah Macdonald and Mark Humphries. We'd love to hear from you and 2SER needs you! Head to love2SER.com and tell us your thoughts, or email us at fourthestate@2ser.com. You can also tweet us at @fourthestateau Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →Ben Roberts-Smith: How Journalism Took on a War Hero
Apr 900:54:57Tap to summarizeThis week, one of Australia’s most decorated soldiers, Ben Roberts-Smith, was arrested and charged with multiple counts of war crime murder. The charges follow years of investigative reporting by journalists at The Age and The Sydney Morning Herald — and a landmark defamation case that tested that reporting in court. In this episode of Fourth Estate, Tina Quinn speaks with two of the journalists behind the story, Nick McKenzie and Michael Bachelard about how the investigation was built — from sourcing and verification, to editorial decisions and legal risk. What does it take to report allegations of war crimes? And what does this case reveal about the power — and limits — of journalism in holding institutions to account? We'd love to hear from you! Email us at fourthestate@2ser.com or tweet us at @fourthestateau Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →Dispatches from the Picket Line: Behind the ABC Strike
Apr 300:44:49Tap to summarizeMore than 2,000 ABC staff walked off the job in the broadcaster’s first strike in 20 years. While the dispute centred on pay, progression and job security, it also exposed deeper concerns about culture, leadership and editorial independence. In this episode of Fourth Estate, Tina Quinn speaks with current and former ABC journalists, including Michael Slezak, Fran Kelly, Quentin Dempster, Emma Field and Scott Mitchell, to unpack what led to the strike — and what it reveals about the future of the organisation. We'd love to hear from you! Email us at fourthestate@2ser.com or tweet us at @fourthestateau Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →Profile: In Conversation with Virginia Trioli (Part 2)
Mar 2901:59:29Tap to summarize"She seems unaware of just how inexperienced she is," was how one media commentator described Virginia Trioli when she first took her place behind the microphone of the Drive program on 774 ABC Radio Melbourne. She had by that point more than a decade of experience as a journalist — but was still relatively new to the art of broadcasting. But Trioli was a quick study, and in the 25 years that followed, would establish herself as one of Australia’s most incisive and instinctive broadcasters, from the interview with Peter Reith that would earn her a Walkley Award, to her expansion into television, presenting Lateline, and her role as the foundation host of the now long-running ABC News Breakfast. As part of our ongoing profile series, the two-time Walkley Award winner joins Tina Quinn to reflect on those years in broadcasting — the interviews that defined her career, the evolution from radio to television, and the pressures that would ultimately lead her to step away from daily broadcasting. Virginia's 2024 memoir, A Bit on the Side: Reflections On What Makes Life Delicious, is published by Pan Macmillan. We'd love to hear from you! Email us at fourthestate@2ser.com or tweet us at @fourthestateau Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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