Freakonomics Radio Episode 624: "The Animal No One Loves, Until They Do"
Release Date: February 28, 2025
Host: Stephen Dubner
Guests: Jan Pinkova, Julia Zichello, Bethany Brookshire
Introduction
In episode 624 of Freakonomics Radio, Stephen Dubner delves into the complex and often misunderstood relationship humans have with rats. Contrary to their widespread negative reputation, this episode explores the nuanced roles rats play in our lives, from beloved pets to invaluable research subjects, and even as unexpected protagonists in popular culture.
Ratatouille: A Paradigm Shift in Portraying Rats
Guest: Jan Pinkova, co-creator of the animated film Ratatouille
Jan Pinkova provides an in-depth look at how Ratatouille redefines the image of rats in media. The film centers on Remy, a rat with a passion for cooking, who teams up with a human chef, Linguini, to create culinary masterpieces. Pinkova emphasizes that the film serves as an allegory for overcoming prejudice and embracing diversity.
- Notable Quote:
"[Ratatouille] is an allegory. It's not about rats and cooking, it's about prejudice. It's about overcoming the limitations imposed on you by misrepresentation, by misunderstanding."
(04:39)
Pinkova discusses the challenges of bringing a rat protagonist to life, highlighting the meticulous research conducted to portray rats authentically and sympathetically. She reflects on the film's success, noting its critical acclaim and massive box office returns as indicators of society's readiness to embrace a different narrative about rats.
Personal Encounters: Julia Zichello’s Relationship with Rats
Guest: Julia Zichello, Evolutionary Biologist at Hunter College
Julia Zichello shares her personal experiences with both wild and domesticated rats, offering a perspective that bridges scientific understanding and emotional connection. Her story begins with an unexpected encounter when wild rats infested her car, leading to a deeper contemplation of their lives and behaviors.
- Notable Quote:
"Rats are creatures in the world that have every right to be here."
(47:26)
Zichello recounts adopting pet rats, Sylvie and Pelle, and how their personalities helped her develop a fondness for them. She contrasts this with the harsh reality of wild rat infestations, suggesting that empathy towards pet rats could foster better relationships and possibly mitigate public antagonism toward wild populations.
Rats in Scientific Research: Insights from Bethany Brookshire
Guest: Bethany Brookshire, Author of How Humans Create Animal Villains and former scientist at Wake Forest School of Medicine
Bethany Brookshire discusses the pivotal role rats play in biomedical research, outlining their significance compared to mice. She explains the biological and behavioral traits that make rats suitable for certain types of studies, particularly in neuroscience and pharmacology.
- Notable Quote:
"Rats are much sweeter than mice, by the way. If you're going to have one as a pet, have a rat."
(25:21)
Brookshire highlights the ethical considerations involved in using rats for research, acknowledging the emotional toll it takes on scientists. She advocates for a more compassionate view of rats, emphasizing their intelligence and social nature, which often goes unrecognized due to cultural biases.
Cultural Perceptions and Changing Narratives
The episode references research by Kuhn Bohmer from Utrecht University, which explores the diverse representations of rats in 20th-century media. Contrary to their vilified image, many portrayals depict rats in a more complex and sometimes positive light, indicating a shift in societal attitudes.
- Notable Quote:
"I absolutely think the way we see animals in media can strongly affect our perception. Rats could be something else."
(26:43)
The conversation underscores the power of storytelling in reshaping perceptions, as seen with Ratatouille. By presenting rats as intelligent and sympathetic characters, the film challenges entrenched stereotypes and encourages audiences to reconsider their views on these often-misunderstood animals.
Reflections and Conclusions
Jan Pinkova reflects on the broader implications of Ratatouille, hoping it opens doors to more empathetic and diverse representations of animals in media. The episode concludes by affirming the importance of challenging preconceived notions and embracing a more nuanced understanding of rats, both in fiction and reality.
- Notable Quote:
"Rats are a part of our life that we need to get used to. They are creatures in the world that have every right to be here."
(47:26)
Stephen Dubner wraps up the episode by encouraging listeners to rethink their relationships with rats, suggesting that appreciation and respect can lead to more harmonious coexistence.
Key Takeaways:
- Ratatouille as an Allegory: The film serves as a metaphor for overcoming societal prejudices and embracing diversity through its rat protagonist.
- Personal Connections: Individual experiences with rats can significantly influence perceptions, fostering empathy and understanding.
- Scientific Significance: Rats are invaluable in research due to their biological similarities to humans and their suitability for specific studies.
- Cultural Shifts: Media representations play a crucial role in shaping societal attitudes towards rats, with potential for positive change.
- Ethical Considerations: There's a growing recognition of the need for compassionate treatment of rats, whether as pets or research subjects.
Credits:
This summary was crafted using the transcript of Freakonomics Radio Episode 624, featuring insights from Jan Pinkova, Julia Zichello, and Bethany Brookshire.