637. What It’s Like to Be Middle-Aged (in the Middle Ages)

Summary

Podcast Summary: Freakonomics Radio Episode 637 - "What It’s Like to Be Middle-Aged (in the Middle Ages)"

Release Date: June 20, 2025

In this episode of Freakonomics Radio, host Stephen J. Dubner embarks on a fascinating journey to uncover what it meant to be middle-aged during the Middle Ages. By blending historical research with imaginative scenarios, Dubner provides a rich, engaging exploration of medieval life, drawing contrasts and parallels with modern experiences.

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Setting the Stage: Renaissance Fair Insights

The episode opens at the Burlington County Fairgrounds in New Jersey, where attendees immerse themselves in the ambiance of the Middle Ages. This setting serves as a springboard for the episode's exploration of medieval life.

00:57 Stephen Dubner: "People worked hard and played hard. It seems exotic to us now."

Musicians like Matt Schwarz and Jordan Cavalier showcase period instruments, highlighting the cultural allure and romanticized view of medieval times that Renaissance Fairs embody.

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Introducing the Experts

To provide an authoritative perspective, Dubner introduces two medieval historians:

• Neslihan Szenerczak – A professor at Columbia University specializing in the religious history of the Middle Ages.

  06:19 Neslihan Szenerczak: "I study everything [historical subjects], because religion is so pervasive in the medieval world."

• Philip Schofield – A historian at Aberystwyth University in Wales, focusing on economic history and peasantry.

  08:08 Philip Schofield: "I work particularly on peasantry."

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Profile 1: Robert son of Adam – The Middle-Aged Peasant

Philip Schofield introduces Robert son of Adam, a relatively wealthy peasant living in Hinder Clay, Suffolk around 1305.

10:35 Philip Schofield: "I will pick someone called Robert the son of Adam."

Key Aspects of Robert's Life:

• Family and Occupation: Likely in his 30s, Robert manages approximately 20 acres, cultivating grains like barley and engaging in mercantile activities. He resides in a wattle-and-daub house with wooden furniture.

• Economic Status: Positioned near the top of his community's taxation records, Robert leverages both farming and trading to accumulate wealth.

  19:50 Philip Schofield: "A peasant in this period could be relatively wealthy."

• Legal System: As a villein, Robert is bound to the local monastery of Bury St. Edmunds. His status allows for certain protections but also imposes restrictions on his freedoms.

  24:14 Philip Schofield: "Some see villiage as a safety net, others as a restriction of freedom."

• Diet and Lifestyle: His diet is predominantly grain-based, supplemented with fish, occasional meat, and ale. Life is characterized by hard work and limited leisure, with a high risk of early mortality.

  14:34 Philip Schofield: "The bulk of his diet would have been predominantly grain based, but leavened by fish..."

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Profile 2: An Artisan's Tale – Neslihan's Medieval Imagination

Neslihan Szenerczak envisions herself as a 52-year-old stained glass artisan in 13th-century Florence, navigating the complexities of medieval urban life.

12:30 Neslihan Szenerczak: "I'd like to be an artisan in a city."

Key Aspects of Neslihan's Life:

• Guild Membership: As a stained glass maker, she must join a guild, which regulates trade practices, sets prices, and provides mutual support among members.

  17:15 Neslihan Szenerczak: "The guild is a very good thing for people inside it."

• Economic Life: Commissioned work from churches and monasteries allows her to maintain a middle-class status, balancing artistic endeavors with economic stability.

  16:36 Neslihan Szenerczak: "If I'm a stained glass maker, that would mean either a church or a monastery would have to give me orders."

• Family and Social Life: Living in a bustling city like Florence provides access to public services like hospitals and education, though it also entails navigating social hierarchies and religious obligations.

  12:48 Neslihan Szenerczak: "Italian cities were much more advanced in the 13th century, much better organized."

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Life in the Middle Ages: Economy, Legal Systems, and Religion

The conversation delves into the intricacies of medieval life, highlighting how economic structures, legal systems, and religious institutions shaped daily experiences.

• Guilds vs. Freelancing: While guilds provided structure and support for artisans, they also restricted freelancing opportunities, enforcing standards and limiting competition.

  18:26 Neslihan Szenerczak: "The guild has so many benefits... but for people outside, it's a very bad negative thing because then you cannot find a job."

• Legal Proceedings: The shift from accusation-based trials to Inquisition-style prosecutions in the mid-13th century led to higher conviction rates, reflecting changes in societal trust and institutional power.

  36:32 Neslihan Szenerczak: "There are two books there, the Book of Accusations and Book of Inquisitions."

• Religion's Dominance: Religious beliefs were deeply intertwined with governance, law, and social norms, dictating moral codes and influencing personal behaviors.

  29:02 Neslihan Szenerczak: "Faith... determines everything they do."

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Death and Medicine in the Middle Ages

A significant portion of the episode examines mortality and healthcare during the Middle Ages, emphasizing the precarious nature of life and the limited medical knowledge of the time.

• Mortality Rates: High infant mortality, frequent violent deaths, and catastrophic events like the Great Famine dramatically reduced population numbers.

  41:38 Philip Schofield: "Between 1347 and 1350, possibly 45% of the population died."

• Healthcare Systems: Limited medical infrastructure relied on monastic infirmaries and barber-surgeons, providing basic care without the advancements seen in modern medicine.

  43:15 Neslihan Szenerczak: "There were public hospitals in Florence... they would take care of you for free."

• Perception of Death: Religious beliefs shaped attitudes towards mortality, with a strong emphasis on the afterlife and moral conduct impacting daily life and societal expectations.

  44:32 Neslihan Szenerczak: "I would believe in afterlife... prepare myself."

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Reflections and Conclusions

As the episode draws to a close, both historians reflect on their speculative lives in the Middle Ages, contemplating the benefits and hardships compared to contemporary life.

49:53 Neslihan Szenerczak: "The more people get into your life, the more difficult your life becomes."

Dubner underscores the enduring human experiences across centuries, highlighting how societal structures and personal choices interplay to shape individual lives.

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Notable Quotes

• Neslihan Szenerczak:

  • "I feel at home." (01:23)

  • "Faith... determines everything they do." (29:02)

  • "The guild is a very good thing for people inside it." (17:15)

• Philip Schofield:

  • "A peasant in this period could be relatively wealthy." (19:50)

  • "Between 1347 and 1350, possibly 45% of the population died." (41:38)

• Stephen Dubner:

  • "I do not belong to this time period. I know it sounds crazy, but when I wore armor... I felt like I belonged there." (00:56)

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Conclusion

Episode 637 of Freakonomics Radio masterfully blends historical research with creative storytelling to explore the lives of middle-aged individuals in the Middle Ages. Through expert interviews and imaginative scenarios, Dubner offers listeners a nuanced understanding of medieval society, its economic and legal frameworks, and the profound influence of religion. This deep dive not only illuminates the past but also encourages reflection on contemporary societal structures and personal well-being.

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For more episodes and detailed transcripts, visit freakonomics.com.

Transcript

[Stephen Dubner]

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[Neslihan Szenerczak]

You know, I feel at home.

[Stephen Dubner]

For some people, home is in the Middle Ages. It appears to be a simpler time. People worked hard and played hard. It seems exotic to us now. The exotic place these people are in is New Jersey at the Burlington County Fairgrounds. It's a warm, sticky Sunday in June and they are attending the annual New Jersey Renaissance Fair Fair with an E at the end. Despite the heat, they're wearing woolen vests and long sleeved dresses, heavy boots. Also among the men, a lot of very bushy beards. Matt Schwarz is one of the musical performers. He is a harpist. I think nowadays you look at a world that doesn't have a lot of our modern problems and you think it was perfect. Of course back then they had their own problems, but I think there's much to be said with a world in which you're in touch with with the outdoors in nature. Jordan Cavalier is another musical performer. This is called the Nikkel Harpa. It's a Swedish key fiddle. It's 16 strings of medial Swedish glory. It has three melody strings, one drone string and 12 sympathetic strings. I started playing six years ago and now I'm here at Ren Faire playing it. This is like my life now. In the US alone there are a couple hundred Renaissance Fairs each year they give you a chance to hear period music, eat a turkey leg or a giant pickle, and pretend that you are not only in a different time, but that you are a different person.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

I am Sir Maligan, the Knight of Fortitude, part of the Knights of Virtue, soon to fight in the Tournament of virtue here at 1:30 on the field.

[Stephen Dubner]

Okay, so there's two knights on like.

[Philip Schofield]

Different horses on opposing sides and they.

[Stephen Dubner]

Have like their jousting stick and they're.

[Philip Schofield]

Trying to get the rings.

[Stephen Dubner]

So whichever one gets the rings, they get the point. Another knight, Paul Mahaffey, emerges from his jousting tournament sweaty and winded. It's almost been a year since I armored up and I love it. There's. It was exhausting, but I could do it again in 10 minutes. The adrenaline gets going and you just get in there. It's just you and him. That's all you see because you can't.

[Philip Schofield]

See anything else in the helmet.

[Stephen Dubner]

And it's great. Okay, so that's what they're all doing here. What are we doing here? When we set out to make a three part series about the arc of human life, we knew we would begin with birth and child rearing. That was last week's episode. You can catch up later if you missed it. We also knew that the final episode would be about aging and death. But what about the middle episode? We thought it would be interesting to explore what it's like to be middle aged. But then you realize that our current concept of middle aged is very new. At the Beginning of the 20th century, average life expectancy was only 31 years old. Now that number on its own is misleading. There were plenty of old people and middle aged people too. But the average was brought down by the incredibly high rate of child mortality. So we got to wondering, what was it like to be middle aged back in the Middle Ages? And we asked the Renaissance Fair attendees a simple question. If you could go back, would you go back? I'd rather be middle aged than pretty.

[Philip Schofield]

Much any century out of the Middle Ages.

[Stephen Dubner]

That was rough, rough time. I would have not survived anything. No, I need like a Marriott, but I need like a JW Marriott. I don't even survive this when it rains. So we have this thing today called ibuprofen that is a very, very powerful help to being middle aged. So that's how the fair goers feel. Today on Freakonomics Radio, we get an expert view on what it was like to be middle aged in the Middle Ages. Ibuprofen not included.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

This is Freakonomics Radio, the podcast that explores the hidden of everything.

[Philip Schofield]

With your host, Stephen Dubner.

[Stephen Dubner]

The Middle Ages, as agreed upon by most historians, cover the years from roughly 500 to 1500. Most historians also agree that Renaissance fairs are not entirely accurate. So we decided to speak with a couple of actual historians.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

My name is Neslihan Szenerczak, and I teach medieval history at Columbia University.

[Stephen Dubner]

How would you describe generally your research interests?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

My research interests are mostly in religious history of the Middle Ages, specifically history of Christianity. But because religion is so pervasive in the medieval world, basically every other type of history falls into the religious history that has social history, political history, and everything. So I basically study everything.

[Stephen Dubner]

How did you come to this particular concentration?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

My story is a little bit unusual, really, because I actually graduated from college as an industrial engineer.

[Stephen Dubner]

Oh, sorry. Yeah, that's a change.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

That is a change. But then in the last year of engineering, I had read Umberto Ecco's Name of the Rose, and there I met for the first time the Franciscan order. What is special about Franciscan order is that they really wanted to be poor. Very, very poor. Poorer than everybody else. And I thought, who on earth might like to be poor? It seemed to me so strange, Such a great contrast to modern life when everybody wants to be rich. I was very fascinated from the beginning with the monks and friars life. Now I see a lot of problems in that kind of life that I didn't see before.

[Stephen Dubner]

For instance?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

For instance, no matter how hard they try, their passions and moral issues do not leave them. We think that the monks are calm and peace, dedicating their lives to God. But when you read the sources, it's not like that. They are very much acting.

[Stephen Dubner]

They could be angry and horny.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Exactly. And corrupt and greedy.

[Stephen Dubner]

Okay, so that's Nestle Shenajak, our first scholar of the Middle Ages. Let's meet the other one.

[Philip Schofield]

My name's Philip Schofield. I'm a medieval historian at Aberystwyth, that's.

[Stephen Dubner]

A university in Wales.

[Philip Schofield]

My main interests are in the broad air of economic history, and I work particularly on peasantry.

[Stephen Dubner]

What would you say drew you to the study of peasantry?

[Philip Schofield]

As an undergraduate, I was really intrigued by the broad socioeconomic history that medievalists, especially in France, were doing, looking at the social structure of medieval villages.

[Stephen Dubner]

When I read about the work of archaeologists and others who find physical evidence or ruins, it always seems a bit miraculous that things have survived from so long ago. And yet it does happen. When you study economic history, I'm curious what the evidence is like. And if it feels as though you're always reaching through a veil of sorts, never quite getting to the reality, that's always the sense.

[Philip Schofield]

On one level, when I was doing my doctorate, I wrote at one stage something like, he probably thought that. And my supervisor, someone called Barbara Harvey, she said, what are you doing? You don't probably think it. You either know it or you don't know it. And if you don't know it, leave it out. That's sort of old school, but it appeals to me really. I imagine if I walk through a 14th century peasant village on the basis of my understanding from 14th century records, there's undoubtedly a lot of things that would surprise me. But there are local court records, manorial records that are really the records generated by lords, but include a huge amount of incidental information directed at the peasantry, including, for example, litigation. That's something I work on quite a bit, is actually peasants not litigating with their lords, but peasants litigating with each other.

[Stephen Dubner]

I asked Philip Schofield if he was willing to imagine the daily life of a middle aged peasant from that era. Maybe a composite figure. Based on bits and pieces of Scofield's research, he was actually able to do us one better than that.

[Philip Schofield]

I did write something almost 30 years ago now in a journal called Past and Present about two peasants who litigated. So they're both real people, and because they were extremely enthusiastic litigants, they tended to be more evident. And because they were relatively wealthy, they were also more evident. And they also exist in taxation data. So that's the kind of person I would maybe go to.

[Stephen Dubner]

Excellent. Of these two peasant litigants, I need you to pick one that you can describe for us. Who would you prefer?

[Philip Schofield]

I will pick someone called Robert the son of Adam.

[Stephen Dubner]

Okay, Robert the son of Adam, where does he live?

[Philip Schofield]

He lived in a place called Hinder Clay in Suffolk.

[Stephen Dubner]

And what year would you like to place Robert the son of Adam in Hinder Clay? That would count as his middle age.

[Philip Schofield]

Let's say about 1305. I hope he's not dead by then. He was certainly active around that time and was doing pretty well.

[Stephen Dubner]

How old is he?

[Philip Schofield]

I would say he was probably in his 30s.

[Stephen Dubner]

And that counts as middle aged then?

[Philip Schofield]

I think so, yeah. I was thinking about this today and what I know about calculations of life expectancy. Most of that is really hard to do from the records I'm describing, but it's really monastic evidence from the 15th century where you've got a Whole range of moments in a monk's life in places like Westminster Abbey and Durham Cathedral Priory and so on. And then you can follow them through various administrative tasks. And then often they end up in the infirmary and their deaths are recorded. The estimates for that tend to suggest that life expectancy is taking people into their late 40s, 50s.

[Stephen Dubner]

Okay. We will return later to Robert, son of Adam, a relatively wealthy peasant in Hinder Clay, England. I asked Nestle Shenazak, who grew up in Turkey, what it's like to really immerse yourself in medieval history.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

It gives you perspective, it gives you an alternative. It takes you out of the bubble, which is modern life. When we grow up, we are born into this life. We sometimes think that this is the only way things could be, but it could have been another way.

[Stephen Dubner]

So if I asked you to switch places with someone from that period, would you be willing or interested if I'm.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Going to have my kids with me? Yes. If certain conditions are met, I guess I would, yeah. Because it's a much simpler life. I'd like to be an artisan in a city, I guess.

[Stephen Dubner]

What would you make?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Stained glass would be nice. I mean, stained glass is so beautiful. People in the Middle Ages had their shops actually inside their homes. So I don't have to even go somewhere else.

[Stephen Dubner]

Where exactly would you choose to live?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Let's make it Italy.

[Stephen Dubner]

In a city or rural.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

It has to be a city, really. Italian cities were much more advanced in the 13th century, much better organized. You have free healthcare, free education. If I'm r, I would have to be peasant.

[Stephen Dubner]

And you want to be an artisan?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Yes, I'd rather be an artisan. I think being a peasant requires far too much energy, which I don't think I have.

[Stephen Dubner]

Let's start with the city. Where will you live?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Well, I quite like Florence, so it would have to be Florence.

[Stephen Dubner]

What year shall we pick?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

12.

[Stephen Dubner]

Fifties would be good in real life today. Do you have a spouse or partner?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

I do have a spouse, yes. And he's Italian, actually.

[Stephen Dubner]

So Nestle Shek has raised the stakes by including herself in our exercise, and she's bringing along her husband and two sons. I asked Philip Schofield what we know about the family of Robert, the son of Adam.

[Philip Schofield]

He's got a brother. Beyond that, it's difficult to be entirely sure. We do know from other contemporaries that if he was fairly typical, he would have a wife and maybe a small number of surviving children, some of whom would survive into adulthood. So it's quite reasonable to suppose that he had three or four children who move beyond infancy.

[Stephen Dubner]

What do his children do? At what age do they start to perhaps work with him?

[Philip Schofield]

Well, they were still really young, you know, less than 10. So small scale herding, managing crops, keeping birds off things, helping with harvest and so on.

[Stephen Dubner]

What level of education would these kids be getting?

[Philip Schofield]

Education is fairly limited. A lot of education is the education of the village, in a sense of learning from doing, in some ways.

[Stephen Dubner]

What does Robert eat and drink?

[Philip Schofield]

The bulk of his diet would have been predominantly grain based, but leavened by fish, both sea fish and freshwater fish. Maybe a little bit of meat, probably bacon, but also poultry. Quite a lot of ale in his diet.

[Stephen Dubner]

Is there a relatively low alcohol version of ale that children and others would drink since it was safer than water?

[Philip Schofield]

I mean, children are drinking ale definitely. Whether it's low alcohol or not, it's difficult to be entirely sure.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Obviously, in Florence you would have access to very good wine.

[Stephen Dubner]

What would a family dinner look like?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

It would definitely have vegetables and fruits. Meat is a little bit more problematic for medieval people, cause it's expensive. Pork and chicken would be cheaper than beef, so we might have that maybe once a week. People did consume a lot of beans and lentils and things like that. Also because they were durable, they don't go bad. We wouldn't obviously have any fridge or anything, not even a cellar. But also, of course, the main staple of any diet is the bread.

[Stephen Dubner]

Say a bit more about why you are determined to put yourself in a city and not a village or the countryside.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

The big difference is that you are much less exposed to the elements. City life is pretty safe compared to the rural life because the cities are walled. They are very well protected. In the countryside, you do get raids. You might have animals coming in, wild animals, which were much more in number in the Middle Ages than they are now. Obviously they've been hunted down over the years. There is food insecurity in the countryside. I wouldn't have food insecurity because generally what the medieval cities like Florence did, they had big granaries, they stored grain just in case there's famine, and then they would distribute it to the citizens.

[Stephen Dubner]

Let's talk about the state of commerce. How does that work? How much do you make and what are you able to buy with it?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

I would have to find commissioned jobs. If I'm a stained glass maker, that would mean either a church or a monastery would have to give me orders. There are lots of churches, many more than now. And if a church can afford having stained glass, which would be expensive I think I can make a decent amount of money to be what corresponds today to middle class.

[Stephen Dubner]

Okay, so you're a middle class, middle aged artisan in the Middle Ages.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Yes. That's a lot of middle.

[Stephen Dubner]

That's okay. That's why. What is it like to be a freelance artisan then?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Well, the thing is, I would have to enter the Guild of stained glass makers. All the trades were very well organized. Today's trade unions, they really have their origins in the Middle Ages. So I would have to pay dues to my guilt. I would have to be registered as a master of stained glass, and the amount of money I can charge would be regulated by them.

[Stephen Dubner]

When you read economic history, the economists are usually anti guild because they see guilds as monopolistic within their domain. There was actually this famous economic essay about how the candlemakers guild were trying to have a resolution passed that forbade the sun from shining at certain times because with too much sunlight there was less demand for their products. Plainly, that was not quite real. But the sentiment, I think, was legitimate. I'm curious. How would you feel about your guild? Would you feel it's generally a positive for you and for the rest of society? Positive for you and a negative for the others. And maybe even negative for you because you have to join this guild and pay dues and have your wages probably set, as opposed to being a true freelancer?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Well, I'm not inflicted with the laissez faire ideas of the modern economy, which I consider a good thing. The guilt is a very good thing for the people inside it. It's a very bad negative thing for the people who are outside, because then you cannot find a job. That is, if a freelance stained glass maker comes to Florence, they would not be legally able to work. But the guilt has so many benefits. Yes, I do pay dues. But for example, if I ever fall into hardship, if I get sick, they come and help me. There are even religious benefits. All the guild members are expected to pray for one another at the time of sickness and especially after death.

[Stephen Dubner]

Would you have an appetite for expanding your business? Maybe renting a bigger workshop and hiring people and becoming a big time commercial person yourself?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Whether I'm some kind of a proto capitalist. No, I can't imagine that. I chose the medieval life because it is the simpler one. The more people get into your life, the more difficult your life becomes. I'd rather try to have a small life. I don't have to deal with too many people. The customers are enough, and my kids and the partner.

[Stephen Dubner]

Okay. And how about the economic life of Robert, son of Adam, our peasant friend in Hinder Clay, England?

[Philip Schofield]

A peasant in this period could be relatively wealthy. I mean, not as wealthy as an aristocrat or a major landowner, but within their community they can be wealthier than others. And for Hinder Clay and Robert the son of Adam, we have very good taxation data which places him at or near the top of his own community.

[Stephen Dubner]

How exactly does Robert make his living and how has he done so well?

[Philip Schofield]

That's an interesting one. A lot of his activity is to do with production of grain and farming his land, almost certainly with some livestock as well. What's interesting about Robert from taxation records is he has a much higher proportion of a single grain than almost anybody else in his community, which suggests he's probably not involved in some monoculture, but is probably buying and selling and accumulating as a grain factor.

[Stephen Dubner]

Oh, I see. So he raises a crop, but he's also a merchant, I think so. I see. And what is his grain?

[Philip Schofield]

In this particular part of the country? Barley is a predominant crop. People also produce wheat, oats, rye, peas, beans, you know, but the predominant crop is barley, and that's where a lot of his wealth is held.

[Stephen Dubner]

And what would you say are the characteristics of Robert that enabled him to become not just a farmer but a merchant? Is he particularly clever? Is he a bit of a bully? Do you think he's honest?

[Philip Schofield]

My sense is he is clever. My sense is that he's actually, I often use the term aggressively, acquisitive. I think he's someone who knows how to maximize opportunity. Some people have that ability, don't they? And some people don't. His brother William, the son of Adam, is also quite well to do in the village, but in a traditional way. And I think that maybe they're born into a family that's relatively well to do, though we don't have the records that allow us to see that. So he probably is relatively well off in capital terms to begin with, but also knows how to play that, how to use markets, how to advantage himself, and particular how to use law to support that. When things start to go against him in any way, he's very quick to turn to law, very quick to actually bring people into court to sue them, to not give up. I don't know whether he's a bully, but I do think he knows what he wants and is prepared to push hard to get it.

[Stephen Dubner]

How much land does he have?

[Philip Schofield]

He has something in the region of 20 acres of land, so he may be investing In a nice house, a reasonably nice house, it would be probably a single level, possibly with a slightly raised area above it. There might be a distinction between a living quarters for people and perhaps a space to the other side of it where livestock might be kept.

[Stephen Dubner]

Are there windows in this house?

[Philip Schofield]

In this house, probably more shutters, certainly not glass windows.

[Stephen Dubner]

And what are the building materials, outside and inside?

[Philip Schofield]

You might be talking about a kind of wattle and daubing, a combination of mud plaster mixed in with straw and things like horse hair and a wooden frame, which you attach that to a fairly basic stone flooring as well.

[Stephen Dubner]

What's the furniture look like?

[Philip Schofield]

Wooden furniture. Locally made wooden furniture. Some of it might be quite ornate. He might copy his lord in the way in which he arranges that living space. So he might seat himself at the end of a table with his family in relative seniority closer or further away from him. For example, he might invest in some decent tableware. Silver, possibly not, but good pottery.

[Stephen Dubner]

How many channels does he get on his television? I'm guessing fewer than five.

[Philip Schofield]

Not so many. Yeah, yeah, yeah, probably.

[Stephen Dubner]

So this lord you mentioned, tell me about him.

[Philip Schofield]

Robert is a villein or a serf, so he's an unfree peasant, so he technically belongs to his lord.

[Stephen Dubner]

You kind of buried the lead on me there. That's a big deal, isn't it?

[Philip Schofield]

Yeah, yeah. But at the same time, he's in a community that is both free and unfree. So around him there might be free peasants and he's an unfree peasant, but that doesn't necessarily mean he's significantly disadvantaged. The relationship between freedom and unfreedom in the medieval village could be almost reversed. Some of the people who hold free land might be relatively poor people holding relatively small plots, whereas the unfree might be relatively privileged individuals, except that they obviously have restrictions on their mobility and so on and so forth.

[Stephen Dubner]

So if Robert is essentially owned or circumscribed by his lord, what are some of the upsides and downsides of that?

[Philip Schofield]

There are some people who say, well, villainage is actually not an impediment, it's a safety net, because the lord cares about his villains. They are his bread and butter, in a sense. He protects them. He doesn't want to be overly demanding of them, that customary rents they pay are fairly low and fixed. Others would say that villainage is an imposition. It's a restriction of basic freedoms. It means that if you want to marry off your daughter, you have to pay a fine if you want to leave. As a young man, you have to pay a fine. Anything you do effectively is through the permission of the Lord.

[Stephen Dubner]

Who is Robert's lord?

[Philip Schofield]

His lord is the monastery. It's the monastery of Bury St. Edmunds, which is a long established Benedictine monastery. Very traditional, relatively hard hearted, I would say, and clearly gains the antagonism of local people.

[Stephen Dubner]

This brings us to an interesting and important point. The power of the church in the Middle Ages. We will get into that after the break. Also, how the criminal justice system worked.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

They would go around and ask people what gossip they have heard.

[Stephen Dubner]

I'm Stephen Dubner. This is Freakonomics Radio. We'll be right back. Freakonomics Radio is sponsored by LinkedIn. As a small business owner, you don't have the luxury of clocking out early. Your business is on your mind 24 7. So when you're hiring, you need a partner that grinds just as hard as you do. That hiring partner is LinkedIn jobs. When you clock out, LinkedIn clocks in. They make it easy to post your job for free, share it with your network and get qualified candidates that you can manage all in one place. And LinkedIn's new feature can help you write job descriptions and then quickly get your job in front of the right people with deep candidate insights. At the end of the day, the most important thing to your small business is the quality of candidates. And with LinkedIn, you can feel confident that you are getting the best. Find out why more than 2.5 million small businesses use LinkedIn for hiring today. Post your job for [e-mail] freak. That's LinkedIn.com freak. To post your job for free. Terms and conditions apply. Hi, Zoe Saldana. Welcome to T Mobile. Here's your new iPhone 16 Pro on us. Thanks. And here's my old phone to trade in. You don't need a trade in. When you switch to T Mobile, we'll give you a new iPhone 16 Pro. Plus we'll help you pay off your old phone. Up to 800 bucks and you still get to keep it. There's always a trade in. Not right now. @ T Mobile. I feel like I have to give you something in return for karma. That's okay. I don't really have much in my purse.

[Philip Schofield]

Oh, let's see.

[Stephen Dubner]

Hand sanitizer. It's lavender. I'm good. Seriously.

[Philip Schofield]

Let me check this pocket.

[Stephen Dubner]

Oh, mints. Really, I'm fine. Oh, I have raisins. I'm a mom. Wait, wait one sec. I've got cupcakes in the car. It's our best iPhone offer Ever switch to T Mobile? Get a new iPhone 16 Pro with Apple Intelligence on us. No trade in needed. We'll even pay off your phone up to 800 bucks with 24 monthly bill credits. New line 100 plus a month on experience beyond Finance Agreement $999.99 and qualifying boarded for well qualified plus tax and $10 connection charge. Payout via virtual prepaid card. Allow 15 days credits and amounts due if you pay off earlier. Cancel See t mobile.com@amica Insurance we know it's not just what's inside your home that matters, it's who you share it with. That's why we work even harder to protect it and as a mutual insurance company were built for our customers. We prioritize your needs and are here for you when you need us. Amica Empathy is our best policy. Call 877-41-America for a free coverage review We've been speaking with two middle aged scholars of the Middle ages about what it would be like to have been middle aged in the Middle Ages. Middle Ages Philip Schofield was describing a fairly prosperous English peasant named Robert, the son of Adam, who was in a sort of captive business relationship with a local monastery. This is early 14th century. Meanwhile in 13th century Florence Nestle Shenojak, a historian at Colombia, has imagined herself living with her actual family from today and she is making stained glass for living. This means that she, like Robert the son of Adam, was in a financial relationship with the church. And let's remember the Middle Ages were a very churchy time. Here is Shennozek in the Middle Ages.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

There is not even a word for religion really. It's a modern world. People have this faith and in many ways determines everything they do. How they rule people, how they work, how they talk to each other, how they write.

[Stephen Dubner]

You think that you living back then would be relatively devout?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Relatively, not too much.

[Stephen Dubner]

How central and in what ways was religion central to your family?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

It would be central in the sense that my two boys would have to be baptized and they would be baptized in the cathedral of the city. Cause when you live in a city that's where they get the baptism. We would regularly go to the church and as much as I can find time for my work, I would also try to go to the morning and evening prayer during the weekdays.

[Stephen Dubner]

What is your relationship to the church? Capital C Church, not the actual parish. How do you think about the church or God or the saints in relation to your life?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

So because I live in a city I would have actually much more access to the capital C church than someone living in the countryside, because their experience would only be the parish. But I can see the cathedral, I can see the bishop. I think I would feel, as many people did feel then, a little bit angry and upset that they are just far too rich. The bishop has got gold plated robes and everything, and the cathedral is so big, they eat really well. There might be some resentment about that, that that doesn't reflect the poor Christ.

[Stephen Dubner]

When you think about yourself as this artisan with your family, and let's say you felt some of that resentment, follow that thought through a bit further for me, when you think about where that wealth comes from, what do you think then?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

The wealth of the Church really comes from the donations and the wills. That's how it built up over the centuries. It's the people that made the institutional church rich. But there is also the fact that the church, after the 9th century started to collect tithes, which were taxes. So 1/10 of my income has to go to my parish, which is quite.

[Stephen Dubner]

A lot more than the guild fees, probably. Yes.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Yes, I would think so.

[Stephen Dubner]

And how would you feel about that tithing?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

I don't know. I think I would force myself to think about it as a good religious deed, that at least I'm giving it to the church. And one fourth of those tithes are supposed to go to the poor. The church is supposed to sustain the poor. So I would hope that the money I'm giving is really going into the good hands.

[Stephen Dubner]

Now, let's say your husband comes home from work one day and says, wow, you would not believe how beautiful the new wing of the monastery is. It looks like it was built for, you know, an Egyptian pharaoh.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

I wouldn't feel good about that. They are monks. They're supposed to imitate Christ, they're supposed to live poor, as poor as they can. I mean, they don't have to die out of hunger, but they don't need a luxurious new wing and that money could have gone to the poor.

[Stephen Dubner]

Now, I want to be fair, I just made that up. What were the monasteries like in Florence at that period?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Well, you know, they were quite grandiose, if I may say.

[Stephen Dubner]

I went back to Philip Schofield, who teaches at a Welsh university, whose name I have a hard time pronouncing. So here's him saying it.

[Philip Schofield]

Aberystwyth. Aberystwyth. Aberystwyth.

[Stephen Dubner]

And I asked if his 14th century peasant friend, Robert, son of Adam, was a regular churchgoer.

[Philip Schofield]

Almost certainly this is an orthodox Catholic country. At this stage, the room for stepping outside of perceived appropriate religious practice is relatively minimal. There's a big debate about what attendance meant relative to belief. But certainly people do attend and would expect to attend in a fairly regular way or so at different points in your life. May be going on pilgrimage.

[Stephen Dubner]

Where would a pilgrimage be to?

[Philip Schofield]

Some people go to Jerusalem, some people might go somewhere in Western Europe, but also they may attend pilgrimage within England.

[Stephen Dubner]

What does Robert think about God or how does he conceive God, given that.

[Philip Schofield]

Christian teaching is to be charitable and to love thy neighbour as thyself and so on? I can imagine people paying lip service to that. But certainly from a lot of contemporary commentary, and I think probably Robert would fall into that. From my reading of him, people struggle to actually follow it through in their daily lives.

[Stephen Dubner]

Would he have believed in curses and was he perhaps on either the receiving or giving end of a curse?

[Philip Schofield]

Really hard to know that from this period because it's not showing up in quite the same way in our records. Certainly people talk nastily about each other.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

The gossip and hearsay was so much bigger source of information in the Middle Ages than it is now. You would rely a lot on what other neighbors tell you.

[Stephen Dubner]

And they did it without social media even.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Exactly. That was the social media, basically gossip and hearsay. That was also the basis of the criminal justice system, by the way.

[Stephen Dubner]

What do you mean?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

That's how they found the suspects. They would go around and ask people what gossip they have heard. If a crime has been committed and no one knows who committed it.

[Stephen Dubner]

But then at a certain point you tried to gather some actual evidence. Yes.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

That would be really difficult without forensic science. If you think about the way the modern criminal justice system works. If there are no witnesses to a crime, what are your fallbacks? Fingerprints and DNA analysis. None of that existed.

[Stephen Dubner]

So what do you think the false conviction rate was?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

In a place like Rome or Perugia, which are neighboring places to Florence, the conviction rate was so low only 10% of trials resulted in a conviction. 90% would be let go out of the reason that there is not enough evidence to convict them. Because the judges had it on their conscience if they wrongfully sent somebody to execution. So they would have to let them go if there is not enough evidence.

[Stephen Dubner]

Was the legal system informed by religious feeling or religious devotion?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Oh, yes, absolutely. Judges and the juries would always take an oath that they are going to follow the procedure. They are going to tell the truth. Somehow people really have taken that quite seriously, especially the judges. You can see that they are cringing not to give in. They don't want to execute people. They are very afraid that in the other life God will see them as a murderer if they do that without sufficient evidence.

[Stephen Dubner]

And then do they conversely assume that if someone did commit a crime but there is no evidence and the judge doesn't want to convict, do they assume that that criminal will be punished anyway by God?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

It's not that they think that God will punish them anyway, so let us not punish them. That is not the case, because they definitely did understand that if you do not hold people accountable, then crime will increase. You do need to deter people.

[Stephen Dubner]

How was that balance struck with such a low conviction rate?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

This low conviction rate belongs to the period where the trial started by an accusation. There are two types of trials. The ones that start basically because I go and say to the judge, my neighbor stole from me, and that would start a trial against my neighbor. I would denounce my neighbor myself, but then I would have to prove the guilt.

[Stephen Dubner]

I see. And the other way, after 1250s, you.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Get a new trial which is the basis of the modern trial. We have Inquisition trials. The state starts the trial. The state makes a case against a person based on the public rumors, based on gossip, and then the conviction rate goes higher. People resented that, especially in England. The start of the Inquisition trial, they said, state has no business interfering into people's conflicts.

[Stephen Dubner]

Interesting.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

It has been seen as an infringement into the rights of the people.

[Stephen Dubner]

You mentioned this change came around 1250. There must have been a period where both systems were operating at the same time.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Yes, exactly. Very good. In fact, if you go to the judiciaries, which still hold the ancient medieval records, there are two books there, the Book of Accusations and Book of Inquisitions.

[Stephen Dubner]

How long did the accusations last? When did that die out?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Well, that's a very good question, and frankly, I do not know the answer. But it went on for a very long time. It was considered a right of the people to accuse someone who committed a crime against them.

[Stephen Dubner]

Coming up after the break, let's talk about dying in the Middle Ages. The people we spoke with at the Renaissance Fair in New Jersey had some things to say about that. I don't think I would have survived a lot. I'm clumsy, weak. I probably would have broke my back pulling a plow or been trampled down.

[Philip Schofield]

By a Viking invader.

[Stephen Dubner]

I would have not survived anything. I would like to think I would have survived the bubonic plague. But when the hand of the reaper comes a sweeping across Europe and Wipes out a sizable percentage of the population. It doesn't matter what you did. I'm Stephen Dubner. This is Freakonomics Radio. We'll be right back. Hi, Zoe Saldana. Welcome to T Mobile. Here's your new iPhone 16 Pro on us.

[Philip Schofield]

Thanks.

[Stephen Dubner]

And here's my old phone to trade in. You don't need to trade in. When you switch to T Mobile, we'll give you a new iPhone 16 Pro. Plus we'll help you pay off your old phone. Up to 800 bucks and you still get to keep it. There's always a trade in. Not right now. @ T Mobile. I feel like I have to give you something in return for karma. That's okay.

[Philip Schofield]

I do.

[Stephen Dubner]

I don't really have much in my purse.

[Philip Schofield]

Oh, let's see.

[Stephen Dubner]

Hand sanitizer. It's lavender. I'm good. Seriously.

[Philip Schofield]

Let me check this pocket.

[Stephen Dubner]

Oh, mints. Really, I'm fine. Oh, I have raisins.

[Philip Schofield]

I'm a mom.

[Stephen Dubner]

Wait, wait one sec. I've got cupcakes in the car. It's our best iPhone offer ever. Switch to T Mobile. Get a new iPhone 16 Pro. With Apple Intelligence on us, no trade in needed. We'll even pay off your phone up to 800 bucks with 24 monthly bill credits. New line $100 plus a month on experience beyond finance agreement. $999.99 and qualifying boarded for well qualified plus tax and $10 connection charge. Pay out via virtual prepaid card. Allow 15 days credits and balance due if you pay off early or cancel. See t mobile.com Pilots know that weather factors like pop up storms, turbulence and unexpected icing can turn a routine flight into a challenge. But what if you had satellite delivered weather data giving you those full picture of what's around you directly on your Tablet or display? SiriusXM Aviation brings you coast to coast high resolution weather info including radar, winds, icing, TFRs, pireps and more without altitude limitations or line of sight restrictions. Plus it includes features not found on Ads B such as storm tracks, echo tops and both cloud to cloud and cloud to ground lightning. SiriusXM's aviation services are compatible with the Foreflight and Garmin pilot apps. You can also add SiriusXM Entertainment and listen to ad free music plus sports talk, comedy news and more. While you fly, fly confidently knowing you have the best information available to make decisions in flight. Visit SiriusXM.com aviation to learn more. Tired of unexpected equipment failures eating into your production time? Manufacturing teams using Maintain X are seeing real results. 33% less unplanned downtime and 32% lower maintenance costs. MaintainX puts real time data in your technician's hands, preventing breakdowns before they happen. Get up and running in just three weeks and join over 10,000 frontline teams maximizing their uptime with Maintain X. Start your free [e-mail] okay, let's talk about death and dying during the Middle Ages. As we all know, the definitive historical account comes from Monty Python in the Holy Grail. Bring out your dead. Bring out your dead. Just one ninepence. I'm not dead. What?

[Philip Schofield]

Nothing. Use your ninepads.

[Stephen Dubner]

I'm not dead.

[Philip Schofield]

Here.

[Stephen Dubner]

He says he's not dead. Yes, he is. I'm not. He isn't.

[Philip Schofield]

Well, he will be soon. He's very ill.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

I'm getting better. No, you're not.

[Philip Schofield]

You'll be stone dead in a moment.

[Stephen Dubner]

I can't take him like that.

[Philip Schofield]

It's against regulations.

[Stephen Dubner]

And here is an actual historian, Philip Schofield.

[Philip Schofield]

Undoubtedly, death was there. I mean, death is always there.

[Stephen Dubner]

Even today, apparently.

[Philip Schofield]

Yeah, apparently. So I've heard. In the second decade of the 14th century, there is a period known as the Great famine where maybe 10 to 15% of the population died. We can't really see the total impact of that because the most vulnerable are the least visible. We tend to think of peasant households as being complex and full of generations, but in reality, they probably weren't, mostly because people didn't live long enough really for that to happen. Something we don't know a lot about for this period, but we know about for later periods, is infant mortality. If you had a number of children, then the strong likelihood is you would also have a. A considerable degree of loss in your life because of that. Violent death is also reasonably prevalent.

[Stephen Dubner]

And what about medicine in 14th century England? What happens when Robert the son of Adam or someone in his family is sick?

[Philip Schofield]

They have a monastic community that's their lord, so they may seek support from their community. There would be an infirmary there. There are things called hospitals, but they tend to be relatively low scale. Unlike in Tuscany, for example, where this period there are substantial hospitals. Here they are intended to house and support a symbolic number of poor, often the equivalent to the number of the apostles, for example. But you would have people that would travel around offering a range of skills, including some limited medical skill. So people who are barber surgeons who might help set an arm or do something like that.

[Stephen Dubner]

Nestle, she will remember, located herself and her family in Florence. This is starting to look like a Wise choice.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

There were public hospitals in Florence, so if you are really sick and you need to be taken care of, then you can go there. And anybody who volunteers there, they would take care of you for free. Still, the healthcare is obviously compared to the modern knowledge that we have is much more limited. They just do not know what are the causes of the many diseases.

[Philip Schofield]

Antibiotics will go a long way to treat bubonic plague, but in the Middle Ages, obviously that was not available. Across Western Europe, between 1347 and 1350, possibly 45% of the population died. What's remarkable is how society coped with that. I don't know how modern society would cope with 45% mortality, but there is enormous continuity. There's a lot of contemporary comment and shock and fearfulness. But also the local records I was talking about record, for instance, repeatedly. X has died, Y has died, Z has died, and so on. You get that persistence of normality in the face of something that was utterly abnormal.

[Stephen Dubner]

Nestle, how about you living in 13th century Florence with your husband and two sons? How do you think about death?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Yes, that's the big question. I would worry about it. What will happen to me when I die? And if I'm a devout Christian, definitely I would believe in afterlife. So I would try to prepare myself and not leave it to old age, because that's actually what a lot of people have done. Even in the Middle Ages, they lived their youth rather frivolously.

[Stephen Dubner]

How old would you expect to live until?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Oh, that depends on so many conditions. But I would hope that I can live until maybe 55, 60.

[Stephen Dubner]

How old are you now in real life?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

52.

[Stephen Dubner]

I didn't realize I was speaking with you so close to the end of your life. Well, yeah, I'm going to miss you.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Well, there will be somebody else in my place doing the stained glass.

[Stephen Dubner]

No, no, no, I don't mean your stained glass. I mean I've taken a liking to you during this conversation. When you said 52, I imagined you living easily till 70 or 75.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

No, I don't think that very often happened to ordinary medieval citizens.

[Stephen Dubner]

I asked Philip Schofield if he would have liked to live during the period he studies.

[Philip Schofield]

I think for a short period of time, I'd be interested. One of the things that would be shocking would be the level of casual cruelty. These villages where people are living fairly close to a marginal existence, can be harsh places. A woman cropped up in litigation that I was looking at recently who had been told to return eight hens that she'd Purchased from somebody. And he then said, well, she's defamed me because she did return the eight hens, but she'd stitched their heads together.

[Stephen Dubner]

Ooh.

[Philip Schofield]

I think that hints at a kind of culture that we might find difficult to immediately just settle into if you.

[Stephen Dubner]

Did have that opportunity. I mean, we're just talking about time travel here now, which is a constant fascination for so many of us. What are maybe one or two of the most unanswered or perhaps unanswerable questions about that life that you, as an economic historian, would really love to crack?

[Philip Schofield]

One I've mentioned earlier would be the proportion of the truly vulnerable. What does that society look like if you walk down a street? Do you see in a village people that are mostly doing fine and supporting each other, or do you see desperation alongside relative prosperity? So it's not a particularly pleasant angle, but I think it's an important one. The degree of social inequality is something that our sources don't really give us full insight into.

[Stephen Dubner]

And would your main motivation for understanding that be gratitude from a modern perspective or simply empirical verification?

[Philip Schofield]

It would mostly be empirical, in a sense that I'd really want to know. What are the hidden stories in our history that we're not picking up? That has its own salutary lessons, of course, for our contemporary society, about how we think of ourselves and what we miss in our society and how we ignore those that perhaps are not as advantaged as others. What are we missing? There was someone called Thorold Rogers writing in the 19th century, who said what he wouldn't give for a history of the medieval village when so much of our history is wasted on the froth of kings and queens.

[Stephen Dubner]

And I went back to Nestle. Han Szynejak, too. At the beginning of this conversation, you said you think you would prefer to live then as long as you could take your family with you. Now that we've talked about all these different elements, the economics and the legal system and religiosity and food, et cetera, et cetera. I'm curious how you're feeling about your choice. You'd prefer to be there, then, even though, according to you, you'd only have a few more years of life left. And it sounds like you're going to spend a lot of that life in church, repenting and so on. Or would you rather stay with us here?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Well, that's a difficult question, because, you know, I have a really nice life here too. But for one thing, I don't see the point of trying to live longer and longer. It's the same thing, just more. It depends on how I live the life. That might be naive of me. The stress was much less in the middle ages. Now we have to deal with a million things. The technology in so many ways has made our life hell. The social media, the emails that you have to reply, electronic banking and taxes that you have to figure out. Also the fact that you don't have electricity. In many ways you do get a very good rest. You don't keep working at night.

[Stephen Dubner]

Will you take me with you?

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

If you're ready, yes. Do you think you can do it?

[Stephen Dubner]

I don't know. At the beginning of this conversation I never would have thought so. But you're fairly persuasive.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Yeah, well, I have to be. I teach this, you know. I'm always looking for converts.

[Stephen Dubner]

When we first had the idea for this episode to explore what it would be like to have been middle aged in the middle Ages, I thought it might be a ridiculous pursuit. But now that we've made the episode, I don't think it's ridiculous at all. It's something I love about history and historians. They are so good at bringing you into their world that your mind starts racing with comparisons to your own time. The benefits of the modern world are massive, but as Nestle, she pointed out, there are also significant costs.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

The more people get into your life, the more difficult your life becomes. So I'd rather try to have a small life.

[Stephen Dubner]

How do you think about our time versus that one? Would you want to go back? Under what circumstances? Let us know. Our email is radioreconomics.com Coming up next time on the show. Consider this fact. For the first time in history, there will soon be more older adults living in the US than children. One of the great achievements of the 20th century is to produce an aging society. It's so weird. We see it so many negative. We talk to the scientists, economists, investors and historians trying to give this aging society a new kind of future. That's next time on the show. Until then, take care of yourself and if you can, someone else too. Freakonomics Radio is produced by Stitcher and Renbud Radio. You can find our entire archive on any podcast app. [e-mail] where we publish transcripts and show notes. This episode was produced by Augusta Chapman with help from Zach Lipinski. It was mixed by Eleanor Osborne with help from Jeremy Johnston. Thanks to Nick Nevis for field recording at the Renaissance Fair and he had help from Kim Kupal. Thanks to everyone at the fair who spoke with us and also the musicians including Michelle Mountain, Matt Schwarz, Jordan Cavalier and Vince Conaway. The Freakonomics Radio Network staff also includes Alina Coleman, Dalvin, Alex, Ellen Frankman, Elsa Hernandez, Gabriel Roth, Greg Rippon, Jasmine Klinger, Morgan Levy, Sarah Lilly and Teo Jacobs. Our theme song is Mr. Fortune by the Hitchhikers and our composer is Luis Guerra. As always, thanks for listening.

[Neslihan Szenerczak]

Would I go back? I don't know. After watching Game of Thrones, probably not.

[Stephen Dubner]

The Freakonomics Radio Network the Hidden side of Everything Stitcher pilots know that weather factors like pop up storms, turbulence and unexpected icing can turn a routine flight into a challenge. But what if you had satellite delivered weather data giving you the full picture of what's around you directly on your Tablet or display? SiriusXM Aviation brings you coast to coast high resolution weather info including radar, winds, icing, TFRs, pireps and more without altitude limitations or line of sight restrictions. Plus it includes features not found on Ads B such as storm tracks, echo tops and both cloud to cloud and cloud to ground lightning. Sirius SiriusXM's aviation services are compatible with the Foreflight and Garmin Pilot apps. You can also add SiriusXM Entertainment and listen to ad free music plus sports talk, comedy news and more. While you fly, fly confidently, knowing you have the best information available to make decisions in flight. Visit SiriusXM.com aviation to learn more. At Strayer University we help students like you go from is it possible to anything is possible by offering access to up to 10 no cost gen ed courses so you can reach your goals affordably and fast. Visit strayer.edu to learn more. No cost gen eds provided by strayer University Affiliate Sophia Eligibility rules apply. Connect with us for details. Strayer University is certified to operate in Virginia by Chev and has many campuses including at 2121 15th Street north in Arlington, Virginia. If you're looking for new ways to get ahead, then you're our kind of person. We're Udemy and we help learners like you upskill in AI, productivity, leadership and management and more. Learn at your own pace from real world experts. You can also prep for certifications that show employers what you know upskill for the career you [e-mail] now back to your regularly scheduled listening.