Fresh Air – "A Look Back At Hitchcock’s ‘Psycho’"

Date: November 21, 2025
Host: Terry Gross (archival), David Bianculli
Guests: Janet Leigh (archival interview, 1999), Evan Hunter (archival interview, 1999)

Episode Overview

This episode of Fresh Air commemorates the 65th anniversary of Alfred Hitchcock’s "Psycho," a film that redefined horror, suspense, and the cinematic landscape. The episode opens with context on the film’s legacy, then jumps into a rich archival conversation with Janet Leigh, the movie’s star, reflecting on filming, the infamous shower scene, and Hitchcock’s meticulous methods. The second segment features screenwriter Evan Hunter discussing the making of "The Birds" and collaborating with Hitchcock, highlighting the director’s knack for suspense and storytelling innovation.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

Part 1 – Janet Leigh on "Psycho"

Hitchcock’s Vision and the Shocking Narrative Structure

• Psycho upended expectations by killing its star (Janet Leigh’s Marian Crane) a third of the way through the film.
  • [03:56] Janet Leigh: "I knew it was going to be a short part. I didn't know it would even be as long as it turned out to be, which was due to Mr. Stefano's take on it."
  • The plan was to lure the audience into Marian’s story before the shocking twist, increasing the impact.

Crafting Norman Bates and Subverting Tropes

• Early discussions were about shifting focus away from Norman Bates’ history and instead immersing the audience in Marian’s viewpoint (setup by screenwriter Joe Stefano and Hitchcock).
  • [05:58] Janet Leigh: "Hitch leaned over and there was this gleam in his eye and he said, 'oh yes, and we'll get a star to play her so that it would even be more amazing.'"

Anthony Perkins’ Performance

• Perkins evoked sympathy and suspicion as Norman.
  • [06:17] Janet Leigh: "Tony Perkins was just so brilliant because almost you wanted to mother him in a way. ... And yet he had that undertone of where there would be a spark of something that would set him off. ... You could never identify what was wrong."

The Legendary Shower Scene

• The meticulous planning: 70+ shots, sketched out in advance.
  • [07:05] Janet Leigh: "The overview was the actual drawings of each shot. ... It was all planned."
• Scene technicalities:
  • Camera angles determined wardrobe (or lack thereof).
  • [07:31] Janet Leigh: "If it was looking at my navel, I could wear a bra and pants ... I dressed according to where the shot was or undressed ... were the shot was."
  • Even in shots not showing her face, Leigh performed terror with her body to keep authenticity.
  • Use of a fake knife; no penetration shown per censorship rules.
  • [08:34] Janet Leigh: "What people forget is that we could not show penetration of a weapon. ... You never saw it enter the body because it was not allowed."
  • Different stand-ins played the attacker in various shots to keep the killer’s identity ambiguous.
  • Moleskin was used for modesty; made shooting arduous and sometimes painful.

Vulnerability and Aftereffects

• Emotional toll of the scene and heightened vulnerability during shooting.
  • [14:47] Janet Leigh: "[During the final take] I could feel [the moleskin] pulling away... I just said, let it rip. And that was the shot that they printed."
• Watching the scene was more terrifying than filming.
  • [15:14] Janet Leigh: "I screamed bloody murder... Even though I read the script, I'd done the show... it just blew me away."
  • The staccato editing, music, and compressed timeframe intensified the impact.
  • After filming, Leigh swore off showers:
    [16:53] Terry Gross: “So it’s been only baths since the making of Psycho?”
    [16:56] Janet Leigh: “Exactly. And if there’s no other way … the shower is never closed, the bathroom is very wet, and I’m always facing the door..."

Hitchcock’s Secrecy and Marketing Innovations

• Strict secrecy on plot details; cast did not do press tours to avoid spoilers.
• Innovated the rule: "No one admitted after the movie starts," to preserve the twist.
  • [19:01] Janet Leigh: "He said, ...‘What if somebody should come in in the middle ... and keeps looking for Janet Leigh and she's not there?...That's going to be very strange.’ So he said, there's only one thing to do. ... We can't let anybody in after the picture starts."
  • The policy drew headlines, resistance from theater owners, and massive audience anticipation.

Part 2 – Evan Hunter on "The Birds" and Collaborating with Hitchcock

Adapting Daphne du Maurier’s "The Birds"

• The novella was “unfilmable” as written; Hitchcock only wanted the core premise.
  • [24:18] Evan Hunter: "He wanted to get rid of everything in the novella except the title and the idea of birds attacking."
  • Relocated the story to California for both logistical and personal superstitions.

Constructing the Story: From Comedy to Terror

• Early iterations of the screenplay went through many genre shifts.
  • At one point, Hunter proposed a screwball comedy that veers into horror.
  • [25:56] Evan Hunter: "Why don't we do a screwball comedy? And suddenly it turns to terror."
• Hitchcock visualized big stars (Grace Kelly, Cary Grant) but couldn’t cast them.

The Mystery Behind the Birds' Attack

• Intentionally left unexplained, but a script scene attempted to establish a collective bird intelligence.
  • [28:45] Evan Hunter: "We decided there was ... a collective intelligence... all the birds attacking mankind for whatever reason. We never explain why..."
  • That explanatory scene was filmed but not used.

Technical Ambition and Innovation

• Hitchcock told Hunter not to worry about technical limitations—he’d solve them.
  • [30:28] Evan Hunter: "Go wherever you want and let me worry about it."
• Used a mix of real birds, puppets, and animation.
  • Examples: puppet birds pecking Rod Taylor’s hand, buzzers for children’s costumes, double-exposure for chaotic bird attacks.

Hitchcock’s Gift for Suspense and Detail

• Meticulous with character logic and suspense beats.
  • [35:52] Evan Hunter: "He was very good on suspense, and he was very good on detail."
  • Example: Hitchcock reminded Hunter about logical character behavior (like whether someone would call a parent).
  • Collaboration resulted in lulling audiences with safe moments before shock, e.g., having the protagonist encounter caged lovebirds before the attic scene.

Hitchcock's Creative Additions

• The famous phone booth attack wasn’t in the script; Hitchcock inserted it to deepen themes and visual metaphors.
  • [39:16] Evan Hunter: "The scene where Melanie is trapped in the phone booth ... not at all in the screenplay... It was wonderful imagery and scary as hell."

Personal Impressions of Hitchcock

• Warm, humorous, generous, and saw himself entering his “golden age.”
  • [40:22] Evan Hunter: "He was like the father every boy wished he could have... He took me under his wing..."

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• [05:58] Janet Leigh (on casting): “We'll get a star to play her so that it would even be more amazing.”
• [08:34] Janet Leigh (on censorship): "We could not show penetration of a weapon. ... You never saw it enter the body because it was not allowed."
• [15:14] Janet Leigh (on seeing the finished film): "I screamed bloody murder. ... It just blew me away."
• [16:56] Janet Leigh: “And if there’s no other way ... I’m always facing the door and there is something by my side that I could grab if I had to.”
• [25:56] Evan Hunter: "Why don't we do a screwball comedy? And suddenly it turns to terror."
• [30:28] Evan Hunter (on Hitchcock's methods): "Go wherever you want and let me worry about it."
• [40:22] Evan Hunter (on Hitchcock’s mentorship): "He was like the father every boy wished he could have..."

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:17 – Introduction to Psycho, Hitchcock’s motivations, and the film’s legacy
• 03:56 – Janet Leigh on learning her character dies early and Stefano’s screenwriting approach
• 06:44 – The planning and execution of the shower scene
• 08:25 – Details about the infamous “knife” and filming restrictions
• 12:23 – How Leigh used vulnerability and discomfort for the pivotal scene
• 14:47 – The “moleskin” mishap and Leigh’s decision to keep going in the final take
• 15:14 – Leigh’s reaction upon first viewing the shower scene
• 19:01 – Hitchcock’s secrecy, press blackout, and theater policies
• 23:37 – Evan Hunter on adapting "The Birds" and Hitchcock’s preferences
• 25:56 – Turning the story from potential comedy to terrifying horror
• 28:45 – The (unfilmed) explanation for the birds' attacks
• 30:28 – Discussing technical challenges and Hitchcock’s confidence
• 35:52 – Building suspense and logical character actions, per Hitchcock
• 39:16 – Iconic phone booth scene’s origins
• 40:22 – Evan Hunter on Hitchcock’s personality and mentorship

Tone and Originality

The interviews maintain a warm, conversational, and deeply respectful tone. Both Leigh and Hunter recall their experiences with candor and humor, often marveling at Hitchcock’s craft, intensity, and showmanship. The affection for their work and for Hitchcock is palpable throughout.

For Listeners Who Missed the Episode

This episode of Fresh Air offers a fascinating, in-depth tribute to Alfred Hitchcock’s creative power, revealing the behind-the-scenes artistry, risk-taking, and lasting psychological effects of Psycho—not just on viewers, but on those who made it. The conversations with Janet Leigh and Evan Hunter serve as invaluable time capsules, capturing the blend of innovation, tension, and reverence that surrounded Hitchcock’s masterpieces.

Whether you're a film buff, horror aficionado, or simply curious about how cinematic legends are forged, this episode provides both context and intimate detail—highlighting the original shocks and narrative gambits that make Hitchcock’s work endure.