Best Of: Jude Law / Pedro Pascal

Summary

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Fresh Air Weekend: Best Of — Jude Law / Pedro Pascal

Date: September 20, 2025
Hosts: Tonya Moseley (WHYY/NPR)
Guests: Jude Law, Pedro Pascal
Also Featuring: Ken Tucker (rock critic)

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Episode Overview

This “Best Of” edition of Fresh Air brings in-depth interviews with acclaimed actors Jude Law and Pedro Pascal, along with Ken Tucker’s review of notable new music releases for the fall. Tonya Moseley explores the personal and professional dimensions of Law and Pascal’s artistry, diving into their acting processes, personal lives, and their views on topics like fame, identity, and family.

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I. Jude Law: Beyond Charm — Crafting Characters with Depth

[Segment Start ~02:45]

A. Introducing "Black Rabbit" and the Role of Jake Friedkin

• Law stars in Netflix’s Black Rabbit, playing Jake Friedkin, a magnetic, successful, but morally compromised New York restauranteur. He is also an executive producer on the series, shaping the vision of NYC nightlife.
• The show centers on Jake and his estranged brother Vince (Jason Bateman), whose reappearance threatens the ecosystem of their high-stakes nightlife world.

Jude Law (on being typecast for looks):
"Just the other day I was at the Toronto Film Festival and in at least two or three of the interviews, that's all they wanted to talk about—my looks. And I kind of looked at them and thought, you know, I'm a 52 year old guy, I've got a 30 year career and that's all you're talking about?" (00:35, repeated/reflected near 24:06)

B. On Character Development & Casting

[05:20]

• The dynamic between Jake and Vince mirrors complex real-life relationships, not simply “good vs. evil.”
• Jake is “the front man, the veneer…with a smile and a shoe shine,” while Vince is creative but unreliable.

Jude Law:
"My character Jake is the sort of front man, the veneer, you know, with a smile and a shoe shine. And for all accounts seems to be very successful, very smooth...Vince, played by Jason, is more the creative, anarchic idea guy, but not great at following through." (05:20)

C. Crafting a New Yorker Accent and Persona

[10:25]

• Law discusses the detailed work behind Jake's accent; he treats accents as muscle memory, and builds specificity by imagining backstory, family background, and social influences.
• Law compares these techniques to working out: “You're basically teaching [your mouth and throat] to do different things. So you have drills...you're teaching your tongue to go in a certain way and then...listen a lot.” (13:30)

D. Method Acting & Scent Memory

[15:20]

• Law used scent as an acting tool in Firebrand, hiring a perfumer to create "a noxious odor" to capture Henry VIII’s historically documented stench.
• The smell was so strong it “helped” cast members play their scenes realistically amidst Henry’s decay.

Jude Law:
"She made me this incredible noxious odor that I kind of sprayed on myself...it was really, really, really rancid. Yeah. But it really helped to me. It's very interesting playing someone who is incredibly powerful...yet is sitting in this in a body that is immobile...and having to kind of face himself." (17:23)

E. Family Background & Early Exposure to Theater

[19:34]

• Law’s parents were educators; his mother later became a theater director. Law’s involvement in local amateur theater set the stage for his acting career: “It was very familiar. It was safe, it was fun, you know, seeing adults playing and laughing, figuring stuff out, telling stories.” (20:15)

F. Fame, Beauty & Perceived Limitations

[21:45]

• Law reflects on turning down (then accepting) his The Talented Mr. Ripley role due to typecasting concerns. Although grateful, he still finds the media’s obsession with his looks “frustrating" and limiting.

Jude Law:
"One of the doors it opened was this attention, yes, to what I look like. And I still find that shallow and frustrating, if I'm honest...I'm a 52 year old guy, I've got a 30 year career, and that's all you're talking about?" (24:06)

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II. Ken Tucker’s New Music Reviews

[Segment Start ~25:05]

A. Featured Acts

• Big Thief: New album Double Infinity features expanded vocal arrangements.
• Zach Topp: Infuses classic country crooner style into contemporary country; standouts “Good Times and Tan Lines” and “Country Boy Blues.”
• Leve: Icelandic-Chinese singer-songwriter, merges classical and jazz influences with sharply introspective lyrics.

B. Key Observations & Quotes

• On Big Thief: “Adrian Lenker's voice swoops and soars...”
• On Zach Topp: “Top is making popular a new variation on the neo-traditionalist country music of the 1990s...” (27:26)
• On Leve: Highlights her “smooth jazz phrasing and arrangements” and her lyrics’ emotional honesty.

"Leve, on her new third album, A Matter of Time, cleverly melds her old school influences and writes lyrics that have an invigorating sting to them." (30:12)

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III. Pedro Pascal: Identity, Family, and Acting as Healing

[Segment Start ~32:48]

A. On Becoming an Actor and Literary Influences

[34:28]

• Pascal was inspired by stories and performances from earliest childhood: “Just think about seeing E.T. in the movie theater. You know, Gremlins...so I was very, very easy source of building a fantasy.” (34:28)
• Devoured literature and TV/theater: obsessed by The Color Purple, Whoopi Goldberg, James Baldwin, and To Kill a Mockingbird.

Pedro Pascal:
"With that show, Whoopi, I mean, I saw that so many times. I could do some of her monologues.” (36:04)

B. Family, Art, and the Power of Representation

• Family movie nights with his mother (a Prince fan) and ballet outings with his sister helped foster a deep engagement with narrative and performance.
• Early exposure to a performing arts program sparked a love for dance—eventually incorporating physicality into his acting.

C. Physicality and Acting

[41:04]

• Pascal describes how his background in dance and movement shapes his characters’ physicality, particularly in roles like Joel for The Last of Us and his fight-heavy roles in Game of Thrones.

Pedro Pascal (on Joel from The Last of Us):
"This is a man who works with his hands. He's a contractor, and he builds things. He...expresses himself through his physical relationship to work...way easier than having a conversation." (41:04)

“Game of Thrones...what the role is most known for is the fight. And that is more dance than you can possibly believe if you don't want to get killed anyway...that is choreography in its purest form.” (42:15)

D. Family History: Exile from Chile & Surviving Trauma

[43:34]

• Pascal’s parents fled Chile under threat because of their opposition to the Pinochet regime, ultimately finding asylum in the U.S.
• He learned the harrowing details only as an adult, recalling one vivid childhood moment watching the film Missing and realizing his mother could have been in danger:

“I remember one very, very vivid experience of seeing the movie Missing...and Sissy Spacek is the size of my mother...and her being out in the streets past curfew by accident and her life being in peril, and me somehow putting all of that together and understanding that—sort of placing my mother in that circumstance as a child and just, like, absolutely falling apart.” (47:40)

E. Movies as Agency and Understanding

[49:24]

• Acting and movies gave Pascal a way to understand and process the world, and he now feels honored to possibly offer the same to others:

“I feel profound gratitude to be doing something that I love to do and the people that I get to do it with.” (49:37)

• He reflects on being a part of a collaborative effort, irrespective of reception: “Always, like, everyone involved is putting their entire selves and bodies into, you know, and cares so much about making it, and it's very bonding, it's very fun, and I don't know anything else.” (49:37)

F. A Special Radio Moment

[50:10]

• Pascal expresses deep personal appreciation:

"I've been listening to NPR through my parents since I was a teenager and my entire adult life, I've been listening to FRESH AIR forever. And getting to sit here with you is very special." (50:10)

---

Memorable Quotes

• Jude Law (on acting and identity):
  “It was a place of great...community and fun. I remember, you know, sitting in the back of the stalls of this little theater...It was very familiar. It was safe, it was fun, you know, seeing adults playing and laughing, figuring stuff out, telling stories. What an education.” (20:15)

• Pedro Pascal (on family and trauma):
  “If she understood that I was kind of a son who was scared for her, you know, and kind of absorbing the context, but not really knowing how to process it.” (49:09)

---

Notable Timestamps & Segments

• 05:20 — Jude Law describes Jake and Vince’s dynamic
• 10:48 — Law on New Yorker accent creation and character backstory
• 17:17 — Law’s process with scent memory for Firebrand
• 21:45 — On typecasting, fame, and the frustration of being defined by looks
• 34:28 — Pascal’s early inspirations and passion for storytelling
• 41:04 — Physicality in acting and The Last of Us
• 43:34 — Family’s political exile from Chile
• 47:40 — Childhood realization about parents’ trauma via the film Missing
• 49:37–50:10 — On gratitude and the meaning of acting

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Tone & Style

The tone throughout the episode is deeply thoughtful yet warm, fostering intimate insights into the challenges and joys of artistic life. Both Law and Pascal exude humility and introspective humor. Tonya Moseley’s questioning is gentle but probing, eliciting candid stories about family, identity, and growing older in the spotlight.

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For listeners:
This episode is a rich exploration of what lies beneath public personas—a testament to the artistry and humanity of two internationally acclaimed actors. It also offers a vibrant snapshot of the fall music scene, making it a blend of culture, reflection, and creative inspiration.

Transcript

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[Tonya Moseley]

From WHYY in Philadelphia, this is FRESH AIR Weekend. I'm Tonya Moseley. Today, actor Jude Law. He talks about the range of characters he's brought to life throughout his career and how he hopes people see more to him than his good looks.

[Jude Law]

But just the other day I was at the Toronto Film Festival and in at least two or three of the interviews, that's all they wanted to talk about my looks. And I kind of looked at them and thought, you know, I'm a 52 year old guy, I've got a 30 year career and that's all you're talking about.

[Tonya Moseley]

Also, we hear from Pedro Pascal. He's been a Marvel superhero, a grieving smuggler in the Last of Us and a bounty hunter in the Mandalorian. This summer he starred in the Fantastic Four, First Steps, Eddington and the Materialists. And rock critic Ken Tucker shares some of his favorite music releases this fall. That's coming up on FRESH AIR Weekend.

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[Tonya Moseley]

This is FRESH AIR weekend. I'm Tonya Moseley and my first guest today is award winning actor Jude Law. In his new Netflix series Black Rabbit. He plays the owner of one of New York's most exclusive restaurants, a man who is magnetic and successful, but also deeply compromised. His judgment clouded, his loyalties divided. His name is Jake Friedkin, and when his estranged brother, played by Jason Bateman, returns with dangerous debts, the world he's built begins to fall. AP here's how we first meet Jake describing his restaurant with a tense foreshadowing of what's to come.

[Jude Law]

I want to say something quick for those of you who don't know who I am. Get the out. No, I'm Jake and yeah, yeah, I own the place. All right. All right.

[Ken Tucker]

Wow.

[Jude Law]

This is the kind of party Black Rabbit was built for. Yeah. When we set out to create this place, we never wanted it to be just a restaurant. We wanted to build a home for our family, our friends, our people. A place you could come for a drink, a smoke for the best burger in New York.

[Music Clip Singer]

Rocks. Rocks.

[Jude Law]

Take a pow.

[Pedro Pascal]

Yeah.

[Jude Law]

It's a place where the night could go anywhere.

[Tonya Moseley]

Law isn't only the lead, he's also an executive producer shaping the series vision of New York City's nightlife, a world that's as glamorous as it is treacherous. Over the last three decades, Law has moved fluidly between independent films, Hollywood blockbusters and stage work in London and New York. He's been nominated for two Academy Awards and is known for roles that walk the line between charm and danger, from Dickie Greenleaf and the talented Mr. Ripley to closer, Cold Mountain and the Sherlock Holmes films, as well as the Fantastic Beasts series. Jude Law, welcome to FRESH air. So let's talk a little bit about your character Jake and his brother, played by Jason Bateman. This is not a Cain and Abel type story. This is not good versus evil. Both of you all are pretty messed up. How would you describe your character, Jake?

[Jude Law]

Well, the brothers and their relationship sit in the foreground of a piece that's also about a particular slice of New York life and I hope sort of any city's life. It's about pulling together a team and providing a kind of hot spot for, you know, the movers and the shakers and all the dynamics that go on behind the scenes of that kind of establishment. The complexities, the relationships, the pressures and the brothers who had built this place, this venue are kind of reflections of all the complexities. And one of them, my character Jake is the sort of front man, the veneer, you know, with a smile and a shoe shine. And for all Accounts seems to be very successful, very smooth, a great person at juggling issue problem people, management. And Vince, played by Jason, is more of the sort of creative, anarchic idea guy, but not great at following through. And he's disappeared. He comes back and sort of shakes it all up. But what you realize is that actually there's a whole lot of issues going on behind the curtain, if you like, of Jake and. And Vince's arrival really just sort of pulls that curtain apart.

[Tonya Moseley]

You use the word veneer to describe your character, that he has, like this perfect veneer. But that's just the surface. Because underneath, as you said, there's a lot of complexity. He's got a lot of challenges. I want to play a clip where he's talking to his brother Vince, as we said, played by Jason Bateman, and he's talking about the truth with his finances. And in this clip, it all kind of comes together where we start to learn it's not on the up and up inside of this restaurant. Let's listen.

[Jude Law]

You bet Mom's money on the Knicks.

[Jason Bateman]

A lot of people bet the Knicks, Jake. They're a professional basketball team.

[Pedro Pascal]

And the money you got from the.

[Jude Law]

Restaurant is the one you and Naveen.

[Jason Bateman]

Kicked me out of.

[Jude Law]

Bailed you out, Bailed you out, saved your ass. You gambled that too, right? Then you go down to Junior, take a loan on the house, you bet it again, lost it all, and then you skip town. Sound right?

[Jason Bateman]

Sounds like the least favorable way you could possibly phrase it. But, yeah, you're all caught up.

[Jude Law]

And Oz, I gotta ask. Cause the suspense is killing me. What happened to your shoes, Vince?

[Jason Bateman]

I got a sweet number on the bus.

[Jude Law]

You sold your shoes?

[Jason Bateman]

I took 500 bucks and I'm chipping away at it. I'm doing my part.

[Pedro Pascal]

Giggles.

[Jude Law]

Yeah, okay.

[Jason Bateman]

I did it on my way home from getting my finger chopped off by those damn zeros who say Jen is next. You're helping me.

[Jude Law]

They said that? They said Jen is next.

[Jason Bateman]

That's exactly what they said.

[Jude Law]

How much do you owe him, Vince?

[Jason Bateman]

140. Big numbers.

[Jude Law]

140 grand.

[Jason Bateman]

It's a big number. There was juice.

[Narrator/Reviewer]

Jesus.

[Tonya Moseley]

That's my guest, Jute Law in Scene with Jason Bateman in the new Netflix series Black Rabbit. I know that you're the executive producer on this and you initially thought about Jason as a director.

[Jude Law]

Yes.

[Tonya Moseley]

How did it come to be, then? He's your brother. And he's that particular brother, I believe.

[Jude Law]

The order was we were developing this piece, and when it became apparent that you know, it was time to sort of go out, find the director who's gonna bring and breathe life into it. We kept referencing Ozark and the tonality of Ozark, that sort of dark, human, but humorous pitch that Jason also has as a performer. And he fortunately saw what we saw in the scripts and came on board as a director, wanted to throw himself behind it. And we hadn't found a brother for me, and it just became apparent to me, well, he should short. You know, he's such a great actor, and what a great asset. Why don't. Do you want to be one of the brothers?

[Music Clip Singer]

And.

[Jude Law]

And he has this incredible quality, I think, to be likable. And it seemed like if we could have a Vince that did all this, had all this, you know, track record.

[Tonya Moseley]

And we still kind of like him.

[Jude Law]

But you still kind of forgive him. Yeah, and he can still kind of be the funniest guy in the room and the most entertaining and charismatic and, you know. Yeah, fortunately, he saw that, and so that's how we became the brothers.

[Tonya Moseley]

This fascinating world, New York nightlife, behind the kitchen. You know, getting to see all the dramas and things like that. And your character in particular, he's a New Yorker. You're this New York archetype. You've even got a New York accent that kind of comes out. Did you study any particular person or accent or anything to kind of embody that?

[Jude Law]

Yeah, Jake's a kind of amalgamation of a few people I know who had similar jobs. And the voice came from working with. With a. With a coach. And the trick I find that helps is to be very specific about an accent. Like, you can't. Can't just say it's a sort of general New York. It's like, okay, what are the. Where did he grow up and what did the parents sound like? And obviously I had Jason as a brother, so I also had to go towards what Jason sounds like. And you have to give the accent a kind of history, otherwise you're generalizing. And so.

[Tonya Moseley]

So you did that for this character in particular, where you. You made a person out of this person.

[Jude Law]

Well, you. I have. That's how I just like to do it. You go back and you go, where was he born and what was his childhood like? And what was mom like? What was dad like? What was his friends like? What was he listening to on the street? You know, what was his shows or is he watching? And you kind of track their emotional and their life up to where you are at and how they've dealt with the different bridges the different dilemmas, the different dramas. And so you fill in this history so that, you know, if people talk in a scene about your mom and you have an immediate reaction because you know what happened to mom and how you feel about her. And it's the same with an accent. Right.

[Pedro Pascal]

You, you.

[Jude Law]

It's amazing that the little things that influence. If I was to talk about my own accent. So I have, my mother was from the north of England, so I have a very, a little bit of the northern England in my Rs. My dad's from south of England, so. And I grew up in quite. What would I call it? I don't know. There was quite a strong southeast London accent, which I kind of tried to hide because I wanted to sound more posh. Yeah. But it comes out like if I'm in, if I go home or if I'm with certain friends. So all of that's in my voice. And so if you're playing a character, you want all of those details to be there.

[Tonya Moseley]

I'm so fascinated by this work because you've had to play quite a few characters with different accents. I can imagine it's not an easy thing to hold on to all of that while also realizing that you have to embody this accent when you practice it.

[Jude Law]

It's kind of muscles, honestly, in the end. I mean, personally, I think I'm always doing an accent, even when I'm playing someone who's English. Cause you still. They have a different background.

[Music Clip Singer]

Right?

[Tonya Moseley]

Right. It depends on what part of it.

[Jude Law]

It just depends on what part of England and what you. There's the thinking it through and then there's the technique of doing it. And the technique is actually quite like taking your mouth and throat to the gym. You're basically teaching it to do different things. So you have, you have drills to do funny like sentences so that you're, you're teaching your tongue to go in a certain way and then. And you listen a lot.

[Tonya Moseley]

Let's take a short break. If you're just joining us, my guest is actor Jude Law. He stars in the new Netflix series Black Rabbit, where he plays a nightclub owner entangled in crime, betrayal and family ties. We'll continue our conversation after a short break. I'm Tonya Moseley and this is FRESH AIR Weekend.

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[Tonya Moseley]

I am really fascinated by some of the things you've done to really embody a role. So I watched the Other Night Firebrand.

[Jude Law]

Oh, yeah?

[Tonya Moseley]

Yeah. Your 2023 film where you played King Henry VIII. I read that you hired a perfumer.

[Jude Law]

I work with her quite often, actually.

[Tonya Moseley]

Really? Yes.

[Jude Law]

Yeah. She's. First of all, she's an absolute genius. Azzy. And she runs an amazing perfumery called the Perfumer Story. She makes incredible scents. And, you know, scents is a really quick way to accumulate sort of feelings and emotions. You know, if you walk into your grandma's house, it smells a certain way and you feel a certain way. If you go out and someone's been cutting the gr. Right, it evokes all sorts of memories and all the smell of gasoline. You know, I mean, things like that are very pungent, very quick to make you feel and think and fit. You know, my job is an odd job, you know, whether you want to or not. You turn up, you put on someone else's clothes and you have to embody someone pretty damn quick. And sometimes it's like, hey, it's seven, the sun's coming up. We gotta go get it.

[Tonya Moseley]

We gotta get this done. But let's talk about what she did for you. Okay.

[Jude Law]

So she.

[Tonya Moseley]

She.

[Jude Law]

She built this. She made a perfume for me. And I'd read this piece about Henry. He basically had these ulcers on his leg that were rotting. And it was a miracle he lived the 10 years he did with them. But you could smell him, apparently, three rooms away. He stank like a fetid.

[Tonya Moseley]

Yes.

[Jude Law]

And it was a really. What? I realized I'm playing him at the very end of his life when eventually he died of these things from a fever. And I just thought it would be very helpful to everyone else and to me if I stank. So she made me this incredible noxious odor that I kind of sprayed on myself.

[Tonya Moseley]

It was made a concoction of pig sweat, fecal matter.

[Jude Law]

You're going, does this say this to.

[Tonya Moseley]

Mimic the smell of decaying fish? So it was really bad.

[Jude Law]

It was really, really, really rancid. Yeah. But it really helped to me. It's very interesting playing someone who is incredibly powerful, all dominant, expects everyone to bow to their every need and thought and want, and yet is sitting in this in a body that is immobile because of the weight he's put on and because of the wounds he has kind of in his own rotting flesh and having to kind of face himself and he can't escape what he's done to himself and who he's become. You know, he's a mass murderer and deluded to the extreme of believing that he's second only to God. Well, he's about to face God and it's like, okay, what's going on? What's going on in that, man?

[Tonya Moseley]

You're pretty unrecognizable in that. And I'm just wondering. There had to be some pretty interesting conversations around the rank smell on that set. It helped you. It also helped your colleagues, your co stars.

[Jude Law]

Well, I mean, I did. It wasn't like I, you know, wanted to shock them or warn them, you know, but we discussed it and Alicia Vikander, who is. Plays my wife in it, the queen. Queen Catherine Parr was very game for it because she sort of loved this idea that she had to have this intimacy and this devotion amidst this sort of wall of stink, you know, and the guys who play my. My. My privy council were old friends of mine from the theater. And again, it was this sort of. This conflict between observing their devotion and putting up with this appalling physical decay.

[Tonya Moseley]

Your parents were educators. What did they teach?

[Jude Law]

My father started out teaching English, but then became quite a young age, headmaster of a junior school and my mum taught English. She taught junior school too. And then she specialized in teaching English to foreign children who are coming in without the. Without English knowledge of the English language. And then she set up a theater company. She was always very keen in the. On theater. So she stopped teaching, went and did a course in theater directing and set up a theatre company.

[Tonya Moseley]

And is that how you were introduced to.

[Jude Law]

I was already. They were also very much involved in local theater, so local amateur theater. And that's really how I got involved. It was a place of great. Yeah. Community and fun. And I remember, you know, sitting in the back of the stalls of this Little theater where mum and dad were putting on shows, doing my homework with my sister, or sitting watching, you know, endless rehearsals. And it just became a place for me of. It was very familiar. It was safe, it was fun, you know, seeing adults playing and laughing, figuring stuff out, telling stories. How do we do this in this way so that the people understand. And that was, what an education. I mean, that's. I grew up watching that night after night.

[Tonya Moseley]

From the very start, you caught Hollywood's attention. Gattaca is one that I absolutely love and is a cult classic. At the time, it had done fairly well. But the talent at Mr. Ripley, I think, is really. When you became a name where folks could identify you, did it take you then by surprise just what they were paying attention to? Because it sounds like you wanted to have this serious career. Still do, which you have done. But when you first arrived, it was really all about your looks. Yeah. Did that catch you by surprise?

[Jude Law]

Not really. I. I actually turned down the role in the talent of Mr. Ripley because my concern was he was the good looking guy. And I was worried that that would limit my career. I suppose I wanted to be seen as something more than that. And I'm very lucky I didn't turn that role down because it changed my career and I got to work with all these wonderful people, opened a lot of doors, and it was a great experience, but it did. One of the doors it opened was this attention. Yes. To what I look like. And I still find that shallow and frustrating, if I'm honest. And it's interesting, isn't it, that we're in a time now where, you know, for women, for many years, that was something that was always discussed. And I kind of, I. But, but fortunately we're turning a corner now where if, you know, if the same conversation were to be applied to a woman, they'd quite rightly be able to say, you know, that's not cool. Let's not, let's not go there. And it's always been, yeah, bit frustrating. But it's a very odd subject to talk about because in talking about it also sort of feels like I'm affirming.

[Tonya Moseley]

That, you know, that you're saying, yeah, I'm gonna go look at that.

[Jude Law]

I'm really good looking.

[Tonya Moseley]

Yeah.

[Jude Law]

But, yeah, it was a kind of. It felt always like a bit of a limitation, weirdly.

[Tonya Moseley]

Did you try to do things to combat that and the choices that you made?

[Jude Law]

Yeah, for a certain amount of time. Yeah. There were certain roles definitely at key moments, which I chose because I just thought, oh well, this will take it away from being that stereotype. I like to think now that I've been doing it long enough and I hope provided enough evidence and variety that it's not or no longer all people see. But just the other day I was at the Toronto Film Festival and in at least two or three of the interviews that's all they wanted to talk about my looks. And I kind of looked at them and thought, you know, I'm a 52 year old guy, I've got a 30 year career. And that's all you're talking about?

[Tonya Moseley]

Yes.

[Jude Law]

You know, it was very odd.

[Tonya Moseley]

Yes.

[Jude Law]

And again, limiting it just feel. But hey, it's also, it's not like they're insulting. Oh my God.

[Tonya Moseley]

Right, right. There are worse things to have to keep talking about.

[Jude Law]

Yeah, yeah. But it is something that fades, so it can't be something you hang your entire life on. It changes, you know.

[Tonya Moseley]

Jute Law, thank you so much.

[Jude Law]

My pleasure.

[Tonya Moseley]

Jute Law stars in the new Netflix series Black Rabbit. There's a lot of new music being released this fall, and rock critic Ken Tucker has chosen to showcase new songs by three very different acts. Big Thief has a new album and their sound is characterized by the intimate lead vocals of Adrian Linker, as does Zach Topp, a young country singer with roots in old country. There's also the Icelandic Chinese singer Lei Vei, who brings a classical music and jazz influence to her pop songs. Here's Ken's review of this eclectic gathering.

[Music Clip Singer]

In the arms of the one I love she'll see pictures of from the future or the past what's lost or waiting.

[Narrator/Reviewer]

Few bands have been as widely acclaimed in recent years as Big Thief, whose signature sound is the haunting voice of Adrian Lenker. Big Thief's new sixth album, I Just Played a bit from the title track. Double Infinity finds the former quartet, now a trio, but its sound has expanded with the addition of backup singers for the first time. Whether Lanker's vocals needed backing is up for debate, but it certainly added a chummy, collegial air to this album. On the song called Los Angeles, this band from Brooklyn, New York, soaks up the LA sun and heat and turns out a warm hymn to cross continental friendship.

[Music Clip Singer]

Los Angeles, 3:33 Nothing on the stereo Dirty tear like an Mona Lisa smiling in half life mysteriously but seriously I follow you forever Even without looking you call we come together even without speaking you saved me, you saved me where.

[Narrator/Reviewer]

Adrian Lenker's voice swoops and soars. Zach Topp's voice has a pinched nasal tone that connects this 27 year old all the way back to classic country crooners like Lefty Frizzell and Webb Pierce. Top is enough of a craftsman that he can fill a funny song like Good Times and Tan Lines with so many amusing little details and vocal curlicues that it becomes something more substantial than a novelty.

[Ken Tucker]

Little bit of dust, a little bit of smoke Baller in a Chevy down a gravel headed to a spot everybody knows Cannonball swinging from an old freight road Talking bout good times and tan lines Cold beer and summer nights that was all there was to life Good times and tan lines Good good times.

[Narrator/Reviewer]

And tan lines Zach Top's big hit singles and new album Ain't In It For My Health signal a shift in country music which has spent recent years emulating hip hop rhythms. Top is making popular A new variation on the neo traditionalist country music of the 1990s, TOP addresses the gap between hipster country and his own retro style in a disarmingly direct manner on Country Boy Blues.

[Ken Tucker]

I shined up my pickup and slipped on my go to town boots I hit music city like a good time and honky talking fool I've been walking for hours Starting to think it wasn't worth the trip oh cause I kinda feel like a dinosaur down on the Vegas strip yeah every spot in town's got a drink in a band so why can't I hear a damn country tune I been up and down and all around lower Broadway with these old.

[Narrator/Reviewer]

Country borders now let's take a big swerve from country to classical. Specifically, the classically trained cellist, pianist, guitar strumming singer songwriter called Leve.

[Music Clip Singer]

Can'T help but notice all of the way.

[Ken Tucker]

In.

[Music Clip Singer]

Which I fail myself I feel the world all the same I don't think I'm pretty It's not up for debate A woman's best currency's her body, not her brain. They try to tell me, tell me I'm wrong But mirrors tell lies to be My mind just plays along.

[Narrator/Reviewer]

With her smooth jazz phrasing and arrangements, the 26 year old leve has charmed millions who first became aware of her via her TikTok videos. Leve, on her new third album, A Matter of Time, cleverly melds her old school influences and writes lyrics that have an invigorating sting to them. Listen, for example, to her witty put down of an egotistical guy called Mr. Eclectic.

[Music Clip Singer]

But you think you're so poetic Quoting epic an ancient prose Truth be told, you're quite pathetic. Mr. Eclectic. Alan park.

[Narrator/Reviewer]

As different as these three acts are, what Big Thief, Zach Topp and Leve have in common is the way they succinctly summarize both the allure and the flaws of the people they've fallen in or out of love with. You end up either wishing you were the object of their admiration or glad you're not on the receiving end of their criticism.

[Tonya Moseley]

Ken Tucker reviewed new music by Big Thief, Zach Topp and lavey. Coming up, we hear from Pedro Pascal. This year alone, he's appeared in Celine's songs, romantic drama materialists, Ari Asters, Eddington and the Fantastic Four First Steps. I'm Tanya Mosley and this is FRESH AIR Weekend.

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[Tonya Moseley]

If you've watched tv, gone to the movies or even glanced at a bus stop ad in the past year, you've probably seen Pedro Pascal staring back at you this summer alone. His face has been splashed across posters and billboards for the Fantastic Four First Steps, Eddington and Celine, Song's Materialists. He's also gearing up for Doomsday, and that's on top of an Emmy nomination for his role as Joel in HBO's the Last of Us. In the past decade, Pascal has become one of Hollywood's most magnetic leading men, often playing reluctant protectors like in the Mandalorian and the Last of Us, who find family in the unlikeliest of places. That connection between found family on screen and his own life came into sharp focus during his Saturday Night live monologue in 2023, when he credited his parents for making sacrifices to bring him to the United States from South America, a journey that began with political exile and helped shape a career defined in part by portraying outsiders finding their way in. That combination of personal history and on screen vulnerability has made him something rare in Hollywood, a star that people feel like they know A recent New Yorker cartoon captured it perfectly. A therapist tells a client it's not strange at all. Lately, a lot of people are reporting that their faith in humanity is riding entirely on whether or not Pedro Pascal is as nice as he seems. Pedro Pascal, welcome to FRESH air. What was it about acting? Because you started talking about wanting to be an actor at fresh, like, four years old.

[Pedro Pascal]

Well, I was born in 75. And just think about seeing E.T. in the movie theater. You know, think about seeing Poltergeist and the Goonies and, you know, Gremlins and, you know, so I was very, very easy source of building a fantasy of. Of, you know, wishing you were either living these adventures, experiencing these adventures, or part of the adventure of telling those stories.

[Tonya Moseley]

Yeah. You know, I keep coming across these little details, like you being obsessed with the Color Purple.

[Pedro Pascal]

Yeah.

[Tonya Moseley]

James Baldwin for Colored Girls, To Kill a Mockingbird. So you were really into literature as well. And I'm trying to piece together who is this kid. How would you describe yourself back then? You were a deeply feeling child. But what did these words, worlds, provide for you? Because, you know, they're entertaining for everyone else, but it sounds like there was another step for you where you felt immersed in them.

[Pedro Pascal]

Well, I think being moved, you feel very alive. You feel very inspired, you know, and in school, in a way, by incredible storytelling, incredible performances, incredible literature, you know, so the process around the Color Purple is very interesting because we had cable tv and Whoopi Goldberg had a televised show that had been transferred to Broadway and then shot for television for hbo. It was just called Whoopi.

[Tonya Moseley]

Yes.

[Pedro Pascal]

And she was playing a bunch of different characters, and I was just floored. It was magic. And with that show, Whoopi, I mean, I saw that so many times. I could do some of her monologues.

[Tonya Moseley]

The hair and the towel.

[Pedro Pascal]

Oh, my gosh. And he said, okay. I said, okay. We said, okay, okay. And I mean, I literally haven't. I haven't seen that since, I think, the 80s, you know, and it's imprinted. Right. And then I'm walking out of a movie, and I see a poster of this, like, silhouette of Whoopi Goldberg in a rocking chair with purple and Steven Spielberg's name on it and her name, Whoopi Goldberg in the Color Purple. And I'm just like, here I am, completely moved by the marketing of it. And I think the movie is a masterpiece. And I think it's one of the greatest screen performances in the history of cinema that she did in her purely freshman experience her first time on camera, on film. Her first movie role. And I just was, frankly, overwhelmed, you know, by it in the best way. And I couldn't let it go. So I had to get the book, and I read the book.

[Tonya Moseley]

You'd walk around with the book?

[Pedro Pascal]

I would hold it. Yeah. I would hold it like a. Like a treasure.

[Tonya Moseley]

Your mom saw this in you. She saw this and wanted to connect with you because of it. You guys would have these family movie nights.

[Pedro Pascal]

Yeah, yeah. My dad was the moviegoer. My mom was selective. She would fall for. She would notice much more if I was, like, really into a book or if Prince was in it.

[Tonya Moseley]

So you were a big Prince. Prince fan, but that also.

[Pedro Pascal]

But she was. No, she was the Prince fan.

[Tonya Moseley]

Okay.

[Pedro Pascal]

She was the huge Prince fan, which by proxy, made me a big Prince fan.

[Tonya Moseley]

And that's around Purple Rain time.

[Pedro Pascal]

Oh, yeah.

[Tonya Moseley]

What were these movie nights like, these family movie nights?

[Pedro Pascal]

Well, Purple Rain is a perfect example of where we all went together. Like, my dad would try to, you know, take us on a school night whenever he got a chance to whatever he wanted to see. But Purple Rain was like, we're all going, you know, And I guess they're sort of, you know, my most special memories. We're a very sort of, like, moviegoing family. My older sister has a love of dance and did ballet, so we would go to the. As a child, she studied ballet, and so we would go to the ballet a lot. I hated it at first until I saw, I think, a really hilarious production of A Midsummer Night's Dream and then started to kind of really appreciate the kind of storytelling that happened through. Through dance.

[Tonya Moseley]

Did you ever dance?

[Pedro Pascal]

I didn't. I didn't dance. I mean, I danced, you know, like, at any chance I got.

[Tonya Moseley]

Yeah. To Prince and stuff?

[Pedro Pascal]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I danced around the house, I danced around my parents. Parties, Christmas, New Year's, all that stuff. I never took class, but then in a performing arts program that my mother found that I went to, from my freshman year in high school to graduation, you had to study dance, you know, did west side Story, and I love dance, and actually got sort of really seriously into, I guess, what you would call sort of post modern style of improvisational dance in college. And that was the only work I could get when I graduated, actually, were through movement professors and doing a lot of downtown stuff.

[Tonya Moseley]

When you say downtown, what do you mean?

[Pedro Pascal]

South of 14th Street, St. Mark's Church, Lower east side, East Village, site specific performances. This piece called Demeter's Daughter that was conceived by a Choreographer named Tamar Rogoff, who is a lifelong family friend and mentor to Claire Danes. And what kinds of stuff would you do for them? Yeah, like postmodern dance. Like, you know, sort of create movement and dance. And then it wasn't the kind of thing like, this is the choreography. Learn it. It was like, let's move and let's write this together.

[Tonya Moseley]

Kind of like improvisation, but for the.

[Pedro Pascal]

Body, for body movement.

[Tonya Moseley]

I'm so fascinated about that physicality because there is a holding of the body in all the characters that you play. I'm thinking about in the Last of Us. Like, how would you describe what Joel is holding in his body?

[Pedro Pascal]

Yeah, holding a lot of Trauma one. And then in a more simple way, this is a man who works with his hands. He's a contractor, and he builds things. He, I think, expresses himself through his physical relationship to work and to maintenance and that kind of thing. So it's sort of like understanding a person who works very roughly with his hands and is in sort of a very consistent relationship to physical labor, you know, in a way that he probably loves, because it's way easier than having a conversation.

[Tonya Moseley]

Right. But it's so fascinating about you and your history with dancing because, I mean, so much of. Well, so much of your acting is so physical. Like, I'm just thinking about a lot of films that you're in. There's so much silent power in what you're doing, but it's through your body that you're telling the story.

[Pedro Pascal]

Well, Game of Thrones being a perfect example of, like, experiencing, you know, that level of exposure for a part. And one would argue that what the role is most known for is the fight.

[Tonya Moseley]

Yes.

[Pedro Pascal]

And that is more dance than you can possibly believe if you don't want to get killed anyway, you know, that is physicality in its purest form, and that is choreography in its purest form. So it's just ironic because I was already pushing 40 when that job happened, and so the doors that opened were, frankly, leaning in the world of action and a lot of highly, highly, highly physical choreography in the experiences, more so than I could have ever imagined, having had a lot of, like, fight choreography on stage, you know, in Shakespeare and all that. But this was, like, another level.

[Tonya Moseley]

Your family history is fascinating because your parents fled Chile when you were a baby growing up. What was the story that you heard?

[Pedro Pascal]

You know, I didn't hear any stories about it, actually. And I hear stories now because I ask. And I also am met with the sort of desire to share and desire to tell what it meant for, you know, my father's sisters to say goodbye to their brother in. In that way, for my mother's family to live in the terror of the experience of her going into hiding.

[Tonya Moseley]

Because what's the story? Because the story that you came to learn, your parents were very young, you were a baby, and they fled from South America to the United States to Texas?

[Pedro Pascal]

Yes. We had asylum in Denmark first and were likely to, you know, stay there, were it not for somebody that helped hire my father into his lab in San Antonio, Texas.

[Tonya Moseley]

Why were your parents exiled?

[Pedro Pascal]

Oh, well, they were involved in the opposition movement against the military regime under Pinochet. They were Allende supporters and, frankly, just very young and liberal. And my mother's side of the family, there's a cousin of my mother's, Andres Pascal, who was a leader of the opposition movement. And so that, I think, just by association, sort of could put the Naiman family in peril. But there was someone who brought an injured man to my mother's and father's home, knowing that my father was doing his residency at a hospital and asked for help. And he'd been shot in the leg, and it was a priest who brought him over to our house. And, you know, at this point, I'm an infant, so obviously I have no memory. But the priest was taken into custody, and he was tortured, and he gave names. And then they went looking for my parents. And, you know, and so they had to go into hiding and find a way to survive. There are a lot of details that kind of go into it that create, like, such a fascinating story. The odd circumstance of my father finding. Finding out that someone was in the lobby asking for his name and a patient that kind of, like, interrupted the moment where the officer wanted to. Was about to ask my father who he was or his name, if he was doctor, in fact, Dr. Balmaceda. And a patient that was like, you know, I'm in pain and no one is attending to me. And I almost wonder. I mean, you know, you gotta be careful because, you know, how much story do you build around it and what's really real? But this was this chance circumstance that gave my father the opportunity to sneak out the back to go and get my mother and go into hiding. And they were right because they came to the house, they ran, they tore everything apart. And it was about six months before they found a plan to sneak into the Venezuelan Embassy and claim asylum and be reunited with my sister and I.

[Tonya Moseley]

What a story to learn in adulthood. It's not a Lore, it's not a story you grew up knowing and having pride in.

[Pedro Pascal]

Right. I had a sense of it. I remember one very, very vivid experience of seeing the movie missing. See, this is the funny thing, is that, like, here we are, this nuclear family in the suburbs of San Antonio, Texas, with this not distant legacy of escape. I mean, the dictatorship was continuing on, and I'm seeing a movie about it in my house. And Sissy Spacek is the size of my mother.

[Tonya Moseley]

Right.

[Pedro Pascal]

Because the age of my mother and the movie missing. Right. By Costa Gravas.

[Tonya Moseley]

Yes.

[Pedro Pascal]

And her, you know, being out in the streets past curfew by accident and her life being in peril, and me somehow putting all of that together and understanding that sort of placing my mother in that circumstance as a child and just like, absolutely falling apart. How old were you when the movie came out in? I must have been like, I don't know, maybe seven.

[Tonya Moseley]

Wow.

[Jude Law]

Yeah.

[Pedro Pascal]

It was a different time. Parents were letting us. Parents.

[Tonya Moseley]

Oh, I know.

[Pedro Pascal]

Parents were letting us watch whatever was on tv.

[Tonya Moseley]

But I'm saying, wow, about you piecing that together and somehow understanding Sissy Sebasek is my mom.

[Jude Law]

Yeah.

[Pedro Pascal]

Feeling that way, feeling that way, feeling that way in that moment. And I. It had to stop. I fell apart.

[Tonya Moseley]

You literally started crying.

[Pedro Pascal]

Oh, I started. I mean, it was like, you know, I think I. Something, you know, bordering on howling. I was. I was. I was so. Did you ever get traumatized by the idea? I don't know. I never got a chance to talk to my mom about it the way I'm talking to you about it, you know, unfortunately, I wonder if she understood. But. Yeah, I guess just to answer it simply, no, not really.

[Tonya Moseley]

When you say you wonder if she understood. What do you mean?

[Pedro Pascal]

If she understood that I was kind of a son who was scared for her, you know, and kind of absorbing the context, but not really knowing how to process the context.

[Tonya Moseley]

Movies have been so important to you in action, everything. Yeah. They allow you to understand the world.

[Pedro Pascal]

Yeah.

[Tonya Moseley]

And now you're doing that for other people. Do you ever think about it like that?

[Pedro Pascal]

I feel profound gratitude to be doing something that I love to do and the people that I get to do it with and being sort of always a part of an experience, you know, whether it's well received or not, but always, like, everyone involved is putting their entire selves and bodies into, you know, and cares so much about making it, and it's very bonding, it's very fun, and I don't know anything else.

[Tonya Moseley]

Oh, Pedro, this has been great.

[Pedro Pascal]

Thank you, Tanya. Thank you so much for having me. I can't tell you this is part of my little pinch me moment. I told you before we started, I've been listening to NPR through my parents since I was a teenager and my entire adult life, I've been listening to FRESH AIR forever. And getting to sit here with you is very special.

[Tonya Moseley]

Pedro Pascal stars in the Last of Us. His latest films are the Fantastic four First Steps, Eddington and Celine Song's Materialists. Fresh AIR Weekend is produced by Teresa Madden. Fresh air's executive producer is Danny Miller. Our technical director and engineer is Audrey Bentham. Our managing producer is Sam Brigger with Terry Gross. I'm Tonya Moseley.

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