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- [00:01]
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- [00:17]
Sam Briger
From WHYY in Philadelphia, this is FRESH AIR WEEKEND. I'm Sam Brigger. Today, Rob Reiner talks about directing the new sequel to Spinal Tap, the mockumentary about a heavy metal band. He'll also talk about his remarkable life and career. He directed When Harry Met Sally, A Few Good Men, Stand By Me, the Princess Bride and more, and was a star of the sitcom all in the Family. Also, where the air is clear and the road is straight, singer, songwriter and guitarist Billy Strings. Strings is one of the rare bluegrass musicians who can fill arenas with tens of thousands of fans. He's been working to get to where he is for a long time.
- [01:00]
Billy Strings
I mean, I slept with my guitar when I was four or five years old. I put it right under the blankets with me. I used to kiss it good night.
- [01:11]
Sam Briger
That's coming up on FRESH AIR Weekend.
- [01:16]
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- [02:39]
Sam Briger
This is FRESH AIR WEEKEND. I'm Sam Brigger. Terri has today's first interview. Here she is.
- [02:45]
Terry Gross
Finally, there's a sequel to the groundbreaking 1984 mockumentary the this Is Spinal Tap. And the director and co star Rob Reiner is here to tell us about that film and his life and career. This Is Spinal Tap was the most influential mockumentary that helped pave the way to movie and TV mockumentaries, including the Office and Parks and Recreation. Spinal Tap satirized heavy metal bands and rock documentaries. The band is known for its excesses, its loud volume, a bass player who stuffs his pants, incredibly sexist lyrics, as well as on and off stage mishaps. In the new sequel, Spinal Tap 2, the End Continues. The band members return for a reunion concert. As in the original film, the band is portrayed by Michael McKean, Christopher Guest and Harry Shearer. Reiner reprises his role as the director of the documentary about the band. This time around, Paul McCartney and Elton John make appearances as themselves. There's also a companion book. Rob Reiner has had a remarkable life. The films he directed include Stand By Me, the Princess Bride, When Harry Met Sally, A Few Good Men and Misery. His father, Carl Reiner, created the 60s sitcom the Dick Van Dyke Show. Rob Reiner was a star of the groundbreaking show in the 70s. All in the Family. Let's start with a scene from Spinal Tap 2. The end continues. The premise of the film is that the band's former manager has died and his daughter inherited the band's contract. She discovers the contract calls for a final concert, which is why the band reunites. She's also found a new road manager. He's played by Chris Addison. In this scene, he's giving advice to the band.
- [04:33]
Chris Addison (character in Spinal Tap 2)
If this is the final gig that Spinal Tap do, then what we need to do is secure your legacy. The simplest, most effective way.
- [04:42]
Billy Strings
Yeah.
- [04:42]
Chris Addison (character in Spinal Tap 2)
That we could do that is that if during the gig, at least one, but ideally no more than two of you were to die. That's what I call the Elvis effect. It really allows for a sort of leaf flowering of pretend die. I think that would complicate matters. It's easier if you just. If, you know, if we just expire. Do you mean actually die? Yes.
- [05:05]
Billy Strings
Yeah.
- [05:06]
Chris Addison (character in Spinal Tap 2)
Well, yeah, but I don't want to arrange. No, no, no, I appreciate that, but I think in terms of your legacy going forward, how you'll be remembered, how you'll be talked about, what effect that will have on record sales. I'm thinking documentaries. I'm thinking a huge memorial concert.
- [05:22]
Rob Reiner
You can do that without actually killing one of us, though, can't you?
- [05:26]
Chris Addison (character in Spinal Tap 2)
It's very difficult to do a Memorial concert when the person is still alive. That's just a sort of rule of thumb. Would you settle for a coma?
- [05:34]
Sam Briger
Oh, no.
- [05:34]
Chris Addison (character in Spinal Tap 2)
That's interesting, you know. Oh, no, now David gets really expensive. That's a great bit of thinking outside. Well, a literal box, I suppose, actually.
- [05:43]
Terry Gross
Rob Reiner, welcome to Fresh air. Congratulations on the sequel. I'm very glad that you made it, and I know everyone else will be, too.
- [05:51]
Rob Reiner
Thank you.
- [05:51]
Terry Gross
One of the things that's very interesting about the film, the first and maybe particularly the sequel, is that you have a band that started off as, you know, kind of like young and rebellious and, you know, all that. And now, like Spinal Tap, they're in their 70s, and it just makes no sense for them to be singing some of the lyrics that they're singing. And that happens to a lot of bands who end up performing their old material about teenage love, you know, when they're in their 70s. But these are songs about, like, their sexual prowess, and they're incredibly. Some of them are just, like, incredibly, like, sexist. So it sounds so inappropriate in so many ways.
- [06:35]
Rob Reiner
Yeah. The beauty of these guys, the members of Spinal Tap, is that in all those years, from their 20s, 30s, up now until their 70s, they have grown, neither emotionally or musically. There's no growth. They basically are in a state of arrested development for, like, 50 years. And the only growth that there is is maybe skin tabs from getting older.
- [07:06]
Terry Gross
They have to be biopsied.
- [07:08]
Rob Reiner
Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.
- [07:10]
Terry Gross
Did you want the second movie to reflect how music documentaries have changed? Because if I did my math right, like Spinal Tap, like this, a Spinal Tap precedes The MTV and VH1 music documentaries that became so famous.
- [07:23]
Rob Reiner
And so there were a lot of music documentaries before we made the first film. I mean, you know, the Led Zeppelin had the Song Remains the Same, the who had the Kids Are all right. And of course, you know, the Last Wall, Bob. Yeah, the Last Walls was Scorsese. And the first one was the Bob Dylan documentary by Penny Baker. You know, Don't Look Back, you know. Yeah. So there were these documentaries, but. So what we were doing was not only satirizing heavy metal, but we were satirizing the documentary form and the way in which documentaries were presented. And I, you know, basically the reason my character, Marty DeBurge, who's the supposedly the documentarian of the film is in the film is because in the Last Waltz I saw. And there's Marty Scorsese. He's in the film. He's. He's documenting this last concert by the band. But he's also in the film. The first film I shot with a 16 millimeter camera. You know, it's a film camera now we have digital cameras. And I shot with two cameras. And I try to, you know, Marty, let's say the character Marty, who's making the film. I have to always filter it through how he would make it, not necessarily how I would make it. And I try to say, will he be affected by the new modern type of techniques that they use in, in reality shows and you know, what, what you see up on social media and all that. And I think he's, he's, you know, he may try a little bit, but basically he's stuck in, in his own inabilities to make it any hipper or cooler than he was. So he hasn't grown all that much either.
- [09:06]
Terry Gross
You started making Spinal Tap 2. The end continues in 2024, on your 77th birthday. And everyone in the movie is the same or approximately the same age as the characters they play. Did making the film make you think more about how you've aged since the first one and all that's happened to you in between?
- [09:24]
Rob Reiner
Oh, sure. You can't ignore it. I mean, you, you know, hopefully our minds are still sharp and we're still able to, you know, as Chris Guest calls it, schnadle. We can schnadle with each other back and forth, but yeah, word for improv. Yeah, yeah. He says, you know, we schnadle with each other, which is true. I mean, and, and what's interesting is that after 15 years of not, you know, working together, we came back and started looking at this and seeing if we could come up with an idea and we started schnadling right away. It was like falling right back in with friends that you hadn't talked to in a long time. It's like jazz musicians, you know, you just fall in and do what you do.
- [10:06]
Terry Gross
You are part of so many comedy related things and so are your friends. So I'm gonna start with like your father was Carl Reiner.
- [10:15]
Rob Reiner
Yes.
- [10:15]
Terry Gross
And he created the Dick Van Dyke show and before that wrote for and acted in Sid Caesar shows back in the 1950s. Albert Brooks, your good friend from high school, you made a movie about him. You did an act with Joey Bishop's son before he made movies. You co founded an improv group and did a lot of improv. In the 70s you were on one of the most popular and groundbreaking sitcoms, all in the Family. You wrote with Steve Martin for the Smothers Brothers. Summer replacement show. Early in your career, you were the third host of Saturday Night Live. I mean, I could go on. You have three movies in the National Film Registry, When Harry Met Sally, the Princess Bride, and this is Spinal Tap. Yikes. That's like so much comedy history.
- [11:04]
Rob Reiner
I'm tired, Terry. I'm tired. When you read that.
- [11:10]
Terry Gross
When you make a friend or meet somebody, is being funny one of the first traits you look for in someone?
- [11:15]
Rob Reiner
Well, you know, it's interesting. Yes, of course. You want to, you know, connect with somebody that, you know, you can connect with on the same level. When I was young, you know, you mentioned, you know, my dad and, and Sid Caesar, you know, he also did to me the greatest comedy albums ever done with Mel Brooks called, you know, the 2000 year old man. And to me, they're the hippest, funniest comedy albums ever. And when I was a kid and teenager and I come home from school, I would put on one of the album. I did it almost every day for a long time and listened to it because I thought, God, this is so brilliant. And that was improvised too. I thought, you know, when I met somebody, if they dug the 2000 year old man and they could quote lines from it, I knew it was somebody I could connect with because they were on the same wavelength as I. It was like a good test to see if this is somebody I could connect with.
- [12:14]
Terry Gross
Was the 2000 Year Old man album and subsequent versions of it. One of the reasons why you wanted to do improv?
- [12:24]
Rob Reiner
Well, no, not really. I mean, I, that's something I always, you know, I, I was drawn to. I mean, I, I, I loved Second City. I love the committee. I used to go visit the committee when up, when they were up in San Francisco. And we got the idea when I was at UCLA, I guess I was about 18 or 19 at the time, to start our own improvisation group. And I wanted to do what my dad did. I, you know, when I was a little boy, my parents said, I came up to them and I said, you know, I, I want to change my name. I was about eight years old, I guess. I said, I want to change my name. And they said, they were, oh, my God, this poor kid, he's worried about being in the shadow of a famous guy and living up to and all this. And they said, well, what do you want to change your name to? And I said, carl. And, and they said, I said, I loved him so much. I just wanted to be like him, you know, and I wanted to, to do what he did. And I just looked up to him so much. So, yeah, I was surrounded by all of this. And I look at there's a picture in my office of all the writers who wrote for Sid Caesar and the show of shows over the nine years, I guess, that they were on. And when you look at that picture, you're basically looking at everything you ever laughed at in the first half of the 20th century. I mean, there's Mel Brooks, there's my dad, there's Neil Simon, there's Woody Allen, there's Larry Gelbart, I mean, Joe Stein who wrote Fiddler on the Roof, Aaron Rubin who created the Andy Griffith Show. Everybody, anything you ever laughed at is represented by those people. So these are the people I, I look up to and these are people that were around me, you know, as a kid growing up.
- [14:16]
Sam Briger
We're listening to Terry's interview with Rob Reiner. He directed, co wrote and co stars in the new sequel to this is Spinal Tap, which is called Spinal Tap 2. The end continues. We'll hear more of their conversation after a short break. I'm Sam Brigger and this is FRESH AIR weekend.
- [14:33]
Capital One / Various Advertisers
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- [15:19]
Rob Reiner
This is Eric Glass on this American Life.
- [15:21]
Sam Briger
We like stories that surprise you. For instance, imagine finding a new hobby.
- [15:25]
Billy Strings
And realizing to do this hobby right according to the ways of the masters, there's a pretty good chance that you're.
- [15:32]
Terry Gross
Going to have to bend the law to get the materials that you need.
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Billy Strings
If not break it.
- [15:37]
Sam Briger
Yeah.
- [15:37]
Billy Strings
To break international laws.
- [15:40]
Rob Reiner
Your life stories, really good ones.
- [15:42]
Terry Gross
This American Life, you decided to give your mother what turned out to be the most famous, most quoted line from When Harry Met Sally. This takes place in the deli, a very famous deli in Manhattan, Katz's Deli, when Meg Ryan and Billy Crystal, their characters are having lunch together. They're friends and Billy Crystal's kind of like going on about his dating life, how good it is and how satisfied, you know, sexually satisfied the women he's dating are. And Meg Ryan is a little skeptical, and she says, like, how do you know that it's real? I mean, how can you judge if what they're expressing is real or not? And he goes, oh, I know. And she goes, oh, really? And then she starts faking the noises as if she's having an orgasm. And everyone in the deli stops eating. Everyone's staring at her. Billy Crystal's watching people stare at him and Meg Ryan. And she's going on and on. And then your mother has this famous line that when Meg Ryan is done, that your mother says to the waiter, so let's play a short excerpt of that. Oh, God.
- [16:58]
Billy Strings
Oh, I'll have what she's having.
- [17:04]
Terry Gross
I'll have what she's having. How did you decide? Oh, that's the line I'm giving my mother.
- [17:08]
Rob Reiner
Well, first of all, Billy Crystal came up with that line. We had the scene. We knew we were going to do a scene where Meg was going to fake an orgasm in an incongruous place like a deli. And Billy came up with the line, I'll have what she's having. And when he did, and he came up with it, you know, before we went to New York, he came up with it in rehearsal. I said, we need to find somebody, an older Jewish woman who could deliver that line, which would seem incongruous. And I thought of my mother, because my mother had done a couple of little things. She did a thing in a movie that Ann Bancroft directed called Fatso, and she did a couple of other little things. And so I thought, oh, she'd be perfect for it. And so I asked her if she wanted to do it, and she said, sure. And I said, now, listen, mom, you know, we don't know. Hopefully that'll be the topper of the scene. It'll get the big laugh. And if it doesn't, you know, I may have to cut it out, because I know the scene is funny with Meg doing that. And she said, that's fine. You know, I just want to spend the day with you. I'll go to Katz's. I'll get a hot dog. You know, whatever it is, she was fine with it. You know, she was okay. And then when we did the scene the first couple of times through, Meg was kind of tepid about it. She didn't, you know, give it her all. She didn't go full out. And so I said, let's try it again. And she was nervous. She's in front of, you know, the crew and there's extras and people. She did it a few times and then it was never exactly what eventually wound up in the film. And at one point, I get in there and I said, meg, let me show you what I meant. And I sat opposite Billy and I'm acting it out and I'm going, pounding the table. And I'm going, yes, yes, yes. I'm pounding the table. And then I turned to Billy and I said, billy, this is embarrassing here. Oh, what? He says, I just had an orgasm in front of my mother. But then Meg came in and she did it obviously way better than I could do it.
- [19:08]
Terry Gross
So I have to ask you, I feel obligated to ask you about all in the Family, which was such a popular show in the 1970s and kind of controversial for its depiction of the generation gap between the. The parents and the daughter who is married to you. You're the son in law in it, and you're very liberal, and the father's really conservative. And that's a constant battle between the two of you. That's one of the main themes throughout the series. But Norman Lear was very liberal. He founded People for the American Way. What was that experience like for you? How old were you when you first started performing in that? The series started in 71, right?
- [19:53]
Rob Reiner
I was 23. And this is, to me, what's interesting about all this. And it was groundbreaking. At the time, nobody had done a show like this. Cbs, when they put it on, they had a big disclaimer at the beginning saying, you know, the views that are represented in the show don't represent the views of cv. Basically, it was a disclaimer saying, I don't know how this show got on here, but you want to watch it, you watch it at your own risk. You know, we don't.
- [20:21]
Terry Gross
Don't sue us.
- [20:22]
Rob Reiner
Yeah, don't, don't, don't. Yeah, I don't know. Somebody put it on anyway. But here's what was interesting about this. We were a country at that time of about 200 million people. And we were number one in America for five years straight, every single week. And every week, 40 to 45 million people watch that show. And they had to watch it when it was on because There was no TiVo, there was no DVR, no video cassettes, nothing. Now we're a country of, you know, upwards of 340 million people. And if you can get 5 to 10 million people watching a show on a given Night that's a huge hit, and they're not all watching it at the same time.
- [21:09]
Terry Gross
Well, there's. There's politics itself that has become. Everybody talks about that, but pop culture is no longer the glue that it once was because there are so many options that everybody is doing their own thing and not watching or listening at the same time. So I know exactly what you're saying. What was it like for you to be famous at that age? You were already from a famous father and had.
- [21:35]
Rob Reiner
That helped. That helped.
- [21:36]
Terry Gross
You went to school with the children of very famous people, and other people you went to school with were becoming famous, too. But what was it like personally to have people recognize you? Did that make you feel good? Was it feeling intrusive?
- [21:51]
Rob Reiner
I gotta tell you, it was bizarre, you know, to be on a show of that power and that reach. It was like being in the Beatles. I mean, you'd go into a restaurant or you'd go into. I remember one time that Gene Stapleton and myself, Sally Strother, walked into a. An airport restaurant, and the entire restaurant stood up and cheered and started applauding. It was that kind of response that you don't see so much now, you know, with people in television. So it was. That was strange. But you have to take it with a grain of salt because you want to entertain them and you hope that you do, but it doesn't matter what they think. You have to do something you like to do, and hopefully other people will like it, too.
- [22:41]
Terry Gross
Rob Reiner, thank you so much. It was really been a pleasure to talk with you and thank you for the Spinal Tap movies.
- [22:47]
Rob Reiner
Well, thank you so much for having me.
- [22:50]
Sam Briger
Rob Reiner speaking with Terry Gross. His new movie is Spinal Tap 2. The end continues.
- [23:17]
Billy Strings (singing)
Girl, it's a great big world but there's only one of me you can't touch. Cause I talk too much Tonight I'm.
- [23:25]
Rob Reiner
Going to rock it. You deny.
- [23:29]
Billy Strings (singing)
Tonight.
- [23:34]
Sam Briger
If you ever find yourself at an arena concert where tens of thousands of fans of all ages are stomping about to the Bill Monroe tune Roanoke or the classic bluegrass song Old Slue Foot, chances are you're at a Billy Strings show. A singer, songwriter and guitarist, Billy Strings is one of the younger generation of musicians carrying the torch for traditional acoustic bluegrass, even while his music incorporates excursions into exploratory improvisational jams and the occasional heavy metal guitar riff. And he's been celebrated by both audiences and the music industry. He's won two Grammys. And Highway Prayers, released in 2024, is the first bluegrass album in over 20 years to reach number one on Billboard's all genre top 100 albums sales chart. That album showcases his songwriting and his terrific band. Since then, he's released a live album with another ace, bluegrass guitarist Brian Sutton called Live at the Legion. The duo performed in a more intimate setting than the arena Strings usually plays in these days. The American Legion, Post 82 in East Nashville. Playing a lot of music associated with Doc Watson. Let's hear the leadoff track from Live at the Legion, Nashville Blues, originally by the Delmore Brothers.
- [25:06]
Billy Strings (singing)
I've got the blues those Nashville blues I've got the blues those Nashville blues Ain't got no hat, ain't got no shoes these people here, they treat me fine these people here they treat me fine well, they feed me beer and they feed me wine and I've got the blue those Nashville blues I've got the blues those Nashville blues I ain't got no hair ain't got no shoes.
- [25:50]
Sam Briger
That's Billy Strings and Brian Sutton on the new album Live at the Legion. Billy Strings, welcome to FRESH air.
- [25:56]
Billy Strings
Hey, thank you so much. Good to be here.
- [25:59]
Sam Briger
A lot of this material comes from Doc Watson. Like, some of these songs are songs that are part of his repertoire. And you said that most everything you do comes from Doc Watson. Can you talk about his influence on you?
- [26:15]
Billy Strings
Yeah, he's like the ground upon which I stand. You know, my dad played his music all around the house growing up. And by the time I could play guitar, you know, five, six years old, I was learning those tunes, too. I might have been able to play some of them before I knew how to tie my shoes or something. You know, it was like I was learning how to speak and talk and walk, and I was learning all these Doc Watson tunes at the same time. And it was just like a religion in my house. You know, his music is just, it's the best. I mean, that's what I was listening to on the way over here. The Sonic Journals, the, the Owsley thing that he recorded. It's just these beautiful recordings and gosh, it was so good. Everything they were playing was just churning.
- [27:02]
Sam Briger
I can hear some of his guitar playing in your playing. But what about his singing? Was that also influential? Like, he didn't have a big range, but he was expressive and he is singing. I always think of his very crisp.
- [27:16]
Billy Strings
I mean, I think his range was really kind of something to behold when you think about it. He had this great low baritone and he could also yodel and get up into that really high falsetto and, you know, but. But with Doc, it was always just spoken. It was always the information of the song came through and the conversation of it. You know, people like him, people like Willie Nelson, people like Dolly Parton, these really great storytellers when they're singing. You know, if you see Dolly Parton on TV singing and you press mute, it just looks like she's talking to you, because she is. She's telling the story. You know, that's one big thing that one of my vocal coaches that I've been working with. One of the big things that I took from some of those lessons was just give me the information. You know, I get on stage and I sing, and I'm so worried about the pitch and am I singing good? Is the tone good? Am I singing right? How's my timing this and that? It's like taking the kids to the park and you're scared to let them go down the slide because you don't want them to get hurt. It's like, geez, let them play, you know? And so if you focus on the story and telling the words, you know, it's just like, I know where the pitch is. I just need to tell the story.
- [28:33]
Sam Briger
So you're doing that more trying to.
- [28:36]
Billy Strings
It's easier said than done. All this stuff, you know, all the music, kind of zen, kind of mindful stuff that I've been getting into, it's kind of the inner game, inner game stuff, you know, I mean, I'm high strung. I got a lot of anxiety and stress, and I'm moving around a lot. I've been really busy the last several years, and I got a lot of my own personal stuff that just haunts me on a daily basis. And I try to. I try to do everything I can to just be cool and get my nervous system to chill, but it just seems like I don't know what I can do to calm it. I do the best I can and I'm doing okay, but it's a daily kind of struggle to just stay on the ground.
- [29:24]
Sam Briger
Does playing guitar help? Or is playing guitar caught up in all of that stuff? Because that's what you do for a living.
- [29:30]
Billy Strings
It depends on what kind of playing guitar. If I'm on stage, that's where the joy is, you know, that's where the. Where the fun is. If I'm. I kind of ride myself pretty hard about practice offstage.
- [29:45]
Sam Briger
Well, Billy, if you wouldn't mind doing another song for us, that's one of.
- [29:50]
Billy Strings
Your favorites I could do. Told you on the way over here. I was listening to that Bears Sonic Journalist Doc and Merle T. Michael. And man, they were sounding good. And they were doing this number here. It's called the Browns Ferry Blues.
- [30:21]
Billy Strings (singing)
Hard left popcorn on a lane mama giving back his walking cane Lord, Lord, I got them browns fairy blues. Well he throwed it away and he went to town to see a little woman in that drink A block and tackle kind you can walk a block and tackle a lion Lord, Lord, I got them browns fairy blue well, I walked up to my girl's old man and I asked him for my true love's hand. Lord Lord, I got them brown sparingly said you la la little kaloo out of her hand I got hard luck pups standing in the rain the world was corn you couldn't buy grain Lord Lord, I got them browns fairy blues Walk around and c clothes smell of his feet forever he goes Lord Lord, I got them browns fairy blues.
- [32:24]
Sam Briger
That's Billy Strangs playing Doc Watson. He'll be back after a short break. This is FRESH AIR Weekend.
- [32:58]
Billy Strings (singing)
Sam.
- [33:26]
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- [34:01]
Capital One / Various Advertisers
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- [34:54]
Sam Briger
Well, Billy, some of your songs deal with some pretty heavy subjects that you've dealt with in your life, including, you know, losing friends to suicide, family and friends who are dealing with addiction, you know, feeling neglect when you were a kid. When you write songs about that stuff, is it helping you process those experiences? Is it easy to sing about that stuff once you've written the songs?
- [35:20]
Billy Strings
Sometimes it's hard, sometimes it is. Definitely that's how I felt when I sang on stage the night my mom died. It was cathartic. I've had songs that I've written about something totally different that I didn't realize I wrote for myself until months later. I write these words thinking that I'm giving some information to some people that might could hear it. Really, I'm the one that needs to hear it. And I wrote that for myself so that I could heal. And now I go sing it on stage. And there's also been songs. Stratosphere Blues and I Believe in you. You know, the other night I was singing that on stage and, you know, like I said, I wrote that before my mom had died. And now singing it after is just different. It's like I knew something or something, you know?
- [36:16]
Sam Briger
I'm sorry about your mom passing away. She died this last June. Would you mind singing a verse of that?
- [36:26]
Billy Strings
I could try. Let's see.
- [36:40]
Billy Strings (singing)
Couldn't help but wonder why you threw yourself away Come on out from under and just take it day by day it's true.
- [36:55]
Billy Strings
I believe in you.
- [37:07]
Billy Strings (singing)
Took a walk to wonder and I wandered on a thorn it's kind of hard to get through all the things we ain't been taught it's true.
- [37:21]
Billy Strings
But I.
- [37:22]
Billy Strings (singing)
Believe in you after all the years and medication Feels good to get your life on track Long as you live I'm sorry to tell you. You never get that monkey off your back.
- [37:51]
Billy Strings
Yeah, something like that anyways, you know.
- [37:54]
Sam Briger
Yeah. That's a beautiful song. Thank you for playing that. Billy. When your mom died, I think you heard in the morning, and you had a gig that night, you decided to play it. You got on stage and you made a, you know, obviously emotional announcement about it. And you said that your mom would have wanted you to go on. She wouldn't have wanted you to cancel the show. Why is that?
- [38:18]
Billy Strings
The only reason she died is so she could, you know, space travel and be there she was at all the shows. You know, she was always in the mix right up front. She'd show up in New Orleans or Seattle or somewhere, and I wouldn't even know she was coming. She freaking hitchhiked there, you know, I was like what? She walks in my green room, what the hell? You didn't even tell me you're coming. You know, she was just a wild one and she was really living her best life in this last little bit. She had become quite involved with a lot of my friends and fans, you know, that go to every show and go out in the lot and stuff. And she became really close to a lot of these people. And I was always had mixed feelings about that.
- [39:03]
Sam Briger
What do you mean?
- [39:05]
Billy Strings
Well, I wanted her to go have fun and be doing, you know, whatever she wanted to be doing, but I worried about her running into the wrong people or. You know, she's been an addict my whole life and had short stints where she was doing pretty good, you know, And I love to see her out there hanging with all the fans, but at the same time, I was leery of them. You know, I would go over to visit my parents house and there would be like the fans there that I see in the front row of my concerts all the time.
- [39:35]
Sam Briger
People you, you knew or did it or just knew as fans.
- [39:39]
Billy Strings
Mostly I just recognize them from the crowd, you know, and then I get to know them because they're hanging out with my parents or something. But, you know, and who am I? What am I supposed to say? Like, don't do that. I don't know, they're grown people. But I don't know. She was getting older and I kind of just had this vision of her in my head that I wanted. Which is stupid. It's not realistic to try to come up with somebody else's life in your brain. But like, I just wanted her to have a garden. And my dad, 70 years old, she was 64. I was like, man, you guys should like be settling down, you know, don't you think? Instead of raring and tearing and going and eating all these shrooms and going to all these concerts. And then she did get wrapped up in the wrong stuff and that's why she's not here anymore.
- [40:22]
Sam Briger
I'm sorry, this might be too personal, but. Did she overdose? Is that. Yeah, I'm sorry.
- [40:30]
Billy Strings
Yeah. And it's, you know, it's. It's messed with me my whole life and now it's gonna mess with me for the rest of it. You know, I have complex post traumatic stress and I have anxiety and depression and I have for years tried to deal with this stuff. Just that happened to me when I was a kid. You know, it wasn't just being neglected and there not being food in the house and you know, My parents being strung out, and I miss them, even though they're sitting right in front of me. And, like, while they were partying and, you know, stuff like that, I was around the corner being molested, you know, before I was 10 years old and all that stuff, you know, and it's a really hard thing because there's such beautiful people and they taught me so much about music. But, yeah, their addiction has been really hard on me for my whole life, and it still is. And really triggering to lose her in this manner, you know?
- [41:28]
Sam Briger
Well, I'm sorry. I hope talking about it is not triggering any hard feelings for you right now.
- [41:33]
Billy Strings
I gotta talk about it because it's like, my whole life I've had to keep a secret in order to try to not make them look bad, you know? Like, even when I was in high school, I spoke to a counselor one time. I mean, I was in 10th grade, but I was couch surfing. I didn't live with them, you know, I moved out when I was, like, 13 because the house was no longer a home. They were strung out, and it's a wonder I was even going to school. And one time I got pulled into a counselor instead of the principal's office, you know, and. And they said, what's going on? You know, And I finally just. They told me, anything I say is between them and it won't leave the room. And I said, yeah, my parents are on meth and I don't even live there. And my house got raided right after that. You know, that same day, five state cops came up, raided the house. I almost sent my mom to prison because I opened my mouth. And from then on, I never said to anybody about anything. I've just. It hurts me. But what hurts me is I've always just been worried about them, you know, and I've always wanted them to be good. And when I say be good, I mean to be well and happy and have some sunshine in their life, you know, A few years ago, I was able to buy them a home. My parents and stuff was good for a while, but it just. Yeah, it really breaks my heart that it went back to this. And now she's gone. And so I think my duty here is to continue doing what I'm doing. For one thing, use all that beautiful energy that I get from her, that crazy wild streak. I got to use that and, you know, honor her in that way. And I feel a great kind of duty as far as just writing down these words, making these songs for people to heal from. And also, you know, who knows? Maybe someday I'll actually be able to help kids that are in the situation that I was in. Maybe I'll be able to help their parents, you know, like open a rehab or something or something like that to.
- [43:35]
Sam Briger
Just.
- [43:36]
Billy Strings
To help combat this, because it's. It's really hard, you know?
- [43:41]
Sam Briger
Yeah. Are you taking some time for yourself right now? Like, are you. Are you able to take some time off the road? And you have a young family now that's also. That's at home.
- [43:55]
Billy Strings
Yeah, they're with me on the road.
- [43:56]
Sam Briger
Oh, they're. They go with you on the road?
- [43:57]
Billy Strings (singing)
Heck, yeah, man.
- [43:58]
Billy Strings
So. So, yeah, I got the whole gang, and we're out there traveling, and it's really cool.
- [44:06]
Sam Briger
Earlier, we talked about Doc Watson, and I wanted to ask if you'd play a tune that maybe was one of the earlier songs that you learned as a kid.
- [44:17]
Billy Strings
Yeah, when I was a kid, I mostly just played rhythm, so I'll give an example of that. My dad, he would play this.
- [44:50]
Sam Briger
You know, that's the fiddle tune. Beaumont Rag.
- [44:53]
Billy Strings
Yeah. And so I would play, you know, and so that's how I started. And that's kind of what I did for the first few years of playing. I was my dad's rhythm player. And that gave me a chance to just listen to how the songs worked, to just kind of stay there in the bass kind of notes and listen to the melodies and listen to the harmonies, how the vocals work together. And that kind of bluegrass harmony just seeped into my ears, I guess. And later on, I got an electric guitar, a little mini Squire Strat, and a Pig Nose amp for Christmas one year, I think I was probably 9 or 10 or so, and that was my first time really trying to play solos and stuff like that. But it was more. I was getting into Hendrix and I was playing more, you know, guitar center stuff. When I got into middle school, I wanted to play with people that were my age. You know, I'd always played with my dad and his friends, and some of them were much older, and I just wanted to play music with people that were into the same stuff as I was, like skateboarding and video games, whatever, you know? And so the only thing that was really going on in my middle school at the time was heavy metal. And I went to a couple shows, and I just. I hated it at first. It was like, this is not music. You know, I don't know what this is, but it ain't music. But I just fell into that friend group, and then next thing you know, I started. I acquired a taste for this music and then I fell in love with it. But after my bands kept breaking up and falling apart, I kind of got back into Doc Watson at this time and just bluegrass in general. This would have been around the time that stuff was really rough around the house. I remember specifically stealing my mom's old Chevelle one day.
- [46:54]
Sam Briger
How old were you?
- [46:56]
Billy Strings
14, 15, you know, because I'd go over to my parents house and hang out with them and stay there and party. And it's not like I just totally left and disowned them. I just. Once I realized stuff wasn't gonna change, I mean, I didn't end up really moving back there, but I'd go there for. For a weekend and hung out there a bunch. But I didn't. Wasn't like my home. And so, yeah, I stole my mom's car one day when I was just sitting around getting drunk by myself. And that's how bored I was. And that's how kind of there was nothing to do in this town. I mean, it was. There's 600 people that live here. There's nothing to do. So I was just getting drunk during the day and I stole mom's car and I went down Hayes Road, this old country road with cornfields on either side. And man, I put the pedal to the floor and I just. I was going. And that corn was just a blur on either side. And there was a tape sticking halfway out of the deck and I pushed it in and I'm like, I wonder what my mom's listening to, right? And then this is what came on. I was in those heavy metal bands and all this stuff. And I hadn't really been listening to bluegrass very much, but I was kind of heartbroken at the way my life was at the time. And when I heard.
- [48:19]
Billy Strings (singing)
I wondered again.
- [48:27]
Billy Strings
You know, Rank Stranger came on. That's what my mom had in her tape deck. And I just started slowing that old car down until I came to a complete stop. And I just pulled over on the side of the road and I started crying and I was drunk, you know. But this song hit me right in my heart. In that moment I was like, what am I even doing in these heavy metal bands? Bluegrass is where my heart is. This is the music I should be playing. And at that time, I just started hunting for an acoustic guitar, you know, and my friend Zach had one. And one of the first tunes I learned how to actually pick how to play the lead on and stuff is a thing called Nothing to It. It goes like.
- [49:14]
Billy Strings (singing)
Sam.
- [50:04]
Sam Briger
Is that one of those licks that you're now tired of or you still like it?
- [50:09]
Billy Strings
I love it. I mean, yeah, it's still the best. I mean, any of that Doc Watson stuff.
- [50:17]
Sam Briger
Your dad taught you how to play guitar? Have you picked out a guitar for your son yet? Do you plan to teach him the way your dad taught you?
- [50:24]
Billy Strings
Well, he's already got one that he just bangs on the floor. I gave him this. Martin Dreadnought Jr. Used to be my guitar. I just practice on the bus and stuff, and I took tape and I covered up all the pokey parts where the strings are on top and I wrapped them real good so he can't poke himself on that. Yeah.
- [50:42]
Sam Briger
So when are you gonna start teaching him how to play the strings?
- [50:46]
Billy Strings
Oh, man. Like I said, he's.
- [50:47]
Sam Briger
He's already gone.
- [50:48]
Billy Strings
He's 10 months and he's. He's just banging on it. But I sing for him all the time. It's always the best. I remember that first night when we got home, the night of my 32nd birthday, the first time I was able to be at home with my son. And I held him and I sang this little song. I'll sing a bit of it for you. He went to sleep in my arms when I was singing this to him. It's probably the best moment of my entire life, besides maybe just the moment he was born. But there's this little lullaby.
- [51:28]
Billy Strings (singing)
Sam, pretty baby, close them pretty by. Listen while your daddy sing lullabies to you.
- [52:22]
Billy Strings
You know, and I sang that to him and he fell asleep. That was like the best.
- [52:30]
Sam Briger
Well, Billy Strings, I want to thank you so much for coming on FRESH AIR today.
- [52:34]
Billy Strings
I thank you for having me.
- [52:37]
Sam Briger
Billy Strings latest album is called Live at the Legion. Fresh Air Weekend is produced by Teresa Madden. FRESH air's executive producer is Danny Miller. Our technical director and engineer is Audrey Bentham. For Terry Gross and Tanya Mosley, I'm Sam Brigger.
- [52:55]
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- [53:30]
Capital One / Various Advertisers
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