What does it take to defend Canada’s Arctic?

Summary

Front Burner (CBC) Episode: What does it take to defend Canada’s Arctic?
Date: July 8, 2026
Host: Jayme Poisson
Guest: Anne Shabata Castleman (Science Journalist, McLean’s contributor)

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Episode Overview

This episode of Front Burner examines Canada’s evolving approach to defending its Arctic territory amid a historic surge in military investment, growing global tensions, and increasing interest from foreign powers such as Russia and China. Host Jayme Poisson sits down with journalist Anne Shabata Castleman to probe into what sovereignty means in practice, the realities facing northern communities, the nuances of foreign threats, and the urgent need to center Inuit voices and needs in any Arctic strategy. The discussion is grounded in Castleman's deeply reported piece for Maclean’s: “The Arctic Needs Defending. Canada isn’t ready.”

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Key Topics & Insights

1. Canada’s New Military Investments in the Arctic

• Major Procurement Announcements (01:05–02:08)
  • Canada plans to purchase 12 submarines worth $100 billion over their lifespan, alongside investment in icebreakers, upgraded bases, and missile defense.
  • The government frames this as “asserting sovereignty in the Arctic” and leading NATO on its northern and western flanks.
    • “These new submarines, combined with the world’s second-largest fleet of icebreakers, combined with new aircraft, new radar, are allowing Canada to assert our full sovereignty in the Arctic.” — Government Official (01:47)

2. What Life Is Really Like in Northern Communities

• Realities in Cambridge Bay, Nunavut (03:17–05:29)
  • Castleman, a “full Southern Canadian,” describes Cambridge Bay as warm and welcoming, yet beset by infrastructure deficits.
    • “The Arctic waters were like this bright Caribbean blue. Like, already it was upending so many of the images, as a southerner, you have of the north and the Arctic as being white and frozen and kind of harsh and forbidding.” — Castleman (03:45)
  • Infrastructure Challenges:
    • Short gravel runways (no jet service, high travel costs)
    • No paved roads
    • Water and sewage trucked to and from homes — “all these little things…created hindrance for the community to thrive.” (04:53)
• Core Daily Struggles: Housing & Cost of Living (05:41–08:07)
  • Overcrowding is critical — “I heard of one student’s home that had 22 family members under one roof. …People take shifts to use the mattresses to rest.” (06:38)
  • Sky-high costs of groceries; northern price inflation double the southern rate. “A box of Pampers I could get on Amazon in Vancouver for 27 bucks selling for 51, or a family-size box of Cheerios going for $18.” (07:46)

3. Can Military Investment Help Local Problems?

• Dual-Use Prospects, But Limited Impact (08:10–10:36)
  • Military infrastructure could bring some benefits (e.g., upgraded runways, garages that serve both community and military).
  • “It’s almost like a Venn diagram of sort of community needs and interests and defense needs and interests. And there is some overlap, but there’s certainly not 100%.” (08:38)
  • With only two communities selected for major support hubs, improvement is uneven: “In some sense this is just a drop in the bucket.” (10:02)
• Who Is the Defense Infrastructure For?
  • Much of the new defense infrastructure primarily serves continental/NATO objectives, not local security: “It’s not necessarily to protect Inuit communities themselves. It’s to protect like targets, populated targets or infrastructure targets in North America, in the south of Canada.” (10:38)

4. The Nature of Arctic Threats: Not Invasion, but Influence

• Gray Zone & Hybrid Threats (11:29–15:26)
  • “The most urgent threat facing the north is not a military incursion from a foreign power…Rather, the far greater risk is from gray zone threats, covert schemes seeking to undercut Canada’s strategic interests.” (11:29)
  • Examples:
    • Cyberattacks
    • Disinformation campaigns
    • Economic interference (e.g., resource acquisition)
    • “We’re seeing foreign influence. We’re seeing foreign-led cyber attacks, attempts to secure mining assets.” (13:36)
  • Socioeconomic inequity in the north makes it more vulnerable to such strategies.

5. Concrete Examples: Tech, Mining, and Vulnerability

• Internet Access and Security Risks (17:07–20:38)
  • The north lacks high-speed Internet.
  • Huawei’s attempted partnership to upgrade Nunavut’s internet raised security alarms (CSIS warnings), later banned federally. Communities remain underserved; some residents turn to Starlink — which itself raises geopolitical concerns.
    • “It was like a lose-lose for them because they still didn’t have high-speed Internet.” (19:17)
• Resource Grab: The Shandong Gold Mining Attempt (21:07–23:30)
  • In 2020, a Chinese state-owned firm’s attempt to buy a gold mine near Cambridge Bay was blocked for national security reasons. The mine instead went to a Canadian operator that now partners with National Defense.
    • “That was the first time that our Investment Canada Act was used to block the sale to a foreign power of a mine on the grounds of national security.” (21:37)

6. Governance, Partnership, and the Role of Inuit Peoples

• Inuit-Crown Partnership: Withering, but Renewed? (23:33–26:24)
  • There are formal structures for Inuit-government collaboration, but trust and momentum have faded recently.
    • “If the partnership with Canada is not on the table…should we not be looking for other partners as well to uphold our interests?” — Natan Obed, Inuit Leader (24:35)
  • Recent meetings have “ironed out some of that stuff,” with new shared priorities (food vouchers, subsidies, tuberculosis reduction).
  • The sense of urgency is acute: “I heard someone describe it as they’re trying to build the plane while flying it.” (26:24)
  • Nevertheless, Inuit leaders warn: “There is still time for us to insert the human, the community element into this next wave of militarization in our homeland so that we don’t repeat the mistakes of the past.” — Natan Obed (26:53)

7. Lessons from History: Cold War Militarization

• Historical Harm from Imposed Defense Projects (27:19–30:55)
  • Runways and DEW line sites built by Americans, left environmental damage and toxic legacy.
    • “The DEW line essentially became obsolete…a lot of these sites were just abandoned… the largest environmental remediation the Government of Canada had ever undertaken at that point in history.” (27:39)
  • Most extreme, dehumanizing example: Inuit forcibly relocated to the High Arctic for sovereignty purposes.
  • Lasting sovereignty comes from people: “We have sovereignty over the Arctic because of the people who live there and…if Canada is unable to partner and really work with the people whose land it is… what kind of lasting sovereignty do we have?” (30:22)

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Notable Quotes

• “The Arctic is Canada’s northern flank and it’s North America’s northern flank. And so this is really continental defense that’s getting built up and upgraded across the Inuit homeland in their backyards.”

  • — Anne Shabata Castleman (10:38)

• “The most urgent threat facing the north is not a military incursion from a foreign power. Rather, the far greater risk is from gray zone threats…”

  • — Anne Shabata Castleman (11:29)

• “If the partnership with Canada is not on the table…should we not be looking for other partners as well to uphold our interests?”

  • — Natan Obed, Inuit Leader (24:35)

• “There is still time for us to insert the human, the community element into this next wave of militarization in our homeland so that we don’t repeat the mistakes of the past and we don’t create undue burden in our society.”

  • — Natan Obed (26:53)

• “You can’t secure the Arctic if the communities themselves, who give us Canadian sovereignty…if Canada is unable to partner and really work with the people whose land it is to build it in the way that they see they need it built, what kind of lasting sovereignty do we have?”

  • — Anne Shabata Castleman (30:22)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [01:05] — Framing Canada’s enormous military investment in the Arctic
• [03:17] — What Cambridge Bay is like, and what southerners typically misunderstand
• [05:41] — Overcrowding, housing shortages, and cost-of-living challenges
• [08:38] — Will defense investments help communities or mainly serve military aims?
• [11:29] — The real threat: “gray zone” interference, not invasion
• [17:07] — Internet access as a security and sovereignty challenge (Huawei/Starlink)
• [21:07] — Chinese mining interests and the blocking of Shandong Gold Mining deal
• [23:33] — The Inuit-Crown Partnership, current tensions, and renewed commitments
• [27:19] — Lessons from the Cold War and the price of imposed sovereignty
• [30:22] — Final thoughts on sovereignty: It’s about people, not just hardware

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Conclusion

This episode moves well beyond headlines about submarine deals and Arctic militarization. It grounds the defense of Arctic sovereignty in the lived realities, aspirations, and partnership of the north’s people—the Inuit—making a compelling case that the true strength of Canada’s claim to the Arctic lies not in tanks or ships, but in meaningful collaboration, infrastructure investment, and respect for communities that have shaped the region for thousands of years.

Transcript

[Podcast Sponsor/Advertiser]

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[Anne Shabata Castleman]

This is a CBC podcast.

[Jamie Poisson]

Hey everybody, it's Jamie. So I hope you caught these two episodes that we ran last week, a pair of documentaries about the astronomical amount of money that Canada is on track to spend on the military. We're seeing more and more evidence of that now, like for instance, Monday's announcement of what's expected to be this country's largest ever military procurement deal. We're looking to buy 12 submarines from the German company TKMS. The contract is expected to be worth $100 billion over a 30 to 50 year lifespan. Mark Carney is attending the NATO summit in Turkey this week, and before leaving, he talked about how these subs put Canada in a position to help lead the NATO alliance.

[Government Official/Minister]

Up north in the Arctic and on NATO's western flank, Canada is taking a leadership role. These new submarines, combined with the world's second largest fleet of icebreakers, combined with new aircraft, new radar, are allowing Canada to assert our full sovereignty in the Arctic.

[Jamie Poisson]

The Arctic is what we're going to focus on today. Earlier this year, the Liberal government announced a plan to modernize and expand the military's footprint in the Arctic. In addition to subs and icebreakers and missiles, it's also stacked stuff like updated bases and turning some communities into support hubs for the army. Improvements to runways and roads. This is all in a bid to assert sovereignty in a region where Russia and China's influence is growing. Doesn't hurt that the US has also threatened to annex us. My guest today, though, makes the argument that the path to asserting that sovereignty must put the people who live on the land and have claim to it at the center. Their presence, after all, is the reason we can say that it belongs to Canada. Anne Shabata Castleman is a science journalist based in B.C. who just wrote this really deeply reported piece of McLean's about all of this. It's called the Arctic Needs Defending. Canada isn't ready, and we wanted to bring her on to talk it all through. Anne, hi. It's great to have you on frontburner. Thanks so much for coming.

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

Thanks so much for having me.

[Jamie Poisson]

So we'll talk more about threats to Canada's Arctic and whether we're ready for them and what Canada is planning to do up there in a bit. But I do want to start by better understanding the place first. You took a trip there last August, I believe, to Cambridge Bay, which is a hamlet in Nunavut. The Kearney government recently announced that this would be the location for one of the military's support hubs. And what does it look like like there now?

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

So, I mean, just to set the scene, I'm like a full Southern Canadian. I never traveled to Nunavut before reporting this piece. Cambridge Bay is. It's a small community, around 1800 people. End of August is kind of the change in the season. So the flowers had just finished blooming, and the landscape, the leaves on the landscape were sort of turning orange. The Arctic waters were like this bright Caribbean blue. Like already it was upending so many of the images, as a southerner you have of the north and the Arctic as being white and frozen and kind of harsh and forbidding. And the community itself is so accepting and warm and hospitable and welcoming. And having said that, for all the warmth and the generosity that was extended to me, I sort of quickly heard and saw what these sort of material infrastructure deficits that so many of these fly in, fly out communities across Nunavut, across the Inuit homeland, experience day to day.

[Jamie Poisson]

Right.

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

So, you know, the airstrip that I landed on was a short gravel Runway that doesn't have jet service, so you can only land turboprop planes. So that jacks up the price of seats. You fly in your fresh fruit, your fresh veg, all of a sudden those costs go know there are no paved roads. Most of the homes, I mean, the vast majority of homes have their water delivered by truck and their sewage is taken away by truck. So all these little things that I saw, they created hindrance for the community to thrive.

[Jamie Poisson]

Yeah, and. And just what are some of the. The biggest challenges? I mean, and you've gone through a Couple already. But I just wonder if you could elaborate for me the biggest challenges that that northerners face.

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

When I was in town, I heard a lot about housing. There just isn't enough housing. And the housing that is there is in very poor repair. And of course you can't have homelessness in an Arctic community. And so the way that people handle this is they basically just squish in to home. So it's not so. Overcrowding is a huge issue, which of course leads to health issues, mental health issues, just well being. You know, the mayor of Cambridge Bay, Wayne Gregory, was telling me about how he started to notice these people sort of walking circuits around town at all hours of the day. And he didn't really know what he was seeing until someone said, oh yeah, those people are hot bedding. And he like, what's that? And then it was explained to him that because of the overcrowding where you have, you know, many families. I heard of one student's home that had 22 family members under one roof. There just aren't enough mattresses. And so people take shifts to use the mattresses to rest. And when it's not their turn to sleep in that one mattress and let's say, you know, it's at odd hours, then they'll walk around town to buy the time. So I heard a lot about housing and actually, you know, the wait list for subsidized public housing in Cambridge Bay, it's like over 150 families are on that list. And this is in a community of like less than 1,000 homes. I also heard about just the cost of groceries, you know, price inflation. All of us have seen it go up in the north or in the Arct, it's risen at twice the rate it has in the south of Canada. So there are some federal subsidies in place. Nutrition north, which I heard was like vastly unpopular, but I saw a box of Pampers that I could get on Amazon in Vancouver for 27 bucks selling for 51 or like a family size box of cheerios going for $18.

[Jamie Poisson]

Wow, wow, wow.

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

Yeah. So food poverty is a big issue.

[Jamie Poisson]

Could this influx of military investment, this $35 billion according to the liberals plan that they want to put into the infrastructure up in the Arctic, address some of the challenges around access to housing, transportation that you just talked about. You know, I'm thinking about this plan to turn some of these communities into like support hubs for the army, for example. Like what, what could that do?

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

There is, it's almost like a Venn diagram of sort of community needs and interests and defense needs and interests. And there is some overlap, but there's certainly not 100%. So as you pointed out. So Cambridge Bay was recently announced along with Rankin Inlet to be a northern operational support node. And this will flow some funds through defence. And the defense has been meeting with the towns, like with the mayor and council in town to sort of hear what their needs are. So I think the mayor is very hopeful that the town might actually see paved Runway hangars. We also discussed about a garage which would be dual use, that some of the garage bays would be just allocated for, for the Canadian Armed Forces for when they're here, if they have something or vehicle that needs warm in order to fix. And we would also have more garage space for our water trucks and our sewage trucks. So these are sort of humble, but I would say material for the community increases. But note that there are only two of these support nodes announced. Right. And there are 52 Inuit communities across the Inuit homeland. So in some sense this is just a drop in the bucket. And when you look at the billions that is flowing to essentially catch up our sort of stagnated and outdated missile defense and NORAD investments, I mean, a lot of that stuff won't necessarily be benefit these communities directly. So.

[Jamie Poisson]

Right. The submarines too, for example.

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

Certainly. And one interesting thing that I think southern Canadians sort of don't appreciate is that a lot of the defense infrastructure that's going into the Arctic, I mean, the Arctic is Canada's northern flank and it's North America's northern flank. And so this is really continental defense that's getting built up and upgraded across the Inuit homeland in their backyards. It's not necessarily to protect Inuit communities themselves. It's to protect like targets, populated targets or infrastructure targets in North America, in the south of Canada.

[Jamie Poisson]

In your reporting, you really do draw this direct link between this underinvestment in the Arctic, civilian infrastructure and broader threats facing the region. You wrote that, quote, the most urgent threat facing the north is not a military incursion from a foreign power. Rather, the far greater risk is from gray zone threats, covert schemes seeking to undercut Canada's strategic interests and advance foreign political or economic ambitions. And what do you mean by that exactly? Just elaborate for me.

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

I mean, I think Canada is experiencing a very nationalistic moment for many reasons that have come together at this point. Whether you look at NATO, Russia's invasion of Ukraine, and of course, the rhetoric that we're hearing from our, our southern neighbors in the States. At the same time, we Know that the Arctic, not just the Canadian Arctic, I'm talking about sort of the circumpolar Arctic, has been identified by China especially to be very strategic in the coming decades as the sea ice continues to retreat. China's very interested in those Arctic shipping lanes and of course, what minerals lie on the seabeds. And so Canada is sort of orienting to the north as well. I think when the public sees all these images of these incredible northern military exercises, we sort of implicitly get the sense that, oh, we must be preparing for an invasion. But, you know, you talk to experts and experts have testified to parliament about this. We are not at risk of a foreign invasion in the Arctic. What is happening? The term is hybrid warfare or gray zone threats. So these are actions, some of them are sort of irritants to just add friction to a country's national interests or strategic interests. Sometimes they seek to sort of undermine or embarrass a target nation. At other times they are disinformation campaigns, let's say, waged over social media to seed certain narratives, to divide a population against their government, to undermine democracies. And so what we're seeing in the north isn't a foreign invasion. We're seeing foreign influence. We're seeing foreign led cyber attacks, attempts to secure, like mining assets. CSIS has been recently testifying this past February, their concerns are around economic interference. So I guess all this to say that circa 2026, the way that countries hostile and rival states are targeting Canada isn't sort of the straight up invasion or warfare that I think people know of from our history books. It really does look different. It's more sort of this like covert scheming, 4D chess moves, as it were. And in that context, the Arctic is extremely vulnerable because the people there already experienced great socioeconomic inequity with the south of Canada. There is this big gap between the north and the south, and that gap poses a rich vein for our adversaries to exploit.

[Podcast Sponsor/Advertiser]

This episode is sponsored by zocdoc. Have you been putting off a doctor's appointment or need a dentist and you don't know where to start? We've definitely been there and that's why we use ZocDoc. Actually, over the holidays, Michael had a dental emergency and seemingly every office was closed. But we hopped onto zocdoc, found an in network dentist, had great reviews, saw real time appointments available, which was key. It was on New Year's Day and booked an appointment in just minutes. It took so much of the stress out of the Already stressful situation. Zoc Doc makes it easy to search and compare over 250,000 local in network providers across more than 200 specialties so you can find the right doctor or dentist and book instantly Taking care of your health just got easier. Download the Zoc Doc app today and book that appointment appointment on your to do list. That's Z O C D O C

[Jamie Poisson]

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[Anne Shabata Castleman]

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[Anne Shabata Castleman]

One example revolves around high speed Internet. So the north is not connected to high speed Internet. And back in 2019, Huawei, I don't know if you remember Huawei was making a move to basically roll out 4 and 5G Internet across Canada. So Huawei announced that they were partnering with a Canadian telecoms company and an Inuit development Corp to bring high speed Internet to to all of Nunavut. And of course this was incredibly welcome news for communities. I mean, you know, having fast Internet isn't just like scrolling Facebook or, or looking at YouTube. I mean, all of a sudden you can have like remote learning opportunities, remote training, you can even beam in like healthcare consults. So not having fast Internet really is a considerable hindrance for these communities. But if Huawei is partnering and putting in this hardware, the question had to be asked like, is this a security vulnerability that we're sort of building into the North? And so a couple years later, the CBC actually reported that csis, our intelligence or National Intelligence Service, had cautioned Natan Obed, the president of the itk, about how foreign interests were seeking to gain a toehold in the Inuit homeland through infrastructure investments as well as some scientific research. And then of course, finally in 2022, the feds banned Huawei, their 4G and 5G. Tonight, we intend to exclude Huawei and ZTE from our 5G network full stop.

[Government Official/Minister]

A decision put on hold for three years, largely due to China's detention of Michael Kovrig and Michael Spavor. There is a need to ensure that we prohibit the installation of their equipment and technology within the 5G network, given the potential risks they pose to national security.

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

This has never been. So it sort of became dead in the water. But what's so interesting to me is that this nevertheless left these remote communities. It was like a lose lose for them because they still didn't have high speed Internet. And actually what you see now is a lot of people, people who can afford it, have adopted Starlink, which you know, I think it was in 2023 maybe the new Yorker and the Wall Street Journal were reporting that Elon Musk, who owns Starlink, was in regular and direct contact with Vladimir Putin. So it's almost like this security vulnerability with Huawei was identified but then no one else really stepped up to deliver communities high speed Internet. And actually just this year the feds made an announcement that they are partnering with a company to deliver high speed Internet to all the communities across Nunavut.

[Government Official/Minister]

And if we want to build Canada strong, we also need to build the north strong. That means making sure people living in northern rural, remote and indigenous communities have the same opportunities as people living in the southern urban centers.

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

But it's not going to be complete until 2029. So I find this such a good example of how there are security vulnerabilities through these foreign investments. If the Canadian government and Canadian businesses aren't stepping in to fill these gaps, they can be filled in by companies whose interests might not completely align with the national interest of Canada.

[Jamie Poisson]

And I know you referenced, well, you've referenced a few times foreign investment as a concern. And I remember in like 2020, right, the, the Shandong Gold Mining, a Chinese state owned firm tried to buy this, this mine which is southwest of Cambridge Bay and the company that owned it, right. And this was actually blocked by, by the federal government. Just like another example of China kind of trying to assert soft power in the region. Fair.

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

There was definitely a period of time where China was very actively seeking to invest in own mineral and mining deposits across Greenland and in Canada. And this sort of came to a head like you in 2020 when Shandong Gold Mining, a Chinese state owned mining company was trying to secure and own this mine on the Northwest Passage. And actually I went and visited it. That was the first time that our Investment Canada act was used to block the sale to a foreign power of a mine on the grounds of national security. I mean the mine itself is like it's located in Hope Bay which is about 150 kilometers away, like just sort of south west ish of Cambridge Bay. But Cambridge Bay houses a huge north warning site as part of our NORAD missile defense so, yeah, I think probably for. There were probably a lot of reasons that the Canadian government looked at that acquisition and said, you know what, it wouldn't be strategic for us to let it pass. And in that instance, it sort of wound up being a great story because the mine was bought by Agnico Eagle, who already owns and operates two other gold mines in Nunavut. They've announced a formal partnership with National Defense to essentially share their know how of how they operate and build out infrastructure. But again, it raises the question of, well, this is still on Inuit homeland in Inuit land. You know, where does that, where does that partnership come in? Let's say if the gold mine company and National Defense are partnering up.

[Jamie Poisson]

Yeah. And is there not a clear path for that?

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

You know, in theory there is. So Trudeau and Obed started up the Inuit Crown Partnership Committee which met several times a year. And it was a way for Inuit leadership and the federal government and the PMO ministers to meet and essentially identify joint priorities.

[Inuit Leader/Natan Obed]

I want to thank the government for working constructively with Inuit. We have come a long way, whether it's in relation to housing funds, working on implementing the UN Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples legislation, but also doing the work of the partnership between Inuit and the Crown.

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

And I think over the past year or so, since Carney's become Prime Minister, the ITK has sort of seen that governance wither on the vine a little bit to the point that actually in late June of this year, at an Arctic security conference, Obed was saying, if

[Inuit Leader/Natan Obed]

the partnership with Canada is not on the table, if we are not going to be respected partners, then should we not be looking for other partners as well to uphold our interests?

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

So that sort of speaks to, I think, a regression in the relationship. In early July, the Prime Minister, Obed and Inuit leadership as well as ministers met in Kujuak. And I think they sort of ironed out some of that stuff.

[Government Official/Minister]

Dear friends, members of the Cabinet, one of the largest cabinet delegations to come to ic, I think it is the largest in Nunegat, underscores how vital this table is. Not just how vital today's meeting is, but how vital the work that we will carry forward from today's discussions, I would like to thank.

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

So it looks like the relationship's sort of back on the table and they have identified some joint priorities, namely universal food vouchers for Inuit families so they can feed and diaper their children, updating

[Government Official/Minister]

and adjusting subsidies, but truly looking and implementing a systems led approach and again, respecting the food systems Here, the harvest

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

systems here, lowering tuberculosis rates among Inuit, which are like 37 times that of non indigenous Canadians.

[Government Official/Minister]

We're backing Inuit led approaches to eliminate tuberculosis, prevent TB and to accelerate diagnosis and treatment. Again, an area, it's not the sole answer where we can leverage the resources that we're putting in elsewhere.

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

So we'll see. But I guess it's hard because there is a sense of urgency. National defense has a lot of catching up to do in terms of building out infrastructure. You know, I heard someone describe it as they're trying to build the plane while flying it. But I think it's also clear that the modus operandi of Carney's government coming out of the gate has not been to really identify deep, meaningful partnership with Inuit as a priority.

[Inuit Leader/Natan Obed]

There is still time for us to insert the human, the community element into this next wave of militarization in our homeland so that we don't repeat the mistakes of the past and we don't create undue burden in our society.

[Jamie Poisson]

We've seen this kind of level of concentration on the Arctic and big swings and militarization in the Arctic before. There were similar efforts during the Cold War. I just. What happened back then and what lessons do you think that the current federal government could glean from it?

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

Gosh, I mean, you know, someone who is Inuit in community could of course speak to this so much better. What I heard is that, you know, the Cold War era of defense build out across the Arctic was really imposed on Inuit in their homelands. So actually a lot of the runways in Inuit communities were built by Americans in the Cold War era. The, the DEW line, the distant early warning system that was built post Second World War to warn of incoming Russian missiles, was built within two years, mostly by American contractors. So it was very colonial. And the DEW line essentially became obsolete as the missile technology improved. And so a lot of these sites were just abandoned. And in fact, they posed huge environmental hazards as they leached like oils, heavy metals. There was garbage on the land. And so the environmental remediation that the government had to do to clean it up, it was the largest environmental remediation the government of Canada had ever undertaken at that point in history. So all this to say, I think it left behind a bit of a toxic basic legacy, certainly in the homeland. And I mean, what I heard from Inuit is it can't be like that this time. You know, as our homeland is being militarized, history cannot repeat itself. And perhaps sort of the most extreme and dehumanizing example of that is the relocation of Inuit into the high Arctic. So Greece Fjord and Resolute Bay, where there were no Inuit communities. And the Canadian government relocated Inuit from northern Quebec, thousands of kilometers away from their homes, and sort of left them with cloth tents lined with newspapers in these remote, remote areas simply to assert Canadian sovereignty on the land because they were worried about Greenland vying for that territory. So, again, I think history is very instructive at the end of the day. You know, you can't secure the Arctic if the communities themselves, who give us Canadian sovereignty. I mean, we don't have sovereignty over the Arctic because we have a north warning system there or, you know, like some troops in Yellowknife. We have sovereignty over the Arctic because of the people who live there and who's. Yes, you know, it's been their homeland for millennia. And if we're not listening and if Canada is unable to partner and really work with the people whose land it is to build it in the way that they see they need it built, what kind of lasting sovereignty do we have?

[Jamie Poisson]

Okay, that feels like a good end. And thank you so much for this. Thank you.

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

Thank you.

[Jamie Poisson]

All right, that is all for today. I'm Jamie Poisson. Thanks so much for listening. Talk to you tomorrow.

[Anne Shabata Castleman]

Foreign. For more cbc podcasts, go to cbc ca podcasts.