The Money Management Holy Trinity

Summary

Episode Summary: The Money Management Holy Trinity

Frugal Friends Podcast - Episode 460
Release Date: November 19, 2024
Hosts: Jen Smith & Jill Sirianni
Platform: iHeartPodcasts

In the episode titled "The Money Management Holy Trinity," hosts Jen Smith and Jill Sirianni simplify personal finance by focusing on three fundamental pillars: earning, spending, and saving. Aimed at listeners striving to gain control over their finances, reduce debt, and achieve financial independence, this episode breaks down each component with actionable insights and relatable anecdotes.

---

Introduction to the Holy Trinity ([03:05] - [05:55])

Jen and Jill kick off the episode by addressing the overwhelming nature of personal finance advice available through various mediums. They propose a simplified approach, concentrating on three essential areas each month to ensure financial well-being without feeling swamped by information.

Jen:
"If you focus on just three things once a month, no caveats, no exceptions, you will be okay. You'll be more than okay."
([03:06])

---

1. Earning: Building a Solid Foundation ([05:55] - [16:10])

Earning is emphasized as the cornerstone of financial health. Jen and Jill discuss the importance of ensuring that you are accurately compensated and fully utilizing your benefits.

Key Points:

• Verify Compensation: Confirm you are receiving the pay and benefits promised by your employer.
• Maximize Benefits: Utilize all available benefits to enhance your overall compensation package.
• Seek Growth Opportunities: Regularly assess your earning potential, consider asking for raises, or explore new job opportunities to increase your income.

Jill:
"I didn't really understand much about money because I didn't have any money to learn with. But once you start making more than you spend, you can begin to build on that foundation."
([10:30])

Jen:
"Am I getting every cent I was promised by the person who employs me? Are they paying me the right amount?"
([12:11])

---

2. Spending: Aligning with Personal Values ([23:20] - [31:19])

Spending is the second pillar, focusing on how to manage daily and monthly expenditures in ways that reflect your personal values and priorities.

Key Points:

• Values-Based Spending: Identify what truly matters to you and ensure your spending aligns with those values.
• Major Expense Categories: Focus on significant areas like housing, transportation, and food to find opportunities for savings.
• Impulse Spending Reduction: By aligning spending with values, reduce unnecessary and impulsive purchases.

Jen:
"Finding what you value coincides with this aspect of it, identifying what is actually important to me, where do I want my money to be going rather than what's being told to me about where my money should be going."
([31:19])

Jill:
"When we align our spending with our values, our transactions have less guilt and shame associated with them."
([27:57])

---

3. Saving: Securing the Future ([31:19] - [45:04])

The final pillar, saving, is about setting aside money for emergencies, short-term goals, and long-term objectives like retirement. Jen and Jill advocate for automating savings to ensure consistency.

Key Points:

• Emergency Fund: Prioritize saving for unexpected expenses to avoid financial crises.
• Short-Term Goals: Allocate funds for upcoming goals such as vacations, new appliances, or educational pursuits.
• Retirement Savings: Start saving early, even small amounts, to take advantage of compound interest over time.

Jill:
"It’s impossible to know how much you’re going to need in retirement, so start by aiming for your first $100,000 invested. Once you reach that milestone, compound interest starts to work in your favor."
([43:10])

Jen:
"We have to be investing for retirement and put it on autopilot even if it's not maxing out your Roth IRA, start putting something towards it. Even $10."
([43:10])

---

Monthly Action Steps ([45:04] - [55:38])

To implement the Holy Trinity effectively, Jen and Jill outline actionable monthly steps:

1. Review Income:

   • Ensure all earnings are accurate.
   • Seek opportunities to increase income through raises or new job prospects.

2. Analyze Spending:

   • Conduct a 90-day transaction inventory to identify spending habits.
   • Categorize expenses and focus on reducing costs in major areas like housing, transportation, and food.

3. Automate Savings:

   • Set up automatic transfers to savings accounts for emergencies, short-term goals, and retirement.
   • Regularly monitor and adjust savings contributions as needed.

Jill:
"If you’re not currently budgeting, start with a 90-day transaction inventory to identify those habits."
([32:05])

Jen:
"Making one good housing decision can save us hundreds of thousands of dollars over decades."
([31:19])

---

Personal Anecdotes and Real-Life Examples ([35:35] - [45:04])

Jen and Jill share personal stories to illustrate the impact of mindful money management. For instance, Jen recounts a situation where a friend's hasty insurance decision resulted in unexpected costs, underscoring the importance of informed spending and saving.

Jen:
"Most of us on our own don't know the exact right answer in every situation. That's why it's important to ask a friend and get the information you need."
([35:35])

Jill:
"I have to know where the cap is. What if multiple catastrophes happen at the same time? I gotta reach that next goal."
([43:10])

---

Addressing Common Challenges ([45:04] - [55:38])

The hosts discuss common obstacles in implementing the Holy Trinity, such as defining "enough" and balancing short-term desires with long-term goals. They emphasize the significance of setting realistic and achievable financial targets to prevent feelings of deprivation.

Jill:
"I have become very good at these other aspects of managing money. This one still feels a little bit shrouded in mystery for me, so I just avoid it."
([43:10])

---

Lightning Round and Community Engagement ([52:00] - [60:46])

Towards the end of the episode, Jen and Jill engage in a lightning round, discussing personal vulnerabilities related to earning, spending, and saving. They also feature a "Bill of the Week" segment, where listeners share amusing or enlightening stories about their financial experiences.

Jen:
"The more we align our spending with our values, the less impulsive our spending becomes."
([45:04])

Jill:
"Saving doesn't have to feel like deprivation. It should feel like full abundance every time."
([43:10])

---

Conclusion and Takeaways ([59:24] - [61:03])

In closing, Jen and Jill reiterate the importance of regularly reviewing the Holy Trinity components to maintain financial health. They encourage listeners to adopt these simple yet effective strategies to achieve a balanced and fulfilling financial life.

Jen:
"When we know how to manage our money, spending has less guilt and shame associated with it because we can know I'm meeting my needs in XYZ ways."
([27:57])

Jill:
"Having something to look forward to keeps hope alive and motivates us to continue managing our finances effectively."
([45:04])

---

Notable Quotes

• Jen:
  "If you just check in with those three things every month, then you're going to be on the right track."
  ([03:40])

• Jill:
  "I have to know where the cap is. What if multiple catastrophes happen at the same time? I gotta reach that next goal."
  ([43:10])

• Jen:
  "Aligning our spending with our values reduces impulse spending because we're meeting our direct needs."
  ([27:57])

---

Final Thoughts

"The Money Management Holy Trinity" offers a streamlined and effective approach to personal finance. By focusing on earning, spending, and saving, Jen and Jill provide listeners with a clear roadmap to financial independence and stability. Their practical advice, combined with personal stories, makes complex financial concepts accessible and engaging, empowering listeners to take control of their financial futures.

For those eager to delve deeper, Jen and Jill promote their book "Buy What You Love Without Going Broke", which expands on the principles discussed in the episode and offers additional strategies for financial management.

---

Disclaimer: This summary excludes advertisements, promos, and segments not directly related to the main content of the episode, focusing solely on Jen and Jill's discussion on money management.

Transcript

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[Jen and Jill]

My name is Jill.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

And today we are talking about really money simplicity. There are countless articles, podcasts, YouTube videos that talk about so many aspects of personal finance it is overwhelming. But I promise you, I guarantee you, if you focus on just three things once a month, no caveats, no exceptions, you will be okay. You'll be more than okay.

[Jen and Jill]

Yeah, I love it when we can simplify something down to its basics to really help us understand something. And that's essentially what this is. But first, this episode is brought to you by Frugal Friends fans. That's right. This one is brought to you by you. We're talking straight to all the super fans, the real ones, the true gems you've written, your podcast reviews, you've called in a bill of the week, maybe multiple. You're singing about living your life in your sleep because the tune is so dang catchy.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Not sorry.

[Jen and Jill]

We both need and want you. As you know, we're launching our book buy what you love without going broke. You can get it@buywhatyou lovebook.com and we need amazing people like you to start spreading the word. We're formulating a street team of people who believe in the Frugal friends message to help tell others about the book. So if you're out there bringing this show, binging this show, not just bringing it, binging it, responding to every friend letter poll. This one's for you. Join our street team, Jen.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Tell them how to it is in the friend letter. So this releases on a Tuesday if you're already on the friend letter, because we know the real ones are subscribed to the friend letter. So look at your friend letter from yesterday, the one that got sent on the 18th, or if you're listening to it later, you can check the 18th, 20th, 22nd is going to be in there and apply. And we will look through these applications. It is not a. It's like five questions. It's just a filter. Apply and then we will announce after Thanksgiving our street team. And it's not going to be a lot of work. We know this is happening around the holidays. This is truly just a way to give you some extra goodies, some extra praise for all your support and then while also asking for a review of the book on some kind of, you know, web platform, whether you bought it on Amazon Bookshop or on Goodreads. So that's really the purpose of the street team. It's not a lot of heavy lifting, but it is something that we're calling on our biggest fans to participate in and we will reward you in kind.

[Jen and Jill]

Yes, love rewards.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Let's talk about the money management holy trinity. And we, you know, we love talking about simplifying money management. We've got episode 352, how to simplify. And then we also got 350 or 346, how to put Good Money decisions on autopilot. We love to think about money as little as possible, honestly, that is our goal, is to think about this as little as possible.

[Jen and Jill]

Yeah, to put as much as we can on autopilot, to not have it take up so much mental or emotional space while also feeling really confident about it. And I think when we can simplify it and when we can have a really solid understanding of it, those things then become possible. So I think part of that is what's the foundation? How do we get the foundation of money management? And it's this, it's these three things. So let's talk about it.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

And because so we, if you've been, if you're an og, if you've been with us, you know, we, the format that we lead Frugal Friends with is we'll do Google something on the Internet and then we'll come back with what Google says and we'll parse out what's real and what's not. Because so many publications write for the algorithm to please Google to rank higher. So it's a lot of fluff. It's a lot of things that may be peripherally true, but not true in reality. And so that has always been our goal is to take what you might see on the Internet and give real life, real world response to it. And because of this, it's very hard to find, honestly. Personal finance can be summed up into a very short article, but that wouldn't rank well in Google search results. So you're not going to be able to find it. That's why you see so many 2000, 3000, 5000 word, you know, mini books almost on personal finance. And so, and there is a lot to be said into diving into the nuance. Right. But we want to give this really overall primer and there was not a good article for it. And that's why we are going to use our own lived experience and almost a decade in personal finance to give that to you via podcast.

[Jen and Jill]

To be fair, you will find a lot of articles that list out these three things. Like, we're not making this up. This is the most simple, the three basics of money management. If you were to look that up, you're going to find what we're about.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

To say, but you're also going to find a lot of other things too. That kind of cloud what the core of it is.

[Jen and Jill]

Yeah.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

So we will. Let's not bury the lead. Let's give you the holy Trinity and what we think that is is earning, spending and saving.

[Jen and Jill]

There it is.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

If you check in with those three things, no exceptions, no caveats, and I know some of you are like, what about, don't worry, we'll get to it. There are no exceptions. This is it. If you just check in with those three things every month, then you're going to be on the right track. You won't have to second guess yourself and you'll know more. The more you check in, the better the questions you'll be asking are. And so you'll know which direction to go to learn more and it won't feel so overwhelming. So let's start with our, with our deity at the top of the triangle, earning. So this is so making money earning, this is as important as how you spend it and how you save it. None of these are more important than the other. I think in frugality, I know in frugality we get very caught up in the saving and we think a lot of us will be like, well, I can't earn more, so I have to save more. And in seasons that can be true. And that's why we've written a whole book about it. There is so much to be said and there are so many books on how to earn more money, you know, so there's a lot to be said to it. But I think it can be intimidating to think about earning if you are in a job where you believe that there isn't a lot of earning potential. So we want to go over some of the things that can make this a really feasible monthly check in.

[Jen and Jill]

Yeah, I think one of the things that I did come across in looking at articles for this was it's not just enough to make enough. You do need to make more than what you spend now, that's not to say that we can't look at our spending and decrease and learn what is enough and hedge against lifestyle inflation. But this is a really important place to begin. And I think one of the things, I've probably talked about this over the years in our podcasting career, how I didn't really understand much about money because I didn't have any money to learn with. And I think that could be the case for a lot of us, is we didn't have anything to even practice with. And so that comes down to earning enough to even be able to learn these other tenants. While no one is necessarily more important than the others, I do think that saving and spending is built upon the earning. So that is, if you're going to start somewhere, that is the place. And so I think when we're looking at this aspect of money management, it is important to check in on how much are we taking home, not just our gross salaries, but what's actually coming home with us at the end of the day, and what is that affording for us? Is it enough? And meaning, is it more than what we spend? And if not, of course, there's different things. We can look at both our spending and our earning, but sometimes it's worth identifying. Could I be making more? Is there room to increase here?

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Yeah, and I think this is the first thing we do because we want to make sure. Am I getting every cent I was promised by the person who employed or the company that employs me? Are they paying me the right amount? Am I getting all the benefits I was promised? Am I using the benefits to their full ability? Because that is compensation. So making sure that we are utilizing all of those benefits and that we're not being taken advantage of, whether intentionally or accidentally. So that is just a baseline to make sure that you are where you are supposed to be. And then we want to start thinking about moving forward, making progress, increasing our income. At minimum, we want to make sure that we are at an employer that is giving a cost of living increase every year. And if they are not, and pay grade, and if they are not, then it could be time to look for another company. And I think it's always time to be looking for what else is out there. But it is, it is truly in with the profit margins that companies are making at this point. It is unethical for people not to be giving at least a cost of living if it is a small business. Obviously, that's a, that's a different story if you're, you know, vested in that business, but making sure that there's some way that what you are making is increasing with inflation and taking that into account and then thinking about more raises. And before I go into that, I want to like, just set the foundation is I think we need to have a what is enough conversation and also what are our goals. So first we have to know, like, what is enough? What do I really need to be making to feel like I'm living comfortably and not just an arbitrary number. Like we're going to have like a baseline number and a dream number. But we can't all just say like, oh, the study shows I need half a million dollars a year to be happy. So that's my number. What do you really need to be comfortable? And then think about like, okay, I would love to add, you know, baseball. Like, I'd love to pay for my, all my kids to do baseball. And that costs this per year. And I'd love to be able to take a vacation to Hawaii. And so with flights and hotels, it's going to cost, you know, this. And so like, do some dreaming and then add that to that. Enough. And like, that is your total, your next enough goal. I would say that you have to decide what is enough or nothing is ever going to be enough. And money is always going to feel like this despair that there's never enough of. And so you may not be able to easily get to your enough. Right. But we need to at least set a baseline so that there's more freedom and there's more sense of accomplishment and not so much despair for not being at this arbitrary, like, you know, six figure, quarter million, half million, wherever you know your next dream is.

[Jen and Jill]

On the flip side, you could find yourself in a position where you want to figure out, how can I make it work with earning maybe a little less. Maybe you are in a position or a career that is not. You're not loving anymore, you're burnt out, or you want to make a career shift and it's going to require you to back down for a time. Or there's a life situation requiring more job flexibility, which means earning less. And so that can also be a part of this earning conversation of, what if I want to earn less? What could that look like for me? And that's going to then inform these other two categories as well.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Yeah. And so when we're thinking about moving forward the monthly checkup part, we should always be doing a monthly checkup to make sure that we are on track to honestly earn in our full potential. Our goal is never to earn as much as possible. But like to see. We talk about Maslow's hierarchy of needs in our book buy what you love without going broke. And we talk about it in the context of spending. We want to spend on our basic needs and our higher needs. Right. But we also like our higher needs really are fulfilled in things like work. Fulfilling work is one of these values that we value so highly in our society. I want to feel like I am living in my full potential, right? I am doing work that maybe I'm not passionate about, you know, what I'm building, but I am passionate about the creativity and the problem solving and working in my strengths. Like that is what I get to do. And so that's what we want to work towards. So every month we should take an inventory of any progress that we've made in becoming better at our job, any achievements we've made for our company, especially if we are able to make them more money or save them money in any way. Just want to take like a real quick inventory of anything that could be useful. If you are going to a different company or going for a raise within your company and you want to make sure your resume is updated so that you can send it to people. If you meet somebody in that month that you want to be able to send your resume to, you want to keep it updated, don't apply for jobs. I think that's a waste of time, honestly. I think your best bet to getting really meaningful pay raises and job increases is who you know. It's not what you know. It is truly who you know. And so continuing to make new contacts in your industry or if you're not, if you are not in an industry you want to be in, making contacts in the industry you want to be in. And so that you can not just build those relationships, but also pass on a resume and just keep planting seeds. That's really what we are doing in this earning conversation every month. We are continuing to plant seeds so we can get closer to the income and the work that we want to be doing long term.

[Jen and Jill]

Not to say that you have to be looking for new work every month. This is. It's more of just as you're looking at your money management, this is going to be a factor you're taking into consideration. And then as it makes sense, you're doing that.

[Alicia Keys]

Hey, it's Alicia. When people tell me, wow, you have such beautiful skin, for a second I.

[Jen and Jill]

Say, who are you talking to?

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Because I never did.

[Alicia Keys]

Key Soul care is a holistic beauty.

[Jen and Jill]

And skincare line I created working with a leading dermatologist. I'm so proud of these product offerings.

[Alicia Keys]

Because they're all about caring for the whole self inside and out. Nourish your skin, nurture your soul.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Try clinically proven Skincare from Alicia Keys with 25% off your first purchase at keyssoulcare.com using code GLOW on air, M.

[Alicia Keys]

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[Jen and Jill]

Second part of money money management is spending. We could also call this how we manage money, but essentially we're spending it in a variety of ways and looking at where is it going, how are we spending it, what is really great about our spending habits and what might need to be shifted about our spending habits. This is the part that we are in the nitty gritty. On a more monthly basis I would say that the earning is we're looking at this kind of maybe yearly, possibly quarterly. The saving that Jen will get to that is hopefully mostly on autopilot. But the spending, the managing our money, this is daily and we should be looking at it weekly and monthly as well. And of course one of the biggest things attached to spending is finding what you value. And we've got a whole podcast and a whole bug about values based spending. If you want to know more about that, buy what you love book. Com and literally any other podcast episode that we've put out up until now. But this really is when we're talking about the foundations of money management. Finding what you value coincides with this aspect of it, identifying what is actually important to me, where do I want my money to be going rather than what's being told to me about where my money should be going and in what ways can I meet my values in ways that don't cost me money? Or is it possible that I'm spending to achieve or meet some need and I don't actually have to be spending? And that money could be going elsewhere. I could be spending it on more important things, or I could be utilizing it to invest for my future. So that's a big component of that. And so I think that can create opportunities for us to actually then spend our time on what matters. I know we talk about the four Fs a lot on the podcast, as well as in the Book of Faith, Family, friends, fulfilling work. These are the things that are most important to us. And so as it coincides with our spending habits, we can be looking at what is important to me within each of these categories. How can I get more of that and then fill in the gaps with what have I earned this month and where can that money be going? Of course, to our basic needs of housing and food and transportation and paying our bills. But then identifying where else can we be putting this money and in what ways do I not need to be spending it on some of these things? Can I just be getting faith, family, friends, and fulfilling work out of. Yeah. Not spending money.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Yeah. I mean, that's kind of one of those creative ways to get more fulfilling work is networking and giving your resume to people. And you don't have to go directly to getting a PhD or taking continuing education classes. Those things are also good. But we want to look at the freeways first. And so how do we get more of what matters most to us? And if we focus on that and get creative there, then it's more of like a trickle up, almost like we're utilizing the creativity to find the freeways and then the low cost ways. I know, like I love to have, you know, wine or cocktail nights with friends at my house or just like sharing a meal together. Obviously that isn't free, but it is super low cost. Right. So, you know, then when we can fill our cup in free and low cost ways, we find ourselves impulse spending less because we're meeting our direct needs, not these peripheral trying to meet needs in a peripheral way that don't ever 100% fulfill the needs. So we always feel like we're not 100% there. Right. And so we just spend more and more to try and get there, but the direction is in the wrong way. So we just got to reorient ourselves to the correct way. And that way we can manage the outflow of everything more accurately. Like, so Jill's friend is here today, and I told her what we were doing. Like the episode, you know, the holy trinity of money management is earning, spending, and savings. She's like, what about giving? I was like, that's spending. That's how you spend your money. You choose to spend your money in a way that aligns with your values, and that includes giving.

[Jen and Jill]

So generosity is not left out. And that's why we say anything that we do with money can fall under one of these categories of earning, spending, or saving. And I think specifically when we can really hone in on this one of spending and feel really confident about it, we can feel really confident about all these other areas too. Again, because it's the area that we are interacting with the most. And when we can feel really, really good about how we're making decisions around money, our spending has less guilt and shame associated with it because we can know I'm meeting my needs in XYZ ways. And actually I do have the money set aside for this vacation that I want to go on. And I know how much I'm able to set aside for my savings and investing goals. And that's why it can be a thing that doesn't take up a ton of our time, energy and attention. Because when we really know what our values are and we're able to align our spending with that, then we're more confident. Like you said, we're impulse spending less. We need to be in our transactions less because we have this sense of knowing where things are going, how we are spending all of our resources in better ways. When it comes to spending, too, we've also got some other simple things attached to this of spending where it counts, right? We've talked about the big three of housing, transportation, and food. This is the majority of where our spending goes. Of course, there's all sorts of ancillary places that we spend on, but this is what's going to take up the majority of our spending and the majority of our money. And when it comes to managing it well, making wise decisions in these three categories can make the biggest difference for us. So making one good housing decision decision can save us hundreds of thousands of dollars over decades. Making one good car choice or other transportation choice could save you hundreds, if not thousands of dollars over your lifetime. And so these are those specific decisions we really want to highlight as make good decisions there because it could make other decisions easier or unnecessary. And then food. And so similar to this holy trinity of earning, spending, saving and having spending be where the majority of our attention goes to. Same thing with food. Amongst housing, transportation and food, we make food decisions regularly, daily, if not hourly, if you're Jen or I. And so this is, this is an area where we can give a good amount of attention to identifying the ways that we can make our food costs reasonable for us. That doesn't mean that we can't go out, we can't get the takeout, we can't buy the coffee at the coffee shop, but making sure that we feel really good about these food decisions because that is a huge category with the biggest opportunity for variations in what we spend week to week, month to month. So yes, it's important to make good housing and transportation decisions. But if we're looking to do something right here, right now, looking at food is going to be a really big heavy hitter.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Yeah. So let's talk about monthly action steps you can do for this. Obviously, if you're already budgeting, you want to look at your past month spending and you want to see, okay, what are the habits that I am maybe not conscious of or the places where I didn't plan well and that caused me to impulse spend, et cetera. I, for, for me, I found that I was eating out a lot because I wasn't planning my meals well enough, specifically my snacks because I'm like a small meal eater so I'll, I'll forget and, and I get really like focused on what I'm doing and I'll forget to eat and then I'll just go all day without eating and then I'm too hungry to cook and I eat out.

[Jen and Jill]

Yeah.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

So once I started planning my eating throughout the day more thoroughly, I eat out far less. And that was something like I had to take a look at. Okay, why, why did I, why is my eating out progressively increasing? What does my day look like and give conscious thought to it. If you are not currently budgeting, then you may want to start with a 90 day transaction inventory where you can look over the past 90 days of your transactions so that you can identify those habits. And then also just like we're looking at our income to make sure our income is accurate, we want to look at our expenses to make sure our expenses are accurate. Nobody has stolen our credit card number and is, you know, doing weird things with it that any subscriptions that we have canceled actually got canceled or that we're not using are, you know, not being charged. So we want to make sure our expenses are accurate. And then we look at those heavy hitters and in frugality we talk a lot about quote unquote saving money. And for us we want to separate that word save. It's usually used in two different. Like we save money for retirement but we also save money on groceries. Those are two different things. For us this is spending less on groceries. So that falls into this category. We. So we also want to be looking at the ways that we can spend less on big things. So if you're looking at your budget, maybe you sort your expenses from highest to lowest and we start with our highest and saying like, okay, what are ways that I can lower this mortgage payment? Did I buy a house when interest rates were 7%? Maybe they're going down now and I'm keeping an eye out on when I can. Refinance is my, you know, transportation, you know, how can I lower it? Maybe not in a refinance right now, but just thinking about all of that stuff. So. And I will tell you a quick story that just happened yesterday. A transportation saving story. And so my sister in law, her car got flooded in Milton, but it still worked. It wasn't. It just got onto the floor and. But it still ran. And she decided to submit a claim to her insurance and total it. And what it did was it cost her in total. Between the loan and stuff, she was out 14 grand. In reality, like if you looked at it, even if something had eventually gone wrong with the wiring or something, would it have cost 14 grand to fix it? I mean even if you had to do a total like rebuild on everything, you're looking at half that.

[Jen and Jill]

Yeah.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Right. So she essentially lost that by choosing.

[Jen and Jill]

That to total it. Yeah.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

And I'm like not here to talk about insurance. Insurance is like not my thing. But yeah, like that was a decision that, that was one decision not thought out or not consulted like fully with anybody that she just made on a whim that cost her $14,000.

[Jen and Jill]

And most of us on our own don't know the exact right answer in every situation. I think that's why we highlight communities so much when it comes to these things of it is good to be able to talk with other friends and hear other professionals and even experts opinions on these things. Because like you're highlighting it's not just about a car buying decision, one car buying decision, but there could be transportation decisions that we make even in the midst of that, in between car purchases, like what you're describing. And it's important to make really judicious ones that could, you know, cost less than in the long run. And that's no shade on her. I mean, I don't know that I could have, especially in a crisis mode, thought through exactly what's right to do here. But I think that the call there is ask a friend and be getting the information that you need. Take a pause. Usually nothing is as urgent as it seems in the moment. Create that pause and give yourself the opportunity to make these wise decisions.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Yeah, because maybe she did do the right thing and we just don't know anything about insurance. That could also be the truth. Right. You know, but asking people, like creating new friends, new relationships, new people in your network who you can feel safe, like asking questions to. And so the very last part on our holy Trinity is saving. And so that includes anywhere that you would put money away for anything. So that's your emergency fund, your short term goals, like vacations, a new car, a new water heater, whatever, a new home and then retirement. And I believe that it is in that order because there is an instant gratification thing in our mind. Right. Which makes it so hard to save because saving is so future. We money nowadays is not really tangible. It comes in and it goes out. But when you buy something, that thing is there, that thing is tangible. Right. And so we have to know that and kind of honor that part of our head while also trying to almost fight against it. But we don't want to shame ourselves for having that instinct. So your savings goals should start very immediate and then get bigger. So that's why first we do emergency fund because that is going to be money that we use in cases of emergencies. Emergencies only. So job loss, your house is, you know, two hurricanes hit it and you need to like fix it up real quick between hurricanes. Yeah. And then we've got our short term goals. So like what are the things that we need to start saving for so that when it does break or something happens, we're not in crisis mode. So limiting our emergency. And then we go to fun stuff like a vacation, like the fun that you deserve having fun in your life right now because tomorrow isn't promised. So whether that's saving up for a pet or a vacation or whatever, like really makes you come alive is saving up for like some big things like that. And then it's not that we have to finish all these before we start saving for retirement, but I think they should take priority to saving for retirement because they they cater to that fight or flight mode that we have. There's more incentive to actually get over the barrier and save. And then we, we do retirement. So 401k or Roth IRA, you just put it on autopilot, whatever. You can put it on autopilot and every couple months try. And this is so your monthly check in would be to make sure I've got my emergency fund, I've got my savings goals on autopilot, I've got my retirement on autopilot. And that the money you're putting into your ira, if you're doing a Roth or traditional ira, is actually going into investments and not just into the cash account that's in there. So these are the things that you're going to do to save for yourself and your family for the future.

[Jen and Jill]

This is another category where I think that defining your enough is really important. And I'm speaking from personal experience and talking to myself here. One of the things I struggle with in this category is identifying what's enough for my emergency fund and my short term goals before I do get to that retirement piece. Because I agree, I think it's important that we have something to look forward to both in the short term and the long term, and that includes how it intersects with money. But I think in all of life it's really important to have something on the horizon, something that holds hope for you. Most of us need that to kind of keep moving forward. And that's what we're describing here with some of these short term goals that it's going to feel really like deprivation if we don't focus on having any sort of fun or vacations or just little gifts to ourselves and only focus on investing for retirement. However, we do have to keep the pulse on what's going to be enough here. Because for me, my emergency fund, how I defined enough for my emergency fund, has changed over time. And part of that has been because my earning has shifted and lifestyle has shifted a bit, right? I'm in a house now, I don't live in a vehicle anymore. And so needing to put more money aside for housing stuff is necessary. I'm getting older, I'm seeing the doctor more often, needing to have money for that. But truly, but still, I have to know where the cap is. I found myself getting in this place of, okay, yep, I've reached that number. But what if this catastrophe and that catastrophe happens at the same time? Okay, I gotta reach that next goal. And then, okay, I want a sinking fund for a car and the holidays and some Vacations and for generosity. And I could keep adding to that list. I could keep identifying and a pool and a new roof and another vacation and just keep pushing off retirement. In part because I want my life to look good now. And in part I'm just going to call it out friends, because investing scares me. I feel like I still don't even understand it to the degree that I would like to and so I avoid it. I have become very good at these other aspects of managing money. This one still feels a little bit shrouded in mystery for me. So I just avoid it. And I think this is the call to say we still have to identify are enough and say this is how I'm going to define it for at least the next year. And we have to be investing for retirement and we have to be putting it on autopilot even if it's not maxing out your Roth IRA, start putting.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Something towards it, I mean even $10. So I like wrote an investing course which if you buy two copies of the book, you can get for free. And I start out with if you've got $10 a month, how you should start there and how you can increase to get to a hundred thousand invested I think in like 5, 10 years. Same if you have a hundred dollars, how to increase that to get there in five or 10 years and then you know, and so on. So it just depends on the pace you want. It's really that first hundred thousand. So honestly it is impossible to know how much you're going to need in retirement. And that's what makes it so impossible to know what to save every month. Right. So the trick is once you get to 100,000 it becomes like you can do anything, right? It's just that first hundred thousand you don't need to know how much you need in retirement, you just need to make it. A goal is to get to $100,000 invested. That's it. So if you can see that goalpost somewhere, you're going to be on a great track because after that compound interest starts to do the work for you. And really it is all you doing the work up to 100,000. And so that's why we say start earlier even with a little bit so you can get to that 100k number. You don't, you, you define what your enough is. But like also you don't have to know specifically what enough is. It can just be a number. It's just so that you feel some confidence in your saving and that you limit those short term goals. Just enough to have some retirement savings on top without feeling like those retirement savings are leading to deprivation or causing deprivation.

[Jen and Jill]

Do you know what I feel really confident about and I feel like is the opposite of deprivation? It is full abundance every time.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

And you're living in your power and your glory in it.

[Jen and Jill]

The bill of the week.

[Alicia Keys]

This is the bill of the week. That's right.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

It's time for the best minute of your entire week. Maybe a baby was born and his name is William.

[Alicia Keys]

Maybe you paid off your mortgage.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Maybe your car died and you're happy to not have to pay that bill anymore. Duck bills, Buffalo bills, Bill Clinton.

[Alicia Keys]

This is the bill of the week.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Hi, Jen and Jill. This is Jana from Indiana. I'm a longtime listener and a first time caller. My bill of the week is actually two bills. One from the past and one from the future. Let me explain. I had my daughter while I was in the military and through the military, everything should have been free. I was surprised when they said I couldn't leave with my baby until I saw the cashier. I owed $8 for eating too much food while in the hospital with her and I was happy to pay that bill. 21 years later, we are celebrating her birthday and we will go out for food and lots of drinks to celebrate. And I am happy to pay that bill as well. Thanks. Love the show. Oh, my gosh, Jana, that hospital is rude.

[Jen and Jill]

$8. They couldn't.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Until you see the cashier at the.

[Jen and Jill]

Hospital, you can't leave with your baby.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

$8.

[Jen and Jill]

You ate too much.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Ate too much. Really? You just had a baby.

[Jen and Jill]

Talk about shaming you.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

I know.

[Jen and Jill]

Wow. But this is very funny. And I love the tie in that on her birthday you owed money for food and Here you are 21 years later celebrating her 21st birthday and paying for food. Talk about full circle. And each time being okay with it. Because you know what? We are okay with paying for food.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

We are okay if the food is good.

[Jen and Jill]

Yes. Well, thanks so much, Jana, for that lovely bill and happy birthday to your daughter. If you all are like listening and you want to submit a bill, if it has to do with past, present, future, if it has to do with paying for food, if it has to do with a rude hospital or your name is Bill. Frugalfriendspodcast.com Bill, we can't wait to hear it.

[Alicia Keys]

Hey, it's Alicia. When people tell me, wow, you have such beautiful skin, for a second I.

[Jen and Jill]

Say, who are you talking to?

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Because I never did.

[Alicia Keys]

Key Soul care is a holistic beauty.

[Jen and Jill]

And skincare line I created working with a leading dermatologist. I'm so proud of these product offerings.

[Alicia Keys]

Because they're all about caring for the whole self inside and out. Nourish your skin, Nurture your soul.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Try clinically proven skin care From Alicia.

[Alicia Keys]

Keys with 25 off your first purchase.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

At keyssoulcare.com Using code GLOW on air.

[Alicia Keys]

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[Jen and Jill]

And now it's time for the lightning round.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Well, here we go. It's the vulnerability round. Let's dive in. Which one of the three do you find most challenging to embrace?

[Jen and Jill]

Lol.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Lol.

[Jen and Jill]

I was first gonna say investing and then I was like, nope, wrong. It's earning. Is it earning for both of us?

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Yeah, it is a foundational piece. I mean, I don't know if it's okay. So part of it is just integrity of I could not do something for money that it is outside of what I believe is like best for everyone. I don't. It's. I being in the Internet marketing space for like literally like eight years. It has been wild. I've tried everything and except for the scams.

[Jen and Jill]

We haven't tried scams.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

I haven't tried scams.

[Jen and Jill]

That could be where the money is.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

It is where the money is and I just can't do it. But no, even like ethical things that other people can do, like really, really well. Like I just have a moral. I. This sounds like I'm like, oh, I'm altruistic. No, it's okay. This is why it's been so easy to market the book and sell people a $25 book is because I have never felt more passionate about anything I've ever done in my life. Even more so than my children. But I'm not trying to sell my children. So there we go. I am so passionate about what is in this book, how it can change lives. I have no problem marketing this book.

[Jen and Jill]

Agreed. I feel good about the book too, because I do feel like it's actually helpful. We put our heart and soul and minds and wisdom into it. It's fun, it's helpful. Yes. I do think it'd be a good investment for anybody. But sometimes it's like, yeah, you could pay for this, but you can also learn this information for free. You know, it's why I have a hard time selling our podcast or making people pay for content. Like, what's in the podcast. It's just like, no, because we want you to have it.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Right. So the book. Yeah. And which is why I've never felt confident selling anything else. And which is why we're so thankful you listen to the ads in the show because it allows us to give you the content for free, which we believe it should be free. And we definitely believe the content in the book is not stuff that can be Googled.

[Jen and Jill]

Yeah.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

And it is absolutely worth 25 and is the way we will pay our bills.

[Jen and Jill]

But whether or not we earn money off of it is yet to be determined.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

And so that's why, like, writing a book is the worst possible way to pick to earn money, because it just doesn't make a lot of. As well as podcasting. And here we are.

[Jen and Jill]

Here we are. And I think that, I mean, I agree, too. In my own experience as well, I have picked career paths and professions that don't pay much. And especially in my 20s, I was just like, who cares about money? And I'm starting to realize, yeah, but there's also going to come a time when my earning potential maybe diminishes because of life events or my own health. Who knows? It's like, it is important to be able to earn money, but I just haven't ever really prioritized it. And I am grateful in many ways for that. But then in other ways, I think I kind of have of cut off my feet in that. What's the saying, like, shot myself in the foot?

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

I don't know what you're saying. Actually.

[Jen and Jill]

I don't think you cut off your feet in really leaning into. I would rather do these things. I prioritize flexibility. I prioritize professions and helping people. That doesn't necessarily pay me back. And I'm not complaining about that by any means. I've made choices in that it has been fulfilling and purposeful in many ways, but it's what contributes to me not really knowing, like, how to earn. You know, I know how to volunteer. I know how to give away stuff. I know how to be helpful.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

We very much move towards what feels good and what feels of service.

[Jen and Jill]

Yeah.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

And I think, like, that's similar.

[Jen and Jill]

We just need to be trad wives, Jen.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

I mean we really did make the wrong choice. Mary rich or Mary capable. We've got some great, great husbands, but I just think we weren't thinking ahead enough. So, you know, and two kids are expensive, man. But, but so yeah. And I think also us growing up middle class and not having like, like you had the feast or famine of an entrepreneurial parent and I had very like rigid inside the rules, you know, W2 parents. And so that very much like impacts how we view earning today. And even with all I've learned, it has really taken this podcast and this book and finding that like the sense of living into my full potential and this is what I want to be doing all the time for the foreseeable future to really decide, you know, this is how I want to earn money and really dive into it. So thank you for listening. If you want to support the show and you want the show to continue to be free and all of that, please pre order the book. Buy what you love dot com. Not because we need it or we're desperate, but because we truly believe in it. We think it will help you and your community. So thank you for listening. It also supports us if you leave a rating and review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify like this one from Noreen 811. Motivating and fun, Jen and Jill. Thank you, Jen and Jill, for keeping me motivated while I tackle endless DIY projects around the house. Sames. Listening to your episodes helps me remember why I'm putting in the sweat equity to fix up our home. Thanks to Frugal Friends, I've saved money, I've avoided excessive spending, and I'm earning more interest on my savings. I love that the episodes come out frequently and they are all interesting and fun to listen to even if the topic isn't directly relevant to my life. Highly recommend.

[Jen and Jill]

Oh, thanks so much Noreen811. That's such a kind, helpful review. If you all listening have not given us a review yet and you have something that you want to say about the show, the way that it's resonated with you, what you find helpful, motivating, we'd love to hear that in the form of a review. Please do that. It helps us. It helps new listeners find the show. Thanks in advance.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Yeah, see you next time. Frugal Friends is produced by Eric Sirianni.

[Jen and Jill]

All right, speaking of our book, we are going to have an audiobook version of the book for all of you who would prefer to listen to us. And we have a meeting in one minute with the producer. With the producer to talk about how we're going to record this. So there you go. Pre order the book and and then get the audiobook once it comes out.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Pre order a hardcover because that's what truly helps us. And then maybe join the street team. Maybe you could just find yourself with a copy of the audiobook. I don't know.

[Jen and Jill]

Yeah, so get the friend letter. I'm sure if you're listening to this, you already are getting the friend letter. And follow that link. To be a part of the street team, apply to be a part of it. Bye. Bye.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Did you know that parents rank financial literacy as the number one most difficult life skill to teach? Meet Greenlight, the debit card and money app for families. With Greenlight, you can send money to kids instantly, set up chores, automate allowance and keep an eye on your kids spending with real time notifications. Kids learn to earn, save and spend wisely. And parents can rest easy knowing their kids are learning about money with guardrails in place. Sign up for Greenlight [e-mail] iheart hey, come on in. Small Business Saturday is right around the corner and so was that shop you've been meaning to check out on November 30th. Support your local community by shopping small on Small Business Saturday. Founded by American Express. Pick up a new outfit, a handmade gift, some vintage vinyl, maybe even some local tea.

[Jen and Jill]

Thanks so much. See you soon.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Shop on small business Saturday, November 30th. That's the powerful packing of American Express.

[Jen and Jill]

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[Dr. Laurie Santos]

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[Jen and Jill]

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[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Sit up a little straighter. It gives you a rush of confidence.

[Jen and Jill]

As soon as you're behind the wheel and a feeling of all eyes on you. That's how the crown transports you here. It's pretty awesome, right?

[Alicia Keys]

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[Dr. Laurie Santos]

There's joy to be had in finding the perfect gifts for the ones you love. And Saks.com's holiday gift guide can make it easy. Whether it's surprising your hard to shop for sister with a Chloe bracelet bag or gifting your partner a memorable scent from Gucci that matches their personality, Saks.com's handpicked guide can help take the stress out of the holidays. Like adding instant cheer to your home with bright decor or giving yourself some comfort by bundling up in a scarf coat from Tatem.

[Jen and Jill]

Find gifts guaranteed to bring joy to.

[Dr. Laurie Santos]

Everyone this [e-mail] at Amica Insurance, we.

[Alicia Keys]

Know it's more than just a car or a house. It's the four wheels that get you where you're going and the four walls that welcome you home. When you combine auto and home insurance with Amica, we'll help protect it all. And the more you cover, the more you can save.

[Jen and Jill]

Amica.

[Alicia Keys]

Empathy is our best policy.