Jen (2:33)

You have been requesting more charts and graphs, right? We've heard you.

Jill (2:39)

So here's the reality. The real median household income is around $83,000 a year. And that that does vary a lot by age. So if you're watching us on YouTube, you're going to see this graph that takes a look at the different age brackets and kind of what is the median household income per age bracket? The the people making the most money out here are between 45 to 54 years old and, and otherwise it's just kind of like a mountain from there. I think it's important sloping up and.

Jen (3:12)

Down to see this because I think sometimes we can get caught in what we are earning in our 20s and 30s and sometimes think we're tapped out. But the reality is most people do increase their income incrementally up until their 50s, mid-50s to late 50s. So I think it should be encouraging and kind of like let light a fire under us. Like, okay, I'm in my 30s, my 40s, I'm not tapped out. I haven't, I have, yeah, I haven't peaked. I have another like decade that I can work towards advancing my career, advancing my income.

Jill (3:52)

Yeah. So then how does this compare though with what you theoretically need to live comfortably? And of course that's going to vary by where you live, the size of your family, how old you are, whether or not you've got various chronic health issues. Just, there's, there's so much that can impact what we need to live comfortably off of. But Smart Assets still did try and talk about what you need to make annually for your household in order to live comfortably state by state. So they look at it as whether you're a single adult or if you're a family of four. And I found this a fascinating. Again, we're going to show I found it the visuals, because you can right.

Jen (4:42)

Off the bat see the disconnect between a real median income being $83,000 per household and the median salary needed to live in each state.

Jill (4:54)

So here we go with the first visual it shows it puts it in rank by state, what are the most expensive states to live in. And then start, you know, going down the list from there. I mean, we all guessed it. Hawaii, Massachusetts, California, New York, they're all at the top. But saying that you need to be earning at least $300,000 a year, essentially, if you are a family of four to be able to live in those states, guaranteed there are people making, obviously there are people making less than that. Right. If the average or the median income actually is $83,000, that's a far cry from $300,000. How are we making do?

Jen (5:39)

Yeah, and it's like it's, yeah, over 300,000 for like Massachusetts, California, Hawaii, we understand that. But even if we look at all the way on the other side to our five quote unquote most affordable states, Kentucky, the Dakotas, Arkansas and West Virginia, a four person family needs an income of almost $200,000 a year to live comfortably in these states. So even in our quote unquote, most affordable states, that median household income really only suffices if you are a single adult. And that's where we see the 80 to 83,000 on there.

Jill (6:28)

And they base these numbers off of, you know, what to sustainably live comfortably on based on a 50 budget. So that's kind of how they came about with these numbers. But we're curious, I mean, comment where you live, if these numbers feel accurate to what your experience is if you find yourself in these different states.

Jen (6:49)

Yeah. Especially if you're a family of four and if you have. If you agree or disagree with this. So for the most part, the data shows that we are pretty justified in feeling broken. So have a great day, see you next week. Okay. But I don't think that's the end of the story because I think that there are a lot of psychological factors. Not just, I mean, there are concrete factors, but also psychological factors that really play into this feeling of broke. And it exacerbates, like we have a foothold of truth. Right. That's how every conspiracy theory, like big deception cults, you know, I love a cult. It all starts with a small foothold and foundation of truth. And then all of the propaganda, the psychological manipulation, all of that starts to take hold. And that's where we get these really hopeless and dire feelings of being broke.

Jill (7:55)

Yeah. And when we have this perception of feeling broke, a lot of times it can lead us to exponentially worse financial decisions. And so I think it's really important to how do we find ourselves in our own radical middle of our own psychological, emotional, mental experiences? But also what is reality? And so part of that is connected to what, why, why do we feel broke? Certainly we've looked at some of the statistics and so there's some facts there. But for the psychological component, we think that it is largely attributed to the meteoric rise of social comparison. Right. We, like never before have access to the world from Instagram, TikTok tock, YouTube, you name it. People are able to be out there showing their lifestyles or what they want you to believe of their lifestyle. No longer is it just the movie stars in the movie that sometimes we'll see a picture of them in a newspaper. Now we've got this access to celebrities and not even just the movie stars like you can become a Instagram famous, TikTok famous, YouTube famous. And so celebrity, celebrity is on the rise. Our access to them is so great and it can make us feel as though that's Accessible. They are accessible, therefore their lifestyles are accessible. Therefore everybody's lifestyle kind of looks like this. And it can make us think, well, what am I doing wrong? Why am I not able to take that type of vacation? Or why am I not able to be going on these spending sprees constantly?

Jen (9:46)

Yeah, I think it's even more insidious than that. It becomes like, oh, if they deserve it, I definitely deserve it. We used to follow celebrities and it was like a peek behind the curtain of a life we'll never lead. And we know it's a life that will never lead. So it wasn't like, I'm gonna go out and buy a designer handbag. Like, their influencers are not influencing, you know, celebrities are not influencing me to buy anything that they have because I know that they are living a lifestyle that is just on another level. Yeah, it's the influencer in the middle that is just this normal person and is now buying. Gosh, I saw a video where this woman has a like $300,000 closet. Like 300 pairs of jeans or something. It just like so exorbitant amounts of things. And they're being gifted things, but they're also going on shopping sprees for designer bags and clothes and all of these hauls. And that is where I think we get a lot of our normalizing. Like, okay, I'm not going to go out and put $300,000 into my closet, but I can buy an extra pair of jeans or an extra shirt every month, every. And that slowly starts to add up and it starts to normalize. And that's where we get the lifestyle creep. It's. It is drastically increasing the rate at which our lifestyle creeps. And we don't think so. You can call it lifestyle inflation. Hedonic adaptation, Hedonic treadmill. It goes by several different titles, but it's always been a thing. It's nothing new. And it's not bad. As you make more money, you are allowed to and arguably should spend more money, you know, within reason and within alignment with your values. But what we are seeing is a lifestyle inflation that is meteoric because we used to just base our lifestyle creep on the people who are around us. Our immediate family, neighbors, social groups. And now we are open up to people who are in different neighborhoods, in different high cost of living areas, different careers that have a different income threshold, all of these things and people, this is the worst of all influencers who buy things because there it is their job to show you things. Like they're not in an, in like a career or income bracket that can justify that. It is literally they're making money on social media for the sole purpose of getting you to buy things. Yeah. And so that's where I think we are seeing with all of this comparison. And it's not even like some people are tempted by the mega mansion like the McMansion influencers, but I think it can also be like smaller influencers too. The micro. There's a lot more quote unquote micro influencers that are not, it's not malicious. I don't think for the most part any of it is intentional or malicious. But it does creep in that like desire, like, I deserve this. They deserve it. They seem to be like me. I deserve this lifestyle creep even if my income cannot keep up with what I quote unquote deserve.

Jill (13:24)

Yeah. And the pressure for everything to be so aesthetic if it is going to go in picture form on the Internet and live for forever. And it's all that we're seeing and we want everything to look beautiful. And we've even talked recently about how going out to eat needs to now become entertainment. It needs to go into our entertainment category. Not just because of, I'm realizing now all of the reasons that prices have gone up from post Covid to just inflation and all this, but also I think restaurants catering to wanting to provide a luxurious experience, something that is Instagramable and needing to charge a higher amount for that. And so now just to afford going out or to buy makeup or to get clothing, it's like we need to be spending so much more to achieve that esthetic. And everything out there is trying to be look so luxurious. That can also play into why we feel broke. It's like this really nasty treadmill.

Jen (14:30)

Well, it's a, I mean in it, it's a cycle. It's coming back around because so we see like last week we talked in our one of our episodes about cars. How cars you used to be able to go to a lot and get like a very basic, simple car for very cheap, no bells and whistles, just something to get you from A to B. And now because people want the, all the tech, they want the shiny new thing, they're seeing all these people on social media with their, you know, Porsches and Maseratis and they're like, okay, I'm never going to get one of those, but I can get a nicer Mazda or I can get a nicer Toyota. Like I want something that's more in my income range but like really nice and Instead of keeping these cars for a long time, we want to change them out every four to five years. So the car dealerships, like I don't have incentive to make my, or the car brand. I don't have incentive to make my cars last long. So I'm going to cater to what the people want. The EVs, the high tech, the self driving and these very simple A to B cars are no more. You can't find them anymore. Brand new, you can barely find them used. But these car brands don't have an incentive to make them because it's not what people want. And so now our choices are more limited.

Jill (16:02)

Now bring back the Daewoo. You know what I mean? Where's the Daewoo?

Jen (16:06)

Where's the Daewoo? It's like, where's the beef? Where's the Daewoo?

Jill (16:13)

I did drive a Daewoo at one point and at one point you could get a two for one on a Daewoo. Oh yeah, two for one car. Bring that.

Jen (16:25)

I know I drove a Saturn SL2. I don't know where the one went.

Jill (16:29)

Thinking you're gonna get one car and you get two for the price of one.

Jen (16:33)

Where? The good old days. I know we kind of debunked that last week, but like, so some, some things were better.

Jill (16:42)

Some of it right.

Jen (16:43)

And so like this. So lifestyle inflation now, as a result of so many years of this is now impacting what brands create and what they don't create, which is just going to be this vicious cycle that creates less and less choice for the frugal and price conscious person. So yeah, like it's. I, I think this social comparison is a really major factor into why we feel broke. But there is, there, I think there's another factor too.

Jill (17:23)

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Jen (17:39)

They really nail the staples. Think 100% organic cotton sweaters, premium denim with stretch that's comfortable all day, and cotton cashmere blends that work perfectly for changing seasons. These are the pieces you reach for constantly because they just work.

Jill (17:54)

What makes quints even better is how they do it. They work directly with safe, ethical factories and cut out the middlemen. So you're not paying for brand markup, just high quality clothing. I can't tell you how much I'm loving my washable. Silk skirt from Quint. It's really a staple.

Jen (18:09)

Refresh your wardrobe with quince. Go to quince.comfrugal for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada too. That's Q U I n c e.com frugal for free shipping and 365 day returns. The start of the year always has me thinking about our goals, especially maxing out our Roth IRAs, building savings and planning for the long term stuff. But goals are just wishes if you don't have the right systems to support them. That's why I use Monarch. It's the budgeting app I use to actually implement those plans, not just track what already happened.

Jill (18:45)

Set yourself up for financial success this year with Monarch, the all in one personal finance tool designed to make your life easier. It brings your entire financial life, budgeting accounts and investments, net worth and future planning together in one dashboard on your phone or laptop. So you can feel aware and in control of your finances this year and get 50% off your monarch subscription with Code Frugal.

Jen (19:06)

What I love is that Monarch helps you move from tracking to actually achieving. I can see exactly where our money is going, project our savings and map out what it takes to hit those milestones. It's helped us feel way more confident and intentional with our money.

Jill (19:21)

Set yourself up for financial success in 2026 with Monarch, the all in one tool that makes proactive money management simple all year long. Use code frugalonarch.com for half off your first year. That's 50% off your first year@monarch.com with code FRUGAL. So the other psychological reason that I think we feel broke is money dysmorphia. This is where we're talking about perception versus reality. And there's all sorts of dysmorphias that we can have. And certainly the way that we view our financial situation is one of them. It's this psychological pattern where people might underestimate their financial reality relative to their desires or goals or peers. Even high earners can find themselves here feeling like it's never enough. And we talked about a study like this in our book Buy what yout Love Without Going Broke, where people were like, how much do you think is enough? And it was the highest income earners who still thought that they didn't have enough, which I found fascinating. So yeah, there's, there's research done in behavioral economics that consistently finds that people who perceive their finances as worse than they objectively are tend to make more extreme money decisions. And we can find ourselves experiencing money dysmorphia in either way as we're talking. Either you, you objectively do have enough to live sustainably and comfortably, but you think you don't, or the other way around. Like, I, I think I'm good. And in reality that's not the situation because we're not actually looking at the debt, we're not looking at the savings or investing. So really it kind of depends on like who we're comparing ourselves to.

Jen (21:05)

Yeah, there's a, there's an excessive hoarding and a YOLO mentality and both are dysmorphia. And we talked about this on our values based spending episode a few months ago, maybe two months ago. And it is, it is more prevalent in these high earners and super savers. And you wonder, you get out there and you wonder, why are there billionaires? It's because of, it's because of this, it's money dysmorphia, success dysmorphia. It's this, this view of what is enough and what is success and nobody is defining it. So nothing is ever enough. Or you do define it and then along the way the goal post changes and I think that's more common. We're like, oh yeah, I know, I know what's enough. I've, I've said it. But how many times have you moved that goalpost and then you're feeling like you're a failure because you can never meet a goal that you keep moving.

Jill (22:11)

It is, that's a tough one though, because as we've talked about, like lifestyle inflation does happen and that's not entirely wrong or bad. You know what, what we thought was enough in our 20s might have been then, but then you get married, you have kids, you've got other obligations, maybe you're caring for aging parents, maybe you, you know, you want to buy a house or that's going to be the most advantageous situation. So like, you know, your back hurts.

Jen (22:38)

So you can no longer go camping and you have to stay at a hotel.

Jill (22:42)

You have to have more luxurious and.

Jen (22:46)

A better hotel every year because you're back. It just gets worse and worse.

Jill (22:51)

Yeah. So. And prices on things go up. Right. There's not the two for one day woo anymore. So we've got to be able to figure out how do we afford cars now when there's, there's no bogo. So some of that is, is real and does need to happen. But then some of that is we just don't truly Have a sense of what is enough. And we don't know even what are the helpful metrics for that. Which I think is why it's helpful to talk about finances, to be able to define how do we, how do we define enough? And I mean, just sidebar is probably a whole other episode, but I think it does have to do with, you know, your debt to income ratio, emergency savings, which. Yeah, we were talking about that here. So whether you're saving for retirement, like, there are some real metrics that we can utilize here to know how. How are we doing? Can I feel okay about where I am financially?

Jen (23:44)

And I think that's one of the reasons that I, I want to get the cfp, like, for. If you don't know. Jill and I are studying to become certified financial planners. We're taking the test in July. But one of, one of the things that really strikes me is this money dysmorphia in people and helping people to see what is reality. Yeah. And what is your perception of reality. And honoring that perception, honoring where that perception came from while trying to weave in reality and not say, like, oh, you're, you know, you're dumb for spending all your money on this or for saving all this money here. Live a little. Save more. What are you doing? Like, but honoring, like, where people are at and where they've come from and helping them move forward. Yeah. Is something that's really, like, exciting to me. And really working with this, like, money.

Jill (24:45)

Dysmorphia piece and people knowing that receiving money advice and consultation is accessible for the common person. It was really surprising to me because I've got a couple of friends who are CFPs and talking with them about the types of accounts that they're managing. And one of my friends in particular said that the majority of the people that he's managing money for, and they are older, like, you know, 40 to 50 plus, have on average about $200,000 in investments. Now, I'm not, I'm not, I don't want to. To some of us, that's a lot. To some of us, that's a little. That's okay. But to recognize that having $200,000 invested for retirement is very doable for the average person. By the time you're reaching your 40s and 50s, if you started young and you did the 401k and you did the Roth IRA, like 100%, that is accessible. We are not talking about like the super, super wealthy that this is for. This is the common person can expect that type of thing. And I think that type of knowledge and understanding is what we want to do here. I think, yeah, what we hope to do with the cfp, but also to help break down some of these misconceptions about where we might be versus where the average person is versus just what do you need? It doesn't even matter what the average person is doing. If you can get a good handle on what's necessary for me and my family and what will we need in retirement, really, that's all that matters.

Jen (26:32)

Because if we don't, then then we make worse decisions and we go from feeling broke to making decisions that get us broker and broker. And it reinforces that small truth. So in a landmark study on financial anxiety and scarcity, Mindset found that perceived scarcity, not actual income, predicted poor financial choices, short term decision making, and lower willingness to plan long term. So our perception of being broke, our feeling of being broke, like, yes, we get it. There's a big difference between 83,000 and 200,000. Right? Like, things are not honky dory, those things. We can't control all of that, but we can do with what we have, what we can. Those words were not in the right order, but you get what I'm saying.

Jill (27:32)

We know it.

Jen (27:32)

We can if. If we have some help, like watching this podcast, subscribing to the channel, or talking with a certified financial planner to help you figure out what is reality and what is perception. So that I can make better decisions, I can make better long term decisions and I can plan with hope and not fear and scarcity.

Jill (27:58)

Yeah, because there was another study analyzing specifically U.S. households. And many middle and upper income households rated themselves as financially struggling despite meeting some of these very real metrics that we already kind of talked about before. But that's having emergency savings, having good debt to income ratios, having made retirement contributions, saving regularly doing these things, and yet still feeling like they're struggling financially. And so that I think can point out to us the struggle might be more so in our heads than it is in reality.

Jen (28:39)

It's 20% real and 80% mental. Yeah. So where do we go from here? Well, I think the first step is subscribing to Frugal Friends YouTube channel.

Jill (28:54)

Hey, yo, we're here for you.

Jen (28:55)

That step, a step one is to track your income like you track your spending. We talk a lot about tracking spending on the show, but I think we also need to be aware of our income and making sure that we are increasing our income year over year through at least our late 50s. You don't have to. I think we, we have that idea and we think of people who are just climbing the corporate ladder or obsessed with building wealth. We have at least I, I have this like idea about them. And I don't want to be one of those people that's just like obsessed with money. I want to be obsessed with life. But I think we can, I think we have a moral responsibility to be increasing our income and advancing our career. Because the people who are not obsessed with life, the people who are obsessed with money, they're going to make it to the top no matter what they have to do or who they have to step on. Right. So if we can be a buffer to keep those people from stepping as on as many people as they would had we not been in the middle, like we have that obligation to be there, to be in the room when decisions are made, to be in the room. Like figuring this stuff out.

Jill (30:19)

Yeah, earning money, investing, spending on the types of products and businesses that are going to help our local community. And yeah, that's such a support the people around you.

Jen (30:31)

Like when you make more, you have the option to invest in more local business, small business. Yeah, that stuff's more expensive and you can't do that when your income is low. It is a choice you can make though, when you're earning more.

Jill (30:45)

I think the next step too is recognizing that not all wants are created equal. And I think exploring and analyzing the things that we think we want because some things might truly just not be a good idea for us. Or maybe we can want something but we truly can't afford it. But to really get down to the meat of what are my true desires, of what I want, want out of life, what do I actually value? If we were to strip away all of the social comparison, if we were able to pierce through some of the money dysmorphia to find out where are we actually at? What do we want, what do we value? And how can we live like this rich life that is not centered around money but does allow us to make the money that we need to make in order to do the things that, that we value that's good for our community, that's good for us. And we believe. You've heard us talk about this before, but it's so helpful to talk to start with that 90 day transaction inventory. This is where we are looking at everything we've spent money on over the last 90 days and actually interacting with it kind of line by line. Not negating the bills like the, the must pays, but Also the discretionary spending and, and asking ourselves a couple of questions. We've thrown out many questions to you over the different episodes. And for the sake of what we're talking about here, we think that asking ourselves, you know, what's missing from here could be really helpful in identifying what do I actually wish that I could be doing with my time and my money? As I look back and see, money is going to be also a tracker in some ways of how we have spent our days. And is this how I wanted to have spent them? Yeah, both my time and my money. What's missing? What would I have rather have added to this? Does it have anything to do with what I'm seeing on social media or are there deeper, more meaningful things that I wish I could be engaging in? How can I get that? Does it have to cost money? For most of us, it's going to have to do with doing the hobbies and things that really light us up. Spending time with family, having meaningful time with friends. Those things don't have to cost money. They can. And you might see another question you can ask is, what's on here that I really love doing that was super valuable to me, that not just met my needs, but met my wants and desires and helped get me closer to my goals. And that could mean, yeah, I did, I went out to a restaurant, it was entertainment, I spent a ton of money, but I had a great time with the people that I went out with. And then finally, what's on here that I didn't love or I didn't value, that's going to be super helpful. Get rid of the fluff, because that's going to free up more money to do the things that are valuable to you or to increase your financial position. Put that towards retirement. Then instead pay down some debt, help yourself, feel a little bit more freer monetarily.

Jen (34:00)

Yeah, I, I think it's valid to feel broke. I think we've got so, so much going on. We've got everything costs more and wages are pretty stagnant. The job market is pretty sparse. But that doesn't mean we don't have any control over our financial future. We control how we feel about where we are financially. And so two things can be true at once. It can be harder and we can be more successful than we were last year and the year before. It's not going to be a constant trajectory up. There's going to be some down and up. But if we, if we let our, you know, I don't even want to say failures. But if we let those down years dictate how we move forward, and if we let the things that are against us dictate how we move forward, then our upward trajectory, we'll never see the full potential of it. We'll just, you know, kind of flatline and we don't need to flatline. And that's what we want you to avoid.

Jill (35:08)

I think there's two pieces of hope for me with this. The first is it is possible to increase my income, right? It's not going to mean that it's that it's going to be super easy or it's going to be a super short amount of time. But that is something I can pursue. And the second thing is it is also possible to enjoy life, live a beautiful, meaningful life without spending a ton of money. And so we can kind of choose which one we want to lean into.

Jen (35:38)

They're not exclusive. You don't have to believe them exclusive. Like you can believe them.

Jill (35:42)

At the same time, they can go in tandem. But we could also find seasons of our life where, okay, in this season I'm going to lean into some more income earning potential in this season. Right now what I'm earning needs to be enough for us. So how do I learn how to be more creative and content with what I already have? And then there could be seasons where both are happening. Sky's the limit, my friends.

Jen (36:05)

And you can increase your income ethically. You don't have to exploit people below you to earn it. You can do it legally. You don't have to commit crimes and you don't have to do it by joining an mlm. And with that, you know, it's time for our favorite part of the week, which is both ethical, legal and not multi level and free.

Jill (36:35)

The bill of the week.

Jen (36:47)

That's right. It's time for the best minute of your entire week. Maybe a baby was born and his name is William. Maybe you paid off your mortgage, maybe your car died and you're happy to not have to pay that bill anymore. Duck Bills, Buffalo Bills, Bill Clinton. This is the bill of the week. Hi, Jen and Jill. I'm Debbie from Alliston, Texas. My bill of the week is from this past summer. Our ladies Bible study group went to the Oklahoma City zoo where for $10 you can ride a camel. So at 61 years old this summer, I rode a camel. And the best part, the camel's name is Bill.

Jill (37:31)

There it is.

Jen (37:33)

Mic drop Debbie.

Jill (37:36)

Mic drop Debbie.

Jen (37:38)

There are so many like, good parts to this. Like, why did your Women's Bible study. Go to the Oklahoma Zoo from Texas.

Jill (37:47)

I don't know how from Texas, right. That was why, like to that zoo maybe. I know Texas touches Oklahoma, but why.

Jen (37:53)

Do they have ten dollar camel rides? Why is that thing that the zoo, why is that a thing the zoo has? If you're in Oklahoma, please let me know. I'm like, why is the camel's name Bill? I mean, I totally respect that and I love that for that camel.

Jill (38:10)

That's my favorite, that's my favor part of this. And clearly that's Debbie's favorite part of this because her comedic timing was perfect.

Jen (38:19)

Oh, Debbie, today is for you. You, you really stole the show today.

Jill (38:25)

Oh, well done, Debbie. It sounds like you just had a great, very full day.

Jen (38:31)

February 17th is Debbie Day. Yeah.

Jill (38:36)

If you all are listening, have a feel that you want to share. If it's about your ladies Bible study, If it's about $10 camel rides. If it's about animals named, you can.

Jen (38:46)

Get anything for $10 today. Okay.

Jill (38:50)

If you got something for $10, yeah, we're gonna want to hear about it. That's a deal.

Jen (38:55)

You can't get McDonald's for $10 and dummy's over here riding a camel named bill for $10. Oklahoma.

Jill (39:03)

Yeah, if you can beat that, absolutely. Even if you can't beat it, obviously we're here for for it. Frugalfriendspodcast.com Bill, leave it for us. We can't wait.

Jen (39:15)

You know what nobody tells you about weeknight dinner? It's the thing that never goes away. Every single day around 5pm, there it is again. For me, it used to be panic, takeout, guilt and staring at the fridge, wondering what I could throw together. Then along came HelloFresh, reducing my decision fatigue and giving me my nights back.

Jill (39:35)

The barrier to eating at home is so connected to the mental load. Figuring it all out when you're already wiped. HelloFresh takes that off your plate literally. They provide pre portioned ingredients, step by step, recipe cards and most meals are done in 30 minutes. One of my favorites is the miso glazed salmon. It's like a restaurant meal, but I didn't spend an hour sweating over it.

Jen (39:56)

HelloFresh has over 100 recipes to choose from every week. Bigger portions so nobody's still hungry. Sustainably sourced seafood, antibiotic free chicken, plus various options to suit your nutritional needs. It's high quality, easy and tasty.

Jill (40:12)

Go to hellofresh.com frugal10fm to get 10 free meals plus a free Zwilling knife on your third box, a $144.99 value offer, valid while supplies last. New subscribers only. I use this and you should do.

Jen (40:26)

You've heard us talk about BILT as the loyalty program that lets you earn points on rent wherever you live. And they just leveled up even more. As of 2026, homeowners can earn up to 1.2 points on their mortgage payments.

Jill (40:40)

This is thanks to Bilt's three new credit cards, the Palladium Card, the Obsidian card and Blue Card. All three turn your housing payments, rent or mortgage into flexible rewards so you can choose the card that fits your lifestyle without missing out on points and exclusive benefits.

Jen (40:57)

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Jill (41:09)

Your hous payment is already your biggest expense. Make it your most rewarding. Find the card that fits your lifestyle and apply today at joinbuilt.com frugal that's J-O-I-N B I L T.com frugal make sure you use our URL so they know we sent you. Terms and limitations apply subject to approval and eligibility. Built cards are issued by column NA member FDIC pursuant to license from MasterCard International Incorporated. And now it's time for lightning round.

Jen (41:42)

Okay, what are you doing to not feel broke? The original question was do you feel broke? But then at the top of the episode we were like, yeah, we feel broke. Already answered that one.

Jill (41:57)

We wrote this episode.

Jen (41:58)

We did.

Jill (41:59)

Because we were like, why are we feeling broke?

Jen (42:02)

We write most of these episodes because we're feeling some type of way. So if you feel some type of way about something, leave it in the comments because maybe we will too. And maybe an episode will come out of it.

Jill (42:14)

Oh yes, we love suggestions.

Jen (42:17)

Okay to not feel broke. Well, I'm gonna give a cop out answer. I feel like I've done that several times in the last couple episodes. But like studying for the CFP exam. We knew you were gonna say it. I know it's a cop out.

Jill (42:32)

We should just guess each other's answers at this point.

Jen (42:35)

But yeah, what are you gonna say?

Jill (42:37)

You probably know. But finish your answer.

Jen (42:39)

Tell people you're retired when they ask what she does. Neither of us like saying that we have a podcast.

Jill (42:48)

No, I'm leaning into that. But sometimes it just feels like too much to talk about what I do.

Jen (42:53)

That's why.

Jill (42:54)

So I will just tell people I'm retired and it's very fun's gonna be.

Jen (42:59)

Like Joe Rogan and I'm like, exactly like Joe Rogan. Like almost to the T. Identical.

Jill (43:08)

But yeah, it is true. Studying for the CFP is you leaning into like more income earning potential.

Jen (43:14)

Yeah, yeah. You some kind of little luxury.

Jill (43:27)

Good times.

Jen (43:28)

Okay.

Jill (43:29)

We are in each other's brains.

Jen (43:32)

People are shocked that we are actual friends outside of recording this show.

Jill (43:40)

I'm exploding inside. Like, I knew that you knew, but the fact that you knew and said it wild. We should monetize that actually just guessing what each other. Guessing each other's. Yeah. Although didn't we try that game at one point where it's like, you know, four words to get to the same word and we just couldn't. We all.

Jen (44:07)

We think very differently, but we know what. Yeah. We know how the other person thinks.

Jill (44:13)

Yeah. Honest to goodness, it is filling my day with little luxuries. Makes me feel like my life is luxurious and it doesn't have to cost money. Right.

Jen (44:26)

It's.

Jill (44:28)

Taking a nice warm shower. It's giving myself a facial massage. It's plating my food so it looks nice. It's enjoying some decaf coffee in a nice mug. But yeah, like, wherever, whenever I can find something that feels luxurious for free.

Jen (44:54)

Especially Jill is so aesthetic. And you guys are missing out on how aesthetic she is because she doesn't post it on social media. And I love that because I don't.

Jill (45:05)

Do it for the gram.

Jen (45:06)

She doesn't do it for the gram.

Jill (45:07)

She doesn't do it for me. So watering my plants, pruning my plants like that feels luxurious. It feels like I'm a lady in my home taking care of my plants. I don't know what voice that is.

Jen (45:19)

But it just inside you.

Jill (45:21)

The aesthetic, aesthetic thing to do would be this. And I'm not doing it online, but yeah, simple luxuries, my friends. Try it out also. What you can try out is leaving us a review for our book. If you've not read it, try that out. Buy what you love without going broke. Buy what you love book.com. but here's an example from Joanie, who said not your average financial book and gave it five stars. This is a great example of a good review. I did not get an advanced copy. I found Jen and Jill through their media blitz for the book. On another personal finance podcast I listened to. So many financial books are about saving for your future. This book helped me get excited about spending in the present.

Jen (46:07)

Yes.

Jill (46:08)

And not just spending for spending's sake, but spending to help me cherish the life I have today. I love these words.

Jen (46:15)

Bless.

Jill (46:16)

So many good words. The focus on psychology is right up my alley and made me think critically about how and why I spend money. I have already become more intentional about my spending. Did a no spend month in January. She must be talking about last January, influenced by their podcast before the book came out and saved $2,500 to put towards the family car we want to purchase this year. Turns out I care way more about a car that fits our family and than I do about daily takeout and Amazon purchases. It's also the first time I truly thought about my environmental impact. Only took me 32 years. This is not your average financial book. I plan to read it again and continue to listen to their podcast to be inspired on how to be a better steward of my money, my time, my relationships, and our earth. Amazing work, Jen and Jill, honestly. Thank you. And this is such a good review to coincide with what we're talking about here. Like, the book is literally called buy what you love without going broke. And obviously, we can feel broke and not be broke. We could actually be broke. But how do we do this? How do we enjoy our lives now, prepare for the future, not feel broke or actually be broke. Like, our book is the blueprint for that. And I feel like Joni highlighted that beautifully. Thank you so much.

Jen (47:35)

Yeah, I mean, so glad that it came across. You never know, like, when you put your heart and soul onto paper, if it's gonna come across as coherently as it is in our jumbled minds. And, I mean, so much of that has to do with, you know, both of us writing it and just fantastic editors and proofreaders. So, yeah.

Jill (47:59)

Yeah, it's like a team.

Jen (48:01)

Thank you, Joanie. Thank you for listening or watching. If you are on YouTube, please hit that subscribe button. Half of you statistically watching this are not subscribed. And if you like this, we do stuff like this all the time. Go back and hit our last couple episodes. I think you're gonna love them, and I think you're gonna love this next episode. I'm kind of obsessed with this, like, series of episodes that we're doing right now. So please subscribe to the YouTube channel, leave us a comment, let us know what you think, and we will see you next time. Bye. Frugal Friends is produced by Eric Sirianni. You know what is my favorite aesthetic of yours?

Jill (48:53)

Okay.

Jen (48:54)

It is January 22, when we are recording this, all of your Christmas decorations.

Jill (49:00)

Are still up your actual mouth because I was gonna say the same thing in our after show. I was about to say, yeah, I'm aesthetic. But here we are a month after Christmas and my Christmas stuff still up. What is happening today?

Jen (49:14)

I wasn't going to throw you under the bus in the episode, but I was like, we're going to, we're going to revisit this.

Jill (49:19)

Christmas stuff is still up. And do you know what's bad about that is I am waiting to wash my floors until I take Christmas stuff down. And that actually might be what's prolonging.

Jen (49:34)

Me taking the Christmas stuff. Wow.

Jill (49:38)

But it just means that also my floors are dirty.

Jen (49:40)

Yeah, I know. You had a really good reason for keeping it up because you were maid of honor in a wedding a week ago and you were doing a lot.

Jill (49:48)

You were doing traveled for the holidays.

Jen (49:50)

Yeah, you were. I mean, you can have your holidays up. Holiday decorations up during the holidays, like that's permissible.

Jill (49:56)

Right. But then like we came back and.

Jen (49:58)

Then you were in full maid of honor mode for the first three weeks and you were the best maid of honor weddings have ever seen.

Jill (50:07)

Thank you.

Jen (50:08)

And I get it. It's the 22nd though.

Jill (50:12)

Yeah, I know. And you know what, Jen? I'm gonna tell you something that's not even gonna help my case. I don't think it's gonna come down till February. Cause we leave again tomorrow.

Jen (50:22)

Yes, you do.

Jill (50:23)

On a trip.

Jen (50:25)

And we could be gone.

Jill (50:26)

We are gonna be gone for like 10 days.

Jen (50:29)

Yeah.

Jill (50:31)

And then we come back in February and that's when it will come down. Uh huh.

Jen (50:36)

Respect though, girl.

Jill (50:38)

And you know what too? I never ended up. This is so backwards. I never ended up getting ornaments on my tree. Like the tree is up. I never put ornaments on it. And then I've never gotten around it taking the tree back down.

Jen (50:52)

Yeah, well. Oh, you know, I didn't put ornaments.

Jill (50:57)

I don't do it for the gram.

Jen (50:59)

She don't do it. She aesthetic. Not for the Graham.

Jill (51:02)

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