Full Measure After Hours

Episode: The Devil and the TVA (From the Archives)

Host: Sharyl Attkisson
Date: December 25, 2025
Main Guest: John Rich (country music star and citizen activist)

Episode Overview

This episode centers on a modern “Grapes of Wrath” scenario unfolding in Tennessee, where country singer John Rich became a citizen advocate against the Tennessee Valley Authority (TVA). Rich joined local farmers and residents in Cheatham County in their fight against a massive new power plant project planned by the TVA, a powerful and secretive federal agency. The episode provides an inside look at how ordinary people, with the help of high-profile allies, successfully pushed back against what Rich describes as governmental overreach, culminating in the TVA abandoning its preferred site.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Background on TVA and the Controversy

• TVA Origins & Structure
  • Founded in 1933 under FDR to build infrastructure and generate power in the South.
  • Answers only to the President, not Congress or local governments.
  • CEO’s salary recently as high as $10.5 million annually—26 times the President’s salary.
• TVA Today
  • A hybrid entity: not funded by tax dollars, but through electricity bills.
  • $13 billion in profits last year; operates across seven states.
  • Has the authority to bypass local zoning laws, making it unaccountable to local or even state politicians.

Quote:

“They don’t have to listen to governors, senators, congressmen. They only have to listen to the President.” — John Rich (04:42)

2. Cheatham County: The Local Impact

• Community Fabric:

  • Cheatham County consists of small, micro-farms and tight-knit families; several “Century Farms” (owned by same families for generations).
  • TVA targeted a site that would impact nearly 6,000 acres of farmland, five or six Century Farms, five school districts, water supplies, and about 450 homes.

• Government Overreach and Lack of Accountability:

  • TVA staff and contractors allegedly entered private properties with guns and bulletproof vests, without local warrants.
  • Local and even federal politicians were frustrated by their inability to hold TVA accountable.

Quote:

“You cannot show up on old ladies’ properties with guns and bulletproof vests demanding to come on their property. That’s Fourth Amendment…” — John Rich (12:20)

3. Why Here? The TVA’s Lack of Transparency

• Existing, more suitable sites (like the massive, decommissioned New Johnsonville coal plant with full infrastructure) were ignored for reasons TVA refused to explain.
• Even state and local officials couldn’t get answers, fueling suspicion.

Quote:

“Why are they coming to Cheatham county and trying to tear this place to smithereens?... TVA won’t answer that question.” — John Rich (08:45)

4. The Role of Advocacy and Citizen Power

• Rich began documenting and sharing the community’s plight via social media (X/Twitter), acting as an ad-hoc investigative journalist.
• Social media activism caught the attention of officials like Secretary Brooke Rollins (USDA) and eventually President Trump.
• As pressure mounted, President Trump took action to halt the plant project.

Key Moment (10:30):

“Secretary Rollins replied to one of my posts on X… and said, ‘I’m on it.’ That began a conversation… She said, ‘yeah, this can’t happen. We can’t lose all this farmland.’ That then got on the radar of President Trump.” — John Rich

5. Confronting TVA Leadership

• John Rich relates a tense but civil conversation with Justin Meyerhofer, senior VP of Government Relations at TVA, objecting to TVA’s approach and tactics.

Quote:

“Why don’t you show up with a cold can of Coca Cola and a hamburger… Treat people like Americans.” — John Rich (12:51)

• Rich decried “lip service and double talk” from TVA officials and stressed the need for persistent public scrutiny.

6. Outcome and Looking Forward

• TVA announced, “based upon feedback received” during public scoping, they were abandoning the Cheatham County site as the preferred alternative.
• Attkisson notes the decision only changed after Rich and Trump intervened—not after years of public protest.

7. The Power of Music and Protest

• Inspired by the events, Rich wrote “The Devil and the TVA,” echoing “Paradise (Muhlenberg County)” by John Prine.
• Lyrics drawn from actual community testimonies, including a striking line from Mrs. Nicholson, a local resident.

Quote (16:08):

“You think you own something, but you don’t own nothing when the government man comes around…” — John Rich, quoting from his new song

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On TVA’s Unique Power:

  “The authority that TVA was given is really different than any other government agency… You don’t have to adhere to local zoning laws.” — John Rich (04:03)

• On How Bureaucracy Disconnects From the People:

  “That’s where the leverage to the citizen has… when it comes to TVA, they do not have to adhere to zoning.” — John Rich (05:21)

• On Activism:

  “I became an investigative journalist. Kind of like what you do.” — John Rich (09:36)

• On the Song’s Message:

  “You think you own something, but you don’t own nothing when the government man comes around… the devil ain’t got nothing on the TVA.” — John Rich (16:08)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• Background on TVA: 02:03–05:21
• Local Impact & TVA’s Irresponsibility: 05:21–08:57
• Involvement of Trump Administration: 09:36–12:51
• Personal Encounters with TVA Leadership: 12:51–13:31
• Call for Reform & Citizen Advocacy: 13:31–15:06
• Writing “The Devil and the TVA” Song: 15:12–17:16
• Host’s Wrap-up and Episode Impact: 17:25–end

Tone and Closing Thoughts

The tone is passionate, down-to-earth, and defiant—channeling both John Rich’s “country boy” roots and Attkisson’s investigative rigor. The episode frames the story as a blueprint for citizen action against powerful but unaccountable government agencies, highlighting the unique American tradition of local resistance and public advocacy.

Final Note:
The TVA ultimately backed off its Cheatham County plans after years of community struggle, but the hosts make clear that persistent citizen engagement—amplified by public figures—was the key to success. As Rich asserts, the American citizen must always “be the boss.”