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- [00:02]
A
Hey there, it's Amy from Granum. Spring is right around the corner, so get your team ready. In the free team that Wins Spring webinar, hosted by Brian Fullerton and Sam Gimble. Learn how to hire, train and prep your crew before the busy season. We'll see you there.
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B
Across four live sessions, you'll discover how to hire the right people, train them efficiently, and streamline workflows so that your team performs at its best. You'll also learn how to turn foremen into strong leaders and strengthen your company culture. This is practical, real world advice that you can implement immediately so your team hits the ground running when spring arrives. You can't miss it. Register now@granum.com events or use the special link in the podcast description and start your season strong.
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C
You're now listening to the Fullerton Unfiltered Podcast. Straightforward, no nonsense, nonsense business advice.
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D
Completely unfiltered.
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B
Grow your business, grow your life. Now here's your host, Brian Fullerton.
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D
All right, guys. Hey. Welcome back to another episode of the Fullerton Unfiltered Podcast. It is your host, Brian Fullerton here hanging with you guys and good morning. Very excited about today's podcast guest interview. We are hanging out here with a guy that most of you know about, some of you don't. He is always trying to hide behind the scenes, but we've got him out front here today and we're gonna honestly hear a lot of great stories and perspective from what Mike is going to be sharing about about growing and scaling a business, implementing technology, and really taking our lawn landscaping businesses to the next level. So without further ado, we're joined today by Mike Lisecki who is currently the CEO of leanscaper. So, Mike, welcome to the show this morning. How you doing, brother?
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C
Awesome. Thanks for having me, Brian, everybody. Thanks for also tuning in.
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D
Yeah, absolutely. Well, so for folks that don't know your background, Mike, I would say if you don't mind taking like, you know, a quick minute or two, I'm sure some folks have seen you out and about, you know, at conferences or events and of course at the leanscaper events. But if folks don't know you, don't know your background, even, even, maybe even like pre meeting Mark Bradley in an introduction to the landscaping world. What's your background for a couple of quick minutes just so people can get to know you a little bit more?
- [02:27]
C
Yeah, sure. Long time ago I wanted to be a stockbroker and so I went to school for business and commerce and then I actually did an intern as A stockbroker. And I realized, wow, this is just a lot of cold calling. This is not what I imagined. Oddly, as the co op, I got to do the things that I was most excited about, which was like spreadsheets and financial analysis. Those guys didn't know as much about spreadsheets as I did. Like the spreadsheet, the investment part they did. But just like building a cool spreadsheet was my thing. So I was actually getting ironically to do the stuff I like to do. But quickly realized like, well, when I get to this level and have to make money, I'm going to be on the phone all day. Not my thing. So I went into software engineering
- [03:11]
D
and
- [03:11]
C
I did a couple of stints after school as a software engineer. And one of them took me to a company called Dynascape. And so if you're familiar with that landscape design software, uh, that's where I, you know, sort of, that was the last software engineering job I had. But that was the way I met Mark Bradley. So I knew who he was already because in our local association I'd heard from a couple people like, oh, you, you should meet him. He's. He's got a bunch of good things going. And I. Mark bought Dynascape and I went to train his staff and Mark wasn't even there. But he sat in on the last sort of maybe three hours of my training. And I, I guess he realized or thought at the time that I need somebody like this. I didn't understand anything about landscaping. I want to make that perfectly clear. I worked for a landscaper for one summer when I was a kid. My foreman would take us to the driving range because we were terribly unproductive and my owner would bounce checks all the time. So that was my only experience in landscaping. I didn't get paid and I didn't work really, unless you call it a golf balls work. So Mark's. The foray into Mark's company was, was my first real boots on the ground experience in landscaping. But what attracted me to what he was doing was a smaller company at the time. You know, very much family run, but massive potential. He had just signed the biggest job that I'd ever seen in my life, residential job. And he needed someone to help organize it and pull it together and thought I could be that person. And then made me an offer I couldn't refuse. Sort of doubled my salary. He gave me the Jeep that he drove to the interview in and that was the part that closed the deal. And from then I started working with Mark, as an operations manager, built systems in the landscape company that were largely based on tech because software is what I took. So I instantly saw this opportunity for all the planning and discussions happen either at the customer's house or in our office, but all the work happens in the field. And remember this is like just when phones were starting to become a thing. But nobody equipped their crew leads with phones. That was just an expense that nobody wanted during her. But Mark saw that as like well, 50 bucks a month. We, we have $50 a day in problems. So this is not an expense at all. And with that also came the opportunity for us to have applications on those phones to allow us to, to communicate. And so for me that was, that was my big, I think that was my contribution which is like, oh wait, I can see how we can make this way more efficient. And we did, we, we grew our productivity amazingly.
- [05:54]
D
So you're, you're one of the, the wizards, you know, if you will, behind the scenes that has helped Mark scale TBG landscapes. And I've had the pleasure of hearing you on stage at a couple different leanscaper events so far. And apparently like you said, you've been doing this for how, how long have you and Mark been on the road teaching and training and other contractors? 20 years probably.
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C
Now 2010 was when we, well even started a little bit before then, but yeah, so call it 20 or 2009. 2010 was when we started, so at
- [06:25]
D
least 15, 18 plus years, which is awesome. Now I have been in business ever since that time, which is ironic. So I, I've never crossed path with these guys until about two years ago, which is funny because at the end of this, at the end of every presentation you're like, yeah, we've been doing presentations like this for a long time and we see the breakthrough, we see the light bulbs go off and I'm like, Where was I 10, 15 years ago? I'm like, Mike, I wish I would have chased you down and went to one of your guys budgeting seminars and all the different things that you guys have been hosting. I have been on this personal journey getting to know Mark and really the stuff that Mark and yourself teach and you guys promote and share the thought process, the X's and O's. Of course, a lot of it's software related these days. It has been transformational for my business. But you guys had like the vision to incorporate this and Mark had the vision to incorporate this 15 or 20 years ago. Can you, can you. I know we're going to get A little bit more personal, like what you do day to day and talk a little bit more about leanscaper. And we got a great leanscaper event coming up here in March. But I just want to kind of like back up, you know, for like take it back 20 years ago. How did Mark know to like be this visionary leader and involve tech and you know, maybe give some examples like ordering job supplies to the, to the job site. Like this, this stuff wasn't even thought of, you know, in 1999 or whenever you guys were putting all this together. Right. And then what did you see with where were Mark was at and what made you attracted to work in an organization like that or even follow, follow a guy like Mark back in the day.
- [07:54]
C
Yeah. Okay. So when somebody makes you a job offer that's going to double your salary and give you a vehicle to drive back and forth to that office every day. And it was a jeep and it was brand new, you listen. And so candidly that was, that was like the tipping point.
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D
That's an honest answer for me.
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C
It changed, it changed the life ride. Two kids at the time, two really, really young kids and that afforded it. We had a nanny and afforded my wife the ability to stay home. I joke about the doubling the salary but like I'm also serious. Yeah, that's life changing. And so, so it opened up that door. Then also I got to see the cool stuff he was doing and like I said, I already kind of knew who he was because people had said like, oh, he's got some awesome stuff going on. Then you get to like what, what made it happen? And from my perspective, what made it happen was my ignorance of how to do stuff which unintendedly became the superpower that I had, if you want to call it that. It like I remember showing up to my first job that. So my first day, my first week, we're shooting a gun at pool in a nice area of Toronto and I'm like dressed in dress pants and dress shoes because I thought like, well I, first of all I thought I'd be in the office most of the time. And second of all I thought I should look good for my new double paying job. So I show up to the job site, they're shooting gunite like a bazooka over shoulders, like seven people holding the hose. It's concrete everywhere, mud everywhere. I'm disgusting. And I also quickly realized that, you know, a this work is quite intricate and skilled and B, I know nothing about it. And so, and so that forced me to Be like, what, what can I put in place that's going to make me do this next time without having to remember all this? I don't know what's even happening here. Much less would we be able to repeat it. So I had to build repeatable systems. That was my thing. I didn't know what I was doing. So I had to build myself a system to do this again next week without missing everything. Mark's thing was then taking that and realizing like, whoa, there's something here, I should be investing. Like, Mark had no problem investing in technology. He already was growing his business, he had amazing goals and then on top of that had the foresight to say, hey, do you think software would be a good industry or, and didn't listen to me when I said no. So that all that worked out well as well.
- [10:28]
D
What, what, what do you think was like the, the catalyst for, for Mark and you guys to start building that software then? Because like you said, I, I, I want to take it back to, and maybe you can timestamp it better than I am. I'm thinking it's probably early 2000s or late 90s, right? And folks were like not doing this. Like you would probably work the phone at best, have slips all over the place like you said, for tickets or POS. Honestly, 99 of people are still doing stuff like that, you know, and the stuff that you guys built in the, the 2000s or whatnot with a massive company that, you know, ended up scaling from 2 and a half million to 5 and then 5 to 50 in like another 5 or 10 year window. Like we're talking about crazy revenue growth for all you guys listening in that don't know, like, these are some of the best that have ever done it. What did, what did technology do to unlock that scalability for you guys? Like how did you, how was technology able to help with that transformative process? And why are, I guess maybe just, you know, devil's advocate. Why are people so reluctant to, to switch to a certain software to adopt technology or, or do they just not believe that it's not going to unlock the doors like that it did for you guys? You know what I mean?
- [11:38]
C
Yeah, that's a good question. The last one to talk about our experience. It's funny because when I do think about the first days there, right, to think about a time where it wasn't very long, but to think about a time where the crews left in the morning and you didn't talk to them again until the end of the day, I can't even figure out how the industry got to where it is today. That is such a complicated problem to solve. And so that alone was, like, the biggest driver between, like, well, we got to fix this. We got to make it so that, like, stuff. We should be reacting constantly and stuff is coming up every hour, so how do we know what's happening? And so that. That was a big driver. Mark also was pretty really active in our local association, and so he would. He'd be educating contractors often. And. And I think he sort of put those two things together as, like, hey, wait a minute. We've been really successful adopting technology. And Mark comes from a trades background. You know him, and he's got this, like, passion and fire for elevating the landscape trade to the value of some of the other trades that are out there. And so combining technology, a new and better way of doing things, and education. No fear of educating our competitors, our peers, our everybody as a way of bringing up the industry. I remember him telling me, like, if we. If we're all charging a fair price, a profitable, fair price, like they do in carpentry and plumbing and all that, then we're just going to compete on productivity. Who can conceptualize and value engineer and sell to a customer better. That's how we should be competing. Competing. So there was no. Yeah, no fear of sharing information. So it was just a fortunate combination of him having a fearless vision of adopting and promoting technology and education out to the masses and my ability to, like, build some of that technology. And so for us, the growth is what did it for us. Right. I was an operations manager until like 25 million by myself. And then when I left, they didn't even hire somebody in my position. We had automated so much of material ordering, time tracking, customer feedback, all that. So much stuff we'd been building, honestly, simple micro applications to manage so much of it, but it. It took the human out of the loop.
- [13:59]
D
Talk to me a little bit more about. Well, actually, let me. Let me interject. It's funny you say that, because when we were building our home a year and a half ago and we were getting quotes from different plumbing guys, different tile guys, different electricians. No joke. All the bids were plus or minus two to five thousand bucks. And if I had three landscapers come and quote my front landscaping, I would have 20 grand, 50 grand, 100 grand.
- [14:26]
C
Sure.
- [14:26]
D
And. And that's. That's the discrepancy we're talking about in our industry. To drive your point home, you know, that there's not a lot of uniformity. And if we all get on the same wavelength, all get on the same sheet of music, like you said, then it just becomes a fact that we're all selling time and equipment and talent. But we can, again, whoever runs the leanest business wins. But that way, a rising tide raises all ships, right? In a very simple fashion. And, and that's why, like, when Mark was talking about that two years ago, I've talked about this endlessly on my podcast when I saw Mark and he talked about that, he didn't talk about lmn. You know, he talked about that. And I said, I came back home from this webinar or seminar that he did the Element Masterminds, right, two years ago. And my wife lays go, so what do you think about Element? I go, I don't think he talked about LMN, but for 20 minutes. But let me tell you about what he wants to do in the industry. Like, I'm like, I think he's doing what I'm doing and I want to do what he's doing. And she goes, I go, let me tell you about this Mark guy. And I just threw up on her for, you know, probably the next hour. So I, I caught who he was and what he was trying to do instantly. And he's like, hey, you need to get on lmn. I'm like, okay. Like, that was it. It wasn't like this debate, do I need software? Do I don't. I do want to go back, though, to that question because unfortunately, so many people are still reluctant to adopt software. Or they, if maybe it sounds whimsical, you know what I mean, that you guys were able to scale this business from 5 million to 25 million and 25 million to 50 million, and a lot of things were automated. It just sounds like very fairy tale to some folks because they're in the grind of starting to systematize their business at a half million million, 2 million, 5 million. And there's like, maybe not like this light at the end of the tunnel that it's scale, that something is scalable. You know, they just see, like, if I want to go from 2 million to 4 million, I got to double my hours. I'm already working 70 hours a week now I gotta work 140 hours a week. Like this just doesn't seem attainable. Can you, can you talk to maybe like that mindset there? And again, if it's a software conversation, if it's a leadership conversation, if it's a systems conversation, I want to give you The. The opportunity to share what your. What do you think the bottleneck is, folks, that might have those thoughts?
- [16:32]
C
Let's make it a psychology conversation, but with an asterisk of, like, I have no idea what I'm talking about. So let's. Let's go here, because I think it'll be more fun. I think it's. There's something comforting about telling yourself what you can do cannot be replicated. And that might be the person who's laying stone on your job. That might be the person that runs a great grounds maintenance crew. And to your question, really, that's the person who's run a business that to date, they got to where they were without technology and without systems, and they've been struggling all this time to get other people to do those things to the level of excellence that they want them done. And so then there's a narrative. And that narrative to yourself is, I'm the only one who can make this happen. That narrative isn't exactly true. There's 70,000 other people in North America that are making it happen. But you get the point, right? And there's something comforting about that because you're. You're validating yourself. I'm important. My skills are not replicable. I'm doing that now. I think the problem with that is, And I'm bringing that up even just because at the crew level, I think we face this at tbg, the landscape company, right? We would be like, hey, now we want to do electronic timekeeping. And you'd have like 10% of the people on board and 90%. Nope, not like, can't do this, not do this, whatever. So there is that innate pushback of, like, what I do is valuable. It cannot be just systemized. It's not going to work. I need to be the linchpin here. Otherwise. Otherwise everything will fall apart. And I think the. The lesson, the good. The part I was trying to talk about earlier is my lack of all of that skills, experience, know how any of that allowed me to not have that filter at all and say, no, we can build this technology. I need it. I don't know how to do other. Like, for me, it was the exact opposite. I need this stuff because I don't have any of that. And I think a lot of people trap themselves with that mentality. And when behind that door, there's something really great, which is the ability to unlock latent potential in your people, the ability to scale a business beyond what you ever imagined. And then to your last point, the ability not to work 140 hours a week, but maybe to work 40 normal hours a week because so much of what you're done is automated to the point where I mentioned earlier, before you even asked the question, like when I left, they didn't really replace my role exactly. There were other roles. We were growing and whatever. But that's, that's the dream.
- [19:10]
D
Yeah. Yeah. I love that answer, by the way. And that's probably one of the hardest pills to swallow for all of us. I would say as we kind of grow past that owner operator phase, or maybe, you know, a team of 10, you can still be pretty intimately involved. But it's very hard to scale past million, million and a half as I see it, as I'm going through it. Without replicating and duplicating yourself and realizing, like, I'm still realizing this, hey, maybe I'm not as needed as I need to be or other people can do what I can do.
- [19:39]
B
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- [20:41]
D
I've come to find out. Learning some of these tenants and principles from Mark, you know, in the last two years. And again, like, here's the crazy thing, folks, I'll tell you honestly, like when, when Mark and Mike and some of their great leaders on their team say stuff on stage, I like go home and do it. And it works. I'm like, oh my gosh, you know what I mean? Like, it's very, very exciting because I'm, I'm the, the weirdo that I'll go to the conference. I'm not there to like exclusively Fraternize and go to dinners, I couldn't care less. Like, I want to fix my life and change my stars. And until, like, my last name has, you know, lot of zeros behind it for my wife, my kids, kids. Like, the job's not done, so I'm not there to, like, mess around. Like, I joke a lot on the podcast and in person, but when I go there, I'm like, please don't bother me. I want to learn. Because these guys have the. The fruit. They have the results. And so, Mike, when you say something on stage, I go home, I reevaluate something. I do it. It works. And you're like, yeah, we've been doing this since the 90s. And I'm like, I'm just, like, fired up, brother. You know what I mean? And I've learned, for example, the lean, you know, principals and the tenants, you know, that Mark's Sharon, and you're promoting all the time and talking about, like, unrealized people, talent. Like, I just realized I have all these great people, and I'm like, yeah, I want to do more for them. And I start unleashing them in my organization, like, very, very remedial level. Okay? Like, the basic stuff. And they're not only doing it, they're outperforming and they're. And they're coming up with their own ideas. And, like, five of us or eight of us or 10 of us are trying to move the organization forward, not just myself anymore. And like, that. I can't begin to describe how fun that makes the business feel versus this. I don't know if we'll ever get there kind of conversation. Can you. Can you speak to that or share about that? Did it ever feel like that with you guys, as you were trying to grow and scale with TBG and you and Mark.
- [22:25]
C
Well, I can relate to what you just said, really, personally, as an operations manager that was building systems and even technology to automate some of this stuff. I will. But I was the linchpin between Mark and the crews in many cases. Definitely between our vendors and the crews, sometimes between the customers and our crews. Mostly Mark. But when. When. That was when Mark had the vision of, like, you know, who would be the best person to run this job is the crew lead, who's on the site, who's doing the job every day. Like, it used to be when himself or his brother or probably half your listening audience was on the job running itself. He's like, that's. That's when that person knows everything about what's happening that day. They're going to know what they need tomorrow, what should have happened yesterday, what they're going to need a week from now. That person should be doing that. And when it was suggested that we build systems that allow our crew leads to order their own materials and, and I immediately pushed back. Like you have no idea how many calls I make to make sure this gets right to get there on time. Our vendors are just as bad as we are and so like all like I'm not getting ever reliable stuff. This is never going to work. And then as we started doing it and I realized, wait a minute, these jobs are going better than they did when I was in the middle of all these conversations because that just opens up all kinds of opportunities. You're right. You get that profound realization of like and feeling of. There's a certain pride in that. Right? Like that, oh wow, this is, this is awesome. To not feel needed when you don't feel like you will. You don't think you're gonna feel that way before you're needed, but after you're like, oh, it is really cool not to be needed for everything. Your life's less stressful.
- [24:08]
D
Yeah. Yeah, I love that. I wanna maybe just circle back to training and we'll probably land the plane here in just a few minutes. Because I want to be really respectful of your time. Like I, I have like 10 different rabbit holes that I could pursue on this whole conversation with yourself because you have such a lot of experience, great perspective. Every time I get with Mark, I'm like, how do I find a guy like Mike? And he's like, you don't have to find a guy like Mike. He goes, I found Mike. Mike gets to work with all of us now at leanscaper. I'm like, okay, fair enough. So I'm like just always enthusiastically like willing to sit at your guys feet with all the stuff that you guys are sharing. Because the breakthroughs I'm going through, like I said, are stuff that you guys have mastered, I mean, and taught hundreds, if not thousands, if not right? Tens of thousands of people on how to do this. And it like it does work. There is an operating system here that you guys are rolling out with leanscaper. One thing I just wanted to focus on for a couple quick seconds was maybe just give these guys like the 62nd on leanscaper. No pitch, but just what that is. But then I would love to see if you can like couple that to the fact that that like AI exclusively is not going to solve your problems. Like ordering materials to the job sites at TBG didn't exactly like make TBG instantly scale to 50 million. It was the, the system of training and education that you guys put together with that is in my opinion my outside looking in. Right. Like as you guys have told these stories, it wasn't automations necessarily or you know, people ordered materials to job site. That's a huge part of it. But you guys taught people how to be owners and you guys taught people how to have their own budget. Right. You, you guys really taught and built a system on how to build leaders. So like AI is great as to get all the busyness out of the business but I don't want people to be confused that like AI and Lana and leanscaper isn't just going to be a silver bullet. Like you still have to teach and train and how to develop leaders. So can you kind of help me with the difference between those two and then how do those marry together? As we're trying to scale our businesses
- [26:12]
C
today, when we talk about growing leaders, you have to create an environment where that's something that people want to do. And I think that's an important nuance not just can do, but want to be able to do. So why would I want all the responsibility of running a job for a dollar more an hour that I'm doing today? That is, that would seem crazy. So part of that would be like. And what Mark was also really good at is building an incentive system that said, look, you know, when we have a budget, we have a way of making sure we're going to be profitable. And then once we surpass that number, I'm going to share in the rewards with you. So now we basically opened up unlimited income opportunity. Like you have like the people who are listening here, limited obviously by like normal constraints, but right. Unlimited in theory. Right. If you did $1 million worth of work, we'd pay you $250,000 or whatever the math worked out to be because like who cares what your wage is? It's what, what you're worth. And so giving them that opportunity was good. And then I think for everybody to realize like that's an important part of building leaders, then the next part is like giving those leaders a system to work within which is I think where I can really come in handy. It can make super clear the expectations of excellence, the expectations of the way things are supposed to happen to everybody in the company so that that's way more scalable. But also learning how to use AI from a question and answer Perspective is like for those who haven't really dug into it is profoundly life changing. I don't mean to your point, like hey, look, order this material. I mean you can have discussions about your relationships, you can have discussions about business, you can have discussions about leadership or education. And it's quite profound what you'll get out of it. And so it's, we've just never been in a more exciting time to grow, cultivate and systemize leaders. I think for those who haven't sort of taken a dip into the opportunity there, number one, it's just personally more rewarding than you think it will be. And number two, five years from now, you're, the value of your business will likely depend on it. And if you're any kind of employee or worker, the value of your job and your, your value on the labor market will depend on your ability to not just use A.I. like you said, to execute basic tasks, but to use AI as a superpower to make yourself, to give you the knowledge of the world behind you and then it's your job to filter that right, to ask the right questions, to pull the right information, the best practices to say. So that's what AI will do for you. It'll give you everything you want. Now it's your job to say, how do I take that down like a funnel and stream it into the thing that's going to have the most impact for whatever my role is. And people that are good at that, and the only way you're going to get good at it is practicing. But people that are good at that are going to be worth a lot more than it's. It's a, a type of person we've never had before in history because nobody's ever had the world's information at their fingertips before. So it's super exciting, but I honestly think super important.
- [29:36]
D
And I, I would say, right, not to be cheesy, but we're just getting started right in this whole conversation. I mean, yeah, like chat GPT for example, came out maybe two years ago, like 18 months ago, whatever you call it, or open source or whatever you guys call that. And I was like reluctant to even use it. Appear friend of ours, Caleb Allman was using it for six months and I was making fun. I'm like, you're using the robots to run your business. And then he's like, as usual, Caleb's like, dude, you're a dork. You don't know what you don't know. And I'm like, for sure. Then I go to One of your guys events and we were using chat right before Lana came out the same time last year and it's only been a year. I don't know if you like can feel that same like holy cow sentiment but like I only have started really coming around you and Mark since March last year when we were in I think Nashville, right. And it's like, it seems like it's been five years of. There is not a single thing in my business that's the same since the same time last year. Not a single thing. A couple of the same employees. But the processes, the systems, the branding, our, our documentation, our SOPs, who we are, what we do, what we say is all completely revolutionized because of you guys. And I'm, I'm, I definitely drink the Kool Aid, quote unquote, not so much exclusively just Mike and leanscaper but like Mark and Mike's thought process. Like these guys have the roadmap and again I'm not here to reinvent the wheel. I don't have that kind of time and my kids are little. I want to spend as much time with them. I want to bless my guys as much as I can, as soon as I can. So my last question, maybe Mike is probably just a simple one to land the plane. You guys are doing a lot with leanscaper. A lot of great technologies coming to the market. What, why, why would people, why are people not adopting technology maybe as fast as they could be or should be, you know, like what's your, what's your. If you had to do a plea, right? Like what, why are people still reluctant, you know, to switch even to a CRM, you know, or our budgeting software like lmn, which you guys did an amazing job with. Is it, is it like the fear of the unknown? Is it. This is the way we've always done it. Because I'm still trying to convince people, hey, you should come to leanscaper and hey, you should come to use Element. And people like, no, no, I'm good. And I'm like, is it the whole you don't know what you don't know, like how did you guys get your teams to start adopting the software? You know, with that pushback? Like you guys are the best at teaching and training people on how to do this and adopt it. Any thoughts there on owners or getting the team to buy in?
- [32:05]
C
Yeah, so I think, I think there's a couple of layers there and I'll try to be quick, but one is, is I think goes back to what we were Talking about before with this, which is the maybe unwarranted confidence in our own, like, I know how to do this. This is whatever. And like, no doubt that you do. You got here. And for sure. But also no doubt that you could be better. It doesn't matter what level of anything you play at, right? There's only a very small fraction of the world that's ever achieved the best at whatever that particular discipline is. And so I think people say no to technology because they don't necessarily. They don't necessarily see the connection between improving their personal performance and technology or their company performance. And then next there's just a story of like, hey, look, I don't need it. I'm fine where I am. And that's okay. That's fine, too. But there's a massive opportunity behind it, and it might be something that you really enjoy and that gets into the other thing where you're like. And we could use kids as an example or people or whatever, but the first time you want your kid to be, like, good at, like, jiu jitsu or karate or something, right? You can put them in that court. And the chances are the first five classes, they're not going to be that thrilled about it because they just got kicked in the ribs, a bunch of time or space smushed into a mat, and it's unlikely they're going to come back super happy. But it's also something that. And you stick to it and you get good at it and you realize the benefits that it has for your mental health, your physical health, the discipline, your confidence, your whatever. Now all of a sudden you're like, well, thank goodness my parents pushed me into doing that for a while, and it got me over that hump and it got me to realize it. And that's my best analogy for technology, my best analogy for how we've rolled it out to our staff. There has been all the way back to TBG days, arguments over us adopting tech. I remember rolling out time tracking and them thinking we were going to be able to scrape their phones for their personal family photos and stuff. Weird stuff, right? Like, no, we can't do that.
- [34:06]
B
We would.
- [34:07]
C
Why would I even. I don't want to see your pictures. None of that. But it's. Once you push people over the edge there and we just, you know, hey, you have two weeks to learn it, ask all the questions you want. And after two weeks, we can't pay you unless you're putting your stuff in here. Those. Those type of things are big. And we do the same at leanscaper. Even though we're all very tech and very tech forward, you make people uncomfortable when you're like, hey, your job is about to change. But you can be so much better at your job if you learn how to use it this way and right. Yeah, I think that's people that are willing.
- [34:36]
D
Yeah, that's probably like the best way I've heard, because that's the truth. I'm two years deep, like I said, into Element, and I couldn't even imagine running my business without it. And now, same thing. I'm about a year under a belt here at Cape Coral's event here in two weeks with one year under my belt with the leanscaper stuff. And it's like, I just know too much. I'm like, I've seen the other side and people are like, hey. And you know, like, outside looking in, even big, big peers, big businesses, you know, they'll, you know, guys with 5 million I've done some shop tours with, they're like, hey, like, is that like, leanscaper thing? Like, is that cool? Is it fun? And I'm like, dude, you don't know what you don't know, you know, And I love what you said. Like, you will probably get your butt kicked with anything in life, not just, you know, software, trying anything new or trying to be better, right? Like, let's just be honest. But again, people use the crutch of software or technology, like it's this whimsical thing. It's like, no, dude, you got to put in the reps. No different than if you're doing anything else in life, you know, and whether it's a hobby or something for business or your, you know, your marriage, right? Like, you, you have to put in those reps, and you're not going to be good at it the first day, week, month or year, you know, I'm a year into the quote, unquote leanscaper ecosystem, and I could see this still take another year or two to really start, you know, getting some great traction in terms of scalability. We're building the foundation this last year. We've got a lot of our ducks in a row, and I can't wait to see where we go this next 12 months because, boy, have we laid like the Burj Khalifa of foundations. Ready to build a skyscraper for brands on maintenance in my, my, in my mind, right? So I, I can't think enough of the time. Mike, this has been great. I know if there's one of those things where I'm like, hey, what are we leaving out or what do you want to talk about? Or where you see in this or what do you think about that? I know we could talk for hours more. I know we'll get you back on in the. In the future. You're always a fun, pleasant conversation. I remember actually being at the Dallas event upstairs at the Fireside Chat dinner, if you remember. And you when the other guy in private equity who was doing like 50 million, you guys were just talking back and forth. It was like. It was like Elon Musk and, you know, Larry Page up here, you know, talking back and forth and like two giant titans of business worth an extraordinarily amount of money. And we're at a round table and you guys were just ranting for like 10 minutes straight. And the guy from Action Home Services, he raised his hand to like, break it up and he goes, does anybody else feel too dumb for this conversation? And we all died laughing because you and this other guy that the thought process was just so elevated. And I'm like, thank God they sent me at the smart persons table, you know, So I just. I have to just say, Mike, I love listening to you. The stuff that you say secondhand, it's like some of the best stuff that I hear all. All year. And you're like, we were teaching that in the 90s. And I'm like, good Lord, you know what I mean? Like, what else you got? You know? And so can't think enough for your time, can't think enough for your wisdom, your leadership, what you guys are doing for the industry. I'll give you the last thought. Anything you want to leave these guys, maybe quick plug for leanscaper, by the way. Coming to Cake Portal. We're gonna see about 500 plus there, which we're trending to have some great turnout there. But I'll give you the last thought, brother. Anything you want to share, anything we left out, but can't. Thank you again for. For the time today.
- [37:43]
C
No, for sure. I'll. I'll be super. First of all, embarrassing. It's not. It's reps and it's being in the room with like, being fortunate enough to be in the room with the right people to have conversations that led to that conversation that you sat to. So, like, it's not natural. It's just right spot, right time, good work ethic. Yeah. Leanscaper AI, it's free. Just like take a run at it. Go play.
- [38:09]
B
It is.
- [38:09]
C
For those who don't know, it's like an AI. It's AI built for nothing but the landscape industry. So it contains our business model, our philosophies, our way of running a business that you can customize to the world's end. But it's a starting point and it's, that's the easiest way I can, I can do to start it. And then behind that there's an accelerator program. And you're right. Cape Coral event coming up in Fry, in, sorry in, in March 11, where you can get in a room with the hundreds of other contractors that are putting this to work in their business every day. So yeah, but if you're just looking at like wet your appetite. Leanscaper AI, go online, sign up and just start playing. Just start putting in the reps. It's not as bad as Jiu jitsu, I'll tell you that.
- [38:54]
D
Yeah, I love it. I love it guys. If you want to go to the event, by the way, first one's free, quick little plug and promo there. First one's free. It's a three thousand dollar retail ticket. So if you guys want to go check it out, maybe you're in the greater Florida area or that date works for you guys, or you just live in the Midwest and you're tired of seeing snow, come on down, get away for you know, two or three days. It's always a great time. That one's all about operations. And so it's kind of piggybacking off of the conversation that Mike and I had today. So if you want to build a bigger company, a better organization, scale this thing, I cannot begin to, I just don't have enough, I don't have the vernacular, the vocabulary to articulate how much that event did for me last year. And we did the back to back events with revenue and operations in Nashville last year. And 100%, that was the best week of my entire business career. Like I will 1000% when I sell in 5 or 10 years at 5 or 10 million, look back and say that event is what allowed me to make a 10 million dollar exit. And I'm not even kidding, I'm not even exaggerating. How good could it be, Mike? Like it is that good and then some. And so you guys are changing families. I know that's your guys mission. I know that's your guys's, you know, ethos. You guys are making a difference. You guys are helping people. Guys like me, just folks that are just floating around in the ethos, hoping that like as the student is ready, the teacher will appear. So I Just, you know, if you guys are having a, a crappy day, Mike, just like to let you guys know, guys like me and folks listening in, like, absolutely need you. Love you. And can't thank you guys enough for sticking with it on the tough days to, you know, hopefully enjoy some of those better days like today. So can't thank you enough, brother.
- [40:34]
C
Hey, Brian, honestly, like, what could be better than trying to help an industry and your business and a family all at the same time? It's awesome. So my pleasure.
- [40:43]
D
Awesome. Well, let's do this. We'll. We'll finish up with their leanscaper AI Plug. Plug your stuff. Personally, I know you're. You're on LinkedIn, right? All that Mike Lysacki probably on LinkedIn and all that fun stuff, right?
- [40:51]
C
Yeah, yeah. Mike Kaisecki on LinkedIn.
- [40:53]
B
Yep, yep.
- [40:54]
D
Give him a follow.
- [40:54]
C
I'm on, to be honest. Yeah, yeah, hit me up on LinkedIn if you have any questions, you need anything.
- [40:59]
D
Yeah. And if you guys see him running around at a leanscaper event, go run up, shake his hand, give him a high five. He'll, he'll be humble and tell you I'm not that good.
- [41:05]
C
He's.
- [41:06]
D
He's a, he's a bad liar. He's. He's awesome. So anyway, but give a high five, Say hey, heard you on Brian show and again, it's just great to know you, Mike, and call your friends. So thanks so much for taking time to be on today's show. I'll let you get back on the road and, you know, finish up the week strong. But guys, that's what we got for you on today's podcast episode. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of the fully time filtered podcast and we look forward to catching up with all you guys here on the next one.
- [41:29]
B
Is your team ready for spring? Every year, crews scramble, deadlines slip and business owners. Owners end up stressed before the season even starts. But it doesn't have to be that way. From March 3 through March 6, join Team that Wins Spring, a free four day webinar presented by Granum with Bryan Fullerton and Sam Gimble. And get your crew ready the right way. Across four live sessions, you'll discover how to hire the right people, train them efficiently, and streamline workflows so that your team performs at its best. You'll also learn how to turn foremen into strong leaders and strengthen your company culture. This is practical, real world advice that you can implement immediately so your team hits the ground running when spring arrives. You can't miss it. Register now@granum.com events or use the special link in the podcast description and start your season strong.
- [42:29]
A
Thanks for taking the time to listen to the Fullerton Unfiltered Podcast with Bryan Fullerton. We hope you enjoyed this production. If so, please consider leaving us a five star review for the show. While the techniques and ideas presented here are designed to help you grow a more successful and profitable business, no one can guarantee these results for you. We want to emphasize that entrepreneurship is not easy and the ideas presented here are just the opinions of Brian Fullerton and his respective guests. No one can guarantee success for you. That being said, we hope the ideas presented here help you and motivate you to go on out there and crush it with your own business.
- [43:03]
C
Fullerton Unfiltered Podcast thanks for listening and
- [43:06]
A
we hope to see you on the next episode.
- [43:09]
B
This has been a Brian Fullerton and Mr. Producer Production.