I interviewed Play Ventures General Partner Phylicia Koh to explore what founders outside of gaming can learn from two decades of game design.

Play Ventures began as a gaming-focused VC fund. Today, it also invests in what Phylicia calls “playable apps,” consumer products that combine utility with the engagement mechanics of games.

That doesn’t mean slapping on points and badges. It means understanding motivation, social dynamics, retention loops, and in-app economies.

We talk about:

What actually makes an app “playable” — and why most gamification fails
The difference between vanity retention and real engagement
Why founders should get comfortable with paid user acquisition
What she wants to see at pre-seed (hint: can you ship?)
How to design for habit in categories like fintech, wellness, and spirituality

If you’re a domain expert building a consumer product and you’ve never seriously considered how game design might increase engagement and lifetime value, this conversation will give you a new lens.

RUNTIME 37:20

EPISODE BREAKDOWN

(2:33) “Play identifies as a gaming and also a consumer VC fund.”

(7:53) How she determines if gaming skills/practices will add value.

(11:19) How to pitch Play Ventures

(14:50) "Can you ship? Because shipping is hard."

(18:05) Phylicia’s top success metrics for playable apps

(21:39) “You're going to need to use paid user acquisition."

(28:07) “If somebody has a good idea, I guarantee you somebody else around the world has that idea too.”

(32:46) An idea she’d like to back that doesn't exist yet

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Thanks for listening!

– Walter.

Turning Utility Into Habit: Beyond Basic Gamification