NBA Positivity: A Winning All-Star Game and a Look Ahead to the Stretch Run

Summary

Podcast Summary: Game Over with Max Kellerman and Rich Paul

Episode: NBA Positivity: A Winning All-Star Game and a Look Ahead to the Stretch Run

Date: February 16, 2026
Hosts: Max Kellerman & Rich Paul
Podcast Network: The Ringer

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Episode Overview

This lively episode centers on the resurgence of the NBA All-Star Game, the positive momentum in the league heading into the stretch run of the season, and discussions spanning All-Star Weekend highlights, dunk contest nostalgia, NBA parity, and even a sharp detour into Major League Baseball’s labor issues. Max and Rich’s on-air chemistry is on full display, blending insider anecdotes, sharp analysis, and quick wit as they break down why the NBA is a source of optimism right now.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. NBA All-Star Game: A Return to Form

• Rich Paul’s Recap
  • The All-Star Game and surrounding weekend were a resounding success: “The entire weekend was great. The All-Star Game, it worked.” [02:03]
  • The new format—every game like the fourth quarter and a structure pitting “World vs. USA”—amplified competitiveness and excitement. [07:06]
• Game Highlights
  • Standout player performances: Wembanyama’s all-around display, Jamal Murray’s hot streak, Tyrese’s clutch moments, and Anthony Edwards’ late-game heroics (“Ant comes down three, Boom. Head fake, drive, baseline dunk… makes another one to go up one.” [09:07])
  • Kawhi Leonard scored 31 points in a quarter, “and he didn’t do it with cherry-picking… he did it every which way you could possibly do.” [11:26]
  • Emphasis on All-NBA caliber: “Those are all NBA. That’s not just an NBA player. Those are all NBA players.” [10:58]

2. All-Star Format, Incentives, and the "Money Debate"

• Max’s Incentive Proposal
  • Max still advocates for a “winner take all, $1 million per player” scheme: “You put a million dollars per player on the line… they’re gonna compete like hell.” [17:27]
  • Rich plays devil’s advocate, worried about logistical issues—especially with replacement players and injuries. [19:04]
  • Both agree higher stakes might push even more participation but recognize complications.

3. Dunk Contest: Is the Wow-Factor Gone?

• Nostalgia and Decline
  • Both reminisce about the era when the dunk contest was iconic (“The dunk contest is like a Lamborghini… the wow factor is gone.” [21:06])
  • “Zach LaVine and Aaron Gordon… we should have closed it on that. That was a high note.” [23:08]
• Causes for Drop in Interest
  • Players’ reluctance due to injury risk and busy All-Star schedules
  • Diminishing returns: “What else can we see?” [22:27]
• Player Roles and Demands
  • All-Star Weekend is packed—events, media, promotions—leaving little downtime for the athletes [25:00+].
  • Rich emphasizes the modern All-Star workload: “Those guys don’t really get to see their family like that… it’s a lot of work.” [25:40]

4. Behind the Scenes of All-Star Weekend

• Insider Stories
  • Rich recounts exclusive events: Tech Summit, Steve Ballmer’s party, an Obama gathering with just 40 guests, Clutch Sports’ buzzy party (fire marshal in attendance!) [28:47–33:16].
  • NBA Cares and Clutch Athletics community events highlighted—players giving back.

5. Baseball Labor Rant

• Max’s Take on MLB Labor and Economics
  • Max rails against small-market MLB owners’ salary cap desires: “Every salary cap argument that any owners in any sports have ever made do not actually have to do with competitive balance. It has to do with smaller market owners…” [34:00]
  • Suggests capping contract years and eliminating deferred money for big spenders to solve MLB’s issues [38:09].
  • Rich chimes in on the importance of smart management as much as deep pockets (“They have the money, but they also have the brains.” [39:22])

6. NBA’s Competitive Parity & Second-Half Outlook

• Renewed Excitement & Parity

  • The hosts cite a long list of legitimate contenders: “Now you have the stretch run… you have a bunch of contenders to do it, emerging stars. You’re right.” [52:14]
  • Max’s “field vs. OKC” discussion, Rich’s Detroit optimism, and deep dives on Denver, Boston, Spurs, and Houston signal a league with real competitive uncertainty [48:00–58:34].
  • “It’s different now, which I also think is really good for the NBA.” [49:50]

• Role Players: The Gap is Shrinking

  • “The gap between a real All Star back in the day and a role player was wide… nowadays, that gap has shrunk.” [54:56]
  • “Don’t sleep on Denver… the rise of Peyton Watson… Now you look at it like, ‘Oh, shit, Denver’s…’” [55:38–56:20]

• Draft & Sleeper Talk to Come

  • Teaser for next episode: Rich to break down sleeper prospects in this year’s draft and demonstrate why picks 17–30 can be just as impactful as higher selections [59:23–61:06].

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the All-Star Game Succeeding:
  “Adam Silver and his team done an unbelievable job. It was a win. Yesterday was a win.”
  —Rich Paul [11:46]

• On Larger Competitiveness and Parity:
  “The NBA, which has had a lot of criticism this year… if you look at the rest of this season, you’re right. There is a lot to be excited about. OKC or the field. What about Wemby and the Spurs? It’s possible that it’s already their time.”
  —Max Kellerman [50:23]

• Max on Incentivizing All-Stars:
  “The All Star Game should be that. It should be the hall of justice against the Legion of Doom, right?”
  —Max Kellerman [18:06]

• Rich on All-Star Weekend’s Demands:
  “You cannot relax. Right. You have to… you have media, you have practice… you have NBA Cares events … if you are a signature athlete… your brand partnerships…”
  —Rich Paul [24:47]

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Important Segment Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment Description | |-----------|------------------------------------------------------| | 02:03–08:37 | Rich’s All-Star Game Recap & Format Discussion | | 09:07–12:46 | Star Performances and Game Highlights | | 17:27–19:06 | Incentivizing All-Star Game Players | | 21:06–23:14 | Decline of the Dunk Contest & Nostalgia | | 28:47–33:16 | Behind-the-Scenes All-Star Weekend Stories | | 34:00–41:32 | Max’s MLB Labor Rant & Rich’s Ownership Insight | | 48:00–55:38 | NBA Parity, Contenders, and Role-Player Analysis | | 59:23–61:06 | Sleepers/Draft Preview Teaser |

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Tone & Chemistry

Max and Rich mix playful banter (“This guy’s a joke…” [62:26]), self-deprecation, and candid insight throughout. Rich peppers the show with exclusive, behind-the-scenes nuggets, while Max drives analytical debates, especially where sports business meets culture. Their chemistry remains authentic and energetic—never shying from differences (“You like a cheese it when it comes to that stuff.” [47:22]) but always driving the conversation forward.

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Takeaways for Listeners

• The NBA All-Star Game regained competitiveness and buzz—thanks to smart formatting and player buy-in.
• NBA parity is peaking: Several franchises could credibly win the championship, making the stretch run genuinely unpredictable.
• All-Star Weekend is not just glitz—it's a grind for the athletes, who juggle events, family, and sponsor obligations.
• There’s skepticism surrounding traditional solutions (like more money or salary caps), but creative tweaks—inside and outside basketball—can shift the narrative.
• Next episode will dive into sleeper prospects for the NBA draft and lessons from draft history.

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For listeners who missed the episode:
Expect a fresh, insider look at what’s driving NBA positivity, rich game and industry analysis, and some classic Kellerman/Paul tangents—serving up both knowledge and entertainment as the NBA rolls toward one of its most compelling finishes in years.

Transcript

[Host/Announcer]

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[Max Kellerman]

Very sharp jacket today.

[Rich Paul]

Thank you. Yeah. Thank you.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

Throwback out the closet.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

See you. You go and spend money every week. I know you do. I don't.

[Max Kellerman]

Well, I gotta keep some stuff fresh for the air, but I got stuff in the closet. Doesn't all fit, but, you know, it's in the closet. Listen, I was calling a fight last night in Vegas. Zufa Boxing. 3 Some good knockouts on that card. But. So I did not get to see the All Star Game. Everyone's telling me, though, like. And everything I'm reading is, it was a success.

[Rich Paul]

It was.

[Max Kellerman]

Simmons was even on. He posted something on Instagram, I think it was, where he was, like, falling asleep on his couch early on. And then by the end of the night, he was like, I gotta give it up. The game was good.

[Rich Paul]

Why was he falling asleep? He must have corn beef.

[Max Kellerman]

He was like, cord in the beginning or something. I don't know.

[Rich Paul]

No boring parts of the game.

[Max Kellerman]

I think he was anticipating that it would be boring because it usually is.

[Rich Paul]

No. First of all, the entire weekend was great. The weekend was really good.

[Max Kellerman]

All right?

[Rich Paul]

But the All Star Game, it worked. And guess what, Max. You were wrong.

[Max Kellerman]

About what?

[Rich Paul]

You don't need a million dollars. You. You don't need a million dollars. I told you, you don't need the money.

[Max Kellerman]

When you. Okay, I'm gonna let you know what. This is what we're gonna do. Let's start the show. You take me through the All Star Game, I'm gonna hear you out. Cause I didn't get to see it. So I want, you know, paint the picture for me. Explain why it was so good. And then when you're done, I'll tell you why my idea is still better.

[Rich Paul]

Let me ask you a question.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

Did you ever. And this is where we need to state your case and you need to go to the judge.

[Host/Announcer]

Uh oh.

[Max Kellerman]

Did you ever hate hearing that get.

[Rich Paul]

Up on that podium in your previous jobs after not watching a game and just say things, blabber things out?

[Max Kellerman]

No, but there were times where like let's say because you know you have conflicts, like you can't watch the game if I'm calling a fight or if I'm traveling or something and I can't watch the game.

[Rich Paul]

I can put your iPad up.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah. What you have is you might miss.

[Rich Paul]

An uppercut, but that's just.

[Max Kellerman]

Is YouTube. You can do the 20 minute version of the NFL game or NBA game and you can catch. So I would use that sometimes. Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

So this explains that if you were doing that, someone who is extremely detailed and extremely thoughtful and all those other things that it takes to be a genius, then that mean others are doing the same thing.

[Max Kellerman]

Are doing the same thing. Some people probably just playing games on their phone during the game, which leads to my point.

[Rich Paul]

It's a lot of, lot of, lot of misses.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

So I will update you as your partner. I'll update you on the All Star game and the entire weekend because it was a really good weekend.

[Max Kellerman]

Oh yeah. You always have some behind the scenes stories too. Are you able to talk about any of them?

[Rich Paul]

I'll take you through.

[Max Kellerman]

All right, perfect.

[Rich Paul]

You want to go on like a Neil Jerker?

[Max Kellerman]

Let's do it.

[Rich Paul]

One tank trip.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah, let's do it, man.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, I could do that.

[Max Kellerman]

All right, Game over with Max Kellerman and Rich Paul.

[Rich Paul]

Game [e-mail]. yeah.

[Max Kellerman]

Right. Email us Please subscribe.

[Rich Paul]

Oh, we gotta go through the email.

[Max Kellerman]

We gotta do the emails. We have to do the emails.

[Rich Paul]

You know what we should do?

[Max Kellerman]

I don't know if we got time today.

[Rich Paul]

Maybe we started what we should do.

[Max Kellerman]

What?

[Rich Paul]

This is what we should do.

[Max Kellerman]

All right.

[Rich Paul]

We have to do a show with threads.

[Max Kellerman]

All right?

[Rich Paul]

And we want people threading. This should be a live show. We want people threading through the show, through the show subjects. Right. So that we could pick a thread, boom. And talk about it right away.

[Max Kellerman]

Oh, that's good.

[Rich Paul]

That could be pretty cool. We can try that. Should we try that?

[Max Kellerman]

You want to do a live show before?

[Rich Paul]

Maybe you want to take the show.

[Max Kellerman]

On the road somewhere or do it from the studio?

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, I mean we got to get out of here.

[Max Kellerman]

Sometimes we do it sometimes.

[Rich Paul]

But we should do that.

[Max Kellerman]

We should have guest. One of these. Like, we got to start having guests.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, but I don't want to have.

[Max Kellerman]

Too many guests because one is probably a good place to start, though. Well, we could do one as opposed to zero.

[Rich Paul]

Well, Snoop said he wants to be our first guest.

[Max Kellerman]

Oh, really?

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, when he gets back from the Olympics. He said he wants to be our first guest.

[Max Kellerman]

I'll have me some Snoop. You know what's amazing now, before we start the show.

[Rich Paul]

The show's already started. Quit saying before we start the show.

[Max Kellerman]

There were some.

[Rich Paul]

It's already started.

[Max Kellerman]

Rappers early on that were just stars. Right. They happen to be hip hop stars, but they were gonna be stars.

[Rich Paul]

More than that.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah, Right. So the guys I always think about.

[Rich Paul]

Ll. Yes.

[Max Kellerman]

Ice Cube.

[Rich Paul]

Yes.

[Max Kellerman]

Right. Those dudes were just.

[Rich Paul]

Don't forget one. Oh, yeah, go ahead. Snoop.

[Max Kellerman]

Snoop is another one. Snoop's just a star.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah.

[Max Kellerman]

And you just happen to be a rapper. But he's just a star.

[Rich Paul]

He is. Yeah. Will Smith was another one.

[Max Kellerman]

Will Smith. Great. Great. Exactly.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah.

[Max Kellerman]

And they all wind up movie stars, basically. Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah. Well, there's acting in entertainment.

[Max Kellerman]

Oh, you mean in performance.

[Rich Paul]

Of course.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah.

[Max Kellerman]

All right. Should we start acting?

[Rich Paul]

I guess so. Yeah.

[Max Kellerman]

Okay. All Star Game.

[Rich Paul]

Wrong, wrong, wrong. What's wrong? What's wrong, Max? What's wrong?

[Max Kellerman]

Remember the Happy Days episodes where the Fonz couldn't say he was wrong? I was.

[Rich Paul]

But in all seriousness, Max, I think you were right in terms of. Let's incentivize it. Right? Let's make it. That will make it fun. That will make it a lot. That will make it fun. But I'm telling you what I saw yesterday. It's a lot to unpack. And we got it right. And let me tell you why we got it right. As much as. As much as it was about all the negative messaging and, you know, All Star Weekends, All Star Games. If you go back and you saw KD's comments, we was there.

[Max Kellerman]

Wait, which ones? From the burner.

[Rich Paul]

No, no, no, no. I don't know about that.

[Max Kellerman]

And we don't even know if it was a burner. We're going to get to that.

[Rich Paul]

Later, when he talked about the other All Star Games. We watched all the All Star Games. They were not competing quarters one through four. They were not.

[Max Kellerman]

Let's not pretend that there was some mythical time where the All Star Game was this incredibly competitive. KD is right about that.

[Rich Paul]

Because we got so many platforms now and people just want to pile on, okay, great. But the reality of it is this. It was a combination of things. The biggest thing was the format. Because if you don't have to play a four quarter game and you create a format where every game is the fourth quarter, you get a competitive start and finish, it's smart.

[Max Kellerman]

It makes sense.

[Rich Paul]

That was very smart. And then when you add on top of that the International versus the World versus the usa, that also is just an added value right now in this case, you saw players like Wemby come out and say, which is great. He came out and said, I want to really approach this with a seriousness. And you saw other players follow with that same sentiment. But I don't think it was necessarily one person did this and everyone else did that. I think it was just a holistic approach by all. And we didn't. And because there was so much chatter about it, we got to hear someone's intentions very early, which in this case it was Wimby's. And then the other thing was the scheduling. I thought that the All Star committee did a great job of scheduling the world team versus the Stars, I believe, which was the younger. Which was the younger team. And that jumped it off right away. It was good. It was good.

[Max Kellerman]

You told me this morning you said something about how what you saw in the All Star game was. How did you put it all? Yeah, like I think about the NFL, the difference between a Pro Bowler and an All Pro player. And so what's the point about all NBA?

[Rich Paul]

Well, you. Well, as I'm watching the game, you're seeing guys that. It's like, wait a minute, these guys didn't practice. I know JB and the coaches, the coach from Toronto and Mitch, they probably put in a couple different sets. Ms. Johnson from the spurs, they probably put in a couple different sets. But when you see a guy and obviously know each other plays, they play each other all the time. But when you, when you. And there's some sets you can just put in that everybody has ran, whether you've been on the same team all your career or was traded, there's going to be some sets that you could just run. But you seen last night, there were stretches. First of all, Wimby was, I mean, he did everything. Dunks, step back, threes, et cetera. You've seen Jamal Murray have a flurry. You seen, you were able to see Tyrese turn it on. You were able to see obviously the LeBron and the KD's ant. I mean, it was a stretch where they were losing. And Ant comes down three, Boom. Head fake, drive, baseline dunk. And then they were like down the entire game. And I think they were down four or five. But anyway, he made a three, come down, get a steal, makes another one to go up one. It's 18 seconds left in the game, or maybe up two. It's 18 seconds left in THE game. And then here comes De' Aaron who they ran a play.

[Max Kellerman]

Mr. Clutch.

[Rich Paul]

LeBron's. LeBron's initiating the offense. They ran a play where I think Jalen, Jalen Brunson, he cut right down the middle. LeBron found him on the cut and then he kicked the ball out to the corner to De' Aon in the short corner. On the closeout, de' Aaron's a left handed player, so now he has to retreat, dribble right as the clock is running down. This is probably one of two shots he's had the entire game. Bucket. Those are all, those are, those are all NBA. That's not just an NBA player. Those are all NBA players.

[Max Kellerman]

I remember watching, like, because in the old days, part of the appeal of the All Star game is if a guy there was a star player, really athletic and entertaining, but he just didn't have a star teammate, you got to see what it would look like if he played with someone else on his level. Right? Yeah, that's what like Vince Carter and AI I remember in All Star, yeah.

[Rich Paul]

There were more, but there were more roster spots then.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah, we shortened, but it was just fun to see. Like, what would it look like if. If AI had a Vince Carter on the wing. Right. And it looked great is what it looked like.

[Rich Paul]

Absolutely. So then you had this stretch where Kawhi, Kawhi. Kawhi scored 31 points in the quarter. Right.

[Max Kellerman]

Which is insane territory.

[Rich Paul]

And he didn't do it with like cherry picking. No, he. He did it every which way you could possibly do.

[Max Kellerman]

How many threes did he hit for that? 31, 3 or 4 type of dude to get, somehow get 31. All through mid range, he had fadeaways.

[Rich Paul]

He had mid range, he had steals. And what he said in his press conference afterwards, the interview afterwards, he said, you know, we are experienced players and so these guys don't mind the sacrificing when they, when they see the hot hand. And it's true, normally in the All Star game, it's like, your turn, my turn. But he was on a heater and they were. The bench was up and the guys that was on the floor fed him. And so it was a win. Adam Silver and his team done an unbelievable job. It was a win. Yesterday was a win. Now, I will say I found out something, though, within it, especially if you're an older team, because see, what happened was the first game was the World versus the younger. I think was the Stars. So they played then. So they beat the World. And you can visibly see how furious Wemby was. He was furious about that loss.

[Max Kellerman]

Good.

[Rich Paul]

Okay. Then the next game, the Stripes beat the Stars. So they won that game. And then I think they beat. They beat. Yeah. Then they beat the World team. The Stripes did. So now the championship game is between the Stripes and the Stars, Both USA teams. But the older team has played.

[Max Kellerman]

Oh, they're gassed.

[Rich Paul]

They're gassed. So now when they. The reason why the last game wasn't as exciting is because I'm not going to say their legs were gone, but, like, you know, it's hard to have four really strong cores.

[Max Kellerman]

Listen, there's a reason why you have a bench. Because what they've found is, when they've looked at it, is you bring a fresh body off the bench, even if he's playing against All Stars. But they've been playing a lot, and they're fresh. The fresh body is like the only thing.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah. And it's only eight. I think it's only eight players, right? Or maybe. Yeah, eight players. Seven. Seven. Or. I think De' Aon and Brandon Ingram was the. And Donovan Mitchell. So it was eight. It might have been a thing where maybe we start those guys and. Or. And. Or. I'll never say you want to lose on purpose, but you get a longer wait time. After you got your first win already, you can get a longer wait time.

[Max Kellerman]

See what you're doing right now. This is the issue with tanking in the NBA. Anytime you set up a game, there will be people who manipulate the rules in order to try. The objective is the same. We're trying to win, but they use the rules in ways that you didn't intend.

[Rich Paul]

No, I was just thinking. Thinking about it from that perspective because I'm like, strategic. Yeah, strategic.

[Max Kellerman]

Maybe we. We tank this game so that we're fresh for the game. We need to win.

[Rich Paul]

That's what tanking is actually, with the fresher legs. You know, the. By the way, the young guys. I mean, could you imag. I mean, the young guys, they was throwing people out there. They were throwing like Chad. Then they throw out Scotty Barnes. Then you had Ty.

[Max Kellerman]

Hey, what did Wemby do it with? Because Wemby has been bullying Chet all year. Did we get that matchup at all?

[Rich Paul]

Not really get the matchup, but Wemby was incredible.

[Max Kellerman]

I mean, but you know what I mean? How he gets up for Chet. Like, Chet is the other long, lanky, weirdly tall, good player. And Wemby seems to see him as.

[Rich Paul]

The size of dude.

[Max Kellerman]

He needs to.

[Rich Paul]

Yesterday he saw everybody. It was. It was. He saw everybody. It seemed to be. I want to send a message because we right back here in 28 kids.

[Max Kellerman]

This is how it used to be. By the way, if you used to miss a game, we. When I was a kid, there was no replay, no nothing. You had to go find some friend in your neighborhood who had to tell you about it.

[Rich Paul]

But it was great. It was great. I took my youngest son. He had an unbelievable time. And the energy was there when you. When the. If you were watching on tv. Because when I first got to my seat, it was like, oh, it looked like it was going to be empty.

[Max Kellerman]

Right.

[Rich Paul]

Boom. By the time the Star spangled Banner was sang, it was like that. It was great. And that arena, great for all star.

[Max Kellerman]

I spoke to someone today who told me they were at a sports bar and no one was paying attention to the game because everyone was watching bobsledding, Olympic bobsledding.

[Rich Paul]

And that could very well be true.

[Max Kellerman]

How can you lose if you're the NBA, you can't be losing to Olympic bobsledding to a gravity event.

[Rich Paul]

I don't think that was the case. But it's the Winter Olympics too, so it's just a scheduling thing.

[Max Kellerman]

Listen, I hear you. I can't really comment intelligently about something I haven't. I wasn't there to experience because I was literally calling fights while this was going on for Zoofa boxing.

[Rich Paul]

It was a win. It was a win.

[Max Kellerman]

This is why I still say. Well, I can't still say you should do this idea instead. But why? I like my idea.

[Rich Paul]

In addition to the format, I guess. Yeah.

[Max Kellerman]

Of just. This is how I would do it. Million dollars to each player on the winning team. Nothing to the losers. Winner take all. Million bucks per player. And the reason I say that is not. I know the argument. Look, other leagues, all star games, don't have to be so serious. Why should the NBA? And I say it's because the NBA has a golden opportunity. Forget about what other people are doing. NFL doesn't lend itself to it. Forget about baseball. The NBA, they put the hoop up in the air. This is like the evolution of soccer. You see incredible things Guys flying through the air, incredible athletic feats. They're like superheroes, they fly around. The All Star Game should be that. It should be the hall of justice against the Legion of Doom, right? So incentivize them to actually play a real game. And this is the real issue for me, Rich. We have convinced athletes like, what is the NBA really? NBA is a TV show. It's primarily a TV show. That's where most people consume it, okay? And to be on this popular TV show, whoever. James Harden, LeBron James, whoever. Making a lot. Here's 30 million, 40 million, $50 million a year to be on this very popular TV show. Cuz you're one of the stars of the show, okay? Luka Doncic, whoever. Now comes the playoffs. Hey, this is an even more popular TV show. And for the honor of being on this show, we're gonna pay you a little less, right? You're not gonna get paid the same, but they're competitive guys and the championship mean something, right? So they'll still do it. The All Star Game is kind of like the championship minus the incentive of winning it, because it's meaningful. So really what we're asking these players to do is, hey, $50 million a year TV star. We'd like you to be on this other TV show that we're doing, which is also a big show. We're not gonna pay you for that one. But if you put a million dollars per player on the line and it's winner take all, plus it's bragging rights, you know how it's gonna get. They're gonna compete like hell. You could do Eastern Conference, Western Conference, like in the old days, but make the All Star Game a better competition than it's ever been. But look, if this worked last night.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, this.

[Max Kellerman]

Then what can I say? I still like my idea though.

[Rich Paul]

Well, you just. In that case, you just put in caviar on top of the fish filet. I understand it. I get it.

[Max Kellerman]

I understand caviar on a fish filet.

[Rich Paul]

No, but we can try it.

[Max Kellerman]

It doesn't sound bad, actually.

[Rich Paul]

No, listen.

[Max Kellerman]

But they still make fish fillets.

[Rich Paul]

Of course. Yeah, but. But here's what I'm saying. You're not wrong. But then there's going to be other complications because once you put the money involved. Now what happens when you have a replacement player? Right? There's. There was a lot of replacements this year.

[Max Kellerman]

The replacement player gets the duck and.

[Rich Paul]

Not the guy who was actually.

[Max Kellerman]

No, he didn't play.

[Rich Paul]

Okay? He didn't play.

[Max Kellerman]

You want to you want some?

[Rich Paul]

Now you come in, somebody out there on one leg.

[Max Kellerman]

See what I'm saying? Now all of a sudden. So, like, you make the incentive, right? Listen, I remember there was a show.

[Rich Paul]

That will stop people from, you know, having a ankle tweak and not playing, right? Yeah, that's true.

[Max Kellerman]

I remember there was a show. Remember the daytime game shows? Like, there would be, like, a $50,000 prize for. What was it, that Star show?

[Rich Paul]

I don't know. I only watched the prices. Right? But.

[Max Kellerman]

But. But the point is, they would have these daytime shows or Jeopardy. The pot would be $10,000. A new car, something like that. They did the same thing. They took it, they put it in primetime, and instead of $10,000, they made it a million dollars. Who wants to be a million? It was called Star Search when I was a kid. Remember?

[Rich Paul]

If you love Star Search.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah, Star Search. But then they did, you know, the big version of that, and they put it in primetime. They just upped the reward. And people.

[Rich Paul]

And people, you know, Let me ask you this question.

[Max Kellerman]

The stakes were higher.

[Rich Paul]

Is that is your idea better for the dunk contest or for the All Star Game?

[Max Kellerman]

Rich, I'm done with the dunk contest.

[Rich Paul]

Finito.

[Max Kellerman]

It's been over for years. Let's face it. You know, when guys. Blake and Dwight.

[Rich Paul]

Nasty. You're not blaming LeBron?

[Max Kellerman]

No, I would. Look, LeBron should have been in the dunk contest at some point.

[Rich Paul]

Of course he said that. Yeah, he wanted to be.

[Max Kellerman]

But, like. And it's. You know, you gotta put on a cape, you gotta jump over a car. You know, they're just.

[Rich Paul]

Here's what I'll say. The dunk contest is like a Lamborghini. Like, no one's really. Like, as a kid, when I was a kid, if you saw a Lamborghini.

[Max Kellerman]

You might have at PS41, where they had the. You were fenced in. In the schoolyard, right? But if you looked outside, and I remember one day a dude had a countach, right? The doors opened up like that Lamborghini, and we were all like, oh, my God, it's a spaceship. It's the greatest thing I've ever seen.

[Rich Paul]

Right?

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah. There was a sense of wow.

[Rich Paul]

I mean, we bingoed about a Toyota Corolla, let alone seeing a Lamborghini. But the wow factor is gone. And I know everyone wants to blame LeBron. What else is new? And I think. And I know for a fact he did want to do dunk contest. But we can't have it every which way, because in some Cases you say, well, you know, people were following him, but not really. Or they didn't follow him, they didn't look up. They, you know, they didn't aspire to be, et cetera, which I totally disagree with. But what I will say is there's a moment in your career as an athlete where if you were interested in doing a dunk contest, you probably should. To be honest with you, me as representation, I'm very like reluctant forward just because of the consistent landing, you know, which is tough, especially if a guy ever had knee complications. Yeah, I definitely don't want you out during the dunk contest for what you know. But then there is some situations where I think young guys want to do it. But I think the bigger issue is. And I would push a young guy, if there was no real issues one time to do it. I think it is in good partnership with the league.

[Max Kellerman]

Haven't they run out of dunks?

[Rich Paul]

But that's what I was going to say. The bigger issue with that is, outside of you aging out is what else can we see.

[Max Kellerman]

Right. Like in what was the basketball movie with Will Ferrell where they did the first alley oop ever? What was that called? What was that? Basketball. Anyway.

[Rich Paul]

Oh, remember?

[Max Kellerman]

And they did the first ever alley oop and people. And the ref was like, I don't know what. He wanted to blow the whistle because it was just too much. But so back then, when you saw a dunk, it was like. It was a spectacular thing. And they. And they were.

[Rich Paul]

And they.

[Max Kellerman]

And since then, it's too much. It's like they've done everything well, really.

[Rich Paul]

Zach lavine and Aaron Gordon.

[Max Kellerman]

Right.

[Rich Paul]

That. That. We should have closed it on that.

[Max Kellerman]

That. That was a high note.

[Rich Paul]

We're not going to get any better than that.

[Max Kellerman]

But that was Dom. That was the version. But the difference was. That was incredible. It was a version of Dominique and mj. Yeah, but that was if. If Gordon And Zach were LeBron and KD. Right. Like, it. It was. But it was good enough.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, but that was at the be. But the MJ and Dominique was at the beginning. And Max normally. And normally it's not necessarily the guys in the All Star game. That's actually in the dunk contest.

[Max Kellerman]

Kenny Skywalker.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah. Because the way it works, when Nate Robertson won, he wasn't an all star. But every now and then you do. He wasn't an all star, I don't think, when he won the dunk contest. Right. But every now and then you do get it. But never. But nevertheless, I Think helping people understand what the All Star weekend is for a player. So if I'm an All Star, let's just say I'm on the All Star team. I come in Thursday. If I don't have a game Thursday night, if I do have a game Thursday night and I fly in after my game, worst case scenario, Friday morning when you get in, your itinerary looks like this. It's not a situation where it's like I get into my room and I get to chill, relax, get me, you know, two scoops of French vanilla ice cream and some chocolate chip cookies. You're on the go because this is our biggest kind of a diet.

[Max Kellerman]

Do you have.

[Rich Paul]

Not me, I don't, I don't eat sweets like that.

[Max Kellerman]

I'm just saying two scoops of French vanilla ice cream.

[Rich Paul]

That's something that you would have.

[Max Kellerman]

I just gained five pounds.

[Rich Paul]

You said that. Well, hence you can't wear the clothes out your closet. Yeah.

[Max Kellerman]

Well, there you go.

[Rich Paul]

But the thing, the thing about it is you cannot relax. Right. You have to, you have media, you have practice.

[Max Kellerman]

This is what I'm saying. They're putting them to work. Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

You have, you have NBA Cares events. And then on top of that, if you are an All Star, if you are a signature athlete, you, you also have your brand partnerships because this is a big weekend. They're going to want some of your time as well. These guys don't really get to see their family like that. And so now if you're asking me to. And where the NBA did get smart, they just. Because it used to be we'll have people for the skills challenge, the three point contest and then the All Star game. Those were like all different people. Now it's smart on one end and then on the other end it's a little troubling because it's not enough players sometimes. Right. So, and you come up with these different things and that's where you do the father and son thing or you can do the brother thing or whatnot. And then, or the old heads and the younger guys. But, but like, so that's Thursday, Friday, Saturday if I'm in the dunk contest and then Sunday I have to play. So you know, it could be deemed a lot and got guys are just like, nah, you know, I, I, I rather not. But, but All Star weekend for players is a lot of work.

[Max Kellerman]

Right?

[Rich Paul]

It's a lot of work for.

[Max Kellerman]

Unless there's a million dollars, winner take all. Yeah. But then all of a sudden everyone. But here's the thing.

[Rich Paul]

That's just the game.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, right.

[Rich Paul]

That's what I'm saying.

[Max Kellerman]

They're being put to. That's what I mean. You don't just pop up on a TV show. It requires preparation and it's our biggest week.

[Rich Paul]

One of our is between the All Star weekend and it used to be free agency. Those are the two big, big moments in, in, outside of the trade deadline, in, in our seasons. Free agency, trade deadline, All Star.

[Host/Announcer]

Right.

[Max Kellerman]

What about the finals?

[Rich Paul]

Well, of course, that's the play. I'm just saying in terms of regular.

[Max Kellerman]

Sets that we have to build the playoffs. Yes. Okay. Yes, I got it. Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

Yes. So by.

[Max Kellerman]

By the way I hear it.

[Rich Paul]

So it's not as easy. It's not as easy as it looks.

[Host/Announcer]

This episode is brought to you by Firehouse Subs. Who just dropped a game changing sandwich? The French dip. Literally one of my favorite sandwiches slash subs. Roast beef, caramelized onions, melty cheese, little freshly toasted garlic butter roll and the warm savory au chou. I've been eating these forever, since I was living on the east coast in la. I think to me, this versus the cheesesteak, the French dip, no contest. Way better. And I think it's really because of the au jus. I don't know anybody who doesn't like au jus. An elite game day sub. Fun to order, by the way, if you want it delivered. Because they usually put the au jus in the special little container you can pour it on. Knock yourself out. The French dip here for a limited time. I wish it was longer. Only at Firehouse Subs. Limited time at participating Firehouse Subs restaurants while supplies last. This episode is brought to you by AMC. You do not want to miss Rise of the 49ers the limited series event premiering February 1st and 2nd exclusively on AMC and AMC. Executive produced by Tom Brady, the docu series charts the legendary rise of the San Francisco 49ers from underdogs to five time Super bowl champions in the 80s and 90s. It features interviews with Joe Montana, Jerry Rice and Ronnie Lott as well as never be seen archival footage. Rise of the 49ers premiering February 1st and 2nd. Visit amcplus.com to start your free trial now.

[Max Kellerman]

Little birdie told me there were some behind the scenes stories.

[Rich Paul]

Oh, no, they just wanted me. I mean, you wasn't. You was at Zufa.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

So you missed a dinner. You missed our party. I know.

[Max Kellerman]

I wanted to be there, but I couldn't.

[Rich Paul]

But it was a Good weekend. Like I told you before, on Friday, went to the Tech Summit, which was great. Friday night, Steve Ballmer and Brian Roberts from NBC put on a great event. You know, former President Obama, he spoke with a small group of people. I took Darius Garland with me there, and it was, you know, his owners.

[Max Kellerman]

How many small group of people?

[Rich Paul]

It was probably about 40 people in there. And then across the hall, Ballmer and Brian Roberts opened it. Opened it up where they invited all the team governors and different brands and different, you know, limited partners within the teams and all the teams. The food was great, Players came by, everyone from the NBC side of things, and obviously a lot of the NBA, Mark Tatum and everybody was there. So that was great. Got to see that. And then I went from there and it was a couple other events. Then Saturday morning, you know, we woke up, obviously you're on the road again. Hitting the road. We did the NBA Cares event with Baby Da Baby, which was great. Great production there. It was a full weekend. But we, Our, our Clutch Sports group party was insane.

[Max Kellerman]

Was it?

[Rich Paul]

It was, yeah. I wish I could have been there, but it was. It was a lot of fun.

[Max Kellerman]

I thought our fight was going to be on Friday, originally.

[Rich Paul]

I know, I. I know.

[Max Kellerman]

I'm like, okay, I'll just come back. But it was moved to Sunday, so.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah. And then Sunday, yesterday, after the party, I mean, the party ended at like 3 o' clock in the morning.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah. How much sleep you got last night?

[Rich Paul]

I got great sleep last night. But the night before, 3:00am I played nine. I played nine holes at 7:00am you're an addict. I played.

[Max Kellerman]

You're an addict.

[Rich Paul]

But then I had. And I had.

[Max Kellerman]

Golf. That is so. People get so addicted to it.

[Rich Paul]

It's a challenging thing. I mean, I'm trying to get really good for different reasons, not for the air. But listen, we had a New Balance event with Darius Garland and Clutch Athletics at Lafayette park with my man Cam Joyce's basketball team, which was great. And then we had a Q and A session with the young guys.

[Max Kellerman]

What was so great about the Clutch party? Let's go back to some details.

[Rich Paul]

Oh, I mean, every. First. First of all, we have a dinner first for the families. We have a dinner for the families and for the team. So a lot of the team executives come, the team owners come by, the unions sits.

[Max Kellerman]

So you tell me that to me that so far I don't hear a great party. I just hear some of the.

[Rich Paul]

No, that's the dinner.

[Max Kellerman]

I said, okay, the dinner.

[Rich Paul]

That's the dinner. And the dinner then kind of organically flows into a party.

[Max Kellerman]

Okay.

[Rich Paul]

When a fire marshal is at your party, that tells you what?

[Max Kellerman]

There you go. That's a detail. That's helpful.

[Rich Paul]

Okay. So the fire marshal. Fire marshal shows up, was there all night.

[Max Kellerman]

There was two doors, high school, the fire marshal.

[Rich Paul]

There were two entryways. Both entryways were pandemonium. And you couldn't even get down the street. So we did it at 4 room, which is next to Labo. So we had both spaces.

[Max Kellerman]

That's good. If you can get into a party, it's no good. You have to be not be able to even get in then, you know, it's good.

[Rich Paul]

I will say our team did an incredible job. First of all, all weekend.

[Max Kellerman]

They normally do.

[Rich Paul]

Our team did an incredible job all weekend, but particularly for that night, they did an incredible job diffusing things. The people were great, everyone got in.

[Max Kellerman]

And then when you say diffusing things.

[Rich Paul]

Like, well, you know what?

[Max Kellerman]

I stepped on my timbs. You know, like what kind of diffusion.

[Rich Paul]

Sometimes if you're in a line for. And people are saying you have to wait, right. For a long. You can either take the. You could take the approach of like, I don't wait in lines approach or. Or you could take the approach of, you know what? I'm confident I'm going to get in. It may take a little bit longer than I expected, but. And everyone got in. Everyone got in. We had a great time. And then DJ Mill, like I told you before, if you have an event, I mean, this guy was on the office rocker. He really was. I mean, he put on a show, he took people all around the world. We had the old school, we had the new school, we had, you know, everything, everything went down. Except for people didn't have their shoes off and they socks during the Tootsie Roll. If it would have got to that point, then we had to shut it all the way down. But it was good.

[Max Kellerman]

Did you get to talk to Obama at all?

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, of course we did.

[Max Kellerman]

What'd you talk about?

[Rich Paul]

Basketball. Of course. He and Darius actually had a longer conversation. He and Darius was talking about, you know, they're the basketball players, so. But it was good. It was good. It was a good, A really good weekend. The city of LA did a great job. I thought the NBA did a great job. And so now it's on the Phoenix. Look forward to Phoenix next year before.

[Max Kellerman]

We get into any other basketball. Cause there are a few more stories that probably good to touch on But I want to do a rant that I promised, or at least I promised it on Friday about the baseball labor thing, the Jeff Passen article.

[Rich Paul]

I like baseball, so go ahead.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah, yeah. So here's the issue.

[Rich Paul]

But I missed the article. I didn't see it.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah, Jeff Passen had a long article about Kyle Tucker, the Dodgers signing him, and Passen's excellent. And what it means for baseball's labor relations going forward, et cetera. The owners are mad. They're prepared to waste sacrifice a season, apparently, according to some, in order to get labor costs under control. Because, rich, this drives me crazy. And I've said it before on this show a couple of times. But I'll say it again, just as the premise to what I want to say, every salary cap argument that any owners in any sports have ever made do not actually have to do with competitive balance. It has to do with smaller market owners going to bigger market owners and saying, we can't do all of the following things against you Dodgers, right, who are rich and smart because you have more fans than us and therefore more money than us. We cannot both compete with you year in and year out and turn a profit year in and year out while our equity increases. Because these guys, a lot of them are pigs, let's face it. That's piggish. Not only do I want my equity equity to increase, not only do I want to be in this league with you, even though you're a major league city and I'm not really a major league city, but I understand why, like, you know, you can't just have a league of quote unquote, major league cities because it'd be 8, 10, 12 cities. And you want your league to be big, so you have to take some minor league cities and put them in with the major league cities. And they do need something to help them compete. Everyone understands that. But it's like our equity is increasing. Although baseball maybe not as fast as basketball and football, there are other reasons for that. And we want to compete and we want to turn a profit. So the big market owners go, don't look at us. We're not going to subs. Let's go get the money from the players. That's what a cap is. It controls labor costs. And that money gets redirected into the pockets of the small market owners. Okay, that I understand the issue in Major League Baseball right now is not that the Dodgers are so rich, it's that they're so rich and so smart. And so there are certain things you can do to give the smaller market owners who are bitching about the other teams having more fans, which is kind of sickening to me. Like, stop crying about it. But okay. And a lot of them are owned by very, very, you know, billionaires who are still have smaller, you know, payrolls that they need than they need to have. But okay. The issue in baseball is that while they control labor costs to start the careers of players before you can even get to arbitration, they keep the price down. Rookie contracts like they have in the NBA and the NFL essentially. Right. The issue is after that's over, the commodities. I know you don't like to talk about players that way, but that's what they are in a business sense, are mispriced going forward. And the reason they're mispriced going forward is not about a salary cap per year. It's about the fact that in order to entice players to sign, they have multi year contracts. And what the big markets can do is give this player a multi year contract where they know at the end of the contract it's not going to be a good deal for them. Right. But they're going to get the prime production from the player now and they'll kick the can down the road and either swallow some of that money or maybe trade it off their books while they eat some of the money. And inflation will kind of reduce that number for them in the future. That's really the issue in Major League Baseball. The contracts are too long, so the commodities are not priced well. So here is my solution. Rich. Okay, the first thing is you should limit the number of years a player can get in a deal. And the second thing is if your payroll is above a certain amount, you can't defer payments. Right. Which seems to be what the Dodgers are doing.

[Rich Paul]

I understand.

[Max Kellerman]

And I think that would address most of what ails baseball and most of what these crying small market owners are crying about. Limit the number of years so that even if you overpay a player and it turns out he wasn't worth it, it's right off your books. Charlie Finley, who was the owner of the Oakland a's in the 70s, who could see free agency coming. His suggestion was he fought it and fought it and when he saw it wasn't gonna stop it. He said everyone should be a free agent every year. Because he understood that what will happen is all the players will be priced accordingly. They'll be properly priced.

[Rich Paul]

Yes, because based upon your production that year, you're a free agent. I'm not paying you five years, then you give me two really good years.

[Max Kellerman]

And three years according to the market. Right. And all the other owners said, no, no, no, we can't do that. And now they wound up in these super long term deals. The reason I bring up this as.

[Rich Paul]

A solution that is very interesting.

[Max Kellerman]

My solution I think would work and I guarantee you it wouldn't be adopted by the small market owners because it really doesn't have much to do with competitive balance. In fact, they're just being greedy. They just want to keep labor costs down, that's all, and pocket the money.

[Rich Paul]

Hmm. Well, I mean, I totally get what you're saying, but from a baseball perspective, let me ask you because we had this conversation before about the Dodgers where we said, yes, they have the money, but they also have the brains. So it's not only the money, it's the brains. Because the people they bet on actually produce.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

When you talk about people not going to baseball games. Because I do watch a lot of regular season baseball games and the stadiums are empty during sometimes. Yeah. And I wonder, like, how are you, how are we even paying these.

[Max Kellerman]

Well, it's 162 games, so 81 home games during the regular season and you have a stadium with 50,000 plus people. You can't.

[Rich Paul]

50,000.

[Max Kellerman]

No, I understand. You're not going to put them in the seats.

[Rich Paul]

I understand that. But then I see scenarios where like, my guardians actually didn't have a huge salary commitment, huge payroll, but did pretty well.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah, they're smart. Guardians are run smartly. So I believe is Chernoff still the. There's a guy who ran radio WFAN in New York. I believe his son was the G GM in Cleveland. Could be wrong.

[Rich Paul]

I don't know, maybe someone check that.

[Max Kellerman]

Who's a GM in Cleveland right now?

[Rich Paul]

Maybe. But, but, but, but to your point not to spend too much more time on it, I do get this idea of like, well, you shouldn't be able to defer.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

But at the same time, if it's a mechanism that could be used for the.

[Max Kellerman]

What I'm saying is so you, what you do is if your payroll is over a certain amount, you can't defer money.

[Rich Paul]

Okay.

[Max Kellerman]

You can defer money if you're the guardians if it helps you.

[Rich Paul]

Got you.

[Max Kellerman]

But you can't defer money if you're. If you already have a certain threshold. Right. And so that helps the guardians compete. If they're serious about it, they will have to pay probably more per annum in the short run for players. But the Players will be properly priced because you can't do eight year contracts. You can do a three year contract, a four year contract, something like that. That's it. All right, that's my proposal.

[Rich Paul]

No, I mean, they're not going to listen to you, but they won't listen to me. But I do understand what you're saying.

[Max Kellerman]

And now Major League Baseball's behind two paywalls. I just read this where they're behind the paywall for not only ESPN but also for like also the baseball package. And you got to pay twice and then maybe cancel one of the subscriptions at a certain point. It's crazy.

[Rich Paul]

Why is it when a league has one of its most unbelievable years, it's always a labor issue?

[Max Kellerman]

Or in baseball's case.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, I mean, they, I mean that World Series I went to two games was incredible. It's like on the hive. It was great.

[Max Kellerman]

Right? So think about this. That's because. And the Dodgers won a classic World.

[Rich Paul]

Series, but the Blue Jays didn't have. What was their payroll like?

[Max Kellerman]

Not like the Dodgers. Right, but. And by the way, the Blue Jays have been mired in the AL east, which is very competitive because that region of the country is densely populated. And the Boston Red Sox have everyone from, you know, connect half of Connecticut all the way up through Maine. It's actually a huge market. And the Yankees are in the epicenter of like the known universe. Right. And so they have a huge market and, and they're outspending the other teams. And the Blue Jays finally get good enough and get over the top after they thought they might for years and didn't and get to the World Series but lose to a behemoth in the Dodgers. But you know, they could have won that Series too. Blue Jays could have won that series.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah. All right.

[Max Kellerman]

That's it. That's all. That's all I have to say about the, about the baseball. I could. So I could fix the All Star. Even though it's already been fixed. I can fix baseball's labors. What can I fix?

[Rich Paul]

Well, I don't know.

[Host/Announcer]

This episode is brought to you by Viori. Look, I'm not a big let's hype up workout clothes guy, but Vuori, I gotta say, total game changer. Been wearing a lot. If you see me power walking around Los Angeles, probably going to see me wearing some Vuori Sunday performance joggers that they have. It's made with four way performance stretch fabric, one of the most comfortable things you own. You will wear them everywhere, I promise. All you have to do is go to Vuori.com Simmons and you get 20% off your first purchase with Vuori. V U-O-R-I.com Simmons. Enjoy free shipping on all US orders over $75 plus free returns.

[Rich Paul]

Exclusions apply.

[Host/Announcer]

Visit the website for full terms and conditions.

[Rich Paul]

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[Host/Announcer]

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[Rich Paul]

Confidence, resilience and the tools they need for life's challenges and opportunities. Up until May 2026, they're running 100 free sessions for schools and community based organizations near you. Learn [e-mail] 100kk that's clinic with a.

[Max Kellerman]

K. Clinic kids is registered 501c3 nonprofit. You want to.

[Rich Paul]

You want to talk about Kevin Durant fixing boxing too?

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah, right, right.

[Rich Paul]

No, I don't want to talk about Kevin Durant. If you want to get into. I know what you want to get into. And we don't even know if that's true.

[Max Kellerman]

No, we don't know. Let me just say something. There's a story out there that I have not seen, seen compelling evidence to verify. Like people, oh, this is Kevin Durant's burner account. Why? Because someone claims that they were in a chat with Kevin Durant and they saw the same picked avatars. I don't know, but it doesn't sound like they have anything concrete. However, the question is, does it sound credible to people? And the answer that cuz Kevin Durant's had burner accounts, he's admitted he's had burner accounts. So this is an issue now where it doesn't take much to convince people that Kevin Durant has a burner and that he's talking shit about guys, right?

[Rich Paul]

I don't know that to be true, but what I do know is these guys have to always be on. They never get an opportunity to be themselves in terms of or what people want them to be. So I don't know. I mean I don't get into burner accounts or anything.

[Max Kellerman]

I'll just say this. If that is Kevin Durant's burner and I'm not saying it, man, he was going off on everyone. Everyone caught it. People were catching strays and also aimed at like, oh man, I mean everyone caught it.

[Rich Paul]

I literally did not see it.

[Max Kellerman]

You know what the truth is though? It doesn't matter if it's your best friend, your family, whatever, if you're being honest about your thoughts, everyone's gonna catch it, including you. Because no one's perfect. Right.

[Rich Paul]

Well, that's how my friend group is.

[Max Kellerman]

Right. But they'll say it to your face.

[Rich Paul]

Oh, you gonna catch it for sure. 100% right.

[Max Kellerman]

I'm gonna start a burner account. Rich Paul is the.

[Rich Paul]

Let me just say something. Two of my friends almost got into a fight over. I won't say it.

[Max Kellerman]

I want talk over a burner. Wait, one of your. Are you trying to tell me one of your friends.

[Rich Paul]

No, not over a burner. Over being very candid with each other. It's the craziest thing. Oh, man. Almost.

[Max Kellerman]

We're too old for it now, but this is the old Rakim line. Every now and then, they give my knuckle game a test. But I don't stress. I don't fess. I just get rid of the stress and then shake hands like a man. Because it's a family thing. Only the crew will understand. But Nowadays, when you're 40, 50 years old, you can't be getting into fights and stuff.

[Rich Paul]

Stuff. But when you're younger, it's just that. It's just. It's just. It's real. It's pure comedy. When you. When you have that friend group that's going to be very honest with one another, it is pure comedy. You know who else is like that? My aunts. They gonna tell you how they feel, especially on Facebook. I'm telling you, man.

[Max Kellerman]

But wait, hold on. Let's. When you say your friends. Are any of these friends in the NBA?

[Rich Paul]

Well, how many friend groups you gonna have with all these friends in the NBA? But, yeah, a few.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah, that almost got into the fight.

[Rich Paul]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Not at all.

[Max Kellerman]

Draymond and LeBron's got into. What do you say?

[Rich Paul]

No, no, no. Here you go again. You know, you like. You like a cheese it when it comes to that stuff. No, not that.

[Max Kellerman]

All right, listen, we. We have a little more time, actually, but I wanted to talk basketball. Maybe we do that next show. I want you to. I want some sleeper picks from you now, because I'm starting to watch college ball now. Super Bowl's over. We're past NBA All Star now.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, but it's a lot more excited left in the NBA.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah, for sure.

[Rich Paul]

Are you crazy?

[Max Kellerman]

No, but I mean, like. But now you. Of course. But that's gonna go through the tournament, right?

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, but the NBA post All Star is on now. When you look at the standings, when you look at.

[Max Kellerman]

Now, it gets interesting.

[Rich Paul]

Teams getting healthy. We can say what we want and you could say, do you still have OKC as your favorites to win the championship? You're taking the field, dude.

[Max Kellerman]

I might. I'm this close.

[Rich Paul]

I'm not asking you to be specific.

[Max Kellerman]

I'm saying, are you too young? Still think they're too young? But man, I like Detroit.

[Rich Paul]

You like Detroit?

[Max Kellerman]

I do.

[Rich Paul]

Okay, good. Yeah, they play tough.

[Max Kellerman]

They're tough.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, they play tough. I thought they was going to make us a. A surface level. Not surface level, but I thought they was going to make like a small addition, but maybe they felt like they had.

[Max Kellerman]

They didn't add a shooter at the deadline. He did. Detroit added a shooter. Didn't Detroit add a shooter? Yeah, her, Kevin. Her.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, no, I was. But no, I was thinking. I was thinking, like, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Max Kellerman]

A shooter who's going to play 35 minutes.

[Rich Paul]

Well, not only that, like, because the Detroit Pistons, no matter how much you shoot, they've always been a team to hang their hat on defense.

[Max Kellerman]

Yep. That's traditionally what it's been.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah. So where you can find a shooter that also on the other side is able to pretty much guard one through four.

[Max Kellerman]

I just also love the fact that it's mid range. Like, you know, like, I love a team that's going to do things differently than every. That's zagging when everyone's zigging, you know.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah. And they're able to put like. I mean, well, you're starting with your point guard who's six, eight. Yeah. So now you're able to. You're starting with size on the floor, which matters, as you know. But. Yeah. So you're taking the field, basically.

[Max Kellerman]

I am. I'm taking the field over. Okay.

[Rich Paul]

So that makes for a good rest of the season and a good post season because obviously in our. In your time, for sure, you pretty much knew who was going to win.

[Max Kellerman]

Them, no doubt the championship.

[Rich Paul]

And it's different now, which I also think is really good for the NBA.

[Max Kellerman]

You know, Rich, you're making a great point about this. We could do the College sleepers like on Wednesday. But you're making a great point. The NBA, which has had a lot of criticism this year and people have pointed, including me on this show, that the ratings are down and da da da and the All Star Game and blah, blah, blah, blah. And I've mentioned that Adam Silver has a real chance. He's been an excellent commissioner. But the challenges don't stop and you have to continue to address them. And it doesn't mean. Cause you've done it well in the past. You necessarily will in the future. But the All Star Game is getting positive reviews.

[Rich Paul]

Yes.

[Max Kellerman]

And if you look at the rest of this season, you're right. There is a lot to be excited about. OKC or the field. What about Wemby and the Spurs? It's possible that it's already their time. It's possible that it's already Detroit's time. Right. Meanwhile, you know, as if this, any of this burner stuff is true with kd. It makes you question Houston right now, but Houston has a lot of time.

[Rich Paul]

I spend time with your guy, Fred Van Fleet.

[Max Kellerman]

Oh, yeah? How's he doing?

[Rich Paul]

He's looking strong.

[Max Kellerman]

Is he coming back this season?

[Rich Paul]

I don't know the answer to that. You have to call Raphael Stone of the Houston Rockets. I did not know the answer to that.

[Max Kellerman]

What do you think? How would you handicap it?

[Rich Paul]

I don't know. And you know what? It was a positive weekend for us. We had six All Stars, which was insane. Jalen Johnson had his first All Star, first of many. It was great, man.

[Max Kellerman]

By the way, the Knicks are good. The Celtics are good. The Lakers.

[Rich Paul]

Wait a minute. The Celtics are two in the easy.

[Max Kellerman]

Right.

[Rich Paul]

We don't know if Tatum's coming back or not.

[Max Kellerman]

If Tatum comes back, this is what I'm saying.

[Rich Paul]

There's a lot of positive action in front of us.

[Max Kellerman]

You got me excited for the second half.

[Rich Paul]

And we can't be like the rest of the field with this negative energy towards the NBA. I will not stand for it.

[Max Kellerman]

You know, this happens in boxing a.

[Rich Paul]

Lot because we also have the real insight.

[Max Kellerman]

There is some. There are some leagues and some sports where cynicism usually is higher in that league or sport than it is in other leagues and sports. You don't see that in the NFL the same way that you do in NFL.

[Rich Paul]

No, I mean, it's run rapid through the NBA. But also we have the knowledge and we have the insights and we have the education and we have the facts.

[Max Kellerman]

Considering all the doom and gloom about ratings this year, you're right. It's shaping up to be a super interesting second half. And also, like in a. The season's too long in 82 games, but now you have. And it's, you know, truncated. The second half is not the same, is shorter than the first half. So now you have the stretch run. The stretch run where you don't know who's going to win the championship. You have a bunch of contenders to do it, emerging stars. You're right.

[Rich Paul]

Which is why I was so excited about the trade deadline, because I thought like 10 teams was probably like a move and a half away of really positioning themselves.

[Max Kellerman]

Right. A little quiet.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, it was, but you say it was quiet, but in terms of like actual transactions, I think it was the most in the history of the league.

[Max Kellerman]

It was 74. Not the seismic kind of stuff. Yeah, yeah, but you're right. The league nowadays comes. The role players are more important than they used to be because the gap between an All Star, not an All Pro, but an all star, not like first team all NBS, but an all star, and a 3 and D plus wing is narrow.

[Rich Paul]

But Max. No, see, I disagree. No, I don't disagree with what you just said, but I disagree with the fact that you said what the role players used to be. It's always been the role players. It was Craig Hodges, it was John Paxton, it was BJ Armstrong, it was.

[Max Kellerman]

You know, it was, they helped.

[Rich Paul]

No, no, it was Sam Cassell. Sam.

[Max Kellerman]

But Sam Cassell wasn't a role player.

[Rich Paul]

He was.

[Max Kellerman]

No, no, no. Sam Cassette was not a role player.

[Rich Paul]

So who was a role player? Kenny Smith.

[Max Kellerman]

No, those two were the backcourt, like. No, but Sam Cassette, Kenny Smith, I get it, because he was a rookie, that first one, right, so. But that was 48 minutes of point guard.

[Rich Paul]

I'm just saying they were, they were, they were not the premier guys. I would tell you that they leaned on Elijah Want. But, but, but, you know, in other cases, I mean, like we talked about. Listen, JR's third quarter, right?

[Max Kellerman]

The beginning of that third quarter, you're arguing something else. There are role players. Of course, of course. They've always been important. It's a team sport. But what I'm saying is the gap between a real All Star, back in.

[Rich Paul]

The day, Derek Fisher's another one, and.

[Max Kellerman]

A role player was wide. And nowadays.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, no issue.

[Max Kellerman]

Right.

[Rich Paul]

I said I agree with you on that.

[Max Kellerman]

I always think of a guy like Mikhail Bridges, if he never leaves, if he's just in Phoenix doing what he's doing, you're going, He's a nice 3 and D plus swing, right? He can defend and he can shoot the three and he can do a little more than that. But then he goes to Brooklyn and you're like, oh, he can do a lot more than that. Actually, he's not quite an All Star, but the gap between him and an All Star is not as great as it once was between that kind of role player and an All Star.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, but, but, but again, when you go to Villanova, you're going to Learn how to play.

[Max Kellerman]

How to play?

[Rich Paul]

Yeah. Like when you go to Connecticut, you're going to learn how to play. When you go to Duke, you're going to learn how to play. So being able to embrace a role, because I didn't pick where I was drafted. I was drafted here. So on this team, they're asking me to play this role when I go somewhere else. Yes, I can do more. And this team actually needs me to do more. So I am doing more now.

[Max Kellerman]

But what I mean, because that gap has shrunk between the role player and the All Star. Oh, absolutely. Now your point about the role players being so important is heightened. And that's why at a deadline, even if there weren't these seismic shifts, those role player moves are more important than ever.

[Rich Paul]

Don't sleep on Denver.

[Max Kellerman]

No question.

[Rich Paul]

This is very misleading because Denver, by the way, AG gets injured. Braun got injured, so those guys weren't playing. But then you had the rise of Peyton Watson.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

And so now he developed that confidence. With Joker out the. Keeping the team afloat. Jamal Murray's first, first first All Star.

[Max Kellerman]

But there's a great example of if Jokic and Murray and Gordon are healthy. Plus now when you. If you have Braun and you have. Now you have.

[Rich Paul]

They added Cam Johnson.

[Max Kellerman]

Cam Johnson, Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

So now you look at his life. Yeah. You look at it like, oh, shit, like Denver's.

[Max Kellerman]

I would not be surprised at all if Denver ran the table.

[Rich Paul]

This is what I'm thinking. Guess why.

[Max Kellerman]

So, so, so before name six different.

[Rich Paul]

Seven different teams.

[Max Kellerman]

Okay. Before we wrap up today, who are the teams that you would say, yeah, they could win the champ. Because usually in the NBA you can't even say, yeah, they could win the championship. There's two, maybe three teams. Let's do it.

[Rich Paul]

Denver.

[Max Kellerman]

Yes, they could.

[Rich Paul]

San Antonio.

[Max Kellerman]

Yes.

[Rich Paul]

Houston.

[Max Kellerman]

Yes. Houston needs things to go right. But I wouldn't say no to Houston.

[Rich Paul]

Okc.

[Max Kellerman]

Yes.

[Rich Paul]

Okay, now let's go to the East. Detroit.

[Max Kellerman]

Yes.

[Rich Paul]

New York. Boston.

[Max Kellerman]

Maybe if Tatum were healthy.

[Rich Paul]

Cleveland.

[Max Kellerman]

Yes. I'd say the East. Detroit, and the other three, you'd have. Someone on the west would have to be hurt and they would have to be healthy. But yes. Okay, let's say eight. Yes.

[Rich Paul]

Cause it's not going to be six or seven teams that can win.

[Max Kellerman]

I don't see it. Realistically, honestly. Okay, let me do that again. Realistically, I don't see the Knicks or the Celtics this year winning the whole thing. I don't see it. Okay. I don't see the Rockets either, but I Could see if. If the Rockets are firing on all cylinders, they could do it.

[Rich Paul]

So you say there's four teams that you feel can actually win.

[Max Kellerman]

Are we missing anybody?

[Rich Paul]

I was going through it. Go ahead.

[Max Kellerman]

Keep going on the West. Are we done with the west already?

[Rich Paul]

I think so. Yeah.

[Max Kellerman]

Not the Lakers.

[Rich Paul]

I mean, if you want to put them as your. As your dark horse.

[Max Kellerman]

Not the Clippers.

[Rich Paul]

Well, that. That would be unfair. I mean, it's just. They're trying to. Yeah, they traded it big. They're trying to figure out. So I don't think they. Yeah, but just they're four in the West. You think there's. You think there's four and one in the east and then solid teams that you think could actually be okay.

[Max Kellerman]

Okay, now let's really do it. I think there are three in the west and one in the East.

[Rich Paul]

That is the San Antonio.

[Max Kellerman]

It's okc, San Antonio, Denver and Detroit. I think those were the top tier. Now you get to the next tier, where you go. Yes, if everything goes right, Houston, New York, Boston, Cleveland. So you got eight teams. Yeah, I think you're right about that. Are we missing anyone?

[Rich Paul]

No. I mean, look, anybody can win Minnesota. Well, they have the ant man. I mean.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

It's not impossible. No, look, it's. We've seen it. I want to see this year some sort of case where. Remember when the Nuggets beat the SuperSonics and Mutombo held the ball? It was like the best out of five series did. And they beat Seattle and Mutombo was on the ground like, we need that back in the NBA, whether it's in the first round or the third round. Like, I want to see that.

[Max Kellerman]

But there's Alonzo Mourning, Patrick Ewing, matchups in the East.

[Rich Paul]

I am excited about the. The. The second half of the season. All right.

[Max Kellerman]

You know, you got me juiced about it.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, good.

[Max Kellerman]

All right, good.

[Rich Paul]

So we'll talk Wednesday. We'll talk college. Because I know you don't watch college. I have to educate you.

[Max Kellerman]

You do, but I'm starting to now. Now I'm starting to see the guys. Because, you know, at post Super Bowl, I start watching college.

[Rich Paul]

You realize it's a really good draft, right?

[Max Kellerman]

Of course.

[Rich Paul]

But not just at the top.

[Max Kellerman]

No, that's what I want, to pick your brain. I want to see who you're looking at that are sweepers.

[Rich Paul]

Here's the thing. It's just as important to get 17 to 30. Right.

[Max Kellerman]

Right.

[Rich Paul]

As it is three to eight.

[Max Kellerman]

I would say it's almost as important. Not just as important. No, I'm telling you, just as important.

[Rich Paul]

Yes.

[Max Kellerman]

All right. You're going to have to explain this. On Wednesday's show. We're getting the Rich Paul sleeper picks for the draft, and I want to hear about.

[Rich Paul]

Well. Well. Yeah. Okay. G. Give you these names and we'll go.

[Max Kellerman]

Okay.

[Rich Paul]

Van Fleet Green, Joli Jokic. For the sake of this right now, second round. Yeah. Watson. I mean, you've had some Jaylen Johnson. Maxi.

[Max Kellerman]

Yep.

[Rich Paul]

Okay. I'm just. I'm just. I'm just.

[Max Kellerman]

It does happen.

[Rich Paul]

I'm just telling you.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah, it does happen. I mean, if I gave you the three through eights.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, but you're.

[Max Kellerman]

You know, I can give you a deeper list, but yes, I'm saying the three through eights.

[Rich Paul]

Okay, give me the three through eights. I can give you the three through eights. That did not do anything.

[Max Kellerman]

We compared three through eights to 17 through 30s. We'd get more good three through 8s.

[Rich Paul]

No, you won't.

[Max Kellerman]

Even though 17 through 30 is a larger pool of players, what I would say, 17 through 30 is 13 players, and three through eight is five players, six players, and 14.

[Rich Paul]

Whatever you want to call it. Five to 12, whatever you want to call it. What I would say to you is, yes, in. In terms of talent, but in terms of impact, different dynamic.

[Max Kellerman]

All right. We're going to get Josh Hart. Huh?

[Rich Paul]

Josh Hart.

[Max Kellerman]

Josh Hart. Dude. Yep.

[Rich Paul]

I'm just telling you, by the way.

[Max Kellerman]

The Lakers for a while did a very good job. Great job plucking Kyle Kuzma at the end of the first round and all that.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah. Caruso.

[Max Kellerman]

Caruso is another one.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Max Kellerman]

All right.

[Rich Paul]

This is what I'm telling you is extreme.

[Max Kellerman]

Wednesday's game over. We get into all of it, and I'm gonna pick your brain on who you should be watching in college.

[Rich Paul]

I may do a solo, put you in the stands.

[Max Kellerman]

Max, you gonna bring out the whiteboard? I get paid the same either way, Rich. I can.

[Rich Paul]

Yeah. I gotta check the contract. I think you could pay a little bit more. No, no, I'm joking. No shabbling the whiteboard out, huh? Whiteboard.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah, maybe. Let's do a whiteboard. Like they. Like a draft room. Why not?

[Rich Paul]

What we'll do is let's. We'll go over the other drafts.

[Max Kellerman]

Yeah.

[Rich Paul]

And like the previous drafts.

[Max Kellerman]

Okay.

[Rich Paul]

That could be pretty good. And, like, just take a draft and not for.

[Max Kellerman]

So what you're trying. You're trying to extract some lesson from the previous draft.

[Rich Paul]

Well, we just want to give viewers a little. A little insight, that's all. Yeah. Yeah.

[Max Kellerman]

Okay.

[Rich Paul]

Okay. All right, cool.

[Max Kellerman]

Game over with Max Kellerman and Rich Paul.

[Rich Paul]

Game [e-mail].

[Max Kellerman]

Should I say please subscribe?

[Rich Paul]

Yeah, for once in your life.

[Max Kellerman]

Subscribe.

[Rich Paul]

You know, please subscribe.

[Max Kellerman]

You know, it's good for you guys.

[Rich Paul]

This guy's a joke. Yeah. Okay. See you Wednesday, Sa.