C (2:00)

Yeah.

B (2:01)

Because that way you and your friend get to watch the game and the kids occupy themselves. Right. So the focus is on the game and everything's good. So that's the plan.

C (2:08)

Yeah. Yeah. I haven't decided. Part of me wants to go because I'm so close.

B (2:15)

Yeah, it's hop, skip and a jump.

C (2:17)

But that always, you know, when you plan something and it sounds Good. In the planning until you follow through with the plan. And you'd be like, damn, why did I even do this?

B (2:26)

This was expensive and it took a lot of time. And the weekend's over and I can't even. I gotta go back to it.

C (2:32)

Yeah. The. The. The traffic and the airport and, you know, so.

B (2:38)

So swing through. If you don't, you know, I have. It's going to be chill.

C (2:41)

Do you have a simulator?

B (2:42)

No.

C (2:43)

Golf simulator?

B (2:43)

No. You. Oh, I see. You're going to LeBron's for the Super Bowl.

C (2:46)

Yeah. No, no, no, no. I was just asking just in case.

B (2:49)

Golf simulator.

C (2:49)

Get a little halftime, a little nine.

B (2:52)

I've swung a golf. I've actually hit an actual golf ball one time in my life. A friend of mine took me out to the range just to hit off the tee. And that was it in my life.

C (3:02)

Good. So when we go and do our.

B (3:05)

Yeah, we'll take a lesson.

C (3:06)

Adventures of Rich and Max. We'll go take a lesson. That'd be good.

B (3:10)

With Palm Springs action.

C (3:11)

Palm Springs. Yeah, that'd be good. Content. Yeah, Perfect. I am excited about the Super Bowl. I will say.

B (3:17)

Yeah. I mean, I'm excited every year about the Super Bowl.

C (3:21)

Yeah. I'm getting. As it's getting closer, I'm like, well.

B (3:24)

You'Re coming off the deadline. You haven't had time to really focus on the super bowl because deadline ended yesterday. So you were slammed for a couple weeks right there.

C (3:32)

You know what's interesting about the deadline? I was talking about this. This morning, me and KCP was talking, and he was like. He was explaining to me the locker room, and he was like, man, I just remember my first free agency and how I was when I was a young player, and so on and so forth. And I said, you know what? I said, it don't matter how long you've been in the league. These times, deadline, free agency is almost like you're trying to figure out a way to soften the blow. Right. And as an agent, you're trying to get in front of things and help your client kind of have some type of calm. But at the end of the day, it doesn't matter because it's still gonna be some sort of impact.

B (4:25)

Gotta pick up and leave.

C (4:26)

I think people have to really understand, man. Like, and I know people say, oh, it don't matter. They get in trade, they make a lot of money. But there's a human aspect to this. The kids, the wives. The wives are the MVPs, because guess what? You get to get up and go. The plane is sent to you. The team sends the plane. The plane is sent to you. You go in, the wives stay back and the kids are still in school.

B (4:55)

Pack up bag. Everything's. Gotta supervise everything. You gotta deal with all the paperwork at school.

C (5:01)

And kids got friends.

B (5:03)

Yeah, terrible.

C (5:04)

You know, everyone's. So as much as it's. It is a luxury to play in the NBA and obviously you're making a ton of money and things like that, but around these type of times, it's difficult. And for me, man, just the last two days, you're on the phone with a team and a team is calling and a player is calling, and a player's parent may be calling, like everyone's call.

B (5:26)

You don't have Jerry Maguire all of a sudden.

C (5:28)

You don't have enough phone lines.

B (5:30)

Listen, we have. Oh, wait a minute. Yeah. We haven't been on the show since AD Got traded. Oh, we got something to talk about.

C (5:38)

No, we haven't. No.

B (5:38)

Let's do this.

C (5:39)

Let's do it.

B (5:51)

All right. Trade deadline's over. Before we get to the table, let's start with the deadline. What's your. What do you think? What do you think just happened in the NBA? Yeah.

C (6:04)

I think for most people that it was probably disappointing for most. From my point of view, the way I look at it, I felt like teams were really repositioning themselves to be in a better position in the summer. You had some teams that decided to get aggressive, and then you had some teams that, in this case, you're trying to either accumulate draft capital or you're trying to shed salary, who got aggressive? I would say the most aggressive one outside of the. Because everyone wants to go by big names, but I'm looking at it a little bit different.

B (6:49)

So Harden and Garland, right?

C (6:51)

Yeah. Hard and Garland. Obviously, AD Is a big name. Washington. Yeah. But Washington was aggressive in a different way. If you look underneath the hood of what they're doing, or at least what I think they're trying to do, it's pretty interesting. It's very interesting.

B (7:10)

I don't know what. Like, this is the thing about Washington, when I see what they're doing, it's like, wait a minute, is what's happening here that they're going for undervalued assets? AD should not be as easy as he was to acquire in a trade, given his talent. And Trey Young, also, that was. Didn't cost them much. So is it as simple as. Hey, look, if the commodity drops this low, you gotta buy. You gotta buy low. Are they actually in the plans for the. It's like hard to say what they're up to.

C (7:40)

See, all trades aren't created equal to max. And I think that we've been conditioned. I say we, as the fan base of the league has been conditioned to think big name, lot of picks.

B (7:53)

Right.

C (7:53)

And that's what it. Or big name traded for big name. That's what people visualize when they think trade. That's not always how it works. At the same time, when you look at what Washington has done, it's not so much as about this trade deadline. I think you have to go all the way back. And let's go to the start of the hire. Will Dawkins, Michael Winger. Right. That's a great start. Then when you think about the ability to bring in players, you know, get those players out, accumulating assets, keeping your picks, having your picks. Then when you think about. Remember I always tell you about timeline. Right, right. In order to win, I think in today's league and tomorrow's league, it's have to gonna be a. It's gonna have to be a balanced attack. When I say balanced attack, I'm talking about from an age perspective. So you have young guys. When you look at the guys that they drafted. Right. George Carrington, Riley Koulibaly, Sar. Right. And then now you add those two names in. Trey and Ad.

B (9:09)

Key veterans who are still good. Yeah.

C (9:11)

So now anytime you win a championship, everyone focuses on the names, but you have to focus on the others. And when you look at what OKC was able to do last year, the others stepped up in a major way every time they were asked, somebody had a big game. And the thing about. And it's not being disrespectful to them. This is just a terminology. But the thing about those guys, that's not considered the star guys, when those guys are young enough to play at a pace and a speed and to have durability and then they have a high enough character to understand that they are pros and they're coming into this night in and night out and willing to be coached and willing to embrace a role. And on top of that, they're performing.

B (10:08)

Put that you think Washington has all that right now?

C (10:10)

Well, I think they're trending in that direction.

B (10:14)

So you're saying that trade deadline, the big picture, is a lot of repositioning for the summer. Not about the deadline so much as the off season. And in terms of Washington, because, I mean, I brought up which is the most aggressive. What are you saying? That it's just a healthy franchise heading in the right direction. Absolutely. You see the signs?

C (10:32)

Yeah. Because it's checking. You got to check all the boxes. It starts at the top. Taylor owners, Zach Lee owners, You're not going to find two better people than that. And I'm going to tell you why. Because if when you look at ownership, you want them to be able to do one thing for you, be willing to pay the tax. Once we put something on the floor.

B (10:53)

This leads right into what I want.

C (10:54)

To talk about that is taxable. Right. So now Dan Gilbert did it. Joe Lacob did this.

B (11:00)

Right.

C (11:00)

You know, the Celtics did it. Now, some teams were able to not have a big tax bill and still win. But I'm saying when you're willing to do this, it just, it just gives you so much.

B (11:10)

Although now, nowadays, this was actually something I want to bring up, my big takeaway from the draft. And I know everyone knows this, but I haven't heard someone say it publicly, like in a broadcast. The NBA is a hard cap league.

C (11:26)

It's a hard cap, very big league now. Very much, yes.

B (11:28)

And the NFL is actually a soft cap NFL. You can renegotiate things, whatever. It was always seen as the NFL as the hard cap league. And there's maneuverability because the NBA has a softer cap. NBA has a de facto hard cap now because of the aprons and all that stuff. And that's why the hardened Garland move made some sense for both teams. But to me, a lot of that is, when you look around the league, it's almost like playing Tetris or something. The pieces have to fit exactly right. So if the salary fits and based on the rules, what apron you're on, you could make the deal. Okay. But it limits it to like one or two trade partners usually. So Garland and Harden, it's like, well, this fits and it kind of addresses sort of both of what we need. So. So it happens. But that's a cap issue.

C (12:16)

And there was no guarantee they was going to be able to keep. Keep Darius anyway down the road. So. Yes, but, but there's a. Yeah, we're definitely. There's definitely a hard cap with, with no flexibility. Pretty much.

B (12:30)

That's what I'm saying. Like, if you sell, you can restructure stuff.

C (12:33)

That's a, that's, that's some flexibility they gotta do.

B (12:36)

I, I think it's actually hurting the NBA. They have to figure out a way. I understand that the NBA, under the guise of competitive balance, really wants the players to help fund the Small market owners. I get that. That's where any kind of salary restriction is always, you know, small market owners telling big market owners, not fair. You're in a big market, you make more money than me. And big market owners saying, I ain't giving you all the money. Let's go get it from the players. Right. But within that system, you need to figure out a way, if you're the NBA, for more maneuverability like the NFL has, you got to figure out a way so trades can make a little more sense and they can happen. It's more fluid.

C (13:18)

I hope so. And. But also, look, I think some other team, Boston gal. Boston got better.

B (13:23)

Yeah.

C (13:24)

Boston got better.

B (13:24)

Yeah. They got a big shooting. Yeah.

C (13:27)

And you still don't know what's going to happen. Atlanta.

B (13:30)

And they got a guy coming back who's going to take the minutes of the guy that went out for the guy who can. The big. Who can shoot anyway. So. Yeah.

C (13:36)

And when you think about it, look, this second half of the season for a lot of teams, they're evaluating talent, right? Let's see. Let's get a closer look. Especially if I don't have to commit to anything right away. Let's get a closer look. I don't have an extended years, extended years out on a contract. I could just get a closer look and then I can make a decision. Right, Right. So I think that's, that's. It's. I'll tell you this, man. I talk to a lot of teams, I talk to a lot of GMs, it's a lot of smart guys.

B (14:15)

And owners are fewer suckers around the league than there used to be.

C (14:18)

And owners are just starting to be a lot more in tune and patient and also willing. When you have a willing owner, it's just a lot you can do. Right. It's a lot you can do. And I think that fans want the short term right now, especially in big markets. We gotta win right now. We have to win right now. When you take on that mentality, that's what causes you to make very impulsive decisions.

B (14:45)

They did it with the Knicks for so many years. New coach, new regime. Oh, we gotta make a splash. And they would lock themselves into a position where it turns out that they were really bad. But even had it worked out, they weren't gonna do better than a playoff series at best. That was their ceiling. And they would do it. Cause they wanted the fans to come.

C (15:01)

To the most dangerous thing you can. You know, to kind of wrap this thing up is to the most Dangerous thing you can do is lean into a name. Right? That name game is a troubling game.

B (15:13)

And by the way, it happened in reverse with Washington, I feel like. Because once a guy gets traded a bunch, and once, if he's hurt. Whatever, whatever. There's a sense that. Look, okay, the Mavs, no, they're not all on the same timeline. AD makes 50 million, whatever it is, he's been hurt. He's been. The shine is off a little bit in terms of the way he's thought about because of the trades and the injury.

C (15:36)

Foolishly, but.

B (15:37)

Right. My point is that you move AD you're hoping that whatever you get back one day in the future can be half as good as AD Is right now, because that would be a tremendous player. That's my point. But that's the name game in reverse, where the name no longer resonates to the level it should in people's minds, and then it becomes undervalued. I would have loved to have seen the Mavs stay together. Because Cooper Flag. Cooper Flag is a stud. And if he gets better next year, and it seems like he will, he has a high iq, he's athletic, he'll.

C (16:17)

Get better every year.

B (16:18)

He could do everything.

C (16:18)

Yeah, he'll get better every year.

B (16:19)

You mean to tell me, Cooper Flag, in his second year, if you got Kyrie and AD can't chip up, he absolutely could. You may have just sacrificed a chip or two, because it's like. Well, it doesn't add up, the money, the whatever. You have AD And Kyrie, if you believe that they will be healthy again, and even 75% of what they were given, how good Cooper Flagg is, keep them together. Keep them together.

C (16:44)

And on the flip side of that, when you look at Washington, and I keep going back to this, and the worst thing a player can do is put their ego in front of them, right? In situations like this, because it's like, oh, I got. You know, I gotta. I try to. I try to help my guys not do that. Be optimistic. Right? Let's look at this. Let's take a deeper look. Medical, you know, strength and your performance. Team, family. Right? Those three things outside of the play are extremely important. And I can tell you firsthand. And I don't know what's gonna happen this summer. I'm just talking, but I can tell you firsthand, those are three things that are tier one.

B (17:36)

This is Podcast Paul, everybody. This is not Rich Paul, CEO of Clutch. It's Podcast Paul talking. Just so no one takes this.

C (17:43)

This is all the above, but those are tears.

B (17:46)

I'm trying to help you, brother.

C (17:47)

I know, but for this situation, I'm not. This. Those are Tier 1 with the Washington Wizards. I know that for a fact. Ownership another tier one, Right. So you have four tier one things that they can actually control.

B (18:01)

So it's a franchise heading in the.

C (18:03)

Right place they can actually control. Now, obviously, if you're making a draft pick, if you're making trade deadline moves, free agency moves, what you hope for is for those things to come to fruition. And you need a little luck on that side and you need a lot of different things to come into play. But if it does, now you're looking at it.

B (18:25)

Let me give you an example, because this is something else. I want to talk about Steph Curry. Steph Curry is riding into the sunset of his career and he's still falling out.

C (18:36)

Max, just want you to, before you say anything, don't get crazy because this my golf buddy.

B (18:42)

No, I'm saying, I'm just letting you know I can't let that affect what I say. I say what I think. That's all. This is all I got.

C (18:49)

I'm afraid of what you. If you say what you think, then they might shut us down.

B (18:54)

Steph Curry is riding into the sunset of his career and he's still balling out of control. Okay. And the warriors are squandering the end of his career. And I'm not even really blaming them. Rich, please. I'm not blaming them. But the fact is it so. So like, let's. I just want to like how this all works. You're talking about the health of the Wizards. Would you say the warriors are a healthy franchise?

C (19:18)

Hell yeah.

B (19:18)

Right. But this is how difficult it is. This is how luck also plays into it. You have. Things have to break your way. Even if you are a good franchise, even if you have a player like Steph, a first ballot, hall of Fame, first tier, all time player. One of the reasons that the warriors were able to put together a dynasty and keep it together for a while was Steph got hurt early in his career. So they signed him to a below market deal.

C (19:43)

Well, it helped them. But not only that, that's not. That's not.

B (19:46)

Did it help them or not?

C (19:47)

Of course, but that's not totally true. Because in that class back in those days, right, people didn't push and push and push. You know, in that time, if this guy signed this deal and it's like, okay, well, you didn't reset the season. Demar got 41 yeah. Steph got 48. Ty Lawson got 48. Jeru Holiday got 41. Or maybe Demar got 48 too. But all those guys were there because. I remember that because I also had Johnny Flynn. They were all drafted in that draft. And back in those days, that was the actual number.

B (20:24)

Rich. Yes. Yes, I understand what you're saying.

C (20:26)

Yeah.

B (20:26)

Steph, had he not had the ankle, would have had a much bigger deal, making it more difficult for the warriors.

C (20:33)

Maybe by.

B (20:34)

Okay, okay, Right. That's the first.

C (20:35)

Because the max was only like. I think the max back then was 80 million. He 48. He got half 48.

B (20:42)

Yeah, but he's. He's a. He's a player more than the max.

C (20:46)

But that's not the only thing that helped.

B (20:47)

I understand. Well, I'm really.

C (20:48)

No, but just so. But because I want to make sure you have.

B (20:51)

Have the.

C (20:52)

The clarity on it. What really helped was, remember, we had.

B (20:56)

That spike in the. In the. In the salary cap.

C (20:59)

Yes.

B (21:00)

Because, yes, I had a 30% increase.

C (21:02)

But what I'm saying, that's what really.

B (21:03)

But you could also call that, like, fortuitously.

C (21:06)

You got to be fortuitous to be successful. Yes.

B (21:08)

This is my point. Fortunately for the warriors, they get an under market deal, even by that market on Steph, plus the inflation of the cap, all that stuff. And so they were able to have it. And then they created a culture where. And Steph created an atmosphere along with Draymond, in terms of the way that they played. And obviously Clay and Steve Kerr, that Kevin Durant's like, I wanna go there. And okay. And the rest is history. Then they were in a very fortunate situation again because of another step injury. And it was reminiscent of the spurs when they had David Robinson, because Robinson gets hurt and they get the number one pick and they get Tim Duncan. But so the warriors, who are. Well, run all the things you're saying, they check all the boxes, Tier one plus, plus. Right. And they've already gotten lucky with a step injury in the past that helped them. It didn't cause it, but it helped them keep a dynasty together and grow it. They get lucky again with a stiff injury, in a sense, and they get to pick up high in the draft and they whiff on Wiseman, and that's why they're in this position. You can't get anything.

C (22:12)

See Max.

B (22:13)

How did they not whiff on Wiseman?

C (22:14)

You can't say things like that.

B (22:16)

Why?

C (22:16)

Because it's obviously true. See, people get. This is what I don't understand. How can you look at a draft and then say that something whiffed. The draft don't guarantee you anything. The draft is potential. You are hoping that this player and its potential is able to reach its highest point. Sometimes in the draft that doesn't happen, just doesn't exist.

B (22:44)

You're saying in the draft.

C (22:45)

No, it exists because obviously we see these players come to fruition. What I'm saying is if the draft.

B (22:51)

No, I'm saying in the Wiseman draft.

C (22:53)

In that draft, the draft order gave you X. You had to make a decision and your decision was why.

B (23:00)

Which is understandable given Wiseman is a prospect.

C (23:02)

Right. So if I'm wedged between and I have, I already have these things plugged in. What we need most is this. Yeah, right. And so we plug and play. If that player turns into Tim Duncan, you talk about three more rings.

B (23:19)

This is, by the way, I'm not saying bad Warriors. I'm pointing out how difficult it is. Even when you have a great organization, even when the, when the chips fall your way, when everything goes, it can still not work out. And the end of Steph Curry's career, it doesn't look like he's going to win another championship on the warriors at this moment.

C (23:37)

That's not how he might, but it.

B (23:38)

Doesn'T look like it.

C (23:38)

But I mean, the man got four rings. But that's not how you started the.

B (23:42)

End of his career.

C (23:43)

Is that a team?

B (23:44)

No, we're good.

C (23:45)

Is that not how you started. That's not how you started the conversation off. Listen, if you a player and you get an opportunity to play for an organization like the Golden State warriors, you're blessed. Now I can tell you that firsthand. I can tell you that firsthand. That's a first class organization through and through.

B (24:08)

I'm simply pointing out how difficult. Even if everything you're saying about the Wizards is true. Tier one, tier one, Tier one, Tier one. And they have some breaks go their way, it's still hard for things to turn out right. Even like right now, the warriors, you would think a couple years ago if you said, how's the end of Steph's career gonna look? You're like, man, they're set up. They got Wiseman and Kaminga and they got all this talent still on the team and Steph's skills will translate later into his career and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And still he finds himself asked out at the trade deadline.

C (24:40)

Things happen, man, you have to listen.

B (24:42)

So I'm think so. Yet last year we watched game seven together. Pacers Thunder.

C (24:48)

Yes, we did. In New York. We was in New York.

B (24:51)

We were in New York. And it was. Was it tied at half right? Like when Halliburton got hurt, it was within like a one possession game. And then the best player on the Pacers, who had some bad games, but some dudes give you the sense that they will ball when you need them. Halliburton gives me that feeling. I'm not always right about that feeling. I thought C.J. stroud would. I was wrong.

C (25:10)

But Halliburton, well, he didn't just give you that feeling. He showed you.

B (25:13)

He also showed. And I don't know that the Thunder, I think they probably do. I don't know that they win game seven if Halliburton doesn't get hurt. So think of how good the Pacers are, Rich. The year before they lose, they beat the Knicks, but that's only because of Knicks injuries. Otherwise they lose that series. The year after they rematch with the Knicks. Now the Knicks are healthy. The Pacers are just better because they improved. And they get to the Finals, they lose a game seven maybe because of an injury to their best player. And now they're no good because they don't have their best player for this year. So they're going to have a draft pick. The Pacers are in the position like the spurs were in, like the warriors were in. Right. But there's no. And this is a draft. You want that to be the case given the level of talent in this draft. And there's still no. Even if the organization's run well, everything's going your way, there's still no guarantee. There's still no guarantee that it works out.

C (26:04)

But what you're saying is. Exactly what I'm saying. There may not be a guarantee, but there may be more of an opportunity within the draft for you to actually hit it. Right. Because, you know, these injuries and things like that, that's just a part of sports. Remember Isaiah had the ankle?

B (26:24)

Yeah, for sure.

C (26:25)

Right. Kaleb and Kyrie both go down. I've been a part of different situations where we've seen it over and over and over again. Things happen. You know, KD went down.

B (26:38)

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C (28:06)

Sure.

E (28:06)

It is a broken system. And what I think this whole portal thing has done hasn't taught people how to have resilience and resolve anything that's easy. They just give up. So failure is good. Sometimes failure brings about an internal drive. And I don't think our kids know how to fail today. They really don't know how to struggle. You know, we the parents have bailed them out of everything. If something gets hard, we the parents say, okay, baby, I got you, I got you. Our era, I guess I'm a boomer. I guess sometimes you just gotta figure the out. You just gotta figure it out.

C (28:45)

Look, I think Coach Cooley is absolutely right and I've said this and I'll continue to say it, and he's a college coach, but he's getting not the total brunt of it. It's like the midway point or maybe on the it's now in the red zone. But it starts with our youth. Our youth system is broken. I don't care what anybody says, it's broken and it's getting worse, right? Cause like he's saying nowadays a kid is trying to manipulate every situation they're in. Failing failure is an experience. It's actually how you learn, Right? So to fail at something and then to identify a reason of why you failed in that manner and then to correct those things and come back and then excel, build character is how you want to build is how you want to grow, how you want your kids to grow, everything. I was just having this conversation the other day with a friend last night about Kids going off to college and the dorms not being how they live at home. Well, you know what, you gotta figure it out.

B (30:03)

That's a huge part of the college experience. If you are fortunate enough to go away to college, because you have to be fortunate to get that. But a huge part of that, and I think this goes for high school too, or any kind of school, is the socialization of your child. Right. To become a full human being. And this is why I know a lot of people like to homeschool. I don't believe in that because I think the kid misses out. Unless there's an extraordinary circumstance the kid misses out on, I would say 50% of their education. If you think the education is 90% in the classroom, it's not. There's a life education that you have, not the textbooks, interacting with other people, peer groups, all that 100%.

C (30:45)

And what he's saying about the transfer portal. I was always torn with the transfer portal because I've been a part of situations where I seen a coach lie to a kid, have them commit to a school, and then the kid get there and you do something totally different than what you said. And so now this kid is pigeonholed there and if he transfer, he has to sit out a year and all those type of things. So I was always torn about that. But now the transfer portal has done the opposite. It's like, you know what? If I don't get what I want, then I'm going somewhere else.

B (31:22)

Pendulum swung too far.

C (31:23)

Yeah, it swung way too far.

B (31:25)

It swung way too far. I think to me, there's a bigger philosophical thing here, which is every generation complains that the next generation is getting soft. Every generation.

C (31:37)

I can see that.

B (31:38)

And there's truth to it.

C (31:40)

Happens a lot on shows, but it's true in life.

B (31:44)

You think about what your grandmother told you, what her grandmother had to tell her. Right? Every generation. And there's truth to it. We are getting softer, but there's trade offs in life. It's good in a sense that we're getting softer. What it suggests is times are getting better now. The trade off is what we're seeing, for example, in college right now because Coach Clou was making a larger point. We coddle our kids in this generation to the point where we bail them out. They don't have to figure it out for themselves. It is more true now than it was in our generation. Yes, but it was more true in our generation than it was in the previous generation. It's an indication that things are getting Better. And yet the trade off is that we're also getting softer. Like, that is the truth. And you don't want to get too soft as a culture, because it does not. You know, what's that stupid. The thing everyone loves to talk about, hard times make hard men. Which. Who makes soft times? Who makes soft men? Right. Like, whatever that is, there's truth to it.

C (32:47)

But let me give you a different look at this, because you're right. In life, that is absolutely right. But in our very unique world of sports, and in this case basketball, what's happening is there's a manipulation for monetary gain. And that is a huge.

B (33:10)

It's the root of it. You think? Yes, but that's. Isn't that an issue of incentive more than anything?

C (33:16)

Yeah, but that's a huge.

B (33:17)

But if you put that incentive in front of you, me, a responsible adult, a kid, whatever, people are. Most people, not everyone. Most people don't have the discipline to say, hey, in the long run, this is not good. They're gonna grab for that incentive.

C (33:29)

Yes, but. And here's the thing. I always like to separate the two, because if I'm not gonna be a pro, I have to maximize my opportunity to my earning potential. I have to maximize that. But I should be able to do that with integrity. Right. And then there's a world where if I'm a pro and I'm thinking big picture, don't get me wrong, there's things that need to be addressed now. Bills, you know, a lot of things that need to be addressed. Now, if I can monitor that as best as I can while also valuing a school, a coaching staff, because these kids are picking coaching staffs now. They're not picking the school. You. You used to pick the actual university. Sure. Now you're picking a coaching staff. But if I can value that and say, hey, this is what's best for me because of how I'm going to be positioned, my other teammates, the history of the school, the coaching staff, how I'm going to be played, et cetera, our ability to win as a unit, and that's going to help raise my profile to be better positioned from a draft perspective. Okay, then I may not take as much as I possibly could to be positioned better, but these are. It's all so blurry, right? There's no clarity.

B (34:54)

It feels like they're going to have to organize the college.

C (34:58)

The good thing is clothes are all over the beds.

B (35:00)

There's enough nil money to keep kids in college longer now and to even incentivize players from the NBA to want to go to college, which means that the star making system of college in the men's game might come back. And that's going to be a good thing for the NBA.

C (35:14)

Yeah, look, now kids can stay longer.

B (35:16)

Stay longer, develop better as people, as players.

C (35:19)

But you know what?

B (35:19)

You get to the league more prepared, you get a little bit stars, you.

C (35:23)

Get a little bit of like what you get in football. In football, if I'm a now it's a risk because I can always get injured. But if I'm a top quarterback and I'm a junior, you might not want.

B (35:34)

To play in a certain game or.

C (35:36)

The top of the draft isn't looking that great. I may punt. Now. It's a big risk and you gotta. But you at least had that option.

B (35:44)

You can't predict the outcome of everything that comes from rules you set up. But you do have to evaluate what you set up and say, okay, the unintended consequence is we've incentivized certain behavior we don't want. Can we tweak that to get rid of that and get something we want more?

D (36:01)

Close your eyes. Exhale.

C (36:03)

Feel your body relax.

D (36:05)

And let go of whatever you're carrying today. Well, I'm letting go of the worry that I wouldn't get my new contacts in time for this class. I got them delivered free from 1-800-contacts. Oh my gosh, they're so fast. And breathe. Oh, sorry. I almost couldn't breathe when I saw the discount they gave me on my first order. Oh, sorry. Namaste. Visit 1-800-contacts.com today to save on your first order. 1-800-contacts New Year, new me. Cute. But how about New Year, new money? With Experian, you can actually take control of your finances. Check your FICO score, find ways to save and get matched with credit card offers, giving you time to power through those New Year's goals. You know you're going to crush start the year off right. Download the Experian app based on FICO's Core 8 model offers an approval not guaranteed. Eligibility requirements and terms apply subject to credit check, which may impact your credit scores. Offers not available in all states. See experian.com for details. Experian spring break isn't what it used to be. It's better this spring. Stay three nights and get a $50 Best Western gift card. Life's a trip. Make the most of it at best Western. Visit bestwestern.com for complete terms and conditions.

B (37:17)

Rich, we gotta talk Super Bowl.

C (37:20)

I'm excited about the Super Bowl. Yeah. I really am.

B (37:23)

Every year.

C (37:24)

Yeah. Yeah. But I know I'm watching TV and people are saying, oh, it's Seattle. Yeah. Well, guess what? You can think Seattle all you want. And, you know, I saw what Tom said. I don't know if I agree with that.

B (37:39)

Tom Brady came out and said he's not rooting for either team.

C (37:43)

He's rooting for the Patriots.

B (37:45)

Are you sure about that?

C (37:46)

You have to.

B (37:47)

It could go the other way, though. Like, I always thought when Eli and Peyton went to each other's Super Bowls. They're close. I get it. I'm close with my brother. There's some. But there's a competitiveness, especially super competitive people. Man, I won one or I'd won two. He won one if he stays at one.

C (38:06)

But what's the.

B (38:06)

There's a little party. So Tom Brady. They got rid of me, right? They got rid of me.

C (38:11)

He played 20. What are you talking about?

B (38:12)

They did. But he was still great. And they got rid of him. I thought, yeah, good move. Move. Before he gets too old, before he falls off the cliff. And he was still great. You got to have a certain feeling about that.

C (38:22)

Well, in that situation, I guarantee you're saying, okay, if you're going to retire.

B (38:27)

And he's involved in a rival franchise now. Rival kind of rival. But Raiders are a national brand at least.

C (38:33)

But if you're going to retire, okay, cool. I'm pretty sure they would have been like, great, you could retire. You could do whatever you want to do. But if you want to still continue to play, that's always a tough choice. It's a tough choice for anybody in that sport at that age. Still falling, though. And he's still. And you know what?

B (38:50)

They believe me, I guess, that he was about. I think Belichick agreed with me that he was about to fall off and.

C (38:54)

He won another Super Bowl.

B (38:55)

He was wrong.

C (38:56)

And he won another super bowl and almost defended it.

B (38:59)

Like he took the super bowl champs, the eventual super bowl champs, into the fourth quarter and scored on him for the lead. Like, pretty good title defense.

C (39:07)

I don't see him having any type of anything.

B (39:11)

Anything in him. So why say that you're not. Why not say that you're.

C (39:15)

I don't know. I cannot answer that question. But what I can say is there's no effect on him. If Drake may and the Patriots win the Super Bowl.

B (39:24)

Who you pulling for?

C (39:27)

I just want to see a good game.

B (39:29)

I'm pulling for the Seahawks for two reasons. One, I think they're the better team. And I'm predicting it. Two, I root against any team from Boston, New York. So Boston I'm rooting against.

C (39:38)

New Balance is in Boston. I like Boston.

B (39:40)

Boston team, if you're from New York, anything Boston you're rooting against.

C (39:43)

Well, I'm not from New York.

B (39:45)

Yeah, but I am. All right, so I want to get to the actual prediction for the game. But before we do, I look at this. Well, first, I actually, before I even get there, I want to talk about Kraft not getting into the hall of Fame. And I'll tell you why. I'll tell you why. Obviously, six Super Bowls, first ballot hall of Famer. But it's more than that to me, Rich, and it relates to what you said earlier about Washington now and the Warriors. You see, when you talk about real world experiments. So take Brady Belichick. Who is it more, Brady or Belichick? You had a pretty good real world experiment. It's never going to be perfect, but, like, well, let's split them apart and see what happens. Yes, Brady wins a Super bowl, gets to the playoffs again, almost beats the eventual champs. Belichick got to one playoff, never won another playoff game, got worse and worse. Went to college. No good in college. Man, that makes Brady look good and Belichick look not as good as Brady.

C (40:38)

Right.

B (40:39)

But there's someone who might look better than even Brady or Belichick in their role, and that's Robert Kraft. Because Robert Kraft buys the team, they get successful. There's no Brady, there's no Belichick. They're back in the Super Bowl. So, like, he's a first ballot hall of Famer. Duh. Robert Kraft. Beyond just Brady and Belichick, they say a fish rots from the head down, but the opposite is also true. And I think at this point, given all the evidence, you have to look at Kraft to go met, for example, the reverse is true with the jets, the New York Jets. And this also relates to the Super Bowl. Woody Johnson is a horrible owner. There's just no two ways about it. But the jets are dysfunctional. Always, all the time. It doesn't matter what GM they bring in, what coach they bring in. I mean, Tannenbaum ran a good operation for a minute. It got better, you know, but through the years, they are usually, not always, but usually a laughingstock. And they never win the Super bowl since 1969. Right. Ridiculous. So. And I'm not a Jets fan, I'm a Giants fan. But this is the truth. Look at Sam Darnold. Sam Darnold gets drafted by the jets and you're like, well, that didn't work out. And they're playing the clip all the time. When they played the Patriots and said, I'm seeing ghosts, right, it just looked like it wasn't going to work for Sam Darnold. He is in the super bowl with Seattle in the Super Bowl. And so it brings me back to Kraft and Drake May and Mike Vrabel, a really good player with the Patriots in that Patriots dynasty, is now brought back as the coach. He's having success. They draft a guy, they put him in the right situation. They draft the right guy, they develop him, right? And here they are back in the Super Bowl. So I think a lot of what this super bowl says to me to give credit to the Patriots, who, you know, I root against them, but. But, man, Kraft, they're back in this. Kraft is a first ballot hall of Famer. I don't care that he's not a first ballot hall of Famer. In my mind, he always will be.

C (42:40)

But that's why I believe it's not as easy as people think. The Patriots believe they can win. Every time they walk in their facility, they don't see, like, you know, ragtag things. They see winning, they see success, they see Super Lombardi trophies. When you walk into an organization every day and that is the fumes that's coming out of the H Vac, and everywhere you turn, you say, you could.

B (43:11)

Say H Vac, Yeah, you could say H Vac, Yeah.

C (43:13)

I mean, I've done. I paid for enough H Vac. But when you see, like, you know, everywhere you turn, it's a quote, it's a championship quote. It's somebody holding up a trophy. It's guys. Vrabel, who played for the Patriots. Do you know what school Vrabel went to? University? What?

B (43:33)

Oh, okay. Yeah, of course. Of course. That's. Of course it comes out of that.

C (43:40)

But what I'm saying is when you around winning, it does something to you. You cannot not have confidence. And it's not just about confidence. The winning comes with preparation, professionalism, you know, approach, detail, like. And so pad.

B (44:06)

Yeah, professionalism.

C (44:08)

What was the other approach and detail?

B (44:10)

Yeah. Okay.

C (44:10)

Oh, I like that pad. Yes.

B (44:12)

Okay.

C (44:12)

But when you think. And when you think about this, you think about what teams in the NBA is doing. This is why we mentioned. We mentioned the Wizards.

B (44:22)

The Wizards, yeah.

C (44:22)

Let me tell you something. Just I've never seen something.

B (44:25)

And you started with ownership. When you talk about the Wizards, you started with ownership.

C (44:28)

Yes.

B (44:28)

Because guess what makes a difference?

C (44:30)

Yesterday Ted Leonis is on a phone call having a conversation. It's not just about like a trade.

B (44:39)

With A.D. oh, right.

C (44:41)

He's like, hey man, like look, this is great.

B (44:44)

The owner of the team gets on the phone and calls the star player that was just acquired.

C (44:49)

Yes. For a trade. So these are things that it's like you're showing up. You're not just making it back.

B (44:57)

By the way, kids, 50% of life is showing up.

C (45:01)

Yeah, you're showing up.

B (45:02)

You're halfway there. If you just show up.

C (45:04)

At least you know, regardless of what happens at worst case scenario, you know, oh, this person cares. It's not just a trade. Whatever.

B (45:16)

And the reason 50% of life is showing up is because it requires the base level of effort. It is always easier to not show up.

C (45:25)

Right. Or to not care. Yeah, to not care.

B (45:28)

Because showing up is a level of. It's a requisite level of caring.

C (45:33)

So I believe. Listen, I think we're going to see a really good game. I just want to have some good food Sunday. So I got to have my Chinese and look, it's good players on both sides.

B (45:47)

Well, okay, getting to that. When I look at the Patriots, I said it the other day, I have like a checklist for teams. Coach, first check, check. Quarterback second check, check. Nowadays I got the O.C. third check, check. I think for the purposes of one game. So wide out comes next. And I think there's a check there too on both sides because. Yeah, but I'm just going Patriots right now.

C (46:11)

Okay. Okay.

B (46:11)

Then I would say offensive line. But if you want it like. And the Patriots have an excellent young left tackle right check. Then I would say pass rush. That's where Seattle starts to separate itself. Seattle's defense is outstanding at all three levels.

C (46:31)

Yes, right.

B (46:32)

They have all the checks too. Plus an excellent, well rounded defense. And I would say therefore that what the super bowl comes down to since Seattle, they both do a lot of things well. Seattle keeps going down the list with checks where the Patriots don't quarterback. This is the Sam Darnold game. If Sam Darnold. Seattle is expected to win because of what I just mentioned. If Sam Darnold plays well and they win all the glory. But he. It's like what we talked about. Which quarterback, what players have the most pressure. If they lose, he will be blamed. Right. If they lose, it's cause he didn't play well. Hard to imagine a game where Darnold plays well and he lose.

C (47:11)

Quarterback always gets to blame but defense wins championships. So I'm gonna need you to take the defense on your checklist up a little bit higher.

B (47:19)

I think you're right about that. I think you're right.

C (47:21)

You know what school Kobe Bryant went to?

B (47:24)

What school Kobe Bryant went to? Are you talking of which Kobe Bryant? Not off the top of my head. Oh, yeah. Now I know. Now I know off the top of my head.

C (47:32)

Come on, Max. You know what high school.

B (47:33)

That's the time I'm asked that question.

C (47:34)

You know what high school he went to?

B (47:35)

I don't know what high school he went to.

C (47:36)

Glenville. I keep telling you this, Max. I'm gonna take you to a Glenville game.

B (47:40)

All right, we'll go.

C (47:41)

Yeah, you have to go.

B (47:41)

Take the show on the road.

C (47:42)

Yeah.

B (47:43)

So anyway, because of all those things.

C (47:45)

State champions again, by the way, this.

B (47:47)

Year, because I root against the Patriots, because I honestly think Seattle is better. I'm taking Seattle to win. Well, are you not predicting the game?

C (47:55)

I'm not predicting the game.

B (47:56)

I think the Super Bowl.

C (47:57)

Here's the thing.

B (47:57)

It's all right.

C (47:58)

I'm not. Let me sit.

B (47:59)

You can make super bowl prediction.

C (48:00)

I can make a Super bowl prediction.

B (48:02)

I would probably say low scoring game, Seattle wins.

C (48:06)

No, no, I don't think it'd be a low scoring game. I'm gonna say it's gonna be 27 to 27, 27 17. That is a low scoring game.

B (48:26)

Yeah. You know, by the way, I would say. I was about to say the exact same thing. I'll say 2817. Because they go for an extra. They go. They try the two point conversion at some point because the metrics tell them to do it. Let's call it 2817.

C (48:39)

Okay.

B (48:39)

You say 20.

C (48:39)

I'd say.

B (48:41)

And Seattle.

C (48:42)

And I think Seattle. Yeah.

B (48:44)

Because if the Patriots win, it seems to me it will be because Sam Darnold turned the ball over. Right. And they had. By the way, the Patriots can do that.

C (48:54)

I do think the Patriots can win if Gonzalez has at least if that defense, and I'm saying led by Gonzalez and obviously Barmore on the defensive line. If that defense has two turnovers, then, yeah, then the Patriots has a real shot.

B (49:14)

The star that emerges from the game is. I got one for sure.

C (49:19)

I think it's jsn.

B (49:20)

Me too. Jackson, Smith and Jigba is already elite, elite, elite at the position. And it's a home run hitting position. And if you ball out in the super bowl and I expect him to, you become an enormous star.

C (49:34)

But if the Patriots Win. Although I know in this case, normally they give it to the quarterback in Drake May, but Stephon Diggs would be the indicator.

B (49:46)

I think Diggs is that type of guy also. Yeah, yeah.

C (49:48)

Stephanie.

B (49:49)

Although he's not. He's no longer in his prime, but he's still very, very good.

C (49:52)

Yeah. Did you see the NFL honors?

B (49:54)

Did I see them?

C (49:56)

The awards?

B (49:57)

Yeah, Yeah. I mean, I know who won. No, I didn't. Did I watch?

C (50:00)

No. I'm saying I just want to give a shot. Like, you know, Miles Garrett, defensive player of the year.

B (50:04)

Jsn.

C (50:05)

Yeah.

B (50:05)

Jsn, which is offensive player of the year, is just the non quarterback who had the best year.

C (50:09)

But T. Mac won the rookie offensive player. And Myles Garrett is. Is represented by our president of football, Nicole Lynn, agent extraordinaire. And also T. Mac is represented by Zeke Sandhu, senior agent in football at my team.

B (50:28)

It's fun going to rich's suite at SoFi because you see the clutch agents watching. Not just watching, but watching different games. They got clients in every game. Yeah.

C (50:39)

And in those cases, I'm just. I'm here, which is great. That's why I like to go to the football games. I'm no fun going to a basketball game. Cause I don't talk to you.

B (50:47)

Saint is. By the way, you got an agent at Klutch. Knows a lot about football. Boy.

C (50:51)

Well, you would hope so.

B (50:52)

Yeah. Know a lot about football.

C (50:53)

Can't be in football. And know a lot about.

B (50:54)

I text with him during the playoffs more than you.

C (50:57)

As you should.

B (50:58)

Yeah.

C (50:58)

Yeah. As you should.

B (50:59)

All right, Rich. We both like Seattle by virtually the same score.

C (51:04)

Yes.

B (51:06)

And it's time to go watch the Super Bowl.

C (51:09)

Yeah. Maybe. Maybe. I might. I might. I might slide by. Yeah. I might slide by.

B (51:12)

Yeah.

C (51:13)

If I. If I get an opportunity, I'll let you know.

B (51:15)

Chinese?

C (51:16)

Chinese? Yeah.

B (51:17)

What do you eat?

C (51:19)

I'll tell you. I'll text it to you because I don't. I don't want to. Yeah, I'll tell you.

B (51:23)

Max Kellerman, Rich Paul. Game.

C (51:25)

Game over. Enjoy the super bowl and please subscribe.

B (51:31)

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