Game Over with Max Kellerman and Rich Paul

Episode: Wide-Open AFC, Holiday Thoughts, and a Surprise Phone Call
Date: December 22, 2025
Host: The Ringer

Episode Overview

In this lively pre-Christmas episode, Max Kellerman and Rich Paul discuss the unpredictable AFC playoff picture, the pressures of holiday gift-giving, LeBron James’ Christmas game comments, and a heartwarming story about the Knicks’ players sharing their NBA Cup bonuses. The episode shifts effortlessly between sports takes, personal anecdotes, cultural observations, and culminates in a surprise live call with Rockets star Fred VanVleet about his rehab status. The co-hosts keep things candid, personal, and often hilarious, touching on how sports intersect with fans’ lives and holiday traditions.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Wide-Open AFC Playoff Race

(02:18 – 14:35)

• Max opens by calling the AFC “wide open,” contrasting former certainty about the Bills and Texans with the recent surge from teams like the Jaguars, Steelers, and notably the Broncos.
• Rich is bullish on the Browns despite their lackluster playoff hopes, highlighting the die-hard nature of Cleveland fandom.
• They discuss the Texans as a sleeper pick:
  • Max: "Texans to me are my sleeper pick to win the Super Bowl." (04:07)
  • Rich praises the Texans’ growing “continuity and professionalism.”
• The absence of the Chiefs/Mahomes prompts a “parallel universe” conversation:
  • Max: “It’s almost like when Jordan stepped away for those two years...now we get to see a parallel universe [in the AFC].” (05:09)
• Quarterbacks flipping the script:
  • Trevor Lawrence’s development is center stage.
  • Max takes a hard line: "Going into this season, it’s not an exaggeration to say [Trevor Lawrence] was a bust." (07:36)

2. Trevor Lawrence & Player Expectations

(07:35 – 14:35)

• Rich uses New Edition’s “Can You Stand the Rain” as a metaphor for QB maturity and resilience.
  • "In life, you have to...stand the rain, man." (07:43)
• Debates on hype and bust labels:
  • Max: “A guy comes out with Wemby-level hype...and doesn’t deliver, that’s a bust.” (13:09)
  • Rich pushes back, urging patience and context, especially for hyped players.

3. Browns Fandom, Small Markets, and Holiday Economics

(14:38 – 24:54)

• Rich shares personal stories of growing up a Browns fan, describing the legacy and wounds left by near-wins and the team's move in the 90s.
  • "Being a Browns fan is...you're in a totally different universe." (14:44)
• Discussion of big markets vs. small markets:
  • Rich: “In a big market...the sun’s still shining. In a small market, if the Browns lose…the whole town is depressed.” (20:00)
  • They explore the local economic boost from winning teams and how it affects everyone “from people serving drinks to company owners.”
• Hilarious sidebar on gift-giving pressure among wealthy circles:
  • Rich: “It’s not about rich or poor monetarily, it’s about how rich a character is.” (22:07)
  • Max: “Getting something for your rich friend is hard, because anything they have, they want.” (24:54)

4. The Knicks’ Bonus Story and The Meaning of Team Culture

(26:29 – 35:06)

• Knicks players use their NBA Cup bonuses to reward support staff, prompting a wider debate:
  • Max wonders why ownership doesn't just handle those bonuses, referencing Dolan’s reputation for generosity.
  • Rich pushes back: “That has nothing to do with ownership…This is more of an admiration from the players to say, ‘hey, these people are here every day with us.’” (28:04)
• The hosts agree this gesture signals rare team chemistry and cohesion.
  • Rich: “When you enjoy playing with each other, that matters. When you hesitate to swing the ball, maybe you hesitated to give your share of the bonus too…” (34:41)
• Analogy to the “Nova Knicks” (Knicks team composed of Villanova alumni) as a model for other leagues putting together “chemistry-first” rosters.

5. Rockets Update: Fred VanVleet’s Status – Live Surprise Call

(35:06 – 40:36)

• Max claims the Rockets could be a dark horse NBA champion if healthy, but is skeptical about VanVleet’s return.
  • “From everything I’ve read, it seems like he’s out for the season.” (35:58)
• Rich, calling Max out, calls Fred VanVleet on-air.
  • Fred answers mid-rehab:
    • Fred VanVleet: “I feel great, man. I’m feeling strong, and we’ll just see where things go. My hopes [are up].” (37:15)
  • Both hosts agree a VanVleet return would make the Rockets a legit title contender.

6. Fighters Fights: Joshua vs. Jake Paul

(42:15 – 46:58)

• Max dismisses the Anthony Joshua vs. Jake Paul bout as a real “comeback” while Rich gives Paul immense credit for simply surviving in the ring.
  • Max: “Did anyone think he was gonna beat Anthony Joshua?...He refuses to let other people put limits on him…” (44:27)
  • Rich: “I tip my hat to Jake...that right, what was it, a right cross? Me or you, he would have knocked us out the ring.” (43:56)
• The segment ties into the recurring theme of defying expectations and grit.

7. Holiday Real-Talk: Gift-Giving, Presence (Not Presents), and Christmas Sports

(53:02 – 57:27)

• LeBron’s Christmas comments dissected:
  • Rich: “21st Christmas Day game…if you ask me what I would rather do, [I’d] rather be with my family…” (53:01)
  • Both agree the public would flip if “anybody else” said the same, noting the unique scrutiny facing LeBron and modern athletes.
• Advice for partners on how to “watch the game and help” on Christmas, delivered humorously with practical tips.
  • Rich: “Turn the game on in the room with the kitchen…ask, is there anything I can do? Can I wash potatoes?” (54:39)
  • Max: “You have more energy than I do.”
• Reflection on being present for loved ones, not just physically but emotionally and as a leader.

8. Personal Growth & New Year’s Resolutions

(47:05 – 52:27)

• Max flips the script on New Year’s resolutions:
  • Max: “You should resolve…not to lose your gut. That way, if you keep your gut, you kept your resolution...” (47:28)
• Rich opens up about striving to be more present and effective as a leader and mentor:
  • “Just be more present in different people’s lives...from a leadership perspective...you can get better at things.” (49:16)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

“The AFC is wide open. Wide open.”
—Max Kellerman (00:35)

“In life, you have to...stand the rain, man.”
—Rich Paul (07:43)

“Going into this season, it’s not an exaggeration to say [Trevor Lawrence] was a bust.”
—Max Kellerman (07:36)

“Being a Browns fan is...you’re in a totally different universe.”
—Rich Paul (14:44)

“In a big market...the sun’s still shining. In a small market, if the Browns lose...the whole town is depressed.”
—Rich Paul (20:00)

“It’s not about rich or poor monetarily, it’s about how rich a character is.”
—Rich Paul (22:07)

“When you enjoy playing with each other, that matters...If you hesitated in terms of giving your share for the bonus, then you’re going to hesitate on the swing-swing [on the court].”
—Rich Paul (34:41)

“I feel great, man. I’m feeling strong, and we’ll just see where things go. My hopes [are up].”
—Fred VanVleet (phone call, 37:15)

“I tip my hat to Jake...what was it, a right cross? Me or you, he would have knocked us out the ring.”
—Rich Paul (43:56)

“You should resolve ...not to lose your gut. That way, if you keep your gut, you kept your resolution…”
—Max Kellerman (47:28)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• AFC Playoff Breakdown & Trevor Lawrence Discussion: 02:18 – 14:35
• Browns Fandom, Small Markets, and Gift-Giving: 14:38 – 24:54
• Knicks' Bonus Story & Team Culture: 26:29 – 35:06
• Rockets & Fred VanVleet Surprise Call: 35:06 – 40:36
• Anthony Joshua vs. Jake Paul, Player Grit: 42:15 – 46:58
• New Year’s Resolutions & Personal Growth: 47:05 – 52:27
• LeBron’s Christmas Comments & Holiday Life Dynamics: 53:02 – 57:27

Tone & Style

The banter is energetic, bantering, and authentic—Max’s analytical but opinionated style pairs with Rich’s relatable storytelling and life wisdom. Both bring humor and humility as they connect professional sports with everyday life, maintaining a conversational, often playful tone throughout.

For First-Time Listeners

This episode weaves sports analysis with cultural and personal insights: you’ll find hot takes on the NFL and NBA mixed with honest talk about family, holidays, and navigating expectations—on and off the field. The surprise Fred VanVleet call is a highlight, and the story of the Knicks’ generosity is a perfect holiday feel-good moment. A must-listen for sports fans who also care about the stories and the people around the games.