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A
The roofing industry is broken and we've got the fix. At HirePro, we help homeowners do the same thing a roofer would do when it hails on their own house. Own the project, delegate the tasks and keep the compensation. But you don't have to take my word for it. You could ask Chrissy. Chrissy, how'd it go? It went great. You educated us on how everything worked, showed us behind the curtain, so to speak. And after our $25,000 roof was replaced, we walked away with almost $6,000 for the work we put in. And what work was that? We got the permit and we picked the color. Hire pro handled everything else. You did a great job. And I'm not even being paid to say that. If anyone's listening and has a storm damage claim, call them. Don't hire a roofer, hire a pro. That's awesome. I appreciate the kind words and I think you just made up our new motto. All right, Joe, you're up. So if insurance has approved your roof replacement, give these guys a call at 651-402-3400 or visit them online at. Hire a dot pro. That's H. Then put the dot there. Pro. Hi, I'm Ben Hageman, owner of American Pressure. We specialize in industrial pressure washers and set ourselves apart with a customer focused experience backed with industry leading experts, a large inventory of equipment, parts and accessories and a great service department to take care of you, our customer. Buy local, buy quality, buy from American Pressure. Learn more@americanpressure.com stop in and see us. You'll be glad you did.
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B
Support for this podcast comes from Progressive,
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A
America's number one motorcycle insurer.
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B
Did you know writers who switch and save with Progressive save nearly $200 per year. That's a whole new pair of writing gloves and more. Quote Today Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates national average 12 month savings of $197 by new customers surveyed who save with Progressive between October 2024 and September 2025. Potential savings will vary.
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A
1, 2, 3. Meshk. I said a hootie hootie hoot. 1, 2, Yo ding flipping what you call your whiz bang half a looting. Howdy, howdy hosky to each and every one of you out there. Mishke here with you. And the first thing I want to address on today's program is the sad news that songs have been growing meaner over the years. This is research that's been done out there. I don't know who paid for it, but pop songs have been growing progressively more meaningful over recent decades. We're getting meaner people, meaner, more wretched, more spiteful, more straight, razor toed. According to Tony Joe White. It's not a shock that songs are getting more mean. Everything's getting more mean. I go to the dry cleaners and the experience is more mean. I wave to a child at a Kool Aid stand. The whole experience is more mean. The kid says, stop waving, creep. I say, okay, so much for the nice cold drink I was gonna buy from you. I hope you go broke. And the kid throws a rock at my head. It's rough out. It's. It's rough out there. It is rough. I guess it used to be different. I guess we used to be nice. Mm. Here's the story I'm finding in the news. There's a reason a grandparents record collection feels so different from what's topping the charts today. And it goes beyond the sound. Over the past half century, the words woven into popular music have drifted away from themes of care, loyalty, love, and increasingly have moved toward themes of harm and degradation. Hey, songwriters out there, are you writing songs of harm and degradation? And I'm tapping my foot to that. What's my problem? Researchers have numbers to back it up. It's a study published in Scientific Reports. It analyzed the lyrics of hundreds of thousands of English language songs. Song lyrics have long been treated as a kind of cultural mirror, reflecting the values and attitudes of the era that produced the songs. If that holds true, then the picture coming back over the last several decades is one of shifting priorities, shifting moral priorities, at least in terms of the music that becomes popular. We like it mean now. Mean, a B.B. king song is drifting into my mind. You been mean. You bad and mean. You been mistreating me, woman. You bad and mean. Stop it. Behave. I don't mean to make light of the fact that we're getting meaner, but the only other option is depression. Just getting sad. See, it's hard to get up every day and look at the world around you and still find a reason to go on. Oh, sure, there's the spouse and family members who'd be sad if you disappeared. But what I'm saying is this is just another brick in the wall. We're getting meaner even in our songs. Who's responsible for this mean songwriting? Would you knock it off? Cause it's affecting my own songwriting. I was writing a song the other day, and afterward I looked at the lyrics and I said, what's my problem? I must be affected by the Times as well. I have apparently unconsciously been going in the same direction of more and more disturbing lyrics. This latest song I've been working on is about a guy who doesn't like his roommate. It's called My Ugly Freakin Roommate. The lyrics go, I don't like you, never have I just want you gone. Go find some other place to live. Stay there from now on. I don't like your family and I don't like your friends. In fact, several people are gonna die before this little song ends. I'm only that far. I've been trying to write a chorus for it and there's got to be a chorus. I was thinking maybe. Mean, mean, super mean I'm as mean as they come Mean to the bone, man, so mean I'm numb Mean, mean, I'm super mean I'm meaner than Pol Pot I guess what I am saying is Mother Teresa. I am not. The song needs some work, I'll admit, but there are other verses that center around this whole desire to get rid of this roommate and to foment total global thermonuclear war. I'll tell you some guys who I think are responsible, and I'm quite serious. I think the Canadian rapper Drake and the American rapper Kendrick Lamar gotta take some of the blame. They've had a feud going for years and years, and it's just time for it to stop. It's just disturbing these two songwriters. Back in 2024, Drake comes out with a song where he accuses Kendrick Lamar of domestic abuse and claims that Lamar's creative partner, Dave Free, is the biological father of Lamar's son. And then 20 minutes later, just 20 minutes later, Kendrick Lamar releases a song in which he accuses Drake of running a sex trafficking ring. This is all true. And the next day, the next day, deciding that wasn't harsh enough, the next day, Kendrick Lamar releases a song in which he accuses Drake of pedophilia. This is real. This is a feud between a couple of rappers. Could you tone it down? I remember when I was growing up, there was this song on the radio. Come on, people now Smile on your brother Everybody get together, yeah Try to love one another right now Remember that one, Jesse Collin Young? Yeah. Well, if Jesse Colin Young tried to write that today, he would be killed. He would be killed halfway through the song, they would kill him. And in a mean way, I think Taylor Swift is somewhat responsible. She has some mean breakup songs. I mean, okay, so you're hurt, Taylor. Do you have to hurt back? I mean, that really is our lowest animal instinct, isn't it? To just hurt back when we're hurt. You hurt me, I'll hurt you. Why can't we just cry instead and say owie, owie. Just cry when you're hurt and say ouch. Ah, ah, ah. You don't have to hurt back. I think it's more courageous and impressive to take it, to take the pain. Taylor Swift. What if you just wrote a song that said, ah, ah, ow, ow. Ah, ah, ah, ah. He broke up with me. Ah. Head hurts, my heart's broken. So they say. To find the stuff that isn't very mean at all, you go back to the late 60s, early 70s. That's where you can find lyrics like this. John Sebastian. What a day for a daydream. What a day for a daydreaming boy I'm lost in a daydream Dreaming about my bundle of joy and even if time ain't really on my side it's one of those days for taking a walk outside. I'm blowing the day to take a walk in the sun and fall on my face on somebody's new mowed lawn. I don't know that I've heard a line like that in any other song in my life. I'm falling on my face on somebody's new mowed lawn. That's an original line there, John. No one else has ever said that in a song. He wanted to fall on his face on somebody's newly mowed lawn. Cause it was a day for a daydream and a daydreaming boy. Anything mean there? I can't see it. Or how about this song? This goes back to the band. Small Faces. Over the Bridge of Sighs to rest my eyes in shades of green under dreaming spires To Ichiku park that's where I've been. What did you do there? I got high. What did you feel there? Well, I cried. But why the tears there? I'll tell you why. It's all too beautiful. It's all too beautiful. It's all too beautiful. Yeah. Small Face has delivered that song. Then there was this song a half century ago by Friends of Distinction, Grazing in the Grass. One of my favorite summer songs. Yeah, well, the guy who wrote that was traveling on the road with the band through the countryside. And he looked out the window and he saw something every Midwesterner has seen all their lives. Cows grazing in a pasture. And he thought, that's a good life right there. Look at that. That is mellow. Just grazing in the grass. What a gas. That would be just doing that all day. And he wrote the lyrics to the song Grazing in the Grass. The first line is, it sure is mellow. Grazing in the grass. And then the backup singers sing, grazing in the grass is a gas, baby, can you dig it? And then the lead singer says, what a trip. Just watching as the world goes past. Yeah, the cows are having a trip. Grazing in the grass is a gas, baby, can you dig it? And then the lead singer says, there are so many good things to see while grazing in the grass. Flowers with colors for taking everything out of sight in the grass. The sun beaming down between the leaves. Grazing in the grass as a gas, can you dig it? And the birds darting in and out of the trees. Everything here is so clear you can see it Everything here is so real, you can feel, feel it real, so real, so real, so real. Can you dig it? It wasn't mean, it wasn't mean. It was dumb, it was weird, but it wasn't mean.
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C
However,
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A
Minnesota's own Robert Zimmerman got more than mean in a song that goes way back. One of the meanest songs I ever heard growing up in. In fact, let's face it, the Meanest song, positively 4th Street. Up until that moment, I will argue, no song had ever been that mean. No popular song, not one had ever been that mean. Positively 4th street came along and delivered a brand new standard. People must have wondered, what is this? Can you say this? And can this actually be popular? You know the song, right, people, it's just brutal. I mean, Bob must have wrote this and thought, maybe I should stick it in my back pocket for a couple of days and see if maybe when I calm down, I want to just throw it away. I'm not sure this is the kind of thing a guy should be belting out in public, but maybe another half of them said, there's a lot of money to be made off of this song. There sure was. But I tell you, I was uncomfortable hearing it from the beginning. I was uncomfortable. This is not a song I would ever cover. It's too mean. Listen to the lyrics. Forget about the music momentarily and just listen to what Bob is actually saying. He's awfully upset. You've got a lot of nerve to say you're my friend. When I was down, you stood around there grinning. You got a lot of nerve to say you have a helping hand to lend. You just want to be on the side that's winning. You say I let you down. You know it's not like that. If you're so hurt why don't you show it? You say you've lost your faith. That's not where it's at. You have no faith to lose, and you know it. I know the reason you talk behind my back. I used to be among the crowd you're in with. Do you take me for such a fool to think I'd make contact with one who tries to hide what he doesn't know to begin with? You see me on the street. You always act so surprised. You say, hey, how are you? Good luck. But you don't mean it. You know as well as me you'd rather see me paralyzed. Actually, paralyzed. You'd like to see me a quadriplegic, wouldn't ya? Why don't you just come out one time and scream it? No, I do not feel that good when I see the heartbreaks you embrace. If I were a master thief, I'd rob them. And though I know you're dissatisfied with your position and your place, don't you get it? It's not my problem. I wish that for just one time you could stand inside my shoes. And for just that one moment I could be you. God, I wish for just one time you could stand inside my shoes. You would know what a drag it is just to see you. Just to see you is a drag. And I know it must not be great for you either, because I'm not paralyzed yet. Now, that was the meanest song to come along ever. At that point, in terms of popular music, I don't know that I want to be known for that. Delivering the meanest song ever. Ho. I mean, someone could tell me. What about the murder ballads? The old country murder ballads from long ago. They were violent. They were very violent, I'll give you that. Were they mean? Well, I guess murder is mean. Murder is mean. By golly, I'm hearing a song in my head right now called Knoxville Girl. I can hear the Leuven Brothers now delivering at 1956. Oh, my God, that one was disturbing. Get ready for this. I met a little girl in Knoxville a town we all know well. And every Sunday evening out in her home I dwell. We went to take an evening walk about a mile from town. I picked a stick up off the ground and I knocked that fair girl down. She fell down on her bended knees for for mercy she did cry. Oh, Willie dear, don't kill me. Here I am unprepared to die. Well, she never spoke another word. I only beat her more until the ground around me with her blood did flow. I took her by her golden curls I drug her round and round, Throwing her into the river that flows through old Knoxville town. Go down, go down, you Knoxville girl With the dark and roving eyes. Go down, go down, you Knoxville girl. You'll never be my bride. Well, she certainly won't. I mean, even if she were to survive, I think that's a deal breaker. Beating her with a stick, dragging her by the hair and throwing her in a river to drown. You go to any dating site, you will learn that's a deal breaker. I don't know if guys sat around the campfire saying to their wives, hey, let me play this one for you, sweetheart. Just learned it. It's about that guy who picked up a stick and knocked the girl down. And when she cried, she didn't want to die. He just beat her more and dragged her by the hair and threw her in the river. By the way, honey, I guess half century from now, songs are really going to get mean. Yeah, they're really going to get mean later on. But I will say this. You got this Drake and Kendrick Lamar battle going on this horror, horrible, horrible thing where they're accusing each other of just the nastiest stuff, sex trafficking and pedophilia. I mean, I like to hearken back to Lennon and McCartney. John Lennon was pretty cruel to Paul McCartney after the breakup of the Beatles. He was pretty nasty to Paul, and after a while, Paul didn't want to take it anymore. And he wrote a song called Too many People where he took some shots at John Lennon. One line was, you took your lucky break and you broke it in two, pretty much blaming John for the breakup of the Beatles. But I will say, if you look at the lyrics to McCartney's song Too Many People, it's very veiled, very vague. It's not obvious that he's taken shots at John, and the shots aren't wildly mean. But classic Lennon, who was the meaner of the two unloads on Paul McCartney. I mean, it isn't quite Lamar versus Drake, but I would say following positively 4th Street. The next meanest song I encountered was when John Lennon wrote how do you sleep? To Paul McCartney. I mean, just that by itself is mean, how do you sleep. What's worse is he got George Harrison to join him on the song so that it could look like the Beatles are ganging up on Paul. And Lennon wrote, so sergeant Pepper took you by surprise. You better see right through that mother's eyes. Those freaks was right when they said you was dead. The one mistake you made was in your head how do you sleep? How do you sleep at night Paul? You live with straights who tell you you you was king and you jump when your mama tells you anything the only thing you done was yesterday and since you've gone you're just another day how do you sleep? How do you sleep at night? A pretty face may last a year or two but pretty soon they'll see what you can do. The sound you make is Muzak to my ears. You must have learned something in all those years. How do you sleep? How do you sleep at night? That's what John Lennon wrote to Paul. Can you tell Lennon spent a little more time with Bob Dylan than Paul McCartney did. Wow. McCartney was the one afterward who wrote a song called Dear Friend Trying to make up Trying to say hey, let's not do this man, life is short. Ladies and gentlemen, this is your attorney speaking. We're currently cruising at a comfortable altitude of you got hit by a car and that's not okay and I'd like to welcome you aboard. Brad, Shaw and Bryant, in the event of a sudden loss of fault, meaning someone else clearly caused your accident, a compensation mask will automatically drop down in front of you. Please secure your own settlement before assisting others, even if those others are your spouse who keeps saying it's fine, I'm fine, when it's not, in fact fine. Bradshaw and Bryant proudly offer a free consultation located in the seat back pocket in front of you. We ask that you remain seated with your seat belt fastened for the duration of your legal claim as we may experience unexpected turbulence such as the other driver's insurance company saying they will only offer $800, which we do not recommend accepting. I should mention I'm not actually a pilot. I'm an attorney. Thank you for flying Brad, Shaw and Bryant. We know you had a choice of personal injury attorneys and on behalf of the entire crew, we thank you for trusting us and we hope you enjoy your settlement. Please remain seated until the case has come to a complete and full stop. Bradshawn Bryant learn more@minnesotapersonalinjury.com
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B
Insurance isn't one size fits all. That's why customers have enjoyed progressives name your price tool for years. Now, with the name your price tool, you tell them what you want to pay and they'll show you options that fit your budget. So whether you're picking out your first policy or just looking for something that works best, better for you and your family, they make it easy to see your options. Visit progressive.com find a rate that works for you with the Name your price tool. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates. Price and coverage match limited by state law.
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A
Minneapolis St. Paul Plumbing, Heating, air and Electric would like to remind you that in the month of June, they're offering 50 bucks off any repair, any repair involving your furnace, plumbing, air conditioning or electrical. With that 50 bucks, folks, you could buy a couple of takeout meals, spend it on a haircut, decent bottle of wine, a month of some basic streaming subscription, a mid range pair of earbuds. You might not want to save 50 bucks. You might like blowing money, just throwing it away. In fact, why don't you light a $50 bill right now and toss it outside? I'm sorry, I got carried away there. I want you to call Minneapolis St. Paul Plumbing, Heating, Air and Electric. Because they're my guys and they have been for years and they support this show and they're good and they're solid and they've been around since World War I. And they're four generations deep into this. Now. Come on, you got a better one? Name it. Right now. I'll wait. 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. Minneapolis St. Paul Plumbing, Heating, air and electricity. You can find them by going to callmsp.com. Let's say we go to the phones. It's been a while since we've gone to the phones. Let's see if we can come up with a name from the listeners out there and give one of them a call. Kick in that old machine. Let's see what we got. Kate, it's time to call Kate. It's never too late to call on Kate Every call is just great. Pick up the phone, you won't be alone. You can talk to Kate. Talk to Kate. It's always great to call on Kate. Hope that she don't make me wait. Hope that she don't hesitate. Talk to Kate. Talk to Kate.
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D
Hello, Kate Miski.
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You nailed it. One of the rare folks of the female persuasion to voluntarily include her number in the list. You didn't have someone else do it for you. You actually wanted to be on that list yourself. That is extraordinarily rare. What do you think is different about you? Because you're different. I can tell you already, you are one different cat.
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D
I have been told I marched to the beat of my own drum.
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A
Is it even a drum?
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D
I don't know what kind of drum that is.
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A
I'm not sure it's a drum. I think it's a gazoo.
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D
Could be.
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A
Yeah.
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D
I just walked in the door from a trip. We just got back from Las Cruces New Mexico. Road trip. My husband drove and I was in charge of entertainment, and we listened to the roadshow the whole way. I know that roadshow was your old one. Podcast.
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A
A podcast.
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D
You actually know me.
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A
Kate. Kate, Kate, Kate, Kate, Kate, Kate, Kate, Kate. And you're a Kate who's married, and you at least have enough money to travel, so that narrows it down right there to almost nobody. And you go to Las Cruces, New Mexico, in the summer. Odd.
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D
Very hot. It was so freaking hot.
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Yeah, I stay the hell out of the south from March through October. I just don't go south during those months. Do I know you? Through work.
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D
Through my work. 13 years ago.
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Oh, was it a Monday? About 34 degrees. I paid a traffic ticket. You took my money. Oh, yeah. 13 years ago. 13 years ago. 13 years Ago. 13 years ago.
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D
You may have been in some pain.
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Oh, I know who you are. Kate. The masseuse.
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D
Bingo.
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I remember now.
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D
Yes.
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Oh, how are ya? Are you good?
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D
Retired?
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Tired?
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D
Retired.
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Oh, retired. I wouldn't have asked you this during the days when you were a masseuse, but I feel like asking it now because I've asked it of so many people. Are there stories that come out of your massage days that are front and center in your mind? Weird stories, wild stories, interesting stories, odd stories. That's a job that seems to me to be rife with odd experiences with humanity.
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D
You would think, but I had a policy of not talking while I worked because I didn't want that to pull from the focus of the massage.
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A
There still could be stories just with, I don't know, someone screaming while you're massaging them. Someone who refuses to shut up even though you said we're not going to talk. Someone who right before the massage or after does or says something very, very strange. There are still ways in which you could have odd moments, but. Are you telling me you skated through a masseuse career without a weird moment?
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D
No, I did have weird moment, and it involved a male.
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A
One male, twice.
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D
This one person, he was caressing my leg.
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A
That is almost like a cliche. I don't know what these guys think. I wonder what they do think. Because the idea is they know they're going to someone who does therapeutic massage. There are other types of massage, and that fella certainly could have gone in that direction. Do you think he made a mistake?
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D
It could have been cultural. English wasn't his first language, but there was one other male client. I used to teach massage as well. I taught for seven years. I would Tell my students the male anatomy stuff happens, and it's not always intentional. So that did happen to me. But I could tell it was intentional because he was in control.
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A
Intentional.
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D
I used to tell my students, Mr. Midnight came around.
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Mr. Midnight. I like that name. I've never heard that before. Mr. Midnight.
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D
With my students, I would say so. You might have a client on the table, and all of a sudden, Mr. Midnight comes around.
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A
Mr. Midnight. All of a sudden I see a whole television series. It's a cable series, obviously, but I definitely see a new streaming show called Mr. Midnight. He's both a weird thing that happens on the massage table and a cop. They call me Mr. Midnight. I appear out of nowhere at a massage table, summoned often by a city in need, in need of law enforcement, but not any old law enforcement, the kind that can only come from one. Firm and rigid in his beliefs, hardened by struggle, standing tall against all that's wrong with this world. In the case of the guy where it was intentional, when you say, you know it was intentional, there was a
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D
dance, so to speak, Mr. Midnight was dancing.
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A
Mr. Midnight was dancing.
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D
Yep. At that point, I just said, I'm gonna have you roll over onto your stomach now.
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A
Didn't even know you've crashed, Mr. Midnight.
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D
Yeah, no kidding.
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A
And the fact that Mr. Midnight was dancing, I don't even know what to make of that. But that certainly changes. My television program moves it a little later in the evening. Move this way Watch me sway Everything's all right it's out of sight I missed midnight. I had a friend one time, I asked him, have you ever had a massage? And my wife for a while was a massage therapist. So to me, it was such a natural thing. But I asked a buddy of mine one time, you ever get a massage? And he said, I tried it once. I was curious. And it was the most painful experience of my life. And it was just horrible hearing him tell the story. I don't know who he went to or what the devil was going on there, but he said the entire time he was just wincing and just wanting to scream. And of course, he was a classic Midwesterner who thought, well, I best not do that. I best just take it. But the whole time, it was, What was going on there?
- [33:30]
D
Well, the therapist probably was applying too much pressure and not getting the shoes from the person, because you can tell,
- [33:39]
A
well, what are you doing there? I mean, I wonder what too much pressure was. I mean, maybe she was trying to address the spine through the navel.
- [33:48]
D
Could be, yeah. And you need to pick up on cues and communicate. Let me know if the pressure is too much or too little.
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A
I think if I were this guy, I would have said something like, can we just switch to talk therapy? Just a quick shift. I'll still pay you the same amount, but hands off. I heard about a massage operation in town with a strange name, and I'd like you to help me understand it. And it was therapeutic, it was legit. I know something about it, but here was the name. Deep tissue, deep issue.
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D
Oh, wow.
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A
Do you get it?
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D
And pain. There are some theories where it can be psychological.
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A
Yes.
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D
Like maybe post traumatic stress or in a car accident. In addition to the muscles, it also. There's a psychological component or issue as well.
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A
Somehow there was this idea that in the midst of the massage, an old memory could suddenly come up. Deeply emotional, disturbing memory. And all of a sudden you're weeping uncontrollably from where pressure was placed on a muscle.
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D
That's exactly right. I had had experience with that with clients and then myself receiving massage. That happened to me a few times. Or I'd start crying. Not because I was in pain. It was, you know.
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A
And did you know exactly where the emotion was coming from?
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D
Yeah, it was grief.
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A
I had a situation one time when I was trying to chase down what was going on with some chronic pain, and I was onto my 37th medical practitioner. I mean, I was out in the woods now. I mean, I was long past the orthodox guys. I'd already been to the Mayo, and I had someone say to me, you know what you ought to do? You ought to go find out what was going on when your mom was pregnant with you in her belly. And I said, what?
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D
What?
- [35:55]
A
What, what, what, what, what? And they said, yeah, you know, a lot of times what people are dealing with later in life can go all the way back to when they were in the womb. Who knows what your mom was dealing with? You took all that in. You should ask her about that. And I thought, well, that's one area I haven't explored. I haven't done that. And I haven't tried the treatment where you stand below a second story window and someone drops grapefruit on your head. Those were the remaining two I hadn't tried. So I took my mom out to lunch, and I said, mom, a certain alternative medical practitioner would like to know what was going on with you when I was inside your belly. What was going on? And she said, well, it was one of the worst stretches of my life, Tom. I had a mentally handicapped sister and My mom had a slew of kids. Kids were everywhere. And this particular kid was pretty rough to raise in the midst of raising all the other kids. It was a pretty intense experience trying to deal with her along with another kid who had polio and then the rest of us who were just hellions. And she placed her daughter in a home when she was pregnant with me. Just couldn't deal with it. And the entire nine months that I was inside her, she was absolutely wrecked with guilt and stress and shame and this horrible sense that she had failed her daughter, putting her into a home, and what kind of mother was she? And it was just. Just a terrible, terrible, terrible stretch. And she said, when you were born, all you did was cry. That's the story of your life the first year. So I said, well, that's going to be interesting for me to pass along to the folks at the grapefruit dropping joint. Anyway, it was interesting to learn that. And, you know, who knows what that did? But anyway, after I was born, she said, that's it. She went back to that home and got her the heck out of there. And she raised her. She wasn't gonna shirk what she thought was her responsibility. And I'm sure the kid was better for it. My sister ended up advancing in ways doctors said she never would. She ended up doing things doctors said she never could. And as an adult, she ended up living a semi independent life, which would have been thought of as impossible when she was a little kid just banging her head on a wall all day. So that's a story about different ways, you know, and the Chinese have. I believe the Chinese in traditional Chinese medicine, believe that all the different organs represent different emotions. I seem to recall that the liver represents rage, which makes me really worry about all the drinking being done in this country. We're kind of an angry country more so lately. Well, the drinking's been picking up, I think. So you guys just got back from. Say the name of the place again. Las Cruces.
- [39:09]
D
Las Cruces. Friends of ours have a home down there and they're selling it. So they said, you gotta come down one more time before we sell it. So that's what we did.
- [39:19]
A
Are they moving to Tucson?
- [39:22]
D
So they're originally from here and moved to Las Cruces. And then they thought the winters were too cold in Las Cruces.
- [39:31]
A
Oh, dear God. Oh, dear God.
- [39:33]
D
I know another home in Tucson. It's hilarious.
- [39:41]
A
What has happened.
- [39:42]
D
Pretty much everybody's reaction when they hear that.
- [39:45]
A
Were they really raised in Minnesota? Were these People truly raised in Minnesota.
- [39:50]
D
Yes.
- [39:50]
A
I wonder if it isn't just that they looked around and said, you know, people are old here, but not as old as we like them. Let's go to Arizona. You ought to just dig a hole between here and Tucson. They're never even going to make it all the way there. Well, I'm going to let you relax and get back to your life.
- [40:08]
D
Thank you for calling me, Tommy. Thank you so much.
- [40:11]
A
Oh, it's so good to hear your voice. And thanks for letting me know who you were. Welcome back. Great visiting with you.
- [40:17]
D
You too, Tommy. Take care.
- [40:19]
A
So long. The Wellshire Memory Care center was built for this reason. The family behind it had a loved one needing to be placed in a memory care center. They didn't like the options. They didn't think any of them had the kind of quality care they wanted for their loved ones. So they decided to get into the memory care business and they built a state of the art facility that they would have been proud to call home for a person they cared about. The Wellshire is home for all sorts of people with dementia and Alzheimer's. And it feels like home. And the people are treated as if they are home. As if staff is family. The coffee shop, the cinema, the salon, the library, every hallway, every desk, every. Every staff member, every live music performer, all of it focusing on people with memory care needs. That's what the family behind the Wellshire wanted for their loved one and could not find. So they created it for you with your loved one so you can feel like you're placing them somewhere that is home. The Wellshire Memory Care center of Medina and Bloomington.
- [41:34]
B
You're listening to this podcast, so I know you've got a curious mind. Here's a helpful fact you might not know yet. Drivers who switch and save with Progressive save over $900 on average. Pop over to progressive.com, answer some questions and you'll get a quick quote with discounts that are easy to come by. In fact, 99% of their auto customers earn at least one discount. Visit progressive.com and see if you can enjoy a little cash back. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates. National average 12 month savings of $946 by new customers surveyed who saved with Progressive between June 2024 and May 2025. Potential savings will vary.
- [42:48]
A
Let's go back to the phones, get ourselves another listener. Fire up that old gonculator. Let's see who we have. Josh. It's the good old one syllable names today. Kate. Josh. Solid names. Let's find out if Josh is.
- [43:34]
C
Is this mishke?
- [43:35]
A
Sure is.
- [43:37]
C
Oh my God. How are you doing? I've been getting phone calls from St. Paul for a couple weeks. They're all spam because I don't live in St. Paul anymore, but I'm answering
- [43:51]
A
them every now and then. A call from St. Paul is from a warm blooded, good hearted soul. Just looking for conversation.
- [44:02]
C
Awesome.
- [44:03]
A
What's the most interesting thing about you?
- [44:06]
C
Oh my God. I don't know how to answer that kind of question.
- [44:09]
A
Is there anything interesting about you?
- [44:12]
C
I think I lead an interesting and rich life, but if I try to like start naming those things, it all starts to sound kind of mundane.
- [44:19]
A
And the problem is you're thinking in terms of what's interesting to you. And you got to think about the people out there listening. You got to think about them. What they like is the dark underbelly.
- [44:30]
C
The dark underbelly.
- [44:32]
A
Have you ever done time?
- [44:33]
C
No.
- [44:34]
A
What's the closest you've ever come to death?
- [44:38]
C
Well, that one's a little easier. I was stupid enough to get in a canoe on the Upper Yakima river with a friend and almost no preparation. Luckily we were wearing life jackets and were able to not die that day. But we spent plenty of time and too much time in the water chasing our canoe down a river that we had no business being on.
- [45:00]
A
Part of me wishes you would have drowned and then been revived by your pal and I could have talked to you about that experience.
- [45:07]
C
That would make for better radio.
- [45:09]
A
All my life I've read stories about people in the state of Minnesota or Wisconsin who are out in a canoe and they fall out of their canoe and they drown. And we learn in the article that they didn't know how to swim. Now they were not wearing a life jacket. I have to get myself in the mind of someone who doesn't know how to swim. If I don't know how to swim and I'm in a canoe, I'm terrified. These people are saying to themselves, what could possibly go wrong? Meanwhile, a wind comes up, the weather changes, they get up or shift a little bit. Those tippy tippy canoes.
- [45:51]
C
Did you hear about that guy in Wisconsin who faked his death and tried to leave his family? And I think he went and like hooked up with a lady and Georgia or Ukraine, someplace over there. And then it took them years to figure out that this guy had actually had an elaborate plot to fake his death and leave his family.
- [46:08]
A
A lot of people think it's hard to fake your death, but Let me show you how easy it is.
- [46:15]
C
Okay.
- [46:16]
A
I'm going to fake my death right now. Okay. Are you ready?
- [46:21]
C
I'm ready.
- [46:21]
A
Okay.
- [46:32]
C
I expected a little more dramatics. Oh, he's still doing it. This is the part where everybody leans in to see if their radio is still working or if this is the show. Well, coincidentally, I started reading Agent Zoe months ago on your recommendation, and I happened to finish that book just this morning. Awesome recommendation there. All right.
- [47:21]
A
That was awkward. A little bit,
- [47:26]
C
yeah. Yeah. I mean, it was. It was a little weird, but that's
- [47:30]
A
exactly what would happen were I to actually suddenly die while talking to you. It would be identical to that. So I thought it was important to give you a chance to react as you would were I to have actually died. Let's face it, you would have done nothing more than gone on with your day.
- [47:49]
C
Um, I hate to say it, but probably I would have assumed we got cut off, which would be such an awful way for that to go.
- [47:56]
A
Now you can understand why I wanted you to drown.
- [48:00]
C
I'm such a bastard.
- [48:02]
A
So what do you do for a living?
- [48:04]
C
I teach at a college. I'm out in Washington State.
- [48:07]
A
I'm calling you in good old Washington state.
- [48:10]
C
Yep.
- [48:11]
A
And you are Professor Josh.
- [48:15]
C
Yeah.
- [48:16]
A
What do you teach?
- [48:18]
C
I teach technical writing.
- [48:20]
A
Technical writing has always intrigued me because it sounds like writing, except for that other word.
- [48:27]
C
No, it's definitely writing, but it's more technical.
- [48:31]
A
Yeah, well, the other word really changes it. So what does that word do to the writing? Were I to pick up one of these technical writing novels or what would I read?
- [48:41]
C
Well, there aren't any novels. My first job was in radio. I was a reporter for South Dakota Public Radio. Did the news there for about four years. Moved out to Minnesota. Had a hard time segueing that public radio work into more public radio work. I did actually come down and do an interview with the folks when I don't know if KSTP still has what they called the women's station back in the early 2000s. Had an interview there but didn't get the job and looked around and thought, well, I gotta do something. So I ended up kind of sidelining myself over into technical writing because I wrote a lot as a radio reporter and then found that pretty interesting and found some opportunities at the University of Minnesota to continue my education and followed those until I ended up here in Ellensburg, Washington.
- [49:30]
A
They still have the women's station here. It's 20ft outside my door here. 20ft outside my door is a door to another studio. And it's the studio that I used to broadcast from when I was with KSTP radio. So they've changed that over to the Women's Talk Station, FM107.FM107, that's what it was. Not only are there women in there right now, I can look through my little window and see their on air light. They worry about me in a way that's uncomfortable for me. Have you seen the logo for my show? It's a street lamp with a pair of headphones hanging over it.
- [50:12]
C
Okay. Okay.
- [50:14]
A
And that's it. It's just a street light. And on the post hanging is a headset. And that's it. And then it just says mishke. Well, around here there's a hallway with big posters for everybody's show. It's sort of like the walk of fame. You walk down that hallway and show after show is featured on either side of you as you walk. And everybody has this elaborate presentation with photographs and lots of words and colors splashed all over. And then they come to mine and it's just this white background with a black pole of a street lamp, my name and headphones. Well, at the women's station, they think, who's that guy? Everybody else looks more like your classic afternoon drive. Or there's these sports posters with sports guys and they're very colorful and elaborate. And so the women at this station have decided that the guy who has just the light post and his name and nothing else is a serial killer. They told me that they make up all sorts of stuff about me. They don't know me. They have no idea who I am. They're young women. They weren't even alive when I got into radio. And they sit around and talk about the guy with the weird poster in the hallway with just a light post. What happens on that guy's program. I've heard this from several people now. I don't go introduce myself or try to defend myself or say, you ought to listen to my show. I'm at the far end of a dead end hallway here. It says the old outpost on the door. And you come inside and it doesn't look like anybody else's studio in this building or in any building in America. It looks like about 1967 in here. And they periodically come down and just look in my window. I've been thinking about putting a curtain on the door window, but they poke their head up into the window and look in. And when I look over, they dart away and head back into their studio. And I can hear them Chattering Anyway, so, yeah, there's definitely a women's station. Oh, man, I had to go in there sometime and do what I did when I was on the radio. When I was on the radio, I busted in and I said, get out of here. Go down to my microphone. I'm taking over your show. And they went down to my show, and I took over their show. And let me tell you something, the guys who listened to me, they liked the women who came down and took over my microphone. The women, when I was talking, they didn't care for that at all. They didn't like me taking over their show at all. Really. There's a lesson there. There's a lesson there. Think about it. Say there's a women's bar, and then there's a guy's bar, okay? So all the women are in the women's bar and the guys are in the guy's bar. And say a bunch of guys crash into the women's bar one afternoon, Hey, I want some beer. The women would not be happy about that. Now imagine at the guy's bar, a bunch of women come in. The guys would be ecstatic. See the difference?
- [53:31]
C
Yeah.
- [53:32]
D
Yeah.
- [53:33]
A
Anyway, there's a lesson there. I'm not sure what it is. Yeah, you must have some stories from South Dakota radio. Just saying South Dakota radio makes me think there's a dozen stories right there.
- [53:45]
C
We used to have a bully of a governor. I don't know if you remember him, Bill Janklo. I went to interview that guy once, and I had a fancy new digital recorder that the studio had bought for me, and I brought it out there, and I hadn't charged the battery, so I chased this guy down. There was a big fire in the Black Hills, and I chased Bill Janklo down for the interview and caught up to him and sat down in this coffee shop and pointed the microphone at him, and he Talked for about 30 seconds before that battery died. And I looked up at him and I thought, there is no way I'm telling this guy that my battery died. So I interviewed him for, like, another 20 minutes with no battery. Said, okay, thanks a lot, governor.
- [54:21]
A
There are so many times in life similar to that, I think, for all of us where we do something to cover ourselves and to save face. That is awkward as hell, but we're doing it. Could I give you an example of a woman I know who had to do something and you're going to say afterwards, mishke, that story was nothing like mine, and it is nothing like yours, but I'M thinking of saving face, the things we have to do in life. So I know a woman, a lovely woman. Now, if I said too much about her, I would begin to give away her identity. She played a prominent role in political circles, not only here in the Twin Cities, but ultimately out in Washington, D.C. i know her, and that's why I know this story. She was at a dinner party, having a lovely meal at a fancy house on Summit Avenue in St. Paul when she excused herself to use the bathroom. She went upstairs into the bathroom and proceeded to have a bowel movement. The problem was it was a little too large and would not flush. Everyone knew she had excused herself to go up to the bathroom, and it wasn't a large enough party where it wouldn't be obvious who had last used the bathroom were she to simply wander back down, leaving it there. She tried several times to flush it. It wouldn't flush. And actually, the last time, the toilet overflowed a bit and she spent a lot of time cleaning it up. But she still had the initial problem of getting that darn thing flushed. She decided eventually that in order to save face here, she decided she needed to remove that item in that toilet. There was a window in the bathroom that if you opened it up, you could reach out to the roof, and the roof had some snow on it. So she opened the window, opened the storm, removed from the toilet the item, and set it on the snow on the roof outside the window of the bathroom, and then grabbed little pieces of snow to cover it, to cover it up. As she covered it, the snow melted because that item can be a little warm, you know. And she got more snow and covered it some more. And only when she finally had it all covered did she close the storm and close the window and then return as if nothing had happened. Now, wintertime, that baby's gonna be there a while. Eventually, on a warm winter day, the snow melted around it, and the homeowner looked out the window one afternoon and saw it sitting there very large, very large. That's why it plugged up that toilet. And he could not, for the life of him, figure out what animal could have possibly been up on the roof and done that. That's larger than what a bear would leave. So that's what I was reminded of when you told your story. Well, I'll tell you, Josh, I've enjoyed our little chat.
- [57:43]
C
Me, too.
- [57:44]
A
I'm glad to hear that you are a listener of the show from way out in Washington.
- [57:49]
C
We used to listen to you on AM 1500, but the first time I ever heard you was in Spearfish, S.D. at night. We could catch AM waves from St. Paul all the way out and Spearfish. So we would catch the show that way.
- [58:03]
A
One of the glorious things about radio, and I'm glad I lived in a time when there was radio, because the magic of the bounce or the skip.
- [58:11]
C
Yeah.
- [58:12]
A
The signal would go bouncing across the land after dark. You would maybe miss Iowa, but you would hit Nebraska. You would miss western Minnesota, but you would hit the Dakotas. You would miss sometimes part of the Dakotas, but you would hit Montana.
- [58:29]
C
It was crazy.
- [58:30]
A
It was wild. And then when I got to wcco, well, that's a clear channel station. They didn't bring their wattage down after dark. They would get in the winter time. In the winter, it really traveled. They would get 30 states and sometimes you'd get someone who was hearing it for the first time because it had never gotten to their state before or their city or town or it had a few times, but they weren't listening then and they didn't know what they were hearing.
- [58:56]
C
Yeah, yeah. Nowadays so much is all the same. And back then you could hear some awesome, interesting people on the radio driving across at night, just sort of scanning through the AM dial, see who you pick up. You hear all kinds of crazy stuff driving at night that way.
- [59:12]
A
The 90s into the 2000s were a magical, magical time in AM radio in America. Well, thank you for taking all this time to talk to me. I'm most grateful to you.
- [59:24]
C
It's been fun. I'm so glad I picked up this call.
- [59:27]
A
I hope to talk to you again sometime.
- [59:29]
C
Call me anytime. I Take care. Bye.
- [59:32]
A
So long.