Nothing Was Ever “Just Right” For Alex Anele's OCD

Summary

Podcast Summary: Get to Know OCD

Episode: Nothing Was Ever “Just Right” For Alex Anele's OCD
Host: Dr. Patrick McGrath (Chief Clinical Officer, NOCD)
Guest: Alexandra Anele (YouTuber, Beauty Content Creator)
Date: February 1, 2026

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Main Theme

This episode centers on Alexandra Anele's personal journey living with OCD—particularly struggles with "just right" and perfectionistic compulsions. She discusses discovering her symptoms, the impact on her work and life, misconceptions about OCD, and her transformative experience with Exposure and Response Prevention (ERP) therapy. The conversation emphasizes the broader emotional toll of OCD (including shame and guilt), the process of seeking help, and the power of self-compassion.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Alexandra’s Early OCD Experiences

• Earliest Symptoms: Counting, color-coordinating candy as a child ([04:05]).

• High School Onset: Obsessions with cleanliness, especially regarding dishes and glassware in restaurants; avoidance behaviors became increasingly disruptive ([04:12]).

  “It started to really affect my life and also…the people around me, because we would have to leave a restaurant.” – Alexandra ([04:30])

• Delayed Recognition: Initially thought her behaviors were normal or simply “grossed out.” Only later considered OCD after seeing NOCD ads referencing her experiences with CBT ([05:27]).

Misconceptions About OCD

• Many assume OCD is just about hand washing or checking, missing its pervasive impact ([03:09]).
• Alexandra shares how her own understanding shifted from stereotypes to recognizing OCD's reach into almost every aspect of her life ([03:31]).

The Immense Impact on Daily Life

• “Just right” and “perfectionistic” compulsions profoundly interfered with Alexandra’s life:

  • Became paralyzing and prevented her from working, socializing, or even completing simple household tasks ([10:47], [11:33]).
  • Created a feedback loop of shame and anxiety.

  “Things need to be just right—has been crippling, especially in the last like four years for me. It's prevented me from being able to get work done. It's prevented me from being social.” – Alexandra ([11:33])

• Shame, guilt, disgust are equally as central as anxiety:

  “…It's not that you're just going to be anxious and you're doing these compulsions to stop anxiety, you are also going to do it to stop guilt and shame.” – Dr. McGrath ([12:38])

The Experience with ERP Therapy

• Initial anticipation of ERP (Exposure and Response Prevention) is much worse than the reality ([07:13]).

  “The anticipation was so much worse than what you experienced. And you are able to move through that and you find this sense of calm.” – Alexandra ([07:32])

• ERP provided Alexandra with tangible, immediate relief—contrasting with years of less effective CBT ([07:44]).

  “ERP gave me something tangible...I felt something real here. I felt this actual moment of relief.” – Alexandra ([07:50])

• Letting go of “safety behaviors” (like deep breathing or muscle relaxation) only truly helped once she stopped seeing them as solutions ([09:08]).

How OCD Affected Her Work as a Content Creator

• Self-employment and control over her environment heightened her “just right” compulsions ([10:40]).

• Symmetry OCD even impacted her makeup routines and video production:

  “I struggle a lot with symmetry OCD. And...how that symmetry OCD affects me doing my makeup.” – Alexandra ([27:07])

• Clutter or minor disorder in her home could block her from even starting creative work ([27:04]).

Positive Changes After Treatment

• Marked reduction in the “noise” and anxiety in daily life ([15:00]).

  “Overall, I think with the ERP...the noise in my head that used to exist has been brought down significantly.” – Alexandra ([15:00])

• Now able to function more confidently and comfortably—e.g., can eat and drink at restaurants without obsessive anxiety ([29:28]).

• Greater ability to be present:

  “Now being present is—it feels natural. It feels like I'm not forcing myself.” – Alexandra ([30:57])

Self-Compassion and the Emotional Journey

• Recognizing and working through decades of shame, and learning self-compassion, was a turning point ([14:01], [37:33]).

  “That self compassion, being able to tap into that…has been life changing.” – Alexandra ([38:19])

• Self-acceptance and not letting OCD define self-worth is a major takeaway ([40:17]).

Advice for Others

• Don't delay seeking help out of pride or fear; trying the “same things” won’t magically start working ([36:12]).

  “At some point, you reach a point where you—you can't do it by yourself.” – Alexandra ([32:56])

• ERP/Therapy is less terrifying than anticipated and support matters, especially from professionals who understand OCD ([24:15]).

• Working with a therapist helps expose suppressed emotions and is more effective than attempting exposures alone ([32:09]).

• For those doubting their symptoms are “bad enough” or those hesitating to get help:

  “…If you feel like you resonate at all with any of the things that I say, just give it a Google…seek out some kind of ERP therapy because it's so life changing and you're never going to know until you just give it a shot.” – Alexandra ([22:58])

Accessing Effective Treatment

• Alexandra discovered NOCD through online ads and emphasizes the importance of accessible, specialized care ([20:49]).
• Notes challenges for those without insurance, highlighting the need for broader accessibility ([21:15]).
• Praises NOCD’s customer service and therapist-matching process ([32:56]).

Reflections on Progress

• There’s no “cure”—OCD is chronic, but with ongoing support and ERP, it is manageable ([34:49], [37:00]).

  “Try different, not harder.” – Dr. McGrath ([37:00])

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "That idea that things need to be just right has been crippling… It’s prevented me from being able to get work done…It just feeds the OCD." – Alexandra ([00:00], [11:33])

• "The anticipation is what is so terrifying…once you actually experience ERP…you realize the anticipation was so much worse than what you experienced." – Alexandra ([07:13])

• “OCD will use any emotion that it possibly can in order to get you to do a compulsion.” – Dr. McGrath ([12:38])

• “No, exactly, exactly.” – Alexandra, when asked if OCD will ever be satisfied ([19:21])

• "Try different, not harder." – Dr. McGrath ([37:00])

• "Now being present is—it feels natural. It feels like I'm not forcing myself." – Alexandra ([30:57])

• "That self compassion, being able to tap into that when I have a negative thought…Has been life changing." – Alexandra ([38:19])

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Important Timestamps by Topic

• 00:00 – Alexandra describes the crippling need for things to be “just right”
• 04:05 – Early childhood OCD symptoms, onset of “contamination” obsession
• 07:13 – Alexandra describes ERP; the role of anticipatory anxiety
• 10:40 – Impact of OCD on daily life and creative work
• 12:38 – Shame and other emotions in OCD discussed
• 15:00 – Improvements and the effect of ERP on anxiety levels
• 17:22 – Alexandra discusses learning to trust her own body/mind versus OCD’s doubts
• 22:58 – Advice for those hesitant about seeking help
• 27:07 – Symmetry OCD’s influence on makeup and work
• 29:28 – Living life post-ERP; newfound ability to participate in daily activities
• 32:56 – Working with therapists; importance of support, customer service experiences
• 37:00 – On trying different approaches, not harder (“Try different, not harder.”)
• 38:19 – Reflection on self-compassion as critical to recovery

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Tone and Style

• Warm, candid, and encouraging. Alexandra is honest about challenges but speaks with hope and tangible optimism. Dr. McGrath is supportive, validating, and injects humor and professional insights.

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Conclusion & Takeaways

Alexandra’s journey powerfully illustrates the complexity of OCD—how it extends far beyond stereotypes, embedding itself in daily routines, relationships, and self-image. She highlights the relief and life change possible with the right treatment (ERP), honest self-reflection, and self-compassion. Her advice: Don’t wait, seek help, and release the myth that you have to do it alone or “just try harder.” Support is available, and progress—even comfort—is possible.

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Where to Find Alexandra Anele

• On all major social apps under “Alexandra Anele” ([41:11])

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“Be better to yourself than your OCD ever will be.” – Dr. McGrath ([41:15])

Transcript

[Alexandra Anale]

Being a YouTuber, I definitely struggle with things being just right. I mean, that idea that things need to be just right has been crippling. And it's prevented me from being able to get work done. It's prevented me from being social. What that causes is just this sort of paralyzing feeling where nothing, nothing can happen. I can do nothing. It's really easy to be influenced by looking at other people and seeing that they have it together and think I need to be doing those things. Or if in my case, and I'm sure a lot of people can relate to this, I'm not doing enough. And if I'm doing something, I'm not doing it well enough and I need to be doing it more, which is so overwhelming. And I finally got to the point where I was just like, I can't. Like, whatever I'm doing, it's not working. It's not working. So I have to try something else. At some point, you reach a point where you. You can't do it by yourself.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Foreign. Hi, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the get to Know OCD Podcast. My name is Dr. Patrick McGrath. I'm the chief Clinical officer for NOCD and your host. If you're looking for help for OCD or related conditions, check us [e-mail] that's n o c d dot com. And if you like the Get To Know OCD podcast, well, you can subscribe on our NOCD YouTube channel. Today I'm joined by Alexandra Anale. Hello. How are you today?

[Alexandra Anale]

I'm great. How are you? Thank you so much for having me.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

You are a YouTuber. You have content, you do all sorts of cool stuff with makeup and beauty things that people might say I could use some. Who knows? But tell us what brings you as a beauty and makeup content creator to the get to Know OCD podcast?

[Alexandra Anale]

Well, so I have. I have been living with OCD for most of my life, surprisingly.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Have you told it to go away at all? I'm just curious. Have you?

[Alexandra Anale]

You know, once I figured out what it was. Okay. Once I figured out what it was. I did try that. It didn't seem to work.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

It doesn't work, does it all? I apologize. I interrupted you. I'm sorry. But I always. I like to ask that question.

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah, yeah. But I have a. I've talked about it a little bit. I. I'm trying to think of, like, how long I've been in treatment for it now, but long enough to. To have experienced major results with erp, and I've Talked about it a bit on my channel, and I've had quite a lot of. Of people resonating with. With my experience. Wow. Okay. And I would say people who. Who, like me, were not necessarily aware of ocd, exactly what it was and how it was affecting their life.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Do you find, as someone with OCD who's come out with your ocd, see surprise when people learn that it's more than just washing your hands or checking the locks?

[Alexandra Anale]

Absolutely. I. I think the idea that a lot of people, and actually recently was on a trip visiting my boyfriend's family, a lot of people, we had this conversation, and a lot of people, they kind of have this idea of, like, I have to tap, you know, the door three times before I leave the house or flip the light switch. And it's interesting because that was. That was kind of my idea of it. And it's. It's so much. It's so much bigger than that, and there's so much more of a spectrum. And I think in general, the thing that shocked me the most and the thing that ends up shocking a lot of people is how much. How it's very much embedded in almost every single aspect of your life.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

So as much as you're comfortable, I'd love to hear just what was the evolution of your OCD experience that led you to finally get a diagnosis, get treatment, and be here today?

[Alexandra Anale]

So I would say, like, if I think back to my earliest symptoms, the. The earliest I can remember is kind of being a kid and sort of like counting and color, correct color, coordinating my M and Ms. Or my Skittles. And, you know, it was one of those things that didn't really, like, stand out to me for a very long time. And still, until I started reflecting and I understood a little bit more. My main. Probably my biggest struggle with OCD began in high school around contamination cleanliness. For me specifically, it manifests around needing to control how the cleanliness of the dishes that I eat off of. So silverware, dishware, glassware. And that really snowballed. It began in high school, and it really snowballed to the point where I was leaving restaurants if I sat down and didn't like the look of the silverware or if there was a little smudge on a glass. And it started to really affect my. My life and also, you know, the people around me, because we would have to leave a restaurant. And that's. That's really where it began. And I wasn't necessarily. I wasn't necessarily aware of that being ocd. I Kind of thought it was just, well, you know, that's a gross thing that most people should, should feel the same way. And so I didn't really think much about it until many years later. And it was. Honestly, I think, you know, I kind of had maybe a sense because of comments that I'd received from some people that maybe I had some, you know, obsessive tendencies. But it wasn't until I saw an ad for no CD on YouTube and it reflected very much my experience with CBT therapy, which I had been doing for about eight months for, you know, anxiety and depression. And one of the things that in the ad it said was that, you know, traditional CBT therapy can, can increase symptoms of ocd. And in the last, I did it for about eight months and in the last four months of my CBT therapy I felt such an increase in my anxiety. And at the time I didn't really connect that to O C D. Sure. But when I saw that ad, I thought, oh, maybe this is something that I could try. And I reached out, made an appointment and I mean, the rest is history. Like I've been, I've been doing it ever since. So.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

So people, I thank you for that story. And people will sometimes hear about ERP and maybe be a little wary or frightened of it. Can you maybe put some rumors to rest or just tell people what was it like to actually do good evidence based ERP care for ocd?

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah. So it is really scary. I mean, the beginning, it's really scary. And it's the idea of it. And what I think you come to learn is that the anticipation is what is so terrifying. And it really, it really is the anticipation. It's that feeling that you get. And once you, once you actually experience ERP when you experience the exposure with a licensed professional and you are able to sort of like move through that wave as you come to the other side, you realize the anticipation was so much worse than what you experienced. And you are able to move through that and you find this sense of calm. One of the things that, that blew my mind because I had sort of had this experience with CBT therapy was that ERP gave me something tangible that it gave me this like this idea that, oh, I felt something real here. I felt this actual moment of relief that now I know it's. It. It makes more sense to me to be able to see the other side that I. This is something that I can continue to work on and I can finally find peace and that anxiety can come down. And it was incredible because I felt it immediately. The first ERP session that I had, I was like, oh, I see this now. When eight years of CBT therapy was just kind of like, I, I get it. Like I can conceptualize it, but I can't get there. Why can't I get there?

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Yeah. Was it weird to give up safety behaviors that you've probably been taught, like things like diaphragmatic breathing and muscle relaxation, which people will tell you, oh, when you're uncomfortable, do these things that'll make it better. And yet in ocd, it seems to keep you st action.

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah, I think, yeah, I think my. It's interesting because you're sort of your, your, the way the lens with, through you're looking to, at just life in general has such a huge impact, I think, on how you interpret those things. So if you are looking at things life like, oh, you know, just doing some, some breathing is going to fix me or is going to. Yeah, is going to fix me and make me feel better. It doesn't. It ends up just sort of like pushing everything down and to the side and it just increases. It's sort of like a band aid over a bullet hole. And that's not gonna work. So once you are able to sort of like shift your mentality, I think, and understand that just breathing, just doing breathing exercises isn't actually going to be addressing the underlying issue, then you can come back to things like that eventually and you'll have a completely different perspective. And they may actually, you know, provide a sense of relief in a situation where, you know, you, you are feeling a little bit stressed and need to meditate, but you're not putting everything on that action as if it's going to heal. All these years of, you know, anxiety and trauma, whatever it might be that led to your OCD symptoms.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

How much did OCD interfere in your day to day life and in your confidence in the work that you do?

[Alexandra Anale]

Well, there's a lot there.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

I'll sit back and listen. Go ahead. You just take it away.

[Alexandra Anale]

How much time do we have? Yeah. So in terms of my day to day life, I would say, you know, being a YouTuber, I'm self employed, I work from home, I have all the control over my schedule, over, you know, what time I'm doing things, over whether or not I am working or focusing on home things. And if I definitely struggle with the just right, with things being just right, um, which I never really, I never really connected with the idea of perfectionism until it was described to me as, you know, maybe not perfectionism, but things need to be a specific way. They need to be right.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Yeah.

[Alexandra Anale]

And that has been, I mean that idea that things need to be just right has been in crippling, especially in the last like four years for me. And it's prevented me from being able to get work done. It's prevented me from being social. It's prevented me from being able to get, you know, tasks around the house done. Things that are, that should, from the outside might look extremely simple, like, you know, folding laundry or vacuuming or something. It's prevented me from being able to get those things done. And what that causes is just this sort of paralyzing feeling where nothing, nothing can happen, I can do nothing, which sort of creates this feedback loop of shame. And it just, they just, it just feeds, it feeds the ocd. The OCD feeds the shame and it just continues. So I would say in terms of like affecting my daily life, it was, it was all encompassing for at least a few years.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Well, I'm going to actually pause on that because I'm glad that you said shame because a lot of people think of OCD as anxiety, but it's also shame and guilt and disgust and other things too. So I think it's really important to highlight the fact that it's not that you're just going to be anxious and you're doing these compulsions to stop anxiety, you are also going to do it to stop guilt and shame. Because OCD is a jerk and will use any emotion that it possibly can in order to get you to do a compulsion.

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah, absolutely. I, I think for me in particular, really diving into that shame and guilt is a feeling that I, that I felt my whole life and couldn't really understand why. And experiencing the ocd, experiencing, sorry, the erp, it really, it really just shone a light on the, on the shame and the guilt and how much they control. How much they control my life and like I said, provided so much relief from those things.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

And isn't it interesting, I'm going to assume looking back, there was nothing to be ashamed of, but OCD sure does create this thing that feels so very real. Right to you?

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah, absolutely. And that takes, it takes a lot of undoing. Like it, I. It takes so much work when you have been living, you know, 34 years of, of just shame and guilt for when you learn later on, you know that self compassion isn't a bad thing, that you, you've been living with this and that it really just is keeping you in this place where it's that, like I said, continual feedback loop of shame and guilt.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Yeah, yeah, ocd. Not, not a fan of it, I'll tell you, ocd. Not, not a fan of that OCD thing. So. Okay, so the second part was, you know, comparing now, like being able to do your YouTube work, OCD will, I'm assuming, still try to lob a grenade at you now and then. What's different today than before treatment?

[Alexandra Anale]

So I think in general I've experienced like quite a bit of a comedown when it comes to my overall anxiety. I would say like the noise in my head that used to exist has been brought down significantly. So overall, I think with the erp, you know, starting at. And I don't know if you want to explain this here, you'd be better at it than me. But starting with, you know, things that might, exposures that might be a 1 or a 2 or a 3 and sort of work way up to the tens. Doing that gradually has sort of just brought everything down. So overall in my day to day, I'm just not experiencing that noise as much. There are moments when, you know, things start to pop up a little bit.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Sure.

[Alexandra Anale]

And I think that's where the self compassion work really comes in. Sort of recognizing that, you know, these things are things that are going to be something that I have to deal with probably for the rest of my life, but it's not going to be as heightened as always. And when they do pop up, I have the tools to be able to actually confront them and it's not going to destroy me, not going to bring me down to this low where I'm just going to live forever.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Right. Yeah. And we do it gradually. Right. We're not throwing people in the deep end of the pool and telling someone to figure out how to swim. We're going to stick a toe in the water and see how it feels. So that's that gradual exposure work. And really sometimes people will talk about, oh, you did exposure therapy, but it's really exposure and response prevention therapy because you were being exposed all of the time to your obsessions. If, if just being exposed to them was helpful, you, you wouldn't have needed therapy by any.

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah. So.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

I really appreciate there's, there's a quote we pulled of something that you said once. It's. Listening to your body can be moot if you don't know what you're listening for. I wonder if you could share kind of more about that. And as you were experiencing OCD and anxiety and then finally got into treatment, what did you kind of learn from, from that experience about being able to trust your own mind, trust your own body? Because OCD will put doubts into everything, of course.

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah. I think, I think in general, my outlook was always very negative, very like doomsday. And I think, you know, we're not people in general. We're not truth seeking. We're inherently comfort seeking. And if you have a confirm confirmation bias, like we all do, you know, you could think that you have some kind of an ailment. And if you've decided that that's what it is, you're going to be looking for evidence of that rather than, you know, maybe going to your doctor and getting, you know, test results and then find. Having the actual data to find out what's actually going on. And I think that that is what I spent a lot of time doing. I didn't know, I didn't understand what I was listening for. And a lot of it was, like we mentioned earlier, sort of like addressing the symptoms. And my response would always be to look for those. Like, look for those band aids, essentially. And I would force myself to, okay, now I need to be, you know, the most organized person. And especially in this day and age with the Internet and influencers, me being one of them, you know, we have like, fitness influencers and people are showing you, like, what you should be eating and things like that. And it's sort of, I think with someone who has compulsions and has that shame and that deep shame and guilt, it's really easy to be influenced by looking at other people and seeing that they have it together and think I need to be doing those things. Or if, in my case, and I'm sure a lot of people can relate to this, I'm not doing enough. And if I'm doing something, I'm not doing it well enough, and I need to be doing it more, which is so overwhelming.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

But isn't that ocd, Right? It's. Could you ever do enough for ocd?

[Alexandra Anale]

No, exactly, exactly.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

It's. Yeah, it's. It's trying to feed something that's got an eternal hunger. Right? Just. You'll, you'll never, you'll never give it enough. And I think that that's something that, that I've said recently to a lot of people. I, I wonder how you resonate with this. Maybe the greatest lie of OCD is that you can achieve something when the reality is OCD set it up to never cross the finish line.

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah, absolutely. I think it's. It is, it is, and it, it Gives you this. It gives you this empty feeling like I. This is something that I need. This is a hole that I need to fill, and I need to keep going and keep going and keep going, and. And the bar just keeps getting higher and higher and higher, and you'll never reach it.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Getting access to treatment can be difficult. How was it for you? You said you saw one of our ads, so that's cool. But you'd also been doing therapy for a long time without somebody potentially acknowledging that OCD was actually playing a role in what was going on. I'm assuming there were some frustrations with that along the way and, and sometimes relief when you finally find it, but also maybe regret to the years then lost to not having done the best treatment. So how, how do you, how do you manage all that in your head?

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah, I, I, I, I mean, I am, I'm very lucky and thankful that I did come across that ad. And in. Thankfully, I mean, I think I came across a few of them, and it was sort of this thing like, you know, I watched the first one and I was like, oh, that's interesting. And then maybe I, I heard a couple other ones, and I was. It was sort of reinforcing. I think it was. It just happened to be, like, the right time for me because, like I said, I was in CBT therapy. Yeah, the first four months were okay, and then the last four months were so bad. And so I was at this point where I was just like, I need something else. And luckily this message came up that was like, here's something else. If you're going through what you're going through right now. So it was incredibly lucky. And, you know, unfortunately, I think it's really hard to get the word out to, to everyone. I would not have known if I had not. If I had not come across that. Like I said, my, you know, my therapist at the time, OCD was never anything that came into the picture at all. And in terms of, you know, I'm very, very lucky. I have good insurance, and luckily it was covered. So that was also a contributing factor. I thought, you know, I saw it's covered, so, like, I might as well give it a shot and see how this goes. I can try it, but there are a lot of people who don't have insurance, and I can only imagine that if I was in that situation where I didn't, I would probably be a little bit more, you know, reluctant because I would think, well, you know, am I going to be able to pay for this? Or what? Whatever. It might be, yeah.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

It's been a goal of ours all along to try to keep it as affordable as possible. For sure. Because we know that there is good therapy out there. It's getting access to that therapy, which is really the issue for so many people.

[Alexandra Anale]

Absolutely, yeah.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

I'm assuming people reach out to you now that you've been out about your OCD story and ask you questions. What kind of things do you hear from folks who might be on the fence about treatment or if they have ocd, you know, they, they look up to you. So what do they, what do they ask you about?

[Alexandra Anale]

I think the most common thing that I receive is people who will say, you know, I think I resonate with this, but like, I don't really think that it's that bad or, you know, like, I'm dealing with it, I'm managing that kind of thing. And, you know, that's kind of how I felt. That was when it, when it, when it first even occurred to me that like, oh, maybe I have OCD was kind of like, well, you know, I'm getting through my life like I'm living and, and I had absolutely no concept of what the relief could look like. So I always, I always encourage people, if you are, if you feel like you resonate at all with any of the things that I say, just, just like give it a Google basically, like some symptoms or, or, you know, if you do have insurance, like, I always encourage people to seek out some kind of ERP therapy because it's, it's so life changing and you're never going to know until you just give it a shot.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Was that hard to give it a shot for you? I mean, because it. Oh, there's an answer. I like that one.

[Alexandra Anale]

Tell me. Without telling me.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Without telling. Yeah.

[Alexandra Anale]

I mean, reaching out felt easy and there was this little bit of hope in me that was like, oh, maybe this could be the thing. You know, thankfully it was a piece of it. But I would say that like the first, you know, in those first few appointments, you're sort of doing assessments and, you know, receiving a diagnosis and going over like, this is what it's going to look like. This is what exposures are going to look like. And I remember how terrifying I, it was to hear like, these are the exposures that we're going to do. We're going to be exposing you to the things that you've been avoiding your whole life. And I was like, what? I know that this is part of it, but it's so scary. And, you know, it is. It is really scary. But that initial feeling, like I said earlier, like, that anticipation is so much worse than what you actually experience. And the other getting to the other side is like. Is like nothing. Nothing. It's like nothing you'll ever feel.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

And did it turn out to be those things that you avoided for so long were as actually scary as your mind had built them up to be? Or was there a lot of anticipation that was in that?

[Alexandra Anale]

You know, it's interesting because there were some things that I would expect when. When we actually, you know, confronted the exposure, I. I would feel like, oh, this is so. This is like nothing. This is nothing. And then there were other things where I would be like, oh, I think that'll be like a three or something. And then I'm like. I'm at like a seven right now. So really, it's hard to know exactly what is underneath everything. And I think that that's probably, you know, like I said, it's scary. It's a lot. But the most fascinating thing about it is learning what's underneath it, because it's really. When you don't know. It's. You're so good at. At suppressing it. You're so good at, like, protecting yourself from those things, but it's not really protection. You're not actually protecting yourself. You're just. You know, at some point, it's just. It's not serving you anymore.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

You're putting off, instead of protecting.

[Alexandra Anale]

Right, Exactly.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Yeah. How did OCD interfere? Because, you know, you do a lot of work in the makeup world. I've watched some of your videos on that. And how did OCD specifically nitpick at that? Because. Because it does attack things you love or enjoy so very much. So what was it doing even in that realm of your life?

[Alexandra Anale]

I think for me, the. The things have to be just right was probably the biggest. So there were many times when I couldn't even get started filming or.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

I was wondering about that. Yeah, yeah.

[Alexandra Anale]

Oh, yeah. It was like, this is not the. Most of the time, I feel like it would be sort of like, you know, maybe not connected to specifically my. My videos, but things happening around my. My house. If there's piles of clothes on the table, if there's, you know, boxes on the ground, if, you know, there's. There. Things are in disarray. I have to get to that before I can work, which obviously just created so much more anxiety, because now I'm putting off this work that I need to be doing. But I would Say that, like, something that I've learned about myself recently is I struggle a lot with symmetry. With symmetry, ocd. And I. This is actually sort of a newer development where I'm starting to sort of think about how that symmetry OCD affects me doing my makeup.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Sure.

[Alexandra Anale]

Because I've always thought, like, well, yeah, of course I'm trying to get it symmetrical. It's makeup, you know?

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Yeah, yeah.

[Alexandra Anale]

But when you have symmetry ocd, it's like, okay, well, maybe this is something that I need to address.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Yeah. Today's eyebrow will be 0.1 millimeter high.

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Intentionally than the other. Yeah. Yeah, that's. That is interesting. Right? I mean, you. You can. You can think about the fact that in some ways, you might want somebody to do things just right. If I'm going for surgery, I sure hope my surgery does things just right, But I also hope that they're doing their surgery just right out of desire to do it, not out of ocd. Because I think you could probably think of the fact that if someone was doing something with ocd, the checking and the rechecking or something might actually then be interfering or likely is interfering in the experience. So. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. It's almost like, in a weird way, OCD offers you, hey, this will help everything turn out. It's just the worst possible way to get it to turn out that way. And people get really convinced to do it that way. How's your life? I mean, what's. What's just different now? What are just little things that you can do now that before just seems so overwhelming and difficult?

[Alexandra Anale]

Some things that I. That, like, I. For the most part, I can go to restaurants and just eat and drink.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Out of the water glass without the dishes. Okay. Yeah.

[Alexandra Anale]

That's a.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

That's a huge one.

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah, that is huge. Which has vastly improved my social life. So that anxiety is. Is vastly diminished. I would say the person who has benefited from it the most is my boyfriend, because I'm much more relaxed when it comes. When he's not putting his shoes, you know, where I decide that they need to go. Things like that. Yeah. It's so funny because I feel like that list is so incredibly long. It just leeches onto absolutely everything. So overall, I think the biggest. Like, the biggest takeaway is just that my. The noise in my head is so quiet now. It was so loud before. So loud about everything. For example, I remember just sitting on the couch trying to watch a show with my boyfriend. And at the time, I was, you know, doing some, like, interior design things. Around my apartment and he's watching this show and I'm just, look, I'm just looking at things like, can't focus. Just looking at things like, I need to change that frame. Like, if I change that frame, should I make it blue? Like, all of these, these things that just prevented me from even being in the moment and now being present is. It feels natural. It feels like I'm not forcing myself.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Yeah, it's gotta be an amazing change.

[Alexandra Anale]

It is. It, it. Yeah. I'm constant, constantly reflecting and shocked by it, to be honest.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

What advice then do you hand out to folks who again, go back and, and to. Who reach out to you? What, what's your go to advice for people who want something from you?

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah, I think in general, just like trying to understand that if. If you're. If you're in a place where you've been trying things, for instance, the band aids, and it hasn't worked for years and years and years, it's probably not going to. So I think reaching out for help from someone is something that a lot of people are very, you know, reluctant to do. And I have to admit that I was very, very reluctant to do so in the past as well. But at some point, you reach a point where you. You can't do it by yourself. And I think that. I think that I. I mean, you know, there are times for, for example, doing exposures by myself, I find very difficult.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Sure.

[Alexandra Anale]

But when I have someone to do it with, it, not only is there a bit of support, but there's also sort of this forced vulnerability where I'm. I'm much more able to tap into those feelings that I have suppressed. It's a lot easier when I'm by myself to ignore them and push them to the side. Um, so I think that people need to be. I. I mean, I would just suggest that people be more open to working with another person.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

There's that younger you who was reluctant to reach out for help. What kind of was the barrier that had to be crossed for you to finally decide it was. It was time to make a call?

[Alexandra Anale]

I think, unfortunately, it was just making the same. I don't want to call them mistakes, but, you know, they say, like, insanity is, you know, repeating the same action and hoping for a different one. It felt like that I was doing the same thing so many times. I would go through the same experiences of, you know, I don't know, feeling like this sort of, like, shame and then motivation sort of wave throughout my life, which would lead to making different decisions And I always ended up in the same place. And I finally got to the point where I was just like, I can't, like, whatever I'm doing, it's not working. It's not working. So I have to try something else. And, you know, I think a lot of people are sort of reluctant to try therapy in general because you might hear from people that, like, finding a great therapist is really hard. It's very much a relationship, and it's hard to find that connection. And I think that can also be a barrier. And it was, for me, a little bit. And you do kind of have to, like, work a little bit hard to find the right person. And actually, this is a perfect opportunity for me to say that no CD made it so easy for me to find the right person. And I have to. I have to just say that, like, in terms of customer service, there are so many companies out there who do not have good customer service. Maybe they have a good idea, terrible customer service. But I have to say every. Every moment that I've had to reach out or I'm reached out to, it has been. It's just been so easy and. And so nice. And, you know, I had a first appointment with. With someone who was okay, but it wasn't the best fit. And I immediately was reached out to. To say, you know, how was it? Do you want to find somebody else who. What exactly are you looking for? And they helped me find the perfect person. And it's been, yeah, incredible.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

That's great. That's awesome. And therapy doesn't just stop, right? I mean, the. The beauty of at least what I can say, what we offer in OCD is you can. You can be with that therapist for the rest of your life. We could do maintenance. You can message them so that there's already or always somebody in the back pocket there to. To be on your side and to help you. And. And, you know, obviously, OCD is a chronic thing. It's. It's not a I'm cured experience, that there will be waves, there will be stressors, there will be things that will get you. And we will be there to help. There are people who, you know, think, I could do this on my own. And I sometimes think that that's also one of those little lies that OCD tells you don't need a therapist. If you just do what I say, you'll. You'll. You'll get there. It'll be fine. As someone who fell for that for a while and then who finally decided they weren't going to Believe OCD anymore. Words of advice to those who are still believing ocd, hoping that today will be the day. I'll do that compulsion just right. And then everything will be okay, and then all will be well.

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah, I mean, I, like, I so understand that feeling because there's this sense of, there's this sense of like, individuality and I don't want to burden someone else and I can, like, I can do it. I can do it. And I would just say you can. Like, you can, but you're not on the right path and you have to find the right path and that path and, and finding the right person to help you along that path is, it's so invaluable. And again, you're, you won't, you won't know until you get there. So you really just have to have like a little bit of faith that trying something different might actually make a difference.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Yeah, I like to say don't try harder, try different. Right.

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah, exactly.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

As, as you said, trying harder at the thing that wasn't working just didn't work more. Right. It, it never.

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Yeah. Because sometimes people hold onto that notion that there's a flaw in me and I'm just not trying hard enough. And therefore if I try harder at what OCD tells me to do, then I can't achieve it. But that's just simply not the case. Right.

[Alexandra Anale]

Yeah. And I think that that's really where understanding shame and understanding self compassion really comes into play.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Yeah, I like that idea too. I want to end on that, that this idea of self compassion, OCD is not compassionate. It's. It's kind of an ass, actually. So looking back at your life and probably using a lot of maybe internal dialogue to, to beat yourself up to get yourself to be better. What is it like now to do the opposite, to be able to accept vulnerability, a mistake and uncertainty and just be much more okay with it than trying to beat it out of yourself. Right.

[Alexandra Anale]

It's so, it's so funny how easy it feels now.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Like, okay, oh, I like it.

[Alexandra Anale]

It was so much work. It was, it was so much work for a little while, you know, and you, that's something that I think you have to remind yourself when you're beginning. And because it is, you're, you're. You're literally rewiring yourself. So it's going to take a little bit of time. But that, that self compassion, being able to tap into that when, you know, I have a negative thought pop up or intrusive thoughts, being able to just Notice them and allow them to sort of melt away. Has ha. Has been. I mean, it's been life changing. It's completely, like I mentioned earlier, reduced that. That noise in my head and I don't feel like I'm constantly walking around with these, you know, intense self judgments that are leading me to create, you know, maybe a new compulsion.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Yeah, that's awesome. Well, give us one great makeup suggestion that we could all use for you. Well, you know, I think I'm kind of hopeless, unfortunately, but.

[Alexandra Anale]

No, but great. A great makeup suggestion for everyone. Well, I would say one of the main things, and I think a lot of people don't really like to hear this is it doesn't. Your makeup isn't going to matter if you are not taking care of your skin. So. So making sure you have skin care is everything. And that doesn't mean that you need to use like absolutely everything in the world or have like the most intense routine. But the basics, you know, cleansing, exfoliating, moisturizing and sun care. Life changing.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Yes. When sun care and this.

[Alexandra Anale]

Yes.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

That's very, very important for us of Irish descent, for sure.

[Alexandra Anale]

Absolutely.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Awesome. Well, I can't thank you enough for being here today. And really, I think you are an embodiment of that self compassion. I can just see that in how you are and how you speak about it. And I'm so glad that that has come into your life and you've been able to walk away from those years of being negative towards yourself and now helping to spread the word to others that it's. It's okay to like yourself. And, and even if there are thoughts or images or urges you experience that you don't like, it doesn't have to define you as the person you are.

[Alexandra Anale]

Well, thank you so much. I really appreciate it. It's been a pleasure being here.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Awesome, Alexandra, thank you. We appreciate it and we look forward to seeing more from you. Where can people find you? Where can they see some of your great beauty tips and things?

[Alexandra Anale]

I'm everywhere. I'm on all the. I'm on all the apps and it's just. Alexandra. Nele.

[Dr. Patrick McGrath]

Awesome. Well, thank you so much and thank all of you once again for watching another episode of the get to Know OCD podcast. If you're looking for help for OCD or related conditions, you could check us [e-mail] that's n o c d dot com. And if you like the get to Know OCD podcast, well, subscribe to our NOCD YouTube channel. Remember this. Be better to yourself than your OCD ever will be. We'll see you again soon.