New Girl City

Summary

Gettin' Grown — "New Girl City"

Podcast: Gettin’ Grown (Loud Speakers Network)
Date: August 4, 2026
Hosts: Keia and Jade (+ program guests)
Main Theme:
This special episode introduces and spotlights the voices of Black and femme-identifying youth from the New Girl City program at the Lower Eastside Girls Club of NYC. The episode centers both on the art and activism of these young women as they critically discuss the intersections of race, gender, class, and beauty in popular culture — specifically Love Island USA — and reflect on their own lived experiences of segregation and belonging in New York City schools.

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Episode Overview

This collaborative episode is introduced by the Gettin’ Grown hosts, celebrating young Black girl magic and self-care, while presenting the original work of New Girl City program participants. The two main segments are:

1. A roundtable on Love Island USA: Dissecting colorism, double standards, hair politics, and friendship dynamics.
2. A feature on school segregation in NYC: Centering first-person narratives from recent high school graduates navigating race, inclusion, and isolation in an elite Manhattan school.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Introduction and Framing the Episode

(Kitchen Table Talk with Keia, Jade, and Lucretia Berry, Program Director)
Timestamps: [03:13]–[08:02]

• Why The Greatest Love of All?

  • The hosts and Lucretia open with a playful, purposely jumbled rendition of Whitney Houston’s “Greatest Love of All,” framing it as an anthem about self-love and resilience (with a good dose of humor: “I’m sorry, Nippy!" – Podcast Host 1, [02:27]).

• Highlighting the Power of Female and Femme Voices

  • Lucretia explains teaching podcasting to young women as "critical work in this time" because “people just don’t respect it as much as they once did ... It’s more than just purchasing microphones and speaking into them.” ([03:33])
  • New Girl City is described as a civic program building skills "to organize and make change in their communities and beyond.” ([04:20])

• Poetry and Podcasting Focus

  • Participants wrote poems on everything from Bronx Pride to the lack of capitalism-free “third spaces,” then produced podcasts “with just a little bit of guidance” from adult mentors.

"There are many, many women and girls and femme-identifying humans who have very important things to say."
— Lucretia Berry, [04:11]

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2. Love Island USA: A Youth Roundtable Discussion

(New Girl City Students — Diana, Zainab, Sarah, Melissa, Georgia, et al.)
Timestamps: [12:09]–[43:05]

A. Hair, Colorism & The Policing of Black Women's Appearance

• Internet Scrutiny & Double Standards

  • “Anaya gets hate for her hair while Trinity gets praised for her hairstyles.” — Sarah, [13:31]
  • Policing extends beyond the show, with social media dictating “what styles you should wear if you’re going on this type of TV show,” reinforcing the idea that Black women’s hair “must always be done” (Georgia, [14:05]).

• Friendship and Solidarity as Resistance

  • “Trinity lent Anaya another wig ... that highlights sisterhood within the black girls, like, community.” — Diana Vargas, [15:26]
  • Still, intra-group friendship can be fraught, sometimes enabling negative behavior or making harmful excuses for each other (Melissa, [16:32]).

B. Racism, Sexism & Power Dynamics

• Romantic Double Standards and Hypersexualization

  • “Black girls get sexualized more ... even from a young age.” — Diana Vargas, [19:19]

• Performative Validation

  • “It’s good to appreciate a Black woman’s skin ... but he kept doing it in public, it felt performative in a way.” — Podcast Host 3, [20:21]
  • Overuse of compliments about “chocolate skin” is received as disingenuous and implies Black girls “need validation to feel beautiful.” — Sarah, [20:10]

• Power, Economics, and Gender Roles

  • Class differences between contestants affect dynamics (“Anaya ... got a car at 16 ... that also played a role,” — Georgia, [22:49]), as does competition around economic status and who is “the prize.”

• Food as Power Play (“Breakfast as a Symbol”)

  • The ritual of men making breakfast becomes a lever for control: “He was like ‘oh, I guess you’re not getting breakfast over me tomorrow’ ... he’s holding food over her head ... really takes autonomy from women.” — Sarah/Georgia Jackson, [26:44–28:07]

C. Friendship, Betrayal, and Social Hierarchies

• “It’s Not Friendship Island”

  • The show’s format normalizes “betraying friends” (Sarah, [35:53]), but panelists still value the importance of supportive relationships.

• Pretty Privilege, Fan Perception & Sexual Coercion

  • “Huda got away with a lot of stuff because she was pretty ... I think that’s a form of sexual assault.” — Podcast Host 3, [32:59]
  • Anger in women is treated very differently depending on race: “When Huda acts up: sexy. When Melanie or Anaya do: too loud, too aggressive, ‘ghetto’.” — Georgia Jackson, [33:08–34:14]

D. Intersectionality and Unpacking Stereotypes

• Beauty Standards & Group Dynamics
  • "Kenzie ... shocked that for the first time, other women of color were, you know, ... also being like, 'yeah, you're all gorgeous'” — Georgia Jackson, [37:15]
  • The hypersexualization of Black men and their positioning as people to “dominate” versus white men as those you “settle down with” (Georgia Jackson, [36:08])

E. Key Quotes & Moments

• "Why can’t we just, you know, express ourselves how we want to?" – Podcast Host 3, [15:07]
• “They want someone they can control, like an obedient puppy.” — Sarah, [39:14]
• “It just shows how they see us and how they want somebody who just, like, okay, oh, just try to brush it under the carpet ... They don’t like seeing women go ahead and head.” — Melissa, [38:45]

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3. Segregation in NYC Schools: A Student-Led Documentary

(Hosted by Zoe and former students at Bard High School Early College)
Timestamps: [44:01]–[69:43]

A. The Paradox of Elite 'Diverse' Schools

• Context: NYC is “the most segregated” city in the US in terms of public schools, with “90% of Black students attending predominantly non-white schools.” Bard, praised for “diversity,” is still deeply segregated in experience. ([44:05])

• Admissions & Expectations vs. Reality

  • Many students chose Bard hoping for college credits, intellectual stimulation or because it was “the best school in New York,” but were unprepared for the actual demographic and cultural divide (Student Speaker 6, [50:48], [51:06]).

B. Daily Realities of Segregation

• Physical & Social Isolation

  • “It was me and one other Black student, and everyone else was white” in history class (Podcast Host 2, [55:53])
  • Class and club spaces are clique-ish: “I felt unwelcomed in many of the student-led clubs, clubs that were full of ... people that I felt like I didn’t look like or wanted me to be there.” — Zoe, [68:45]

• Being Silenced or Marginalized

  • Sharing experiences of reading about race in class: “Bringing up Darwin’s very obvious racism ... my teacher told me verbatim that what I was seeing wasn’t necessarily racism ... because he didn’t know it was racism.” (Student Speaker 4, [58:30])
  • Students of color frequently feel their views are discounted or appropriated, even on topics of direct relevance to them.

• Emotional Labor and Reluctance to Speak

  • “Saying certain things is like stepping on a field of landmines ... you can be labeled anti-Semitic, racist, or dumb ... it’s easy for that to be turned on you.” — Student Speaker 6, [61:00]
  • Even in ‘inclusive’ schools, “we didn't constantly face racist acts, but there’s still that subconscious and underlying racism,” which is emotionally exhausting.

C. Advice for Future Students/Educators

• Build Real Support, Not Just Diversity Initiatives

  • “Holding space and being willing to listen ... instead of always calling them out in the middle of class.” — Podcast Host 2, [67:21]
  • “Don’t force yourself to fit into a group of people who clearly don’t want you around.” — Student Speaker 2, [65:53]

• The Ongoing Need for Safe Spaces & True Inclusion

  • "Even as welcoming as Bard is, we constantly [faced] ... underlying racism," highlighting the work that remains. ([61:00])

D. Notable Quotes

“It was a shock I wasn’t seeing people who looked like me at every turn, because that’s what I was used to.” — Student Speaker 6, [51:05]
“Why were they the most active people in this discussion? Why weren’t the other people interested in sharing?” — Student Speaker 4, [56:19]
“You can see the obvious divide ... not just in what everyone looks like, but in how everyone is seated.” — Student Speaker 4, [56:26]

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4. Conclusion & Program Reflections

Timestamps: [69:43]–[70:16]

• Connecting the Dots: Love Island, NYC & New Girl City
  • “Society and Love island and New Girl City and New York City all have something in common.” — Lucretia Berry, [69:43]
  • Participants express hope that sharing these stories will make other students feel less alone, and encourage educators to create safer, more inclusive spaces.

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Important Timestamps

• [13:03]–[22:49]: Love Island — Hair, colorism, and friendship among Black girls.
• [26:44]–[28:29]: Breakfast and power in relationships.
• [32:45]–[34:14]: Pretty privilege and double standards on gendered anger.
• [39:14]–[40:10]: The search for control and autonomy, feminist resistance.
• [43:33]: Transition to school segregation segment.
• [44:05]–[55:53]: Segregation, admissions, and culture shock at Bard.
• [56:19]–[63:10]: Classroom dynamics, being silenced, emotional labor.
• [65:06]–[68:45]: Advice for future students and educators.

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Memorable Moments & Quotes

• “You guys did better than most adults, honestly.” — Lucretia Berry on the Love Island roundtable, [43:34]
• "Holding space ... being willing to listen ... helps students engage in rough conversations about why they may not want to speak in front of a class full of white people." — Podcast Host 2, [67:21]
• "Even in New York City ... supposed to be so diverse, you still have so much segregation." — Zoe, [68:45]

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Takeaways

• Youth Voices Matter: The podcast powerfully amplifies young, Black, and femme perspectives, often absent in dominant media narratives.
• Intersectionality in Practice: Both Love Island discussion and school stories show how racism, sexism, class, and colorism shape real lives — in pop culture, media, and education.
• Actionable Lessons: The episode urges adults (especially educators) to build real support, rather than superficial diversity, and to listen rather than presume.

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External Resources

• New Girl City Program: girlsclub.org/new-girl-city
• Lower Eastside Girls Club — Social: @girlsclubny

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This episode is an inspiring celebration of Black girlhood, solidarity, and the strength of youth perspective, weaving together pop culture critique and urgent calls for educational and social justice.

Transcript

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[Georgia Jackson]

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[Lucretia Berry]

I believe that children are our future. Teach them well and let them lead the way. Show them all the beauty they possess inside. Give them a sense of pride to make it easier.

[Podcast Host 1]

That's right.

[Lucretia Berry]

Let the children's laughter remind us how

[Podcast Host 2]

we used to be.

[Lucretia Berry]

Take it away, Kia.

[Podcast Host 1]

I decided long ago never to walk in anyone's shadows. If I fail, if I succeed. Wait. At least I've lived as I believe. Is that right? No matter what, they can't take from me. They can't take my dignity.

[Lucretia Berry]

Because the greatest love of all is easy to achieve.

[Podcast Host 1]

I'm mixing up the verses. Is it? Is it?

[Lucretia Berry]

It doesn't matter. I'm the greatest love of all. I think that's the end.

[Podcast Host 2]

Yeah.

[Lucretia Berry]

I think I'm mixing up.

[Podcast Host 1]

I'm sorry, Nippy.

[Georgia Jackson]

The greatest.

[Podcast Host 3]

Yes.

[Commercial Narrator]

Come on.

[Lucretia Berry]

I don't. I don't know. I don't know if it's easy to achieve. I'm happy to believe I don't. I remember that last and if by

[Podcast Host 1]

chance that special place that you've been dreaming of. Come on.

[Lucretia Berry]

I'm going to watch that lead you to a lone.

[Lucretia Berry (Program Director)]

Yes.

[Lucretia Berry]

That kind of got there a long time. But, you know, there are so many

[Podcast Host 1]

different turns and twists and there's verses and things. It's been a long time since I've heard.

[Lucretia Berry]

We did so much. She did so much. But it was so good. But in the best way. Yeah. It was so classic. And we bring this song to you today for a very specific purpose.

[Podcast Host 2]

I don't know if you guys, it is.

[Lucretia Berry]

No.

[Lucretia Berry (Program Director)]

Yes.

[Podcast Host 1]

But my sister is an educator and she has been teaching the youth, them, the children of New York City, all about the magical world of podcasting. She's doing the Lord's work and she's been teaching them about podcasting, which is critical work in this time because, you know, people just don't respect it as much as they once did. You know, there is a skill to it. It's more than just purchasing microphones and speaking into them. You see what I'm saying?

[Lucretia Berry]

Despite. Despite what these lists tell you, because of what these.

[Podcast Host 1]

Listen, listen.

[Podcast Host 3]

Yeah.

[Lucretia Berry]

There are many, many women and girls and femme identifying humans.

[Podcast Host 1]

Absolutely.

[Lucretia Berry]

Who have very important things to say. And so I've been teaching podcasting this summer. I was a part of a. Part of a program called New Girl City, which is led by Barry. Shout out to Barry and my dear friend Siobhan. They are doing incredible work with, with these young women and young femme identifying individuals. And so New Girl City, agents of change, engages female identifying high school age young people from all five boroughs in civic education and development of key stills to organize and make change in their communities and beyond. And so for the summer 2026, the young ladies did poetry and podcasting.

[Podcast Host 1]

Nice.

[Lucretia Berry]

And they each had to write a poem where, you know, they spoke about something they were passionate about, but that was important to discuss within the community. So we had poems from Bronx Pride, you know, to, to the politics of FIFA, to a lack of third spaces for young adults that don't include that, you know, because that are taken over by capitalism and don't include spending money. They are just. They were such brilliant, brilliant, brilliant young people. And then the second half of the class, we did podcasting and they put together their own podcast, produced and hosted with just a little bit of guidance from Barry and I. And they took it off into their own level. And so in the, in the podcast, they discussed Love Island.

[Podcast Host 1]

Oh, wow.

[Lucretia Berry]

But from the lens of colorism.

[Student Speaker 1]

Oh, good.

[Lucretia Berry]

Massaging the wall.

[Diana Vargas]

Yeah.

[Lucretia Berry]

And I'm excited to, you know, racism and yes, so many important aspects. And it's beautiful hearing it from the young people. And then the second half of the podcast was Zoe where she spoke about segregation in schools in New York City in 2026. We know New York is one of the most segregated cities in the country, actually, when it comes to education, which is, you know, you wouldn't believe so with us being such a forward moving city, you know what I'm saying? But this is important information. And so I'm really She, she conducted interviews with other students about their experiences and how they feel. And I'm just really, really, really proud of them. And so this very special episode of Getting Grown, we wanted to share that podcast with you all so you can see what these young ladies have been working on and you know, go and check out New Girl City and all that they're, you know, all that they're doing. The links will be in the description. And yeah, I'm really excited for you all to hear what they've been working on this summer.

[Podcast Host 1]

Yes, I am thrilled to hear this and share this with our audience. So y' all take a listen and you know, I think this is really dope. I'm excited to hear what the young people are talking about and how they are experiencing a show like Love island. Because me, myself, yeah,

[Podcast Host 2]

actually had to

[Podcast Host 1]

take some space from Love island because I watched last season and I was way too invested in those young people's business. And I, I said, you know, for my own. And it comes on every day so it's easy to get sort of sucked in. So I'm excited to hear this as you hear the chatter down to the tik toks and things and people been talking about it.

[Lucretia Berry]

Yes.

[Podcast Host 1]

But I'm excited to hear how people who are younger than the cast perceive

[Lucretia Berry]

out of the mouths of true babies.

[Podcast Host 1]

Yes. Because people who are older than the cast, like myself, are mortified.

[Lucretia Berry]

They're like 15 or 17, I believe.

[Podcast Host 1]

Exciting.

[Lucretia Berry]

Yes. I can't wait to hear your thoughts and what you think, sister. And please, you all chime in and let us know your thoughts and how you support these young women. And I'm excited for you all to listen. So check out New Girl City, the podcast.

[Podcast Host 1]

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[Sarah]

Hi, welcome to the New Girl City Podcast. My name is Sarah and me and my peers are going to present to you the New Girls City Podcast. We are part of a program based at the Lower Eastside Girls Club bringing together female identifying youth from across the five boroughs to engage in civic education to make change in their communities and beyond. This summer we explored public speaking and art as an outlet for discussions about colorism, segregation, misogyny and so much more. In this podcast we are going to talk about Love Island USA specifically season 8 and interviews with BSEC Manhattan. We are going to explore themes of hair and female friendships in Love island and the double standards. We are also going to look at students experiences with attending predominantly white schools to see if the experience does indeed differ from a more diverse school. So without getting too much into it, I. Let's get started. So grab a snack, get comfortable, and enjoy.

[Diana Vargas]

Good afternoon, ladies. So we're going to start by introducing ourselves. My name is Diana Vargas, and I am the host. And, yeah, so let's go by introducing ourselves.

[Podcast Host 3]

Hi, my name is Zainab.

[Sarah]

Hi, my name is Sarah.

[Melissa]

Hi, I'm Melissa.

[Sarah (Student)]

Hi, my name is Sarah.

[Georgia Jackson]

Hi, my name is Georgia.

[Diana Vargas]

Okay, so today we're going to be talking about a topic that is very controversial. Love Island USA Season 7. Who's going to start with us?

[Sarah (Student)]

Okay, so we're going to start off by talking about hair and friendships. The biggest example when we think of hair in Love island is Anaya. She got a lot of hate for her hairstyles, and people were just being really cruel to her about it.

[Diana Vargas]

Yeah, I can agree, like, certain things that took place, like the bullying on the media and judgment in the hair, like, it kind of reminded me of what feels like to be a black girl. Like, like, in general, like, we get judged for our hair, but, like, other girls like, that are not colored, racist. Like, they don't really get judged for the way they have their hair because they have it easier, in a way.

[Sarah]

But, yeah, I thought it was interesting how Trinity and Naya are both black girls, but Anaya gets hate for her hair while Trinity gets praised for her hairstyles. Yeah.

[Student Speaker 2]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host 3]

I found that kind of weird, too, because it was interesting how the backlash online that Anaya got for wearing her natural hair and how it was, like, standing up in the back and everybody was looking down on it. But when Kaita. Kaita always has her hair straight, right? So when it got wet, everybody was like, oh, my gosh, she should be wearing her curls more. And that was kind of weird to me, too.

[Georgia Jackson]

I feel like on my side of TikTok and social media, I actually saw a similar reaction to an eye with Kada. I feel like everyone was kind of bashing her, I guess you could say, like, with the leave out. Like, the leave out is left out. And even before any of that had happened, before the, you know, the Fiji humidity had gotten to any of them, there were a lot of comments about what styles you should wear if you're going to this sort of, I don't know, TV show. Like, oh, why would you wear a sew in or a bust down? Why would you do that? Like, you need to get box braids. You need to get a style that's going to quote unquote, last and again, we just see this policing of black women's hairstyles, and it's like, why do you care? You know, I don't know. It's weird in Love island where especially

[Student Speaker 3]

with black people, we're going to be

[Lucretia Berry]

looking like, is your hair done?

[Student Speaker 3]

Because you're one of two people there.

[Georgia Jackson]

There might have been some others, but

[Student Speaker 3]

when I was watching Love Island, Mimi

[Georgia Jackson]

India, I feel like everyone's been like, nope, you're not going to catch me

[Student Speaker 3]

looking crazy when I was talking to

[Podcast Host 2]

Lima when I seen her the first night.

[Podcast Host 3]

Yeah, I agree. People are so comfortable policing black women's hairstyles in on the Internet. And it's like, why can't we just, you know, express ourselves how we want to?

[Melissa]

Well, speaking of, like, hair, we can also talk about how Trinity lent Anaya another wig. And I feel like that really highlights some of the friendships in the villa.

[Diana Vargas]

Yeah, that highlights sisterhood within the black girls, like, community. And, like, I can, like, say happily that I have that kind of friendship.

[Sarah (Student)]

And it wasn't just with the hair. They would even share clothes. And that's just like my. One of my favorite parts of watching Love Island. I see the same looks on other girls and how they pull it off. But also, if we go back to Anaya, there was this white bandana that they were wearing and Anaya got so much hate for it, even though Trinity wore it and Kenzie wore it just because she decided to wear it like a babushka style.

[Student Speaker 4]

But.

[Sarah (Student)]

But I don't know, what do you guys think about that?

[Diana Vargas]

And the comments they were talking about, like, slavery and connecting it to slavery. And it's like everybody else wore it. You guys didn't say that when it came to them, but you guys said it when it came to a dark skinned woman.

[Sarah (Student)]

Yeah.

[Sarah]

I just think that it's so nice to see that in such a toxic community, like in Love island, we can find, like, connections and actual genuine relationships aside from the romantic ones.

[Sarah (Student)]

But also, those friendships aren't always the positives. Sometimes they lean towards the negative side because they excuse each other's actions. And we can see this both with the girls and the boys, but especially with the boys, like Sincere and Casey, they would just, like, egg on each other and just, just as much. As long as they have each other's validation, then they thought that whatever they were doing was okay.

[Podcast Host 3]

Yeah, I feel like we saw that specifically with Corbin and Casey, like when Casey and Corbin were making fun of Anaya. Grandma, I feel like, that if one of them stepped up and was like, oh, that comment was not okay, then the whole reaction would have been different. But because they egged it on with each other, it just. They felt really comfortable talking down on her.

[Melissa]

And I feel like with Corbin, when Anaya did the paint challenge and he made that face because she was the only colored woman, I feel like that speaks a lot for itself and how they feel like they can do that. And then how Casey felt like he had access to Anaya's body because he was like, what Titi was giving me was what we should have gotten from the Villa girls. I feel like that just shows the level of respect they had for these girls and how it makes it seem like he was only doing good justice for Anaya to get one thing.

[Georgia Jackson]

But also I feel like with Anaya prioritizing, I guess you can say her friendship with Sincere over Melanie and her kind of giving very harmful advice, like, oh, I'm team Sincere, even though he's super toxic and he's a liar and he's doing all this stuff to you just because he's my friend, you should still kind of continue to go out with him. And then even during family day, when her mom had came on, it was like, hey, you're not being a truthful friend. And then she wanted to switch it up, and it was all like, hey, I'm gonna be honest. I haven't been truthful. And she expected to see immediate change, even though this entire time consecutively she's been like, oh, I'm team Sincere. I lowkey, don't really care what he does.

[Diana Vargas]

Cause, you know, that's what I was saying.

[Georgia Jackson]

I'm like, I don't understand. Why would you. And even when she did kind of switch up and was all like, oh, you know, I wasn't being truthful, I didn't really believe it because I don't think she's the type of person to truly hide how she feels. Like if she feels a certain way about someone, I expect that she would be honest about that.

[Student Speaker 2]

And.

[Georgia Jackson]

And then her total 180 and personality just didn't make much sense.

[Melissa]

I feel like that also highlights on the double standards because, like, the whole villain, even the boys were selling Melanie, give Sincere a second chance. But then when Kenzie, it was like, oh, no, she keeps doing this. And I feel like it's not fair because what Sincere did was 10 times worse. I feel like at least Kenzie was honest. Will try to be the most honest with all her connections, but Sincere was actively lying and lying and lying. So.

[Diana Vargas]

So I wanted to go back a little. Like, while where we brought up Casey trying to say, like, Anaya owned him. Something like the grandma comments. I. It reminded me of something, like, from the Internet that I've seen, like, black girls get sexualized more because of their bodies. And even from a young age, black girls get sexualized more. So I feel like. And it also reminded me of how they treated the angel girl, the one from Casa Amore. They treated her more like, respectful, like she didn't want to be touched. They didn't. They didn't touch her as much. But with the black girls, they were very aggressive with their bodies.

[Sarah (Student)]

I mean, something that started to, like, low key pissed me off when I was watching the show is how much they would tell Anaya that they love her chocolate skin. And I feel like one time is okay. Like, of course we.

[Student Speaker 2]

It's.

[Sarah (Student)]

It's beautiful. But when you repeat it multiple times, it almost makes it feel like she needs that validation to feel beautiful. And she's not just, like, beautiful on her own as, like, oneself.

[Podcast Host 3]

I mean, it honestly felt so disingenuous that Casey kept bringing it up. And it's. It's good to, like, appreciate black woman's skin. You know, it's uplifting, it's nice, it's beautiful and in private. But I feel like he kept doing it in public and it felt like performative in a way.

[Melissa]

Yeah, I did.

[Podcast Host 3]

Like, oh.

[Sarah]

At a certain point, it just felt like he was trying to convince himself that every time he'd be like, oh, I love your chocolate skin. I love this. I love that. It's like, do you. Because why do you keep bringing it up?

[Diana Vargas]

Speaking of Casey and his performance, like, his. His recent podcast with Titi.

[Student Speaker 2]

Oh.

[Georgia Jackson]

Where they were, like, self interviewing each other, basically.

[Diana Vargas]

They were self interviewing each other, and they like him being performative. It brings me back to the fact that they were speaking about Casey taking out Titi's hairstyle, and they were upset that it wasn't aired out. And it's like, it's a representation of black, like, couples and their relationship, but also, like, it's something private between you two. Like, you should be glad that it was an air out because it's something like, why are you so worried about the public's eye and the public's opinion of the. What you did? If you did it out of love,

[Sarah]

like, literally, like, if it was genuine, you wouldn't care if anyone saw it.

[Melissa]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host 3]

Yeah. And I feel like they keep trying to make it like, oh, the reason the Internet doesn't like, like them as much is because they're black. And they keep trying to play the black card. But I feel like they as, like, individually, they did. They had a lot of flaws that made the Internet, like, not like them. Because truly, I think the Internet, at least aside I've been on, they really do appreciate black love. Like, if you love. If you look at Serena and Cordell, like, that was a beautiful couple. So it was never really about black love. Everybody appreciates it, but it was their actions in general.

[Melissa]

And since we're on the topic. Since we're still on the topic of Casey, we can talk about how he kept bringing up how nobody chose him at the door and stuff and making it seem like he was like, oh, nobody picked me. Nobody picked me. And that was, like, two, three weeks ago. And it felt like he was just, like, also being performative there by picking the plan. He even said it, and it's confessional. Oh, yeah. I picked the plan because I thought people were gonna like it. And then he just felt like he just wanted to be like, I think Casey likes being the prize he doesn't want. He likes to be chased. And I feel like that's, like, what Titi gave him at Costa, and that's why they bought it more, because he liked the feeling of being the prize and stuff. So.

[Georgia Jackson]

But also, I think class plays a role when this, too has, like, play plays a role into this as well. Because from the jump, and I had mentioned, like, oh, yeah, my dad, he used to be in the NBA. She got, like, a car at 16, 18, one of those ages. And it's clear class differences. So I think that also played a role into it as well, knowing that the person you're with, especially when we're considering societal roles like, oh, the woman is supposed to make less. The man is supposed to be the provider. He's supposed to be the leader. And having Anaya, who's this, like, I want to say, like, high middle class, you know, lower upper class, it really contradicts that narrative. And I think it had made him feel really insecure about himself and what he's bringing to the table. And I think that's why it was much easier maybe for him to bond with Titi because it seems like they come from similar economic backgrounds and things such as that. So I think it was a bit easier on that part to also, you know, the, like, sexual relations. Of course, it was much easier of Titi, I guess, when it was with

[Podcast Host 3]

Anaya So, yeah, I will say Casey definitely gave, like, insecure because he kept like implying this rhetoric that Anaya was too much. And it felt like he was trying to cause problems to kind of push her away. And I feel like he just kept making it seem like Anaya was too much when I think she. I don't even think she was asking for a lot. She was just asking for. For him to tell her the truth.

[Sarah (Student)]

And yeah, I think we, like, nowadays we really downplay the importance of economics and the role that they play in relationships. And I feel like a really good example of that was Trinity and Bryce. Bryce played it off like he was just like a garbage truck worker and he would just pick up random side gigs when he's actually a really famous DJ and he's like the king of la, apparently. So I don't know, like, what do we think about being open and honest about your economic background? Do you think that really has a big impact on relationships or now?

[Sarah]

Yeah, I definitely think so. But isn't he. Wasn't he always a CEO of something like a tech company?

[Student Speaker 4]

I'm not sure.

[Sarah]

But yeah, I definitely think it plays a huge role now because it's like some people won't go for you if you make less or if you make more. But for Bryce, I don't see why he would do that because it's like he's a white man. Like, I don't see a reason for him, though.

[Student Speaker 3]

Hey, guys, how are we doing? Just want to say thank you for all the love and support and because you guys blew up all my remix videos of that blase song Tie In Future reached out my team and yeah, we're gonna make it official. So remix is coming out next Thursday.

[Diana Vargas]

I feel like it does play a role in the society we are in now because, like, we have to balance things out. Like the 5050 thing rule thing is it's something that we already, like, experience. These men clearly aren't providers anymore. And I guess we have to take this things into our own hands. So, yeah, I feel like it does play out.

[Melissa]

I feel like men nowadays, like, they just want to be the prize and stuff, wearing bedazzled stuff. I feel like all that. I feel like all that comes into play and they also feel like they also are like, oh, no, we need to, we need to split this. If I do this, you need to do this. It's like always something we have to give up for them to actually want to play the provider's role. And I feel like they play to Their favor too. Because then it's like how society sees them as, like, strong people. Like, men are supposed to be stronger and house providers, but it's like, they're not that. And it's like they want to be the one getting provided for and not doing the providing. And they're like, just sassy and everything. And every time a woman tries to, like, talk to them about it, they're like, oh, no.

[Sarah (Student)]

And it's almost like Love island kind of switches these roles by having the men make them breakfast every morning. When I first started watching the show that, like, it didn't throw me off. I thought it was great, but I'm just confused to why, like, they always put up with it. Because sometimes the boys sort of think that makes them all good and mighty because they literally hold control over their food. And even we saw it with Zach and Kada. Once he got mad at her, he was like, oh, well, I guess you're not getting breakfast over me tomorrow. I mean, because you were being mean. So it's really weird how he was just trying to hold food over her.

[Georgia Jackson]

Yeah, but I think that's, like, similar to economics. I think when the man doesn't make enough money, there is a weird conflict between the man and the woman. I think when he makes too much money, then it becomes this special resource that he has to guard that's used against the woman should she, you know, not provide him with what she wants. In this case, like, even something, like, mundane that we consider, like, food, we see that Zach is quite literally holding it over Keda's head and saying, hey, if you don't do this or if you're not nice to me, essentially, then you can't get the food that I'm gonna cook you. And it's weird cause it takes the autonomy from women as well. She can also make her own breakfast. She doesn't need you to make it for her. It's just. It's nice. I didn't understand why he would say something like that.

[Podcast Host 3]

I have noticed that Zach likes to punish Kayda with those little things like that. He'll get really kind of aggressive whenever something happens between her and another man. He'll look really jealous because he would want her to feel bad. And he finds little ways to punish her. And I find that really weird.

[Melissa]

Speaking of food, we can talk about some food challenges Love island does and how, like, disgusting it is and how they like this challenge from season seven. No, season eight. How they were, like, spitting food into each other's mouth and everything.

[Sarah (Student)]

Absolutely disgusting.

[Melissa]

And I feel like it also goes into like, the producers and like, the fetish because I feel like they see the online hate about the food and like, they see everybody say, ew, we don't want to see this. But, like, they bring it back. And that can, like, talk about how in the UK version of Love island, they don't do these challenges. Like, these challenges are always so sexualized. Like kissing on the first day. Three dudes. But with the Love island uk, they actually sit down and get to know each other. Like yesterday kissing. But it's not all about that. It's not all about touching each other's bodies and stuff.

[Sarah (Student)]

I mean, we see a big culture clash when we compare UK to usa. And I just, I'm just so curious to why the usa Just like, I don't know, it gives a very, like, feral sense to it. Like, it's almost like Americans are depicted as animals to the point where, like, they can't keep their hands off of each other. They're like, scavenging at food and those weird challenges and they're spitting it out. I just think it's really dehumanizing. And the fact that they literally commit their whole summer to this show, they have no outside contact. I mean, essentially it's sort of like Hunger Games, but like, not to that extent, but we're just watching from the comfort of our own homes, texting and judging them. I don't know, it's just became like a common culture thing that we get together and it like joins community. But at what cost?

[Sarah]

I mean, yeah, it is really dehumanizing, especially considering how they're literally locked outside, no contact for two weeks before they actually meet each other. So then they're kind of pre programmed to act that type of way. And I feel like the difference between the US Love island and UK is that the US tries to portray it this certain way because it is so normalized in the US to act that way. And so they're kind of just tailoring to their viewers as like, their viewers want to see that and so they're going to give them that.

[Diana Vargas]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host 3]

And I think that since there's money involved, it kind of changes. Everybody's like, aim and the way they approach the game. So everybody kind of has like double question in their head. Are they just playing the game? You know, are they playing it too safe? Like, are they playing it to win? And that kind of changes it. Like, are we really sure we're finding love the proper way?

[Student Speaker 3]

Like, yeah, I was feeling like really good with you. I was, but I never wanted to, like, I never wanted to lose, you know, our chemistry, in a sense. You know what I mean? Because I think we did have good chemistry, but it was just. It was tough because when we got put into that couple and I really wasn't ready to, you know, leave Melanie in that time, and I should have been more honest with you.

[Georgia Jackson]

Speaking of the game, did you guys see Alandria and Nick how they, like, had the PR breakup?

[Student Speaker 5]

Basically?

[Sarah (Student)]

Oh, my gosh.

[Georgia Jackson]

And I think, again, that raises into question, are they just doing it for the money? Is it just a PR stunt?

[Sarah (Student)]

100%.

[Georgia Jackson]

I personally had thought that Nicholandria. I thought they were for Elle, but I guess.

[Sarah]

And how everyone is saying, oh, let's apologize to Ciara now.

[Georgia Jackson]

Yeah, like, bro, everyone.

[Melissa]

Nah. But I think she does need an apology. Like, imagine your closest friend, like, doing that with your man and then everybody making you out to be the bad guy when what she said was very offensive. And I don't want to speak on that topic because that's not of my culture, but I feel like there was some more stuff that should have had as much.

[Sarah]

Not.

[Melissa]

I don't want to say hate, because we don't want to hate on anybody, but should have been brought to light. And I feel like people brush it over. Like, for example, with Huda when her and Chris were in bed, and like, she was like, oh, if you don't do this, I'm gonna get mad at you. I feel like a lot of people brush it over because she was a woman and she's very beautiful. But I feel like if the roles were reversed, everybody would, like, Chris would have got death threats. And I feel like that plays into the fan base that Lovell has, especially with season seven because when Brian Amaya won, I feel like that was out of pity votes for Amaya because they broke up like, a month after the show. So it just shows that the Love island fan base is not the best and not, I guess, well educated. Yeah.

[Podcast Host 3]

I feel like because Huda's pretty, like, pretty, pretty privilege is something that exists. Huda got away with a lot of stuff, and especially that Kristen Huda situation in the bed. I think, like, that was coercion, like, in a way that's like. I think it's a form of sexual assault.

[Sarah]

Like, it is.

[Podcast Host 3]

And she got away with a lot of stuff just because she was pretty and she was, like, really manipulative and crazy and her defenders are, like, insane.

[Georgia Jackson]

But also, I think in comparison with Hispanic women, when they're like feisty and they're angry, it's like seen as something that's attractive, you know? But then again, compared to a black woman, when Melanie, for example, had stood up, when Anaya had stood up, and you have these black women who are standing over these men who was just five seconds ago they were standing and they're like, hey, why are you standing up? Like sit down. All of a sudden you're being too loud, you're being too aggressive. All of this happens. But we see with Huda, it's something that's sexy, something that's attractive. And then you have these other people who are coming in saying like, hey. The reason why she's like this is cause like she has bpd. You have these like self diagnosis, like these videos of like, oh, she's like split in, like you're not a psychologist. But secondly, again, why don't we see this kind of jump to justification of behaviors when it comes to the black woman? Why is it only with certain cultures is that anger something that's attractive to the public?

[Sarah]

Or it's like, oh, she's Arab, so she's supposed to act this way. But then when it's a black woman doing something less, it's like, why are you acting this way? Now you're ghetto.

[Diana Vargas]

Speaking of racism, can we break up Cynthia's family and their towards. What's your name?

[Student Speaker 2]

Trinity.

[Diana Vargas]

Anaya. Calling her a Shrek? Yes. And then calling Trinity's family, talking about like judging them based on first look, you don't even know these people and you're calling them ratchet ghetto.

[Sarah]

I think that's crazy. Especially considering how Anaya is literally the only one glazing, sincere, being on his side. And then you have this whole family calling you Shrek. So now like, what?

[Georgia Jackson]

It's like you have to be careful who you defend.

[Sarah (Student)]

And I don't know, I feel like this really brings up the theme of colorism in Love Island. And I think it's most apparent in the friendships between the girls. At first, Kenzie was so, so close to Melanie, but then when a white girl came in, when Jen came in, she's like, oh, you're my best friend. And they just naturally distance themselves, which, I don't know, I feel like maybe that's just their natural response to being in a setting like that.

[Student Speaker 4]

But I don't know.

[Diana Vargas]

Yeah, you don't really have contact to your like actual best friends outside. So it's like you gotta like settle down with someone and. But it's also weird how she, like, she was telling so, oh, like, I trust you. And then she goes, soon as Jen comes, she's like, oh, I don't trust so at all. It's like, what's the point? You didn't have to say that. You didn't have to say it.

[Student Speaker 4]

Like, I don't know.

[Podcast Host 3]

And I think it was weird what Kenzie did with, like, you know, Gaul, considering that Zhen was her friend.

[Melissa]

Like, I don't know.

[Podcast Host 3]

And you know that Jen has really no other connections and she struggled in the villa and you have a choice. You had multiple choices.

[Sarah]

You know, I feel like betraying friends in that show is also so normalized and defended because.

[Podcast Host 3]

Because they're always quick to say, like, oh, it's not friendship island, but friendship is important.

[Podcast Host 2]

Yeah,

[Georgia Jackson]

But I think with Kenzie, we had seen in real life, like, white woman reacting to not being seen as the beauty standard. And in the early episode, she had really struggled with that. She was like, I know I'm attractive, but for some reason I'm not getting the connections I wanted. And I think that's why she was so hyper focused on her quote, unquote cowboy, like that sort of, you know, and even her language that she would use to describe men, like, when she was talking about Corbin, she was like, oh, I want to be dominated. Like, I want this man, like, all this language. But with Caleb, a white man, it's like, oh, I want, like the white picket fence dream. I want to settle down. I want to have kids. And again, this contrast in language with black man, black men, they're seen as something to be sexualized, something to be, you know, like, they're going to dominate you. Whereas with white men, it's like, that's the one you settle down with. That's the one you have kids with. And again, I think it's evident in the friendship she also has. It's like, why can you. You have so many other beautiful women of different colors that. But all of a sudden another white girl comes in and you feel some better spiritual connection in group out, group stuff like that. I just don't understand it. And I think her reaction to not being perceived as a quote, unquote beauty standard was just, again, so odd. Cause she is beautiful. I think we can all agree upon that. They're all beautiful. But it's just her reaction to it. She seemed so shocked that for the first time, other women of color were, you know, oso being like, oh, like, yeah, you guys are all gorgeous.

[Melissa]

Not just, you I mean, shit, I still liked Corbin.

[Podcast Host 3]

I genuinely did really like him.

[Melissa]

And then you came in.

[Student Speaker 2]

He was my type and I did want to, like, try it out with you.

[Podcast Host 3]

And I feel like I put my

[Student Speaker 2]

best foot forward, but I still felt stronger with.

[Melissa]

I feel like Kenzie just has a really high self, like, risk level of respect for herself. And you can see that when Zach did her dirty and she just didn't talk to him, him. Like, you can see her when Corbin came back. I feel like she really has a high level of self respect. But going back to how people portray black people, black women on Love island, as like ghetto or too aggressive, we can also talk about how the boys also, in a sense, like, see them as that. Because every time a woman of color wants to say what happened, like, say their opinion or something, like when Trinity did it or when Melanie was yelling at Sincere on movie night. And even if you go to Love Island UK every time, like, I don't think men like to see a strong headed, like, strong leveled woman with her strong opinions. And I feel like when men see that, they're always like, oh, she's just being difficult. It's like really just shows how they see us and how they want somebody who just like, okay, oh, like, just try to brush it under the carpet. And they don't like seeing women, you know, go ahead and head. And I also feel like that plays into power dynamics and another double standards.

[Student Speaker 4]

Yeah.

[Diana Vargas]

I feel like at some point they felt threatened that they couldn't really get her to. To see things in their point of view. It's like they want themselves to, like, have more power than.

[Sarah]

Yes. And it's like, it's like they want someone they can.

[Melissa]

Oh, yeah, they want someone they can

[Sarah]

control, like an obedient puppy. They just want, like, yeah, they just want someone who will listen to them and let everything slide.

[Student Speaker 4]

Yeah, yeah.

[Georgia Jackson]

And I think even we see men discussing, like, modern day feminists and how they think that feminists just now kind of hide behind that word to be outspoken and rude against men. And I think when you have women who are standing up and defending themselves, they kind of just take it as that, like, oh, this is just another modern day feminist who's trying to, you know, intimidate me and use her quote unquote authority to threaten me and stuff like that. Again, they take it as a threat because they're intimidated. But I think that's all just because they just want a woman who doesn't question them, who's not questioning their actions, their whereabouts. And stuff like that. So they can just do what they want and then come home, have the wife, and, you know, continue this really weird misogynistic makeup scenario that.

[Sarah]

Yeah, I think it's so interesting how, like, he's holding food over her head just because that's the only thing he can hold over her head in the island. So that really makes you think, like, they really, like, no matter the situation, they will find something to hold over your head at the end of the day.

[Sarah (Student)]

And also something as simple as breakfast, I think it becomes, like, a really big symbol in the villa. For example, if a girl one morning doesn't get breakfast, then she takes that as a sign from the man that he's trying to tell her that he's not interested. And even sometimes in season seven with Serena and Cordell, she flipped the plate all over him. So, I don't know. I feel like they just. It's really hard to fully express yourself in there because you're among so many people. And I feel like when we are around people, we sort of take in their personality traits, so the breakfast just becomes a way for them to just show their true feelings, I guess.

[Sarah]

And I feel like using breakfast to literally hold it over someone's head and showcasing that to millions of people watching is also kind of normalizing that, in a sense.

[Podcast Host 3]

And.

[Diana Vargas]

Yeah,

[Sarah]

okay.

[Diana Vargas]

Speaking of misogynistic, like, we can bring up Zach and Brian.

[Student Speaker 4]

Was it Bryce?

[Diana Vargas]

Oh, Bryce. Their whole relationship. And I'm not gonna lie, that's, like, a little weird. Like what? I feel like there is double standard with that, too. Like, girls, like, you know, girls can be kind of gay to each other, but, like, when it comes to men, like, true.

[Georgia Jackson]

Didn't, like, K and Melanie make.

[Diana Vargas]

Yeah, but, like, there's also, like, a way we view things. Like, I feel like it's so much more normalized for girls to be, like, very sexual with each other or, like, very touchy with each other. Like, when it comes to men, I'm not gonna defend them, but, yeah, it's more like judged, you know?

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[Georgia Jackson]

Hi, my name is Georgia Jackson. I'm a New Girl City member and we hope you enjoyed listening to the segment about Love island and the intersectionality between love, race and gender. If you would like to find more about our program, you can find us on social media@girlsclubny or on our website, girlsclub.org new girl city. Thank you.

[Melissa]

Wow.

[Lucretia Berry]

Respectability, politics through the policing of black hair. Genuine connection, friendship dynamics. You ladies really covered it all and in such a responsible manner. Better than most adults, honestly. Fantastic job. Our next segment is going to be hosted by Zoe, where she's going to speak with us about segregation in schools in 2026. You heard that right.

[Sarah (Student)]

Stay tuned.

[Student Speaker 5]

They say New York City has one of the best school systems in the United States. Yet according to the Civil Rights Project, school segregation in New York remains the worst in the nation. In 2018, 90% of black students attended predominantly non white schools. Almost 2 out of 3 black students and almost half of Latino students attend intensely segregated schools where less than 10% of student enrollment is white. Now, an institution attempting to target this issue by providing education to students across New York City is Bard High School Early College. It's an institution where high school students earn a high school diploma and associate's degree, taking two years of college courses to earn 60 credits. The first campus opened in 2001 in Manhattan, where, according to US News, 1/3 of the body identifies as white and 2/3 as marginalized. The school was considered diverse compared to the rest of the school system. Yet as a recent graduate, it was often very segregated from who would dominate classroom discussions, who socialized in the halls and clubs, to the dynamics between students and teachers. How does an amazing institution like Bard that is championed for serving underrepresented demographics still sadly contain segregation and isolation? How can institutions meant to help the leaders of tomorrow make them feel welcome and as though they have a voice? And so today, with these questions in mind, I brought together some of the amazing kids that I went to school with to hear about their experiences attending what felt like a very segregated high school in New York City. I just want to ask you guys, why did you choose to go to B Manhattan over a traditional New York City public high school?

[Student Speaker 2]

For me, I had taken the SH SAT and I had gone into Brooklyn Tech. But when I was talking to a bunch of my cousins, I had a cousin that went to Bard High School and a cousin that went to btec and Brooklyn Tech sounded like hell incarnated. So I decided that if I went to Bard, at least I would get, like, early college credits out of it.

[Student Speaker 4]

So it seemed more worth it for me.

[Student Speaker 5]

Yeah, a lot of people go there. It's a little too much.

[Student Speaker 4]

How about you?

[Podcast Host 2]

I also did the shsat, but I didn't get into Brooklyn Tech.

[Podcast Host 3]

I got into the.

[Podcast Host 2]

From Staten Island School that. I don't remember the name of the. So not where I wanted to go. But Bard was definitely, like, on the top of my high school list because of the same reason I thought I could graduate with, like, college credits and then be done with school in two years. But that's probably not gonna happen because I don't go to school that allows for that to happen, so.

[Student Speaker 5]

Right.

[Melissa]

Yeah, I know.

[Student Speaker 5]

For a lot of us, it felt like that wasn't super clear until we were doing, like, the college process and then we found out, oh, most schools don't take these credits.

[Student Speaker 4]

Yeah.

[Student Speaker 5]

Yeah. Very unfortunate. So for both of you, Bard was pretty high on your list?

[Student Speaker 6]

Yeah, like, academically and stimulated intellectually. And I felt that BSEC had that environment, and even if it didn't, I was getting out of there, so that was another motivation.

[Student Speaker 5]

Yeah. Well, that's interesting because you also went to a charter school, right? Chances I did, yeah. Well, okay, so you tell me more. Why'd you choose B. Sick?

[Student Speaker 4]

Well, my charter school is poor, okay? It's no longer here anymore. It's been shut down. We were severely understaffed, underfunded, and honestly, I didn't really know what was going on in terms of, like, high school. And we started, like, planning for our, like, high school application list back in, like, seventh grade, which was online. And I wasn't really paying attention at the time. So when they told us, like, oh, yeah, show us your top three schools. I just searched up the top three best school high schools in New York City. BSEC came up. I put that number one and stayed number one ever since. That's. I never really took too much consideration into where I was going. I think that associates degree was, like, a little, like, add on. But truthfully, I just. The best school in New York. And that popped up. And I was like, I want to

[Student Speaker 5]

ask about, like, your expectations going into Bard. Like, what did you think the school culture, the curriculum was going to be like?

[Student Speaker 2]

I guess, for curriculum wise, because unfortunately, our Grade was the year. Or maybe it was just my mom. Maybe they did have it, but we didn't go in to see the school or anything like that. Yeah, like, I have a vague memory from second grade from when my cousin went and her. My aunt had work, so my mom took us both. That was like, my vague memory from second grade, but other than that, like, I didn't remember anything.

[Student Speaker 5]

Well, we were coming off of COVID Yeah.

[Student Speaker 2]

But I remember curriculum wise, I just. The only thing I knew was seeing both of my cousins that went to that school crying, studying for class. That I was just preparing myself for that.

[Student Speaker 1]

Wow.

[Student Speaker 5]

Who were your cousins? Were they there when we were there?

[Student Speaker 2]

No, they were not. They actually, like, a couple years before us.

[Student Speaker 5]

Oh, okay.

[Student Speaker 4]

Okay. Wow.

[Student Speaker 5]

Okay.

[Podcast Host 2]

I thought that because I heard, like, early college and then like, in your last two years, you take college classes only. I thought that we would be able to choose our majors, and that was another reason I wanted to come to Bard. I thought that I would be able to take some, like, more STEM focus, like, of course, some humanities classes, but like, a lot more STEM focused classes than I actually did. But, you know, I think. I think the curriculum is fine. I like the way it. It turned out. I think that if students were able to, like, choose majors, like, I heard that happens at Brooklyn Tech and, like, other art schools like that, so. But I also heard that those schools are a mess, so no shade. But, like, I'm happy that we got a nice, I guess, equal playing field of both humanities and stems.

[Student Speaker 4]

Well, not equal in terms of, like,

[Podcast Host 2]

teaching, but equal in terms of, like, you have to take this amount of humanities, this amount of STEM classes like that. That's.

[Student Speaker 6]

I thought it was gonna be. I didn't expect it to be as not diverse as it was in the beginning. Yeah, never crossed my mind, actually.

[Melissa]

No, that's a lot.

[Student Speaker 6]

I looked up the divert and it told me it wasn't, like, super diverse, but I think seeing is really believing. And so even though I had known when I had gotten there, I was still kind of, like, shocked that I wasn't really seeing people who looked like me at every turn, because that's what

[Student Speaker 2]

I was used to.

[Student Speaker 6]

So it was definitely a big adjustment, like, culture shock wise. And then in the curriculum, I think same thing. I think it wasn't that I was shocked that it was harder or, like, on a more rigorous level. It's just that seeing is really believing and that it took me some time. It wasn't more of, like, a shock that it was happening Shock that was happening. It was a shock that I was there and it was happening to me. So it was definitely more of an adjustment. But freshman year was rough anyways, so.

[Student Speaker 5]

Well, yeah. Well, you both did Smart Scholars or Summer Scholars?

[Student Speaker 6]

I did. I don't know if Kansas did.

[Student Speaker 4]

I did in 10th grade.

[Podcast Host 2]

Not freshman year.

[Melissa]

I did in ninth grade.

[Student Speaker 5]

Well, I mean. Well, can you. Can you explain what Summer Scholars is? But do you. For you, Zoe, do you think that the reason why you were kind of, like, confused that, like, the population there was because you did Summer Scholars, and that is really different from the reality of it.

[Student Speaker 6]

Okay, well, Summer Scholars is a program that supports underprivileged and underrepresented students from underrepresented and underprivileged communities. It can be based on where. Like, the neighborhood, your neighborhood that you grew up in or the middle school you went to. I think, for me, that was my case. And just like, you already got into bars, and now they're just trying to offer some extra support where. I think some view it as a diversity program. And you can, but I think it is more, like, based on your background. It just so happens that a lot of brown and black communities fall into the. The kind of system they set themselves up for. But, yeah, I do. I never thought about it like that, that maybe it was Summer Scholars that kind of, like, shaped my understanding. But even in Summer Scholars, I was.

[Student Speaker 2]

I was.

[Student Speaker 6]

What it was is that it's a smaller group. So, yeah, I'm seeing people who look like me, but I also wasn't. There was a lot of diversity in certain Scholars. Like, so in my immediate friend group, I was like, the only, like, the Summer Scholars. For me, one, I was the only black girl. I like that, I think, because Summer Scholars was, like, a small group. So I, like, something in me still knew, like, this wasn't going to be, like, the population at school, but I did, like, know. I knew statistically what it was going to look like. I just didn't expect to be so shocked when I saw it, because I was like, okay, this is, like, actually happening. Like, I'm actually here in real time.

[Student Speaker 2]

So. Yeah.

[Commercial Narrator]

Yeah.

[Student Speaker 4]

What about for you?

[Student Speaker 5]

Chances?

[Student Speaker 4]

Yeah. When I first started applying to high schools, my teacher, like, my high school credit counselor, was like, there is this website you can put in your school, the school that you want to apply to, whatever high school, and it'll pop out a, like, pie chart of the, like, general breakdown for each different racial group. Latin including. Including Hispanic people and, like, Native Americans or indigenous people. And whatnot inside of the school. And when I did that, it said that Bard was majority Asian. And then it was like, next after that was like a very close second for white. The after that was, I think, Hispanic, black, indigenous. And then Polynesian was like 0%. So I came in already knowing that I was going to be in a very weian space. So when I got there, I didn't really, like, sit there and go. Because I wasn't too shocked by it. I knew there was. That I was coming in to school be a bunch of Asian people. And I wasn't necessarily bad. I wasn't, like, mad about it. I was upset. I was like, damn, no black people. But I wasn't really angered or, like, annoyed by it anything. I was like, all right, I'll just go make friends with the Asian people. I didn't make friends with Asian people, but

[Student Speaker 6]

I would actually argue that it looks whiter than it did than it said online.

[Student Speaker 5]

Yeah, I didn't know that they said it was more Asian.

[Student Speaker 1]

Huh.

[Student Speaker 4]

I remember that.

[Student Speaker 6]

I was just like, wow.

[Podcast Host 2]

I knew that a lot of white people went to the school because I. When it came to researching, like, what do you call it, High schools, I. Me and my mom, we sat down with that big book of high schools, flipping through, flipping through and then looking at everything that there was to look at. So I had, like, an idea. I saw that the percentage of white people was maybe, like, on the higher end. So I was like, okay, this is. This is okay. Like, I'm gonna be around white people. Like, that's. That's cool with me. I got into my first history class at Bard and I was thrown for a loop.

[Student Speaker 4]

Oh, my God.

[Podcast Host 2]

It was absolutely 10 toes down. So many white. It was me, and it was one other student, one other black student, and everybody else was white.

[Student Speaker 5]

I was going to ask you about, like, the interactions between students. What were the different kinds of interactions between students of different backgrounds in the classroom? Did you feel like there were certain students that dominated the conversations more than others?

[Student Speaker 4]

I would say that there were a lot of students that were very dominating in class discussion.

[Student Speaker 2]

I can't.

[Student Speaker 4]

It feels weird to say that they were dominating class discussions because on the one hand, they were the people that made, like, you know, participate and raise their hands and were more active in these class discussions. But you also kind of gotta stop and think, why were they the most active people in this discussion? And why weren't the other people so interested in sharing? And it has to do a lot with just, like, this very when you're in a room and you can see the general demographic of the room and you can also see the court, very easy. There's a very, very obvious divide in the room. Not even just in like what like everybody looks like, but in literally how everyone is seated between the minority population and then what would be considered the white population of the room. Even if a couple of those people in there are not fully white, they are still white adjacent and they hang out with their white counterparts. So by association, unfortunately they're going to be considered a part of that white population. And when you notice that that white population is much larger and much more grouped together than the minority population, it's a little more scary to insert yourself in conversations that you can see them very passionately engaging in because there's like a good chance, there's not even like a good chance, there is a very strong chance that your opinion will kind of be bulldozed over or jumped on. Personally I've had my experience of that, especially in conversations when it comes about like when it's talking about race or anything like that. We've had multiple, we've read multiple books during like the course of senior year seminar about race and about, especially about black people that have, in the conversations about those books have just felt very dull and dry. And that's because nobody really wants to address the racial, the very obvious racial aspects of any of those books. And when you do try to talk about it, especially as a black person trying to talk about, you know, black race, you would think that the black person in the room would know the most about black racial topics. Your not taken seriously. Like there are moments where you would bring an iPad for instance, brought up Darwin's very obvious racism in his book, I don't care to remember the name of the book. But in his novel about like biology and human evolution, his very obvious racism, especially when you're talking about like when he talks about the similarities between black people and monkeys, bringing that up literally was shut down like automatically the second that I said that Darwin was racist and it was very odd that he was comparing black people to monkeys and how like a lot of his takes about human evolution are just thinly veiled racism. I was immediately shut down not just by the people in the room but by my teacher himself told me verbatim that Darwin's racism like that what I was seeing in the book wasn't necessarily racism because at the point at the time that Darwin was writing about, writing in it wasn't racist because he just didn't know that it was racism and that that was just what the general thinking was. So he wasn't a racist, and I couldn't call him a racist. And then there have been other incidents for you with, like, these types of conversations.

[Student Speaker 1]

And, like, it's just that, like, you

[Student Speaker 4]

don't want to put your. You don't want to put yourself out there because there's a very good chance that they're going to disagree with you. And when they do disagree with you, they make it so obviously, like, so know that they disagree with you and they're not willing to accept the opinions of anyone else. It's a very annoying thing to echo

[Melissa]

something that Chancey said earlier.

[Student Speaker 6]

Yeah, it's hard to, like, be comfortable. And I think this is what I was talking about kind of in. It was a subtopic in my podcast episode earlier this season that it's hard to support students coming that are part of diversity initiatives in the classroom when you're not in there. So, like, these diversity, these four diversity initiatives at school that people make up to frame it as students are being supported. They don't target all areas because it's hard to target them in the classroom if you won't listen to them. And so you can't have that. But, like, that's a subtopic anyway.

[Sarah]

So.

[Student Speaker 6]

Yeah. So when you have a clear divide in the room, it does not make you feel comfortable. It tells you that there's already subconsciously a size being picked and being lines being drawn, what you can say and boundaries you can say.

[LifeLock Advertiser]

What you.

[Student Speaker 6]

I can't say in a school that's supposed to be liberal arts and support and promote free thinking and critical thinking. If you already seen these subconscious lines being drawn in a war zone, that's the classroom. Saying certain things, it's like stepping on. It's like stepping on a field of landmines. And like, any little comment you say can be just like, be blown out of proportion or blown up. Like, we make jokes about how during certain books, if you say something, the school people are going to frame you as, like, anti semitic or racist or just really radical and just. Or kind of unfathomable as a thinker, just like dumb or like something just like you're not intelligent, it's easy for that to be turned on you. So especially coming from people of color, students of color, who we have to be so careful in what we say and what we do and how we dress and how we appear in the classroom and what we think, what we're in Doing our homework because we're already fighting so many stereotypes consciously or subconsciously that are brought up in the school. Even as free thinking as bar and even as inclusive bar, I feel like people don't really mention how even as welcoming as you can feel at bar, we didn't constantly. Racist acts weren't constantly being done against us. But there's still, like, that subconscious and underlying female racism and the way people acted both in and out of the classroom and actual racism acts that were happening, like, that wasn't not happening. So when you look at schools that are supposed to be as, like, rigorous and challenging and inclusive, and Bard is a top school and we're still facing these, like, issues, it's really sad, but it's the reality. And so, like, for there to have

[Student Speaker 1]

been more like, POC solidarity. But the truth of the matter is there was not really a lot of that. Like, there was a lot of the

[Student Speaker 4]

time where I would look around in

[Student Speaker 1]

my classes and, like, I would be the only black person or me and

[Podcast Host 2]

my other friend would be one of

[Student Speaker 1]

two black people in the entire class. And at points, like, stuff like that got isolating. Especially I felt it really heavily during a lot of my humanities courses because it just is very easy when, like, you're engaging with.

[Student Speaker 2]

What's the word?

[Student Speaker 1]

When you're engaging with rigorous material. And sometimes that material kind of dives into the black experience. A lot of people just did not take you seriously, just did not listen

[Student Speaker 4]

to what you had to say or

[Student Speaker 1]

felt like you were, like, exaggerating your perspective or would just simply steal your point and restate it. But I consider myself to be stronger in stem and like, a specific interaction I can remember I had was during 10th grade chemistry. I'm so sorry. I'm laughing because I really do love this person a lot. But it just goes to show how, like, just like, your biases subconsciously, or like, it can just, like, shine through and just not paint you in the best light. But yeah, I had an interaction with somebody and our, like, first or second exam scores for chemistry had come out, and it was a difficult course. The teacher was very, very interesting. I can go into her herself as a whole. But I ended up getting. I got like, a basic grade. I got like a. It was a good grade for the course that it was in, but, like, the letter grade of it wasn't all that spectacular. So I was kind of disappointed. But looking at the people around me, they had done a little bit. A little bit worse. And one of my friends who's What'd you get? I got, like a 80, 86, something like that. Like a B plus. But one of my friends who had done a little bit worse than me, we were talking about it and she was complaining about it, which fair. Because there have been a lot of tests where I've been like, wow, like, this was so unfair. Like, I really hate how I performed, and academics do matter a lot in our school. But the person turned to me and was like, but it's good that you got that grade because, you know, like, you're the minority. And I was just like, what that mean? I'm sorry. I was like. I was confused on what that meant. And I was just like, that probably wasn't the best way to voice that.

[Student Speaker 5]

What do you think schools like BSEC could do to allow all backgrounds to feel more seen both in and out of the classroom? And then also, if you could give advice to a ninth grader who might be in a similar position as kind of we were, what advice would you give them?

[Podcast Host 2]

Don't be afraid to talk to your student. Talk to your students, the teachers.

[Student Speaker 2]

Right.

[Podcast Host 2]

Don't be afraid to maybe pull aside those few POC students who are too scared. And then for students, don't be afraid to talk to your teachers, because that's actually what I did. We sat down and we had a great conversation about what she can do to maybe, like, have more classroom engagement and more discussion between, like, the entire class instead of, like, the same five people. And, yeah, nice.

[Student Speaker 2]

For me, I guess I would say. I don't know, there was. I'm just thinking back to freshman year. And for me, I don't really think. I think the only thing I could have changed was telling, like, freshman year, me or, like, other freshmen, not to force myself to fit into a certain group of people. Like, I think that was something I was trying so hard to do because I didn't really know people that well. And the people. Oh, this was what I did before I got into Bard. I had searched up who else was going to be attending Bard, like, on Instagram, and I had befriended those people, and it was, oh, white people. That I had found on Instagram. And so that's why, I guess my freshwin Needs year was kind of so skewed because I was surrounding myself with those people, and they clearly did not want to be around me. And so that was a hard lesson that I had to learn. And some of my teachers were unfortunately not the kindest. But I think, like, it was. It was a very educational year for me. Like, I learned a lot of lessons that I carried with me and even I look back on and I'm able to use them as reference for the future. Like, I think my only lesson would be, like, learn to stick around people that actually want you around. There's no reason to force it just because you've known someone or. I don't know.

[Student Speaker 4]

Yeah, yeah.

[Student Speaker 5]

Chidima also gives this last piece of advice, a story about what her teacher did for her.

[Podcast Host 2]

Because this is what did to me. And it sucks that she did it at the end of the entire year of freshman year, but she pulled me aside and we had a great conversation about redlining and charter schools in New York City and how segregated they are and why that's like why I'm so scared to speak out. And it was towards the very end of the year, like, of like instructional, I guess, time that I would have the guts to raise my hand during our Americas class. So, like just having those conversations with those few students, like, you don't have to, you know, lunge at them about it, but like, you know, so I felt like your students, your, I guess POC students of color will feel a lot safer, like kind of engaging in these rough conversations about why they don't want to speak in front of a class full of white people and how they feel about it. So like just holding space. Holding space and like being willing to listen to those students and why they maybe feel uncomfortable to speak instead of always calling them out in the middle of class like, you know, I think that definitely helped me.

[Student Speaker 2]

Yeah,

[Student Speaker 5]

It was so amazing getting to hear their experiences. Many that I experienced in different forms. I sometimes struggled to speak in classroom settings that I didn't feel comfortable in. I didn't always feel like my opinions represented the majority of the room. And I felt like I'd get crickets so I'd hold my tongue. And I felt unwelcomed in many of the student led clubs, clubs that were full of cliques and the same looking people, people that I felt like I didn't look like or wanted me to be there. I was constantly confused, always wanting to find others that felt similarly to make me feel less alone. From this podcast, I want students who are attending similar institutions to know they aren't alone. Even in New York City, a place that's supposed to be so diverse faces much segregation. And I want educators to learn about the experiences of students behind the scenes stories about how they feel within the classroom and social settings so they can help create safe spaces. Thank you for listening.

[Lucretia Berry (Program Director)]

My name is Lucretia Berry and I am the Program Director for New Girl City. We want to thank you so much for joining our podcast and realizing that Society and Love island and New Girl City and New York City all have something in common. If you want to find out more about New Girl City and our programming, follow us online at Girls Club NY or you can find our website at www.girlsclub.org new-girl-city have a good day and thank you for listening.

[Student Speaker 5]

Oh the End.

[Commercial Narrator]

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