Sometimes, it’s a Ponderosa (Feat: Shar Jossell)

Summary

Gettin' Grown – "Sometimes, it’s a Ponderosa" (Feat. Shar Jossell)

Podcast: Gettin’ Grown, Loud Speakers Network
Episode Date: March 17, 2026
Hosts: Jade and Kia
Guest: Shar Jossell

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Episode Overview

This episode continues Gettin’ Grown’s Women’s History Month series, welcoming journalist and media personality Shar Jossell to the “kitchen table.” The conversation delves into evolving and expansive definitions of womanhood, Black women’s experiences, intersectionality, and the nuances of trans experience in Black communities. Personal anecdotes, cultural critique, and sharp humor abound, grounding a deep and affirming dialogue around authenticity, representation, and self-care.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The World’s Getting Worse – Community & Coping (01:07–05:00)

• Jade and Kia kick off with their frank observations about global and national turmoil, emphasizing how predatory systems—specifically the military-industrial complex—target Black and brown communities by promising opportunities but delivering peril.
  • “That’s why… when I worked at Foot Action, the army would be outside… never at Express Men…because you all are predators in very specific communities.” – Jade (03:46)
• Laughter and Black culture as survival: They discuss the need to “just leave us alone”—visualizing making a map of neighborhoods to be left unbothered (“we’re just on the porch barbecuing and having tuna mac”—Kia).

Pop Culture, Self-soothing, and Black Joy (06:31–11:33)

• Sharing what’s getting them through hard times: TV shows (Elsbeth, Matlock), loving Morgan Freeman’s dulcet dinosaur narration, and memories of Black musicals.
  • “I watched Jade watch the trailer, and so… she’s calling [dinosaurs] by name, like her cous.” – Kia (08:02)
  • Humorous sidetracks into Black theater, musicals, and the subversive comics of church plays and singers.
• Black joy is framed as a form of resistance and self-care.

Reflection on Responsible Tech & AI (11:47–16:29)

• Kia shares moderating an SXSW panel on responsible leadership in AI, stressing tools should center student success and equity, not displace humans.
• Jade and Kia unpack violence and exploitation stemming from tech/data center placement in marginalized communities.
  • “You disrupt… Black and brown communities by putting data centers and poisoning these people… running up electricity bills… all the harm that comes along with… misuse.” – Jade (13:21)
  • “If we… turn our attention away [from necessary system reforms] and solely on AI, we will only use the technology to further power systems that are problematic and marginalizing.” – Kia (15:20)

Kitchen Table: Expansive Womanhood with Shar Jossell (22:01–92:22)

Defining Womanhood – Personal & Evolving (24:49–29:51)

• Shar on womanhood: Shared experiences, culture, expansiveness—not just “flat,” narrow social definitions.
  • “In my lived experiences… life isn’t as black and white. There’s so much nuance in between… the boxes… that’s what I mean by expansiveness.” – Shar (26:06)
• Media, family, and cultural icons profoundly shaped Shar’s early, more rigid ideas of womanhood (southern belle upbringing, Destiny’s Child as a model of femininity).
  • “I venture to say, specifically so many Black millennial trans women have been… impacted by Destiny’s Child…leaned into hyper femininity… camaraderie and sisterhood.” – Shar (30:33)

Navigating Tradition, Authenticity & Intersectionality (32:58–41:37)

• Growing up trans in a traditional, Black Southern context: authenticity as shield and source of confidence.
  • “At each station that I was at, I was 100% in and I knew who I was… that is what kind of pushed back, and then I was able to carve out space for myself.” – Shar (35:14)
• Proximity to “social capital” (popular friends, family support) afforded her protections that are not universal.
• Gratitude for “clarity around knowing who you are as a shield and protector… can’t nobody tell you who you not.” – Kia (37:29)

Shared Threads of Womanhood Across Difference (39:04–47:16)

• Kia asks what all women share. Shar identifies misogyny and the threat of violence as a somber throughline, alongside moments of connection, heartbreak, and joy.
  • “What unifies… womanhood is the misogyny… the propensity to be assaulted, to be disrespected… a through line that I think all women, regardless of background, share.” – Shar (40:51)
• Vulnerability, shared laughter, and moments of heartbreak are experiences that unite women of many walks.

Respectability, Performance & Inter-Community Politics (47:31–53:47)

• Shar discusses embracing certain traditional norms, not as revolution but as authenticity—sometimes receiving pushback for not being a “radical” within trans spaces.
• “My self identifier is not Queer… I don’t view how I show up in the world to be abnormal… I look at myself as normal. Who gets to dictate what’s normal?” – Shar (49:40)
• On being a Black trans journalist: intentionally leads with her skills, not only her identity, eschewing being pigeonholed as “the trans correspondent.”
  • “I was able to exist as Shar… not have to be there as the trans correspondent. I’m a correspondent who’s trans.” – Shar (52:33)

The Dangers of Reductionism & Media Representation (58:21–63:39)

• Media frequently reduces trans narratives to trauma or stereotypes, flattening lived experience.
  • “Can we see a trans person walk into the coffee shop…without them getting jumped…that is not a reality for everyone. That reinforces harmful tropes.” – Shar (58:21)
• Urges for more normalized, diverse, everyday representation in media.

Womanhood as Evolution and Nuance (64:07–83:39)

• Family influence, especially Southern Black respectability, shaped Shar’s early presentation (“If you gonna do it, you better do it right!”).
• Importance of unlearning restrictive norms—every woman’s journey is informed by unique experiences.
• Shar elaborates on the particular emotional toll and complexity of dating and love as a Black trans woman.
  • “I have not had, some of the experiences I thought I’d had because… mine have been rooted in being used and being so emotionally manipulated…” – Shar (79:29)
• Calls out the persistent threat of being blamed/victimized if harmed, and how silence benefits men: “Men benefit from us not talking to each other. That’s the big divide. All roads lead back to men.” – Shar (84:05)

Big Takeaway – Humanity & Respect (87:22–92:07)

• Shar’s wish: Listeners remember trans people are people—family, co-workers, neighbors—deserving of respect, not to be dehumanized or politicized.
  • “The conversation in this country has gone so off the rails…they have dehumanized trans people… Don’t look at us as a political boogeyman… We are not monolithic. Get to know people’s stories for what they are.” – Shar (88:50)
• Encourages picking up books by Black feminist authors for broader understanding (Audre Lorde, Brittney Cooper).

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On Authenticity:
  “No matter what I threw at you, you were gonna be who you were going to be.” – Shar’s father (Paraphrased, 35:14)
• On Shared Struggle:
  “We all fighting the same fight.” – Kia (41:03)
• On Intersectionality & Media:
  “If we exist in theory as the boogeyman, then… it’s all systems go.” – Shar (91:05)
• On Representation:
  “List. When you go grocery shopping, I’m just going grocery shopping… my transness is not my defining pie.” – Shar (58:21)
• On Community:
  “I love that there are things your mama said that my mama said to me… but there are also things you experience that I didn’t… it actually expands our relationship and strengthens our connection.” – Kia (67:34)
• On Womanhood:
  “With age comes firm boundaries… there are people playing in my DMs right now talking to themselves.” – Shar (81:42)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Military & Community Exploitation: 02:17–05:02
• Cultural Coping, TV, Black Joy: 06:31–11:33
• AI, Tech & Marginalization: 11:47–16:29
• Introduction to Shar/Expansive Womanhood: 22:01–29:51
• Intersectionality & Upbringing: 32:58–41:37
• Common Experiences in Womanhood: 39:04–47:16
• Respectability & Authentic Selfhood: 47:31–53:47
• Representation & Reductionism: 58:21–63:39
• Family, Performing Womanhood: 64:07–67:25
• Nuance in Love & Trauma: 75:13–83:39
• Big Takeaways: 87:13–92:07

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Episode’s Tone & Dynamics

Light, candid, and deeply warm—balancing heavy subject matter with humor, lived wisdom, honesty, and loving accountability. The hosts and guest model how friendship, open dialogue, and granting one another complexity can spark empathy and real understanding across differences in Black womanhood.

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Further Resources

• Shar Jossell: @CharSaysSo on all platforms
• Book Suggestions:
  • Sister Outsider by Audre Lorde
  • Eloquent Rage by Brittney Cooper

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Final Note

This episode stands as a resonant, multi-dimensional conversation on what it means to be a Black woman—and a Black trans woman—in America, how we learn from each other, and why expansive, honest dialogue is necessary for forging solidarity and self-love.

Transcript

[Pandora]

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[Ryan Reynolds]

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[Pandora]

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[Jade]

two step two step two step two step two Step two step. There's a star in the east over pyramids in Giza where there once was a girl she ruled the world. Then down the Nile he came with a smile. He was the king, she was the queen. Under the moonlight your eyes won't believe what your mind can't conceive. Ooh. Nights over Egypt. Nights over Egypt. Come on. Jones. Jones girls. Jones sisters. Jones ladies. Jones women.

[Kia]

Praise the Lord.

[Jade]

Praise the Lord.

[Pandora]

Hi.

[Kia]

Welcome back. Welcome, blacks. Welcome to the kitchen table yet again. We're here to talk about the worst adulthood.

[Jade]

Oh, in the worst time.

[Kia]

I mean, it's the. It's getting, the situation is getting worse.

[Jade]

It's getting worse. It's getting worse. It's getting worse. Look, when you got militaries, when you got military people. Militaries and military people is not correct either. But I'm not doing that again. Who are not with this shit. And they're like, yo, I don't. I did not ask to be a part. Now listen, that's another conversation too, right? Because you know, the US Military complex is a predatory system that preys primarily on black and brown communities and poor communities. But we know what else comes in those other poor communities but black and brown communities specifically. So I hate the fact that while I don't agree with this system, y' all are fucking with these young people because you give them promises of free education and all these perks and so forth and so on, and then you send them over there to do nasty fucking work because you wear. We're up in people's business whose business. We don't have no business being a part of, defending or otherwise. And here we are. And that's why when I used to. In college when I worked at the mall and I worked at Foot Action and Express Men just told my age, okay? It was literally as they transitioned from Structure. Oh, yeah. Do you remember the time? I remember structure.

[Kia]

Yes, I do.

[Jade]

When I worked at both stores at the same time while I was in school, the. The army used to be outside the Foot Action. They would not be outside to Express Men. And I told you as a. As a 19, 20 year old Jade, I was like, hey, why the are y' all out here? Why you never down at the Express Men? I don't like that. I was like, it's because it's mostly coming in here to buy sneakers. And they, you know, they got sick of me, so they stopped setting up tables over there. But it really was that because. And I noticed that as literally, as a college student, I'm like, why. Why are you here? But you not there, because you all are predators in very specific communities. You know exactly what the fuck you're doing, and this is why. And then I don't agree with what y' all are doing. So, yeah, the shit is getting worse there. It's getting worse here.

[Kia]

I have been decompressing and enjoying. I have been enjoying black content creators in this moment. I love the ways in which we are like, yeah, you know, writing posts and letters and correspondence to the leaders of foreign nations saying, hey, hey, this don't got nothing to do with us.

[Jade]

Yeah. Can you. I got a. I have a bullet point of neighborhoods that you just. Y' all don't even have to go anywhere near.

[Char]

Listen.

[Jade]

All over the country. Promise you. All over the country, you can stay out of Flatbush. You can stay out of PG County.

[Kia]

We should make a. We should make like a heat map or something for them.

[Jade]

You know what we should make? You remember when there was that ongoing Excel sheet of all the. That Tor blocked on Twitter, and it just. It's growing. Like, we should make that. We should make something.

[Kia]

But for. We need something.

[Jade]

Neighborhoods and counties and like that.

[Kia]

Leave us alone. Just leave us alone. We just on the porch barbecuing and. And having tuna Mac. We're not bothering anyone, okay?

[Jade]

Nobody, nobody, nobody in the house cooking

[Kia]

our greens low and slow. Just let us alone.

[Jade]

Like, y' all need to leave people alone. Leave people alone.

[Kia]

Mercy.

[Jade]

Anyway.

[Char]

Mercy. Yes.

[Jade]

What have I been doing lately to soothe myself.

[Char]

What have you been doing lately? Have you.

[Jade]

Have you caught up on the Elsbeth and the Matlock yet?

[Kia]

Not. Not Matlock, but I am caught up on Elsbeth Tacione. Okay, my dear, but you're my dear.

[Char]

I'll do it tonight.

[Kia]

I'll do it tonight. I'll do it tonight.

[Jade]

Okay, so that the next time we

[Kia]

talk, I will be prepared because.

[Jade]

Where did you last leave off with the season? This season?

[Kia]

Yes.

[Jade]

Yeah, we got new revelations this season. There's new things. Things are moving quickly. They're moving quickly, you know, toward us figuring out who is. Who is responsible for the. Well, Brexit account. Okay.

[Kia]

Because I Listen, because the key cards.

[Jade]

Okay, okay. Matt locked us down. The key cards. And who had access to the room? Now, this is what I'm saying. So. Okay. No, there's new things I need you to get caught up so we can discuss.

[Kia]

Okay, I'm gonna get.

[Jade]

I'm gonna get caught up.

[Kia]

Imma get caught up. I'm gonna get caught up. Speaking of caught up, now you had the opportunity. I remember last time I had made you aware of the dinosaurs documentary. Down to the Netflix. I know that dinosaurs are your jam.

[Jade]

They are my jam and my jelly. I have not. I have not watched it yet. It is on.

[Kia]

You've seen the trailer, though.

[Jade]

I saw the trailer with Morgan Freeman narrating.

[Kia]

I watched Jade watch the trailer. And so you are seeing the dinosaurs and she's calling them by name, like her cous.

[Jade]

Okay, so no seaboard and brontosaurus. Because that's what I said.

[Kia]

I was like.

[Jade]

Because they said, oh, they're herbivores. So they pushed me. And that's wholly untrue. Wholly untrue.

[Kia]

And then when Morgan Freeman started talking,

[Char]

Jay was like, morgan Freeman.

[Kia]

Oh, my God.

[Jade]

Not Joe Clark. Not Joe Clark. Not Joe Clark.

[Char]

Colton.

[Jade]

Colton Blues. They call me Crazy Joe now they gonna call me Batman. I am. It is on my list. I am probably going to watch that tonight actually. I'm probably actually going to watch that tonight. Yes. Because we're going to be done at a reasonable time.

[Char]

We are.

[Kia]

When Lean on Me becomes a musical, Destin is going to play Joe Clark.

[Jade]

Oh, yes. And I'm gonna be miss Miss. Levias. You know what I'm saying, Joe? Like, I have to get into my stern. You know what I'm saying? I got to get into my alfreola. You know, I gotta. I gotta tap in. But I. If I'm not a part of Lean on Me the musical. I'm gonna. I'm gonna be really hurt. And I saw. I think I've told you this. I saw Love Jones the musical.

[Kia]

You did. You did tell me this.

[Jade]

Starring Chrisette Michelle. And I think the nigga from Silk.

[Char]

And.

[Jade]

And I told you there was a random performance of Michelet and like, it was just so much random stuff happening that I'm like, I could absolutely be

[Char]

a part of Lee.

[Jade]

No, Me, the musical.

[Kia]

Oh, absolutely.

[Jade]

I could absolutely be Ms. Lorenzo.

[Kia]

Was it like Portia in it too or something?

[Jade]

Portia was not. Not in that. I saw. I would have to walk out of the King's theater.

[Kia]

Maybe she just did it in Atlanta Club the child.

[Jade]

Was it the nigga? Hold on. Was it Raheem Devon probably played. Who played Darius? I think it might have been Raheem Devon. But the nigga from Silk did come out and sing a song. And then Michelle, because remember, Darius used to play the records. So because it was a theme, a performance, they would have the person. And so it was a random pop up of Michelle a. And a random pop up of the. From Silk.

[Kia]

I love it.

[Jade]

I love black people.

[Kia]

That guy from Silk, he had did a. He did have a church play run too, because he was.

[Jade]

He was.

[Kia]

He did a couple of those.

[Jade]

Yes, he did. Wasn't he in some Tyler Perry?

[Kia]

It was either Tyler Perry or David E. Talbert. Now that was the other main black. The main church. Black church plays playwrights.

[Jade]

I don't think I ever got that. I don't think I got her.

[Kia]

That'd be like. That'd be like, your arms is too short to box with God. Featuring Shirley Feasa or something like that.

[Jade]

You know, that's what it did.

[Kia]

Mama, I want to sing that kind of carrying on, you know what I'm saying?

[Jade]

We don't like the gays featuring Kim Burrell. Kim Burrell.

[Kia]

Can't tell.

[Jade]

That's a hateful something right there. That lady there. That lady is nasty work.

[Kia]

Wow.

[Jade]

Nasty work. What else is going on at the top of this week? You had some tr. You had some travel to do something very cool.

[Kia]

Very cool. It went very well. I had to moderate a panel at south by Southwest Eduardo, which is one of the pre cons for, like, big south by Southwest. But it was really dope. Some of the work that we're doing right now is about sort of responsible leadership and making sure that as we are managing AI As a technology,

[Ryan Reynolds]

what

[Kia]

are the ways that we can do so that center the success of all students and keeping people Safe and still prioritizing learning, making sure that it remains a tool, not something that replaces.

[Jade]

Can you tell me.

[Kia]

Because the girls love. But, you know. Yeah, so it was, it was a dope conversation that I was happy to be a part of. And it was useful because it's, you know, there's lots of talk and chatter, but we were able to connect our audience with like tools and resources and things that people can use and put into practice right now. And it was a really, it was a, it was a, A really dope experience. And I'm grateful that I got to do it and, you know, I did what I got to do and got on out of there, you know what I'm saying? Came on back to the house.

[Jade]

Listen, the thing about AI is, you know, I be on my, I get it. I could be on my soapbox and my righteous indignation kicks up and I'm like, it's killing the planet. And it is, but also the misuse.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Jade]

So. And like the fact that you all take things that can be tools and then they take them too fucking far. And this is where it goes straight to, straight to hell. And then the other side to that is outside of you all disrupting the planet, you disrupt again, black and brown communities by putting data centers and poisoning these people. And so, and when they're, and also not just poisoning them, but also stealing, like literally sucking money out of their pockets that they don't have because you run up electricity bills. And you know what I'm saying? So it's all the harm that comes along with these two, which, which is the misuse.

[Kia]

And it's important that we have conversation. Yeah, it's important that we have conversations about sort of the youth. I mean, we talk about things in, in full and well rounded ways. Right. Because if you're not careful, people will have you out here thinking that, you know, AI is ubiquitous, you know, unavoidable and inevitable and, and you know, inherently good. And they're, you know, like anything, like anything, you know, it can't. It is a tool that can be used for good, but it is also something that could be very dangerous. Like any tool, if you don't know what you're doing with it, you'll do more harm than good.

[Jade]

Exactly, exactly.

[Kia]

And you know, you're absolutely right that there are ways in which this is sort of being pushed and stood up and infrastructure is built around it that is marginalizing communities and not thinking about everyone's safety and wellness and well, being at the same priority. And that's a problem. So I think, you know, we just, we have to tell the truth about these things. And so, you know, I think my position is I heard of someone at a symposium I attended last week, say we keep treating AI like an adoption technology, when in fact it is probably more like an arrival technology, much like the Internet. It is something that is coming and it is happening under our noses and it is happening, happening in ways that we don't have a lot of control over. As such, we have a responsibility to sort of like be aware. Be aware and be knowledgeable about it. And in ways that, you know, we don't fall for the hype and the propaganda and the messaging that, you know, you know, we have to be informed participants and consumers. And so, yes, that's my charge. And, you know, I work in higher ed and, you know, we're talking about what this means for campuses. And, you know, part of our work was talking about, like, you know, we're doing the systems reform that's necessary to make our campuses safe. If we do not think about, if we turn our attention away from that and solely on AI, we will only use the technology to further power systems that are problematic and marginalizing. And so this is why we cannot ignore what is happening, but we have to think about it in ways that continue to maintain our values and priorities. So that's what.

[Jade]

Absolutely.

[Kia]

That's what the conversation was about. I feel like this is a really critical time time. And I was just excited to be invited to be a part of that conversation to run my mouth for good.

[Jade]

Running foundation.

[Kia]

I'm gonna run my mouth for good, okay? For good. I'm not just out here talking, okay? I'm helping. And my mom used to tell me when I was kid, ain't nobody gonna pay you to run my mouth. Run your mouth?

[Jade]

Listen, and my mother never work with my tattoos. Look at me now.

[Kia]

Look at you.

[Jade]

Unemployed. Um,

[Kia]

Health important. Are you crazy? Absolutely.

[Jade]

Yes, I am. But we have a fantastic kitchen table for you all.

[Kia]

Oh, my God.

[Jade]

Okay. We are continuing our Women's History Month conversations with one of our near endearments.

[Kia]

Dear.

[Jade]

Our good sister Shah is joining us at the kitchen table. I'm excited to discuss some of the intersections of being black women in this society and her personal experience, lived experience and journey in defining what womanhood looks like. Please remember to continue to send your experiences, your journeys, your stories, your definitions of womanhood from your lived experience experiences too. Hello at GettingGrown co. Because we would love to read them here this month actually. And Also, don't forget that we have a fantastic roundtable coming up where we get to sit down with Dr. Wendy and a very special additional guest. I'm gonna wait and put that on hold. I'm not gonna give you a name yet, but a very special additional guest. So it'll be a roundtable where we get to discuss all things gynecological, you know what I'm saying? Because I don't want to wrap womanhood up in that conversation. But we talk about all things regarding our bodies, you know, as we're transitioning into some of these new phases of life as well. So please send your questions and everything to hellottinggrown Co for that as well. And we're gonna move on into this kitchen table.

[Kia]

Let's do

[Jade]

foreign.

[Kia]

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[Jade]

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[Kia]

Welcome back, everyone. As promised, we are continuing our conversation in celebration of Women's History Month by talking about the ways in which our understanding of womanhood continues to evolve as we age. And I'm so excited because, you know, it's been a good long time since we've had our sister at the kitchen table and we're just excited to welcome her back. All know her and love her as the brilliant journalist and, and media personality that she is. But you know, she's just our good sister friend. And we're welcome, we're pleased and, and privileged and blessed to welcome Charle back to the kitchen table. Hey, Char.

[Char]

Hey.

[Pandora]

Hey.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Hey.

[Char]

I'm so excited to be back. It's, it's been far too long. I've missed you all. Thank you for having me.

[Jade]

You miss you and I love my Char chat. I got to see Char when I went to la.

[Char]

Yes. Yes.

[Jade]

Did you eat or did you leave

[Char]

before the food Was no you. I first of all, shout out to Jade because I had your gumbo from the day before. You had made it the day before. It was delicious. But you also busted out the pots and pans, and you made jerk chicken and rice and peas and I think cabbage. It was like a multicolored cabbage. Oh, I had a great time sitting around.

[Jade]

I did feed you.

[Char]

I love that. For hours and hours and hours, just chatting and eating and everything, of course, was just like every. I. I just. I marvel at how quickly you can cook. Like, I don't know if it's because we were talking so much, but I was like.

[Jade]

We were chatting.

[Char]

It felt like you whipped that meal up, but I watched you make it from scratch.

[Jade]

Like, there was no, like, out to the grills. Yeah. We came back to the kitchen.

[Ryan Reynolds]

We did.

[Jade]

It was the time, and our poor sister Kia was battling Covid.

[Kia]

I was, because that was the week

[Jade]

we were supposed to have the live show.

[Char]

And then when you all did come to la, I was out of town. So I have yet to. To meet Kia in person. Only through the Internet.

[Kia]

We're gonna do that.

[Jade]

Wait, really?

[Char]

I have never met Kia in person, ever. Only through the Internet.

[Jade]

That's insane.

[Kia]

It's one of my. It's one of my. It's on my vision board. It's on my bingo card for 2026.

[Jade]

We have right this wrong, your bucket list.

[Char]

I got my ticket ready to be down at the walk. Good. I know for y'.

[Ryan Reynolds]

All.

[Char]

And then that date changed, and I was like, well, I'm gonna be in

[Kia]

Cleveland for nabj and them people in

[Jade]

Cleveland, quietest is kept. They got a lot going on in Cleveland. There's a lot happening in Cleveland.

[Char]

Yeah.

[Jade]

Shout out to you all. Cleveland rocks. I do. I love Cleveland. So Char Boogie is Women's History Month, which generally we like to celebrate through our very black lens. Right. Because International Women's Day and Women's History Month, I always attribute that to white

[Char]

women,

[Jade]

but also, we are not white women. So I think it is very important for us to speak as sisters about our shared lived experiences, our individual lived experiences, and our journeys to womanhood. Because, as I called you, I know you listened to the episode from last week about defining womanhood. So I think I would love to start off by asking you, when you hear womanhood, like, what does that mean to you personally?

[Char]

Personally? Oh, that's a great question. When I hear womanhood, I think of. Of shared experiences and culture.

[Kia]

Those are the.

[Char]

The first two things that kind of rattled off in my brain, how I would define it if I just had to do it on the spot. And I think also of expansiveness, that. That's. That's. That's how I would define womanhood.

[Jade]

Say more. Tell her. Give us. Give us more. What is it? What does that mean to you?

[Char]

I think for me, due to conversations, some of which I have participated in, but most of which I have observed because I have taken a huge step back from. From engaging with nicknogs on the Internet, I think that people.

[Jade]

Okay,

[Char]

I think people can have a very flat definition, a very narrow definition of womanhood, manhood and otherwise. And. And in my lived experiences and the lived experiences of a lot of people around me, regardless of upbringing or regardless of identity, you know, life isn't as black and white. There's so much nuance in between, you know, the lines and the boxes that we categorize and put ourselves in. And so that's what I mean by expansiveness. I have some views that, you know, some people might find problematic. We all do.

[Jade]

Everybody knows I do.

[Char]

But I'm always. I'm always willing to listen, and I think that's what makes the conversation for me, one that's always growing and changing because I'm a. I'm. I'm a student of the world. Like, I'm in the world. I look at the world as a classroom, as. As one of my favorite talk show hosts would say, but I'm not going to quote her because Jade doesn't like her and.

[Jade]

Oh, big. Oh. And so.

[Char]

No, but that. That is.

[Kia]

That's the.

[Jade]

Just get on my nerves. That's all she's going to.

[Char]

I'm fascinated by. By the conversations around what we as culture and society determine, define and dictate as womanhood.

[Kia]

Yes. I love that you use the term flat when you describe sort of the. I guess I want to say conventional perceptions of what womanhood is. Last week when we were talking, I think a real light bulb for me was realizing that so much of my understanding of womanhood was really about, like, conventional, like societal labels and norms and, like, expectations versus what I actually experienced more. Like what. What was perceived as women were supposed to be versus what they. What they are. And I. I would say that those lights started coming on for me, you know, in my 30s. But we're just curious, like, you know, well, did you ever have a more limited understanding or. Or perception of womanhood that's now more expansive?

[Char]

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. For me, it's definitely been an evolution, as I expect it is. For all of us. It's definitely been an evolution. You know, I grew up. I'm a product of a southern belle. And when I. When I tracks.

[Jade]

I'm so sorry to.

[Char]

So sorry.

[Jade]

Shar is the. Is the biggest fucking princess. I didn't know that, but that's so funny. Okay, sorry. Keep going.

[Char]

You're fine. Because I always have this conversation with girlfriends of mine because my mom is. She has five sisters and four brothers. She is one of 10.

[Kia]

Wow.

[Char]

And none of my aunts are, like, butch or mask. Everybody. I call it the big four. Everybody is hair, makeup, nails, and fragrance. And so, yeah, I'm talking about even, you know, when you get up, I can remember as a child, like, running errands with my mom and some of my aunts, like, going to the mall. I'm talking about as young as four. And even then, even just with putting on, like, a sweatsuit, there was still perfume and at least a swab of lipstick and some mascara. Like, that's.

[Kia]

I would add one for my family and my. Because mom is one. She had three sisters. It was four girls. But I would say all of them. The one thing that I would add to your big four is jewelry.

[Jade]

Yes, yes, exactly. Yes, exactly.

[Char]

Big jewelry people. Big jewelry people.

[Kia]

A bip and a bop Honey. A bob. Very much.

[Jade]

Always. There's always an accessory.

[Char]

Always. There's always. So, yeah, I'm gonna change it to the big five now. Thanks, Kia. I forgot about the accessorizing with the jewelry. Yes. And so for me, yeah, it was limited. When I. Like I said, when I list. Listen to you all's episode last week. You know, there was a lot of mention of, like, sitcom moms and, like, and. And how women showed up in media. That's how a lot of it was informed for me. Like, I venture to say, there's so many, specifically so many, like, black millennial trans women who have been so influenced and impacted by Destiny's Child. And I'm one of them, right?

[Kia]

I.

[Char]

For me, Destiny's Child, I felt like one of the reasons I gravitated towards them is because they leaned into hyper femininity. They were not dressing and showing up like SWV or Escape or tlc. It wasn't baggy jeans and Timbaland boots. It was stilettos and miniskirts and sassy lyrics, neck rolling can you pay my bills? Lyrics. And so for me not to derail this conversation because I'm a big Destiny's Child, I love Beyonce. But for me, when I think about my foundation, it's all of them. I love the camaraderie and the sisterhood of that group. And so that, because that was a reflection of my mom and her sisters,

[Jade]

I felt like, okay, so this is the original DC is because I was gonna ask you which iteration?

[Char]

Well, I'm, I'm, I'm a little biased because, you know, Tanitra Michelle is from Illinois, she's from Rockford. And I love DC4, but I have a deep appreciation for DC3. Survivor got me through seventh grade. That's another episode, though, that got me through a rough middle school period. Survivor. I was like, I'm gonna show him. But I say that to say, for me, it just was. It was media reflected back to me. Yes, it was media. And I. And for me, one of my most eye opening moments was Two Can Play that Game. And it might sound elementary, but Two Can Play that Game, starring Vivica and Morris. That was the first time I had to confront or I felt like the question was planted, as in, like, who are you going to be? And so, you know what I'm saying, Like, I'm watching, you know, the Girls Run Around. It was a binary film. The girls are running around doing their thing and then you got Anthony Anderson and Morris Chestnut and goatees and briefcases and. And so that film, as elementary and as silly as some may say it is, that really planted a seed for me. So my, it was very binary. My view of womanhood was very binary. It was very kind of rigid, just like manhood. You know, I'm a product of the church. These conversations are kind of fixed. And then as you grow, as I grew and I got to know more people and I had more experiences and more conversations, and there have been people that gotten me together, that have pulled me together, and I'm like, okay, I get it now. So now it's way more expansive. All of it.

[Jade]

Okay. What to those. So those are really like very traditional settings.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Right?

[Jade]

They're like. That are also, as Kia and I discuss often, they're spaces where as much love and culture and things that flow from there and that we still hold very dear today, there are also some deep problems as well. So as a black trans woman growing up in those very traditional spaces and then going through your own journey and evolution, what did that look like for you? Being a part of some of these. Yeah, a part of some of these spaces that don't always necessarily have the safest expressions around the expansion of us as a people.

[Char]

Yeah, for me, it was, it was one of those things where, yes, I grew up as we. I'm gonna just keep saying I statements

[Kia]

because I feel like.

[Char]

I keep saying like, as we all did, but we all did grow up in a very binary society. And I think what saved me and what continued to save me throughout my life has been where I was at each station in life. I've always been confident it. No one's ever been able to pull my car. There's always been an authenticity there that any. No one could deny. No matter where I was in my life, where I was in my presentation, I was exactly who I said I was. I showed up exactly that way. I was unwavering and I was consistent. And so I believe that in a weird way that protected me and shielded me from a lot because people are always, you know, positioning people specifically of marginalized identities for you to prove yourself.

[Kia]

Yes.

[Char]

Are you are who you say you are.

[Jade]

Yes.

[Char]

You know, and so I believe that's what saved me. And that's not to say that I didn't perform. There were times and ways that I did show up and I performed. I was a child, and as an adolescent, I was given certain freedoms. I should mention that both of my parents, although, you know, there's. We've had our issues and things are great now and, you know, it's classic story, you know, in teenage years, years now I'm neck rolling and talking about bills, you know. You know, but my parents, they. We laugh about it now because my parents have been. My dad in particular has been like, look, no matter what I threw at you, you were gonna be who you were going to be.

[Jade]

Yeah.

[Char]

And I was unapologetic. And I did not try to. There was nothing that anyone could do to get me from not being me. There was no whooping, no spanking, no punishment, no do this. No know I'm going. I just. It just was intrinsic. And I think that because, like I said, because I showed up authentically and I showed up consistently because I knew who I was. Even though who I. Who I have been has evolved and has shown up in many different stages throughout the course of my life. At each, like I said, at each station that I was at, I was 100% in and I knew who I was. And so I think that is what kind of pushed back. And then I was able to carve out about space for myself because everyone, typically the people that I had proximity to, held some sort of social capital. Like my friends in high. Both high school and college were like the popular girls, the cheerleaders, step captain, you Know, she's really cute in, in. In her sorority. And it was one of those things where it's like, well, you can't invite me and the girls to the party and leave out our friend.

[Kia]

That's right.

[Char]

And so there was, There was a degree of privilege there that I did not take for granted because I saw counterparts of mine that were not having those experiences that, that were similar to that. But I acknowledged it even then. And I, as an adult, you know, you reassess and I'm like, this is due to the proximity of who my friends were at the time. And my. If. If your best friend is the baddie of the school, then you're going to have certain privileges, even if you are on the margins. And when it comes to the representation and the numbers that mention make up the student population. I hope I answered your question and I wasn't all over the place.

[Jade]

No, I'm always all over the place, so it doesn't really matter.

[Char]

I'm all over the place.

[Kia]

I think you absolutely did in that. That clarity around knowing who you are is a shield and a protector. I believe that that's something that God gives. I think there are people that are placed in our lives that cultivate that. But I think that sort of. Yeah, assurance is a. Is a gift because when you know who you are, can't nobody tell you who you, who you not.

[Jade]

You know, it's divine. Exactly.

[Kia]

You know what I'm saying? And I think that that's something that, that's the, that's the golden ticket. That's the one right there. So, like, it doesn't matter. And I, and I think to the, to the argument or to the point of us thinking about identity and womanhood in this new and expansive way that makes it so much bigger than how you dress or, you know, what your preferences are or anything really. It is. There's the authenticity that makes it so dope. So I think given. Given the different experiences and identities and that the. Those authentic and individual ways that we show up. Do you think that, what do you think women across. Across those. Those differences actually share? Like, is there a line around woman just from your experience and we're just talking to you. Not, not that you're representing anybody other

[Jade]

than you, but yeah, because I don't represent a lot of exactions. I never speak on their behalf very much same.

[Char]

Listen, we could say that till we're blue in the face, but the fact of the matter is that, like, because specific, specifically black trans people are so underrepresented in media, oftentimes, what one of us says becomes applicable to everyone. So thank you for that caveat because I am here again, grown. Just speaking for Char.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Char]

God, I just forgot your question, Kia.

[Kia]

What are the. Across different experiences and identities? What. What are the things that all women share in? In your opinion? Are there things that all women share?

[Char]

Yeah, I think that, again, speaking to that cultural aspect, I am. Because I am a woman who leans towards the binary, and I have done, I feel, the necessary homework. I've read a lot of black feminist theory, Brittany Cooper, Audre Lorde, bell hooks, et cetera, et cetera. I've really interrogated why I do the things that I do. Is it because of social expectation, or do I genuinely enjoy them? And I think I genuinely enjoy, like. Like, I enjoy a trip to Sephora. I enjoy my nails being done. I enjoy designer perfumes. And so when I. When I think about your question, the first thing that comes to mind as a unification is two. There are two arguments that are presented. On one hand, I hear, you know, people describing, you know, menstruation and motherhood and things of that nature. And I never take away from that because that is divine. That is, you know, it is what it is. But there are also CIS women who cannot do those things, right? Do not menstruate, who cannot reproduce. That does not make them any less of a woman. And when it comes to. To the trans conversation in this, I think that, unfortunately, what unifies a lot of the experiences in womanhood is the misogyny. Right? Is. Is the. The propensity to be assaulted sexually, physically or otherwise, to be disrespectful, respected. That is a through line that I think that all women, regardless of. Of. Of background, share. Now, is it the most fluffy and. And bright thing to say? No.

[Jade]

No. But it's honest.

[Char]

Yes. I think that that is also, you know, an ugly side of a unifying thread that links us all together in the complicated journey of womanhood.

[Kia]

We all fight in the same fight.

[Char]

Yeah.

[Jade]

Yeah. And I didn't even. I guess I don't even really. I guess I have thought about it, but if somebody would ask me, that would not be my first response. But it's actually the most honest. It's the most truthful.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Jade]

Like, you niggas are the apex predators, and you show your ass at every turn, whether it be with high beams or, you know, low light, you always find a way to show your ass. And so that is a very. While it's a unfortunate lived experience, it spans all across intersections of womanhood. You're Absolutely, absolutely.

[Char]

Yeah.

[Jade]

Where. What are some experiences in womanhood that you felt deep connection with other women and it doesn't matter the lib. Just deep connection in general where it's like, yeah, this is my shit. This is my tribe.

[Char]

This is my village. For me, again, this is two arguments for me because I, Well, I should say two talking points because there's been good things and there's been good things. There has been shared interests in activities. There's been moments of vulnerability that I've had with girlfriends where it's been like, me too. Or they've looked at me and said, me too. I think that oftentimes we generalize. I think that oftentimes it's just human nature. Right. I think that people struggle to give people the, the, the platform to be individuals. And it's, it can be sort of reductionist and dismissive when you say, oh, the trans community or all black women or black women. Because that's not, because we're not monolithic. We do have through lines that connect us, but everybody's different. Right. And so I think about, like I said, those shared experiences of, of, of shared interests, I should say shared interests of things that excite me, that lean into sort of like those stereotypes, those traditional stereotypes. I bonded with women. I know that. I love when, when Kia does a makeup tutorial, for example, like, I genuinely love the glam. I used to work in cosmetic at a cosmetics counter. So I love like, like we can bond through technique. And you like Danessa Myricks, too. Like, they're just certain conversations. But then I'd say on the. Perhaps the most eye opening, eye opening through line for me has been around, like heartbreak. And what I mean by that is there were years that I spent saying, like, oh, this is happening to me because I'm trans. Or this happened to me as a direct result. Result of me being trans. He showed up in this way. Well, it's always that, like, I'm always good until I'm not. And then I sat around there. There's been a few, you know, brunches, lunches and dinners where I've been like, girl, what's his name? Because the, the stories have mirrored.

[Kia]

Yes.

[Char]

When I say the stories have mirrored. Yeah. Where it is. It's made me pull my own card and say, oh, oh, this didn't happen because I was. There is a, There is a world where I, I, I gave myself that answer. I don't know that to be true or for sure. And I'M listening to this sister story and her story sounds just like mine. So it is by. It's not necessarily by virtue of transness. It could just be by virtue of just being a woman and him being a. Whoever the him is.

[Jade]

Hello. Because we are not monolithic, but are

[Char]

really. That's been really eye opening and really gagged me when I realized because I was going down a pathway of being a perpetual victim, if I'm being honest and being kind of woe is me, because I kept striking out in certain areas of my. Of my personal life. And then like I said, there were stories that even that I've heard on you all's platform on getting grown, where I'm listening and driving or listening and working out, and I'm like, God damn, like, what? Yeah, that's me. That is my story. Word for word, bar for bar. That's my story. So. So yeah, they're, they're. Like I said, there are pros and there are cons, but they're. They're just certain experiences that cannot. That don't have an asterisk by them. Everybody always wants to put an asterisk by the experience. And not all of the experiences require an asterisk. Same with. When you break it down on a racial component, black women and white women are not the same, but there are certain experiences that black women and white women share that don't require an asterisk. Same with tall women and short women. Like, it goes down the line. There are just certain things on a social level. Right. And even on other levels, we can talk about medical field, like, there's just a certain through line that doesn't require an asterisk. And people are very bloodthirsty to separate. Like, well, we're not the same. And that's not what I'm saying. I find beauty in everyone's experience. But also, we're not going to denote or dismiss my experience because there's a lot of intersection.

[Jade]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Char]

Crossover, babe.

[Kia]

And that's the beauty of it, right? I think, I think I'm moving more towards, especially in this. I feel like there's a societal pull. Right? Everyone's trying to find a lane or trying to, you know, know, fit in their category. But like you said, it is an intersection. I think, you know, many of us don't have a lane. We have an intersection. And what is it, what does it mean to sort of fully embrace and live, you know, there as opposed to feeling like you got to pick parts of yourself? I. I think that, that I Love that, that you use that word. And I just, I'm just grateful for these kinds of conversations because it does help us to sort of see the ways that, the connections and ways that we feel like we are isolated and alone and our experiences are singular. And it's like bookie.

[Char]

And I should mention that my view of my own womanhood has been kind of rigid. There have been people that have called me moderate. Right. Because it's been kind of binary. It's been kind of. Yeah, this, like I said this, this conversation can go on for six hours.

[Jade]

But I'm like, go any direction you feel like though. Like, don't.

[Char]

I'm just saying that.

[Jade]

Don't feel like you got a herd back.

[Char]

I'm just saying that what. Within my own community, I've experienced pushback because I lean into certain traditional norms. I am not a revolutionary in the ways in which I show up, up. And leaning into those norms have granted me safe passageways in a lot of ways because I'm not a threat. I'm not bucking up against a system. I'm benefiting from a system in a lot of ways. And I also acknowledge that while also constantly interrogating every step of the way. But I'm also very comfortable and I'm not here me, me benefiting from a system I don't believe intrinsically harms the next girl.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Char]

But I'm going to be authentic to myself. So if I enjoy getting my hair done, if I enjoy dropping a couple hundred at Sephora, if I enjoy Mannies and petties and like I mentioned designer powders. And when I say powders, I mean face powders before anybody tries to get cute. But like design designer powders and eyeshadow palettes and, and perfumes. No, because I can't. I gotta, I gotta nip it in the bud.

[Kia]

Jade. Yeah.

[Jade]

I wasn't even thinking about cocaine.

[Char]

I live in la. I live in la, so I have to put that caveat because people get excited. Right? So and so, yeah, I look at that, I look at this system, I'm able to deconstruct it. I'm able to interrogate it. And I look at how, just like everyone else, I'm a flawed human being. Not only participating, but surviving in it.

[Kia]

It same. Yeah.

[Char]

And so that is where sometimes, you know, people are like, girl, you ain't no radical. Girl, you ain't no leftist, you ain't no. And I, I believe my politic is queer, but like, for example, I do not. My self identifier is not Queer. I do not self identify as queer. That is my personal choice. Right. I've written read essay again, the black feminist theory. I do not view my. Myself or how I show up in the world to be abnormal.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Char]

I don't view it as weird. And I know that people have found power in that, but I don't.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Char]

And I don't. I also, in reclaiming my. My self agency and autonomy, I don't give the world the permission to define that for me. Nothing about me is peculiar, weird, or like I said, there's beauty in that. But I look at myself as normal.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Char]

Who gets to dictate what's normal?

[Kia]

Exactly. And why does normal have to be the same for everybody? Go ahead.

[Char]

That's the better question.

[Jade]

Exactly.

[Char]

And so that's, that's where it kind of gets kind of sticky with me and my personal politic when it comes to addressing things on. On public platforms. And like I said, again, I'm willing to hear everything. But this has been my. Throughout my own interrogation. And I. I litigate so much for myself. And as a working journalist, I'm constantly having conversations and I know where I land.

[Jade]

You're not. And the thing about it is, as you're saying these things, I'm thinking about, you know, just the quick trajectory of what I know I've, you know, for the years that I've known you. And I'm like, you're not quiet. It's not like you hide anything. What is it that is expected of what do you like? What is it that is expected of you to be doing? Are you like, that's like us as. That's like somebody being like, I need you to come and speak to on all fertility rights. And I'm like, I can't do that. Like that.

[Kia]

Don't what.

[Char]

What it is, Jade. And this is about to get real spicy on getting grown. What I believe it is based on conversations I've had with people and based on things that have made their way back to me is some of my peers and counterparts at the beginning of my career took issue with the fact that we all like for me, I don't compete because I what's for you is for you. Can't nobody come in between what's for me. I don't care how much sabotage, how much hijacking. And I think there was an issue because I've always led with the type of journalism that I do. When I entered the field, I did not enter in an activist space. I did not enter through nonprofit, which is Fine, if you do. But I think that there was a resentment from some of my counterparts that I was able to exist in certain spaces, particularly black spaces, and I was able to exist as just Shar. I was able to interview the cast of Martin. I was able to do certain things at the BET Awards and not have to be there as the trans correspondent. I'm a correspondent who's trans. And that was very. At the time for me, that was incredibly calculated because I knew what type of journalism I wanted to do. I did not want to be relegated to just talking to Billy Porter. I can talk to Denzel, too, and I have. I can talk to Courtney B. Vance, too, and I have. And I think that some of it. That. So a lot of the. The conversation that came down to around me boiled down to that, because it was almost as if, how dare you exist in and around Hollywood and not. And not lead with the fact that you're trans? And I did not lead with the fact that I'm trans because I did not find it pertinent to the job. They call me and they want me to talk about Laverne on Orange is the New Black. We can talk about it. But if they call me and it's to talk about Mary J. Blige performing at Sofi Stadium at the super bowl, that's what I'm talking about. I don't. I don't find it necessary to bring up my identity or my gender in this conversation, because I'm here just to talk Grammy fashion.

[Kia]

Yes.

[Char]

And that. That's the quiet part that people don't want. Well, they do say out loud, just not to me. And it's found its way back to me, which is fine. Everybody is entitled to their opinions and their critique. Critiques. But that is. That has been a lot of, I believe, like, my issues when it comes to. To that. And it doesn't help that I'm. I'm still solid. I'm still very confident in who I am, and I've been affirmed each step of the way. And so, yeah, it's. It's layered. It's really layered. And I feel like I'm talking out of school. Like I'm, oh, I'm getting grown. I'm talking out of school. But it's. It is what it is.

[Pandora]

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[Kia]

So good.

[Ryan Reynolds]

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[Jade]

I got it. No, I got it.

[Kia]

Seriously, I insist. I assisted first.

[Ryan Reynolds]

You.

[Char]

Don't be silly.

[Kia]

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[Char]

On purchases.

[Kia]

Okay.

[Char]

Rock, paper, scissors for it.

[Kia]

Rock, paper, scissors. Shoot.

[Pandora]

No.

[Kia]

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[Char]

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[Ryan Reynolds]

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[Jade]

No, I think these are. I think these are honest conversations that need to be had, right? Like, I think that they're like, I be candid, right? I've known Char now for some years. I've asked Char to come on Jaden xd. I've asked you to come on Getting Grown. I don't ask you to come on the programs through the lens of like, I'm gonna bring on my trans friend Char. That's because I, I don't look at you. No, it's not that. That is, that is your. That is part of your lived experience. And I'm never going to act like that is not important. But that is not all of who you are. And so my love for Shawn comes from our conversation, from your personality, from the humor, from the time that we've spent together. And so I've always wanted to be mindful of making sure that I acknowledge my friend's lived experience, but also not make that the sole focus of not just our relationship, but our interaction. Interaction. How we interact out in the world. Like, and I think the conversations are important, right? We also need to have uncomfortable, necessary conversations between CIS and trans black women, right? Because we've got to find a true solidarity. We are fighting a really nasty system out there where it's attacking all of us and it's attacking us in very specific ways as well. And if we don't, if we don't talk about it, then they're gonna keep being able to do the things that we do and we're never gonna band together and come together. So I think there's a fine line between hosting these conversations in a responsible way, but also not pigeonholing people into one specific space as well. Am I, like, am I making sense to y'?

[Kia]

All? For sure. And I would Say that the system also is set up to pit us against each other. It is about. It is designed to be divisive. It is designed to generate more confusion and angst and vitriol than understanding and alignment and, you know, just connection. And so, like. Like, Jay, like, you know, I. You know, Char is Char, and I love Shar.

[Jade]

Yeah.

[Kia]

Because we connect over life and. And makeup and. And church.

[Char]

We have.

[Kia]

And. You know what I'm saying?

[Jade]

Y' all got more in common than we do.

[Char]

You know, he and I had a heart to heart one night a few years ago. I was going through it, but, like,

[Kia]

it's very much like, you know, and I think that, like, I don't want anyone to look at me. And, like, I. I have. I think I have experienced people looking at me and deciding who they think they are before they. Who I. Who they think I am before they get to know me.

[Char]

Me.

[Kia]

So I am conscious about doing that to other people. And I don't. You know, I. So. So again, I think that is the gift of having, like, multi. Yeah, go ahead. I'm sorry.

[Char]

I was just saying, like, multifaceted womanhood. Yes. It goes back to what. What Jade is saying. Like, my transness is not a secret.

[Kia]

No.

[Char]

It is just a piece of my pie. It is not my defined lining pie. But that's the sum of my experiences. Absolutely. My experiences have not. Has, so far in life, have not been dictated, determined, or driven by my transness. When I go cash a check at Chase, I'm not cashing a trans check. I'm not having a trans experience, whatever that is, because that's up to the person to define. Right.

[Jade]

Correct.

[Char]

When I go grocery shopping, I'm just going grocery shopping. Like, it's not somebody. And I think that that's also the reflection in media, like, what I've been complaining about for years. Like, can we just get, like, an insecure. Can we see a trans person walk into the coffee shop to get them a cup of coffee and meet up with their friends and walk their dog and put up, like, without them getting jumped on the way to the. To the coffee, you know, or thrown in the dumpster? Because that is not a reality for everyone. That's some people's reality, but I think it reinforces harmful, harmful tropes and stereotypes when we have one singular tunnel, descriptive vision of what people think the trans experience is. And that's not problematic to say. Just, like, at one point, you know, black men had to fight in Hollywood to not be defined as thugs. Black women have to fight to not be defined as, you know, welfare queens or what have you or maids or whatever.

[Jade]

Exactly.

[Char]

So that, like that, that, that diversity in the ways in which we show up. And I'm so passionate about this because the media determines so much, because y' all know, people don't read no more.

[Kia]

People reading.

[Char]

They not watching documentaries. So our, our shows, our movies like that stuff. It matters.

[Kia]

It matters. It matters.

[Char]

It does. It matters because that's how people then go out into the world and interact with, with people who are 0.1% of the population and have no political power but have the biggest bullseye on their back.

[Kia]

Exactly.

[Char]

Yes.

[Kia]

There are such.

[Jade]

I would also argue. Oh, my God.

[Kia]

I was gonna say there are costs to these narrow lenses. Yeah, the cost are absolutely great. Like, and I'd absolutely. Go ahead, sis. I, I, that's what I was gonna say.

[Jade]

No, I was just saying, I, I will also argue to your point. Sh. Of, you know, sometimes I'm just going to the store, I'm just going to the bank. I'm just going, you know, to wherever. I will also argue like, like, I like my makeup. I'm binary. There's a lot of people. We're all different. Again, I'm clearly. I, I do. I'm not a makeup girl. I am not the most feminine girl in the world. But I would, I would say that your activism is also you getting to just exist as yourself as well.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Jade]

And I don't. And I, I would hope somebody can widen their own perspective of what. What quote unquote, activism or whatever is supposed to look like, because we can't sit in one breath and talk about part of being joyful is that is radical, and we get to be ourselves despite whatever's happening outside, and then be mad when somebody is doing that.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Jade]

So that's all I was saying.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Jade]

What you about to say, Kia?

[Kia]

I was gonna say, I think that the audacity, the courage, the confidence, the intellect that is required to know who you are and to define who you are for yourself without anybody else's input or opinion. To me, like, when I think about womanhood, when I think about strong examples of womanhood, it is that. And I think that's what I'm sort of taken away from this. And when we think about future generations and what we want the babies to think, like, if we want, if we want to. If I'm thinking about the narrow ways that I thought about womanhood or femininity.

[Jade]

Yeah.

[Char]

Yeah.

[Kia]

And what that, you know, how that translated and Shaped my upbringing and limited and skewed my perspective. When I'm thinking about generations coming up after me, I want them to see womanhood as this. Like, we were talking about Jay last week, like, our grandmothers, you know, some of them were super hyper, and some of them were not, like, you know.

[Jade]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Kia]

Didn't make them any less grandma. Like, didn't make them any less grandma.

[Jade]

Not at all. No, not at all. Yeah, not at all.

[Char]

And history has shown us that womanhood is something to be defined by the times. Yeah. The definition of what we consider feminine or womanly has changed, like, every 15 years. When you look at the history of this country and of the world, the world pre colonization was way more expansive when it came to, you know, gender variation. It was like, everybody was, even you. Like, every corner of this world, Romans, Greeks, every colonization was way of in there. It was puritan culture that brought in the binary of, you know, suits and ties and dresses.

[Kia]

Right.

[Char]

And so that is. I think that that also has to fold into this conversation, because to your point, Kia, when I look to the future, I want people to be able to exist as they are.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Char]

Without the social. Without the social hierarchy or pressures to. To, you know, conform. But also still interrogate each. Yeah, interrogate along the way. That's what I do. I interrogate along the way.

[Kia]

Yeah, yeah. Because we're all subject to change.

[Char]

We're all evolving. Yeah. Yeah.

[Kia]

That's how we evolving, and that's how we are able to reflect back and note the differences and how experiences have shaped that evolution. Right. It's like, yes, there were certain things that happened to me when I was 22 that shaped how I see myself at 43. So. And speaking to that. Yeah, go ahead.

[Char]

Speaking to that. When you just said that, something just popped in my brain because my. My family. I have a supportive family. And I know that some of that comes from. Let's just say I have some aunts and uncles that were very. Upon my transition because I was always feminine. I should mention my transition did not come as a surprise to anyone. I was not like, captain of the football team and then was like, hey, like, I was always. Like, I was wearing makeup in high school, so let's start there.

[Jade]

Okay.

[Char]

Like, I was very, you know, the doll diva. But y' all know black families. Right. And I had aunts and uncles. I can remember in my infancy of my transition. They were like, knife, now, if you gonna do it, you better do it right.

[Kia]

All right.

[Char]

That also influenced a lot of my early a Lot of my early approaches to. To my. Like, I have aunts that would be like, now, now, where's your slip? You know, like, I just remember having these conversations.

[Jade]

You're.

[Char]

Send me a picture before you go on that job.

[Jade]

Skirt ain't falling.

[Char]

Right. What are your foundations looking like, really?

[Jade]

They.

[Char]

They ran a tight. They ran a very tight and. And critical program.

[Kia]

Program.

[Char]

Right. But that also folded into. To my presentation. That is the family that I come from. But I can remember those.

[Kia]

Those words.

[Char]

I can laugh about them now. And I was laughing about them then.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Char]

But that was the thing. Like, it was like, okay, we're wrapping our heads around this.

[Kia]

Yes.

[Char]

No one surprised.

[Kia]

Okay.

[Char]

We kind of saw this coming.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Char]

But if you're gonna do it, you better do it right. Don't be now.

[Jade]

Don't be out here if you're gonna do it. It's like. Is the problematic piece of this. It's like, problematic. I hear you. And we'll get to that later.

[Char]

But in the name of, like, I just think, like. Like what Kia was mentioning about that evolution and how I had to unlearn certain things for sure. That were really placed upon me because if you gonna do it, you better do it right now. Don't. Don't be walking around here bearing our surname. You know, you out there looking raggedy

[Jade]

and foolish, you know. Okay. Okay. Which is very black and very respectable.

[Char]

Respectability.

[Kia]

Very.

[Char]

I come from a very respectable, respectable family. They are very big into respectability politics. So. So we're all like, I'm unlearning isms and phobias and all. Like. I feel like we all are, but they're just. Sometimes it feels like there's an emphasis on certain things with certain people and I. And it's across the board. And it's like, there. There's some grace there, especially if people are still learning. But when you have background, context, text, and. And. And you're able to have these types of conversations on such a large platform, like getting grown. I think that it. I hope that your listeners are listening to this episode and really taking in the diversity of the trans experience, because if they know a trans person, I. My story might mirror theirs or it might be very different.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Char]

And I think that's so important to. To conversations. And it echoes the theme of the show. It echoes the theme of the this month and you all series that you have going on around Div. Diversity and womanhood. No two people have the exact same story.

[Kia]

Yes.

[Char]

And that informs and shapes the one. The women that we grow and evolve into becoming.

[Kia]

And no two women should. In my. In my. Like, you know what I'm saying?

[Jade]

They shouldn't.

[Kia]

Like, that's what makes it so. That's what makes it good, though. You know, it's like the fact that we can come together and have moments of. Like you were saying earlier, Char, like, I love that there are. There are things that your mama said to you that my mama said me to. To me. I love that. But there are all. But there are also things that your mom. That. That you experience that I didn't experience, for which I learned. Right. And it doesn't. It doesn't make me question or doubt any aspect of who you are. It actually expands our relationship and to me, strengthens our connection. So I think when we are forced into these singular or linear perspectives and viewpoints and boxes and lanes, we lose the opportunity to see all of the beautiful depth and breath.

[Jade]

Yeah.

[Kia]

And there's.

[Char]

That's where the policing comes in. Yeah. That's when people. Policing and minding their. Minding other people's business and trying to govern over their lives. That's where that comes in. Because you're showing up not in a way that I was taught to.

[Kia]

Right.

[Char]

You're showing up in a different way. And instead of being receptive.

[Kia]

Yes.

[Char]

And at least willing to listen. Yeah. Right. You want to come to me talking about what you don't agree with is if what I do has anything to do with you.

[Kia]

It's true. It's true.

[Char]

It's so peculiar to me. It's so strange.

[Kia]

And we miss. We miss the opportunity to learn. Go ahead.

[Jade]

I think it.

[Char]

It.

[Jade]

It just shows. It's the beauty of the diversity of us as a people as well. I don't want to run into, like, I. I meet more black women than I should who have been sexually assaulted. Right. That doesn't mean that I want to. That I'm going to all of my. That I want to only engage with people who have been assaulted in a way, because it's like, oh, we all share this lived experience. You see what I'm saying? And I think there's some beauty when I meet somebody that's like, you know, I've never had that happen to me. I actually grew up in this way where I'm lucky because I know so many too many people or this. And I think that's beautiful. Right. Because that is. That is a lived experience that will bond a lot of us in a way that is not, you know, not necessarily unhealthy. It's just what it is. But I think also the diversity and finding somebody who's like, you know, I actually had a pretty, pretty calm childhood. There is some comfort in that. When I hear somebody say that, I'm like, damn, that's really.

[Kia]

I had a supportive family. I'm like dope, you know what I'm saying? Like I had a really important family.

[Jade]

I'm not looking, I'm like, what? Nothing bad.

[Kia]

I never had.

[Jade]

You never got jumped, your parents didn't divorce, like, you know what I mean? So I think to look from that, to look for that in any, any one community to, to expect that you're supposed to present in a certain way is narrow minded as a human in general and with, there's beauty in everybody's individual lived experiences and that's how we learn so much about people. And so I just, I hate that you've had to, to navigate that. But I also love that you're like, yeah, nah, I had two healthy, loving parents and you know what I'm saying? And I'm a debutante and I don't know what else to tell you. Like, I think there's that, that's dope to me as well.

[Char]

It hasn't, it hasn't. It hasn't been. Yes. In comparison. Yes. As you were speaking, I was thinking about in 2020, there was someone that gave my phone number and I'll be really quick with this, but there was someone that gave my phone number to a woman who was trying to orchestrate a panel about bridging lot of conversations about CIS women, trans women coming together, da, da, da, da. And this woman from New York called me and she took over the entire conversation. She was like, I, I'd love to connect with you, I'd love to. Blank, blank, blank, blank, blank. But this entire conversation she was projecting stereotypes onto me and she became so disappointed when I said, and I gave her so much grace because I said, well, you know, that's not necessarily my story, but I can point you in the direction, because this was a paid opportunity, I can point you in the direction of something my sister, you know, and she got off the phone with me so quick and I don't know if it was due to agitation, embarrassment or both, but it was crazy for her. Like when I think back in hindsight and this just came to mind when you were speaking Jade, to call someone and to assume that you know their story based on, I don't know, headlines or media narratives or what you might have seen on pose and it but

[Kia]

again, I don't know if I, I

[Char]

even found her because we're so underrepresented as a community that people think that through shows like Pose or Legendary or articles that they read that there's a there that we all have the same stories. Particularly I'm talking specifically to black. Black people.

[Jade]

Huh. We had to engage in sex work and we had to, you know. Necessary.

[Char]

Yeah, yeah. And even. And so it's like when, when you don't hear that. When, when you. It was like she was disappointed that I did not engage in survival sex work, which is fine. That I have. That I'm college educated, which is fine. I can speak to those things. But she was not interested in having that conversation in her framework of bridging whatever gap she perceived between black CIS and trans women for whatever reason. And so yeah, I just, I had to note that. I just thought about that. That literally happened in the pandemic.

[Jade]

It happens all the time because again, as humans, many of us pigeonhole people due to one aspect of themselves instead of looking at people as whole humans. Yeah. And I hope that conversations like these allow somebody to check themselves and like zoom out and be like, you know what? Let me look at somebody as a whole human as a. As opposed to one aspect, one detail.

[Char]

Yeah.

[Jade]

Of them. I would hate for people to look at one aspect of me and my lived experience and put that on me as my whole being. You know what I'm saying? And so I hope that this does that. I hope this does that Key and I were talking about the difference different. You know, we go through so many stages of womanhood, whether it be performing in ways that we think womanhood is supposed to look like, like to also coming into ourselves. And I know you've always been very sure of like who you are. But also we know just an age, an age as that we live so many different. So many different lives. Can you talk to us a little bit about your journey through that womanhood and what maybe different things look like at different times for you when it came to your womanhood?

[Char]

Oh my gosh. For me it's been to. Cuz not only am I hard headed sometimes I could be a little bit of a know it all. Especially when I was younger.

[Jade]

Not you. Capricorn.

[Char]

Yes, I was your Capricorn. Excuse me. I got it. Thank you. You know, giving very that. Oh Capricorns. But I, I'm someone I guess in age. I just turned 38 in January and I've been content with how I thought a lot of my experiences as far as like, love and dating were on, were on par with my cis counterparts, and they really weren't. Oftentimes with LGBTQ+ people, there's a conversation around, like a delayed adolescence. You know, people turn 30 and it's like, why are you acting like you're 15? Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, you know, which is still a fair question because by then your frontal lobe has developed like you, you should be moving.

[Jade]

Any adult in any community, I to want you grow up, you should be

[Char]

moving a little differently. But I realized that I was filling in, like, when I look at like, chapters because, like I said, I haven't had issues socially. So I'm thinking about, I'm zeroing. Zeroing in on love, on romantic love in particular, because that seems to be the only area that I feel like my gender is really affected. Like, really shows up. Right? It shows up a lot there, the conversations that I've had. There's a, There's a prison. There's a unique prison. And being positioned, or I should say actively participating in, in this, like, exception box, because you can choose whether or not you want to participate in that. And in the past, I have, right. There's been guys that I've come across who, you know, I never thought, you know, I would never would have known or I never thought that I would be attracted to, you know, but, but, but. And it's just something about you and Young Star really bought into that and wasted so much time and dealt with so much emotional abuse. Why am I laughing? It's not funny.

[Jade]

No, because we laugh in trouble.

[Char]

That's so relatable though.

[Kia]

It's so, like so many of us want to be the exception. Or it's like, oh, he not gonna do that to me. Or like, we feel.

[Char]

Well, even if I, even if I didn't know and I've talked, I should mention, I have talked to like, plus size girls. There's a lot of like, like cross over there when it comes to trans bodies.

[Jade]

And we can do colorism, texturism. Yeah, all of that.

[Char]

And so, and so for me, I had to come to, to, to terms with like, no, a lot of my, like, dating and, and love experiences were not on par with my counterparts. I was just being used as a vessel for sexual gratification for men and being lied to and manipulated and kept like, I know I'm special worthy. Worthiness is a birthright. I know this for sure. You know, I don't, I don't question this, but there's something about. Sometimes there have been times where I feel like, am I lying to myself? Because if I feel this way, and I know this to be true, I know this for sure. Why do I feel like my experiences are not reflecting this back to me? It's not showing up in that way. And so I've really had to deconstruct the ways in which I approached romantic companionship to the point where I just. I. Currently, I'm taking a big step back, and I. I've taken a big step back, and it's been very, very intentional because it's like dealing with the games that everybody else deals with. But there's also. That's where the asterisk comes into play that I was mentioning earlier. Especially in today's sociopolitical climate, the conversation has shifted in such vitriolic ways as it pertains to trans people, trans bodies. I'm black. I'm at the Intersect. Like I tell my mom, mom, every day I wake up, and at my intersections, I'm being reminded that the world hates me. I'm being reminded that the world hates black people. And if I don't see anything racist, I see things misogynistic. The world hates women. And if I don't see anything misogynistic, I see transphobia. The world, like, literally all three main intersections that I'm at every single day on socials, I'm being reminded. And sometimes it's all three. Sometimes it's a. You know, it's. What did Jackie Christie call it? A Ponderosa.

[Kia]

A Ponderosa.

[Jade]

Please do note it now.

[Char]

Shout out to Jackie. I used to work on Basketball Wives. Shout out to you, Jackie, if you're listening. That's my girl.

[Jade]

We were just talking about OG basketball before this. Please continue.

[Char]

Jackie is my girl. I love me some Jackie Marie Christie, baby. But anyway, I find. I find it to be. For me, that was the biggest, I guess, journey in my. In my. In my womanhood was just really sitting with the fact that, like, wow, I have not had, you know, some of the experiences that I thought I've had because mine have been rooted in, like, being used and being so, like I said, emotionally manipulated to the point where

[Kia]

I

[Char]

have become physically ill. You know, it's been bad when you buy into the things that people tell you and, you know, those moments of intimacy and. And also dealing with the indecisiveness. It's just such a unique journey that I've been on that I struggle to articulate it truly. But. But I find that to Be my, my most transformative beyond performance, as you mentioned, or beyond presentation. I remember Kia in last week's episode mentioned around womanhood and, and the duties ass that we're raised in. You know, women wash the dishes, men take out the trash, even things like that that all factor into this conversation. For me, it's been like trying being authentically myself. But also there's a degree of performance, trying to be perfect, trying to, you know, divorce myself from Beyonce's toxicity of I just want to be the girl you like love you be.

[Jade]

Oh, no, but those, those lyrics, we, when we reflect on the lyrics, so many lyrics.

[Kia]

It's not just those. Sometimes I'll catch. Sometimes even destiny Shao. I'll catch something and be like, yeah.

[Jade]

Just did this recently as I was making a playlist episode.

[Kia]

No, my girl said.

[Char]

My girl said, take all of me. I just want to be the girl you like. And I sang that at the top of my lungs without thinking about what I was, what I was calling into myself. And that's exactly what was happening. They were taking all of me, my God. Because I just wanted to be the girl that they like.

[Jade]

We be shaking our asses to teacher Moses. Especially after what the K. Trotta put the beat over it. We said, oh, yes, a resurgence. And we'd be shaking our asses to this girl. I just wanna be a girl.

[Kia]

Like, no.

[Jade]

So. And it is definitely a trope in a. It is a, A hole.

[Char]

Yeah.

[Jade]

That is easy to fall into.

[Char]

That has been. Yeah, I'll. I'll put a cap on that. That has been the biggest, I guess, learning experience specifically to my womanhood, specifically to my existence that I have. Like I said, it's been incredibly nuanced. I've been told different things, communicated different things, shown different things. And I just, I, I, I. With age comes firm boundaries. There's people playing in my DMs right now that are talking to themselves.

[Kia]

Hello.

[Char]

Because I know I am unwilling, willing to bend on what I want to entertain in my life. I'm not making caveats, especially for things that I find trivial and stupid. I'm not making caveats and concessions for that because I don't require. Well, I should stop. Someone told me I need to stop saying I don't require much, but I truly don't like. And what I mean when I say that is it's just such foundational common sense. Seems like you don't get to come over here and, and play with me. Because right in my mind, you, you think you can Play with me because I'm a different type of woman. You think you can play with me? Because there have been so many people that have benefited from my silence, because I know the positioning that I hold. I know the game that I'm playing. I know I'm in Hollywood. You say one thing, you're done. People write you. You know what I'm saying? And that's not saying that I'm protecting terrible people. But there have. I've had my share of experiences, and there are men that are benefiting from me being silent, but they also know that I have things to lose. I can't wake up and put all our messages on my Instagram story because I have a lot to lose by showing up in that way. And that's just not my style. And so it's nuance. And also just knowing that y'.

[Jade]

All.

[Char]

It's so weird being in a position. And I know that with femicide and black women, Black CIS women, this happens as well. But just knowing that, God forbid, if something were to happen to me, the world is going to say it's my fault regardless. Heartless. And I've covered stories. There are. There are trans women, black trans women that have been killed stories that I've covered. I can think of one. This woman was, like, living with this man like, they were in a relationship for, like, two decades, and he murdered her. And all of the comments was like, well, if she would have just been honest. My God, I know that that's how the world is going to. God forbid anything happened to me. It's that. That's the comfort in.

[Kia]

In.

[Char]

That's their comfort. Right. Is. Is just like, them automatically, like, I don't have a fighting chance. My story doesn't have a fighting chance. The details of the interaction don't have a fighting chance. And I think that men benefit from that. Takiya's earlier point. Benefit from us not talking to each other. That's the big divide. All roads lead back to men. The reason we don't talk to each other. All roads lead back to men. Every last one of them.

[Jade]

Again, the biggest.

[Char]

Every. Every last one of them. And so, you know, it makes me think TS Madison often times says, we're not tricking them, they're tricking y'.

[Kia]

All.

[Char]

And so, like. But I feel like people know this. Like, you know this.

[Kia]

You know this.

[Jade]

They do. They don't want to. They don't. They act like they don't want to know it, though. And that's the problem.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Char]

Because when, you know they don't want to acknowledge.

[Jade]

They don't want to acknowledge.

[Kia]

You can be held accountable when you know. So it's easier to say. Exactly. Yeah, exactly, exactly.

[Char]

But that is what frustrates me because we, I question if. Well, I don't have much faith that we will see the promised land in my lifetime because I look at the conversations happening and I know that the world is bigger than the Internet, but I look at the conversations happening in this country. I look at aside from conversations around womanhood and male attraction and who likes who. I just look at the conversations in the black community, in and of the black community, just even with the politics. And I'm just like, we never be a united front, not in my lifetime. I do not believe that we will see it. There's too much misogyny. There's too much of the isms, the obious, the too much to sift through. And it can be kind of scary. It can be kind of scary. So I'm just trying to get through my life as an adult woman who is, is approaching 40 in under two years. Welcome and just making sure myself the best version of me that I can give myself and others. I can't pay attention to that other stuff. I'm already surviving in Trump's America, which is enough to send anyone down the rabbit hole.

[Kia]

My heaven.

[Char]

Jade. I know that was very wordy, but for me that has been the transitions through my womanhood. It has not been through family or friends, friends necessarily. People have been fairly consistent with me, but it's been dealing with. And when I was at one point actively pursuing romantic companionship. Now I'm just chilling, but like there's just, it's multi layered threats. You mad cause my resume longer than yours and that you were conditioned to believe that that was never supposed to

[Jade]

happen because it wasn't.

[Char]

Like I'm dealing with egos, I'm dealing with social stigmas, I'm dealing with. With being an armchair therapist nursing your womb. Like it's when I tell you I have and it's like I said, I've been an active participant, but I've been with some incredibly emotionally needy men. Just needy big babies.

[Jade]

We can have conversations.

[Kia]

Like you were saying bar for bar. Like you saying bar for bar.

[Char]

And I've shown up for them. I've prayed for them, I've cried with them, I have shown up for them, they've cried in my lap. I fed them them. I've been a self, a safe harbor for them. And for what?

[Jade]

For them to play girl Play games. But anyway,

[Kia]

child,

[Jade]

I. Sorry, I'm processing in real time. I think I have one more question.

[Char]

Okay.

[Jade]

And Kia, you feel free to jump in if you have anything else. If someone's listening to this conversation today.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Jade]

What do you want them to take away from it?

[Char]

I've played a lot on this episode, but I've also been very serious.

[Kia]

Best part for the course over here at the kitchen.

[Jade]

This is what we do. Hello.

[Char]

I guess I am you all's love child today.

[Jade]

Yeah. Yes, you are.

[Char]

I played a lot, but I've been very serious because I know that, you know, I know how I showed up today, but I'm in a very relaxed state with y'. All, and sometimes I forget that this is going out into the world because it feels like a FaceTime call.

[Jade]

But that's what we wanted. We wanted to be organic conversation.

[Char]

Yeah. Well, I, I'm, I, I'm going to give you organic conversation. I'm just. When it's posted, right,

[Jade]

you're like, well, I have a deeper day. I don't know.

[Char]

No, no, no. As a professional, I, I still, if you are, if you would like clarity, if I feel like engaging in further conversation after this episode is really, perhaps I will engage in further conversation if there's some clarity or, I mean, some confusion around some of the things that I've said. What I want people to take away from this episode is that trans people, trans women, are people worthy and deserving of your respect. We are someone's daughter. And I'm going to speak for trans people, not just trans women, because there are trans men and non binary people.

[Jade]

Absolutely.

[Char]

But we are people siblings. Siblings. We are people's grandchildren. We are people's nieces and nephews. There are people that love and care about us. We are people's co workers. We are people's. We're your neighbors.

[Kia]

Yep.

[Char]

And I feel like the conversation in this country has gone so off the rails that they have successfully dehumanized. Dehumanized trans people. They have successfully demonized trans people and made us this political boogeyman, this hockey puck, this off ramp. We are the poster child for. Look over there. Don't look over here. Don't look at us. Don't look at the cost of living quadrupling. We're going to keep talking about sports that don't matter. And people buy into it. It's successful. It divides feminists. It divides the left. That is the one topic that divides people. And regardless of where you might stand or your opinion might be, Trans people, or even me, I'm still a human being worthy of respect. I'm still a human being worthy of respect and of the gift of life.

[Kia]

Yes.

[Char]

And no one gets to police or judge that. No one has a heaven or hell to put me in. You worry about your own salvation. If you happen to be one of those people, you don't worry about me. That part. You know what I'm saying? You don't. You don't like trans people, then don't transition.

[Kia]

It's very simple.

[Char]

I borrowed that argument from, from Whoopi, right? She always says if you don't, if you don't agree with abortion, don't have one. If you don't agree with gay marriage, don't get gay married. But you don't get to then try to dictate and police what I do with my life. And like I said, people are entitled to believe what they want to believe. There are some people, I'm sure you know, because we're not all monolithic. There might be some, some listeners to you All's very podcast. No matter how inclusive and affirmative you. There are people that just don't rock with me or don't rock with trans people, and that is their right. But I'm still someone's child. I'm still someone's sibling, and I am worthy of love and respect. And I think that all that, that needs to be what comes out of this is that all trans people are, and we are not monolithic. Get to know people's stories for what they are.

[Kia]

Yes.

[Char]

And I know that we're 0.1% of the population and don't know more Americans. A few years ago, there was a statistic that more Americans believe that they had interacted with a ghost than with a trans person.

[Jade]

Person.

[Char]

That's how small we are in the United States. And there's something to be said about that and that, that goes into the six, the, the success in demonizing and dehumanizing us. If we exist in theory as the boogeyman, then, you know, it's all systems go. And so, yeah, I don't want to grandstand and be on my pedestal, but I, I hope that people take away from this just the through lines and like I said, with just like womanhood being expansive. Whether you view it that way or not, I'd ask you to pause. I'd also ask you to pick up a book. Sister Outsider. Audre Lorde, Eloquent Rage, Brittney Cooper. There are tons of great books. I know a lot of Y' all don't read, which is fine. I don't want to sound elitist or snobbish. You can get the audio version, but please just expand. Have them down to the audible. Yes, go down to the audible. There's just. Just a. A wealth of knowledge out there and information, and you owe it to yourself to. To explore that.

[Jade]

Yeah.

[Char]

And so that's what I'd say.

[Kia]

Oh, we love you.

[Jade]

Perfectly said.

[Kia]

Thank you for being here. Thank you for bringing your full, wonderful, amazing, talented, brilliant self to join us at this kitchen table. You are the perfect choice for this conversation.

[Char]

Yeah.

[Kia]

And I'm grateful to know you. I'm grateful that you're a part of my. My family. I'm grateful to call you friend. And you got to come back and see us real soon. Yes, sister friend. You got to come back and sit with us soon.

[Jade]

You do always tell the people where to find you, where they can find you and all of your incredible works online.

[Char]

And thank you all for having me again, Like, I always like coming here. This is my second time, so thank you for having me. And we're not talking. Talking. Yeah, this is good. You can find me everywhere at Char says, so that's sh. With an S S, H, a R S A y S says so that's everywhere. And, yeah, hopefully, you know, this resonates with someone and gets through to someone. And thank you all for having me. I'm deeply appreciative to you ladies for extending and sharing your platform with me in this way where we. We're having personal chat.

[Jade]

Thank you for coming. And also, so being, like Kia said, just being a part of our world and a part of our life, we're grateful to have you here. And. And we know that this is a vulnerable conversation.

[Char]

Right.

[Jade]

Very honest. So we're really grateful that you felt safe enough to come and sit and talk with us.

[Char]

Look, I knew I was in good hands, but y' all know. Y' all know off. Off camera, the day that I've had with running around. So it was like I was running around into this seat, and I'm like, lord, guide my word. I know you hungry. I don't know what they going to ask. Oh, I'm starving. I don't know what they going to ask me. But Holy Spirit, I trust that you will guide this conversation in my word so that I don't misspeak. And it's going to be what it's going to be.

[Kia]

It's going to be what it's going to.

[Jade]

That's it because you are authentically shy. That's all. And that's it. I am that if you if ain't been nothing else, you're authentically shy. So make sure you all check out the description box where you can check out all things char. We'll make sure that Char says so is linked there. And we'll see you all for the next segment.

[Char]

Wasn't that delicious?

[Kia]

So good.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Your bill, ladies.

[Jade]

I got it. No, I got it.

[Kia]

Seriously, I insist. I insisted. First, people with the Wells Fargo active cash credit card before to pay because they earn unlimited 2% cash rewards on purchases. Okay. Rock, paper, scissors for it.

[Pandora]

Rock, paper, scissors, shoot.

[Char]

No, the Wells Fargo active cash credit card. Visit Wells Fargo.com ActiveCash Terms apply.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile with a message for everyone paying big wireless way too much. Please, for the love of everything good in this world, stop with Mint. You can get premium wireless for just $15 a month. Of course, if you enjoy overpaying. No judgments. But that's weird. Okay, one judgment anyway. Give it a try. @mintmobile.com Switch upfront payment of $45 for

[Pandora]

3 month plan equivalent to $15 per month required intro rate first 3 months only, then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra. See full [e-mail].

[Kia]

Let's talk self care. I mean first part of my self care was that conversation with Char because

[Jade]

we love oh sis, so good. Sis supreme.

[Char]

Hello.

[Kia]

And I just love that we can expand our continue our conversation about our expansive understanding of womanhood. You know, thinking about it in such a full and complete way. I love that for us. But in self care I got a chance to spend some time with Rhonda. Rhonda came to visit for the weekend and it was just a good, it was a good time. It was, it was a good sort of break and change of pace for her and change of scenery for her. And it's always just good to have some time with your mom for me. And so, so I think I was telling you sis, before we were recording, like I really am enjoying this season of getting to know my mom in a different way. And I think, you know, as we're both processing grief and just sort of managing this season of loss in our family, I think there are ways that we're see, we're both learning and understanding each other with sort of like new ideas eyes and I think that, excuse me. Has been very healthy and very timely and so, you know, you'll love that. You know, she helped. I was organizing my shoes and had bought some new sort of organizational boxes for my shoes. And so she was in my room helping me put those together. And, you know, we were just sort of like. And we were watching because, you know, she loves. She loves the bachelor and hgtv and they're doing, like, a new bachelor where the. They've. They've invited all. Love the former contestants that were like, carpenters and real estate agents and all of that to come and renovate the bachelor mansion. And they have these challenges. So we watched that, and, you know, of course. You know, we watched the first episode of that, and of course, they. They voted the black woman off first. And we probably just like.

[Jade]

Because you know how they do.

[Kia]

You know, some things never change.

[Jade]

Same for survivors. Even though cute. Get my nerves. Sorry. Go ahead.

[Char]

Exactly.

[Kia]

No, it was just. It was just good to just hang out. We kept it, you know, we just enjoyed each other. Did a little shopping. We got pedicures. You know, she ran errands with me. We ate out a bunch of times and just sort of enjoyed each other. It was a quick little weekend, and I went on to Austin and she went back home, but it was just a cute little girls weekend with my mom.

[Char]

It was a good time.

[Jade]

That's really, like. That's. That's so fulfilling.

[Char]

Right?

[Jade]

Like, it just, like, fills your heart up when. When you walk away from the experience being like, I really enjoyed you. There's something different about, like, you love them. You know that. There's no question about that.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Right.

[Jade]

But then I think there's something. There's an extra layer of sweetness to like, I. I enjoyed our time together.

[Kia]

Yes, yes, yes.

[Jade]

I love that.

[Kia]

Very good.

[Jade]

I love that.

[Kia]

Very good.

[Jade]

I love that. Did you pass my message to Rhonda?

[Kia]

I did.

[Jade]

Okay. All right.

[Kia]

She said. And she said, I know.

[Jade]

Let's just say I basically told Kid, tell Ms. Rhonda that I am her heathen hitter. And if there's something she don't want to do because it conflicts with her spirit, it don't conflict with mine. Oh.

[Kia]

I said, james, she has made her. She will make her services available to you if you're interested in them.

[Jade]

Yeah, I. Yeah. On the list right now.

[Kia]

I know. I know. Yeah, I know. I know who to call, so go. Message received. Exactly. Message received.

[Jade]

Oh, my self care this week is very, very, very, very stereotypical of me.

[Kia]

Okay.

[Jade]

You know, we were just discussing this before recording. Doordash is out of control.

[Kia]

Everything.

[Jade]

Everything is out of control.

[Kia]

The prices.

[Jade]

I mean, groceries are out of control. But I Was like, if it's gonna get out of control, at least let me get two, three meals out of it. You know what I'm saying? As opposed to. To just this one. And we spent $170 for three chicken dinners. So, my God, I have been. I cook often, as you know, but like, I've been cooking more. Like eating out is a true treat at this point. And I made the finest batch of oxtail.

[Kia]

Oh.

[Jade]

That I've ever made.

[Kia]

Come on. That's amazing. My life. That's not something small to say places.

[Jade]

Yeah. In my life. In my life.

[Kia]

My life.

[Jade]

And. And then I've also been, you know, I'm not a pastry girl, but I have been practicing my kolaches, you know, in case people have brunches and things like that. So savory and sweet. They're almost like a mini Danish. They're Czech. Of Czech origin. My toxic millennial trait is that it's. I still say Czechoslovakia, even though doesn't exist any more.

[Char]

Technical.

[Kia]

I mean, for many years now.

[Jade]

But please listen. I feel like I was like 15 when it switched over to the Czech Republic. And I was like, no, we were like, being 80s babies includes, you know, in countries that ain't countries no more. You know what I'm saying? Genetically due to the military, the whatever. Military.

[Kia]

Isn't that wild?

[Jade]

It's crazy. You know, I still say Czechoslovakia, but they are a Czech pastry that can be savory or sweet. So I've been practicing that, and I

[Kia]

think I feel like I've had some in Houston.

[Jade]

Yeah. And then we have a Brooklyn kolache. We have one more place here, and they are a Texas origin because apparently there was this great migration to Texas in like the early 1900s and of. Of Czech people, like, leaving the war or leaving, you know, turmoil back home. And so, because I was wondering, I was like, what's the intersection of that? That's such an odd. Cuz that when I was looking up recipes, they said, check text. And I was like, no, I've heard of Tex Mex. What's check text? And that's what a kolache is. And that was like the. My most favorite. One of my most favorite discoveries in Houston ever known to man was a. So I am now making them. And I told XD what. What makes this so fulfilling is that because I'm not a pastry chef. And you already know when you start getting to breads and doughs and cakes, it's science.

[Kia]

I mean, chemistry.

[Jade]

I made the first batch and I was like, this is good. I think there are tweaks that I want to make to this dough specifically.

[Kia]

And.

[Jade]

And I thought of the tweaks in my head. There was nowhere that had them documented because there's so minimal recipes on it. So I was like, all right. I think if I do this, this, and this, it will give me what I need. I did this, this, and this. And the way that it worked and hit, I was. That was one of those, like, I am celebrating me. I can't believe I did that. I can't believe I did that.

[Kia]

I love it. If you, like, look at my expertise, I have it. I love that.

[Jade]

For me, it is me. It's me. So. So that's my self care slash. I know that's right.

[Kia]

I.

[Jade]

Instead of looking at cooking as a burden or like, I gotta do this, I'm just playing around. We're making Vietnamese food. I'm. I'm just. I'm playing around with so many things.

[Pandora]

Yeah.

[Jade]

And it feels really nice to do, so it's warming my spirit.

[Kia]

I love that.

[Jade]

So that was my self care this week. But shall we close this thing out with our little petty peeves?

[Kia]

Let's do it.

[Jade]

Let's go.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Jade]

All right, then. All right, it's time for the petty peeves. I think. I. I'm trying to figure. I was like, who is this petty peeve with? I think it's with myself.

[Kia]

Oh, yeah.

[Jade]

I foolishly. Okay, so the plan was I hit up Tristan, right. I was thinking he was gonna choose one. One option, he chose the other. That's fine. So I was like, all right, listen, we can either order Costco on. On Instacart and you pay for it, or you have to drive me to Costco and, you know, you still pay for it, but, you know, I'm giving you the option. You want the convenience or not. So he was like, yeah, no, we'll go Saturday morning early. Like, the best time to go is as soon as they open. And I was like, I love it. Okay, now, there is one benefit to going Friday nights and Saturdays that I won't say. But so. So I will say that I'll be factoring that in. But I was like, all right, we go as soon as it opens. So that means I got to get up at 8. Like, we're going to be out the door so that we can be there when they open and get all of our executive black card, you know, because we're not using the Costco all the way. Right. You're supposed to get in, like, 30 minutes early. It's all kinds of things. So we're like, yeah, we're going to go take advantage. Both of us left over. Okay? We overslept. I mean, so we're like, all right, well, now we got to go drop Noah off to dance, and then we got to go to Costco, which means. We. Means going to Costco on a Saturday afternoon.

[Char]

Sheesh.

[Jade]

And it was in that moment where I should. And it was mostly because when I'd done the price comparison. So I'm lied for oxtail, I. The best price was at Costco. When I started breaking down the math, I was like, all right, some places are, like, $13 a pound right now, which I fully blame white people for. And some places are like. I was like, okay, Western beef is, like, pretty reasonable. But then Costco ended up being, like, $8 a pound.

[Kia]

Boom.

[Jade]

So I was like, I'll go to Costco. That was the only reason why I was still determined to see this all the way through. It was instant regret when we got in there. It was hard. It made me realize things about myself that I didn't like. I was having conversations with myself that I won't repeat out loud. I was feeling extra hateful. It was a horrible, horrible situation. I think the. The highlight, the silver lining, was that I ran into a listener.

[Char]

She. She.

[Jade]

She quickly expressed love in an aisle. And I think I.

[Kia]

She.

[Jade]

I found her when we were in the throes of, like, are these the lines? So I'm so. I just pray, sister, if you hear this, I hope I was kind, because I was at my peak irritation in that moment.

[Kia]

Do you hear me? I know that's right.

[Char]

I know that's right.

[Jade]

You know? And it was irritation with myself and others, so. But we did find the hack of the line to get on. I don't know if we got in front of people or not. I. I am enough of a good human where I can't care. I can't carry that moment. Then we get in the parking lot. Now Tristan does something that is infuriating to me. Okay? He's parked across the way. And I was like. He went to the car. He was like, I wanna make sure we don't get towed because we parked in this particular area. Okay, cool.

[Kia]

Oh, my gosh. Okay.

[Jade]

So I was like, I'll call you when I get outside with the stuff. Then you just walk across and help me get the stuff. We'll put it in the car, and then I'm gonna run to the Petco right There. Okay.

[Char]

Okay.

[Jade]

So I call him. And I was like, can you. All right, I. Come on. Walk over and come back. Help me get this stuff. I'm waiting there, like, 10 minutes. You are literally like, it's a walk right across the way. Where are you? I see this causing havoc with the car in the parking lot.

[Kia]

Why are they going?

[Char]

Why did you.

[Jade]

I want to know it.

[Kia]

That's a good question.

[Jade]

So then I have one of those most. So I'm like, what are you doing? When I was walking, exactly, I was like, what sense did this make?

[Kia]

Explain to me.

[Jade]

And then there is another. And he happens to be black in the parking lot. And he's like, yeah, what sense does this make? And I said, uh, none from you. Okay? I said, I am enough. Like, I don't. I don't want to hear your opinions. And he was like, but no, okay,

[Kia]

I get to do this.

[Jade]

You don't get to do this.

[Kia]

Exactly.

[Jade]

Why are you guys mosi. Mosey your ass on somewhere? Who the fuck

[Kia]

are you guys? Okay, that's crazy.

[Jade]

But my irritation is with myself because I should have full. Not going to Costco on a Saturday. Or I should have gotten my black

[Kia]

ass up to go at the time that we shower. That's correct.

[Jade]

Lesson learned. Lessons were learned.

[Kia]

I was gonna say lessons were learned. And, you know, it is what it is. Adulting in practice.

[Jade]

What's your petty beef?

[Kia]

My petty beef is very petty because I would like to talk about television programs, and I think that we are just at a time where I feel like, as a consumer, we're getting cheated because seasons are much shorter than they used to be, and there are so many hiatuses. Is that the right pluralization? I don't know.

[Jade]

I don't know. Oh, yeah. Don't ask me everything.

[Kia]

Everybody's on hiatus all of the time, and seasons are shorter. If you go back in Hulu or Netflix and you decide to stream a show of yesteryear, you will see that like. Like, I'm. I am in my semiannual Grey's anatomy rewatch. Season three of Grey's Anatomy had 27 episodes in it.

[Jade]

God damn.

[Kia]

Thank you.

[Jade]

And.

[Kia]

And I just feel like today, like.

[Jade]

Right.

[Kia]

You know, I just. I feel. I mean, Simpson, Designing Wings, Cosby Show, A Different World.

[Jade]

Marvin.

[Kia]

When you go back and you look

[Jade]

at the season, like, 22. 23 episodes.

[Kia]

23 episodes. And I just feel like, what happened? Like, what happened? And I understand production costs are probably higher than they used to be, and contracts are not set up like they once Were. So I understand it probably from a perspective.

[Jade]

It's because of y', all, though. It's because y' all got greedy with everything and so things are not what they once were because y' all keep making them not those things anymore.

[Kia]

I just, I. It is very sad. I mean, even like. And I know that they're short form series, like, but if you think about it, like Bridgeton, we wait. We wait years for Bridgeton to get eight episodes. And it's really unreasonable.

[Jade]

Like, just Euphoria is coming back this year. I feel like that has been on hiatus for three years. I said a mother at this point.

[Kia]

That's what I'm saying. She's recently. She's a wife. She's grown.

[Jade]

Like, what are we doing?

[Kia]

But I just. I mean, I understand that things change, but there's something that, like, as a consumer, maybe. I don't know, maybe it's just. Maybe my. I definitely need to monitor my expectations. But I just. I feel like I am to the point now where I wait and let the episodes pile up because I need to be able to watch them when I want to watch them. I would rather binge a season than to just be waiting. And then you gotta wait like 911. Like, you know, the girls and. Whatever happened to the holiday episodes? We used to have a Thanksgiving episode. We used to have a Christmas episode.

[Jade]

They do them before the holiday and then they go on a break for three months like they did with Matlock and Elsbeth. I'm waiting on Bob's Burgers to come back. It don't come back until April.

[Kia]

I mean, all. And I understand and I know that people. And I mean, I'm not saying that people got to work year round, but I feel like we could do everything. We batch everything. Anything else. God darn it.

[Jade]

Why don't you all figure out how to do that? I was watching.

[Kia]

I told you, pay for these subscriptions. I'm sorry.

[Jade]

Consistent programming.

[Kia]

I need to be able to watch my programs when I want to watch them. That's all I'm saying. I want to watch my program.

[Jade]

They also prematurely cancel shows, which is infuriating. They did it with. Oh, I know you didn't watch it, so I'm not even summoning you. Lovecraft Country.

[Kia]

But I know that y' all really are upset about that. And I.

[Jade]

Because it was unnecessary. And then I told you I was watching the Santa Clarita Diet. I'm so irritated that the way that they left season three and then in the Netflix just Said, too expensive. We're not going to continue on. Didn't even allow them to wrap the story.

[Kia]

It's really wild. Like, I'm just saying. And I'm just like you, I don't know who's making the decisions. It seems like all the good shows don't stick around and we be having to force with this. It's 98 million episodes of Love is Blind, though. Y' all love that.

[Jade]

Hello, hello, y'.

[Kia]

All.

[Jade]

And I keep hearing that it just getting more and more and more horrid.

[Kia]

It's a season. I mean, it's a new season every.

[Jade]

Every eight weeks, like, more and more horrid. I agree with you. I share this. That petty beef I share. And I get it also. The other side to that is like, we actually never had this much programming or this much access to stuff. We had to wait for reruns. We had to tape things on the vcr. But like you said, when we enjoyed a show, we got like 22 seasons of it. And it was. It was like a few week break in between and people were working and acting. And Hollywood is shifting because the executives are greedy, like every other power dynamic in the country.

[Kia]

And it really. And it. And it deteriorates the art of it. And it makes it like. Like it was a career, like, you know what I'm saying? Like, shows where people's like, whole livelihood, you know what I'm saying? Like, you people be on the show and it's because like six seasons of Designing Women was literally 200 episodes.

[Jade]

Wow. You see, you see, you see endless content. That's why. And this is why they are also our comfort shows, because we can go back to like they were. They're always there. They're always there. And y' all keep playing around with the new stuff with us. So we got to go back to the things that make us feel like warm and cozy.

[Kia]

Classics. We got to go back to the classics. And I feel like there's so much. And I love it. We're in a. We were just talking about AI at work, but I. I was at a funders dinner this week, and it's like, you know, organizations are investing billions of dollars in AI and the truth of the matter is parents are buying corded phones, house phones again. They're getting corded phones and teaching their kids how to call the restaurant and make a dinner reservation. They are saying they are removing screens. They are. There are counties in. In North Carolina who are suing the school board and saying they want Chromebooks and laptops out of the classroom. So I think there. There is a movement also where people are recognizing that we have aired. Like, we've gone too far on the side of, you know, all of this, like, consuming and engaging technology.

[Char]

We.

[Kia]

We are missing balance, and people are craving analog hobbies. Like, we don't. We want. We need something to do that doesn't have anything to do with the screen or device. And I feel like that's healthy. And I mean. And like, you know, I think that. That I feel good. I watch a couple episodes of Designing women. They only 28 minutes, and then I turn over and go to bed. It's not like I have to sit there and. You know what I'm saying?

[Jade]

Yeah. And I also. I realized, too, with the age of switching gears, I guess a little bit, what you just said just sparked something for me. I need to make Noah make reservation. Like, we.

[Kia]

We need to go out to eat

[Jade]

and say, a family. We need to. We went off of breakfast a few weeks ago. They got to. And sit down and order your Shirley Temples, because you only get those at restaurants.

[Char]

Yes.

[Jade]

And, you know, just like, yeah, some things.

[Kia]

There's a woman on Tik Tok who, like, makes her child, like, you know, like, you know, she has. Has a house phone, and she'll make her child like, hello, this is the Smith residence. Can I take a message? Like, those are the things that. That kids don't know how to do no more.

[Jade]

No. What's the house?

[Kia]

You know what I'm saying? And it. And. And it feels small and trite, but it really does. Like, it's this level of social interaction and building that comfort around engaging and talking to strangers and being able to do so and not have a panic attack. That's something. That's a muscle that has atrophy feed in our society. We gotta get it back right? You know what I'm saying? We got to get it back right.

[Jade]

You know what's so funny? Tristan stopped paying the Spotify subscription, and I don't use it. So I was. So. I don't. I don't. But one day, we were riding in the car, and a commercial came on, and I was like, oh. And he goes, oh, yeah. Nah, I. I cut that premium out. And I was like, oh, okay. You know, pray tell, why? I just.

[Char]

Yeah.

[Jade]

And he said he was like, a, I'm not paying them that for all of that. When I can still hear the song, he goes, b, when Noah's riding with me, he was like, let that hear a commercial. Like, she Commercial. She needs to understand that stuff gets broken and it's not always at your access and your freaking to.

[Kia]

Come on, Tristan. That is not.

[Jade]

He is not right.

[Kia]

Wrong.

[Jade]

I said, you better feed two birds with one scone.

[Kia]

It's very true. And sometimes you gotta wait.

[Jade]

Yeah, sometimes. Yeah, sometimes you gotta wait. Think. Cuz that's the problem is that the impulse control is out. It's out of control because everything is at. They have access to everything at their fingertips.

[Kia]

Amazon everything comes right to the house. My friend Lillian was telling me that her. Her son like, asked for some Starbursts or something. And she was like, not right now. And he said, we can't call. We can't call the. We can't call the. The instacart.

[Jade]

You see? Yeah, exactly.

[Kia]

Excuse me, sir.

[Jade]

Exactly. That's no.

[Kia]

Excuse me, sir. We're not gonna install.

[Jade]

No candy coming in the house yesterday talking about, can we order some Popeye? I said, I have a roasted chicken getting ready to go in the oven. Absolutely not. Absolutely we can get it, but we can get it tomorrow and we can plan for it. And then while we're at. Exactly.

[Kia]

That's right. That's right.

[Jade]

Y' all are too comfortable with this doordash and shit.

[Kia]

I fully endorse it, but it's very. It's very true. And I think to that. To that regard, I. I personally just feel like I'm tired of. Of. Of not. Of having to wait years and years between episodes. Episodes and seasons of. I mean, seasons of my favorite shows. Yeah. Either we gonna do it or we not.

[Jade]

That's what's taking you so long to watch Matlock. Because it is.

[Kia]

Because it gone away. It was gone for three months. That's Jay. A trimester.

[Ryan Reynolds]

What are we doing?

[Jade]

Actually, yes. It was gone for a trimester. It was gone for a full trimester. Holy ghost.

[Kia]

God.

[Jade]

Somebody have their baby. They're like, damn, I just want it in the last piece of my gestation. I just wanted to chill.

[Kia]

Okay.

[Jade]

Can't even binge.

[Kia]

That's what I'm saying.

[Jade]

The baby can't even finish this season.

[Kia]

It's like, I got to go. Y' all take it too long.

[Jade]

No. And Netflix will finish the shows, cuz they said, no, you binge too much.

[Kia]

They said they're tired of us. They're tired of me. Because I'm to going awake. I'm gonna wait.

[Jade]

I'm awake and I'm gonna. I'm gonna binge something. Exactly.

[Kia]

Something all the way through me.

[Jade]

Something on in the background every time. But I'm so sick cuz I was. I just saw this other ad the other day and it was for like Acorn TV or something like that. All these thrillers and I was like a whole. A whole channel dedicated to. Ah, I've been there. So now I'm getting ready to go. Yes, short films, please. I heard about Mubi. Stop. I'm about to be on time for that. I will be on time. Well, we want to thank our sister Shar for joining us at the kitchen, please.

[Kia]

Thank you so much.

[Jade]

We love you. We love you big, wide and deep. You can check out all things Char in the by on the link attached in the Bible bio and make sure you stay in tune because Shara be on it journalism wise. She's gonna deliver the news to you and she's gonna do it in a very pointed way. I love the way Char talks. Shar is like.

[Char]

She's professional.

[Jade]

She's such a professional when she speaks. I was on the phone with her the other day and I was like a journalist. Exactly. Journalist. Okay, thank you, sister, for. For joining us at the kitchen table to have a conversation that is so necessary, you know, as black women. And so we thank you for that. Thank you to everybody who tunes into the Patreon so you can see the full video version of this episode and more. Kia and I had a little impromptu extra dialogue the other day, and so you all can go check that out exclusively on Patreon. And since this. Take them out and tell us what to do.

[Kia]

Make sure that you're taking care of yourself, moisturizing your mind. And you do. You can do that by minding your business. Okay? Worry about yourself, especially in these last and evil days.

[Jade]

Yes.

[Kia]

You also want to keep your insides moisturized by drinking just as much water as your body can sustain every day. Hydration is key, girl. Okay. Don't be out here dry and ashy. And. And your skin, girl. Dry and ashy. Moisturize your skin because your black will crack. Crack if it's dry.

[Jade]

The video version of this, you see that my Rihanna forehead is reflecting all of the light. And that is. Oh, my God. I moisturized. That's it.

[Kia]

First of all, I did not know that my mother. My mother. I didn't know my mother knew who Rihanna was. But when, when, when she found out somebody had been shooting in Rihanna's house, she was like, ah, she just had a baby.

[Jade]

Wait, what? Oh, okay, you all go to the Patreon if you would like to hear additional conversation. We'll see you there.

[Pandora]

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