Vacant Spaces (Feat: Kat Guillaume-Delemar)

Summary

Gettin’ Grown, “Vacant Spaces” (Feat. Kat Guillaume-Delemar)

Podcast: Gettin’ Grown (Loud Speakers Network)
Episode Title: Vacant Spaces
Guests: Kat Guillaume-Delemar, President & CEO, Center for Community Progress
Release Date: March 31, 2026

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Episode Overview

This week, Keia and Jade dig into the intersection of community, policy, and self-growth with guest Kat Guillaume-Delemar, a Brooklyn-born, Haitian-descended leader in community revitalization and anti-vacancy advocacy. The conversation centers on the human story behind vacant spaces, the exploitation of Black lands and communities, and how history, activism, and personal experience fuel transformative change. The episode is rich with emotion, laughter, and sharp cultural commentary, interweaving personal vulnerability and practical knowledge for listeners trying to thrive and uplift their communities.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Music Nostalgia & Black Millennial Memories

[01:40 – 14:43]

• Jade opens with a tribute to Michael Jackson’s “Liberian Girl” and its influence, referencing generational gaps on TikTok’s use of classic tracks.
• The hosts evoke late-80s and 90s hip-hop nostalgia, connecting those eras to their coming-of-age stories as Black women and discussing upcoming Jay-Z concerts (with attendant ticketing drama: “I was in a queue with 891,000 people in front of me!” – Keia, [07:03]).
• The segment orients listeners in the show’s signature blend of humor, longing, and Black cultural pride.
• Notable Quote:
  Jade [13:04]: “...my memory is fleeting, many times, but I have clear, colorful memories... the seas, the smells—can’t you? Memories of living off the 4 train in the Bronx during motherfucking baseball season... one of the worst points of transportation in life!”

2. Navigating Current Events with Black Women’s Perspective

[14:14 – 21:09]

• Jade brings attention to issues of misinformation, under-reporting of critical world events (Sudan, Gaza, Congo), and pervasive ICE surveillance.
• The segment emphasizes the need for continual vigilance, self-education, and community care amidst relentless global and local crises.
• Notable Quote:
  Jade [18:57]: “...if you are traveling, they are in the motherfucking airports... you niggas with those motherfucking vests on... may you see the motherfucking day.”

3. Black Womanhood, Health, and Survival

[21:31 – 28:06]

• Jade recounts her harrowing bout with norovirus, highlighting the vulnerability of health, the necessity of self-care, and the everyday heroism of Black women surviving routine adversity.
• The narrative underscores the importance of rest, cleanliness (handwashing PSA!), and familial support.

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Kitchen Table Talk: “Vacant Spaces” with Kat Guillaume-Delemar

[30:40 – 94:42]

Introducing Kat & Her Legacy

• Kat introduces herself not just by her professional titles, but as a “compassionate revolutionary, child of God, daughter of Haitian immigrants, and Brooklyn American.” ([33:35])
• Her story is profoundly shaped by her matrilineage—particularly her great-grandmother, Marie Noel Jeannette, a labor organizer, rebel, and national figure in Haiti.
  • Memorable Moment: Kat’s assertion:
    [34:11] – “...I am currently living a life I didn’t even know I could possibly dream for myself... I am her representation still living in the physical.”

Lived Experience as Foundation for Activism

• Kat details cycles of generational trauma and resilience—her great-grandmother’s activism, her mother’s migration and struggles, her own experience surviving abuse and poverty.
• She illuminates why she honors sex work, survival, and bodily autonomy in Black womanhood, linking it to land, agency, and inherited strength.
  • Notable Quote:
    Kat [48:46]: “I look at land the way I look at the bodies I just discussed... this land has been raped and violated, and this land... is still beautiful.”

Vacant Spaces as Sites of Trauma & Transformation

• Kat discusses growing up in Flatbush, Brooklyn, surrounded by vacant lots, abandoned buildings, and the traumas of poverty and violence.
• Childhood experiences—community organizing to reclaim lots, transforming a “trauma site” into a vibrant park—shaped her entire approach to community work.
  • Notable Quote:
    Kat [57:03]: “...my neighbors weren’t politicians or rich people; they just had enough... chased the drug dealers out, cleaned the trash, and turned a vacant lot into a park.”

Systems, Policy, and Power

• Kat breaks down the systemic roots of property vacancy: red tape, restrictive zoning, punitive taxes, and code enforcement directed disproportionately at poor Black and immigrant communities.
• She critiques protest without policy change:
  • [62:44] – “If all you’re doing is protesting, it’s just unified complaints... until they change the policies, it’s going to be the same thing we’re protesting over and over again.”
• Practical explanation of “heirs property” and how Black families lose generational homes to policy loopholes, predatory investors, and tax foreclosures.
  • Jade [67:05]: “...the aggressive, predatory behavior of stealing deeds while elders are still in their homes is happening everywhere in NYC.”
  • Kat [71:37]: “...you have an elder who’s paid their home off and now, because of new housing nearby, their property tax skyrockets to four times what it was... it’s not equitable; it’s punitive.”

Community Progress: Solutions, Education, & Empowerment

• The Center for Community Progress focuses on:
  • Education of policymakers, residents, and practitioners.
  • Technical assistance for neighborhood organizations.
  • Developing strategic, community-driven solutions (e.g., land banks, creative placemaking).
  • Fighting policy, not people.
• Advice for Listeners:
  Kat [81:24]: “Dare to dream. Don’t see vacant land as just a problem—see its potential... be strategic—complaining isn’t enough, partnership alone isn’t enough. What are you going to do? What do you want?”
• Resources: The Center’s webinars, learning exchanges, and biennial “Reclaiming Vacant Properties” conference (next one: Pittsburgh, Sep 22–25, 2026).
  • Website: communityprogress.org
• On Ownership & Community:
  “It’s not just about home ownership. The folks who chased the dealers out didn’t own; they were renters. You are part of your community regardless.” ([97:29])

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Highlights & Memorable Quotes

• Kat [36:41]: “It’s okay to be ratchet and righteous at the same time.”
• Kat [48:46]: “Land has been raped... but is still beautiful. My mother’s body is still beautiful.”
• Keia [80:11]: “Singular solutions can’t address systemic problems... transformative practice for systems change starts with a changed perspective.”
• Jade [86:20]: “You haven’t said a word about gentrification, and I appreciate that—it reframes the conversation beyond the obvious and towards actual solutions.”
• Kat [89:26]: “Just because that fixture’s been raped doesn’t mean it’s not beautiful.”

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Practical Takeaways & Calls to Action

• See vacant land as full of possibility and power, not just blight.
• Educate yourself on local policies that drive vacancy (tax codes, zoning, code enforcement).
• Advocate for strategic policy change, not just protest—action must follow indignation.
• Partner with community members, but make partnerships strategic, purposeful, and aligned toward change.
• Find resources through communityprogress.org – webinars, guides, and leadership programs for all.

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Additional Segments

Lessons in Self-Care & Food

[101:11 – 116:39]

• Keia shares the joy of “tuna mac” and cultural food musings. The hosts uplift Black women reinventing soul food online.
• Jade discusses listening to her body, calling out of work, and the importance of rest:
  • Jade [112:11]: “Sometimes you have to call out of work for yourself.”
  • Both emphasize honoring your limits and giving yourself permission to rest.

Petty Peeves Parade

[116:43 – 126:46]

• Jade’s: Public yawning without covering your mouth (“Cover your mouth, Grandma, Uncle, Auntie!”)
• Keia’s: Early-morning door-knockers and workplace interactions lacking basic social skills (“Why are you talking to me? To whom are you speaking?”)
• Hilarious riffs on generational service habits and the chaos of name spelling in public spaces.

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Closing Reflections

• Kat encourages listeners to support Black women, emphasize the beauty in struggle, and move beyond complaint to strategic action.
  • Kat [95:05]: “We who are fighting the good fight don’t get enough avenues to speak and support each other... thank you for creating this space.”
• Keia and Jade mark nine years of Gettin’ Grown, reaffirming the show’s mission to uplift, inform, and build community.

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Find Kat Guillaume-Delemar & Resources

• Website: communityprogress.org
• LinkedIn: Kat J. Guillaume-Delemar
• Conference: Reclaiming Vacant Properties, Pittsburgh, Sep 22–25, 2026
• Email: [e-mail] (see episode for spelling)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [30:40] – Kitchen Table Talk: Kat’s Introduction
• [33:35] – Kat on Identity & Faith
• [37:24] – Kat’s Family Legacy
• [48:46] – Land and Black Women’s Bodies
• [57:03] – Community Reclaiming Vacant Spaces in Brooklyn
• [62:43] – Systems, Protest, and Policy
• [67:05] – Predatory Deed Theft & Policy
• [74:59] – Solutions: Center for Community Progress Programs
• [81:24] – Advice for Listeners: “Dare to Dream...”
• [86:20] – Why This Isn’t Just About Gentrification

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Stay safe, moisturize your mind, drink water, and mind your business—per usual. Support each other, honor your ancestors, and see beauty and potential in spaces that others have written off.

Transcript

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[Jade]

Liberian girl you came and you changed my world I love so brand new Liberian girl you came and you changed me girl I felt feeling so true Liberian girl you know that you came and you changed my world Just like in the movies two lovers in a scene and she says do you love me and he says so endlessly I love you Liberian girl He goes lower there. But it was a but that's not the part that y' all think it is, is it? Huh? That's way later. I love Liberian girl Yes all the time now you already know sister. The Other song that comes up. First of all, I want you young people to know that Liberian Girl is off of, I believe, the bad album.

[Kia]

Huh? That sounds right.

[Jade]

Came out in the 1980s or whatever the y' all are saying now.

[Kia]

1800s.

[Jade]

I don't know. They're saying 1900, so I don't know. But you know, I don't know. I'm adding Drazzle Dazzle on it now. That is not a new song. You all just this. The young human. I don't know their pronouns. Who came up with the majorette dance to go along with this trend. This is why it's popular. But this song came out 89. Liberian girl, to me personally, is one of the top 10.

[Kia]

I agree with that. I would agree with them.

[Jade]

I would agree. And also, as an elder millennial, the other song that comes up for me when I hear Liberian Girl is Bitty boy, I've been looking for your ass. It's a quarter pass.

[Kia]

Classic.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

The classics, okay.

[Kia]

The classique.

[Jade]

Whose song is that? MC Light.

[Kia]

I feel like that's about right. Yes.

[Jade]

Was that. Hold on. That wasn't Queen Pen. Hold on.

[Kia]

I don't think it was Queen.

[Jade]

I know. That was the party at a party till it's red.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Come on.

[Jade]

Okay, this is staring at me. But no, that was. Okay. So MC Light, what song was that? MC Light came back.

[Kia]

I don't think it was Queen Pen. Oh, let me.

[Jade]

It wasn't. It was MC Light, Our Scientology Queen. MC Light, Liberian Girl Sample. Cuz it was. That's keep, keep, keep keeping on. Cuz you came and you changed my world. Change my world. Your love. So come on. Doing it right,

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

right.

[Jade]

Yeah. 1996.

[Kia]

1996.

[Jade]

Yes. And she came in there like the baby on the track and was kitty boy. I've been looking for your ass since a quarter pack.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

That's my favorite.

[Jade]

That's a vocal stem for me, if you don't know. Oh, my God.

[Kia]

That's the blast from the past. It's been heavy in 1996 over here. As you know that we are also.

[Jade]

Oh, shit. 30 years.

[Kia]

This week for the 30th anniversary of the Reasonable Doubt, 25th anniversary of the Blue.

[Jade]

So I keep one eye open like cbs. You see me stressed, right? Can I live? That's a valid question right now. I'm so sad. I have not secured tickets and probably won't at this point unless they cost $6,000 to go see Sir Jonathan Covey.

[Kia]

No, they'll come down. I'm confident Cause you know, we are in the market where the Resell killers.

[Jade]

Yeah, I don't like that. I don't like that.

[Kia]

But I feel like it wasn't the

[Jade]

Ticketmaster man on the files. Wasn't he in the files?

[Kia]

Was he? I mean, everybody.

[Jade]

I don't know. Don't quote me on that. I don't know.

[Kia]

Allegedly.

[Jade]

I don't know. Allegedly. Allegedly. Allegedly.

[Kia]

Wow. Okay, so there's still time. And they did add another show. The third show.

[Jade]

I know.

[Kia]

The third show on Brian's birthday. And let me tell you, Brian, we need you, Brian. I got. I got it. I felt like it was. I was. I felt like he looked out because I joined the queue very randomly, not thinking it would make a difference. You got tickets? I got tickets. I joined the queue very randomly. And I was expecting. Because when I joined on Tuesday, when the pre sale started for the original two concert dates, for one one time, I was at a reasonable place. It was like 62,000 people in front of me, which is like two weeks, right? Yes. That was for the blueprint queue.

[Jade]

Okay.

[Kia]

When I signed into the Reasonable doubt queue, I did a whole story about this. When I signed on to the Reasonable doubt queue, literally 800,000 niggas was. 891,000. Some other ungodly number, though, I said, quite literally 1 million niggas was in the queue in front of me.

[Jade]

You see, you know, I don't have that fight in me no more. You know, I don't.

[Kia]

And I just, you know, But I waited and I waited. So by the time I eventually did get in there, and by the time I was in there, there was only, like, floor seats. You know, the tickets that cost 1500. You know, it was kind of like, okay. So I had. Was like, okay, I was the blueprint for the 11th. Okay, we got those. Cool, cool, cool. I was just like, I'm just gonna have to take the L on a Reasonable Doubt. And I was sit my desk working, and my friend Jasmine hit me and was like, girl, he added another show. And I said, excuse me, one more time. What did you say to me?

[Jade]

I'm so sad. I'm so sad. I'm so sad.

[Kia]

When I got into the queue the first time, I was. I was number 184, which. And, you know, I'm not spooky. I'm not spooky. You know, I'm not spooky. But I was kind of just like, this concert is on Brian's birthday, July 12th. Brian was born in 1984.

[Jade]

Yeah, yeah.

[Kia]

I was just like, I kind of feel like my brother said, let me just.

[Jade]

Yeah, we gotta go to this. I am, I was fighting for my life. So I was not even even able to quite literally fight for those that

[Kia]

I was fighting for.

[Jade]

I saw. I couldn't fight for those.

[Kia]

That is correct. That is correct.

[Jade]

I think the only rest in my, If I come across tickets, if, if somebody hits me and says, I think, you know, I'm. I'll take it as a divine, A divine answer. But I am grateful that I have seen Shanathan in his prime multiple times, multiple tours, multiple blocks of his career and life.

[Kia]

And I think that it's been such a good, it's been such a joy to see him age. And I watched the gq. Did you watch the GQ interview? He did an interview with this adorable young man. I don't know who that young man is, but he is, he is quite precious.

[Jade]

I didn't.

[Kia]

But he did an interview with GQ. It's on the YouTube. Okay. And I was watching it and I was just like, there is a wise old man in Jay Z now.

[Jade]

Like, I mean, he better the be.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

It better be.

[Kia]

It better be. And you know, I am grateful because, you know, you know, the narrative. We don't, we don't have a lot. It's, it's just good to see us age. I'm sorry.

[Jade]

Yeah, no, it is, yes.

[Kia]

Yes. It's good to see us literally mature and, like, see the evolution in real time. And, you know, he's still himself in all of the ways that we know that he will always be, but he is grown, like, very much like, and like, wise and well read and deeply cultured. And, you know, I think that they're, I just, I just enjoyed the conversation and just being able to listen in to him, speak to this person who could be his child with such, I mean, not saying that he needed to be patient, but it was just like a cross general conversation because the, the young man had the utmost respect and reverence. He knew Jay Z's music and catalog literally, like, you know, was able to call up, you know, verses and lines and asking, like, very wonderful questions. It was really good. Really well done.

[Jade]

Oh, I need to watch that. I like a good end. I love a good interview.

[Kia]

Solid. It was a solid. I feel bad because I don't. I keep calling him that young man. I'm gonna find his name. But I, I, it made me want to follow more of his work.

[Jade]

All the young men.

[Kia]

Yes.

[Jade]

Okay. Yeah. I love a good, thoughtful journalist I really do. Especially when that is your job. Like, we interview people, but we are not journalists. When that is your job. I love when it's done well, because there's so many people out here now who are bastardizing that.

[Kia]

Frasier Tharp.

[Jade]

Let me look him up. Let's see what this young man looks like.

[Kia]

And I mean, just. I want to know. I mean, he looks very young. He might very. Because, you know, I'm. I'm back. I'm. You know, he could be my age because you know how we age.

[Jade]

This is a young men. I don't think I've ever seen him, but I am.

[Kia]

But he did a. He's an editor.

[Jade]

I love that. Yeah, he is. And he is young and I mean, just precious. That's lovely. I love that.

[Kia]

Sorry.

[Jade]

I love that.

[Kia]

I don't want to.

[Jade]

I can't wait to see that.

[Kia]

Senior associate editor at gq. I love that he said. I think he said when blueprint came out, I was 11 or something like that. I was just like, my God, today.

[Jade]

Wow. When the blueprint came out so good,

[Kia]

I love that I went and followed him down to the Instagram and everything. Because I said, now this young man is very skilled and just a very talented.

[Jade]

Okay, I'm seeing his work. Yeah. I gotta go see more of that.

[Kia]

Yeah. And I am excited. I'm excited about just sort of like now my hope. Okay. I want everybody down to Yankee Stadium to remember that we are all closer to 50 than we are. I don't want. I don't want y' all down there. I mean, get down here and sit down and rub your knee and don't be here trying to do too much. Okay.

[Jade]

Yeah. Cuz you. Cuz. Cuz like to do a lot. Cuz y like a lot. And I want you to know we too old.

[Kia]

We are. All of us are too old for this.

[Jade]

And while my memory is fleeting, many times I have. Clear, clear, clear, clear. Colorful. I can see that. I can see the seas. I can smell the smells, can't you? Memories of living off of the Fortrain in the Bronx. We know during motherfucking baseball season. Please do not get on there with that same foolishness. Listen, that was a. That was one of the worst points of transportation in life. The 4 train during baseball season. Living in the Bronx. Yeah, go ahead and put all that together. You gotta pass 161. You can't even get home. Seven trains pass you by because you can't fit on any of them. But anyway, yeah, I can't Wait. That's so crazy. That was 11 when Blueprint came out.

[Kia]

I think something like that, or. I don't know. Was it? Maybe it wasn't. He said he was 11. He.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

He.

[Kia]

I don't remember which album it was, but he said he had to ask his parents to get it.

[Jade]

Let me tell you something. Blueprint came out on my birthday.

[Kia]

It did.

[Jade]

It came out on the birthday. It came out on. On the day.

[Kia]

You remember when Sis. I remember this very vividly because we were all sort of like sitting ducks because the phones wasn't working. We couldn't really go anywhere. I97 played the whole album.

[Jade]

Yeah. They played the whole album.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Yes.

[Jade]

Okay.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Never forget this.

[Jade]

I've been looking for your ass.

[Kia]

It's a quarter. Listen.

[Jade]

Okay. Oh, my God. No. That was a. What a time to be alive. And what a time, like I said, to be alive for all of the lives, to see all of the progression. Because also, yes, we know there. You know, with life, there are many complications and challenges and missteps. Okay. You know, we don't.

[Kia]

We don't get it.

[Jade]

Right along the way.

[Kia]

He's very honest.

[Jade]

I gotta watch it. I gotta watch it.

[Kia]

He talked about how going through that publicly was therapeutic in healing and really just all the ways that it evolved his thinking and matured him. We also got to see him. He talked a little bit about watching Blue at the Cowboy Carter tour. I won't give it all away. But there was a moment where it was like, look at, look at, look at that. Because something like, she wanted to be on every song. And he said, you will not be on that stage dancing. There's no 6x kills. Please get somewhere. He said, if you don't.

[Jade]

Absolutely not.

[Kia]

That's crazy. I said, and I know.

[Jade]

Walked in the club like nobody's business. Thought she was going to be up

[Kia]

there dipping and boxing, talking.

[Jade]

You will not be throwing that ass in a circle. Excuse me.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Excuse me, ma'. Am.

[Jade]

You can split to the back. Because truth be told, listen, we love you, niece, but I don't want to see you dance to Tyrant, okay? It's not appropriate.

[Kia]

Certain things that mothers and daughters should not be doing on not together.

[Jade]

And that's dancing with Tyrant Together.

[Kia]

That's it. That's it. That's it. And so. And so I'm so glad, you know, it just sort of normalized. Made them very real black parents in that moment. Because he was like, that makes me.

[Jade]

That pleases my soul. That pleases my spirit.

[Kia]

Same, same, same.

[Jade]

Yeah. I can't wait. You know, we need a little light in this world.

[Kia]

This is what I need.

[Jade]

You know, we need to grab the pockets and the. The.

[Kia]

We need to reconnect. Yes, we need to reconnect. I'm very excited about the nostalgia of bringing this back and to really think about it. Like you said, we remember where we were when these albums dropped. We remember, you know, and we've lived life since then. So I'm just excited about coming back around to, you know, all of it and. And just, you know.

[Jade]

Yeah, I'm excited about that.

[Kia]

It's like, okay, yeah, this is gonna be a good time.

[Jade]

I. I'm going to pray that spirit directs me to some tickets. Same, you know, and we're just gonna. I'm just gonna pray the spirit directs me to some tickets, and we're going to leave it there because that's the best we can do. I do want to bring a little news this week because, yes, even though, you know, we are not. We're not bullet pointing everything that happens every week because everything is happening all the time. And I said the same thing on Jaden XD last week. I do think it is important to note, you know, that there are still things going on and that we, you know, we still want to be tapped in and tuned in and get our understanding together. I also redirected people to our episode with ISOSA OSA about misinformation, disinformation, and malinformation. So I also admonish you all to check that episode out again, especially in light of just, like, getting bombarded all the time with things going on all over the place from here and ice being in the airports, ramping up all of their terrorism because, you know, we keep seeing this every week. It's something. There's reports everywhere that they're everywhere. I told you all about my encounter with them, but now everybody's encountering them. If you are traveling because they are in the motherfucking airports, which was written right. This was all. This was all said previously. This was all written down, but it doesn't make it right. And you niggas, you niggas with those motherfucking vests on.

[Kia]

Wow, that's been wild. That's been wild to.

[Jade]

May you see the day that. May you see the motherfucking day. Also in light of. In Sudan, I know we haven't spoken on Sudan in a while. That does not mean that the genocide has stopped in Sudan. And I thought this was very important to note. And I am so grateful for Sarah continuing to Provide information. I have to send her messages sometime because I'm like, I know your spirit is heavy. To deliver this news constantly out of love for your own people, mind you, is still such a wear on the surface spirit, right? But no more of a clearly, no more aware than, than the people who are actually going through it. So the RSF recently, I believe it was last week, as you all are listening to this episode, looted and destroyed the main hospital and pharmacy in Kermuk Blue Nile, following the takeover of the city. And 3,000 residents of the city are. Have been displaced as a result of that. How cruel, how evil and how wicked to destroy a hub that is needed, that is a necessary space in a community. But not a surprise with all of the havoc that they've been wreaking. Meanwhile, 42 paramedics have been killed by the IDF in Lebanon literally in the last three weeks. And so between what's happening here, what's happening in Sudan, what's happening in West Asia, still, things going on in Gaza, they just recently were in the middle of a sandstorm, you know what I'm saying? So it's like no breaks whatsoever. We're still continuing to go on in the Congo. We just want to keep ourselves informed because again, all of these are connected through the evil powers that be. And so I just wanted to make sure we. We noted that this week and I shared that information. But how was your week, sis? How you doing? How you feeling?

[Kia]

I'm safe. I have what I need. I'm hanging in and doing my best. Yeah, Just moving through, doing my best, child. Yes. Literally, you know, life is still lifeing, but like I said, you know, we are, we are just taking it day by day.

[Jade]

Yeah.

[Kia]

How about you?

[Jade]

Yeah.

[Kia]

Oh, man, you've had quite a. The last several days have been a bit tumultuous for my sister.

[Jade]

Yeah, I, I was, I almost. My spirit left my body.

[Kia]

Oh my God.

[Jade]

I caught the neurovirus. So that was not funny at all, actually. Actually. And I only wish it on a handful of people, I really do, especially the powers that be, especially over a particular age, because it gets dangerous. It's dangerous for babies and it's dangerous for old people. So I only wish, I wish that's only on a handful of folks. No, I don't wish it on you. I don't. I. I've stopped the phrase, I don't wish this on my worst enemy because there are things that I do. There are things that leprosy, you know, if I could just pull it out.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Magic Hat bag.

[Jade]

I pulled it out. And now that I have dealt with the neuroviruses going in there, I'm like, I wish this on you in the worst way. It is awful. It's horrible in every way, shape, form and fashion. It stopped my life. The world stopped. Not for it did it stop for me. I couldn't do.

[Kia]

It happened so quickly because I spoke to Jade. What was it, Sunday? What was. What was it?

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Monday?

[Jade]

We recorded our intro for last week's episode Monday night.

[Kia]

Yes. And I talked to Jay Tuesday and she looked like a different person.

[Jade]

Yeah. Yeah, y' all should have Monday night with Kia. And I recorded Kia was supposed to travel.

[Kia]

It didn't.

[Jade]

Hallelu. I was preparing to travel to go see my kids at the detention center. And my grandma. I so key. And I recorded our intro for the reprise last week. Hope you all listened. Wonderful episode. And talked to my grandma for like an hour on the phone, you know, was excited about seeing her packed. I was doing laundry. I got in the shower and that was all she fucking wrote. Yeah, it was quickly.

[Kia]

It happened so quickly. Within hours, I think at night. We recorded that night and it was like not even 24 hours. Yes, it was less than 24 hours. The next time I spoke to you.

[Jade]

No, sister. We recorded at 8. Something. I was projectile vomiting at 1am When I tell you, it just hit me out the blue and then it.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Oh.

[Jade]

Peeled my muffin cap back.

[Kia]

Okay. And I. I personally, I think that vomiting is the worst thing ever. Like, I know I am a full body. Like, the people. I am fascinated by the people who can do it, you know, and just get up and keep on going. Like, most of the time, if I am that sick, it is taking all of my energy. Like, I mean, it is a full body situation.

[Jade]

And also, sorry, tmi, but you know, we are all grown here. Dustin. Actually, I talked to Dustin because Dustin called. He's like, where the you been? I was like, look.

[Kia]

He goes, damn, what's wrong with you?

[Jade]

So then he switched up his tone, right? It was like, I'll send you some juices and some blah, blah, blah.

[Kia]

Right? Of course.

[Jade]

You know he loves me. Justin was like, you know how. He's like, yeah, I know. I bet once you threw up, you felt so good. I said, no, Dustin, I didn't. Because I'm not one of those people that's ever. I don't throw up once. And then it's just like, whoo. Sweet flower relief. I wretch, nigga. Like a fucking 1989 Chevy that's running out of gas. I'm going to wretch till the. Till the. There are three drops of bio left. Like, I'm so. So. I was. I am miserable when I throw up. And when your husband, who you've been with for a decade and a half, says, bitch, I never seen you this sick in my life.

[Kia]

Seriously.

[Jade]

No, you're sick.

[Kia]

Yeah, you look. Your physical appearance looked different.

[Jade]

It's winter. It's winter. So I'm already on, you know, I'm already leaning. You know what I'm saying?

[Kia]

I said that.

[Jade]

Took me over the edge. I know. Thought I was on the shut in. No.

[Kia]

Jay called me and I was like, we. You have. We have to cancel. Let's go to the hospital.

[Jade]

I was like, what do we do?

[Kia]

She was like, no, I think I'll be okay. I was like, no, sister, no, no. We must meet. We must seek medical attention.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Oh, man.

[Jade]

I fought it, though. I fought it that first day. I fought the hell out of it. Like, my whole body hurt. My back. Everything was horrible. It was hard. This thing is horrible. I don't wish it on you. You all know how I am about washing hands and wiping down doorknobs. It can get. It can get anybody. I was bit.

[Kia]

But no. But no one else got it, so.

[Jade]

Tristan and no one else has. Nah, they didn't get it, Noah. I don't know what. I think she was faking stomach.

[Kia]

Shit.

[Jade]

But no, nobody else in my house actually got it. I masked up. Like, once I. I realized what was happening, I immediately, you know, threw the mask on. I was in the bed for two days. You know, I showered like, seven, eight times. Had to change the sheet, like, you know. You know, it's the whole. The whole thing.

[Kia]

It's a thing.

[Jade]

It's a thing. And you know you're sick when you're. Your animal will not leave your side. Trouble is wrong. Yeah. She was like, not only am I going to be near you, I'm going to be near, like, are you good? What do you need?

[Kia]

What's going on? What's happening?

[Jade]

Yeah, my most Caucasian feature. That nigga sleeps next to me. And I don't care to hear your thoughts about it. So just playing. Yeah, that's. That's how. That's how this week went for me.

[Kia]

Well, we're glad that you're looking like you're in the land of the living yet again.

[Jade]

Thank you, sister. Shout out to hyaluronic acid and Powerade.

[Kia]

Oh, my goodness.

[Jade]

Yeah. Powerade.

[Kia]

Now wash your nasty hands you see, I wore this shirt in your honor. Wash your hands.

[Jade]

Wash your hands. Wash your hands. Wash your hands. Wash them. And also clean under your nails. Make sure you have a nail brush by the sinks. You got to put the disinfectant on there. Clean under those nails. Yeah, very important. I have it by every sink system. There's only two, but there's two.

[Kia]

Got to do it, got to do it, got to do it.

[Jade]

But we have a wonderful guest actually.

[Kia]

Very exciting.

[Jade]

Very, very exciting. A wonderful convert and timely conversation because you all know community is one of our biggest flexes here.

[Kia]

Again, our pillars. One of our key core pillars.

[Jade]

Yes, yes, our key pillars. Academia talk. So I think we should head over to the kitchen table. What say you?

[Kia]

I'm ready. Let's go.

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[Jade]

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[Kia]

Yes.

[Jade]

During Women's history, during Women's History Month. The last, the last week of Women's History Month. How exciting is that? So Kathleen Guillaume Delamar is the president and CEO of the center for Community Progress, a council member of the city of Glenarden, a proud graduate of Howard University, and a mother of two with a deep personal connection to the harm vacant properties cause a community. Guillaume Delamar has focused her career on addressing injustice, working on issues including community revitalization, affordable housing and homelessness. Drawing on two plus decades of community development and activism, Kathleen leverages her roles to widen the scope of the conversation around property vacancy, abandonment and deterioration. From one obsessed with numbers to a rich solution oriented story about the people who live near them. Ladies and gentlemen, Thidlemen, everybody in between, please welcome to the kitchen table Kat, Guillaume Delamama, our Brooklyn sister in the house.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Brooklyn American. Brooklyn American

[Jade]

that is so much better than other people that are claiming American these days. I'll take it.

[Kia]

How are you, Kat? Welcome to the kitchen table. How are you doing this evening?

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

You know, I am doing well, Kia and J. I am doing well. I am getting grown.

[Kia]

Uh huh.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Yes, I am getting grown.

[Jade]

Let me tell you all. Kat came into the room with the best inner g. She said she needed this conversation tonight. And truth be told, after the week, after the, after the months we've had, truthfully, we also need this infam, this, this energy exchange. So we're so grateful for you and your beautiful spirit joining us.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Oh, thank you. And you know, I usually try to always start being authentic because I think that's, there's, that's lacking nowadays. And I try to let spirit guide me into what I'm entering or getting myself into. So I just have to reciprocate what you just said, Jade and Kia, because your presence was already felt before you both even uttered a word. So awesome.

[Kia]

Thank you. Welcome. So we have a thing we usually do with our guests where, you know, we, you know, folks submit a bio and you know, we have those sort of written representations, accolades of who we, who we are with respect to, like the things that we've done. But we also like to give our guests opportunity to introduce themselves. Right. Because we believe that you are more than what you do. So how would you want our audience, like, what would you want our audience to know about Kat?

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Kat is unapologetically a child of God. That's right.

[Jade]

Yes.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

While she is of Haitian descent, proudly of Haitian descent, she represents the Brooklyn American side of her just as hard.

[Jade]

Wave your frontal flags.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Yes, you have to wave it. I am Kat is a compassionate revolutionary. I say what needs to be said. I come from a long line of strong women, and were it not for their sacrifice, I would not be living their dreams.

[Jade]

Yes.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

And my dream, and the reason why I say their dream is because I am currently living a life that I didn't even know I could possibly dream for myself. So knowing the sacrifices that women, women like my great grandmother made, I am her representation still living in the physical. And her representation is very much one of rebellion, very much one of unapologetic social activism. One who dares not shy away from speaking truth to power even in a capitalistic society when we know that we are living in a climate right now where censorship is real. Speaking truth to power is something that is non negotiable regardless of which hat I wear. I am also someone who is really big on alignment. I, you know, my professional life, my civic engagement life, my personal life, all have to be aligned and they all have to be centered in doing something that I know when I go to bed at night, who I serve is going to be proud of me. And I know that that deals at least for my calling, to be one that always fights for the marginalized, whether it means fighting for the black and brown people and others, fighting for immigrants, as I am a child of immigrants, specifically Haitian, and I know how that is, I also believe in fighting for those who have been poor. And lastly, Cat, I'm not going to try to give my husband and family shout outs because they don't need it right now. They're already blessed. Lastly, Cat, is someone who really believes in scripture. And one of, in my scripture, if I can tattoo it on my head, that I live by is Isaiah 117, which is says to do good, seek justice and correct oppression. So you'll catch me cussing sometimes. But I try to be, you know, what is it?

[Jade]

Listen.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Yeah, that part, you know, it's okay to be ratchet and righteous at the same time. Yeah. So that's.

[Jade]

I think that that is one of the most powerful intros I think we've had from a guest that no shade to any of you all. You all say beautiful things, but that was very, very powerful. Like, I feel your. I feel your ancestors, I feel your spirit through that. Can you, can you talk a little bit more about your grandmother? Obviously we very much want to get into your work, but of course, we've got to give honor and reverence. And you really spoke some beautiful things. Can you give us a little bit more about this amazing figure?

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Absolutely. So I am actually named after my great grandmother. Her name was Marie Noel. Jeanette. Excuse me. And the Jeannette, everybody called her Jeanette. So when I, my mother was having me, she decided to call me Kathleen Jeanette. I was just like, okay. And as a child, I always felt special knowing that I was the one who carried her name, not knowing that I would be carrying her legacy as well. That was something that I never. And I remember growing up, you know, first I would say, you know, cat in that mouth of hers, right? Because I was always the skinniest person, small, dark, hue. But I was always like, but that's not fair and that's not right. And I would say to anybody, I really would. I would say to anybody and I would always hear, she's just like her great grandmother. This is like Jeanette all, you know, all over again. And I never knew what the power was with that, right. I was like, okay. I guess she said that this wasn't fair either, right. And so when I started getting older, like my teenage years, I started really seeing the impact of what she had on the family. My great grandmother was somebody who was so full of wisdom till this day. If you go to certain parts in Haiti and you, you mentioned her name and you say you're one of her descendants, Delta, stop what they're doing. Just to pay attention to you. She was someone, I mean, you'll hear of Papa Doc and Baby Doc and you'll hear of the, the other presidents who were not considered dictators. And they all, in order to become president, they all had to pass through my great grandmother to get like that side, that seal or sign of approval. She was arrested more times than we can count. She was also a woman, you know, in a male dominated society. She was a woman who helped create a labor force for the peasants, right? For the people. You know, she, she, she was someone who had to sacrifice her body to provide for her family. And, you know, and it's not like she did it with shame either. She didn't, she was like, look, I'm going to do what I need to do. And she was also given. And I'll never forget when she transitioned, when she passed away, she was given a presidential burial. And this is in Port au Prince, Haiti. And to know that our ancestral land is the house that we actually, well, not we, but they actually made a historical. They made it Into a historical landmark, our actual house. And this is the house that I would go to when I would be in Haiti. My mother and her siblings were born there. My grandmother and her siblings were born there. My great grandmother and all 11 plus her 12 siblings were born there. So to see the impact of what this one woman was able to do, and from creating the union, it was called the Mobilization of the Peasants Union. And a president came out of that, and he got placed into exile and became an expat. Daniel Finole was his name. But to know that my great grandmother instilled that. That fighting, you know, that, that, that fighting essence and spirit in her children and great grandchildren who didn't grow up with her because she, by the time elders, you know, and, you know, knowing that she, at least from my, My. My vantage point, she was not married. And my grandmother, who was married, but she had my. She was pregnant with my mother by the age of 14 again, her body for shelter. My mother, who, you know, who lived and breathed everything that her grandmother said. My mother was a scholar. She went to Spain to become a doctor. That didn't happen. And she fell on hard times. After she had my brother, she went back to Spain, fell on hard times. And again, people do what they have to do. And she became unhoused and had to use her body. Illness is real. And I'm a product of that sacrifice that my mother made. She, she, using her words, you know, she prostituted herself for shelter. And so fast forward, here I come, right? Still hearing the legacy and the story of my great grandmother, but not realizing that that I too would have to sacrifice my body at a very young age, from 6 to 9 years old, due to my mother's insignificant other. But not to take away from the women that predate me, because my mother's still here. My grandmother transitioned a few years ago, and my great grandmother transitioned way before that. I, you know, I shared how I would always be that girl who would be sassy. But I didn't think I was sassy. I was just out. Outspoken, just highly outspoken. I. I knew without knowing what I would become, that intergenerational curses are real. Yeah. And while I didn't experience generational wealth, I knew that I had to stop a pattern. And so what I chose to do was to live into my calling without even knowing as a child what calling was. Right. I just knew that I wanted to make sure that I represented all the people who had to sacrifice their bodies. I represented all the people who had to struggle, and I had to make sure. That my future children didn't experience what I experienced, what my mother experienced, my. What my grandmother, and what my great grandmother experienced while fighting and living out, out and up through her legacy.

[Jade]

Oh, my goodness. I'm processing. I'm processing all of that. I think the way it's so interesting because we. We had our sister Char on the show a couple of weeks ago, and we were speaking about the very important relationship between black CIS women and black trans women and how we fall under the black women umbrella because we have many of many similar experiences. Right. And it's so much better for us to be united than not. And I think the way that you just spoke, not only just about this legacy, because I have so many questions, and I know Kia has so many questions, but I just want to call out the way that you spoke about your foremothers and your ancestors and what an honorable way to speak about the sacrifices that they've made, including with their body, which is why we never want to shame sex workers. Right. Because you don't know why people are doing the things they do, whether that be by choice, because they just motherfucking want to, or because they have to do that for themselves, for their livelihood, for their. For their. Their descendants or what have you. So I think I. I so deeply respect and want to make sure that we acknowledge the way that you just spoke about your ancestors. What a beautiful, beautiful, respectful, honorable way. And so I just want to do that. But, Kia, I'll pass it to you before I can.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Thank you. Thank you. And, Kia, I. I do want to also tell you thank you as well, because oftentimes we bring our represent. We bring our representation, no self to a conversation. And I always tell people, you didn't ask me what's my resume. You asked me about my stuff.

[Kia]

That's right.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Thank you for that. And.

[Kia]

Right.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Thank you.

[Kia]

Yeah, I think that's so. I love this because it just. It just creates space for us to think about ourselves as whole people with multiple dimensions. And our experience and who we are in the present is always grounded in. In the stories of the people who are responsible for us. You know what I mean? The people who care for us and the people who did what they had to do to make sure that we had what we need and we carry that legacy in so many ways, like, not just in the ways that make the resume. So I'm appreciative of you speaking about your family legacy in such a way, because, you know, and Jade and I are also grandma's girls. Right. So you know, we. That relationship that you have with your, you know, that. That is a special, special spiritual, even.

[Jade]

Spiritual.

[Kia]

Because, I mean, you know, we don't. When we don't have them with the present in the present, they don't leave us. They don't leave us.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Exactly. Exactly.

[Kia]

Yeah. So I'm, I'm grateful for you sharing that and would love if you could sort of talk about how that sort of sets you up to be in some of the spaces where you are now. I think in reading about your work and reading about you, one of the things that resonated with me was the relationship or the common thread between your work is just sort of you sort of reclaiming and thinking about vacant spaces. And I think when we think about our communities, when we think about what, like historically, how marginalization and systemic oppression have showed up in our lack in lack of access, I just, was just moved. Even in reading, you know, the word vacant space, I don't know, just was something that stayed with me. And so could you talk a little bit about your childhood experience? You talked about, you know, who your parents were, who your mom was, and how that has shaped your experience, but your, Your work is grounded very much in your childhood experience. So talk to us a little bit about that.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

It has, and I'm going to let you all know this right now because if you listen to me in other podcasts, you will hear similar information because my truth is my truth, but you will hear the delivery being very different.

[Jade]

And I saw you talking to that white lady when she calls you Jeanette,

[Kia]

right?

[Jade]

She goes, what a beautiful name. I said, white women are so funny when they be trying to be on the right side. I know you on the right side.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

I'm about to go there. Okay? I'm about to go there. And so, and I want to thank you for letting me go there because there are many faces and iterations of our code switching when we're still sharing the exact same information and the delivery is different. So where I am going to ask the both of you right now is do I have. And the listeners as well. Do I have your permission to go deep?

[Jade]

For sure, Please, we request you.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

I have to make sure, because so when we think about vacant spaces and abandoned structures, I look at land the way I look at the bodies that I just did disgust of. My body, my mother's body, my great grandmother's body, my grandmother's body and land, specifically in this nation. I can talk about other countries, but I'll speak about this nation since this is Where I've been doing the. The heaviness of my work. This land has been raped and touched and violated. And this land at the same time has been so beautiful. Yeah, it still is beautiful. My mother's body is still beautiful. Because thinking about my childhood, all of the ugliness that happened does not negate the beauty that my. And the sacrifice that my mother made and those women before her mate. And I want to be clear that I am not knocking and purposely excluding the men in my life. Excluding the men in my life because I have a wonderful husband, a wonderful son, a wonderful brother. My granddaddy was amazing. And others and uncles. But as I look, I. I remember one day walking. This is after I gave birth. And I remember walking one day, getting off the, The. I'll say subway. Getting off the train, because we got. Stay natural. Okay, fair, you know, getting off the train. And I looked around, it was so crowded. And I just saw people walking towards me, walking besides me, saying, excuse me. And I was like, wow. You know, with the exception of scientific stuff like test tubes and things like that, I'm like a woman carried all of these people here, right? And you don't know their story, but there's a beauty in that because, you know, my sisters, I'll tell you, if I was in my mother's shoes, I would not have had me. And the fact that she chose to have me and the fact that she sacrificed everything to have me. How dare I not make something of myself? How dare my brother not make something of himself, right? So now I always try. When I speak about my childhood, I speak about all of me. And I thank you for asking me about my great grandmother. But I. I think about my brother now. And this is not about bragging. This is about. About. About the rearing of. Of. Of. Of. Of a child, regardless of the ugliness of a circumstance. My brother, who's only two years older than me, is a prosthodontist. I used to say it's a prostituting dentist, but that's not what it is.

[Kia]

I was like, tell me more.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

He does reconstructive surgery.

[Jade]

Okay, okay, okay, copy. Okay.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Very, very, very well. Sought after dentist in Atlanta, Georgia. He has several practices and to know that I am a professional. I made history as an elected official. I am now leading a national organization. And I am doing it where I still, at this stage in my life, am operating as an adult who is giving little cat the opportunity to utilize her voice to speak. So when you think about my childhood and the work that I do about this. And I'm going to get into the vacant space right in the land. So I see the vacant properties, the vacant land. I see the beauty in that. I see how unjust policies have created that. Just like unjust touches.

[Kia]

Yep.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Have created women to be abused and men too. Right. And so when I look at my childhood, I recall this older woman who lived in this, in a single family home right next to my building on Crook Avenue and Ocean. And she.

[Jade]

That's why I got my cat. Sorry. Okay, keep going.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

And this woman lived there, this older woman. And I used to see her on her porch. And then one day, you know, I lived in a. I, I hate the term affordable housing. I just despise it because to me, slumlord living is affordable housing, right. So I always add the term dignified housing or quality housing. Right. And quality affordable housing. Like something in front of the. The word affordable. And our building there was always like a fire alarm, something going off. And this time we. It was like 2, 3am in the morning, at least in my young mind, that's what it felt like. And we had to run outside and the house, the single family home where the older woman lived in was a caught fire. Oh, and that was the very last time I saw the. I don't remember seeing her after that. And shortly after that, you know, the house burnt down, as I said. But nothing was done after that. It was just a vacant lot. Now I touched on briefly on my mother's insignificant other who terrorized our home. And when he wasn't terrorizing us in our small apartment, he also. Well, let me speak for myself. When he wasn't terrorizing me in the small apartment, he was outside terrorizing the neighborhood with his fellow drug addicts and the drug dealers and all that. And right up the street, you know, Jade, we talked, we mentioned Uma Park. It wasn't back then, it was fake it lot. And he, you know, if he wasn't at that lot next to where he, if he wasn't at the lot where the house was, he was at the park that would later become Uma park park, the lot that would be a coma park. And I remember just as a child, like already terrorized at home, I gotta be terrorized outside too. And it's like everything's in my face. And so my safe haven was school and going by my friend's house and being able to come back home. And again the cycle would continue to repeat itself as far as the abuse and all that stuff. But then I knew my Brother. After he left to go to school, I knew that I wanted to go away, to blame it on the Huxtables. Let me be very clear. I'm gonna say something.

[Kia]

Huxtables, yeah, very clear.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Huxtables. And it was an influence, right? The Huxtables. And I was like, is that real? Like a. Somebody's m. A lawyer is married to an engineer and they got kids who, you know, because. Okay, that part.

[Kia]

The Blackstone. Yes.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

In Brooklyn.

[Jade]

In Brooklyn.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

There. And so being able to see that and then knowing that I had to leave, I. I was like, okay, I need to go where a different world is and find my world. And I went to. I. I proudly attended Howard University. And right before I left, and I have to say, the Howard University, you know. Okay, so once I made the decision to go there, I knew already that, That I didn't know where I would land. Like, I just knew some, some way, shape or form I was going to have my fist up in the air fighting for NAACP or something in between. And right before I left, something happened where the neighbors in our neighborhood, they had enough. And to be clear, flatbush in the 70s, 80s, 90s, specifically 80s and 90s, it was majority black, low income immigrants.

[Jade]

Yeah. Because of the. Not the great, you know, the migration when, when whites were going out to Long island and Westchester, happening there.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Yeah. And so when that, you know, happened, I saw my neighbors, you know, they weren't politicians, they weren't, you know, rich people. They just had enough and they were chasing the drug dealers out all the trash that was in the lots. Like, they were like, enough is enough. And then it caused a ripple effect. And I saw like, wow. Then I remember later on, every time I would come see my mother, I saw the last. Were cleaned up more. Cleaned up more. And then next, you know, I was like, wait, what is this groundbreaking? What is happening here? And it was a park. It became Uma Park. And till now, when I go there, I'm in amazement of seeing, you know, this place that held so much trauma for me is a place of so much joy and potential. And it was vacant, Right. But it's beautiful. It was beautiful. It was already beautiful, but people didn't see it. Right. And then the other vacant lot where the older woman resided, that in her house, caught on fire. That. That now vacant lot is now a dignified affordable housing building that is so beautiful with amenities and green space. And so, you know, the work that I do now, right. I look at my lived experience because I can go and Be credentialed. I can school people and tell them that I got my bachelor's in African American Studies. And then I did this and then I went to work for this agency and this organization. And then I, I was on the Housing Authority. I was the vice president of the housing Authority in my city. Then I became a commissioner for Prince George's county for the Affordable Housing Commission. And I could say all of that, that. But my lived experience is what kept me rooted in all the work that I did. So one thing, the first thing that I did besides volunteering at the, at the Equal Rights center, after that I decided to go into the affordable rental housing with wrapped around services space. Because I always thought what, what, what would my mother's and my experience and even my brother's experience be like if we had dignified affordable rental housing and didn't have to rely on the welfare stamps of our abuser or let me correct that of my abuser. Then I said, you know, let me go into the anti homelessness space. And then I said, because I know my mother's story very well. And then when I came to the vacant space, I said, I know what it means to be a dreamer and to want something for your neighborhood and to want your friends to come visit you, but they really can't because your neighborhood has this reputation of being like New Jack City because of the vacant lots that are there and the drugs that are there, the violence that are there. And I dare anyone to look up the crook Avenue C R O O K E Avenue in Flatbush, Brooklyn, New York and you'll see, you know what I'm talking about.

[Jade]

I'll tell you that even with the cleaning up, that crook is still one of the blocks that faces more issue that we get more reports on even now with crime lowered. So you can, even if we look nationwide at what was happening, like you said in the late 70s, 80s, early to mid-90s with the crack epidemic and on all of that, you already know how that was affecting hoods all over the country, you know, so that's just giving extra context to it. But please continue.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

And that's the reality that I bring. So I can, I can code switch and, and I'm pretty sure some people in my staff are like, dad, cat is going wrong. If you are listening, which you should be, it's Jada. But, but look, you're bringing this part of me out and, and I will say that it's a good, you know. Oh yeah, it's the part that's raw and Real, because I can give the data, I can give the metrics, I can give the, you know, the, you know, it's 750 unhoused individuals and 1.4, you know, I could give all of that 1.4 million. Etc, but I. When you're getting the raw data, you're getting the experience of the people who live in the communities that you are trying to serve or you are trying to engage and work with, not work for. And so for me in present day, you know, as president and CEO, I have the honor and privilege of working with individuals who as, who are as equally committed as I am, you know, to solve the issue where we are the only. And I, I hate always using the word only sometimes because we're in 2026, but I'll use it for bragging rights. Right. We are the only national non profit that's dedicated to fixing the systems that lead to widespread vacancy, abandonment and deterioration of property. So when we think about deterioration. Right, deterioration. If you think about slum Lord living, you know, like that's a precursor to the property becoming abandoned and then vacant.

[Jade]

Yes.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Right. And something. And so for me, especially under my leadership, what I have tried to do is let's not look at vacancy. Like to the question that you asked here, like, let's not look at vacancy when it's already occurring. Vacancy as a possibility to occur to prevent it from taking place. Right?

[Jade]

Yes.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

And so when you do that, what you have to do is you have to look at certain things and add as, as a recovering elected official. Lord Jesus. Right. God bless. You have to see. Speaking of broken systems, look, you, you better broken. But the system is so intentional and what so many of us have failed to do and it's become. My life's mission is to educate. I don't like gatekeeping. Right. And when you think about why vacancy takes place or occurs, it's because of these unjust policies. It's because of the punitive tax system, the property tax system and, and draconian code enforcement. I hate the word code enforcement. I rather say code compliance or code encouragement, restrictive zoning. Like you can't do this here, you can't do this there. When you know that if I was asking to have a dog park here, you would want it there. But we don't need a dog park. Right. And then they're finding, you know, there's financing gaps and in underserved markets and, and all of these things are centered around policy. And a lot of times, like what we have, what we have had to learn And I'm speaking about we as myself. Right. And others like myself. Growing up, I talked about my great grandma protesting and organizing. I wasn't there when I was, I was no way near being born when she started fighting the good fight. But I just always heard about protest, protest. And I don't want to knock that, I don't want to knock that. But when you hear protest, protest, protest, right. You're not really giving the full picture because if all you're doing is protesting, it's just unified complaints. But if you see that you are protesting while you're trying to enact policy change as a legislator, yeah, I know that you can do whatever you want, but until they change the policies, yeah, it's going to be the same thing that we're protesting over and over again. And so it's important for me in my role leading this organization to number one, provide the technical solutions to the human problems. So educate the policymakers, educate the people on their rights and what they should be advocating for and showing them the beauty of that land that was raped. That was yours.

[Jade]

Yeah.

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[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

I just had to go there.

[Jade]

No, that's. I think that's so timely, cat, because as you were talking it made me think about the, the extremely predatory behavior that's happening. That's been happening, let's be clear. But it's being reported a lot more now. It's especially when it comes to particular communities, especially here in New York that are stealing people's land deeds. And they are. But they're doing it while these especially elders are in their homes. Right. And it is, it's very predatory and aggressive the way that they're doing it as well. Right. So they're doing it underhanded because they're going to. Through all of the, like you said, the deeds and the policies and the so forth and so on and figure out which loopholes and red tape works for them. And then they're using that to prey on these elder black people and the, and the homes that they own. Can you speak more to that in a way that makes sense than what I just did? Because I feel like it ties in.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

I was gonna say you coming for my job because you tend to.

[Jade]

I'm just soapbox there. I scream a lot. I, I get really pissed off. I do try to do my end of work, but this is your work and I feel like you're the perfect person to speak to.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

But sis, let me tell you, you literally said it. You literally said it. I'm dead serious. Like sometimes I think it's. And I think we need to do this more. Sometimes people over complicate something that is so explanatory. And when, when a sister and a brother and whoever says something, I love

[Jade]

that you're doing that. You don't have to do that. Like we love y'.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

All.

[Jade]

But you're not, we're not talking. I mean, we're talking to you, I guess, but.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

All right, Niagaras, y' all heard what she said?

[Jade]

Okay, I'll say it for you.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

So. No, you said it. And, and one of the main things that we do right now because like when you like you Said Jade, you said red tape. Red tape is another word for policy, because they wouldn't be doing it if it wasn't, if they didn't find a loophole, meaning that loophole is a particular policy. Right. And so what we do is we actually take those particular policies because every community is different. Right. Like what's impacting Baltimore and New York or Camden is different than what's impacting Detroit and Cleveland and Atlanta. Right. But. But the speculativeness of those deeds is something that is real. One of the main things that we do is if we're going to a community and we see that that's something that's running rampant, we try to make sure that it's handled on the policy side. So they know that this is unjust. How could you make this right? The other thing that we're looking at also is the, like, trying to untangle tangled titles, which people call heirs property. Right. Heirs Property has become a buzz term right now that people are all, you know, are getting worked up about, rightfully so. But it's one of those things where people are trying to get in where they can. They're finding the deeds of one person, and one person is like, oh, wait a minute, Grandma's house, Grandmama's house, or big Mama's house isn't actually your family's house anymore. It's. I can take it. Right. And oh, there's back taxes, even though Grandmama's house was already paid for. And so there's a lot of these things that are taking place that are just unjust. Right. And even, and even when you think about the, the, the, the taxes, like. Let me talk about the taxes for a second. Right. You have people who have always paid their home, paid for their homes, and they were pictured that they, they live in a community that has been underinvested, under resourced.

[Jade]

Yeah.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

And while made sure that they still stayed, they maintained their home while the neighborhood was going down. Now you have this neighborhood suddenly gentrifying. Right. Like we're investing the neighborhood. Okay, great. Now I don't have to live next to this. Me, as the elder person who's been living here forever, I don't have to live in a, In a neighborhood that's under resourced. I see you guys are now paying attention to my street, my neighborhood. Thank you, thank you, thank you. But then now, because it's new housing, now comes the new tax rate.

[Jade]

Yeah.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

And now you have new people who are coming into the neighborhood, able to buy this new lavish house with this new property tax but me, who I, you know, I've been holding it down for so long, my property tax has skyrocketed to four times what it originally was. And so here it is. While I'm still trying to do what I can, you're now finding me, right now.

[Jade]

Make it make sense through public record.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Right, Exactly. How is that equitable? How is that fair? Right. Or at this. Go ahead, go ahead.

[Kia]

No, no, no. Finish your thought, please.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Or same thing. As far as the home is concerned. Right. You have an elderly home. We just went through Covid was like yesterday. Right. And so a lot of people had lost their jobs, a lot of people got sick, couldn't go into work, et cetera, et cetera. And you always make sure that you paid your. Your, Your bills, you, you kept your house clean, you mowed the lawn, et cetera, et cetera. But now you fall on hard times. You're sick and you have a broken window, you're not working, and you have a house next door. Who, a speculator or investor purchased that house. They don't live there. They probably don't even live in the same state. But they bought property because land is something that nobody's going to ever invent. Rent. It's all. Land is land.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

And they're not keeping up with that property because they're like, look, I'm just gonna take care of it once a year. I don't live there. I don't care. But you have the older person who lives in that property that they've always kept, maintained it, but now they're following hard times. Why are they getting fined the same exact way that the investor who doesn't take care of different. Like, again, it's not equitable, it's not fair, it's punitive, it's draconian. And so this, the way the system has. And so what happens is people lose their homes just off of that, you know, so it's just.

[Kia]

I love, I love that, the work that you're doing. I know you have your. I want you to talk a little bit more about the center for Community Progress, because I feel like we talked a lot about your work and community revitalization and all the different tentacles of your personal work with that, like your, Your advocacy, your work with, you know, local government. But I love that you said that you're focused now on education, because I think so many of us, because we have been living in and negotiating these sort of problematic waters, like we, we always leverage the quote on the show. It talks about, like, racism is not the shark. It's the water. We're all swimming in it. Right? Because we're all swimming in the water. It's very easy to sort of like. Like we are very much ignorant to the insidious nature of these. These systems that are designed, which is why it's happening. And I think there's also a lot of narrative and comms that are out here trying to make it seem like this is for the better. Right. You know, it. It is. It is. I love that what your work is about in this community revitalization piece is sort of at the core of that is educating people about how these things really work and what are the things to look for and how we keep ourselves safe. So talk a little bit about. A little bit about that.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Yes, thank you. I. I swear I was going to say wade in the water as soon as you said water, But no, like I said, what. We're the only national nonprofit in our space, and we work with policymakers and practitioners, community members, residents in places that have lots of vacant and abandoned properties to help them restore the true purpose to the land. And you know, we started. Oh, my goodness, it's been 16 years now. You know, back then, you know, 16 years ago, the market, the housing market was oversaturated with residential vacancy and all. And I mean, all of the disastrous impacts that had. That it had on families and communities of color, preyed upon by bad faith lending. Some of the stuff that Jade, you were talking about, right. Like a lot of bad faith lending practices, the stripping of generational wealth and home ownership and. And dare I say, the upending of the fabric of so many communities already struggling in disinvested neighborhoods like myself, like, we were already struggling, and now you're already doing that. It. And one thing that we also saw, especially back then, was the black and white home ownership gap widened in the aftermath of the crisis. And so with all that being said, let me say this, that we do not flip houses or do construction. What we do, and our theory of change is really big on this. It starts with education, right? So what we do is we advocate for policy changes that remove the barriers to community revitalization. And the way we do that is, is we educate the community leaders and the policymakers and residents who want to strengthen their neighborhoods. You know, like, we. We don't. We're not interlopers, so we don't go anywhere where we're not invited. So we always want to make sure, like people, on any given day, we get. Every yearly we get close to 800 calls capacity is, is steep for us, but we don't turn anyone down as far as we get a call, we always respond. And so that's where we don't again, not being interlopers. And so we always tell people, you can come listen to our webinars, attend our event. You know, we educate you on tools that are available for you to utilize in your community. What could work in one community doesn't necessarily work in another community. Some communities get educated on creative placemaking. Where if I. If. For those who don't know what creative placemaking is, if, if you think about the arts, right, like there was, imagine the, the South Bronx in the 70s, 80s where it was abandoned murals, burned down structures. But you are actually now you see murals and art, you know, from those places or, or a park being built and you see dancing in the alleys and just the art, the artists being one with the community, the true essence of the community. So we educate people about creative placemaking. We also educate people about like what I said about you probably need to change your policies because that's why it's happening. Whether it's called compliance or it's property taxes or it's probably you need a tool called the land bank. You know where land banks are for those who don't know they're public entities that are given special state enabling power to acquire vacant land or properties and maintain them and turn them back to productive use. Use with. And the only. And the way they turn the back into productive use is you have to turn it back to productive use with what the community wants, not what you want. So you know how sometimes you'll go in, like I said about the dog parks, like you see a dog park and say we don't need a dog park, we don't need a target. We, we need a school or you know, we need a new car. Exactly right. So there's the educational part. But then after we provide the educational part, as far as our theory of change is concerned, we then provide technical assistance things, right? So because it's like, okay, this is what we need. We've been educated on this, but we don't know how to start, right? So I have a team that we have lawyers, we have former legislative or government employees, and we just have good, you know, urban planners who actually. And people who just fight the good fight, who provide technical assistance to communities to find specific locally applicable solutions that reduce entrench vacancy. And we also uplift gift success and best practices from communities practicing equitable, efficient and effective I always say those three E's, Equitable, efficient and effective. Community revitalization. You can't have one, you can't have two, you have to have all three. Yeah, all three. And so we also know, because it's important for me to say this on the educational side, that there's no single solution to vacancy. But there are combinations of.

[Kia]

Right.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

So there's a strategic code compliance, there's the effective delinquent property tax enforcement policies and practices, there's community engagement, there's land banking. So there's all of those things. But you have to educate people and not gatekeep. Because once you gatekeep, you're just continuing the cycle, you're just part of continuing it. So that's, that's what we do so much.

[Kia]

I think that is so key that you said that because so many people feel like singular solutions can address systemic problems. And it's just like that. It's just, it's just a misnomer. Like nothing about that actually lines up. And if we think about the transformative practice that's necessary for systems change.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Exactly.

[Kia]

It originates with change perspective, like learning. You have to think differently before you're able to, to, to move the needle with that. So core, like education being core to your theory of change. It's so real. I love that. And I think we're talking about systems change. And I'm sorry, since I don't want to jump in front of you, but I'm just thinking real quick, I just want to ask for individuals, right. So for, for you or the only non profit in the country that's doing this necessary work. If I'm just an individual thinking about what vacancies are doing to my community or to communities that I love and I want to do something, I don't know what, I don't know where to start. What advice would you give to people and families who want to get involved and help and generate some impact?

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Absolutely, yeah. Number one, and I'm not just saying this to say it. Dare to dream, Dare to. That's the first thing. So don't just look at it as this is a problem, look at it as the potential that diminishes this problem property has. Because oftentimes you always hear like when you hear a complaint, you always hear like we don't want this here, we don't want this here. But you, it usually stops there. Or why is this in our neighborhood? Say what you want, right? And, and then once you know what you want, then you already know which trajectory you can be on from the educational standpoint. And what I mean by that is I don't just, you know, in my 49.99 years plus tax in Paris and terrorist years of age duties, okay, you gotta say the duty customs, okay, you gotta say all of that, right? When one thing that I used to always say is we have to partner. We have to partner, right? But I think we see right now that partnership is not enough for individuals. You need to be strategically aligned in your strategic partnerships. Your partnerships need to be strategic because there needs to be a plan in place. I don't need you to partner with me because we're both going to be complaining. So I need us to be strategic about what the problem. Because I'm like, you see what they did? Let me tell you. So you think it's okay to have that layer?

[Jade]

It just becomes an echo chamber.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

And I live with complaint boxes in my house. So I don't need to do it in my personal life, in my professional life either.

[Kia]

So it's not a strategic partnership. Not at all.

[Jade]

No.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

It needs to be. So what are we going to do? I'm always like, okay, so what are we going to do? What's the end? What do we want? Right? And so not saying what are we going to do? That's the first thing. What are we going to do? And then what do we want? Right? Then it's. And, and I'm not, I swear to you both, I think you all, you both can feel my virtual energy that I'm not going to blow up smoke up your asses. Yes, I said asses. For my listeners. Yes, I said it. Go on our website. Let's go on our website. Go on our website. Go on our website. I can tell you you can do a search for almost anything and you will find what you're looking for.

[Kia]

Resources.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

And while you're looking for it, you will also find. When is the next webinar? When are they having a learning exchange? We have a community revitalization fellowship program for individuals. For individuals, right? We have a vacant property leadership institute for individuals and policymakers and nonprofits to all come together as a delegation. And we also have events like conferences. Right? So we're going To Be Selfish plug September 22nd to September 25th. We are having our biannual conferences every two years called the Reclaiming Vacant Properties conference. Individuals, advocates, faith based leaders, policymakers, foundations, you name them, government officials, everybody and their mama and papa is there.

[Kia]

That's right.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Over.

[Jade]

Yeah, hold on, Pause. You gotta say, say the website for us, Cat, we're gonna put it in the description but say it for people listening right now.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Website, please go to www.communityprogress.org Again, that's www.communityprogress.org. our conference is going to be held in Pittsburgh this year because we never go where we are not invited. Pittsburgh wanted us, other communities wanted to us, but we decided on Pittsburgh. This go around. It's going to be held September 22nd to 25th. Look up Reclaiming Vacant Properties Conference or just RVP and you will see it right there. And I guarantee you again for the individuals. Individuals. If you just want to get your feet wet and be like, I don't know where I fit, I guarantee you you'll find a tribe there. And I'll be there. I'll be there. So you, you know, you are a whole tribe.

[Jade]

You are a village within yourself in the most necessary way. I love that. And I because like you said, with, with us all needing different things within our community, we do have to figure out the best ways to be effective in the work that we do. And I love that in this almost hour of speaking, you ain't said shit about gentrification. And I really appreciate that because that's not what the this is about. That's actually one of the greater problems that we're having in our communities when it comes not just to vacancies, but

[Kia]

in general to refrain that conversation.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Thank you. And I'm so happy that you caught that. I didn't realize that you would catch that or others would catch it. So this is gentrification. The word gentrification gets on my nerves and I'll say, why? So 20 plus years ago, before it became in style to say the word gentrification. Yeah, I would say gentrification. So now when people say love you like y' all just catching on. Like when people say woke, I'm like, oh, like I can't hear the word woke no more. You know, but I like my woke people. But I just want to, you know.

[Jade]

But no, but I hate the term.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Yeah, but, but we, you know, but, but it's true. Like I, I, I think oftentimes we talk about the problem, but we don't talk about what we want to come out of that problem. Like, okay, yeah, don't just solve it it, but solve it and turn it into what or do what with with said issue. Right. Because again, protesting and complaining is only going to get you.

[Jade]

But so far, yeah, it's necessary. Right. It's a form of resistance. It's an expression. It unifies us. But like you said, there has to be action exactly behind that. After has to follow that. Absolutely. That's the important work. Oh, you've said so much.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

I look and I say this like I want to be very clear that I protest. Like I, I, you know, I wear my 4 inch heels and I also wear my Timberlands. So

[Jade]

a girl who can do both.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Okay, So I have my, my, my, my, my suits, my power suits and I have my, my, my sweats and jeans and my microphone. And so, and so I, I do think that especially this climate that we're living in, especially. And I don't want to make this sensationalized. Like, you know, black women have been in the forefront. We know that. I don't need to keep saying it because I know, you know, and, and that's why I tell people, you want the data or the raw data? Because again, I'm gonna get raw data. But in this climate that we're in right now, it's very important for us to not just normalize what's happening right now. We can't normalize it. And I'm saying this as somebody who has to pay bills. I'm saying this as somebody who can't afford to lose job and her health care, her good, good health care. You know, I can't do that. But I also know that I come from a line of people who sacrificed. We come from a line of people that sacrifice. And how dare I not sacrifice. So my future children and my future grandchildren, excuse me, God willing, they can have a story to tell about their grandmother was, who their grandmother's sisters, Kia and Jade were. You know, it's important for us to do that. And so again, when we're looking at vacancy and things of that nature, we want to make sure that these things are things that we see the potential and beauty in. Because just because that fixture has been raped doesn't mean that it's not beautiful.

[Kia]

It's true.

[Jade]

And you know, this is God work you're doing. And it, it is very much in alignment with who you are. Going back to the beginning of our conversation with you being of Haitian descent and also acknowledging and recognizing the land that you live on now has been pillaged and, and, and taken advantage of by people who were not invited there. Which is why I also love that you go to where you're invited. Haiti itself, you know, is paying a disgusting price for something that is not, not that that is an atrocity that was committed against them.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

And they're you know what I'm saying?

[Jade]

Oh, yes, and still paying it and still suffering the consequences, but yet is a beautiful land, right. A beautiful land that I don't think gets enough for sure. For the beauty of, for the actual beauty of it. You know, I, I can't wait to visit when I can. Right.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

And, and, and I thank you for that because I live and breathe Haiti. It's in, it's in my ethos. It's, it's, it's in my being. And so when, when I talk about my ancestral land and our house, which we had knocked down and built up. We had the house since the 1800s. Our land since the 1800s. And to know now that the militia. We literally saw our house in the news, literally worldwide news, we saw our house. And to see the militia is occupying our house right now. Our house.

[Jade]

That's a violation. That's a violation.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

And so, and to know that my house in Haiti International now was abandoned and was vacant because of the militia. So again, these are, these are things that I live, whether it's on the national side, stateside.

[Kia]

Yes.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

That's why I say all the time, time, my whole being has to be in alignment. I could switch how I speak. I could say my SAT words from high school. I can speak those long words and, and those four syllable words if I want to.

[Jade]

But you don't need to.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

But I don't need to because I, My experience is my experience. And you know that the plight of Haitians here, you know, as far as policy, you know, the, the, the temporary protective status that's being under attack for Haitians. The. It's the same way that there's a war on poverty right now. Yeah, there's that. That we are fighting. But while we're fighting this war on poverty and, and in. Under resourced neighborhoods.

[Jade]

Yeah.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

We're also seeing that under resourced neighborhoods, like Crook Avenue, where I came from and my mother still lives there, under resourced neighborhoods are full of underestimated individuals, for sure. And I was one of those underestimated individuals. My brother is one of those underestimated individuals. My cousin. And so when we look at that, right. We're looking at the potential, the potential of everyone through policy.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Through protest, through not normalizing this behavior. This is not okay. If, what, if, if anybody gets anything from this conversation, we have a broader conversation about vacancy. We have a conversation about the systems and the structures that are in place. But then we also have a call, and that call to action is, let's not just protest. And complain. Let's also have a plan. Let's strategically attack this plan, you know, to make sure that it becomes a reality.

[Jade]

Yeah, absolutely. You.

[Kia]

Yeah. Like you said, I was just gonna say, you know, I appreciate you for being here and thank you for bringing your full self. I think education and credentials and even those four syllable words that you're talking about, those are, those are nice things to have. But to me, you know, you can have those things and still not be credible. I think your experience, your lived experience, your life, your legacy, your family history are the things that really ground you in this work. And it's very clear that you're connected to. It's not just a job, it's a vocation, like you feel, you know what I'm saying? That's very clear. And so we just appreciate you coming and sharing that with us and with our audience. We're excited to share the work that you and your organization are doing. All that stuff will be linked in. Hi, Brooklyn. Brooklyn want to be an in.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

I just know

[Jade]

it's in every episode. Don't worry.

[Kia]

No, no, no. We ain't we always. Brooklyn is always.

[Jade]

She makes herself known.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Co host Cinderella Brooklyn America.

[Kia]

Yeah, so no, no, no, we're just grateful. We're grateful. We'll share all of your information in the description box. If there's anything else you want our listeners to know about, about what you're doing, just let us know. We, we are in full support of, of your mission. And thanks for, for coming and kicking it with us this evening.

[Jade]

Yeah.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Thank you. Thank you. Jay. One thing, I. One last thing that I would want the listeners to know is support black.

[Jade]

Please support black women.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Support this platform. You know, oftentimes things, unless they're like late breaking news, sensationalized, you know, the sky is falling, or the current occupant of the White House is doing some late breaking thing.

[Jade]

I wish neurovirus on you. Okay, continue. I'm sorry, we don't get.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

We as people who are fighting the good fight, we don't get avenues or enough avenues to speak and support each other. And so if the listeners are listening, this is sweat equity being done by Kia and Jade. And no, they did not ask me to do this, but I would be remiss if I didn't actually shout them out. Not just as black women, not just as sisters in the struggle, but as people who are really doing right by writing others. So we're getting grown, but we're getting down to business. And I just want to thank the both of you for giving me the opportunity to share who I am and giving little Cat, my younger self, the opportunity to speak to you all as well through my body.

[Jade]

Okay. I love you. You're so wonderful. You are so wonderful. We, we're so grateful for that key. And I just celebrated nine years, or acknowledged nine years. We didn't really. Yeah, this is a celebration. It's a celebration every time.

[Kia]

Yeah.

[Jade]

We get to have a conversation with another black woman who's doing another leg of incredible necessary work that we need in the many branches of black women who are doing all this necessary work. And so we're just grateful for your presence, for your acknowledgement of that. Thank you so much. After nine years, I'm still in the same apartment. And I'm grateful that I have a roof over my head. But I think the work and the quality of the work, the conversations we have, have in the amazing individuals like you in our community who listens are the reasons why this continues to work the way that it does. And so thank you so much. We're gonna have all of the links in the description box. Make sure you all check out the conference in September. I'm going to check it out. Me and my husband, because we don't own shit, but we'd like to, you know, before the curls, buy everything up. I don't know if you're gonna have to edit that outside. And because they're buying everything up, it's crazy. But you know what?

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

It's not just about home ownership, though. Just know that it's not just about home ownership. My mother never owned property. The folks who chased the V, the drug dealers and drug addicts, they didn't own property. They were renters.

[Jade]

You know, community.

[Kia]

Whether you are or not, you still a part of your community.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Community.

[Jade]

Yeah. And we do have to band together because I got a new green haired person in my building every other day with a new dog and I'm. Yeah, exactly. They got green hair, they work in a barista. Then they usually have a shiba inu that they're walking down the street.

[Kia]

I'm so tired. I'm so tired.

[Jade]

Katt, we're so grateful for you. We're gonna have all of the information in the description box and I know the listeners are gonna have so many questions for you. So please tell them where they can find you again, one more time. What's the best way to reach out if they have direct questions as well?

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Sure. Please feel free to reach out to me. I'm on LinkedIn. You can find me on with my name, Kat K A T, middle initial J and last name is Guillaume Delamar. I know that's a lot of. It sounds very simple, but it's a lot of letters. That's. A U M E, hyphen, D E L E M A R. So you can find me on LinkedIn, Facebook. Same thing. You know, Kat J, Guillaume Delamar, yours. You guys are going to get all nine letters of the Guillaume in the name Delamar and all one. Let me see. Professional email is K G U I L L A U m [e-mail] and I will give you my Social Security number too, but that's too sacred.

[Kia]

We will make sure all of that is available so that the listeners who want to reach out will have everything they need in order to do that. And you're welcome back at the kitchen table anytime. Anytime.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

I love anytime. I love the food at the table. Thank you. Thank you.

[Jade]

I can't wait to feed you. All right, you all stick around for the next segment and we will see you in a moment.

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[Jade]

I deserve.

[Kia]

Just self care time, darling. And I this past Sunday was just in the spirit. I don't even know what came over me but you know, I had a hankering for some baby shower cuisine and I very randomly wasn't at all planned. I did not, it's not like I said, I, I wanted this and went to the store and got the things. I just happened to have these things in my kitchen, in my pantry already. And so I got, I finished watching church online and as service was wrapping up I just walked into the kitchen and made myself some macaroni salad with tuna. I made me a tuna Mac. A Mac and tuna. It was just the perfect, it's just a good lunch lunch, you know what I'm saying?

[Jade]

It's the perfect bite.

[Kia]

It's the perfect lunch. It's substantive. It's like, it's a little bit more than like a tuna sandwich or a tuna salad, but it, it is. And it's just enough and you can whip it up really quickly and you sit it in the fridge and I've been eating off of it all week, but it's just been so good.

[Jade]

Yes. You know, it's refreshing, it's easy, you

[Kia]

know, easy to do. And it felt like, you know, it just, it just satisfied my soul. It felt cultural, you know, I don't believe like that was a question I was going to ask my social media. I didn't get around to it. Like do white people make macaroni salad with tuna in it? Do they make tuna Mac?

[Jade]

Yeah.

[Kia]

Do they make Mac and tuna?

[Jade]

Yeah, I think they do.

[Kia]

They do. I've never seen any like, you know, like in the deli or like at the supermarket you'll see a macaroni salad or even a seafood salad or even a potato salad, the Russian potato salad more specifically.

[Jade]

Maybe tuna is harder to do. And even though I don't understand how you can do a seafood salad but not do a tuna salad.

[Kia]

So yeah, I've seen tuna salad, like tuna fish and they'll call it tuna salad but like do they make Mac and tuna. Like, we make macatona a good tuna. You know what I'm saying?

[Jade]

That question is a very specific question. Do they make it like we make it?

[Kia]

Oh, probably. No.

[Jade]

But I do believe. I cannot confirm. But my spirit tells me, like, you all seem like a tuna macaroni people.

[Kia]

They do make macaroni. They do make macaroni as a. As a. As an entree.

[Jade]

You see what I'm saying? Cheese. As the. So I feel like tuna. Mac or tuna. I feel like they make some very kind of casserole.

[Kia]

Yeah, you're right.

[Jade]

Probably. So you all confirm. Oh, yeah. Isn't there a tuna casserole?

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Oh, there's. Oh, that.

[Kia]

Let me look it up, because I've

[Jade]

heard there's a tuna casserole.

[Kia]

I don't feel like I've ever seen one.

[Jade]

No, I have seen one. I believe it. It. It requires a sort of creamy base. So those baked.

[Kia]

No, no, no, no, no. This is baked.

[Jade]

It's a baked situation. Yeah. With breadcrumbs on top.

[Kia]

Comfort food with canned tuna, cooked pasta, egg noodles or macaroni.

[Jade]

Egg noodles.

[Kia]

Creamy sauce. Often condensed soup. What kind of soup? Like, creamy sauce.

[Jade]

Probably a cream of something.

[Kia]

Vegetables topped with crunchy breadcrumbs. Breadcrumbs or potato chips.

[Jade]

I know it. Potato ch.

[Kia]

Potato chip casseroles are something that.

[Jade]

That white people, you know, they also love a crushed Ritz cracker on top of.

[Kia]

Oh, Lord. Egg noodles, cheese celery. Oh, cream of mushroom soup. Oh, that sounds.

[Jade]

I knew it was a cream of something. I knew it was a cream of something.

[Kia]

I remember watching tv and on somebody's sitcom, somebody's mama was making a tuna casserole. But. But I've never seen one in real life.

[Jade]

No, I. I have seen tuna casserole,

[Kia]

but a tuna casserole is not a tuna Mac.

[Jade]

Let's be fair. No, no, no, no, no, it's not. But what I think my. I feel like, because they'll make a tuna casserole, they might make a tuna Mac, but I can't confirm that. Maybe we just claim that.

[Kia]

If somebody knows, y' all let us know, okay? If somebody knows, send us an email. Leave a comment, let us know. Because now. Now I'm. I'm interested. You know, this is. Now.

[Jade]

I came across a young lady online who I follow. I love her content, too. I've got to find her name. And she's basically reinventing soul food. Me XD have spoken about her.

[Kia]

Okay, I might follow her, but she's like, you probably do she's been posting very regularly, like. Yeah, yeah, I'm. I'm. Yeah, just sort of.

[Jade]

It was a Negro Frito, which was like a negro version of a sofrito. That's not what she called it. That was what I called it. But she's doing things like that. She did a. I saw her make like a soup.

[Kia]

Like a turnip soup.

[Jade]

Oh, oh, she made like a turnip soup.

[Kia]

And she like. She. Oh, good, sis. I'mma say it, Tennessee. Cuz I. I think I say saved it because she made like a crispy white fish. Oh, and made like a.

[Jade]

Maybe I missed that one.

[Kia]

She made a broth with pot liquor.

[Jade]

Oh, yeah, because let. Save your pot liquor when you make your greens. Save your. I always save pot liquor when I make my greens. She made a bean salad, but she did it with black eyed pea. A collard green and beans. Yes, yes, yes, it looked good as. Yes, it looked good as. She also introduced me to a brand. If. If anybody knows this young woman, tell her I'm deeply interested in her work. I'm about to purchase many of her jars. Black girl kimchi. I make kimchi. You know, I think I told you recently I was making my own kimchi at home. To know that there is a business that is making it that I can support. That I support. You know what I'm saying? Black girl kimchi is making a variation of kim cheese. I believe there is an olive. Yeah.

[Kia]

Black eyed peas and collard green salad with a sweet lemony jerk.

[Jade]

Jerk vinegarette. That looked phenomenal. I'd probably put a little maple in that vinegarette as well. And a dash of mustard. Sounds fire. Does she do red wine vinegar in there? I. Absolutely.

[Kia]

She did.

[Jade]

She's giving amazing ideas. She does a pepperoncini and a red onion.

[Kia]

Red onion, I believe. Green pepper. Yes. She. And I love that she massaged the greens.

[Jade]

You have like kale.

[Kia]

You have to massage the greens. Cucumber, pepperoncini and black eyed peas. She added the mustard. Green kimchi mustard. Okay. Yeah. She had jerk flavoring. Let me go back. She had jerk frank. She added a little. It looked like orange marmalade or some jam or something to it. That's what it looked like because they said it was sweet. Maybe it was honey. What was. Let me just go back.

[Jade]

She might. It could have been a dollop of any of it. Could have been an apricot jam. It could have been a dash of guava. It could have been a little honey. Who knows? Shakayla. I think all of them Would work, honestly. You could put a little, you know, a little bit of maple. I think any of them would bring.

[Kia]

This is not the young lady that I found, but I'm gonna find the one that I found, the young lady that made the turnips soup with the fish.

[Jade]

Okay.

[Kia]

Charles had reposted her.

[Jade]

Okay, okay, okay. I'm interested. I'm interested.

[Kia]

Oh, yeah. She has the recipe down to her sub stack girl. Yes.

[Jade]

Okay, so what was it?

[Kia]

What was the little dollar with? With some fresh cornbread.

[Jade]

Yes. Huh. Huh. I also always freeze my corn, you know, because we never eat all the cornbread. So there's always a couple pieces left over. So I do freeze those as well because it's good. Like if you're cooking dinner during the weekend, you want to throw a little piece of cornbread on, but you don't want to make a whole batch. That always holds you over. If you have a smaller family, you never finish it off. So she's. She's. We'll link her in the description box. I would love to actually have her on the show.

[Kia]

Same.

[Jade]

Same. Cuz I love, you know, you. You know how I feel about our food and what I think we've.

[Kia]

And we've had lots of conversations about, like, not losing recipes and soul food and we should. We should reach out and see if she would be interested. It be down to join us.

[Jade]

Yes. But we will. Because we've been chatting so much. We'll put the link in the description box so you all can follow her online. You said Shakayla, right? It's Shakayla Felice.

[Kia]

It's her name.

[Jade]

Kayla Feliz. But yes, we will link her in the description box so you all can check out her content. She's doing amazing, amazing, amazing work online. I love what black women in food are doing online right now. I'm just. I admire so many and, you know, so there's such inspirations for me to bust my ass. And yeah, here I am busting my ass in different ways. Sierra. Oh, no. Sierra. Sierra Nicole Reese. That's who it is.

[Kia]

This is not. This. This is not the same person.

[Jade]

This is the. This is. This is her.

[Kia]

Let me send you her.

[Jade]

Oh, wait, let me show you her. Her face. Oh, damn. Of course I turned it just as she. Damn it. Hold on. Show your face.

[Kia]

What is she making? What is that her? That's the girl that made the. That's not. That's the girl that made the collard greens or that's somebody else.

[Jade]

This is who I was talking about. With the collard green bean salad. Oh, that's who was also featuring the kimchi. This is Sierra Nicole Reese and she's doing a whole.

[Kia]

I'm gonna see who I was looking at because this is the one I saw. So it's two black women out here making collard greens and black eyed pea salad.

[Jade]

And this is why, this is why we have always said at gettin grown that there is not one carrot.

[Kia]

No.

[Jade]

Because there's enough for. To go around for everybody and there's enough for everybody to get their things.

[Kia]

I just sent you this girl. Girls.

[Jade]

Okay.

[Kia]

Hers. Her post. That's the one that I saw.

[Jade]

Okay. I love that we are. I love that. I love that there's multiple people doing these things.

[Kia]

Same. Oh, she's. She's based in Seattle. Oh nice.

[Jade]

Oh, look at us.

[Kia]

I know.

[Jade]

Look at us. My. My self care is not super involved. The reason you all got a reprise is because I called out of work last week and that was. And that's. That. That's my sister. When you, when you work for yourself, sometimes you have to call out of work.

[Kia]

It's true. It's true.

[Jade]

And so that's what happened. I called out of work, I told myself that I was sick and then I got sick for real. Which is usually how it happens.

[Kia]

No, it's. I mean and you have to listen to your body. You have to listen to your yourself. Particularly when we're creating. Right. And we want to be very intentional about what space we create. And we respect the kitchen table so much that we want our spirits and hearts and minds and bodies to be right. We're not just going to show up on. No. On the other stuff. Right. Because y' all can hear that and y' all can feel it.

[Jade]

Absolutely. And I called last week because we were absolutely planned to record an episode and you know, I, I was, I was bleeding. So I called Kia and I said I really want to have it and I'm just gonna. I can't find it. Like I'm trying my living breathing best and I, I literally. I can't, I can't dig for it. And it was. She was very understanding. And so that's my self care this week. I had to call out of work to myself.

[Kia]

You know, I mean it happens. It happens with the best of us. Sometimes we just don't have it. And you know, as we say and we'll continue to say, we're negotiating such trash times that like there's. You know what I'm saying? Like it's like it wears on your body, you know? And I know that I'm getting older. I'm getting older, and I think my capacity to sort of push through is shrinking.

[Jade]

Yeah. Yeah. I don't. I'm. I'm less apt to push myself to a place, you know, and I want to save my push because there are going to be times you have to push, right? There are times you have to. And then there are times where you have to listen to yourself and say, I can't push. And I'd rather preserve my energy for the times where I really need and want to push. Not saying that I don't want to do it for the episodes, but you know what I'm saying? Like, sometimes, like, going to see my kids at the jail this week, I really wanted to. I was like, I'm gonna try my living best. And I.

[Kia]

Yes. And you was gonna go until.

[Jade]

Oh, girl.

[Kia]

Told you to stay your behind home.

[Jade]

Yeah. Shout out to Kiana. Shout out to Kian.

[Kia]

Sometimes you need somebody else to say, girl, you look terrible. Sit down.

[Jade]

Kiana said, jade, you have the neurovirus. I have it a few weeks ago. You have six out of seven symptoms and you're not going any. Cuz I was like, okay, well, I'm going to go see the kids on Thursday and Friday, then I'm just going to miss Wins. She said, no, you won't be going on this trip. Unfortunately.

[Kia]

Unfortunately, you need to sit your ass down.

[Jade]

That's what she said. I got black bombed. I got black bombed.

[Kia]

Unfortunately, you need to sit your behind down somewhere.

[Jade]

And then here come my mother with all of her theatrics because ironically, my grandma went into the hospital. That conversation I told you I had with her after we recorded, she went into the hospital the next morning. And so I'm throwing up. She can't feel her legs. She's okay now. She's in a rehab facility. Her sciatica is up real bad. But she. So we both woke up, just my cousin facetimed me and. And then face. And then. So I could see my grandma. And we're both laid in the bed looking. I said, look at us. We're miserable girls. She's like, we're miserable. So, you know, I got black mom. Then my mom is like. She's like, I'm such a terrible mother and daughter. I can't be there for my mother. I can't be there for my daughter. I said, stop it now. I'm too sick for this way to

[Kia]

think about you, Mom. They do that so well, so.

[Jade]

Well, I love it. But the only great I gave her grace because my mother is a doer. Yeah.

[Kia]

And she wants to be there for both of you.

[Jade]

She's. And she's a be thereer. You know what I'm saying? When I went into labor, she was like, airplane now. And she stayed with me for almost a month.

[Kia]

No, that's what they do.

[Jade]

Moves a doer. She's a. And she does it for her mother too. So I know she felt helpless, but I was like, you can't hop on a of piece. Complain every time.

[Kia]

And we don't want you to get it, girl. You can't.

[Jade]

I don't want you to get it.

[Kia]

I don't want you to get this. So sit back. Okay.

[Jade]

Nah. So that was. That was my self care. And you know, I feel good about that decision. And here we are, you know, with fresher energy.

[Kia]

Fresher energy and purged spirits and body. Very much so. Okay.

[Jade]

And that's it. But let's move on to these petty peeves. Close this thing on out.

[Kia]

Let's do it. Country. Petty, petty, petty.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

All the same to me playing Jane Spaghetti.

[Jade]

All right, it's time to put the petty on parade. I don't know if I said this before, but I. There was an uptick of it I saw on the train the other day, which is probably where I got that fucking neurovirus, now that I'm thinking about it. Mighty God, take a shot for every time I've said neurovin virus. And so I noticed that there's an. Are people not taught to cover their mouths when they yawn anymore?

[Kia]

Oh, no, I don't think anyone's taught to cover their mouths when they do anything. People chew with their mouth open. People just doing what? Coughing, sneezing. It's just. I mean. I mean, whatever happened to like, the people just don't care? Ah, it's real bad. It's.

[Jade]

No, they don't.

[Kia]

It is.

[Jade]

It's disgusting. And I just. I was like, you know, I don't know if you all realize it, but your little particles also fly out of your mouths when you yawn too. You know what I'm saying? Like, we need to get back. I was taught to cover my mouth when I yawn. I was taught to not cover my mouth with my hand when I sneeze or cough. Like, I don't wear these basic teachings, you know, that needs to be a part of gentle parenting. You want to be gentle on your little bodies, don't you? Then teach them to Put their mouths and noses in their shirts and just wrap up like a nun when they would sneeze and cough and to cover the. Their mouths when they yawn. And the elbow, the elbow sneeze. Doesn't work. Still sprays.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

It's still sprays.

[Jade]

So I just. That's my petty peeve this week. It's just very brief. But please, if nobody taught you, Grandma, Uncle, Auntie Jade is here to tell you, cover your mouth when you yawn.

[Kia]

Grandma, Uncle, Auntie, you.

[Jade]

What's your mother call me? Mother.

[Kia]

I just feel like in this age at this, in this, in this is it just me, but. So there's some work being done in the subdivision here and some of the. I think they're doing roof repair repair on a lot of the houses. The units.

[Jade]

No.

[Kia]

And so they sent us an email telling us that they were going to do it. The email laid out the times, the dates, who was going to be involved. And so I, you know, was aware that it was happening, but I'm, I am. And I, you know, shout out to the morning people, right. All the, the girls, the gays, the days that get up at 5 and 6 in the morning just be traipsing about, you know, that. Yeah, that is not my ministry. Never has been. And I recognize, yes. But I, you know, I aspire, I admire, but it's just not who I am. So at 7am in the morning, somebody is banging on my door. Now I don't, I don't know. Now, forgive me, but I just, maybe I'm just. I need to grow up. But I just feel like it is like, why isn't it 7am too early to be knocking on somebody's door?

[Jade]

Yeah, I don't think they're allowed to start construction before Eddie Am, so you shouldn't be allowed to a. You shouldn't really be allowed to freely knock on my door. But, you know, I won't be that person.

[Kia]

Right.

[Jade]

Because that's part of what's wrong with

[Kia]

telling me like, you know what I'm saying? So I'm like, you know, is something wrong? So first of all, he just rings the doorbell and I'm just like, what is this? And I look on the camera, I see that it is the worker people. So I'm just like, okay, I know that they're working on the roof. Mind you, I do not live like, I live on a lower units, so my home is not impacted by the roof at all. Right. So I'm just like, okay. He continues to ring the doorbell and Then he starts banging on the door. So I get up and I go downstairs. I open the door and I'm just like, just. What is your problem, sir? What are you going through?

[Jade]

You can't talk?

[Kia]

I mean, is your car in the. Is your car in the driveway? No. No, it is not.

[Jade]

Did you look before you came banging on my door like the police?

[Kia]

Well, well, where is your car?

[Jade]

I just told you it's not in the driveway.

[Kia]

It's not in the driveway. And I don't see how that is your concern. Is it in the garage? Yes. Oh, okay.

[Jade]

I just told you.

[Kia]

And so you banging on my door.

[Jade]

It's not in the driveway.

[Kia]

7am for no. No reason. Okay. If it's not in the driveway, then it is not impacted by whatever you're doing. I understand that you feel like you need to let people know so they can move their cars. If you would have looked in my driveway because my driveway also has the same house number on it. So you would have seen that my driveway is empty. And you banging on my door like the opposite at 7am have you lost your mind?

[Jade]

I'm telling you. And he looking at me like he

[Kia]

judging me like, you're a slacker. Oh, my goodness. You're not. Oh, like he's just looking at me like, why you're not up?

[Jade]

Listen here, Christian.

[Kia]

I don't say, yo, yo, yo, I'm

[Jade]

glad you got your Tim Hortons at 4:30am but it's a different household over here. I don't know if your wife is up making those. Making hus. Lunch for my husband in his blue collar job at 4. And. And she sends you with a fucking beach cooler full of food. But over here, I'm just now wiping the crust out of my eyes.

[Kia]

I'm brushing my teeth like, what is wrong with you?

[Jade]

And also, even if I'm not, even if I was fully the fuck awake, don't bang on my door like that at any point of day.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

Yeah.

[Jade]

Unless there is a fire. Yeah.

[Kia]

Like, he acted like. Like somebody. Like somebody was standing in my driveway and got hit by something. Like there was an emerging situation happening right now. And I'm just like, sir, what? Where's your car? To whom are you speaking?

[Jade]

Who the fuck are you talking?

[Kia]

To whom are you speaking? How do you know that I have a car?

[Jade]

Oh, that is a better way to say that, isn't it?

[Kia]

But you know there's a way. To whom are you speaking? To whom? I would love to know. Because there's a way, right? You Know, and I get it. Like, you know, it's the whole. The mansplay. Explaining things sometimes. And they just talk to you like, you don't know anything. Like, I need this man to tell me to move my car. Please, sir, get off my porch with this foolishness.

[Jade]

My car was in the driveway. I told you.

[Kia]

And I told you no. And then you say, well, where is it? Excuse. Have.

[Jade]

Why.

[Kia]

Why are you talking to me? Why are you talking to me, Please? What do you want banging on my door? Excuse me. Jesus is not even up yet. What do you want?

[Jade]

He arises at 7:30am Are you kidding?

[Kia]

It's not okay. I just would never bang on nobody's door at that hour. I would never bang on nobody's door, period.

[Jade]

Well, the social skills these days are also waning. Just like our nerves and our tolerance, the social skills are also just depleting at rapid rates. I'm noticing.

[Kia]

It's real bad out here. It's real bad.

[Jade]

It's the way drive to how they interact to that young man that works at the Lowe's. When I went to go buy that paint. I have it out for you, sir.

[Kia]

Wow.

[Jade]

I have it out for you.

[Kia]

What do you do?

[Jade]

Nothing.

[Kia]

Oh, exactly.

[Jade]

That's the problem. And he was working, walked up to me and Tristan and looked at us. He looked at us.

[Kia]

Now, you know that just burns me right up, right? Because I told you, when I went over to the Popeyes, I placed my order, I drive around the window, the little boy just looking at me, and I say, you, sir, at work.

[Jade]

I'm not. I'm not at work.

[Kia]

I'm not at work. I'm not at work. So it's not on me to initiate the exchange. Do you want my money money or not?

[Jade]

Like, I was getting irritated and I told you about the young ladies at the cvs, and they were, you know, they. They were like, what are you. But I. I think at this point, I'm about to start walking up and again, my millennial way is to be like, hello. I'm not even calling a millennial way. My human way.

[Kia]

They think we are to be like,

[Jade]

hey, how are you?

[Kia]

They think we're so, so old, edges out of it. And I'd be like, good afternoon.

[Jade]

No, I'm not even gonna. I'm about to walk up and start looking at them too. Like, we're gonna look at how long. And I'm gonna put a timer on my phone, and I just want to see how long we're gonna look at each other before somebody Says something. Because it ain't gonna be me. It's not gonna be me. It's not gonna be me. I promise you that. This is my new way.

[Kia]

Oh.

[Jade]

If you don't say nothing, that I don't say nothing. And then we're just gonna to stand here, both of us.

[Kia]

What's wrong with y'? All?

[Jade]

What is wrong with y'? All?

[Kia]

I want to know what's going on.

[Jade]

Oh, God. Oh, my God. Yeah, I want you all to do that. And please start reporting back to me how it works. Walk up and say nothing.

[Kia]

Just be looking.

[Jade]

If they say something, then we move about as normal, Right? But if they say nothing, say nothing. And I need. I want to know how these exchanges. Exchanges go.

[Kia]

Let's do a experiment because I'm sick of it. I'm sick to death. I'm sick of it. I'm sick of it. And y' all got to do better.

[Jade]

I think maybe after. I'll give it a solid. I'll give it a solid minute of us looking at each other, which is a long time, right?

[Kia]

That is a long time of silence.

[Jade]

No, but this is. But this is how awkward it needs to get.

[Kia]

It needs to get.

[Jade]

So that will be my. That else. It's going to be my.

[Kia]

I feel like these children are off put by awkward, though. They are just at. They feel right at home.

[Jade]

Let's get weird then, little cuz. I'm ready. I'm ready.

[Kia]

Weird energy out here. We just out here.

[Jade]

You know I can't. You know I can't.

[Kia]

You picked the right one.

[Jade]

You sure did. Don't let me walk up to you in a dinosaur T shirt and I'm putting headband on.

[Kia]

I don't know if I told you this weird. Let me say it on the. Let me. Because I think. Did I. I might have told you just when I. When I was down to the Chick fil a at the airport, and there was a young man in front of me. His name was Robert, okay? He. Robert ordered his food, went on and wait for it. And then I order my food and I go and stand by Robert and the little girl calls his name, Robert, and hands him the bag. Robert, I don't know him. Robert walks up to me and he says, look at this, right? He shows me the bag. That baby spelled his name R O, B, I, T. I said, the children are not all right.

[Jade]

I said, the children are not all right, y'.

[Kathleen Guillaume Delamar]

All.

[Jade]

The children are not okay.

[Kia]

We have. We are in danger now. I said, now. This girl, she had to be maybe, maybe 19, 20, 21 years old. Could not have been her first Robert in her life. I don't believe that. I refuse to believe that.

[Jade]

Nah, Nah.

[Kia]

Okay. And if it was R O, B E T, I would say okay, she just left out the other R. Yeah.

[Jade]

Like maybe it was a mistake.

[Kia]

It's not no mistake.

[Jade]

Nah. Robert.

[Kia]

And Robert was so distressed that he, he walked up to a stranger and

[Jade]

said, stranger, look at that, look at this, look at this, look at this, look at this.

[Kia]

We both just looking at the girl like, my God today.

[Jade]

How'd she spell your. What'd you tell her your name was?

[Kia]

I don't even tell the girls the truth no more. What's your name? Lisa. Lisa, don't hurt yourself. Don't hurt yourself. Don't hurt yourself. Okay? I say Kia like they spell it like the car Kia or Lisa. Something very simple. I don't even stress the people out with my full name. I know what I done had. I done had this name all my life. I'll tell you my name was is Chris. Before I say I'm not doing that when cuz I don't have time. It's not a teachable moment. I'm not here to educate you. You know what I'm saying about how vows work. That's not in my pay grade today.

[Jade]

So I'm about to have fun with that too. My new name when I go out to eat and they have to put it on the ticket is triceratops.

[Kia]

And my mom says the same thing. She's like, they can say Tchaikovsky. I'm like, no, they can't, Mom. They can't say that.

[Jade]

No, they can't. Nor can they at all spell that. They don't even know there's a W in there.

[Kia]

N. They don't know that. They can't say that. They can't say that.

[Jade]

Oh, God bless us. Well, thank you to our guest this week. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

[Kia]

Absolutely.

[Jade]

Kathleen Yom Delamar, we are so grateful for you and your conversation and necessary work out here in the world of pure and utter horribleness.

[Kia]

Wow.

[Jade]

Thank you to all of our patrons who tune in every week and support us just for the video versions of this and sometimes an additional conversation. We're just grateful for you all, you know, throwing support to the kids. We need it it especially in these precedented time. I'm tired of living in precedented times cuz they not unprecedented at this point.

[Kia]

There a pat.

[Jade]

They're patterned, they're president, they're written Down. They're typed. They're.

[Kia]

They're cyclical times.

[Jade]

What's the. Where they stamp it. What's the, what's the called? What's the.

[Kia]

Notarized.

[Jade]

No, they are notarized. These are notorized times. Okay. Certified. But we are so grateful for all the support that we get during these times. Happy nine years. To getting growing again. Happy nine years. Yeah. And sister, take us out and tell us what to do.

[Kia]

Make sure that you're moisturizing your mind. Okay. The way that you do that is by attending to the business that is yours and yours alone. Okay. It's. It's strongly giving. Worry about yourself out here.

[Jade]

Yeah.

[Kia]

Okay. You also want to make sure that you are drinking just as much water as your body can sustain every day. You have to stay hydrated in this season. Okay. You're gonna start aging and looking like them. You don't want that. Finally, you want to moisturize your skin. Beloved. It's your largest organ and it will in fact crack if it's dry.

[Jade]

Absolutely. All right now. Bye. Bye. Keep yourself safe.

[Kia]

Bye.

[Pharmaceutical Narrator]

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[Kia]

We heard you shouldn't talk about going to the bathroom in public, so we decided to sing about it.

[Jade]

Light a candle, Pour some wine Grab a roll the soft kind for a little me time Charmin Ultra Soft Smooth tear Wavy edges for my rear so

[Kia]

let the softness caress your soul Just

[Jade]

relax, you're on a roll. Let her rip. Charmin Ultra soft Smooth hair Charmin Ultra

[Kia]

Soft Smoothed hair has the same softness you love now with wavy edges that tear better than the leading one Ply brand Enjoy the go with charming.