A (3:40)

The other thing that you mentioned in an email was that GTD had made a big difference in not just helping you get Factory 3 running smoothly, but making sure that that wasn't your entire life. You still had time for the rest of your life, which is. It was just really gratifying to hear that.

B (4:01)

That, I mean, yeah, that and I've, I've heard this from, you know, many people that use gtd. That, that has been, you know, just freeing up my, my mind so that I can really relax and take time off when I'm not working. I, it's something I didn't even know was possible to the extent that it is just trusting that everything is, is organized and waiting for me when I get back. Yeah, the system has allowed me to do that.

A (4:30)

Yeah. And how about family? Do you have family? And if so, have they noticed that you're any more relaxed or available?

B (4:39)

Yeah, I mean, I haven't actually asked them that, but I, I imagine, yeah, I imagine they've seen a change in me over the. It's been, yeah, it's been like almost five years since I started using gtd. So I, I would, I would think it would be fair to assume that they've seen, seen a shift. Yeah.

A (4:58)

Yeah. I suppose if you really wanted them to find out you're a GTD nerd, you could hand them a survey and say, all right, here's a hundred question survey that'll assess whether, whether you've found me to be more or less available in the time I've been using gtd.

B (5:13)

I'll definitely, definitely. If you got one, I'll give it out to them.

A (5:17)

No, I'm not going to inflict that on you, you or your family. How about tools that you are using or have used? Were you managing your lists with something when you found gtd and what have you used since then?

B (5:33)

Yeah, that's a, that's a great question. So I'm actually using the same tools that I was using before. Before I found gtd. I was using an Excel spreadsheet for my to do lists and Apple Calendar on my Mac and my phone. I'm still using those same platforms. But I'm using them a bit differently. I originally had one giant spreadsheet with what I now realize was a mixture of actions, projects and bigger goals that I was struggling to get done. So I now still have spreadsheet that has different tabs for actions, projects, someday, maybe goals and objectives. And then I use my calendar for appointments and then I also use it to keep track of things that come up through the day that I do a daily review every morning and then go through things I've assigned myself to my inbox.

A (6:37)

Coincidentally, I've been thinking about Excel or any kind of a sort of spreadsheet as a way of managing lists and thinking it's a really good system because it's all sortable. You can move columns if you want. You can sort by any column. You can sort by one column followed by another, followed by another. So it handles many of the issues that people have with apps for gtd. Like why won't it link my projects? Why won't it.

B (7:05)

Exactly, yeah, that kind of stuff. Yeah. I like the simplicity of it. I've been using spreadsheets for, you know, most of my life now, so I'm pretty comfortable using Excel. So it works for me. I mean, it doesn't have, you know, I, I suppose some of the features that different to do apps have, but I like it better just being able to use it the way that I want to.

A (7:29)

That's true, yeah. That way you're not trying to go work around some kind of a quote feature in an app that doesn't work for you that you have to try to find a way to ignore or turn off anything like that. Yep, that sounds great. And then you said Apple Calendar on your Mac and iPhone. Are you, are you all Mac these days or got anything going on Windows?

B (7:55)

I'm all Mac, yeah. I'm a super Mac fanboy. Been using Apple since I was a kid, so. MacBook, iPhone.

A (8:06)

Yeah, got it, yeah. And does that translate over into. I'm going to leak over into Factory three a little bit here. Does that translate over at all into anything you use for controlling equipment over there or.

B (8:21)

I would say as much as, as much as possible. I mean, we have, we have an imac for the members to use. Most of the software is web based, so it runs, you know, runs fine on Mac or PC. A lot of members bring their own computers as well. I find a lot of them are Mac users which, you know, I think I'm attracting, you know, my kind of people in the space in that way.

A (8:46)

Yeah, yeah, okay. Good. Well, let's, let's get into factory three. And I'm not sure where to start, but I'm going to try to make it broad enough to let people in who may, may be scratching their heads going, I don't even know what this, what they're talking about yet. So is, is Factory 3 organized as a corporation or a nonprofit corporation or how, how does that work?

B (9:12)

Yeah. So from a business perspective, Factory 3 is an LLC. Factory 3 is a makerspace. So it is a communal workshop. We're in a big warehouse in Portland that has been converted into a wood shop, metal shop, sewing and fiber arts, and then we have digital fabrication. So we have big laser cutters, 3D printers. A lot of it is like big industrial equipment that people can't really have in a house, definitely can't have in an apartment. I live in a city, so, you know, myself and a lot of people here aren't, would not be able to use that equipment otherwise. Um, it's a similar concept to a coworking space or a gym. Those are kind of the best analogies I could make to it. You know, a lot of people have a gym membership, not a lot of people have their own gym at home with a personal trainer on staff and all the, all the big machines. And it, it just, it's something that most people don't need and most people can't afford.

A (10:17)

Right, right. And just don't have the space for.

B (10:20)

Exactly. Yeah.

A (10:22)

Yeah. Okay. And when you. What. How about the word maker? That's. I get the impression that when you say that you mean it to be a very broad term that doesn't, it doesn't leave anybody out. So do you have any kind of a way that you think of that or define that?

B (10:42)

Yeah, I mean, I personally define it very broad. That's correct. I would, I would say everyone is a maker in, you know, in all different ways. We have members that come to use the space just for computer work. They just bring in their laptop and they want to be around a community of creative people. So, you know, making things doesn't need to be in the physical world. It can be on a computer. Makers can also be welders, woodworkers, painters. I mean, there's just all types of.

A (11:15)

I just had a kind of a cross sensory impression of Factory 3. Thinking, if I walked in there, I bet it would have a whole combination of smells, from things like hot metal to woodworking, to glue to paint to all kinds of things like that.

B (11:35)

We've got all that. We have a Candle maker too, who makes scented candles. So I like to brag that we have the nicest smelling makerspace in the world.

A (11:45)

That's fun. That's fun. It balances out any of the other chemical smells.

B (11:50)

Exactly.

A (11:51)

It also reminds me of a, a big toy shop or a toy shop for grown ups.

B (11:58)

It's definitely that. And you know, for a lot of our members it is, it is a place to come play after work. We have members who come in to do their full time job in the space, you know, different types of production and making things. But for a lot of our members it is just a place to come play which is, which is much needed.

A (12:18)

Yeah. And when somebody comes in there to make something, give us an idea of how big a space is. What's the, what's the smallest thing somebody's ever made? What's the biggest thing somebody's ever made? Do you have any trouble getting something out that's so big that it can't be removed from the building or anything like that?

B (12:39)

Yeah, I mean we have quite a range. It's a 5,000 square foot space. So there's room to do a lot in there. The smallest thing, I mean we have one member who's a jeweler, so I guess that would be more on the small end like rings and bracelets and necklaces. The largest thing currently that's being worked on is a tiny home. So it's 40 foot trailer with a. It's basically like the size of a studio apartment. One of our members is building it to live in with her son and.

A (13:15)

She'S building that inside Factory 3.

B (13:18)

So we have a little outdoor space next to the building that we rent out for larger projects like that. So she is using that space.

A (13:26)

Okay.

B (13:27)

And then she, she'll work in the wood shop and do like her, you know, build like her cabinets and her flooring and then she can, can bounce between the shop and the outdoor space which is really convenient for her.

A (13:38)

Yeah, that makes sense. So she can work on something that's that she's can get her arms around and then be able to carry that out to the tiny home to install it.

B (13:49)

Exactly.

A (13:50)

Got it. Okay, well that didn't even occur to me that somebody might do a combination of something that was fairly large but outside and making parts for it inside Factory 3.

B (14:03)

Yep. Yeah, it's a good use of the space.

A (14:06)

Interesting. Okay, and you mentioned some pretty high tech equipment like laser cutters, laser printers. Those are not the kinds of things that most people would have access to any other way.

B (14:22)

It's true. Yeah. I mean, they're, they're, you know, machines that, I mean, you could buy a 3D printer or a laser cutter and have it at your home. Where it gets tricky with some of the equipment is the upkeep and maintenance and just knowing what to do if something goes wrong. That's a big part of what we provide is not just the equipment, but the training and knowledge to use it.

A (14:48)

Very important.

B (14:49)

So, yeah, definitely. Very important part.

A (14:53)

Yeah. I, I recently met a. A maker in New Mexico who runs runs up space similar to yours, but it's specifically for architects and training. And a big part of what they do there is make sure that people know how to use the equipment before they let them near the equipment.

B (15:15)

That's a very, very good thing to do.

A (15:18)

And, and they have a whole safety protocol about here's what happens, here's what we do if anything goes wrong. And so there's a lot of education that goes along with providing the equipment.

B (15:29)

Definitely, yeah.

A (15:31)

What about your other background? How did you get interested in, in even doing something like this?

B (15:40)

Yeah, I mean, I've been making things since I was a kid. My dad's a maker. We had a little wood shop in the basement, so I would make like my own toys when I was a kid. It just made sense to make things that I wanted to have. You know, as I got like older, became an adult, you know, living in an apartment, it became harder to do that kind of work. I actually joined another makerspace about an hour south of us. I was living down in Portsmouth, New Hampshire, and I didn't really know about makerspaces until I found out about that one. I joined for a place to learn how to work on motorcycles. I bought an old motorcycle from the early 70s, and my project was simply to take it apart completely, put it back together and have it run. What kind is was a 1971 Honda CB350. Oh, I bought it off. Bought off a Craigslist for 300 bucks. It would, you know, I, I could tell that. I could tell that the engine could be repaired, but it was not currently running. It was a really, it was a really fun project. I learned a lot about motorcycles. I did not expect to learn welding, machining, woodworking. Just being in that space around other makers like, it just showed me things that are possible that I didn't think I could do. And I wasn't expecting that. I wasn't expecting it to be so welcoming and beginner friendly.

A (17:11)

Wow, that's great.

B (17:13)

So moved back up to Portland and There was just nothing like it up here. We're. We're a very creative city. We have a lot of artists and makers here. I assume there was a space that I could just join, and I couldn't find anything that. That compared to that one down in Portsmouth.

A (17:30)

And so you decided to make a makerspace.

B (17:33)

Exactly, yeah.

A (17:36)

Did you eventually get to the point where you could ride the. Ride that Honda back up to. To Portland?

B (17:43)

So, yeah, I did. I did get it running. I. I took it for some rides around New Hampshire. I ended up selling it while I was getting Factory 3 going. It was just not, you know, just too many, too many projects. I didn't need another one at that time.

A (17:58)

Yeah.

B (18:00)

Yeah.

A (18:01)

Well, there's a good market for those. They're very in demand these days.

B (18:04)

They definitely are. Yeah.

A (18:07)

So this was. It was. It's clear that this is something you've been interested in your whole life. If you were making your own toys, that's. That sounds like you could have been running Santa's workshop and having toys made for kids all over the world. Sure. Was there anything like something that you were more drawn to in the way of. Of material to work with? For example, metal more than wood or anything like that?

B (18:37)

I would say metal for sure. I, you know, like I said, I grew up with a little wood shop, so I. Wood was my medium just because that's what I was able to work with. I always had this idea in my head that metal was like something I could never do. Like, I just had like this mental block on it, partly because I never had access to the equipment, but it's just something I didn't really know a lot of people that worked with it. It just seemed so much harder to work with than wood. Since joining that makerspace down in New Hampshire and then eventually starting Factory three, I mean, I realized just having access to the equipment and having some people around doing it with you, like, metal is very accessible. Anyone that lives near a makerspace, go take the intro to welding class. Most makerspaces have it. It's like a three, four hour class.

A (19:28)

Oh, that's all.

B (19:30)

That's all you need to learn MiG welding, which is like, you know, it's one of the easier types of welding to do. Ever since taking that class, it just like opened my mind up to, like, I can work with metal, and that means there's a lot more. More things I can do.

A (19:46)

Well, that's encouraging to hear. Wow. Talking to you, I want to go back and repeat wood shop and metal shop that I took in junior high school.

B (19:54)

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I'm sure you got, I'm sure you've got a makerspace by you in Santa Barbara. Definitely. It's my understanding makerspaces started in the Bay Area and I mean, I'm sure they're all over California.

A (20:11)

Yeah. Cool. All right, well, I'm sorry, I'm taking a trip down my own memory lane there, thinking, oh, I wish I'd paid more attention. And frankly, I wish I wish you had been my metal shop and wood shop teacher back then too, because I think you would have made the whole subject more interesting and more fun.

B (20:28)

Oh, thank you.

A (20:28)

John, back to gtd. In, in your work with Factory three, have you, have you found that anybody there, either customers or people who, who, who work with you or work for you there, do they ask you about how you get so much done? Do they. Is there some way that you've shared about GTD with them in any way?

B (20:51)

Yeah, I mean, I've definitely shared it with a few people. I don't, you know, I don't know of anyone like members or people working for me that is currently using it, but they, you know, definitely people, people are interested sometimes in just like how I, how I keep the space running. A lot of makerspaces have like a full time crew of three people. Factory 3 is just me full time, and then I have a few people helping out part time. So it is definitely like the system I really feel allows it to be possible to just keep track of everything that needs to be done.

A (21:31)

Well, I would imagine there's a lot to keep track of because pick any one of those pieces of equipment and it's probably got its own maintenance schedule and a lot to track. Just about that one piece of equipment.

B (21:43)

Exactly. Yeah.

A (21:45)

I'm ready to travel to Portland and see the place. This is fascinating to me.

B (21:51)

Yeah, I'd love to have you by anytime.

A (21:54)

How fun. Thank you. Thank you so much. Is there anything else that you thought of that you wanted to talk about? Let me just plug the, the website factory3.org and the three is the number three. So factory number three.org is the website.

B (22:14)

Thank you, John. Yeah, no, I don't, I don't really have anything else. I mean, I'm just like. Yeah. Just express my gratitude for, for GTD and David for developing it and you know, all you guys for helping to, to spread the word and, and get it out there. It's definitely like, definitely been life changing for me. It's definitely like put me in a lot better place. With like, work, life, balance, and just being able to do the things that. That are important to me. So. So thank you for all of it.

A (22:45)

That's what it's all about. It's. People think it's about the lists and. And doing what's on the list, but it's more about freeing up your mind and your space so that you can be present with whatever you're doing.

B (22:57)

Exactly.

A (22:58)

And I forgot to mention, at the very beginning of our email chain, you said you were interested in attending a GTD summit. And I said, well, unfortunately, we had one in 2019 and we don't have plans for another one yet. But I pointed you to the GTD summer camp that our partner in the Nordics have been doing. I don't know if you got over to that one this summer, but I think they're planning to keep that going as a regular summer thing.

B (23:28)

Oh, I love to hear that. Yeah, I was not able to this summer, but I've definitely got it. Got it on my. My calendar to sign up for next summer. Yeah, that's something. I mean, I'm just interested in talking to other people that use gtd. I've run into, like, I think just one person just through, like, friends and people that I work with. So, I mean, I would just love to be in a room with other people that use it just to, like, talk and share ideas.

A (23:58)

Yeah. Okay, that sounds. That sounds great. I. I have a feeling that. That there are lots of other people who are. Who consider themselves makers who might find it really interesting to talk to somebody like you who has managed to apply GTD to a very creative way of life.

B (24:17)

Definitely.

A (24:18)

Yeah. Yeah. Thank you so much for spending time and telling us about Factory 3 and your GTD journey.

B (24:26)

Hey, thank you, John. And thank you for everybody listening.

C (24:40)

I'd like to give a short message to those of you who've been participating and playing with GTD Connect for a while and sort of remind you that all of us with this GTD methodology and this set of practices go through cycles. I still go through cycles myself. Initially. There's kind of the inspiration and there's a lot of material to ingest and to get familiar with. And so people oftentimes, when they first come onto Connect, are just potentially overwhelmed by how much information there is. In a way, it's just a huge library where we've been able to archive so much different information from so many different perspectives and people and points of view, and so understood that it's like walking into a library going, gee, where Do I start? So that's oftentimes the initial phase of this. And many people after a year or two probably get on some level or some plateau where they go, well, I kind of got it now. I've got my system set up and everything's fine and I'm fine tuning. And you may find yourself at that point also finding yourself saying, gee, I'm now becoming a resource of this methodology for people around me, people asking me for assistance and help in this. And we've seen in the forums a number of people now sharing ideas about how to get your teams more involved or families more involved with this information. So some of that information is in there as well. But I think you'll find yourself going through cycles of this and you may find that much like if you've ever read a software manual. I remember when I learned Microsoft Word to be begin with, for instance, I read the manual, wow, this is really cool. And I started to use the tool and didn't need the manual anymore. As a matter of fact, a good example of that right here, the manual for this camera that's taking this picture right now. Initially I read this, got it all set up. That's really cool. And that's really fine. And so pretty much everything was onto cruise control. I didn't need to go back to my library to make this really work. And then of course, as I started to get more sophisticated in terms of the stuff I wanted to do, got more inspired about some things I saw other people are doing. I go, how do I do that? Went back to the manual. I went, oh God, I didn't realize I could do that. I didn't realize I could do that. And I remember at least two or three iterations of going back to Microsoft Word back in the. In the days when there actually was a manual for that as opposed to just all online and realizing, oh my God, I didn't realize that, oh, I could do that now, I could do that now. And I think that's what you might find with code connect to is that it's a gold mine of stuff. Well, many people have read getting things done more than three or four times, and every time they read it, they get something new out of it. So I think you may find connect the same way and probably even easier because hey, doesn't take much to just click on, surf around, see what might be new or what might be of interest to you and pay attention. There's more than meets the eye in there.