Viral Article Book Club: Friendship Betrayal, Ozempic, and Summer House Drama (with Caitie Rosen)

Summary

Glamorous Trash: A Celebrity Memoir Podcast

Episode: Viral Article Book Club: Friendship Betrayal, Ozempic, and Summer House Drama
Host: Chelsea Devantez
Guest: Katie Rosen
Date: May 12, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode of Glamorous Trash dives deeply into why betrayals in female friendships feel so devastating—sometimes more so than romantic breakups. Host Chelsea Devantez is joined by friend and reality TV superfan Caitie Rosen to discuss two viral articles from The Cut:

1. “Why Friendship Betrayal Feels Impossible to Get Over: Blame the Science and Sexism” by Kate Heaney
2. “Losing My Friend Over Wegovy” by Sophia Ortega

The episode unpacks the science, social expectations, and emotional dynamics unique to female friendship breakups. Chelsea and Caitie also use two pop culture case studies—the Summer House drama (Amanda, West, Sierra) and the Wegovy friendship story—to ground these explorations. Expect thoughtful, emotional, and laugh-out-loud moments as they peel back the layers of female friendship and pop culture’s influence on our understanding of it.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Why Female Friendship Betrayal Hurts So Much

(03:10–10:44)

• Cheryl & Paula Story (from the article):

  • Cheryl, an interior designer, is used by wealthy friend Paula for free design help and her discount code. When Cheryl finds out Paula used her code in secret, she ends the friendship.
  • Chelsea: “Cheryl writes her a letter and is like, friendship over. ...And Paula sends a postcard back saying, ‘sounds good, playa. Sorry, I don’t see it that way.’ That is such a dagger. ‘I don’t see it that way.’” (04:20)
  • Caitie: The friendship didn’t hinge on one betrayal, but a “death by a thousand cuts”—many small offenses culminating in a final straw. “The thing that ends it is this tiny little paper cut. But it’s enough. Either when the mountain is big enough, or it’s just the final straw.” (06:22)

• Science & Sexism:

  • Women place higher expectations on friends, particularly around emotional support, so betrayals are more painful.
  • Chelsea: “There’s not stories and movies and books and songs about women using your discount code at Restoration Hardware. ...So you don’t see it coming.” (08:05)
  • Friendships are perceived as “the most egalitarian relationship that you’re in by choice.” Betrayals thus feel shocking and uniquely painful.

• Ambiguous Loss:

  • Female friendship breakups often lack closure (no “dividing assets,” no cultural script), leading to ambiguous loss: the friend is absent, but “still around kind of... in your thoughts and perhaps on Instagram.” (10:03)
  • Caitie shares personal experience: “There are books on my shelf that I borrowed from this friend... I decided to take a break from putting in all the effort, and what happened is all of a sudden, she didn’t wish me happy birthday anymore.” (11:19)

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Case Study 1: Summer House Drama - Amanda, Sierra & West

(15:23–23:56)

• Background for Non-Viewers:

  • The drama is likened to “if J. Lo and Ben broke up and a month later he was dating Leah Remini.” (16:00)
  • The issue’s core: Amanda hooks up with West, for whom Sierra still had feelings. Amanda and Sierra had built their identities in contrast and support of each other, making the betrayal doubly devastating.

• Publicness & Identity:

  • Chelsea: “Within a friendship between two women, there’s often a lot of identity-making within the comparison. ...All these ways identity is made in another woman’s shadow.” (17:15)
  • Chelsea calls out racial dynamics: “Amanda, in my opinion, is a very average white lady. And Ciara is an absolutely stunning, just gorgeous Black woman—and also a nurse. ...And yet this dog bag man... chose Amanda. And what goes into that?” (18:25)
  • Caitie clarifies that West was not exclusively choosing Amanda, but the public Instagram confirmation stung.

• Handling Betrayal Publicly:

  • Chelsea references Amanda’s social media attempts to balance branding obligations with public grief. “I don’t think it works. ...I think it comes across callous at best.” (20:46)
  • Caitie (and her therapist): Amanda may have constructed an internal world where “she has done nothing wrong... because if she exists in reality, the weight of the shame will be too much for her.” (21:16)

• The Missed Apology:

  • Chelsea: “Bringing it back to that Paula and Cheryl story—had Paula just apologized... that friendship could have mended. ...So many friendship betrayals don’t mend because there’s no apology.” (22:16)

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Case Study 2: Wegovy (Ozempic) and The End of Friendship

(23:56–30:47)

• Article Overview:

  • Sophia loses a best friend after discovering she’s secretly taking Wegovy (a weight-loss drug), something Sophia, as someone with a history of disordered eating, finds deeply hurtful and antithetical to her values.
  • The friend kept it secret, worried about Sophia’s reaction. When Sophia found out, the friendship ended.

• Who’s In The Wrong?

  • Chelsea notes that while headlines make Sophia seem unreasonable, if you map it onto a moral or political issue, it makes more sense: “If someone I loved was partaking in this thing I think is detrimental, how painful would that be?... that’s enough to end a friendship.” (27:09)
  • Caitie initially compares it to sobriety but concedes that the friend’s choice is less passive—a more active value statement.

• The Power of Secrets:

  • Chelsea: “When something is a secret and hid from you... it makes the betrayal so much harder, because it’s so clear how deliberate your choice was. Like, ‘I knew it would hurt you, so I’ve hidden it from you.’” (29:57)
  • Caitie: “And that’s the same as the Sierra-Amanda thing... I was lying to you because I knew how much it would hurt you.” (30:05)

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Wrap-Up: The Power of Language and Reality TV

(31:13–32:26)

• Both agree Kate Heaney’s article gives sorely needed language for a topic often ignored in pop culture.
  • Caitie: “It just gave me extra language that I didn’t have before... I love that.” (31:45)
  • Chelsea: “In a world where we get, like, barely any movies and TV and things talking about this, just having an article articulate what I’ve always known in my bones... is so powerful and helpful.” (32:02)
• Reality TV, despite its detractors, is essential for seeing women’s relationships, because scripted cultural representations lag behind.
  • “This is where we are getting our stories. And in our stories is how we discuss and form who we want to be and think and all of that.” (33:40)

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Notable Quotes

“Friendship betrayals like this one are difficult, if not impossible, to get over. It’s devastating when a once trusted companion breaks that trust.”

• Chelsea Devantez, reading from the article (04:33)

“Friendships are where we become who we are.”

• Article highlighted by both Chelsea & Caitie (05:17)

“I always thought... women don’t have to fuck you over. There’s no shared kids. There’s no shared sexual attraction. ...And I think that’s what also makes the betrayal hurt more.”

• Chelsea Devantez (08:09)

“The thing that ends it is this tiny little paper cut—but it’s enough.”

• Chelsea Devantez (06:22)

“I think every step of the way, Amanda has handled this... not conducive to that friendship continuing.”

• Caitie Rosen (22:59)

“When something is a secret and hid from you... it makes the betrayal so much harder.”

• Chelsea Devantez (29:57)

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Recommended Timestamps for Listeners

• Main thesis on friendship betrayals: 03:10–10:44
• Summer House drama explained & explored: 15:23–23:56
• Wegovy friendship breakup discussion: 23:56–30:47
• Key takeaways on friendship, language, and pop culture: 31:13–33:40

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Tone & Style Highlights

• Conversational, vulnerable, witty and sharply insightful.
• Both hosts are honest about their lived experiences and their own friendships.
• The tone is supportive but never saccharine, balancing humor with thoughtful critique.
• They acknowledge pop culture's power and flaws, championing “trashy” reality TV as a vital space for real women's stories.

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Final Thoughts

Whether you’re enthralled by Summer House or simply grappling with a friendship that soured, this episode provides essential language, cultural references, and a compassionate lens for understanding why some wounds linger. The hosts celebrate the messy, meaningful world of female friendship—and the stories (trashy or not) that help us make sense of it.

Transcript

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[Chelsea Devontez]

This summer Serve up the Cookout Classics, Heinz Ketchup and Kraft Singles. Every good burger needs a layer of perfectly melty cheese and thick, rich ketchup. We all know it's not a cookout without Heinz and Kraft. Welcome to Glamorous Trash. This is a podcast that book clubs, viral articles, celebrity memoirs and trashy discourse to elevate your life. I'm your host, Chelsea devontez. I'm a TV writer, comedian, filmmaker, author and sometimes I'm in step two and today is a viral article episode where we recap, recap and discuss viral articles as it is part of the Glamorous Trash literary world. Now this week we are going to reference two articles. The first one from the Cut, yes, sorry, my still my favorite publication and everyone on the Patreon's favorite publication. And the first article is why Friendship Betrayal Feels Impossible to Get Over Blame the Science and Sexism by Kate Heaney. And then we're going to go into two case studies of friendship betrayal. One, one of them is from the article Losing My Friend Over Wegovy by Sophia Ortega and the other, of course, is the West Sierra Amanda Summer House model, which we're really gonna use as a way to discuss all the themes from this article. So here is your trigger warning for discussions on diet, culture and disordered eating. Now let's dive in. My guest today is Katie Rosen. Katie is a cookie, a reality TV super fan. She covered Parvati Shallow's memoir with us and so others. She also recently started her own Patreon called Voice Notes from the Group Chat, which I think I have a small hand in starting because I would always Ask you for voice notes.

[Katie Rosen]

The biggest tangent stuff.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Okay, good. Am I the hand of God in your.

[Katie Rosen]

Yes. Yeah. My original bully.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Ah, I'm thrilled to have that. And really I would go to Katie and I'd be like, hey, what is this really niche Internet thing that I know you know all about? And she would send me like a three or four minute voice note. And so now that is your podcast where you can get niche Internet how to voice notes from Katie.

[Katie Rosen]

Under 20 minutes.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Under 20 short.

[Katie Rosen]

In and out. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Get in, get out. You are the perfect guest for this article for so many reasons. But let's just dive right into it and they will come forth. Okay. So the first article is why it's impossible to get over friendship betrayal. And it's like, look at science and sexism. And this article starts with talking about a friendship breakup story from a friend of the family. And it's about Cheryl and Paula. And basically Cheryl doesn't have money but is an interior designer. And Paula gets really wealthy and keeps using Cheryl for free advice when she interior designs her mini mansions and never pays her friend Cheryl. And Cheryl's always doing it for free because she loves her friends. But then one day finds out that Paula has been taking her advice and then using her designer code to get couches from. What is it?

[Katie Rosen]

It's a restoration hardware.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Restoration hardware. Which is. I mean, those couches are like $20,000. They're so expensive. Anyways, she was using her friend's discount code without telling her. And that does it. And Cheryl writes her a letter and is like, friendship over. I don't appreciate your behavior. Goodbye. And Paula sends a postcard back saying, sounds good, playa. Sorry, I don't see it that way. Oh, I. That is such a dagger. I don't see it that way. But like, best of luck.

[Katie Rosen]

I mean, it's so tough.

[Chelsea Devontez]

It's so tough. And so I loved this thesis. I'm going to read it from the article. Friendship betrayals like this one are difficult, if not impossible to get over. It's devastating when a once trusted companion breaks that trust. Even thinking about it is enough to get most of us riled up. Just see the public's fervent reaction to what's unfolding on Summer House. The Amanda West Sierra drama isn't shocking because some guy was a dirtbag. It's shocking because Amanda and Sierra were supposed to be friends. But why does the latter hurt so badly? And what makes it so hard to get over? And later she writes this sentence about friendship where she says friendships are where we become who we are.

[Katie Rosen]

Oh, I highlighted that one. It gave me goosebumps.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Right. And not only does that feel true, but then when you have a friendship betrayal, it's not only the friendship, but it's who you are. The existence you forged within that friendship is then called into question. Okay, so first off, Katie.

[Katie Rosen]

Yeah.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Cheryl and Paula, where do you stand?

[Katie Rosen]

Well, I'm firmly on Cheryl's side, obviously. I feel like one of my biggest friendship breakups was a friend who sort of our whole friendship would tell me sort of over and over again why she would never prioritize me and blah, blah, blah. She would always explain her bad behavior and I'd be like, well, she knows and she's telling me. And so that's. Yeah, that's fine. And then the one time I found out, she lied to me and I was like, oh, well, okay, that's it. I'm done.

[Chelsea Devontez]

So you were like, as long as she's aware, I'm okay. But if she's not being up front,

[Katie Rosen]

if we're being honest with each other, then, like, we have all the information and I can make that choice about, like, how I feel about this. But, like, once it's that, that, like, secret, that lie, like, oh, you're keeping this thing from me.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Yeah.

[Katie Rosen]

Then I'm like, okay, well, I can't trust you then.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Yes. What I love about this story you just shared and the Cheryl and Paula story is that it is death by a thousand cuts, which I think female friendship specifically tends to go through, where the Cheryl and Paula story, there was so much behavior to end that friendship ongoing. And same with the story you just told. But then the thing that ends it is like this tiny little paper cut. But it's enough. It's like either when the mountain is big enough or it's just like the final straw and then that ends it. But really, it sounds like it was a bad friendship overall.

[Katie Rosen]

Oh, yeah, absolutely.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Katie Rosen]

But I also feel like, you know when it's like, is it a crab or a frog or whatever? You put it into boiling water and it, like, tries to get out. But if you slowly turn the, like, temperature of the water up, you just stay in the water.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Yeah.

[Katie Rosen]

So it's like the temperature's been, like, slowly rising. Slowly rising. And then they just stab you.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Yeah.

[Katie Rosen]

And then that. Then you're like, oh, I gotta get outta here.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Yeah, absolutely. I think that is a reason why these friendship breakups are so hard. That it happens, like, sometimes slowly over time, a Thousand small cuts. Also in the article she writes, and this is the sort of social science behind it, women tend to place higher expectations on their friends for behavior and the complexity of emotional support that's expected. So when things don't go well in a friendship, if there's conflict or betrayal, women tend to report that it's much more upsetting than when it happens from men. And, like, I relate to this so much. I feel like my entire life from just having eyes and looking around. But also, like, movies, tv, books, we are taught and we know that, like, romantic relationships go awry and break your heart, and there's breakups and there's divorce. And then on top of that, if you're a straight woman, it's like, we know men gonna do you wrong.

[Katie Rosen]

You're gonna trust a man?

[Chelsea Devontez]

Yeah.

[Katie Rosen]

No, come on.

[Chelsea Devontez]

You know, a man is gonna fuck some shit up at least once in your life, if not hundreds. But that's built in. And yet I'll choose this relationship or I'll try this. Like, you're aw. I know for me especially, I always thought because of, like, the women who raised me who also had their own problems, but with my childhood brain, I just thought, but, like, women don't have to fuck you over. There's no shared kids. There's no shared sexual attraction. It's just, like, the most egalitarian relationship that you're in by choice. And I think also culturally, there's not stories and movies and books and songs about, you know, women using your discount code at the Restoration Hardware. And so you don't see it coming. And I know I definitely had my guard down and still constantly have my guard down around women the way I have a much bigger guard up and wall up around men. And I think that's what also makes it. The betrayal hurt more. What did you think of that section?

[Katie Rosen]

It really does make so much sense that, like, of course our expectations for men are lower. And of course the, like, people you choose to be your friends are the people you're like, oh, I want to spend all my time with this person. But, like, platonically, I'm not looking to, like, get some societal marker out of this relationship. You know, I'm not trying to check some box of, oh, I have to get married or I have to. You know, you're just like, oh, this is just bringing me joy.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Yes.

[Katie Rosen]

I just, like, want to be around you platonically. Because your spirit speaks to my spirit.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Yes.

[Katie Rosen]

For that to go away is so devastating.

[Chelsea Devontez]

So devastating. And I think this is like the social science behind why these breakups hurt more than romantic breakups. One, you don't have expectations for it. Two, you don't have articulation for it in culture. And three, we expect more from women than we do of men. And so which is just. I mean, that could be a thesis in so many things.

[Katie Rosen]

Yeah.

[Chelsea Devontez]

In the article she writes, women also, sometimes, because female friendship breakups are so complex and so intense that they can sometimes not always have that closure that you get in society with a man or a romantic partner of any kind. I'm getting my box of stuff. We no longer kiss each other in the mouth. We divide our assets. Things like that change where, like, in a friendship, the way you're in each other's lives can be much more subtle. And so there's no actual closure to the friendship ending. And she said this could lead to something called ambiguous loss, where the person is physically absent, but often in your thoughts and perhaps on Instagram. Have you experienced this?

[Katie Rosen]

Yes, of course. I mean, like, with this one main friendship breakup especially. But, like, I've had especially, like, even when you just, like, have a friendship fizzle out just because you're like, someone moves and you were like an in person friendship, not like an in your phone friendship. And so you're not good at maintaining that relationship or, you know, whatever, just, like, having them kind of, like, fall away, but they're still around kind of is, like, so tough. But, like, yeah, in a friendship breakup, like, I still have two or three books on my bookshelf that I had borrowed from this friend. I decided I was gonna just take a break from putting in all of the effort that I was putting in and see if anything happened. And what happened was that all of a sudden, one year, she, like, didn't wish me happy birthday anymore. We, like, weren't seeing. You know, we just, like, weren't. And then a mutual friend told me that she asked, who knew how I felt, told me she asked her why we hadn't hung out recently. And she was like, oh, yeah, I don't know. I guess we're just. You're both busy, and it's devastating.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Devastating.

[Katie Rosen]

So I feel like that counts as ambiguous lives.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Oh, my gosh. Absolutely.

[Katie Rosen]

Yeah. And now that Cameron Diaz movie, the Sweetest Thing, just, like, makes me sad instead of happy.

[Chelsea Devontez]

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[Chelsea Devontez]

Okay, welcome back. Let's continue the conversation. Okay, so I want to take what's discussed in this article about why this betrayal can be impossible to get over more than a romantic relationship and look at two case studies. The first is Sierra and Amanda and west from Summer House, which has been all over the news. And I will explain to you, Katie, how I think about it. And Katie the expert will tell me if that's correct. So anyone who doesn't watch Summer House like me, someone explained it to me. It's as if J. Lo and Ben broke up and a month later he was dating Leah Remini.

[Katie Rosen]

I was just gonna say that's from the in the Hunter Harris Glamour article about Sierra.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Okay, so I had that. Whoever told me that must have copped it from Hunter Harris. Thank you, Hunter Harris. You are the best.

[Katie Rosen]

Or just there's just a hive mind.

[Chelsea Devontez]

There's just a hive mind. So I thought that explained it perfectly. Where? Where? Then you're like, yes, Ben, you suck. But also like Leah, how good you to JLo. Like, you saw her through so much and also you saw the way he treated her and you guided and nursed and nurtured her through it. How dare you. Is that your take on the Summer House breakup and why people are flipping so hard for this drama?

[Katie Rosen]

Okay, yes, that's one part of it. This is the thing is like Amanda was there for Ciara during the up and down rollercoaster of Ciara and West's relationship. And also Amanda's marriage has been slowly falling apart over the last three years and Ciara has been constantly there for her and defending her to her husband and like being a good friend to both of them. And this is the thing is like, Amanda has been there for Sierra, but Sierra has really also been there for Amanda.

[Chelsea Devontez]

She's been the better friend.

[Katie Rosen]

Yeah, they were just like really there for each other in such a specific way and such a public way. And I do feel like the publicness of the betrayal just like really amplifies it.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Okay, this is what I've just sort of, like, picked up from all my meme reading. But I think within a friendship between two women, there's often a lot of identity making within the comparison. And I've done this to a detriment where, like, I have become who I am. I've defined myself against this other woman I ride or die through life with. And so when I was younger, in high school, college, I had this best friend and she was the writer and I was the silly actress. And it's so interesting now it's so many years later and we had a friendship breakup. But, like, I am a writer, but I was never going to realize that's actually most of who I am within that comparison to her. Like, she's the pretty one. I'm the crazy clown. Like, all these ways identity is made in another woman's shadow. And I feel like with Sierra and Amanda, there's also a lens we can look at it with that looks at racial politics and beauty and superficiality that way. Because Amanda, in my opinion, is a very average white lady. And Ciara is a absolutely stunning, just gorgeous black woman.

[Katie Rosen]

And also a nurse.

[Chelsea Devontez]

And also a nurse. And yet this dog bag man. Dog bag man. We know what it's in a dog bag. Poop. Chose Amanda and what goes into that and that type of comparison, especially in our culture.

[Katie Rosen]

Yeah. Okay. I do think just a small point of clarification is that he was choosing a lot of people, including still Ciara a little bit, and several other women, but he chose.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Chose Amanda. Like, they put out the Instagram post. Well, they got caught, but then they doubled down and were like, yes, together versus, like, no. That was just a fuckaroo.

[Katie Rosen]

Yeah. I think if they hadn't gotten caught, I don't think this would have necessarily been like. And now we're together.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Really.

[Katie Rosen]

I don't think that's. I don't think that's what he wanted. I mean, maybe it's what Amanda wanted. She was like, yeah, he was sleeping with a bunch of other people. Like, they got caught and they had to be like, so it makes means something.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Well, because they were both making a huge choice to not care about Sierra by even fucking around.

[Katie Rosen]

Yes. This is just, to me why it feels like even more or just even more of a betrayal. He was hooking up with a bunch of people. It wasn't like, oh, he was drawn to Amanda. Like, it was this, like, cosmic thing. And they're like, we're such good friends. And it really like, Built out of all of this. It's like. I mean, I guess, but, like, you were just fucking around and you got caught.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Oh, so that's the betrayal where it's like, amanda, why would you sacrifice this for literally nothing? Which makes her the worst friend for,

[Katie Rosen]

like, some of this guy's time, when you knew that he was also still, like, talking to Sierra and, like, talking to a bunch of other people.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Now he has to be with Amanda

[Katie Rosen]

because kind of all the other girls dumped him.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Here's the other piece I want to pull into this. I saw a post Amanda made. Again, I want to remind everyone I've never watched Summer House. I am only in the cultural discourse to study the friendship breakup. But she made a post where she was like, hey, I'm really hurting. I'm really thinking. I'm really sorry. And if you see me posting about, like, shopping and parties and brand collabs, just know that's my way of moving on. But, like, I am thinking about this behind the scenes. I've seen some other influencers post something similar. Like, hey, I am going through a tragedy. So when you see me post, like, my outfit of the day, like, just know, like, I'm still sad inside. And I gotta tell you, I don't think it works. I don't think you can do it.

[Katie Rosen]

No, I think it comes across callous at best.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Yeah, I mean, I think what they're trying to say is, hey, I already took my $20,000 to post Dunkin Donuts next month, so I'm still gonna be doing that. And all my clicks and my views lead to so much money and impressions and fame and clout. So, like, I will post my skirt of the day, but I am genuinely still depressed. And to that I say, sorry, you gotta lose the money. You gotta say bye bye to the money for just a little bit and, like, be an authentic human, which is what we ask of you online. Which is ridiculous because it's not an authentic place, but that's what's being asked of them.

[Katie Rosen]

Okay, so obviously I have talked about this in therapy. And look, my therapist loves Bravo. And sometimes this is how we just find our way into things. What we decided, my therapist and I, is that Amanda has created this schema for herself. This, like, internal reality for herself where she has done nothing wrong. Because west and Sierra were not officially together. She's allowed to just hook up with this single person. She's single, he's single. She hasn't done anything wrong because she's been showing basically no remorse. And so I think either she really feels no remorse, there's no guilt, no shame. She doesn't feel like she has any reason to be sorry, or she's had to create this whole internal world for herself where she did nothing wrong. Because if she exists in reality, the weight of the, like, shame, of this betrayal that she has caused, that she has done, her bad choices will, like, be too much for her.

[Chelsea Devontez]

And you know what? I've witnessed both of those and different people at different times. It's like a route people take. It's a fork in the road. Which shame spiral are you gonna go on? And what unhealthy way will you deal with it? Bringing it back to that Paula and Cheryl story at the beginning, had Paula just apologized, which is referenced in the article, I've been like, I'm really sorry. Whatever she needed to say, I think it would have made a difference whether Cheryl still needed time or not. That friendship could have mended. Same thing with Amanda and Ciara. Like, if you were to fall on your sword and really apologize, you probably still have a ways to go, but at least there's a chance at coming back. And there's so many friendship betrayals don't mend because there's no apology.

[Katie Rosen]

Yeah. And I think that every single step of the way, Amanda has handled this in the way that is, like, not conducive to that friendship continuing. Like, okay, the first reports, she could have been like, yeah, I'm so sorry this happened, whatever. But, like, obviously she didn't want to stop doing it, so she was like, let me try to keep hiding this for now. Even though, like, Ciara, like, you know, a month before the statement, the joint statement, Sierra was like, hey, were you at West's apartment last night? Because they have each other's locations. And then Commando was like, no, of course not. What are you talking about? Or like, oh, I was there doing this, like, innocuous reason, like, whatever, blah, blah. And they kept lying about it and kept lying about it. And then 24 hours before the statement came out is when she told Sierra, like, hey, actually we're gonna release this joint statement that ChatGPT wrote.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Disgusting. And also having each other's location, there's a friendship marker for you, so.

[Katie Rosen]

Well, yeah, it feels like she said, like, oh, I did this thing, so my friendship's over, so I'm just not even gonna. I'm just abandoning it over here, which

[Chelsea Devontez]

is like, that's truly detestable. And I've seen many a person in a friendship make that choice. Okay. Let's go to our second friendship scenario. This is from an article that had, like, 800 comments on it. People lost it. It was written by Sofia Ortega, and she was basically like, I lost my best friend because she took Wegovy behind my back. So basically, my friend took Ozempic. Now our friendship is over. To summarize the story a little more, which there's not that much more to it, is that the person writing this article had a history of dealing with diet, culture and eating disorders and had a real problem with these drugs. And just all of that, like, was a big trigger point for her because her friend knew that about her. When her friend decided to go on WeGovy, she didn't tell the person who wrote this article, but she had it in her fridge because it's her fridge, her house. And one day she had the person who wrote this article, Sophia, over to watch her dog. And being as close as they are, she opens her fridge to get a drink and sees the Wegovy and is like, how dare you? And they haven't spoken since. And basically the friend is like, I was hiding it from you because I thought that was the kinder thing to do because I knew you would spiral out if you knew, and so I was hiding it from you so that you wouldn't have to go through a body spiral. But Sophia is like, how dare you? And, like, your value system and that you hid it from me and that you would do this at all is enough to end our friendship. I think most people are on wegovy lady's side where they're like, this is for her. It had nothing to do with Sophia, and she was just trying to protect you because she knew how you'd feel. What is your take on this?

[Katie Rosen]

Okay. I actually see it a little bit differently.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Good. Me too.

[Katie Rosen]

Oh, okay, great. Because I understand why the author was like, I actually can't be friends with you anymore. But not. I didn't feel that it was like, oh, you, like, lied to me. You hid this from me? And, like, that's why we can't be friends. I think she was just like, oh, I just genuinely can't be around someone I know is taking a weight loss drug because it will cause a resurgence of my eating disorder. And, like, that's just like a. She's like, I just need to protect myself. And the friend was like, I get it. I understand that that is the case. Technically, I guess the friend chose the Wegovy over her. Sort of. There wasn't, like, space to have that Conversation. It was just like, oh, I actually need to not have you in my life because now I know this thing about you. Like, she was gonna go over for book club, like, a month after she, like, saw it or whatever. It was like, I actually can't come to your house. I might tell everybody at book club that you're on wegoffi, because that's all I can think about.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Because it is a huge trigger for her body issues. Yeah, I felt like it, the way it was written. And obviously the headlines are never written by the writers. They're written by other people who work at the magazine to pull in clicks and clickbait. So the headline doesn't help. But I don't think the writing helps either. And that it really is positioned of, like, my friend wanted to take Wegovy. And like, that can rot. In which case you're like, okay, we're not on your side. But I do think if you really sit with it and you can map it over something that that would cause deep harm to a moral or value or something that you hold really dear, that you wouldn't want someone who is directly opposed to that, who believes the opposite, to be in your life every day. And if you think of it like how someone voted, then I can start to open myself up to how she felt about this, where she's like, listen, I'm voting for fill in the blank of candidate we're all thinking of but has nothing to do with you. And she's like, oh, I actually don't care. I can't even be around someone who does that. What do you think?

[Katie Rosen]

Okay, I felt it was more like someone who is, like, sober and just like. Like, there are people who are sober who can be around other people drinking, and they have their tools and they can get through it and it's fine. And there. I feel like there are some people who are sober who are like, I actually can't be in an environment where there is alcohol because that will be too big of a problem for me and my sobriety. And, like, that's how I felt about this.

[Chelsea Devontez]

See, I don't. I don't think that is a correct mapping. Okay.

[Katie Rosen]

Because.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Please tell me why. Well, and debate me, because we don't know her friend's medical conditions, anything about her medical health. And so I can only assume that this is a Wegovy by choice. And I think I'm also projecting that because it made the author so mad versus someone who's like, really needs to take this medicine. I'm hoping she wouldn't have these feelings. But if this is a wegovy by choice, I just want to be thinner because that's what I want. It's a value system and a level of choice that I don't see. When we look at like a sobriety mapping, it feels optional for her friend. To her I feel like semi glutides. They're much more politicized and we don't know as much about them. They haven't been around as long. They're not available in every bar or and supermarket and restaurant.

[Katie Rosen]

And that is so true. You really, you do have to go out of your way to get them. Like pretty far out of your way.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Yeah. And so I think she sees her friend doing a much bigger portrayal betrayal than taking part of a culture she can't be a part of.

[Katie Rosen]

I guess that makes sense.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Drinking culture, I guess if that's a culture.

[Katie Rosen]

Well, and now I agree with you.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Ah, I won. Fantastic. No, but I think because I really thought about that article and I thought like, oh, this author's in the wrong. This is so silly. It doesn't affect you. And then I mapped it over something that would like really hurt me values wise if someone I loved was partaking in this thing that I think is like detrimental how painful it would be. And then on top of that, while it was maybe it wasn't the biggest deal for the author, I think it actually might have been because when something is a secret and hid from you, you either pull off that secret forever wegovy in a small fridge and a safe in your bathroom when your friend comes over or keeping it a secret at all makes the betrayal so much harder because it's so clear how deliberate your choice was. Like, I knew it would hurt you so badly. I've hidden it from you. I know what I'm doing.

[Katie Rosen]

And that's the same as the Sierra Amanda thing of like, I. I was lying to you when you asked me very direct questions because I knew how much it would hurt you.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Yeah, I mean it's hard too because is just the value system of choosing to use wegovy when you hold beliefs that like you shouldn't do that for whatever body reasons. Like, is that enough to. Is that enough to end a friendship over?

[Katie Rosen]

See, okay, I don't think that she was like. I think it's partially the choice of like, okay, yes, my friend is valuing thinness in this way that I don't agree with it. Like immediately triggered something that I think she was like, oh, no, I'm Concerned about my own literal.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Like, I don't have. I don't actually have control over.

[Katie Rosen]

Yeah. I don't have the coping skills to be able to, like, see WeGovy even just in person one time.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Tough, given how 2026 is rolling out.

[Katie Rosen]

Very tough. WeGovy sponsors the PWHL. Oh, God, it's Barbie and WeGovy on the boards. It's real bad.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Are you serious?

[Katie Rosen]

I am serious.

[Chelsea Devontez]

That is not. Those are not two sponsors you want together.

[Katie Rosen]

And then medical isotopes.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Oh, my goodness. Oh, my goodness. Okay, it is time to do our click lit quiz. Let's do it. For the first article about friendship betrayals. Was it well written?

[Katie Rosen]

I think yes. Also, I'm a big fan of Katie Heane of two of her memoirs. I love it.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Ooh. Yeah. I thought it was fantastic. Did it make you want to scream about it with someone only? No, because it's just something I've thought about quite a bit.

[Katie Rosen]

Yeah. I feel like more like just like that big sigh that we both just took right now. It made me want to just have a big sigh.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Yeah. Yeah. Now, final question. Did it deepen your thinking on the subject matter?

[Katie Rosen]

I think yes. And like, look, I have been thinking a lot about this.

[Chelsea Devontez]

So you talked about in therapy.

[Katie Rosen]

I talked about in therapy. I recorded a podcast episode about it. I've been thinking a lot about it and I do think it did. It just gave me, you know what? Cause it gave me extra language that I didn't have before, and I love that. Like, oh, just give me a few more extra scientific terms to talk about something. I really did like that a lot.

[Chelsea Devontez]

I absolutely agree with you. That's exactly what I was going to say. In a world where we get, like, barely any movies and TV and things talking about this, just having an article articulate what I've always known in my bones, which is friendship is where you define yourself, is just feels so powerful and helpful.

[Katie Rosen]

And that is why reality TV is so important, because that's where we get those stories.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Okay. And you know what? Can I just take a second to yell about a review we got? Because I know this isn't good form.

[Katie Rosen]

Please.

[Chelsea Devontez]

However. However, they were deeply, deeply, like four paragraphs of a review on Apple Podcasts. Mad at me for saying there was depth or something intellectual to be received from reality TV and other trashy parts of culture, which is what the theme of the podcast, besides women telling their own stories. That's the theme. And so they were like, yeah, the fact that there's so much Reality tv, like, I'm out of here. And. And to that I say, like, I absolutely understand that not being your form. Just the way that, like, horror movies aren't for some people, it's not your genre. However, until we have a culture that makes art about the stuff we are talking about, until we have a culture where I could name more than one female ensemble show that is fictional, when I could name 1200 that are on reality TV, like, until that evens out, this is where we are getting our stories. And in our stories is how we discuss and form who we want to be and think and all of that. And so I know that's what your point was, Katie, but I just yelled it back at you. Reviews, it can hurt because you can't write back to them.

[Katie Rosen]

Well, look, now I have a new enemy. Yeah, you know, I love a new enemy.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Thank you, Katie. New enemy. And yeah, go leave us a nice review. If you like the podcast, Katie, tell everyone where they can listen to your podcast and leave you a review about reality tv. Oh, my gosh.

[Katie Rosen]

Please don't leave me any reviews. My podcast is only on Patreon because I refuse to learn how to do anything else. If you just search voice notes from the group chat on Patreon, you will find me and there will be a link in the show notes.

[Chelsea Devontez]

Katie, thank you so much for coming on. Also, Katie did one of the best female friendship breakup episodes I think we've done where we covered Carolyn Calloway and Natalie Beach's memoirs on this podcast. And what I think we were too afraid to say at the time because we didn't want to hurt feelings, was that one book was written way better than the other. So if you're about to go listen to that episode, keep in mind that one of the books was really good and the other wasn't.

[Katie Rosen]

And it might not be what you think.

[Chelsea Devontez]

It's not what you think. Okay, bye. Bye. A big thank you to our senior managing producer, Christina Lopez, our executive producer, Jordan Moncada, our sound engineer, Marcus Hamm, and our amazing associate producer, Dominique Banas. I also want to give a huge thank you to our incredible partners over at Thrive Cosmetics and Quince. We will link those incredible brands in the show notes, so go check them out. Everything is always linked in the show notes on Apple. There's also transcripts, and if you ever have questions, go to the Patreon Chat lounge and I will see you there.

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