Iran says its peace terms - rejected by US - are 'generous'

Summary

Global News Podcast – May 11, 2026
Episode Theme: Iran’s Peace Terms, Hantavirus Cruise Outbreak, Political Upheaval in the UK and Thailand, and World Affairs
Host: Alex Ritson (BBC World Service)

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Episode Overview

This episode explores high-stakes diplomacy over Iran’s “generous” peace terms (rejected by the US), rising tensions and suffering inside Iran, global health concerns after a cruise ship hantavirus outbreak, UK Prime Minister Keir Starmer’s embattled leadership following election losses, the return of divisive Thai figure Thaksin Shinawatra, and other urgent world news. The podcast features on-the-ground reports and in-depth analysis from correspondents and experts.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Iran’s Peace Proposals, US Response, and Regional Impact

(00:38–05:09)

• Main theme: Ongoing war involving Iran and US-led coalition, focus on diplomatic efforts for a ceasefire and reopening the Strait of Hormuz.
• Diplomatic deadlock:
  • Tehran calls its latest counterproposals “responsible and generous,” but President Trump immediately labels them “totally unacceptable.”
  • Details of proposals remain undisclosed; talks are at an impasse, risking further escalation and impacting oil markets.
• Expert analysis:
  • James Gilmour, former US ambassador:
    • “The Iranians are behaving almost as though they're winners... and I think that they're not yet losers, frankly.” (02:19)
    • Predicts protracted negotiations, as neither side is incentivized to make immediate concessions.
• Correspondent insight:
  • Carrie Davies, Dubai:
    • Both sides are “pretty rigid in their positioning,” with public threats of escalation.
    • Mixed signals from the White House: threats of intensified bombing, but also talk of “openness to diplomacy.”

Notable Moments

• “Both need to appear that they are coming away with a win... The back and forth of negotiation seems to be going on behind the scenes.” – Carrie Davies (03:55)

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2. Inside Iran: Civilian Suffering and Repression

(05:09–08:47)

• Fergal Keane provides harrowing testimonials from Iranians impacted by war and repression.
• Civilians’ trauma:
  • Alireza (musician):
    • “If the situation continues like this for another six months, many might commit suicide because they can't endure it. Living in Iran is truly difficult.” (06:51)
  • Medical crisis:
    • “We have one psychologist who only comes one day a week for a population of 26,000 people... Hope will not come back.” (07:25)
  • Former political prisoner Shirin:
    • “Whenever I hear a disturbing sound, my body reacts involuntarily... I still have anxiety that the war might start again. And that is a terrifying thing.” (08:01)
  • Ongoing mass arrests and record executions are deepening public despair:
    • “We've now lost the streets.” – Shirin (08:27)

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3. Hantavirus Outbreak on Cruise Ship MV Hondius

(08:47–11:30)

• Repatriation efforts:
  • Outbreak site: Tenerife, Canary Islands. 146 on board; three dead; several more sick, including recent French and American cases.
  • Passengers are being flown home; US CDC is opting for clinical assessment over WHO-recommended 42-day quarantine, raising concerns.
• Risk management:
  • WHO chief present on site, questioning US response.
  • “The US certainly... don't seem to be imposing this 42 day quarantine... WHO has said that there may be risks associated with not following its guidelines.” – Guy Hetchko (10:46)

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4. UK Politics: Keir Starmer’s Crisis After Election Losses

(11:30–14:36)

• Political fallout:
  • Labour’s PM Keir Starmer faces intense pressure after “disastrous” local elections, with even Labour MPs calling for his resignation.
• Starmer’s stance:
  • “I know that people are frustrated by the state of Britain, frustrated by politics, and some people frustrated with me... I have my doubters, and I know I need to prove them wrong, and I will.” – Keir Starmer (11:50)
• Brexit position:
  • Starmer attacks Brexit, pledging to pursue a new deal with the EU.
  • Analyst Rob Watson: “I think reversing it [Brexit] might be going a bit too far… Britain is still broadly split along those lines.” (12:28)
• Starmer’s unpopularity:
  • “I was looking at the latest polling... he gets a net favorability rating of -48%. Only Liz Truss has been more unpopular.” – Rob Watson (13:48)
  • Prediction: Unlikely Starmer will lead Labour into the next election.

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5. Thailand: Controversial Former PM Thaksin Shinawatra Released

(14:36–17:56)

• Background:
  • Thaksin, sentenced for corruption, is released on parole; must wear an ankle monitor for four more months.
• Divisive legacy:
  • “He has, you know, people who dislike him as strongly as those who showed up to greet him... He's abrasive, autocratic in some ways, visionary in others.” – Jonathan Head (15:22)
• Political future:
  • Thaksin’s influence endures through funding/mentorship, but diminished party role.
  • “Impossible to imagine Thaksin playing the kind of decisive, often divisive role in Thai politics that he has in the past. But he'll be in the headlines for sure.” (17:50)

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6. Russia-Ukraine: Fragile Ceasefire and Peace Prospects

(19:58–22:45)

• Frontline status:
  • Three-day ceasefire for Victory Day largely fails; drone and artillery attacks persist.
  • “This is in name a ceasefire, but not in reality.” – Jonathan Beale (20:36)
• US mediation:
  • Ceasefire deal was US-brokered; discussions about prisoner swaps, but expectations for real peace are low.
  • Putin’s conciliatory statements seen as domestic messaging amidst continued fighting.

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7. China-US Relations: Advice for Middle Powers

(22:45–25:32)

• Upcoming Trump-Xi summit:
• Malcolm Turnbull’s counsel:
  • Warns smaller nations not to “suck up” to either China or Trump’s America.
  • “You win respect from strong men, from bullies... by standing your ground and being true to your own values.” – Malcolm Turnbull (23:30)
  • Recounts his own tough dealings with Trump:
    • “He started off saying no way. Ended up grudgingly and unhappily agreeing to stick with an agreement I'd done with his predecessor, but that won his respect.” (24:37)
  • Emphasizes protecting sovereignty and not yielding to pressure.

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8. Argentina: Economic Recovery Spurs Consumer Tourism in Chile

(25:32–29:24)

• Context: Post-crisis Argentina sees budget surplus and disinflation; yet, consumer goods remain expensive.
• Shopping exodus:
  • Argentines are crossing to Chile to buy cheaper goods amid favorable exchange rates.
  • “With the price difference, we can pay for our holiday in Chile and buy things that we need for our home.” – Ricardo, Argentine shopper (28:45)
• Historical perspective:
  • Decades of hyperinflation restricted consumer plans; reforms under President Milei brought stability and cross-border spending.

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9. Sun Lounger Disputes at Holiday Resorts

(29:24–32:08)

• Consumer rights:
  • German tourist wins $1,500 damages for being unable to access paid-for facilities due to “sunbed hogging.”
  • Some hotels introduce booking systems or clear spaces if left unattended, to ensure fair access.

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10. Miscellaneous Quotes and Segments

• On leaders and strongmen:
  • “All of the flattering and grovelling is a massive mistake, particularly with Trump.” – Malcolm Turnbull (24:18)
• Iranian despair:
  • “Whoever controls the streets controls the country. And for their enemies, they've made Iran into a claustrophobic hell.” – Fergal Keane (08:36)

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Notable Quotes With Timestamps

• James Gilmour (02:19): “The Iranians are behaving almost as though they're winners, and I think that they're not yet losers, frankly...”
• Carrie Davies (03:48): “It's very difficult to know how much of this is a negotiation tactic, how much of this is public posturing... both need to appear that they are coming away with a win...”
• Alireza, musician (06:51): “If the situation continues like this for another six months, many might commit suicide because they can't endure it. Living in Iran is truly difficult.”
• Shirin, former political prisoner (08:01): “Whenever I hear a disturbing sound, my body reacts involuntarily... I still have anxiety that the war might start again. And that is a terrifying thing.”
• Keir Starmer (11:50): “I know... some people [are] frustrated with me. I have my doubters, and I know I need to prove them wrong, and I will.”
• Rob Watson (13:48): “He gets a net favorability rating of -48%. Only Liz Truss has been more unpopular.”
• Malcolm Turnbull (23:30): “You win respect from strong men, from bullies... by standing your ground and being true to your own values.”

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Additional Segments and Flow

• The episode closes with reports on Russian/Ukraine events, practical advice for leaders dealing with US-China rivalry, South American economic migration, and consumer protection on holiday.
• Tone is urgent, analytical, and sometimes deeply personal—especially on civilian war suffering.
• World Service correspondents and expert guests sustain immediacy and depth throughout.

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For listeners: This episode delivers concise headlines with layered context, first-hand accounts, and expert analysis of Islamic world conflict, public health scares, political tumult, and society. It’s an essential listen for grasping today’s interconnected crises.

Transcript

[Malcolm Turnbull]

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the uk.

[Carter Sherman]

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[Alex Ritson]

This is the Global News podcast from the BBC World Service. I'm Alex Ritson and at 16 hours GMT on Monday the 11th of May, these are our main stories. Iran denies its counter proposals to U.S. peace plan are excessive. Uncertainty over the negotiations sends oil prices higher. A French passenger from the cruise ship MV Hondius tests positive for hantavirus and the British Prime Minister, Keir Starmer tries to shore up support after last week's dismal election results. Also in this podcast, A former prime minister of Thailand, Thaksin Shinawatra, is greeted by supporters on his release from jail. We start with the war in Iran and the diplomatic efforts to secure a lasting peace. Both sides seem to be talking, but there doesn't seem to be much agreement. Tehran says its latest proposals to end the conflict and reopen the Strait of Hormuz are responsible and generous, even though President Trump has already described them as totally unacceptable. All this could undermine the ceasefire. James Gilmour, a former U.S. ambassador to the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe, says he doesn't think there'll be a quick breakthrough.

[James Gilmour]

We're not yet getting anywhere. I think the United States got themselves into a war in which they're going to try to achieve an outcome through the use of force. And that force is either air bombing, air attacks, or and, or a blockade against their economics. And the question remains outstanding, is that going to be enough to bring bring Iran to the point where they're willing to concede some very important issues so far, not so far. The Iranians are behaving almost as though they're winners, and I think that they're not yet losers, frankly. And I think that this negotiation is going to go on for some time in my, in my view.

[Alex Ritson]

Our correspondent Carrie Davis in Dubai says neither side has publicly released details of what they want.

[Carrie Davies]

What was it exactly that the president thought was unacceptable? We don't have any further details on that. Well, it might be the case that in the coming days we hear more from the US Side about where they think Iran needs to change its stance. We may also get the simile from Iran, but both sides seem to be pretty rigid in their positioning at the moment. And also both have talked about further potential escalation. So before we had this response from Iran, the President had said that if Iran did not agree to a deep, that the US Would resume bombing and with greater intensity. At the same time. We've also heard from the White House, particularly in the course of the last week, talking about how President Trump is open to diplomacy. So what path will the President choose next? And what sort of further actions are we going to see from either side? That is what we're waiting for.

[Alex Ritson]

Do we think it's a real rejection or is it a negotiation tactic with all of this?

[Carrie Davies]

It's very difficult to know how much of this is a negotiation tactic, how much of this is public posturing, because both sides are trying to appeal to their own domestic audiences. Bear in mind both need to appear that they are coming away with a win, with a success for this. Both sides have been talking about the weakness of their opponent. And even though both sides have continually talked about their public positions, which seem miles apart, yet this back and forth of negotiation seems to be going on behind the scenes. So there must be something that they're finding that is appealing, there's something to further talk about, because otherwise you'd imagine this negotiation wouldn't be going on. But exactly what that middle ground is is very difficult to say. And how much of this is genuine rejection from the President, and how much of this is an indication of him trying to sort of play hardball, as it were, and trying to get more from the Iranian side, we don't know. I think the only way for us to be able to read that is what the President says and does next. Whether this starts to have more positive noises again from the US saying, oh, no, actually, we think that there is more that the Iran are already offering us, or if we start seeing further sort of escalatory tactics potentially in the Strait of Hormuz from either side, that will give us a bit more of an indication about whether or not this feels like a genuine dead end or it is just something that is being said publicly to try to alter that position behind the scenes.

[Alex Ritson]

Carrie Davies. As the conflict continues, people inside Iran continue to struggle despite some respite brought by the ceasefire. The BBC, using trusted sources, has been speaking to some of those affected. Our special correspondent, Fergal Keen has been hearing from those traumatized by conflict and government repression and a warning that some listeners may find the material in his report disturbing.

[Fergal Keane]

They own the streets today, the women of the Islamic revolution. But in a country where the men still make all the rules. This demonstration stage, managed by the regime to convince the world they're ready to fight, to tell their own people, don't even think about protesting. There's little chance of it. The population is wounded in spirit and mind. Huddled over a stove, musician Alireza cannot come to terms with the things he's seen in the last few months. Looters fighting next to the bodies of bomb victims. The situation was completely out of control. The police had come to take the bodies of those killed in the barracks to the hospital. But they couldn't control these looters. At the same time, I saw many corpses, some with the lower half of their bodies severed. People were collecting them in blankets to take them to the hospital. If the situation continues like this for another six months, many might commit suicide because they can't endure it. Living in Iran is truly difficult. Families of all political persuasions are mourning their dead and missing. Airstrikes have put added strain on the under resourced health system, unable to cope with the wave of trauma. As a medic explained, as soon as

[Carter Sherman]

you ask, how are you feeling? The patient starts crying. And we have one psychologist who only comes one day a week because they haven't signed a contract with him. Only one day a week for a population of 26,000 people. They say there will be an agreement, but it feels like the fire of war in this country never goes out. I am completely hopeless. Now I can say with certainty hope will not come back.

[Fergal Keane]

For former political prisoners like Shirin, these are days of relentless fear, war, the death of friends, the possibility of torture. When they've come for you once already, the fear never goes away.

[Shirin (former political prisoner)]

Whenever I hear a disturbing sound, my body reacts involuntarily. The psychological pressure that entered my mind has numbed part of my left hand. It doesn't work. I still have anxiety that the war might start again. And that is a terrifying thing.

[Fergal Keane]

More than 50,000 people have been arrested and last month saw a record number of executions for Shirin despair.

[Shirin (former political prisoner)]

Things have happened that we couldn't do anything about. The detainees were hanged. We've now lost the streets.

[Fergal Keane]

Whoever controls the streets controls the country. And for their enemies, they've made Iran into a claustrophobic hell.

[Alex Ritson]

Fergal Keene the last remaining passengers on board the MV Hondius, the cruise ship affected by an outbreak of the deadly hantavirus, are being repatriated from Tenerife in the Canary Islands. 146 people were on board. Three of them have died of the virus and several others have become ill, including most recently a French woman. The U.S. department of Health says one of the American passengers being flown home has also tested positive and another is showing symptoms. The head of the World Health Organization, Tedros Adhanom Capriasis, who's on the island, has questioned the American decision not to follow WHO guidance to isolate passengers for 42 days. I heard more from Guy Hetchko, who's in Tenerife.

[Guy Hetchko]

I'm at the port where the passengers are being brought to land and then put onto flights from here and then repatriated. Yesterday, just over 90 passengers from 19 different countries were brought in small boats from the cruise ship which is anchored just off the port here. And then they would move very quickly in a bus to a nearby airport and put onto their flights to go home. There are just 24 more people to go today. There will be a flight going to the Netherlands, taking them home to the Netherlands. And the final flight we're expecting will go to Australia. Some of the crew will remain on the boat and it will continue on to Rotterdam in the Netherlands.

[Alex Ritson]

Guy, tell us more about the WHO guidelines. Are people expected to isolate and what's happening in the U.S. well, yes, I

[Guy Hetchko]

mean, the WHO recommends 42 days quarantine because that is the period of incubation for the virus. And so it says that that is recommendable for anyone who's been in contact with someone who has tested positive for the virus. Now, the situation in the United States is the US Centers for Disease Control says it doesn't want to cause alarm and that this virus should not be treated like Covid. Now, on that point, the WHO and the US agree, they don't want to see comparisons or close comparisons with COVID because that might cause alarm. But the US certainly the health authorities there don't seem to be imposing this 42 day quarantine. The 17American citizens who were flown back home yesterday, for example, are undergoing clinical assessment in Nebraska. But it doesn't seem that they'll be undergoing that long quarantine. And the WHO has said that there may be risks associated with not following its guidelines.

[Alex Ritson]

Guy Hedgeko. Here in the uk, Prime Minister Keir Starmer is fighting for his job after disastrous local elections that were dominated by the populist right wing Reform Party. Calls are growing even from his own Labour Party MPs for him to resign. But speaking at a news conference, he said he was determined not to give up.

[Fergal Keane]

I know that people are frustrated by the state of Britain, frustrated by politics,

[Guy Hetchko]

and some people frustrated with me. I know I have My doubters, and I know I need to prove them wrong, and I will.

[Alex Ritson]

Mr. Starmer also launched a direct attack on Brexit, saying it's made people poorer. He said a new deal with the European Union was an immediate priority. So is this an attempt to reverse Britain's decision to leave the eu? UK political correspondent is Rob Watson.

[Rob Watson]

I think reversing it might be going a bit too far, Alex, But I think what Keir Starmer has decided is that if you look at Britain, I know it's 10 years on from the referendum, Alex, but essentially the country is still sort of broadly split along those lines of people who voted Remain and people who voted Leave. And I think the Prime Minister has decided that the Labour Party is really struggling to get any Leave voters to come back to support Labour and that therefore, the idea is you try to unite the progressive left, if you could put it that way, and that therefore, to come out and denounce Brexit, talk about the harm it's done and talk about closer relations with the European Union really, really makes a lot of sense.

[Alex Ritson]

But he's in trouble. Would that turn things around for him?

[Rob Watson]

Well, it would certainly help things, because the argument goes inside the senior ranks of the Labour Party that if it's true that the party is split still along Remain Leave lines, you might scoop up some of those people who used to support Labour, but who've gone off to parties like the Liberal Democrats and the Greens, who are very much more pro European. So that's the strategy. But of course, it has all sorts of other problems.

[Alex Ritson]

Yeah, as you say, I just give us a sense of how disillusioned British people really are with this Prime Minister.

[Rob Watson]

So he gets. I was looking at the latest polling from YouGov, one of the biggest polling companies in Britain, Alex, and he gets a net favorability rating of -48%. I mean, that is pretty dire. Only Liz Truss has been more unpopular. And that is why the view, I think, inside the governing Labour Party is that his position is unrecoverable, that he's just too unpopular in the country, too unpopular in the party to come back from this, and that he is therefore a Prime Minister living on borrowed time. The challenge to his leadership that might have happened today, I think, has perhaps dissipated, Alex, But I think there is a sense that it is borrowed time and that at some point in the medium to long term, he will be gone and he will not lead the party into the next election, despite his determination, Alex, to stay and fight.

[Alex Ritson]

Rob Watson to Thailand. Now Crowds filled the streets of Bangkok to catch a glimpse of Thaksin Shinawat being released from prison on parole. The former prime minister was originally sentenced to eight years for corruption and abuse of power in 2023. That was then shortened to a year. He initially served time in a prison hospital, but Thailand's Supreme Court decided he would have to go to an ordinary prison. Now, after serving eight months, he's out, but he'll still have to wear an electronic ankle monitor for the remaining four months. He says he feels relief, but is everyone in Thailand happy to see him released? Our Southeast Asia correspondent is Jonathan Head.

[Jonathan Head]

Taxon is a very controversial figure, very divisive. He has, you know, people who dislike him as strongly as those who showed up to greet him as he came out of prison. Love him and believe in him. That's the way he's been. He's abrasive, you know, autocratic in some ways, visionary in others. He made a huge impact when he first came to power 25 years ago, the first party that really had a kind of modern platform. And a lot of his policies genuinely improved the situation, particularly of lower income people. And they still thank him for that and still believe in him. But there were lots of problems with the way he governed as well. And Thailand has an extremely well entrenched and powerful conservative establishment built around the monarchy and with the backing of the army, which is very skeptical of any elected politician who has ambitions to transform the country. And Taxin was not a diplomatic man and he fell out with them, ended up being ousted by a coup governments led by his parties. His parties kept on winning elections even when he was in exile. Those governments also found themselves either being dissolved by the courts or there was another coup in 2014. There has been this persistent opposition to him. And in many ways, he would argue the time he spent in jail the last eight months is part of that political process. His critics would say, well, he was convicted of three counts of corruption and abuses of power, that these things did go on when he was in government and he's lucky to have spent so little time in jail. The big question really now is, you know, he's always sought the limelight. He's never shrunk into the background. But he's 76 years old now. His party is no longer the election winner it once was. It was pushed into third place in the most recent election three months ago. Will he still attempt to be a decisive player or will he finally do what he said many times and spend more time at home to be with his grandchildren.

[Alex Ritson]

And that is the question, isn't it? Will he have his eyes on a return to politics?

[Jonathan Head]

I think he will stay very involved in his party. You know, there's no question he's still the main funder. He's a very wealthy man. His family are very influential in the party as well. They all play a role. There's no question that as an elder statesman, they will go to him for guidance. But I don't think he will have the profile that he had in the party. There will be some saying, look, we need to let younger people come forward, we need new leaders. And the party itself, which is now only a junior partner in the current Conservative government, just won't have the clout it had. And for all those reasons, it's impossible to imagine Thaksin Shinawatra playing the kind of decisive, often divisive role in Thai politics that he has in the past. But he'll be in the headlines for sure. You just know he's not going to stay quiet.

[Alex Ritson]

Jonathan Head still to come in this

[Malcolm Turnbull]

podcast, people who go to Washington and suck up to Donald Trump, or frankly do the same in Beijing, are making a massive mistake.

[Alex Ritson]

Some blunt advice from Australia's former Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull ahead of Donald Trump's visit to China.

[Jonathan Head]

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[Alex Ritson]

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[Fergal Keane]

Grab the recipes on TikTok and start cooking.

[Alex Ritson]

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[Carter Sherman]

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[Shirin (former political prisoner)]

I drive my bus in a busy city. That's why road safety is so important to me. I know that I must slow down and be extra careful when I make a wide turn. Buses need more room than cars. Everyone can help keep our road safe.

[Jonathan Beale]

Safe.

[Shirin (former political prisoner)]

Next time you're driving, remember to give buses plenty of time and space to finish turning before driving ahead. Let's all plan to share the road safely. Learn how at www.sharetheroadsafely.gov.

[Alex Ritson]

This is the global news podcast. It's the end of a three day ceasefire between Russia and Ukraine that was agreed to cover the celebrations of the Soviet Union's victory over Nazi Germany. Speaking at the victory day parade in Moscow, Russian President Vladimir Putin said the conflict could be coming to an end. But both sides have accused each other of continuing attacks through the truce. Ukraine's President Volodymyr Zelenskyy said there were more than 850 drone strikes on Ukrainian positions in the first few hours of the agreement. I heard more from our defence correspondent in Kyiv, Jonathan Beale.

[Jonathan Beale]

It isn't a ceasefire on the front lines. What there has been is a limitation on long range strikes carried out by both sides. So there haven't been air raid warnings going on in Kyiv for the last few nights. That said, there have been a few drones, long range drones getting through, which have hit cities like Kharkiv, like Kherson, three civilians killed, more than a dozen injured. But as far as the front line is concerned, the fighting really hasn't let up. And for example, there were yesterday 104, 40 clashes on the front line, 5000 one way attack drones being used and 1500 artillery shells fired, according to Ukraine's general staff. So I think you get a sense that, you know, this is in name a ceasefire, but not in reality.

[Alex Ritson]

So effectively over what then? The prospect of longer term peace talks?

[Jonathan Beale]

Well, I mean, clearly there are discussions going on with the US at the moment. And remember it was the US that brokered this ceasefire. President Putin had tried to declare one unilaterally to coincide with the victory day parade in Red Square. And then President Zelensky suggested his own ceasefire and it was only reached an agreement because of the us and there's also the promise of prisoner swap of thousand prisoners, which hasn't happened yet between both countries. So we have seen evidence that the US is still engaged in so called peace talks. But we know that the US is more focused on the war in Iran at the moment. So there isn't any expectation that this war is going to come to an end soon. And the expectation is that on the front line, as we've seen with the evidence of the fighting, that the Russians will continue to push ahead. That said, they are making much slower progress than they have in previous years. You know, we've heard President Putin talk about the war may be coming to an end. I think that's for a domestic audience. You know, that's his own side who are clearly concerned some people in Russia about this war and the effects it's having on the economy. There is no indication, as I said earlier, that this war is coming to an end.

[Alex Ritson]

Jonathan Beale in Kyiv. All eyes will be on China later this week when the long awaited and delayed meeting between President Trump and the Chinese leader Xi Jinping will take place. Many will be watching for signs of how well they'll get on. But the relationship between the world's two most powerful men is also important for all the other smaller nations that have to keep on good terms with both Washington and Beijing. The former Australian Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull is one man who's had experience in the often tricky task of keeping both partners happy. He spoke to my colleague Anna Foster.

[Malcolm Turnbull]

This is a critically important thing, both with China and with Washington. In the imperial capital, they regard deference as their due. So people who go to Washington and suck up to Donald Trump, or frankly do the same in Beijing, are making a massive mistake. You win respect from strong men, from bullies, if you want to call them that, by standing your ground and being true to your own values. Recently, the focus has been on Donald Trump and you can see those leaders. I mean, look at the Europeans. Look at that unfortunate, awful incident last year when the Europeans rolled over to Donald Trump. What did they get in return for that? Tariffs and threats to invade Greenland. The bottom line is sovereignty matters and you have to stand up and defend your sovereignty. And all of the flattering and grovelling is a massive mistake, particularly with Trump,

[Carrie Davies]

when you have a personality who is

[Shirin (former political prisoner)]

making decisions on his own, big, far

[Carrie Davies]

reaching decisions, often depending on what kind

[Shirin (former political prisoner)]

of mood he's in that day. For those leaders to speak out, to

[Carrie Davies]

risk souring that relationship for a long time, it's a. It feels like the kind of dance

[Shirin (former political prisoner)]

that we've barely seen before.

[Malcolm Turnbull]

That's true. I mean, I was fortunate in my dealings with Trump in the first term because by force of circumstance, we had a very big row, really, that first encounter, and I stood my ground. He started off saying no way. Ended up grudgingly and unhappily agreeing to stick with an agreement I'd done with his predecessor, but that won his respect. There's no need to be rude or performative, but it's, you can be respectful, but nonetheless stand your ground. But you've got to be very careful with whether it is in the playground or in geopolitics. If you are dealing with strong men, bullies, you know, people who like to use force, power to get their own way, who bluntly say Might is right. If you're dealing with that. The only way to do that is with, obviously, respectfully and politely, but stand your ground.

[Alex Ritson]

Malcolm Turnbull speaking to Anna Foster. When Javier Milei became president of Argentina in 2023, he promised a radical shake up of an economy that was on the brink of collapse. Since then, Argentina's economic woes have eased, with the country reporting a budget surplus for the first time in 14 years thanks to significant cuts in government spending. Inflation has also been slashed. And although progress has slowed recently, some Argentines do have more money to spend. Many of them have been flocking to neighbouring Chile in search of goods that are much cheaper or not available back home. Jane Chambers has been to see if Chile is becoming Argentina's shopping centre.

[Jane Chambers]

Every year, hundreds of thousands of Argentinians head to neighbouring Chile's central coast. One of the reasons is because it's Argentina's closest, most accessible shopping zone. I'm here at Binha Outlet park, which has become a popular destination for Argentinian shoppers. In a large shoe shop. I talked to one of the sales reps.

[Guy Hetchko]

In the last two months, the majority of people in the shop have been from Argentina. I think it's because of the exchange rate, which at the moment is working in their favor. And it's holiday time now.

[Jane Chambers]

Eduardo spots an Argentinian customer, Dolores, who's visiting with her family.

[Carrie Davies]

I'm here to buy trainers and football boots for my children and things like school rucksacks and pencil cases for when they go back to school, as well as clothes.

[Jane Chambers]

The outlet park is currently running a marketing campaign called Tourista Feliz, which in English means happy tourist. I'm off to meet head of marketing Carolina Gormes to find out more.

[Shirin (former political prisoner)]

The Tourista Feliz campaign means that we give special benefits and discounts to tourists who visit us here.

[Jane Chambers]

Why are Argentines such an important market for you?

[Shirin (former political prisoner)]

Because we are an outlet. Our prices are already cheaper than other shops, but we also have brands that are more expensive for them back home or that they can't find in Argentina, like Adidas, Puma, Rosen, Cannon, Oakley, Levi's and many more. And that makes it attractive for them.

[Jane Chambers]

I've come to the leafy campus at the Universidad de Desarrollo in Chile's capital Santiago, to meet Chilean economist Klaus Schmidt Hebel, who teaches here and at the Catholic University.

[Alex Ritson]

For 80 years. On and off, Argentina has had very significant hyperinflation when inflation went up to 10,000% per year and then moderately high inflation of 30 or 50% during that

[Jane Chambers]

time, people in Argentina didn't know how much their daily goods, like bread and meat would cost. From one day to the next. Household budgets were squeezed, and for many of them, trips to Chile were out of the question. Then something changed.

[Rob Watson]

This happened until two years ago, when

[Alex Ritson]

Mr. Milei was elected president, and from then on he put into place a

[Rob Watson]

fiscal and monetary shock program.

[Jane Chambers]

Now, with a more predictable exchange rate, people can plan trips and spend with more confidence. Back at the shopping outlet in Vinha del Mar, I get chatting with some more Argentinians, Ricardo and his family.

[Alex Ritson]

Personally, I am a lot happier and if things continue like this, I think everything will stabilize in the future. Household goods are so much cheaper here than in Argentina. There can be a 30 or 50% difference in the price if we buy them here. With the price difference, we can pay for our holiday in Chile and buy things that we need for our home.

[Jane Chambers]

Chile's tourism authorities say around three to three and a half million Argentinians visited last year, and most didn't fly. Instead, they drove across the Andes, making sure they had more room to stock up on cheaper clothes, electronics and household goods.

[Alex Ritson]

Jane Chambers now have you ever stayed at a hotel on holiday and wanted to sit down on a sun lounger, possibly near the pool, but been unable to find a spot because they've all been taken, or have other people's belongings on them? It seems it's a growing issue, and one that some hotels say they're trying to do something about. It comes after a German tourist won a payout of more than $1,500 in damages because all the sun loungers at his holiday resort were taken, our reporter Pete Ross told me.

[Pete Ross]

More I think some listeners can relate to this idea of trying to find a sun lounger when you've spent hundreds or maybe thousands of pounds on a hotel and you want to use the facilities. It seems that kind of long gone are the days where you can kind of just mosey on down at any time and just take a nice spot or find a free sun lounger. In UK culture, nabbing one of these places where you can recline and then sort of dropping your towel and wandering off so no one else can use it for hours on end has been a bit of a joke for years, but it is a phenomenon in other countries too. And as you say, the issue does seem to be getting worse. TikTok and other social media platforms are full of videos of dozens, if not more holidaymakers behind closed doors, waiting for them to be unlocked and flung open at the Crack of dawn. So they can all sort of speed walk or sprint in some cases to some of these coveted spots. There is a serious consumer rights issue to this. I mean, you look at the case in Germany you mentioned there. Imagine again, as I've said, you've saved all year, possibly for the one holiday that you and your family can afford and then you cannot use the facilities that you've paid for. Then perhaps it is a serious case to answer. And certainly that man in Germany who won that $1,500 payout suggests that, yes, perhaps holidaymakers or hotels want to look at this issue a bit more seriously.

[James Gilmour]

Yeah.

[Alex Ritson]

What are the hotels doing?

[Pete Ross]

Yeah, well, it seems in the past they were a little bit reluctant to step in to resolve disputes. Arguments can often get quite heated. They can even sometimes get physical. And there have been accusations that hotels didn't take the issue as seriously as perhaps they might do. We've had holidaymakers contact the BBC telling us about a range of ways that hotels now seem to be tackling this issue. Essentially a booking system. You know, if you think about here in the uk, you have to walk into a cinema and just take any old seat. Now you have to book in advance. Same with trains, Same with many things. It seems it's happening with sun loungers now as well. And one hotel in France is struck on a very interesting idea. They set off a horn two times a day and if you're not in your seat, a bit like musical chairs, they'll come along, clean all your stuff off and it's free for someone else

[Alex Ritson]

to take in a few seconds. Some people do it just to be annoying.

[Pete Ross]

I think so.

[Alex Ritson]

I thought so. And that's all from us for now. If you want to get in touch, you can email us at globalpodcastbc. You can also find us on X at BBC World Service. Use the hashtag globalnewspod. And don't forget our sibling podcast, the Global Story, which goes in depth and beyond the headlines on one big story. This edition of the Global News Podcast was mixed by Holly Smith and the producer was Richard Hamilton. The editor is Karen Martin. I'm Alex Ritson. Until next time, Goodbye. I'm Kai Wright.

[Carter Sherman]

I'm Carter Sherman. Welcome to Stateside with Kai and Carter. We're a new show from the Guardian.

[Carrie Davies]

We're talking to big thinkers and the

[Alex Ritson]

best journalists just trying to understand the world through smart conversation and honest reporting.

[Carter Sherman]

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[Alex Ritson]

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[Jonathan Head]

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[Alex Ritson]

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[Carter Sherman]

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