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Global News Podcast
Israel and Iran continue strikes - extra edition
00:17:14
Israel launches new strikes in response to Iranian counterattacks
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- [00:00]
Bernard Etchio
This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK.
- [00:06]
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Jonathan Marcus
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- [01:08]
Sebastian Ussher
This is an extra edition of the Global News podcast on the continuing confrontation between Israel and Iran. From the BBC World Service, I'm Bernard Etchio and at 1130 GMT on Saturday 14 June, these are our main stories. The Israeli Air Force says it's continuing to attack targets inside Iran. It follows a wave of airstrikes by Tehran across Israel in response to the attacks on Friday targeting its nuclear program with explosions heard in Jerusalem and Tel Aviv. We'll speak to a defense expert on where the conflict might go next and we'll test the mood in Israel and Iran at this unprecedented moment. The sound of an Iranian ballistic missile striking the Israeli city of Tel Aviv as both nations continue to launch strikes on each other. Iranian missiles have hit targets across Israel as its supreme leader vows to inflict heavy blows. It's being reported at least three people in Israel have been killed. Iranian state media has reported. Two deputy commanders in the armed forces are the latest high ranking officials killed by Israeli strikes. Iran's representative to the UN has said 78 people were killed in Friday's Israeli strikes and at least 320injured. Iran's supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei has accused Israel of starting a war. Israel's UN envoy has called Israel's operation an act of national preservation. Overnight, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu addressed the people of Iran, appearing to urge them to overthrow the Islamic Republic's regime.
- [03:00]
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- [03:33]
Sebastian Ussher
Hear from both Iranian and Israeli perspectives as well as from the US on what role it is or is not expected to play in the coming days. But, but first let's go to our Middle east correspondent, Sebastian Ussher, who's in Jerusalem.
- [03:47]
Bernard Etchio
I mean, it was a night where Israel certainly continued very strong, fierce attacks on Iran, particularly aimed at its air defense system and its ability to fire missiles towards Israel. I mean, the air defense system I think, is an attempt to clear a path. This is what we've been hearing from the Israeli army to the Iranian capital to essentially make it so that the Israeli air force will be able to strike at will. We've also heard from the Iranians that two more senior commanders have been killed. The Israeli military has said now that they have assassinated nine senior Iranian nuclear scientists. That's three more than we were hearing about yesterday. They say they've attacked more than 150 targets in Iran since this campaign began. And we also know that three of the main nuclear facilities that Iran has in Esfahan, Natanz and Fordo have all been attacked. Israel saying that two of them, the one in Isfahan and Natanz, have been significantly damaged. Here in Israel, we had more salvos of missiles overnight. To our calculation, there have been six of these salvos since this all started early yesterday morning here in Jerusalem. I mean, we see the interceptions overhead, but there hasn't been really a sense of, of real danger here. I think of people have taken to their shelters, but that isn't the case in other parts of the country where we've begun to see some of the damage that's been inflicted. And as you said in your introduction there, three people have been killed and a number of people have been injured. I mean, I was just walking through the Old City in Jerusalem a few minutes ago and it's normally, as you can imagine, very much a bustling center where both Arab Muslims, Christians and Jewish people mix as they're heading towards the Al Aqsa Mosque or the Western Wall. The Al Aqsa Mosque is closed at the moment for security reasons. And there are barriers at the entrance of the gates into the Old City. Most of the shops are shut it up. So a sense that life is certainly not continuing as normal here. But I've just had a message from the app that tells people here whether they should be taking shelter or not, saying that at the moment we don't need to take shelter. So there's a slight lull as far as Israel and Jerusalem are concerned. The Iranian missiles.
- [06:15]
Sebastian Ussher
Well, Sebastian, what are we hearing from Tehran?
- [06:19]
Bernard Etchio
Well, I mean, from Iran. There has been, as you were saying, from its supreme leader, defiance, as you would expect. Also, there's been a warning from Iran, which I think is significant to the US, The UK And France, to say that their military base and ships will be targeted if they help Israel to defend itself against these volleys of missiles. Also, I think, interestingly, the sixth round of talks between the US And Iran that were due to take place on Sunday and that one would have imagined would have been essentially stopped in their tracks by what's happening. Though Iranian officials have described them as basically meaningless now, they haven't actually ruled out the possibility of them continuing. So, I mean, this is what President Trump has been saying, essentially that what Israel has done should be the clearest warning to the Iranians that they need to get to the negotiating table and essentially accept the conditions that I think have been laid down by the US that's been unacceptable to them so far. But as I say, there is a possibility still that Iran may be able, in a face saving way to continue those negotiations that could be a way out of this current situation. But at the moment, it seems to me that Israel, its military, its leadership is intent on continuing this for some time. And really one has to wonder quite what the limit of their ambitions is.
- [07:43]
Sebastian Ussher
Sebastian Usher in Jerusalem. Those nuclear talks between Iran and the US That Sebastian referred to there had been due to resume over the weekend, but Iran has pulled out of Sunday's planned meeting in Oman. Meanwhile, President Trump has spoken to Mr. Netanyahu about the Israeli attacks. My colleague Alex Ritson heard more from our Washington correspondent, Jake Kwon.
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Jake Kwon
The two leaders had a phone call on Friday afternoon. It's a second phone call in just few days. And the details of the phone call, what was discussed is not given, but they likely spoke about the next steps and their shared goal here, which is to really keep the nuclear weapon out of the Iranian hands. And originally it appeared there was some discord between the two leaders. But Washington's position has been quickly evolving in the past 24 hours. And Washington has been saying that they knew that this attack was coming, unlike what they were saying earlier where they distanced themselves from this attack, saying that this was all Israel's doing and the US had nothing to do with it. But now they're really embracing the attack more openly. Now. We heard from President Donald Trump that the US had been told ahead of the attack. And he called it an excellent attack, and he praised the great American equipment that was used.
- [08:55]
Jonathan Marcus
Donald Trump has urged Iran to make a deal on its nuclear program to avoid Israeli attacks. But surely the time for those talks is over.
- [09:04]
Jake Kwon
Well, that would be what it seems like. President Trump appears to be using this devastating attack as a leverage. He still believes that a deal could be reached. He was putting further pressure on the Iranians to accept really American demand for a nuclear deal here. He warned the Iranians that there will be more attacks to come and that without a deal, they will face what he calls even more brutal attacks by the Israelis. And while the White House said that they are still looking for a deal at the scheduled talks this Sunday, of course, the Iranians have now pulled out after their chief negotiators were reportedly killed in the initial attack. And President Trump is still blaming the attack on the Iranians for dragging their feet in the negotiation and said the hardliners who had been driving the talks are now dead. And it is unclear whether President Trump is misguided in thinking that a deal could still be reached. But at least in the immediate future, a deal seems quite unlikely.
- [09:56]
Sebastian Ussher
Jake Kwon in Washington. What about ordinary people caught up in this surge in hostilities, those who right now might be sheltering in their homes or bunkers in Tel Aviv or Tehran? We'll hear an Iranian perspective shortly. But first, here's Noga Tanapolsky, a journalist with two decades of experience covering Israel and the Middle East.
- [10:18]
Noga Tarnopolski
Israel is a society still in trauma from what happened on October 7, 2023, and the fact that the nation failed to protect its borders and its citizen. And those images from back in 2023 of, you know, a granny being pulled out of bed by terrorists in her 90, those have really stayed with Israelis. And I think until the Israeli hostages are rescued, they will be part of the Israeli experience. So what did we see this morning? A granny killed in her own bed by an Iranian missile. A baby 2 month old being rescued by a police officer. These images are having a very major effect in Israel, in addition simply to the fact that it's three civilians killed in just the first 12 hours or so of an Iranian retaliation to Israel. And Israelis are exhausted and have very little faith in their leadership right now.
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Bernard Etchio
How much concern is there that this could be not just something over a couple of days, but this could go on for a lot longer.
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Noga Tarnopolski
The concern is huge, especially because the prime minister has almost promised that, saying that this operation was created was conceived to last for two weeks. And again for Israelis with kids at home in the summer, the idea of again being stuck for weeks on end with no school, with children crying in bomb shelters, you know, you can say that Israelis are lucky to have these air raid sirens and the whole system. And it's true, Israelis are. Nonetheless, it's a very bad time to be an Israeli. It's a very fragile moment for Israeli society. And I think that to the extent that Netanyahu hoped that this security operation could also benefit him politically and might kind of re burnish his credentials as Israel's Mr. Security, I think it's a very big risk.
- [12:23]
Sebastian Ussher
Noga Tarnopolski speaking with my colleague Niki Schiller. Shakayen Arousi is an Iranian human rights activist. She gave us her reaction to the airstrikes on Iran.
- [12:34]
Shagayen Arousi
We are very terrified. And at the same time, the main thing is that we are very shocked. It was very shocking. I want to tell you this not just because we didn't expect it, also because the way that it happened, for example, the first hours, especially the first hours, that the defensing system does not work. You cannot imagine how we feel as a people even out of that country or the one that they are inside, that how this is possible, that even the defense system does not work. And just few hours ago we learned that probably it was a hack from the Australian regime that even the defense system does not work. And also, for example, we learned that the first round of the attack, the drones, they were transferred inside Iran and they were launched from inside Iran. And because of this, it was that. That's terrible and shocking what's happening. So it was a kind of, not even a normal act of war. It was a kind of terroristic attack. At least the first round it was completely terroristic attack, what's happening for us. And also it's very important for me to emphasize this, that here or there, sometimes I see during these hours in different media, especially the ones that they are close to the Israeli regime, that they show Iranian people, the ones that they are our family inside the country, that they are happy about this attack and they are expecting that this attack bring them peace and democracy. I think really this is a dehumanizing, dehumanizing the image of Iranian community.
- [14:08]
Sebastian Ussher
Iranian human rights activist Shaggaye Naruzi. We're joined now by the defence analyst Jonathan Marcus. Jonathan, what do you make of what we've seen so far as regards Iran's retaliation against Israel? How effective has it been?
- [14:23]
Jonathan Marcus
Well, it's been less effective, clearly, I imagine, than the Iranians would have hoped. Several rounds of ballistic missiles fired at Israel in the past 24 hours and of course also initially that wave of explosive drones sent. It's clear, of course, that Israel's defenses are not 100%, it's not a magic wand and some missiles have impacted and there have been small number of deaths and a number of casualties. I think, though, the clear indication is that the Israelis achieved what they wanted to at the outset, to knock the Iranian system sideways, to knock them off balance completely. That has to some extent mitigated the response that the Iranians have been able to mount. I suppose the real question is, in the coming hours and days, will the Iranians, who of course remain under a very large scale Israeli aerial attack, will they be able to gather their resources and mount the sort of riposte against Israel that would really challenge Israel's aerial defences?
- [15:25]
Sebastian Ussher
Well, could we see the Iranians extend the range of their targets, for instance, trying to hit U.S. bases?
- [15:32]
Jonathan Marcus
Well, I think all sorts of things are possible. I mean, we might see other dimensions to Iran's attacks against Israel, for example, a cyber dimension. We could see terror attacks by Iranian proxies abroad. It's interesting that Hezbollah, obviously, which was one of the great ramparts of Iran's defences in the region, much weakened by its own struggle against Israel. Hezbollah seems to be sitting this out for the time being. The key question, of course, you heard those threats the Iranians have made against the Americans and others who might aid Israel in any way. We believe the Americans already have taken down some incoming missiles that were heading towards Israel. So to that extent, the Americans are already involved. Of course, if Iran actually attacked American targets in the region, that would raise the stakes incredibly. It might well draw in the Americans. It might be indeed exactly what the Israelis might be hoping for. So the Iranians have to be very, very cautious, I think, in how they measure the strategic options in front of them.
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Sebastian Ussher
Jonathan, tell us more about the scale of the damage Israel has inflicted on Iran's facilities.
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Jonathan Marcus
Well, look, clearly we don't know precisely what has been achieved. I think, though, from the nature of the attacks themselves, some of the video we've seen of aircraft in the region, region and so on, it's clear that they have been remarkably successful in creating a situation where they can operate in Iranian airspace pretty much unchallenged. We know there have been severe attacks against the air defence system, obviously attacks against the Revolutionary Guard Air Force High Command, which were very successful. Several officers taken out. The huge question, of course, is what real damage have they done to Iran's nuclear installations? We know that the damage, significant damage, has been done to facilities above ground. That seems to be clear. We know the Israelis appear to have an intimate knowledge of exactly what these facilities look like, even the buried ones, where the access points are, where the power generation comes from and so on. But I think it's still going to be very difficult for the Israelis to cause the sort of damage they would like to deeply buried, highly fortified, underground facilities.
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Sebastian Ussher
Defence analyst Jonathan Marcus. And that's all from us for now. But there'll be the regular edition of the Global News podcast later. This edition was mixed by Rebecca Miller and the producers were Judy Frankel and Steven Jensen. The editor is Karen Martin. I'm Bernard Ecchio. Until next time. Goodbye.
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