The Global Story: Trump’s ‘CEO of everything’

Summary

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The Global Story: Trump’s ‘CEO of everything’

Podcast: Global News Podcast (BBC World Service)
Hosts: Asma Khalid (Washington, D.C.), Tristan Redman (London)
Air Date: October 12, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode focuses on Larry Ellison—a tech titan and founder of Oracle—whose vast and rapidly growing influence spans artificial intelligence, social media, and legacy media. Framed by Donald Trump dubbing Ellison the “CEO of everything,” the discussion explores how Ellison’s business ambitions and personal connections position him (and his family) at the heart of America’s—and potentially the world’s—information infrastructure and media power. Wired magazine’s Jake LeHart joins to dissect the roots and implications of this new era of concentrated technological, media, and political influence.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Rise and Persona of Larry Ellison (03:12–07:06)

• Origins:
  • "He really goes back in the Silicon Valley scene. So, you know, we're talking like 1970s is when he starts getting involved. He ends up coming up with this project where it's a database for the CIA and the code name for it is Oracle."
    — Jake LeHart (03:27)
• Oracle’s Backbone Role:
  • Oracle powers fundamental internet infrastructure; described as "digital plumbing."
• Ellison’s Flash & Ambition:
  • Known for extravagant purchases (e.g., buying 98% of Lanai island in Hawaii for $300 million in 2012).
  • Strongly competitive, favoring monopoly-like dominance: "Essentially if your business isn't some version of a monopoly, it's kind of not worth being in that business." (06:27)
• Persona:
  • "He had this kind of larger than life persona that really outshadowed the kind of nuts and bolts of that server business."
    — Jake LeHart (05:16)
  • Notable book title: “What’s the difference between Larry Ellison and God? God doesn’t think he’s Larry Ellison.”

2. Bucket 1: AI Infrastructure – The New “Landlord” of Silicon Valley (07:06–10:44)

• Strategic Position:
  • Oracle provides the core infrastructure (servers, data centers) behind the AI boom.
• Influence without Competition:
  • "He's not actually trying to compete with his own version of AI. He's providing the infrastructure for AI companies to function...he's the kind of landlord of AI."
    — Tristan Redman (08:30-09:18)
• Guaranteed Profits:
  • Regardless of which models win, Ellison collects as AI infrastructure is continually needed:
    "Ellison has probably the best shake of the deal, no matter where the AI boom goes."
    — Jake LeHart (09:41)

3. Bucket 2: The Attention Economy—Ellison & TikTok (10:44–14:28)

• TikTok’s Journey:
  • Escalating national security anxieties around Chinese ownership (ByteDance) led to Trump’s order that TikTok divest from Chinese hands.
• The Making of a Deal:
  • “I’d like Larry to buy it too.”
    — Donald Trump, on TikTok (12:55)
  • Oracle (Ellison) had been TikTok’s US data provider; the Trump administration favored Ellison for US ownership.
  • Outcome: In September 2025, a consortium led by Ellison acquires an 80% American stake in TikTok. Ellison is majority holder.

4. Bucket 3: Legacy Media — The Ellison Family Media Dynasty (14:28–22:51)

• Generational Expansion:

  • Ellison’s son, David Ellison, steers family investments into Hollywood.
    • Started as an aspiring actor; transitioned to producing and business (SkyDance).

• Major Acquisitions:

  • Skydance purchases Paramount, which includes CBS (18:15).
  • Mergers occur amid controversial FCC changes and political interventions from the Trump administration.
  • Trump leverages lawsuits and settlements (e.g., about a Kamala Harris interview) to extract monetary and programming concessions.
    • "Trump’s able to get not just 20 million bucks out of this thing, but also an agreement from CBS to provide this kind of vague form of pro Trump programming."
      — Jake LeHart (19:08)
  • Colbert Show’s cancellation is cited as a sign of the deal’s impact (20:11).

• Future Prospects:

  • Ellison/SkyDance set sights on acquiring Warner Bros. Discovery ($70 billion bid), merging significant news (CNN, CBS) and entertainment holdings.
  • Appointment of Bari Weiss (editor in chief of CBS News), known for anti-woke editorial positions (22:09).

5. Media Monopolies & Political Influence (22:51–24:29)

• Anti-Monopoly Laws:
  • Enforcement depends on leadership of FTC and FCC, which, under Trump, appears favorable to Ellison’s acquisitions.
• State Influence on Media:
  • FCC Chairman Brendan Carr pressures networks to align with administration values—even to the point of late-night show cancellations.

6. The Ellisons — America’s New “Robber Barons”? (24:29–27:50)

• Comparison to the Past:
  • The Ellison family's media and data control likened to the Vanderbilts (railroads) and Rockefellers (oil):
    “The Ellison family has become to data and attention what the Vanderbilts were to the railroads...it’s almost impossible for any other individual or organization to try to rival it.”
    — Jake LeHart (25:10)
• Unprecedented Power:
  • “Has anybody in the United States ever potentially had as much power and influence as this one man?”
    — Tristan Redman (26:13)
  • “Hands down, no. Attention is, in a lot of ways, kind of the most valuable commodity in our modern era...”
    — Jake LeHart (26:48)

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• “In the case of Larry Ellison, it’s well beyond technology, sort of CEO of everything.”
  — Donald Trump (01:56)

• "He owns 98% of Lanai—an island."
  — Jake LeHart (05:07)

• "If your business isn't some version of a monopoly, it's kind of not worth being in that business."
  — Jake LeHart (06:27)

• "[Ellison is] the landlord of AI."
  — Tristan Redman (09:15)

• “I'd like Larry to buy it too.”
  — Donald Trump, on TikTok (12:55)

• “Bari Weiss—she currently runs this newer outlet called the Free Press, which is sort of framing itself as against the excesses of political correctness and liberal bias in US media.”
  — Jake LeHart (22:25)

• "All of our attention is equally scarce... You add in this really, really potent combination of popular entertainment platforms and a large, large chunk of, you know, live video news… that's where… when millennials and Gen Z are the majority… they could be much more affected by the media and attention component of this empire."
  — Jake LeHart (26:48–27:50)

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Key Timestamps

• 03:12 — Ellison’s Origins and Oracle’s Beginnings
• 05:03 — The Purchase of a Hawaiian Island
• 07:06 — How Ellison and Oracle Define Monopoly Power
• 09:15 — “Landlord” of the AI Revolution
• 11:13 — TikTok & the Rise of National Security Concerns
• 12:55 — Trump Favors Ellison in TikTok Deal
• 14:51 — Ellison Media Dynasty and Son’s Role
• 18:30 — FCC & Trump’s Leverage Over CBS
• 20:11 — Stephen Colbert Show Ends Amid Merger
• 22:09 — Bari Weiss Appointed as CBS News Editor-in-chief
• 25:10 — Ellisons Compared to Historical “Robber Barons”
• 26:48 — The Power of Controlling Reach and Attention

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Tone & Language

The conversation blends journalistic rigor with an accessible, slightly incredulous tone—balancing detailed, technical discussion of infrastructure and policy with colorful anecdotes about Ellison’s ambitions, family dynamics, and business style. The podcast maintains a factual, analytical approach while reflecting genuine amazement at the scale and implication of Ellison’s gathering power.

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Summary

This episode presents a timely, in-depth investigation into Larry Ellison’s transformation from flashy Silicon Valley mogul to arguably the most powerful (and politically favored) information and media baron in America. Through expert commentary and vivid examples, listeners gain insight into how technology, politics, and legacy media are converging under a new, singular influence—one that could define the information landscape for generations.

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Transcript

[BBC Announcer]

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[Asma Khalid]

America is changing, and so is the world.

[Tristan Redman]

But what's happening in America isn't just a cause of global upheaval. It's also a symptom of disruption that's happening everywhere.

[Asma Khalid]

I'm Asma Khalid in Washington, D.C. i'm.

[Tristan Redman]

Tristan Redman in London, and this is the Global Story.

[Asma Khalid]

Every weekday, we'll bring you a story from this intersection where the world and America meet.

[Tristan Redman]

Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Asma Khalid]

Hey there. I'm Asma Khalid.

[Tristan Redman]

And I'm Tristan Redman. And we're here with a new weekly bonus for you from the Global Story podcast.

[Asma Khalid]

The world order is shifting. Old alliances are fraying and new ones are emerging. Some of this turbulence can be traced to decisions made in the United States. But the US Isn't just a cause of the upheaval. Its politics are also a symptom of it.

[Tristan Redman]

Every day we focus on one story, looking at how America and the world shape each other.

[Asma Khalid]

So we hope you enjoy this episode. And to find more of our show, just search for the Global Story wherever you get your BBC podcasts.

[Tristan Redman]

It's been a big few weeks for a man you might never have heard of, a man who's at the center.

Of Donald Trump's vision for America.

[Donald Trump]

In the case of Larry Larry Ellison, it's well beyond technology, sort of CEO of everything. He's an amazing man and an amazing business person.

[Tristan Redman]

Larry Ellison's company, Oracle, has already cornered the market on AI real estate. Now he's preparing to buy TikTok. His son's company owns the movie studio and news giant Paramount. And he's in talks to buy Warner Bros. Last month, for one day, Larry became the richest person in the world. All of a sudden, Larry Ellison is holding the reins. He's building an empire which could shape the US and the world for generations to come. From the BBC, I'm Tristan Redman. And today on the Global Story, we.

Explore the vast and growing influence of.

A man who's been called the shadow president.

[Jake LeHart]

Hey, hey. All right, here we go.

[Tristan Redman]

Is that Jake?

[Jake LeHart]

Yes, it is.

[Tristan Redman]

Hello, Jake, this is Tristan in London.

How are you doing?

[Jake LeHart]

Not too bad, not too bad.

[Tristan Redman]

I'm talking to Jake LeHart. He covers the White House for Wired magazine. And he's particularly interested in how Trump world interacts with Silicon Valley. I started by asking him where Larry Ellison comes from.

[Jake LeHart]

So he's like an oog. He's an American slang term for original gangster. He really goes back in the Silicon Valley scene. So, you know, we're talking like 1970s is when he starts getting involved. He ends up coming up with this project where it's a database for the CIA and the code name for it is Oracle. And that obviously later becomes the name of the company.

[Tristan Redman]

What exactly is Oracle, Jake?

[Jake LeHart]

Software for hosting various websites, data sets on servers. So I would describe it as the fundamental infrastructure of the Internet. I was just actually talking to an NPR host who used the term digital plumbing, and I think I'm going to steal that now. Where whatever your cool startup or product is or, you know, whatever your innovation on Wall street might be with some big fancy model, ultimately that data needs to be stored somewhere. It needs to be stored reliably. And Oracle ends up developing a real advantage on this front. They're also just really good at marketing. They're really good at selling other companies these very expensive software products to make them even more money. But the thing to emphasize about ellison in the 90s is it's a lot of flash. He's buying foreign jets, he likes to fly these jets. He's into yachting. He owns a sail racing team. And he's always making these big, big purchases of big estates or, you know, with Hawaii buying up more and more of the island of Lanai to the point where it reaches 98%.

[Tristan Redman]

Are you saying he owns 98% of a Hawai, an island?

[Jake LeHart]

Yes, he does. It's. It's pretty crazy.

[Tristan Redman]

Well, how much did he pay for this island?

[Jake LeHart]

$300 million in 2012.

[Tristan Redman]

$300 million for an island? What does he do with it?

[Jake LeHart]

You know, this is a trend you've seen with other folks in Silicon Valley. Like, this is just kind of an ego thing that these guys do. Because when you get that wealthy, there are, there are only so many purchases you can make that no one else can buy. Right. So he had this kind of larger than life Persona that really outshadowed, you know, the kind of nuts and bolts of that server business. And I think part of that's because he's always seen himself as a storyteller.

[Tristan Redman]

Well, I mean, he sounds like a flashy big spender. I mean, one way you can tell how important someone is is how many biographies they've had written about them. And Ellison has had a lot of biographies written about him. Some of the titles are quite hysterical and hint at just kind of how ruthless his ambition has been over the years. And the one title I found funniest of all is what's the difference between Larry Ellison and God? God doesn't think he's Larry Ellison. And then there's another one which is a bit pithier called Everyone Else Must Fail. How would you describe his leadership style? What kind of manager of people is he known as?

[Jake LeHart]

Well, I think to the point about how everyone else must lose. This is a really important strain to understand in how Silicon Valley billionaires have really affected politics in the US Especially with how they've taken over the Republican Party in a lot of ways, which is this belief that essentially if your business isn't some version of a monopoly, it's kind of not worth being in that business. That the nature of the modern economy, especially in tech, is that there is sort of it's a, it's a winner take all ecosystem and that someone gets to the new technology first and then they own it.

[Tristan Redman]

Okay, well, I mean, you mentioned that his belief is that if you're not in a monopoly, then it's not worth being in that realm of business. So, I mean, one of the things I really wanted to ask you about today is these realms of business that he is really starting to take over in some ways. In fact, Trump has described him as the CEO of everything. So I think it would be easier if we separate these regions of his power into, into kind of buckets of influence. So first of all in artificial intelligence, and then secondly in the attention economy, so social media, and then in traditional media. So let's start with the first one, which is artificial intelligence. What's the story of Larry Ellison's expansion into artificial intelligence?

[Jake LeHart]

Well, really, this is just because the servers are the lifeblood of artificial intelligence, and that the financial boom that he sees from AI starts in the 2000s. When you look at the reality of these large language models, which is that they are very, very resource intensive. And to train each generation of those models requires more energy and a lot more data. And there are simply very few companies in the world that can provide that level of, of compute and the ability to scale that at the pace that these companies need.

[Tristan Redman]

But he's not, he's not actually trying to compete with his own version of AI. He's providing the infrastructure for AI companies to function. So it' almost like he's providing the, the football stadium for the players to play in rather than the actual players themselves.

[Jake LeHart]

Right, right. Or to use you know, a fast food analogy, you know, McDonald's in the US they're not necessarily in the burger business. What they're in the business of is real estate, because they own the land that the McDonald's franchises sit on, and then they are leasing those to a franchisee. But they're always going to be fine when, you know, no matter what happens with that McDonald's owner's franchise, they have a very valuable plot of land that is for any commercial purpose.

[Tristan Redman]

So he's sort of the AI landlord.

[Jake LeHart]

Yeah, that's actually a great way to put it, I think.

[Tristan Redman]

So one of the things that, you know, looking at it from afar, not being a tech billionaire, I mean, I've always assumed that the people who hold power in artificial intelligence are the ones who own and develop the large language models. So how does Oracle owning the AI infrastructure translate into power in the industry?

[Jake LeHart]

So that's where I think Ellison has probably the best shake of the deal, no matter where the AI boom goes. Because these companies need to invest a ton of money in data centers and in training these models before they can ever look at making a profit. And there's an assumption in the Valley that AI is on this kind of unstoppable track to keep growing and growing and growing, and that you can justify spending any amount of money on building up the infrastructure to train these models when the goal is to beat China and to reach this benchmark of artificial general intelligence. Now, if none of that happens, Larry Elson still makes a ton of money because they had to invest all this stuff in the data centers. Right. But that's where, you know, he's kind of cornered that front end of the market. And with this new boom of Trump's second term, highly prioritizing, expansive growth in AI. Larry Olson's a huge beneficiary of that because for any of that to start, you've got to pay Oracle to get those servers up and running.

[Tristan Redman]

Okay, so he's the kind of landlord of AI. He's the guy who gets paid whatever happens to AI. So he has a huge amount of power over the future of the AI industry. I want to turn to our next bucket of influence because it's a big one, the attention economy. But really, I just mean TikTok, because he is now going to be one of the principal owners of TikTok. Can you remind me how we got to this stage?

[Jake LeHart]

So I think the first flashpoint for TikTok is around 2020 and it all centers around the Chinese company ByteDance. And this potential for a back door is what people will call it for the Chinese Communist Party to look at Americans data.

[Grainger Advertiser]

President Trump is making good on his threat to crack down on two popular Chinese owned social media apps.

[Donald Trump]

We're looking at TikTok. We may be banning TikTok, we may be doing some other things.

[Grainger Advertiser]

Signed executive orders banning TikTok and WeChat from operating in the US within 45 days unless they're sold. Mr. Trump says the apps are effectively spyware.

[Jake LeHart]

So basically, after Trump's order for ByteDance to divest from TikTok, we get a series of punts. And a lot of that is because this is a far easier said than done. And a lot of Americans really like their TikTok.

[News Reporter]

President Trump was speaking out this week about the social media app TikTok as he repeatedly pushes back the deadline for the app's Chinese parent company to either divest or face a ban in the.

[Donald Trump]

US and we're going to watch the security concerns and we have buyers, American buyers. We have American buyers.

[BBC Announcer]

We need to know who's going to own it.

[Jake LeHart]

Right?

[BBC Announcer]

We need to know who in the United States here is going to own it.

[Jake LeHart]

Which seems like the big part of Trump extends this. Essentially like the deadline gets pushed back 90 days over and over and over again. We get to January of 2025.

[Donald Trump]

Well, thank you very much and it's an honor to be here today.

[Jake LeHart]

So Trump's getting questions in the Oval Office about whether he wants Elon Musk to buy. Tick Tock. Are you open to Elon?

[Donald Trump]

I would be if he wanted to buy.

[Jake LeHart]

Instead of running with that, which Trump is often prone to do, he says.

[Donald Trump]

I'd like Larry to buy it too.

[Jake LeHart]

I want Larry to buy it as in Ellison. And from that point on, TikTok was seen as Larry Ellison's asset to lose. At that point, that he was seen as the clear favorite for whatever the US ownership version of this company would look like.

[Tristan Redman]

Why did Trump want Larry ellison to buy TikTok?

[Jake LeHart]

That is kind of unclear, other than Ellison really proved his worth as a savvy operator for Trump. I mean, a lot of the credit that he gets from my sources around the president and Trump advisers is that, you know, he stays under the radar. He's not like Elon Musk sort of just spouting off on hot button issues and getting himself in trouble. And side note, Oracle has been this whole time has been providing cloud computing and servers for US user data on TikTok. So he's already been making money off of it.

[Tristan Redman]

And where have we landed then, with the ownership of TikTok?

[Jake LeHart]

So in September 2025, Trump approves this new consortium of U.S. owners to run TikTok stateside. Interesting. Let's see what the deal is. Gives Americans an 80% stake in TikTok. Which Americans? Well, you'll never guess. Yes, Larry Ellison is one of them along.

[Asma Khalid]

That they will be part of a group to take over TikTok's algorithm.

[Jake LeHart]

And Larry Ellison is leading it. He will be the majority holder of this new American version of TikTok.

[Tristan Redman]

Yes. Okay, so Larry Ellison at this point owns some of the most critical infrastructure for artificial intelligence in the United States. He now owns also one of the biggest social media networks in the United States. But what's he doing with traditional media, with legacy media? How's he expanding his influence here?

[Jake LeHart]

So that's where the trajectory of the Ellison family dynasty could get really interesting and at a potential unprecedented level of power, at least in modern times. And Larry Elson, by the way, is 81. He's older than Donald Trump. So like Rupert Murdoch, he has placed a son in a position to carry this business into the next era.

[Asma Khalid]

America is changing, and so is the world.

[Tristan Redman]

But what's happening in America isn't just the cause of global upheaval. It's also a symptom of disruption that's happening everywhere.

[Asma Khalid]

I'm Asma Khalid in Washington, D.C. i'm.

[Tristan Redman]

Tristan Redman in London, and this is the Global Story.

[Asma Khalid]

Every weekday, we'll bring you a story from this intersection where the world and America meet.

[Tristan Redman]

Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts.

Who is his son? David.

[Jake LeHart]

So David Ellison is Larry's basically clear heir to the family fortune. David Ellison is interesting in the sense that David actually got his start wanting to be an actor. So his big big shot is this 2006 movie called Flyboys. It's a World War I drama. He co stars alongside James Franco. About $60 million of the family fortune gets put into this money where David, the son, privately finances it with another executive. And, you know, it's a. It's a, like an okay movie, but David's performance in it doesn't really lead to any future promising work. And that's where I Mean, is it respectable, his performance? Look, if I'm taking my reporter hat on and I'm going back to my days as an art critic for my college newspaper, I would say, no, he looks like a fish out of water in the performance, I gotta say.

[Tristan Redman]

Okay, so how does he go from being a reportedly failed actor. I'm gonna couch that carefully. To being a media magnate.

[Jake LeHart]

Yeah. So when I spoke to this source of mine who knows the Ellison family, they were basically saying that the movie was a turning point for David where he starts to tell people that he wants to work behind the camera. Now, normally that would mean, like, you know, director, producer, a key grip, so somewhere on the crew. Right. That's not what he actually means. He ends up having this production company under him called Sky Dance. And they get very ambitious with their mergers and acquisitions, so they end up acquiring Paramount. Paramount includes the broadcast network cbs, and they are regulated under this agency called the Federal Communications Commission. So that broadcast license gives the federal government a lot of leverage over these broadcast companies in a way that just hasn't been applied before. But Trump's able to exploit it in terms of kind of weakening the foundation of Paramount. To make this merger more appealing for.

[News Anchor]

The Trump administration to allow the FCC approved Skydance Media's $8 billion bid to acquire CBS News parent company Paramount. The stamp of approval from the FCC comes after months of turmoil revolving around President Trump's legal battle with 60 Minutes.

[Jake LeHart]

We have Trump suing the CBS network for this interview that Kamala Harris did on 60 Minutes, where they simply edited out a portion of her answer.

[News Anchor]

Mr. Trump accused the CBS News program 60 Minutes of deceptively editing an interview with then presidential candidate Kamala Harris.

[Jake LeHart]

That is normally not grounds for a libel or defamation lawsuit, but Trump gets them to settle for around $20 million.

[News Reporter]

This is a deal getting the green light just weeks after Paramount agreed to settle with the Trump administration.

[News Anchor]

What's more, as part of the deal, Skydance agreed to address the Trump administration's concerns about alleged bias at CBS.

[Jake LeHart]

Trump's able to get not just 20 million bucks out of this thing, but also an agreement from CBS to provide this kind of vague form of pro Trump programming. Then the merger starts moving through. The late night comedian Stephen Colbert becomes kind of a sacrificial lamb, where around the time of the merger, his show is announced that it's going to end after its run of the current season. And of course, Stephen Colbert is one of the most critical and I would argue, most effective comedians in our country at really needling Trump and clearly he's been a thorn in his side for years.

[Tristan Redman]

So the Ellisons want to make this merger happen. But it sounds like the Trump administration has a lot of influence over whether Paramount and Skydance, the Ellison's company, can merge. Paramount has to agree to paying out for the CBS interview with Kamala Harris.

[Jake LeHart]

Yep.

[Tristan Redman]

And they have Stephen Colbert taken off the air for the deal to go through. Is that what you're saying?

[Jake LeHart]

Colbert was sort of a casualty of the deal? I think is the better way to understand it. But you know, Colbert's remained outspoken after that announcement was made. That was kind of the clear sign of dominance, I would say for the fact that like this company must submit for this merger to go through. And they're sort of there was a price that had to be paid beyond the monetary one for the government to allow it.

[Tristan Redman]

What happens next for the Ellison's media empire?

[Jake LeHart]

So for this to be the kind of major force that people worry it might be would require more mergers and steps to happen that aren't necessarily as easy as they mean be presented. So the big one on the entertainment front would be this $70 billion bid for Warner Brothers Discovery.

[News Reporter]

The Wall Street Journal is reporting that Paramount, Skydance is preparing an Ellison backed bid for Warner Brothers Discovery.

[Jake LeHart]

This news, Warner Brothers Discovery has just a really valuable mix of properties that they were about to spin off in the coming year. So those include cnn, which is one of our biggest cable news networks. They are the cable news network with the largest international presence by far. They also have hbo. That's where shows like the Wire, the Sopranos succession, they have a Harry Potter franchise. They have Barbie, which was supposed to have been splitting off or spinning off, I should say the reason that this, the timing of this acquisition would be huge for Ellison is that if they can acquire Warner Brothers Discovery before they were going to spin off these other properties, that would allow the Ellison media empire to merge CNN and CBS having an even larger share over our news ecosystem. This journalist by the name of Barry Weiss will have a major leadership role.

[BBC Announcer]

A major shift in the landscape of TV news. Paramount Skydance announcing that they've made Bari Weiss editor in chief of CBS News. She's known for her outspoken support of Israel and strong takes on polarizing topics including gun rights, diversity and inclusion programs.

[Jake LeHart]

She currently runs this newer outlet called the Free Press, which is sort of framing itself as against the excesses of political correctness and liberal bias in US media. So you know, when we already have only a handful of these companies overseeing most of our News organizations in America. You know, you're talking about a lot of pro Trump real estate in that landscape. If all this goes through, okay, so.

[Tristan Redman]

Skydance, the Ellison's company, has said that they are committed to diversity in their programming and that their main journalistic output, CBS's reporting, is still going to be fair and unbiased and fact based. Nonetheless, there is a huge amount of media power at this point accumulated in the hands of the Ellison family. How is all of that legal? Isn't there monopoly, competition law in the United States? How does that happen?

[Jake LeHart]

There is, but it all depends on who enforces it. It depends on who's in charge of the, of the Federal Trade Commission and then also the Federal Communications Commission with, with Brendan Carr, who's become one of the big characters the Trump administration.

[News Anchor]

FCC Chairman Brendan Carr spoke about the merger and the administration's approach earlier today.

[BBC Announcer]

President Trump is fundamentally reshaping the media landscape. And the way he's doing that is when he ran for election, he ran directly at these legacy broadcast media outlets, abc, NBC, cbs.

[Jake LeHart]

And you know, he's made it pretty clear that, you know, you're going to have to kind of do a favor for the administration by having the way he'll put it, is programming in the interests of the American people.

[BBC Announcer]

For years, you know, government officials just allowed those entities with execs sitting in Hollywood, in New York to dictate the political narrative. And he.

[Jake LeHart]

But really you're talking about kind of being aligned with the administration's agenda and politics as a prerequisite for having your business go through.

[Tristan Redman]

Is Brendan Carr the same guy who pressured ABC to cancel Jimmy Kimmel, who pressured Disney to cancel Jimmy Kimmel from his late night show?

[Jake LeHart]

Yes, exactly.

[Tristan Redman]

So we've gone through these big buckets of influence that Larry Ellison and his family have amassed over the last few years. So he's got a hold of AI infrastructure. He's about to own TikTok, which has huge political influence. And he's extending his influence into quote unquote, legacy media, film studios, news channels. And it just seems to be growing. This is a kind of new level of power and influence in the United States. Is Larry Ellison a modern day robber baron like a kind of a Carnegie or a Rockefeller?

[Jake LeHart]

I think a good comparison would be what the Ellison family has become to data and attention is what a Vanderbilt family was to the railroads in the US or the Rockefellers to oil, where it's this combination of business and political influence that is just so large that it's almost impossible for any other individual or organization to try to rival it. Where, you know, this could really set the US On a kind of longer term, you know, semi permanent, pro Republican conservative media apparatus that so far, at least on tv, you know, has really been limited to Fox News. I mean, there are a number of conservative outlets online. Conservative podcasters have been doing very well in the U.S. but that's all disparate and spread out and fractured. Right. Like, there has not been anything that's been this kind of totalitizing megastructure that seems to be in the works here from the Ellison family.

[Tristan Redman]

Well, you mentioned the VanDerbilts who built U.S. railroads. Right. But now you're looking at a man who's in control of the data and attention spans of people of the United States, which. And people who control attention and data in that way feels to me like they sort of control almost everything. You control politics, you control what's popular, you control what sells. I mean, has anybody in the United States ever potentially had as much power and influence as this one man?

[Jake LeHart]

Hands down? No. And that's the thing is attention is, in a lot of ways, kind of the most valuable commodity in our modern era. I mean, yes, we have rare earth minerals and all these other, you know, physical, tangible things, but the fact is, for each one of us, all of our attention is equally scarce. We only have so many waking hours of the day. And you add in this really, really potent combination of popular entertainment platforms and a large, large chunk of, you know, live video news in an era when, just let's face it, younger people consume video first. So that's where, if you look at this in the future, when millennials and Gen Z are the majority of the population, and then they're the ones who are in charge in the U.S. that's where I think they could be much more affected by the media and attention component of this empire.

[Tristan Redman]

Jake, thank you so much.

[Jake LeHart]

Thanks for having me on. Thank you for highlighting Larry Elson.

[Tristan Redman]

That was Jake Lehart, a senior writer at Wired magazine. Today's episode was made by Sam Chantarasak, Aaron Keller and Annie Brown. It was engineered by Travis Evans and I'm Tristan Redman. If you like this episode, then you might also like our episode from September 23rd on whether Apple can cut ties with China. So do scroll back in the feed and take a listen and please leave us a review. It helps others to find us. Thanks for listening. We'll be back tomorrow. Cheerio.

[Asma Khalid]

America is changing and so is the world.

[Tristan Redman]

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[Asma Khalid]

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[Tristan Redman]

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[Tristan Redman]

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