The Global Story: What Elon Musk did next

Summary

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The Global News Podcast: The Global Story — "What Elon Musk Did Next"

Date: May 10, 2026
Host(s): Asma Khalid, Tristan Redman
Guest: Lily Jamali (BBC North America Tech Correspondent)

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Episode Overview

This special episode explores the evolution of Elon Musk's influence since his departure from a formal advisory position in the Trump administration, focusing on his roles in technology, AI, and space—especially through the lens of his ongoing lawsuit against OpenAI and his ever-expanding Starlink satellite empire. The episode asks: Is Elon Musk now more powerful than ever, exerting influence that rivals or exceeds that of national governments?

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Musk in the Trump Administration and Aftermath

• Musk’s White House Role:
  • In 2025, Musk served as a special government employee leading Trump’s Department of Government Efficiency (nicknamed DOGE) but soon left, causing speculation about the dynamics of power in Washington.
  • He pushed bold deficit reduction plans in government (saving $4 billion per day for a $1 trillion annual cut).

    “We do need to move quickly if we’re to achieve a trillion dollar deficit reduction in financial year 2026… But we can do it, and we will do it.”
    — Elon Musk, Cabinet meeting (01:51)

2. The Musk–Altman (OpenAI) Lawsuit

• Background and Stakes:
  • Musk co-founded OpenAI as a nonprofit in 2015, donating at least $38 million, with the mission to develop AI "for the benefit of humanity."
  • Musk is now suing OpenAI and CEO Sam Altman, claiming they breached the nonprofit contract by converting to a for-profit model and enriching themselves.
  • OpenAI counters that Musk is acting out of “sour grapes,” upset at missing out on ChatGPT’s meteoric success after leaving the company. Musk now runs his own AI venture, xAI—a direct OpenAI competitor. (05:12–06:54)
  • Musk’s Demands: $150 billion for OpenAI’s nonprofit side, Altman’s removal as CEO, and the unwinding of all OpenAI’s for-profit entities.

    “For one thing, he wants $150 billion... He wants Sam Altman out of the company as CEO... and an unwinding of all these for-profit entities.”
    — Lily Jamali (06:59)

Notable Trial Moments

• Courtroom Drama:
  • Musk appeared in formal attire, contrasting with his former casual style.
  • Judge Yvonne Gonzalez Rogers reprimanded Musk and Altman, requiring both to stop posting about the case on social media as their comments were complicating the proceedings.

    “The judge pretty much dressed Musk down and said... stop posting on social media about this case. You’re just making this complicated for all of us.”
    — Lily Jamali (07:48)

• Key Admission:
  • Musk disclosed under cross-examination that xAI used OpenAI models to train its own chatbot, Grok, allowing OpenAI’s legal team to present him as hypocritical—especially given xAI’s lack of acknowledged safety guardrails. (11:16)
• Public & Media Reaction:
  • The trial is packed with observers, including tech industry figures and even protestors performing outside the courthouse.
  • Judge noted during jury selection, “I know that in Elon Musk’s case in particular, he is not well liked," but reminded the jury to be fair regardless. (12:22)

3. Legal Troubles Beyond the US

• Probes in France and Europe:
  • Musk failed to appear before French prosecutors investigating the use of X’s (the social platform) algorithm in political interference and Grok's involvement in generating non-consensual sexual images.
  • Additional investigations are happening in the UK, Europe, and several US states, with many officials seeing Musk’s platforms as enablers of harmful speech or deepfakes. (13:00–14:41)

4. Starlink: The Satellite Internet Powerhouse

• What is Starlink?
  • A SpaceX division providing global satellite Internet via ~10,000 satellites in low Earth orbit, now serving 10 million users in 150 countries.

    “Starlink might be the most important part of Elon Musk’s empire… right now, it is the largest satellite Internet provider in the world.”
    — Lily Jamali (15:09–15:54)

  • Used in rural, disaster-stricken, or underserved areas—and increasingly critical in war zones.
• Starlink in Global Conflicts:
  • Musk’s restrictions on the use of Starlink by both Ukrainian and Russian forces have directly impacted wartime strategies; he has turned access on and off based on his own judgment of ethical or geopolitical risks.
  • Starlink has been deployed after the US captured Venezuelan President Maduro and provided during Iran’s blackout, giving individuals Internet access at personal risk.
  • The core issue: control over Internet access in numerous countries now rests with Musk as a private individual.

    “Bottom line here is that Starlink is providing this vital service, but one man... is the one who gets to decide who gets access to the Internet and who doesn’t.”
    — Lily Jamali (18:20–19:19)

• Debate Over Power & Responsibility
  • Critics question the concentration of such power in a single person, but Musk tends to frame himself as acting for the greater good—even as the judge in his trial provocatively questioned whether anyone should assume he’s a good steward of such enormous power. (20:01)

5. The Next Frontier: 1 Million Satellites and Space Data Centers

• Massive Expansion Plan:
  • Musk recently requested US government approval to launch up to 1 million satellites, with the vision of building solar-powered data centers in space to power AI and sidestep Earth’s energy constraints.

    “He wants to... grow to a million satellites as part of a plan to build these data centers in space… It’s always sunny [in space].”
    — Lily Jamali (22:51–23:49)

  • Such a move is described as a “space grab”—an unprecedented private land grab above Earth, with virtually no competition except perhaps Jeff Bezos/Amazon (who have filed objections with the FCC). (24:45–25:47)

6. Is Musk Now More Powerful Than a Head of State?

• Analysis:
  • With the ability to control or deny Internet service globally—and to shape AI platforms—Musk’s leverage is, in some ways, superior to that of many national governments. He faces fewer term limits and has resources extending far beyond political cycles.

    “If you can provide or withhold Internet service, that is raw power because it’s something that supersedes government. It is a global resource in a way.”
    — Lily Jamali (26:31)

• Ultimate Reach:
  • Musk's ambitions are funded by a vast fortune and likely to continue regardless of changes in the US administration.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Influence:

  “There was chatter in Washington about who was really running the show. And then, somewhat unceremoniously, Elon Musk was gone.”
  — Asma Khalid (02:24)

• On Power Dynamics:

  "It is absolutely arguable that he is more powerful than some heads of state in certain contexts... And access to Internet, frankly, can be a life or death thing for those in a war zone or a disaster zone."
  — Lily Jamali (26:31)

• On Personal Style:

  “Elon Musk was a man I remember seeing... in this casual attire in a cabinet meeting with a baseball cap on his head.”
  — Tristan Redman (07:30)

• On Judge’s Admonition:

  "She said, we just don't need those distractions outside of the courtroom."
  — Lily Jamali (08:01)

• On Starlink’s Reach:

  “10 million active users across 150 countries.”
  — Lily Jamali (16:58)

• On Space Ambitions:

  “You've heard of land grabs on Earth. Think of this as Musk potentially trying to create a land grab in space.”
  — Lily Jamali (24:57)

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Timestamps of Key Segments

• Trump Cabinet Role & DOGE (01:01–02:50)
• Transition from OpenAI Co-Founder to Rival (04:55–06:54)
• What Musk Wants from the Lawsuit (06:54–07:30)
• Courtroom Drama and xAI Admissions (07:30–11:16)
• Public and Legal Opinions of Musk (11:43–13:00)
• Probes in France and Beyond (13:00–14:41)
• Explanation of Starlink’s Global Impact(15:09–16:58)
• Starlink in Conflict Zones (17:16–19:19)
• Responsibility and Musk’s Self-Perception (20:01–21:19)
• Expansion to 1 Million Satellites & Data Centers in Space (22:18–24:45)
• Comparisons to Heads of State (26:29–27:43)

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Conclusion

This episode paints a vivid picture of Elon Musk as a figure operating beyond traditional centers of power, wielding technological and infrastructural influence that impacts global connectivity, political dynamics, and the future of AI. Whether as a disruptor, altruist, or unchecked private consolidator of power, the debate around Musk’s role is only intensifying—especially as he pursues projects that reshape not only Earth, but the very fabric of space.

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Transcript

[Asma Khalid]

This BBC podcast is supported by ads

[Carter Sherman]

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[Asma Khalid]

craving something specific. From global flavors to viral snacks, TikTok has it all. If you can dream it, you can make it right at home. Find your next favorite dish on TikTok.

Hey there. I'm Asma Khalid. And I'm Tristan Redman. And we're here with a bonus episode for you from the Global Story podcast. The world order is shifting. Old alliances are fraying and new ones are emerging.

[Tristan Redman]

Some of this turbulence can be traced to decisions made in the United States.

[Asma Khalid]

But the US Isn't just a cause of the upheaval.

[Tristan Redman]

Its politics are also a symptom of it.

[Asma Khalid]

Every day we focus on one story looking at how America and the world shape each other.

[Tristan Redman]

So we hope you enjoy this episode. And to find more of our show, just search for the Global Story, which

[Asma Khalid]

is wherever you get your BBC podcasts.

[Donald Trump]

So I'm going to ask if it's possible to have Elon get up first and talk about Doge, because it seems to be of great interest to everyone.

[Asma Khalid]

That's President Trump speaking at the very first Cabinet meeting of his second term back in February of 2025.

[Donald Trump]

So, Elon, if you could get up and explain where you are, how you're doing, and how much we're cutting. And it's an honor to have you been a tremendously successful guy.

[Asma Khalid]

I remember this meeting quite well because I was actually there in the room as a journal. These were the days when I used to cover the White House for NPR.

Thank you, Lima.

[Elon Musk]

Thank you, Mr. President. Well, I actually just put myself for Hubble Tech support here because this is

[Tristan Redman]

actually

[Elon Musk]

as crazy as it sounds, that is almost a literal description of the work that the Doge team is doing at the time.

[Asma Khalid]

You probably recall that Musk was designated a special government employee leading this Trump initiative called the Department of Government Efficiency, or dogeco. And Musk had grand plans to slash government spending, promising to reduce the federal deficit.

[Elon Musk]

We do need to move quickly if we're. If we're to achieve a trillion dollar deficit reduction in financial year 2026, it requires saving $4 billion per day, every day from now through the end of September. But we can do it, and we will do it.

[Asma Khalid]

And sure, it was odd to hear from someone at a Cabinet meeting who was technically not an official member of the Cabinet. But that wasn't what really struck me about this moment. No, what struck me was the respect and deference that Musk commanded in that room. It's hard to remember now, but at the time There was chatter in Washington about who was really running the show. And then, somewhat unceremoniously, Elon Musk was gone.

[Elon Musk]

I expect to remain a friend and an advisor, and certainly if there's anything the President wants me to do, I'm at at President service.

[Asma Khalid]

In May of last year, Musk left Doge. And though he's since remained an extremely high profile figure, he's been laying somewhat low until the last few weeks when his lawsuit against his former colleague, OpenAI founder Sam Altman, landed him back in the headlines. But just because we didn't see him doesn't mean he went away. In fact, in the year since his departure from the White House, while the public's attention was elsewhere, the world's richest man was quietly shoring up his control of space and the world's Internet. From the BBC, I'm Asma Khalid in Washington, D.C. and today on the Global Story, even though he's no longer in the heart of power in Washington, is Elon Musk now more powerful than ever?

Well, Asma, this is the tech trial of the century for us here on the tech beat.

That's Lily Jamali, the BBC's North America technology correspondent. She's been in Oakland, California, covering this landmark trial between Elon Musk and Sam Altman, the CEO of OpenAI.

And in order to get access to the courtroom, you either need to have had a media pass, which we do, or you gotta get in line around five in the morning and just hope that you get a seat.

[Tristan Redman]

Lily, in our episode today, we wanna take the long view on what exactly Elon Musk has been up to since

[Asma Khalid]

he left the White House about a year ago.

[Tristan Redman]

And I don't think that we can have this conversation in this moment about Elon Musk without mentioning that he is currently suing the CEO of OpenAI, Sam Altman. That trial of those two tech titans is underway as we tape. And I know you have been in the courtroom in California covering it all. So let me just start there. What is this lawsuit actually about?

[Asma Khalid]

Elon Musk and OpenAI CEO Sam Altman actually started OpenAI together with some others back in 2015, and it was a nonprofit that was the vision for it that was supposed to develop AI technology safely.

[Tristan Redman]

And Musk gave a lot of the money for it starting. Is that right?

[Asma Khalid]

That's exactly right. He ended up donating somewhere on the order of $38 million. And, you know, the idea behind this was to develop AI safely and to develop it for the benefit of humanity. A very lofty goal, but one that Musk thought was really important to have in sort of the founding rubric for. For the company. So now he says that Altman and Greg Brockman, who's the president of OpenAI, breached this nonprofit deal, that they had this nonprofit contract and ended up enriching themselves along the way. So at a certain point, they decided to become a for profit. It's a lot easier to collect money from investors that way, and, boy, is it expensive to develop AI technology. And so in doing that, what Musk is saying is that the for profit entity kind of superseded, at a certain point, the nonprofit that they had created together, the nonprofit that he had donated all this money to. That's his argument. On the other side, you have OpenAI and Altman and Brockman saying that this is really just sour grapes on Musk's part, that he is upset that he left OpenAI when he did in 2018. About four years later, they launched ChatGPT, which was this massive overnight success. It's worth noting here that Musk is actually working on his own AI startup, Xai, which is a competitor to OpenAI. And so that's another part of the company's argument, is that he's just trying to kind of derail one of the top players while he's trying to get his own thing off the ground.

[Tristan Redman]

And so what exactly does Elon Musk want? What is his end goal here?

[Asma Khalid]

Couple things. For one thing, he wants $150 billion. That money would not go to Elon Musk himself. It would go towards OpenAI's nonprofit entity. He wants Sam Altman out of the company as CEO. And he also is really pushing for an unwinding of all of these for profit entities that have become a really key part of the company's ability to fund itself. So those are the three main things he's pushing for.

[Tristan Redman]

I saw that Musk took the stand the other day. He was wearing a suit and tie, which, um, Lily, I will just say is a wardrobe choice that stood out to me. Elon Musk was a man I remember seeing as a White House correspondent in this casual attire in a cabinet meeting with a baseball cap on his head. So. So that stood out to me.

[Asma Khalid]

Yeah, I mean, definitely. The fact that he's in a suit and tie is a statement. He has to endear himself to this judge, Yvonne Gonzalez Rogers, who ultimately decides the fate of this case. There is a jury that's been impaneled of nine Northern California citizens, but they are in an advisory role. They will issue a verdict, but it is considered an advisory verdict that the judge will take into consideration. If she has a problem with it, she can overrule the jury's decision. Yeah, she will ultimately make the call. And, you know, there were a lot of memorable moments. But I mean, just to start, before Musk even took the stand, the judge pretty much dressed Musk down and said, listen, you've got to stop posting on social media about this case. You're just making this complicated for all of us. Because going into the trial, Musk had been posting to his social media platform X about the case, disparaging Sam Altman and Greg Brockman, calling Sam Altman scam Altman and trying to make his case in the court of public opinion, so to speak. And she said, we just don't need those distractions outside of the courtroom. And she actually turned to Sam Altman at one point and said, would you also agree to stop posting about this

[Tristan Redman]

case with Sam Altman posting about it?

[Asma Khalid]

Because, well, Musk was saying, I'm just doing this because OpenAI is posting about this and it's me trying to defend myself. So you kind of had this little bit of a playground situation with these two boys who are a little trigger happy with the social media and the judge saying, this has got us up. Both of them agreed to do so, and that was how we started the case.

[Tristan Redman]

And Lily, you've been there in the courtroom. What's it been like?

[Asma Khalid]

It is a packed courtroom. It's a media circus. You see high profile people, not just the parties to the case. But Ari Emanuel, the Hollywood super agent who is working with Musk's team, was sitting right in front of me.

[Tristan Redman]

Interesting.

[Asma Khalid]

On the second day of Musk's testimony. And it's really interesting, that kind of hearing Musk articulate himself. I haven't actually been in a room with him in probably 10 years. And his public image has really changed during that time. Back then, I think he was truly revered as a technologist and somebody who really just had a much less polarizing public image then than he does today. And seeing him there, having to answer questions, you know, in a trial that he himself initiated. But he had to answer some questions that I think were pretty uncomfortable. I think, you know, also really important is hearing details about his AI venture, Xai, which is now part of SpaceX, which developed that controversial AI chatbot Grok, that's made a lot of negative headlines over the last few months for different reasons. He admitted on the stand, under prodding from OpenAI's lead lawyer, that he has used OpenAI's models to basically train his product. And I think that was an uncomfortable admission for him to make. So we're getting a little bit of a look under the hood at how he's doing his own startup, which is not a nonprofit, which is not known for safety guardrails. And so that is, I think, you know, being painted as pretty hypocritical by OpenAI's lawyers, in addition to journalists are

[Tristan Redman]

just curious onlookers coming by, folks who work in tech.

[Asma Khalid]

There are, I think there are people that want to pitch Elon Musk their startup. He was leaving the stand and actually walking out the courtroom. I think it was on Thursday. There's also downstairs, outside of the courthouse, there are these protesters who are doing performative art, impersonating Elon Musk and Sam Altman, putting up these very.

[Tristan Redman]

Protesting. Both of them.

[Asma Khalid]

Yeah, because frankly, they're not both beloved, if I can be so bold. They are both tech billionaires who are in control of this incredibly important technology to varying degrees. And that does not sit well with a lot of people. In fact, during jury selection, Judge Yvonne Gonzalez Rogers was pretty blunt about that. She said something to the effect of, I know that in Elon Musk's case in particular, he is not well liked. And I don't, you know, the judge

[Tristan Redman]

said that out loud.

[Asma Khalid]

The judge said something to that effect that like acknowledging people don't like Elon Musk. And she said that it was okay for them not to like him as long as they could vow to be fair to him and the other parties in the case.

[Tristan Redman]

Okay, Lily. When I heard that Elon Musk was going to go to court in this lawsuit with OpenAI, I was actually in Europe and there was a story circulating there that caught my attention, and that is that in late April, Musk was actually summoned to appear before prosecutors in France, but he did not show up. Did you recall this, too? I just want to get clarity on what that was all about.

[Asma Khalid]

It doesn't have anything to do with this case, but it is a sign of the times. Right. So in Paris, authorities have been looking at how X's algorithm has been used to interfere in French politics. This is a probe that began early last year, and that investigation has now grown to include grok, which, you know, you might remember earlier this year that GROK was being used by people to create these non consensual sexual images of women and girls. And so now GROK is being probed in a number of jurisdictions. And yet Musk has really dug in his heels saying this Paris probe in particular is part of a political attack. This was a voluntary summons. He didn't show. But you have other investigations happening in the UK and in Europe, but it's also about political speech. Groc has been caught giving people, you know, just really unreal responses.

[Tristan Redman]

Holocaust denial, right?

[Asma Khalid]

Yeah, there's Holocaust denial. There is this Mecca Hitler incident from last year. And all of this is a product of the parameters that are being set by Xai. So it's not an accident. And so that's why, in addition to those probes happening in Europe, there are several dozen attorneys general here in the United States. These are US States that are taking action against Xai. After Grok was involved in generating all these sexualized deepfakes, Elon Musk's response has consistently been that authorities are looking for any excuse that they can for censorship.

[Tristan Redman]

So, Lilly, while the legal drama is certainly making headlines, perhaps the bigger story, the one that is, albeit not being talked about as much, is Elon Musk's satellite Internet company, Starlink. And I think it's fair to say that a lot of people here in the United States might not feel like they have actually been exposed directly to Starlink beyond, say, WI fi services on a flight. So can you at the outset, just explain what exactly Starlink is?

[Asma Khalid]

So, as you said, it's a satellite Internet company. It is a division of SpaceX, which is Musk's rocket company. And I would argue that Starlink might be the most important part of Elon Musk's empire, even though it doesn't get the coverage that various other parts like Tesla and SpaceX itself get. Over the last couple of years, Musk has launched thousands of satellites into what's known as low Earth orbit. There's something like 10,000 of them up there right now, and that's basically the majority of satellites that are orbiting in that area at the moment.

[Tristan Redman]

So he's the clear industry leader when it comes to satellites in low earth orbit.

[Asma Khalid]

He is the clear industry leader. Exactly. And you can sometimes even spot them at night. They look kind of like a string of stars that are tethered together, shooting across the sky. That's Starlink for the users of Starlink. They get these units, this kind of square device that comes. It's a flat antenna, and you can get Internet from anywhere using it. Starlink has been gaining traction, providing Internet on airlines. It's also in places that are sort of considered underserved markets. So here in the US that would be rural areas. It's sometimes one of those early services that are provided to people who have just been through a natural disaster where the traditional infrastructure around them has just been destroyed. And so it's out there, but maybe not everybody has heard of it. Right now, it is the largest satellite Internet provider in the world with more than 10 million active users. 10 million active across 150 countries.

[Tristan Redman]

150 countries, wow. I mean, Lily, that's what I find so fascinating about Starlink. I mean, while it may not be incredibly popular yet in the United States or Europe, it has become, it seems, so central to how so many people around the world do access the Internet.

[Asma Khalid]

You're not wrong about that, Asma. Starlink has been used in war zones. And I think that's a pretty important point to dwell on for a moment. It's actually that use in war zones that I think has generated the most international headlines around Starlink. So this sort of started towards the beginning of the war in Ukraine, not long after Russia invaded Musk back in 2023, refused to allow Ukraine to use Starlink for a surprise attack that they were wanting to launch against Russian forces in Crimea. The quick context there is that Russia seized Crimea from Ukraine back in 2014. They now claim it as their territory. Musk reportedly refused to allow the Ukrainians access because he was concerned that Russia would respond by using a nuclear weapon. And then more recently, Musk denied Russian forces access to Starlink after Ukraine's defense minister asked him to block them from using it. So now he's sort of on the other side. Right.

[Tristan Redman]

So at times, over the course of the war, he has restricted Starlink's use, you're saying, both to Ukraine and to Russia.

[Asma Khalid]

That is our understanding. It's also happening in other parts of the world. So earlier this year, Musk decided to make Starlink available to Venezuelans for a time after the US Captured Nicolas Maduro, the Venezuelan president. That was announced just after Musk had dinner with US President Donald Trump. So there we see, you know, the potential influence of politics at play. He's also made it available in Iran after a prolonged Internet blackout by the regime there. But people use Starlink in Iran at their own risk. They can be imprisoned for using it or for even helping distribute it. So bottom line here is that Starlink is providing this vital service, but one man, this private citizen who, you know, sometimes makes questionable choices to a lot of people, is the one who gets to decide who gets access to the Internet and who doesn't.

[Tristan Redman]

I understand, Lily, that critics of Musk will question the concentration of power, say, that Musk has and the ability to turn on and turn off access. I'd also imagine, though, that Musk sees himself as someone who is also providing this altruistic service to people in times of need. I mean, you mention Iran. Iran has had an Internet blackout now for more than two months. And I know it's been extraordinarily difficult for Iranians to connect with people in the outside world. I mean, you could argue that we here at the BBC rely on people who are, at times are connecting via Starlink to be able to tell us what's going on inside the country over

[Asma Khalid]

the last couple of months.

That's right. And I think, you know, it's interesting that you bring this up because during the Musk vs Altman trial that I've been covering, you kind of get this sense from Musk that. And I don't think this is new. I've again been following him for a number of years now. But you get this sense from him that he thinks of himself as one of the good guys. And the judge at one point said to. I believe it was Musk's lawyer because they were having this argument about whether the notion of human extinction brought about by AI, whether that could be part of the trial. Were they going to let Musk talk about that? And, you know, she at one point said, you know, let's not assume that everybody wants Elon Musk controlling this kind of powerful technology. He might think he is a good steward, but a lot of people who watch him don't agree with that was the point that she was making. I think that that argument about AI and human extinction and who gets to control this important technology is equally applicable to Starlink and the power to control human connectivity to the Internet around the world,

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[Tristan Redman]

Lily. Earlier this year, Musk asked the US government for permission to launch 1 million satellites into space. And on the surface I thought, okay, it seems like he wants to expand access even further, right, to allow people to connect to the Internet. But the one thing that was very confusing to me about this announcement is that I read these satellites are envisioned in some ways to allow Starlink to create data centers in space. Can you explain that?

[Asma Khalid]

That's right. Musk is launching new satellites into low Earth orbit all the time. It helps that he owns a rocket company, SpaceX, as he's doing this. But what he wants to do seemingly is to create this footprint. He already has a fairly sizable one, but to expand that footprint to grow to a million satellites as part of a plan to build these data centers in space. We learned about this plan from an announcement that Musk made back in March. The plan is to have SpaceX put these data centers into orbit around the world. They would use power from the sun. And Musk is kind of trying to sidestep one of the main constraints to developing AI and to having people use it here on Earth. And that is power, access to enough electricity. These are really energy intensive processes. So Musk has talked about how space has the advantage that it's always sunny.

Okay, but is it tested?

[Tristan Redman]

Like, do we know that a data center in space could actually work?

[Asma Khalid]

We don't know that. There are a lot of things that could go wrong. We don't know if these data centers in space are cost effective. It could be incredibly expensive. So it's worth noting that this is all happening as SpaceX is preparing to IPO soon to publicly list with a valuation of more than a trillion dollars, possibly as much as 2 trillion. So that could be really important to helping him pay for this very ambitious idea. And then the other thing is that data centers need a lot of maintenance. So there's a question of how do you get people or, you know, adequate robots to continue that ongoing maintenance work that has to happen.

[Tristan Redman]

Can we just talk about the sheer number of satellites that Musk is proposing putting into space? 1 million. That's one of those astronomically large numbers

[Asma Khalid]

that's just hard to quantify. What would it mean to have 1

[Tristan Redman]

million little satellites all floating in space around the Earth?

[Asma Khalid]

Seems like a lot.

[Tristan Redman]

So can you just give us a sense of the scale here? How large is this project?

[Asma Khalid]

Yeah, well, I think the way to frame this is that you've heard of land grabs on Earth. Think of this as Musk potentially trying to create a land grab in space. So he wants to a spacecraft flood, a space grab, flooding low Earth orbit with his own satellites at a time when there really aren't all that many viable competitors to stop him. Or one competitor is billionaire Jeff Bezos. Bezos is the founder of Amazon, of course, which has been working to build up its own satellite Internet business. And it's made some interesting moves lately, including this acquisition of a company called Global Star in April. And in fact, Amazon has filed a formal objection with the Federal Communications Commission, the fcc, over what Musk is doing.

[Tristan Redman]

When we think about the arc of Musk's recent career here in Washington, it centered a lot around politics. And there was an active debate here in Washington about the power that Musk had. And now listening to you, it seems like after leaving that informal position in the Trump administration, after he, you know, largely faded to the background of, of some of the political discourse, that Musk has nonetheless actually accrued more power. You've described this unprecedented space grab, and it makes me wonder what exactly his

[Asma Khalid]

end game is here.

It is absolutely arguable that he is more powerful than some heads of state in certain contexts. If you can provide or withhold Internet service, that is raw power because it's something that supersedes government. It is a global resource in a way. And access to Internet, frankly, can be a life or death thing for those in a war zone or a disaster zone. Their ability to communicate is squarely in Musk's hands. And we know that Musk is interested in power. And it's also important to recognize that he's been building this power infrastructure for years now before Donald Trump, and he's going to be there after Donald Trump leaves office. And he's going to have a lot of money to play with in order to carry out these various ambitions that he has.

[Tristan Redman]

I mean, it arguably makes you similar, you're saying, to being a head of state, but perhaps more powerful because there are no term limits and your reach is global.

[Asma Khalid]

Exactly. For Musk, he simply doesn't have those constraints on him. He is probably the most important figure in the tech industry and is making all kinds of choices that affect every single one of us.

[Tristan Redman]

Well, Lily, thanks so much for joining us on the Global Story.

[Asma Khalid]

Really appreciate it.

Thanks for having me.

That was Lily Jamali, the BBC's North America technology correspondent. And just a reminder, if you all have any questions or story ideas for us, we love hearing from listeners. You can send us a note at our email address, theglobalstorybc.com and those of you all who are loyal listeners of our show know that here at the Global Story, we dive deep every weekday on one big story at the intersection of where the world and America meet. If you're also looking for a way to catch up on the latest news from around the world, then check out our sister show, the Global News Podcast. You can find it wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Our episode today was produced by Zandra Ellen and Valerio Esposito. It was edited by James Shield and mixed by Travis Evans. Our senior news editor is Chana Collins. Our digital producer is Matt Pintus. And I'm Asma Khalid. Thanks as always for joining us and we'll talk to you again soon.

[Kai Wright]

I'm Kai Wright.

[Carter Sherman]

I'm Carter Sherman. Welcome to Stateside with Kai and Carter. We're a new show from the Guardian.

[Kai Wright]

We're talking to big thinkers and the best journal. Just trying to understand the world through smart conversation and honest reporting.

[Carter Sherman]

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[Kai Wright]

Stateside with Kyan Carter will come out three times a week, Monday, Wednesday and Friday starting May 13.

[Carter Sherman]

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