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- [00:00]
Interviewer
This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the uk.
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Ryan Seacrest
And Doug, there's nowhere I wouldn't go
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Liberty Mutual Advertiser
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Janak Jalil
Hey everyone, check out this guy and his bird. What is this, your first date?
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Ryan Seacrest
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car insurance with Liberty Mutual together.
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Janak Jalil
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Lily Jamali
Yeah, the bird looks out of your league anyways.
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Martha (Kohler Ambassador)
When Kohler, global design leader and luxurious kitchen and bath products, asked me to be their ambassador for timeless, elegant, durable cast iron, I said I'm in. Soon after, I was in their Kohler Wisconsin foundry watching molten iron poured, enamel applied by hand and the beautiful finished pieces ready to ship. Since 1883, Kohler cast iron has been crafted by incredible artisans and seeing it firsthand gave me a whole new appreciation for their craftsmanship. Now I am proud to lend my stamp of approval to my favorite Kohler cast iron products for their durability, beauty and enduring style. Shop my curated picks@kohler.com as the Kohler Cast Iron Ambassador, I say long live Cast Iron.
- [01:29]
Janak Jalil
This is the global news podcast from the BBC World Service. I'm Janak Jalil and in the early hours of Tuesday 21st April, these are our main stories. Mixed signals from Iran and the US as uncertainty continues over whether planned peace talks in Pakistan will go ahead. Apple's chief executive Tim Cook is stepping down. Look at his legacy and tell you about the new man who's replacing him. The American singer David pleads not guilty to the murder of a 14 year old girl whose remains were found in his car.
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Dr. Vinod Balachandran
Also in this podcast, she is doing fantastic. She hiked up Mount Etna last year to celebrate her 50th wedding anniversary. She is a picture of vibrancy.
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Janak Jalil
A new vaccine against pancreatic cancer gives hope to patients. With less than 48 hours to go as we record this podcast before the ceasefire deal between the US and Iran expires, it's still not clear whether peace talks between them will go ahead. In Pakistan's capital, Islamabad, roadblocks are in place and key sections of the city have been sealed off in anticipation of a meeting. But Iran? Iran has yet to officially commit to more talks. Its chief negotiator, Mohammed Baga Calebaf, said Tehran would not accept discussions under the shadow of US threats. However, our correspondent in Tehran, Liz Doucet, says there are growing indications that the Iranians will go.
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Liz Doucet
There's still radio silence from Iranian officials about whether they will go to Islamabad for a second round of high level, high stakes negotiations. But with every hour that passes, there is a growing sense that the talks will take place. The Iranians have to make their point. The Iranian media said that the Iranian officials hadn't actually made a decision about going as long as the US Naval blockade was in force. And when we speak to officials here, they say they have their reservations about this negotiating process. Even though President Trump continues to talk about great progress, a deal even within days, there is still concern here that the way the negotiations are taking place tend to be demands made of the Iranians that they are not ready to make. But they do want this process to continue. And so at the end of the day, there may well be talks in Islamabad this week. We just have to wait for that confirmation from both sides.
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Janak Jalil
Lise Doucet in Tehran, who's reporting from there on the condition that none of her material is used on the BBC's Persian service. These restrictions apply to all international media organizations operating in Iran. On the US side, the Vice President, J.D. vance, who's expected to lead the American delegation, is reported to be preparing to leave for Pakistan just over a week after he first held talks there with the Iranians. Our US Correspondent David Willis is also following developments.
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Liberty Mutual Advertiser
It's coming down to the wire and the big question, as Lise was just saying there is, will Iran attend? President Trump has said that as far as he is concerned, the Iranians promised to turn up. He expects their negotiators to do so. But Iran has accused the United States of continuous violations of the ceasefire agreement, including with its blockade of Iran's ports, and sending unconstructive and contradictory signals in the word of one Iranian official. And Iran is saying that it will refuse to submit to force. Now, the vice president, J.D. vance, is still, we believe, in Washington. He is due to leave for Islamabad in the morning, but he obviously won't be going if there's nobody there for him to negotiate with in Islamabad. Now, Tehran had earlier ruled out its attendance at those talks, but there has since, as at least hinted, there been some evidence that it may be prepared perhaps to review its stance on that. And against that background, we've had further mixed messages from President Trump himself, who said both that he is under no pressure whatsoever, whilst also saying that when all this happens, it will happen relatively quickly. So it could come down ultimately to whether he, President Trump agrees to end the blockade of Iran's ports something that he has promised to consider doing.
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Janak Jalil
And assuming these talks do go ahead, the two sides are still a long, long way apart.
- [06:19]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
They are. And President Trump, of course, is eager for a deal that will help avoid a further surge in oil prices. Concerns surrounding the possible collapse of these ceasefire talks have sent prices rising again by around 5%. Mr. Trump wants the state of Hormuz reopened. Traffic, of course, through that vital waterway has all but ground to a halt. And the US Also wants Iran to hand over its stockpile of enriched uranium, which is something that Iran has declared a non starter. The Iranians are seeking a pledge from the United States and Israel that the conflict won't resume, wants reparations for damages caused by the war and relief from long running sanctions. And of course, on Sunday, President Trump again warned that the United States would destroy every bridge and power plant in Iran if it rejected the United States terms.
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Janak Jalil
David Willis, Meanwhile, in southern Lebanon, an image of an Israeli soldier hitting a statue of Jesus with a sledgehammer has been widely condemned after it was shared online. Israel's Prime Minister, Benjamin Netanyahu says he's stunned and saddened by the incident and has promised that the military will take appropriately harsh disciplinary action. Yoland Nell in Jerusalem told the Israeli
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Yolande Nell
prime minister was quick to come out with his comments in English on his X account. I think understanding very well the international damage that this could do. This photo that's been shared widely on social media over the past couple of days, the Israeli army has confirmed it's a soldier who is at the moment in southern Lebanon or has been in southern Lebanon in recent days. He's holding what appears to be a sledgehammer or an axe poised just over the face of this statue of Jesus on a crucifix that's been toppled. The understanding is that this is in the village of Dabal, which is in southern Lebanon, a Maronite Christian village. This was a family's own shrine on the edge of their land at the edge of the village. It's not clear exactly at the moment what damage was ultimately done, but the Israeli army is saying that they will help the Christian community there to repair this statue. The foreign minister of Israel, Gideon Saar, came out and said that he apologized for this incident and to every Christian who had been hurt by it in their feelings. So you can see that this has really sort of, you know, had a big effect and that the local priest there told the BBC in Beirut that this was a desecration and, you know, really extremely upsetting for the Christian community in Southern Lebanon. In this wide area which is currently occupied by Israeli forces, thousands of Israeli forces on the ground there. They see this as being a stronghold for the Shiite Muslim group Hezbollah.
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Janak Jalil
Yolande Nell When Tim Cook took over as chief executive of Apple 15 years ago from its legendary founder, Steve Jobs, he had a hard act to follow. But he continued the smartphone revolution begun by the late founder, turning Apple into a multi trillion dollar jugger. Now it's been announced that he's stepping down. He'll become the executive chairman of the company's board. Apple's head of hardware engineering, John Turner, will take over as chief executive in September. Our North America technology correspondent, Lily Jamali told me more about Tim Cook's time at the helm of apple.
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Lily Jamali
In his 15 years at the helm, Tim Cook has transformed this company from a $350 billion market cap to a $4 trillion company. Extraordinary. On his watch, it was the first trillion dollar company. So he has been seen as a steady hand after the departure of Steve Jobs. Very big shoes to fill, to say the least. But he has also been criticized for, you know, really moving the supply chain to China in a big way. That was a process that actually had begun under Steve Jobs. He has sometimes been criticized for his politics. You know, he's been sort of thrust into the political spotlight because of the diplomacy he has had to undertake as the head of Apple during tariff wars under Don Trump, being seen with US President Donald Trump in the White House and elsewhere. But this is a transition that's been closely anticipated and watched for a long time. And as you say, he will be the executive chairman after this summer.
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Janak Jalil
So given all that, tell us about the incoming chief executive, John Turner and what he's expected to bring to this very high profile role.
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Lily Jamali
Yeah, so I mean, by way of background, you mentioned his title, senior vice president of hardware engineering. And when you think of Apple, the first thing you think of is hardware, Right. You think of products like the iPad and the iPhone. And in their announcement today, Apple said he was instrumental in the introduction of products like the iPad and AirPods. He's also been there for various generations of the iPhone and some other products. But the iPhone is really the bread and butter for this company. More than any other product, he is considered a safe choice. John Ternus is. But I think there's a lot of questions right now about where is Apple going to land when it comes to having a footprint in AI. Are they going to cede that territory completely to other companies or do they want to make a splash there? And I think there's also some concern that Apple hasn't had a big product in a while. Can he make this a culturally relevant company once again?
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Janak Jalil
And how is this going down in the tech world?
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Lily Jamali
It is a very big deal. I mean, Apple is such a force in Silicon Valley. So anytime you see a transition like this, people are talking about it. And people have been talking about it for several months as we've seen some pretty high level departures at the company. So we kind of knew this was coming. But this is a guy who is young, 50 years old, he has spent basically half of his life at Apple. So he's been there a long time. And I think people don't know him that well. You know, he's not a household name yet. Maybe he will be in two, three years time, but I think people are going to be watching here in Silicon Valley to see if he is somebody who is decisive, who will make big, bold moves. And they want to see those early on.
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Janak Jalil
Lily Jamali Pancreatic cancer is one of the deadliest types of cancer, in large part because symptoms often don't show up until it's too late. Only around a quarter of patients live for a year after diagnosis, and just one in 10 survive for two years. But now an experimental vaccine developed by scientists in New York is offering a glimmer of hope. It works by training the patient's own immune system to target the cancer. And so far, it's shown striking results in a small group of patients, with most of them still alive more than five years on. My colleague Paul Henley spoke to Dr. Vinod Balachandran, who's leading the trial at the Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer center in New York.
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Dr. Vinod Balachandran
When we think of vaccines, we think of vaccines for infectious diseases. In that scenario, what you're doing is you're teaching the immune system to recognize a virus or a bacteria that has yet to infect your body. The majority of cancer vaccines are used as a therapy. Most of them are given to patients who have cancer in some way or form with an intent to treat their cancer. In this particular scenario, we use the vaccines to teach the immune system to recognize pancreatic cancers in an effort to prevent their reoccurrence after surgery.
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Interviewer
And they're described as personalized. What does that mean?
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Dr. Vinod Balachandran
Personalized refers to the fact that each individual patient's cancer vaccine is custom designed for that individual based upon individual genetic analysis of their tumor as well as genetic characteristics of the patient.
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Interviewer
Why is pancreatic cancer such a killer? The figures are terrible for Survival as they stand, aren't they?
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Dr. Vinod Balachandran
90% of patients with pancreatic cancer die within five years of diagnosis with current treatments, and it is projected to soon become the second leading cause of cancer death in the United States in the next year.
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Interviewer
Tell me why there's such cause for optimism about this treatment in this study.
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Dr. Vinod Balachandran
Part of the excitement is around the fact that you can in fact teach the immune system to recognize pancreatic cancer. And not only that, you can do it in a very potent and durable way so you can make a very strong immune response that has all of the requisite features you would think needed to be able to treat cancer. And excitingly, although this is a small clinical trial, what we find is if we can make this immune response in patients, patients are living much longer. So this is an exciting proof of concept that you can use the immune system to recognize pancreatic cancer and treat it. One of the most challenging cancers in oncology, we think can provide a blueprint to do it in other cancers as well.
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Interviewer
Can you give us an example of how your treatment has worked on a particular patient?
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Dr. Vinod Balachandran
Sure. So the first patient on this clinical trial is Donna Gustafson. She was the first patient on our clinical trial to receive this personalized RNA vaccine to treat pancreatic cancer. She had her diagnosis initially when she was vacationing in Australia to visit her daughter. So she flew back to the United States to our center at Memorial Stone Kettering, where we performed surgery to remove her cancer. And then she became the first patient enrolled on this first pancreatic cancer RNA vaccine trial. And now six years later, she remains alive with very strong evidence of persisting immune response in her peripheral blood.
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Interviewer
So how is she doing now?
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Dr. Vinod Balachandran
She is doing fantastic. She hiked up Mount Etna last year to celebrate her 50th wedding anniversary. She is a picture of vibrancy and is able to do all of the normal things she would do in life and more and really living her life to the fullest.
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Janak Jalil
That was Dr. Vinod Balachandran, still to come in this podcast.
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Liberty Mutual Advertiser
He is a superb writer, very, very easy to read and an interesting writer. The sales of his books tell their
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Janak Jalil
own story tributes to the author of the Naked Ape, Desmond Morris, who has died at the age of 98.
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Ryan Seacrest
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Lily Jamali
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Martha (Kohler Ambassador)
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- [19:58]
Ryan Seacrest
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- [20:32]
Janak Jalil
This is the global news podcast Pope Leo has told Angolans on the latest stage of his tour of Africa that many people are being exploited by authoritarians and defrauded by the rich. It's just the latest example of the forceful speaking style he has recently adopted, with sharp denunciations of war and inequality that have angered the the US President Donald Trump. The Pope told worshippers at a mass in the Angolan town of Sorremo, near the border with the Democratic Republic of Congo, that violence and oppression went against the Christian message. Nomsa Maseko sent this report from Angola's capital, Luanda.
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Nomsa Maseko
Pope Leo finalized the third leg of his tour of four African countries with a visit to a nursing home in the oil and mineral rich country where he decried the exploitation of natural resources. Tens of thousands of worshippers welcomed him in Kilamba, near the capital, Luanda. On Sunday, he urged Angolans to move beyond the divisions created by decades of war.
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Janak Jalil
We are one spirit and one body.
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Arab Barghouti
I urge the people of Angola to
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Nomsa Maseko
build a country in which past divisions
- [21:51]
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may end forever, where hatred and violence
- [21:54]
Dr. Vinod Balachandran
disappears, where the sickness of corruption will
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Liberty Mutual Advertiser
be replaced by a new culture of justice.
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Nomsa Maseko
For many here, this message felt personal. In a country scarred by the legacy of a brutal civil war as well as inequality, The young people of Angola are still praying for a peaceful country and a world with more humanity. We hope that the visit of the Holy Pope will help us to have everlasting peace in Angola and we will be eternally grateful. The Pope is the messenger of peace and we're living in a dangerous world where we are seeing wars around the world. And we hope the Pope's visit will bring peace not only for Angola but for the entire world. I'm 15 years old and I hope that one day I'll be consecrated as a priest. Being a priest is a vocation, but being a bishop is not a vocation but a calling. I always tell my peers that we should dedicate ourselves to the Church and follow the footsteps of the Holy Pope and preach a message of peace here in Angola and the world over. The pontiff also visited a 16th century shrine in the city of Mountain Mushima, which was the epicentre of the African slave trade, and recalled the sorrow and suffering endured by generations of Africans. His remarks come amid renewed scrutiny of the complex relationship between Roman Catholicism and the exploitation of the African continent. The city of Mushima has become an important place of pilgrimage here in southern Africa. It also serves as a stark reminder of the horrors inflicted by Europeans on the native population. The Angolan government is turning this area into a religious tourism destination with the construction of a basilica and a pilgrim square, which is expected to attract millions of Worshippers. The apostolic journey of the the pontiff will end with a visit to equatorial guinea, where 80% of the country's population is Catholic. Many hope Leo will address the human rights injustices in a country ruled by President Obianguema's authoritarian government.
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Janak Jalil
That report by Nomsa Maseko lawyers representing a man described by his supporters as the world's most important prisoner say he's been subjected to several violent assaults behind bars in recent weeks. Marwan Barghouti was convicted in Israel of murder in a trial that's been criticized as flawed by legal experts. Barghouti, who many Palestinians call their Nelson Mandela, has spent more than 20 years in prison, much of that time in solitary confinement. He was seen for the first time in a decade last year when the far right minister Itamar Ben Gavir released a video of himself taunting the imprisoned Palestinian leader. Mr. Barghouti's last recorded interview from jail was with Britain's Channel 4 news back in 2006.
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Liberty Mutual Advertiser
Israel succeeded to arrest my body, but not my head and not my soul. They will not succeed to do that. They will not broke our will for independence and for freedom. So I think we are freedom fighters. Finally we'll be get out from the prison. And I see myself as a Palestinian resident who exercises his rights in Palestinian democratic state. This is my dream.
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Janak Jalil
Many former leaders and celebrities have called for Marwan Barghouti's release. His son, Arab Barghouti told us more about what his father has suffered and at the hands of the Israeli prison service.
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Arab Barghouti
On April 12, the lawyer was finally able to see my father after months and we learned about very disturbing news. On March 24, the Israeli prison Authority in Madidda Prison they went to him and they put him on the ground in his cell. They had a dog come and start kicking him with his paws. And that was the first assault. The second one was moving him from Jiddo to ganot prison on March 25. And a Nashon unit, which is responsible for transporting the prisoners and known for being the most vicious, attacked him and they assaulted him on the way. And then on April 8, they came to him in Ganut prison. In his cell they started beating him up. He started bleeding for two hours, calling for medical treatment, but no one gave him any medical treatment.
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Interviewer
Do you ever get to speak to him?
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Arab Barghouti
No, I haven't been able to speak with my father directly for almost four years.
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Interviewer
And he has no visitors in prison other than these visits by his lawyer?
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Arab Barghouti
Yeah, and they're very rare. It's barely once every few months.
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Interviewer
The Israeli prison service says that all the allegations you've just quoted are false and baseless. You dismiss their version of events?
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Arab Barghouti
Do you let them get humanitarian organizations, international lawyers? Let them send anyone? If they're claiming that they're baseless, why do they prevent them from seeing anyone?
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Interviewer
They claim that all cases of systematic abuse on their part are baseless and that any individual misconduct is always investigated.
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Arab Barghouti
That's laughable. For me. They have killed more than 100 Palestinian political prisoners. Only in the last two years.
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Interviewer
From your point of view, why is your father in prison? Why do you think he's locked up?
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Arab Barghouti
Because they don't want Palestinian representation that is respected by the whole world. They don't want someone who's capable of unifying the Palestinian people towards a political vision. And because he supports the two state solution.
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Interviewer
Specifically, he was charged with 26 charges of murder and attempted murder stemming from attacks carried out by a group that he led.
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Arab Barghouti
Yeah, but it's very important to show. By whom? By the occupation itself. So the occupation judicial system is a tool of the occupation.
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Interviewer
The Israelis obviously think that it's important politically for him to remain in prison. Him specifically. Many in the Palestinian world view him as a potential future leader, someone who could unite many sides of various Palestinian political movements. Do you?
- [28:33]
Arab Barghouti
Of course he's a leader. He knows his worth, he knows what he can represent to the Palestinian cause. But he's always been very clear and consistent that he would only come in a democratic process.
- [28:43]
Interviewer
Your hopes of seeing him out? Well, seeing him again must go up and down according to current events. Where do they stand at the moment?
- [28:51]
Arab Barghouti
I never lost hope that one day my father will be back to meet his six grandchildren. That he will be part of our lives. He's been absent from, you know, my siblings, weddings, special occasions, and I represent almost 10,000 families who are going through the same nightmare.
- [29:09]
Janak Jalil
Arab Barghouti talking to Paul Henley about his jailed father, Marwan Barghouti. The American singer David has pleaded not guilty to the murder of a 14 year old girl. The remains of Celeste Rivas Hernandez were found in the artist's Tesla car last September. The 21 year old musician, whose legal name is David Burke, has been charged with first degree murder in the killing of Celeste. The Los Angeles District Attorney, Nathan Hockman, described the case as a parent's nightmare.
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Arab Barghouti
I had the chance to meet with some of the family members of Celeste and their grief is uncalculable as to what happened to their daughter. What they have demanded what we have assured them that the district Attorney's office
- [29:58]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
working with LAPD would give them is
- [30:02]
Arab Barghouti
the idea is the proof beyond a reasonable doubt on who killed their daughter,
- [30:10]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
on how their daughter was killed, when
- [30:13]
Arab Barghouti
their daughter was killed and bring that killer to justice.
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Janak Jalil
Our LA correspondent Shaima Khalil was in court and told us more.
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Shaima Khalil
This has been a day charged with emotion, with expectation. There were so many months of secrecy and speculation and then we got to the day where charges have been levelled against David and he's been charged with first degree murder. And since then he's pleaded not guilty. This was his first court appearance and I was in court and the mood there was quite charged, you know, there was emotion. But also when Celeste's parents stepped into the court, her mother wearing a black shirt hanging onto her father's hand, visibly upset, there was absolute silence. And then we heard earlier from the Los Angeles District attorney Nathan Hockman. Now we know that there are charges of first degree murder that his defense team say he is not responsible for. That they deny. But the charges against the 21 year old singer also include numerous sexual acts with a minor mutilation of her body. The district attorney also accused the singer of murdering the 14 year old to maintain his lucrative musical career that she was allowed, allegedly threatening. This of course all started out when the teenagers dismembered and decomposed remains were found in September 2025 in David's Tesla when someone reported a foul smell coming from his impounded vehicle in a Hollywood impounded area. Now, the artist lawyers have said that the actual evidence in the case will show that he did not murder Celeste and that he was not the cause of her death. But for months we understand that a grand jury has been hearing evidence. Now it all comes out in the opening in public court hearings. We know from the authorities that this teenager was last seen alive in April 2025, which had gone to Burke's house in the Hollywood Hills. And since then she was never seen or heard from again.
- [32:08]
Janak Jalil
Shaima Khalil in Los Angeles. Tributes have been paid to the British zoologist, television presenter and artist Desmond Morris, best known for his hugely popular book book the Naked Ape, who has died at the age of 98. Our science correspondent Helen Briggs looks at his life and legacy.
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Helen Briggs
In 1967, at the height of the swinging 60s, Dr. Desmond Morris calls shockwaves with his book the Naked Ape, which defined humans as hairless apes, not so different from their primate cousins and driven by the same urges.
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Helen Briggs
The book was criticised by some for oversimplifying the way we behave and reinforcing gender stereotypes, but became a publishing sensation, translated into many languages and selling more than 10 million copies. Born in the Wiltshire village of Perten in 1928, Desmond Morris trained in zoology at the Universities of Birmingham and Oxford and worked at London Zoo as curator of mammals. He later used this knowledge as a presenter of TV programs on animal behaviour.
- [33:39]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
You see, and immediately the chimpanzee put its arm around you and greeted you as well.
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Helen Briggs
As a prolific author writing more than 70 books, he was a surrealist painter, still exhibiting art well into his 90s. Although some of his ideas have been disproved, he'll perhaps be remembered as a communicator of popular science and for exploring human behaviour through the lens of biology and evolution.
- [34:06]
Janak Jalil
Helen Briggs, the evolutionary biologist and zoologist Richard Dawkins, himself a popular scientific author, knew Desmond Morris for many years.
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Liberty Mutual Advertiser
I would say his books were aimed at the general public. I don't think they were major contributions to science. He did make some good contributions to science in his papers in the ecological literature on animal behavior, and he was a very imaginative researcher. So he did make very valuable contributions to the science of ethology, the science of animal behavior. He is a superb writer, very easy to read and an interesting writer. The sales of his books tell their own story.
- [34:45]
Janak Jalil
Richard Dawkins, paying tribute to fellow author Desmond Morris, who has died at the age of 98. And that's all from us for now. If you want to get in touch, you can email us@globalpodcastbc.co.uk. this edition of the Global News Podcast was mixed by Chris Ablaqua. The producers were Carla Conti and Arian Kochi. The editor is Karen Martin. I'm Janak Jalil. Until next time. Goodbye. Support is available 24. 7 with VRBoCare. We're here day or night, ready whenever you need help because a great trip starts with the right support.